Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss

o/t - Happy Saint Crispin's Day - 25 October

41 views
Skip to first unread message

David Amicus

unread,
Oct 25, 2016, 3:20:12 PM10/25/16
to
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Crispin%27s_Day

MartinS

unread,
Oct 25, 2016, 5:23:34 PM10/25/16
to
David Amicus <ami...@webtv.net> wrote:

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Crispin%27s_Day

Also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Agincourt

--
Martin S

David Amicus

unread,
Oct 25, 2016, 6:12:37 PM10/25/16
to
Thanks!

MartinS

unread,
Oct 25, 2016, 10:14:25 PM10/25/16
to
> Thanks!

Henry V, Act 4, Scene 3

This day is called the feast of Crispian:
He that outlives this day, and comes safe home,
Will stand a tip-toe when the day is named,
And rouse him at the name of Crispian.
He that shall live this day, and see old age,
Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
And say 'To-morrow is Saint Crispian:'
Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars.
And say 'These wounds I had on Crispin's day.'

--
Martin S

David Amicus

unread,
Oct 25, 2016, 10:45:50 PM10/25/16
to
On Tuesday, October 25, 2016 at 7:14:25 PM UTC-7, MartinS wrote:
> David Amicus <ami...@webtv.net> wrote:
> > On Tuesday, October 25, 2016 at 2:23:34 PM UTC-7, MartinS wrote:
> >> David Amicus <ami...@webtv.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Crispin%27s_Day
> >>
> >> Also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Agincourt
> >
> > Thanks!
>
> Henry V, Act 4, Scene 3
>
> This day is called the feast of Crispian:
> He that outlives this day, and comes safe home,
> Will stand a tip-toe when the day is named,
> And rouse him at the name of Crispian.
> He that shall live this day, and see old age,
> Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
> And say 'To-morrow is Saint Crispian:'
> Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars.
> And say 'These wounds I had on Crispin's day.'
>
> --
> Martin S

Every school child whether in Britain or America should be required to memorize that before they can graduate!

Shakespeare is the greatest writer ever in the English language!

LONG LIVE THE BARD OF AVON!!!


kat

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 4:09:07 AM10/26/16
to
But why that bit? We did loads of Shakespeare plays when I was at
school, though not that one, my children had a Shakespeare -mad English
teacher who took them on weekend visits to Stratford, including 2 plays.
We get plenty without learning one verse!

--
kat
>^..^<

GordonD

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 4:35:07 AM10/26/16
to
Didn't Alex fight in that one?
--
Gordon Davie
Edinburgh, Scotland

GordonD

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 4:36:15 AM10/26/16
to
Why? It has nothing to do with America. Or Scotland, for that matter.

MartinR

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 8:00:39 AM10/26/16
to
Nearly all Americans and Scots speak English, and Shakespeare wrote in English.

MartinR


Ophelia

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 9:28:47 AM10/26/16
to
"GordonD" wrote in message news:e7b85p...@mid.individual.net...

On 25/10/2016 22:23, MartinS wrote:
> David Amicus <ami...@webtv.net> wrote:
>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Crispin%27s_Day
>
> Also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Agincourt
>

Didn't Alex fight in that one?

Gordon Davie

=====================

Hmm that might have been REnzo!

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

David Amicus

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 11:54:52 AM10/26/16
to
It's one of his most well known quotes from a history play. Agincourt is important to both England and her eldest daughter America.

I can't remember reading Shakespeare in either grade school or high school. But I did take a Shakespeare class in college. I got an "A". The class went to see a performance of Richard III.

In grade school we had to memorize a couple of poems by Longfellow. And in high school I took French and at the end of the period the teacher would read to us from "Evangeline".

David Amicus

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 11:56:40 AM10/26/16
to
I mentioned the American poet Longfellow. I don't know if anyone outside America would know about him.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Wadsworth_Longfellow

kat

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 4:35:27 PM10/26/16
to
Ah, so well known that you know it from a college class, whereas I did
5 years of it, plus an intensive week in 1964 celebrating his 400th
birthday - and that play wasn't one we did at all!

--
kat
>^..^<

kat

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 4:36:48 PM10/26/16
to
On 26/10/2016 16:56, David Amicus wrote:
> I mentioned the American poet Longfellow. I don't know if anyone outside America would know about him.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Wadsworth_Longfellow
>

Yep, we did Hiawatha in my first year at High school.

--
kat
>^..^<

GordonD

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 5:50:56 PM10/26/16
to
On 26/10/2016 16:56, David Amicus wrote:
> I mentioned the American poet Longfellow. I don't know if anyone
> outside America would know about him.


Other countries aren't as insular as Americans - they know about culture
other than their own.

GordonD

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 5:54:37 PM10/26/16
to
I wasn't talking about Shakespeare. I wouldn't dispute that he's one of
the greatest writers in the language.

What I was disputing was David's statement that every schoolchild in
Britain and America should be able to quote that particular speech,
given that neither America nor Scotland were involved in that battle.
Not on the English side anyway!

GordonD

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 5:55:23 PM10/26/16
to
He'd have been on the French side. You know how he feels about cheese.

David Amicus

unread,
Oct 26, 2016, 9:29:17 PM10/26/16
to
But the primary heritage cultural history of the USA until 1776 is English history from pre Roman times until King George III.

America is England's daughter. It would be disrespectful not to acknowledge our mother.

We are because she is!

Ophelia

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 3:54:17 AM10/27/16
to
"GordonD" wrote in message news:e7cn2a...@mid.individual.net...
Gordon Davie

=======================

Troo

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

Enzo Matrix

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 7:28:31 AM10/27/16
to
GordonD writted:
-------------------------------------------------------


On the French side?!?!?! À la lanterne!

--
Enzo

I wear the cheese. It does not wear me.

Enzo Matrix

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 7:29:25 AM10/27/16
to
Ophelia writted:
---------------------------------------------

Standing right here!

MartinR

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 8:12:11 AM10/27/16
to
Sorry about my misunderstanding. It's true that nobody, even English or their descendants, should be made to learn Shakespeare verbatim.

MartinR

David Amicus

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 12:22:13 PM10/27/16
to
I think everyone should know Homer, Virgil, Dante and Shakespeare! These four are the greatest poets of not just Western Civilization but of the world!


I call them QUATTUOR POETAE LAUREA CORONATI - the Four Crowned Poets.

GordonD

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 12:47:20 PM10/27/16
to
And Scotland should be involved because... ?

GordonD

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 12:48:07 PM10/27/16
to
No worries. I should have trimmed that bit out.

Ophelia

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 12:50:01 PM10/27/16
to
"Enzo Matrix" wrote in message news:e7e6mt...@mid.individual.net...
Enzo

=================

OH boy that takes me back!!!

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

Ophelia

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 12:50:01 PM10/27/16
to
"Enzo Matrix" wrote in message news:e7e6oj...@mid.individual.net...

Ophelia writted:

"GordonD" wrote in message news:e7b85p...@mid.individual.net...

On 25/10/2016 22:23, MartinS wrote:
> David Amicus <ami...@webtv.net> wrote:
>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Crispin%27s_Day
>
> Also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Agincourt
>

Didn't Alex fight in that one?

Gordon Davie

=====================

Hmm that might have been REnzo!

---------------------------------------------

Standing right here!

Enzo

=================

Is that you lurking again??
--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

GordonD

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 1:10:23 PM10/27/16
to
You're too young to remember that battle!

Ophelia

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 1:51:05 PM10/27/16
to
"GordonD" wrote in message news:e7eqnt...@mid.individual.net...
Gordon Davie
================

*strutt*

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

Enzo Matrix

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 2:33:18 PM10/27/16
to
Ophelia writted:
>> "Enzo Matrix" wrote in message news:e7e6mt...@mid.individual.net...
>>
>> On the French side?!?!?! À la lanterne!
>
>
> OH boy that takes me back!!!

Who was it wot used to say that?

Ophelia

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 2:36:00 PM10/27/16
to
"Enzo Matrix" wrote in message news:e7evjc...@mid.individual.net...

Ophelia writted:
>> "Enzo Matrix" wrote in message news:e7e6mt...@mid.individual.net...
>>
>> On the French side?!?!?! À la lanterne!
>
>
> OH boy that takes me back!!!

Who was it wot used to say that?


Enzo

==============

I can't remember ... who?
--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

Mudge

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 4:29:13 PM10/27/16
to
On 2016-10-26 21:50:54 +0000, GordonD said:
> On 26/10/2016 16:56, David Amicus wrote:
>> I mentioned the American poet Longfellow. I don't know if anyone
>> outside America would know about him.
>
> Other countries aren't as insular as Americans - they know about culture
> other than their own.

Of course - everyone knows Longfellow was a very tall American President !

--
The Canadian Curmudgeon (in 10C Calgary)
Fix the biosphere - eliminate people

Mudge

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 4:33:16 PM10/27/16
to
On 2016-10-27 12:12:08 +0000, MartinR said:

> Sorry about my misunderstanding. It's true that nobody, even English
> or their descendants, should be made to learn Shakespeare verbatim.

Correct, if you remove the word "verbatim"

Shakespeares "English" can damage the brain !

David Amicus

unread,
Oct 27, 2016, 5:01:14 PM10/27/16
to
I thought that Britain was insular while America is continental.

And the most continental nation of all is Australia!

;-)))

MartinS

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 1:23:14 AM10/29/16
to
"Ophelia" <OphEl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "Enzo Matrix" wrote...
> GordonD writted:
> On 26/10/2016 14:28, Ophelia wrote:
>> "GordonD" wrote in message news:e7b85p...@mid.individual.net...
>> On 25/10/2016 22:23, MartinS wrote:
>>> David Amicus <ami...@webtv.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Crispin%27s_Day
>>>
>>> Also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Agincourt
>>
>> Didn't Alex fight in that one?
>>
>> =====================
>>
>> Hmm that might have been REnzo!
>>
> He'd have been on the French side. You know how he feels about cheese.
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
>
> On the French side?!?!?! À la lanterne!
>
> OH boy that takes me back!!!

Doesn't it just? Wasn't that Marie from Accrington?

--
Martin S

MartinS

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 1:29:19 AM10/29/16
to
GordonD <g.d...@btinternet.com> wrote:
> On 25/10/2016 22:23, MartinS wrote:
>> David Amicus <ami...@webtv.net> wrote:
>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Crispin%27s_Day
>>
>> Also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Agincourt
>
> Didn't Alex fight in that one?

There have been plenty of battles in Agincourt, Ontario (the north end of
Scarborough) - colloquially known as Asiancourt.

One housing development near where I once lived includes St Crispin's Dr,
Harfleur Rd, King Henry's Blvd, Prince Hal Cres and King Louis Cres,

My year in grammar school studied Henry V for O Level English Lit, so I
know it almost by heart. I've also seen the movies starring Larry Olivier
(1944) and Kenneth Branagh (1989). Both excellent movies in their own way.

--
Martin S

MartinS

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 1:46:45 AM10/29/16
to
MartinR <martin...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 09:36:15 UTC+1, GordonD wrote:
>> On 26/10/2016 03:45, David Amicus wrote:
>> > On Tuesday, October 25, 2016 at 7:14:25 PM UTC-7, MartinS wrote:
>> >> David Amicus <ami...@webtv.net> wrote:
>> >>> On Tuesday, October 25, 2016 at 2:23:34 PM UTC-7, MartinS wrote:
>> >>>> David Amicus <ami...@webtv.net> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Crispin%27s_Day
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Agincourt
>> >>>
>> >>> Thanks!
>> >>
>> >> Henry V, Act 4, Scene 3
>> >>
>> >> This day is called the feast of Crispian: He that outlives this
>> >> day, and comes safe home, Will stand a tip-toe when the day is
>> >> named, And rouse him at the name of Crispian. He that shall live
>> >> this day, and see old age, Will yearly on the vigil feast his
>> >> neighbours, And say 'To-morrow is Saint Crispian:' Then will he
>> >> strip his sleeve and show his scars. And say 'These wounds I had
>> >> on Crispin's day.'
>> >
>> > Every school child whether in Britain or America should be required
>> > to memorize that before they can graduate!
>> >
>> > Shakespeare is the greatest writer ever in the English language!
>> >
>> > LONG LIVE THE BARD OF AVON!!!
>>
>> Why? It has nothing to do with America. Or Scotland, for that matter.
>
> Nearly all Americans and Scots speak English, and Shakespeare wrote in
> English.

All widely differing varieties of English!

Shakespeare had Scottish characters in his plays - Captain Jamy in Henry V
and Macbeth, Macduff, etc in The Scottish Play.

Will's birthplace, Stratford-upon-Avon, is under 30 miles from Birmingham,
so his accent would have been quite different from refined Londoners.

--
Martin S

MartinS

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 1:55:29 AM10/29/16
to
Mudge <Nos...@never.ever> wrote:
> On 2016-10-27 12:12:08 +0000, MartinR said:
>
>> Sorry about my misunderstanding. It's true that nobody, even English
>> or their descendants, should be made to learn Shakespeare verbatim.
>
> Correct, if you remove the word "verbatim"
>
> Shakespeares "English" can damage the brain !

Cold enough for ya, eh, Mudge?

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/pedestrian-collisions-calgary-snow-police-warning-1.3826274

--
Martin S

MartinS

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 1:57:11 AM10/29/16
to
David Amicus <ami...@webtv.net> wrote:

> I mentioned the American poet Longfellow. I don't know if anyone outside
America would know about him.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Wadsworth_Longfellow

Never 'eard of the bloke. I've heard of Peter Stringfellow, though. ;-)

--
Martin S

MartinS

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 2:00:35 AM10/29/16
to
kat <little...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On 26/10/2016 16:56, David Amicus wrote:
>> I mentioned the American poet Longfellow. I don't know if anyone
>> outside America would know about him.
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Wadsworth_Longfellow
>>
>
> Yep, we did Hiawatha in my first year at High school.

By the shore of Gitche Gumee,
By the shining Big-Sea-Water,
At the doorway of his wigwam,
In the pleasant Summer morning,
Hiawatha stood and waited.

Oh, those trochaic tetrameters!

--
Martin S

Ophelia

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 4:16:53 AM10/29/16
to
"MartinS" wrote in message
news:58143241$0$20325$b1db1813$2411...@news.astraweb.com...
Martin S

================

That sounds familiar! Blimey! How many years ago was that?????



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

Ophelia

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 4:20:26 AM10/29/16
to
"MartinS" wrote in message
news:58143a36$0$56181$c3e8da3$b135...@news.astraweb.com...
Martin S
==

lol

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

GordonD

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 5:23:54 AM10/29/16
to
Never seen the Branagh version but I have the Olivier one on DVD. I
believe it was made as a morale-booster during the war.

MartinS

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 12:32:19 PM10/29/16
to
It was, and they made excellent use of models and symbolic sets, which
would be CGI today. The battle scenes were filmed in Ireland, away from
the warplanes and bombs over England. The famous speech at Agincourt
that I quoted earlier was specifically aimed at boosting morale.

The Branagh version has one of those long, uninterrupted shots (about 5
minutes) as Henry carries the body of "Boy" (a young Christian Bale)
across the battlefield, littered with dead extras.

--
Martin S

Mudge

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 5:01:03 PM10/29/16
to
On 2016-10-29 05:55:33 +0000, MartinS said:
Indeed - and far too early !

--
The Canadian Curmudgeon (in 6C Calgary)

David Amicus

unread,
Oct 29, 2016, 5:13:02 PM10/29/16
to
Here is info on Hiawatha

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Song_of_Hiawatha

=======================================

In Hamlet Claudius is a bad guy. Is that a dig about the Roman Emperor of that name who conquered Britain?

kat

unread,
Oct 31, 2016, 6:57:44 PM10/31/16
to
Having just had a school reunion I could tell you how many years it is
for me. A lot.

--
kat
>^..^<
0 new messages