[Because My Tears Are Delicious To You] Fuzzy Sapiens (Little Fuzzy, book 2) by H. Beam Piper

[James Nicoll]

Fuzzy Sapiens (Little Fuzzy, book 2) by H. Beam Piper

http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/the-messes-that-you-made
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My Livejournal at http://www.livejournal.com/users/james_nicoll
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll

[Carl Fink]

On 2017-10-15, James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:
> Fuzzy Sapiens (Little Fuzzy, book 2) by H. Beam Piper
>
> http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/the-messes-that-you-made

I read this when it first appeared and haven't thought about it since then.
Thanks for reminding me.

Also, I had no idea Campbell was so utterly wrongheaded about drug testing.
I knew about his bizarre inertialess drive nonsense, of course.

Good editor, but very much a flawed person.
--
Carl Fink nitpi...@nitpicking.com

Read my blog at blog.nitpicking.com. Reviews! Observations!
Stupid mistakes you can correct!

[Robert Woodward]

In article <slrnou6rpi...@panix2.panix.com>,

Carl Fink <ca...@panix.com> wrote:

> On 2017-10-15, James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:
> > Fuzzy Sapiens (Little Fuzzy, book 2) by H. Beam Piper
> >
> > http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/the-messes-that-you-made
>
> I read this when it first appeared and haven't thought about it since then.
> Thanks for reminding me.
>
> Also, I had no idea Campbell was so utterly wrongheaded about drug testing.
> I knew about his bizarre inertialess drive nonsense, of course.
>

I might have to dig out the editorial in question, but, IIRC, Campbell
pointed out that what Kelsey was worried about was NOT the potential for
birth defects and the additional testing she wanted might not have
discovered that. For that matter, I have a vague recollection (from the
80s?) that it doesn't cause birth defects in some species of mammals
commonly used for preliminary screening of drugs.

--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.
ã-----------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward robe...@drizzle.com

[Ahasuerus]

On Sunday, October 15, 2017 at 2:46:48 PM UTC-4, Robert Woodward wrote:
> In article <slrnou6rpi...@panix2.panix.com>,
> Carl Fink <ca...@panix.com> wrote:
>
> > On 2017-10-15, James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:
> > > Fuzzy Sapiens (Little Fuzzy, book 2) by H. Beam Piper
> > >
> > > http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/the-messes-that-you-made
> >
> > I read this when it first appeared and haven't thought about it since then.
> > Thanks for reminding me.
> >
> > Also, I had no idea Campbell was so utterly wrongheaded about drug testing.
> > I knew about his bizarre inertialess drive nonsense, of course.
> >
>
> I might have to dig out the editorial in question, but, IIRC, Campbell
> pointed out that what Kelsey was worried about was NOT the potential for
> birth defects and the additional testing she wanted might not have
> discovered that. For that matter, I have a vague recollection (from the
> 80s?) that it doesn't cause birth defects in some species of mammals
> commonly used for preliminary screening of drugs.

Campbell's _Collected Editorials from Analog_ are available online at
https://archive.org/stream/collectededitori01camp/collectededitori01camp_djvu.txt

My take on his 1950s/1960s articles is that they are a good illustration
of Carl Sagan's favorite saying: "extraordinary claims require
extraordinary evidence". And that "blasts on the trumpet and salvos of
artillery", to quote Harry Harrison, are no substitute for evidence.

[James Nicoll]

In article <robertaw-452EF2...@news.individual.net>,

Robert Woodward <robe...@drizzle.com> wrote:
>In article <slrnou6rpi...@panix2.panix.com>,
> Carl Fink <ca...@panix.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2017-10-15, James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:
>> > Fuzzy Sapiens (Little Fuzzy, book 2) by H. Beam Piper
>> >
>> > http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/the-messes-that-you-made
>>
>> I read this when it first appeared and haven't thought about it since then.
>> Thanks for reminding me.
>>
>> Also, I had no idea Campbell was so utterly wrongheaded about drug testing.
>> I knew about his bizarre inertialess drive nonsense, of course.
>>
>
>I might have to dig out the editorial in question, but, IIRC, Campbell
>pointed out that what Kelsey was worried about was NOT the potential for
>birth defects and the additional testing she wanted might not have
>discovered that. For that matter, I have a vague recollection (from the
>80s?) that it doesn't cause birth defects in some species of mammals
>commonly used for preliminary screening of drugs.
>

Enjoy!

https://archive.org/details/collectededitori01camp

[J. Clarke]

On Mon, 16 Oct 2017 00:11:56 +0000 (UTC), jdni...@panix.com (James
Nicoll) wrote:

>In article <robertaw-452EF2...@news.individual.net>,
>Robert Woodward <robe...@drizzle.com> wrote:
>>In article <slrnou6rpi...@panix2.panix.com>,
>> Carl Fink <ca...@panix.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2017-10-15, James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:
>>> > Fuzzy Sapiens (Little Fuzzy, book 2) by H. Beam Piper
>>> >
>>> > http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/the-messes-that-you-made
>>>
>>> I read this when it first appeared and haven't thought about it since then.
>>> Thanks for reminding me.
>>>
>>> Also, I had no idea Campbell was so utterly wrongheaded about drug testing.
>>> I knew about his bizarre inertialess drive nonsense, of course.
>>>
>>
>>I might have to dig out the editorial in question, but, IIRC, Campbell
>>pointed out that what Kelsey was worried about was NOT the potential for
>>birth defects and the additional testing she wanted might not have
>>discovered that. For that matter, I have a vague recollection (from the
>>80s?) that it doesn't cause birth defects in some species of mammals
>>commonly used for preliminary screening of drugs.
>>
>Enjoy!
>
>https://archive.org/details/collectededitori01camp

Or for a piss-take on that particular editorial:
https://nebushumor.wordpress.com/2015/06/01/misted-the-lesson-of-thalidomide-part-1-of-4/

[Robert Woodward]

In article <4a9fde92-8b79-4a00...@googlegroups.com>,

Ahasuerus <ahas...@email.com> wrote:

> On Sunday, October 15, 2017 at 2:46:48 PM UTC-4, Robert Woodward wrote:
> > In article <slrnou6rpi...@panix2.panix.com>,
> > Carl Fink <ca...@panix.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On 2017-10-15, James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:
> > > > Fuzzy Sapiens (Little Fuzzy, book 2) by H. Beam Piper
> > > >
> > > > http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/the-messes-that-you-made
> > >
> > > I read this when it first appeared and haven't thought about it
> > > since then. Thanks for reminding me.
> > >
> > > Also, I had no idea Campbell was so utterly wrongheaded about
> > > drug testing. I knew about his bizarre inertialess drive
> > > nonsense, of course.
> > >
> >
> > I might have to dig out the editorial in question, but, IIRC, Campbell
> > pointed out that what Kelsey was worried about was NOT the potential for
> > birth defects and the additional testing she wanted might not have
> > discovered that. For that matter, I have a vague recollection (from the
> > 80s?) that it doesn't cause birth defects in some species of mammals
> > commonly used for preliminary screening of drugs.
>
> Campbell's _Collected Editorials from Analog_ are available online at
> https://archive.org/stream/collectededitori01camp/collectededitori01camp_djvu.
> txt

At least the ISFDB identified WHICH issue of ASF this editorial was in
... digging out my copy ... it appears that I didn't remember it
completely correctly. I hadn't remembered the vigor which he had
chastised Kelsey for denying approval for what he considered to be no
rational reason at all (she did this before the problem with peripheral
neuritis was reported). There was no hint in the editorial that Kelsey
wanted the drug tested using a protocol she (and perhaps others at the
FDA) had devised (I consider that rational, perhaps petty-fogging, but
rational - the wikipedia article on Kelsey sort of hints that was the
case).

I did notice his assertion that it wasn't not possible to discover some
side affects for any drug until that drug has been in wide circulation
for years. I recall several recent FDA actions that appear to support
his opinion.

--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.

—-----------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward robe...@drizzle.com

[Ahasuerus]

On Sunday, October 15, 2017 at 10:22:46 AM UTC-4, Carl Fink wrote:
> On 2017-10-15, James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:
> > Fuzzy Sapiens (Little Fuzzy, book 2) by H. Beam Piper
> >
> > http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/the-messes-that-you-made
>
> I read this when it first appeared and haven't thought about it since
> then. Thanks for reminding me.
>
> Also, I had no idea Campbell was so utterly wrongheaded about drug
> testing. I knew about his bizarre inertialess drive nonsense, of
> course.

Well, he started with Dianetics, then moved on to "psionics", dowsing
and other increasingly far out pursuits. The Dean drive was just one of
his later hobby-horses.

Since scientists refused to accept his (self-evidently correct) ideas,
he eventually concluded that modern science was deeply flawed. As he
wrote in one of the collected editorials:

"Science has ducked the issue of studying psi very simply; it has denied
that there is any phenomenon to study. In doing so, it is denying a truth
— an unpleasant, perhaps disastrous, truth."

By the time of the thalidomide episode, he had already progressed to equal
opportunity contrarianism.