Second time around
David Mitchell
I'm having a book-buying dry spell at the moment, forcing me to re-read
even books I didn't necessarily like first time round.
So, the thought for the day is, what books have you re-read to either
their betterment or detriment?
I'd like to start the ball rolling with _Cowl_, by Neal Asher, and
_Feersum Endjinn_ by Iain M Banks, both of which I am enjoying much more
this time round, and on the distaff side _The Outback Stars_ by Sandra
McDonald, which manages to make interstellar travel boring, and _The
Bridge_ by Janine Ellen Young which was so unmemorable that I
accidentally bought it twice.
--
=======================================================================
= David --- If you use Microsoft products, you will, inevitably, get
= Mitchell --- viruses, so please don't add me to your address book.
=======================================================================
JohnFair
wrote:
> So,
>
> I'm having a book-buying dry spell at the moment, forcing me to re-read
> even books I didn't necessarily like first time round.
>
> So, the thought for the day is, what books have you re-read to either
> their betterment or detriment?
>
> I'd like to start the ball rolling with _Cowl_, by Neal Asher, and
> _Feersum Endjinn_ by Iain M Banks, both of which I am enjoying much more
> this time round, and on the distaff side _The Outback Stars_ by Sandra
> McDonald, which manages to make interstellar travel boring, and _The
> Bridge_ by Janine Ellen Young which was so unmemorable that I
> accidentally bought it twice.
>
I can't really think of any rereads that I enjoyed more the second or
third (or...) but most have been at least as good as they were the
first time round. David Weber's Honorverse books tend to be the ones I
reread most but I've got these in e-book format so I have them with me
on my journey home from work.
The major disappointment when rereading were Zelazny's second series
of Amber books, which were fun the first time but pretty much
unreadable the second time round.
--
John Fairhurst
http://www.johnsbooks.co.uk
David DeLaney
>I'm having a book-buying dry spell at the moment, forcing me to re-read
>even books I didn't necessarily like first time round.
I have found the solution to that a good while back: have Too Many Books.
>So, the thought for the day is, what books have you re-read to either
>their betterment or detriment?
We'd be here all day ... I'll just note that I'm currently rereading the
Malazan Books of the Fallen series (now in: House of Chains), due only partly
to the reread-blog series on tor.com .
>_The Bridge_ by Janine Ellen Young which was so unmemorable that I
>accidentally bought it twice.
Occurrences like this are why I long ago started keeping a list of what I
actually had. (How long ago? Well, it was on floppy ... on an Apple ][e...)
I only recently got the technology to actually have it WITH me in the BOOKSTORE
- which helps a great deal.
Dave
Peter Huebner
david.robo...@googlemail.com says...
>
> So,
>
> I'm having a book-buying dry spell at the moment, forcing me to re-read
> even books I didn't necessarily like first time round.
>
> So, the thought for the day is, what books have you re-read to either
> their betterment or detriment?
>
> I'd like to start the ball rolling with _Cowl_, by Neal Asher, and
> _Feersum Endjinn_ by Iain M Banks, both of which I am enjoying much more
> this time round, and on the distaff side _The Outback Stars_ by Sandra
> McDonald, which manages to make interstellar travel boring, and _The
> Bridge_ by Janine Ellen Young which was so unmemorable that I
> accidentally bought it twice.
Re-read this week: "The Phoenix Guards" by Brust, which seemed a lot
shorter, somehow, the third time around. Still good fun, although I more
and more come to the conclusion that Paarfi is just such an ass (not
arse).
"Paladin of Souls" by Bujold. 3rd time round. Still as fresh, still as
good, still as moving if/when/where I can channel Istha and where she's
coming from emotionally at the beginning of the book.
"The Forbidden City" by MZB. <cough>. I really don't think I get off on
this any more. Put it aside after the first few chapters.
Picked up again and romped thorugh in one sitting (after a false start a
few months ago) "The Other Wind" by LeGuin. Very slow start (I thought)
but once it takes off, it really does. She beautifully ties off a lot of
strands left dangling after the three Earthsea books and Tehanu. Some of
which weren't even dangling in a particularly obvious way.
Mathilda by Roald Dahl and the Bromeliad-Trilogy by Pratchett. Still as
wonderful as ever. I wonder if the Bromeliad movie will ever come out.
One hears very little about it. (Incidentally, the movie adaptation of
Mathilda by Danny DeVito was one of the worst, ever, that I have had
the misfortune to start watching - no, I couldn't bear it all the way
through to the end - and the worst I've ever seen him play and direct
characters he obviously doesn't understand). Mathilda is NOT the esp-
terminatrix action movie heroine type.
Highjacking the thread: first read of "The Etched City" by K. Bishop.
What a novel! It starts out with the feel of spaghetti western (music by
Ennio Morricone), somehow turns into a city of Dali-esque distortions
and surrealistic creatures and almost leaves us with some interesting
spiritual and ethical speculations before exiting, stage left, in the
epilogue. Certainly the most 'different' I've read for a good long time
and enjoyable too, albeit quite dense, this is not a book I could read
in a single sitting. Kinda left me feeling like I was looking at the
strewn-across-the-landscape remains of a plane crash. I keep having
flashbacks to scenes in this book.
Also a first for me was "The Circus of Dr. Lao" which I can only
recommed (picked up after a recent mention in the ng).
Pullman's "His Dark Materials". I am not sure how many times I'll have
to read this to mine all the psychological, philosophical, sociological
and theological goodies out of these books. Well done, Mr. Pullman, and
I am certainly not done with you. I'm sure it can be read by young
adults on a different level, as an adventure story, but, well ... that's
not the way I read them.
I'm sure there was something else, slips my mind though.
-P.
David Johnston
<david.robo...@googlemail.com> wrote:
and on the distaff side _The Outback Stars_ by Sandra
>McDonald, which manages to make interstellar travel boring,
Sounds pretty realistic, not that this is a virtue.
tphile
I have found that there is a significant difference reading something
as a youth and rereading
much later as an adult. and not always for the better.
Juvenile works such as Danny Dunn, Three Investigators, Hardy Boys
etc. have lost some of
their charm, novelty and wonder. As an adult you see more of the
flaws.
and as an adult when I read something new, I know its not the same as
if I read it as a kid.
I wonder what reading Harry Potter would have been like when I was
ten.
same applies to other media and genre
Which is why we need to make sure kids experience them before its too
late.
tphile
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
Whereas I have been reading these off-and-on with my younger son and
finding them excellent. Sure, they're dated, but in very interesting
ways. I really wish they could be re-issued.
> As an adult you see more of the
> flaws.
> and as an adult when I read something new, I know its not the same as
> if I read it as a kid.
> I wonder what reading Harry Potter would have been like when I was
> ten.
It's hard to know for sure because it also depends on what went BEFORE.
If you haven't seen any Epic Fantasy adventure (and its the kind of
thing you'd like), it's very likely that whatever epic fantasy you read
first will lock itself in your mind as the exemplar of the genre, even
if it's a much later example building on stuff decades older.
I found Potter interesting because they blended two things I'd seen
before but never looked at in that particular way: Roald Dahl's
"Isolated Child Finds Magic", best exemplified in "James and the Giant
Peach", and the boarding school story.
Another kid's book I recently re-read and which held up very well as
what it was meant to be was "Runaway Robot" (generally credited to Del
Rey but actually by Paul W. Fairman based on an outline); I found it
extremely effective, and one of the most THOUGHTFUL kid's books I've
ever seen.
The Re-issue of Anvil's "Pandora's Planet" as "Pandora's Legions" both
allowed me to read the adventures of "Able Hunter" which I don't think
I'd ever seen before, and to re-experience the original novel, finding
it actually better in some ways than I recalled. I had not quite grasped
the unique brilliance of one of the core "gotchas" of the novel when I
was younger.
--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Live Journal: http://seawasp.livejournal.com
Dorothy J Heydt
Peter Huebner <no....@this.address> wrote:
>
>Also a first for me was "The Circus of Dr. Lao" which I can only
>recommed (picked up after a recent mention in the ng).
I could start a branching thread here, "Stories/novels that were
not as good as the movies they spawned," but I won't. It would
be a fairly short thread.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Should you wish to email me, you'd better use the gmail edress.
Kithrup's all spammy and hotmail's been hacked.
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
> In article <MPG.26c6e2567...@news.individual.net>,
> Peter Huebner <no....@this.address> wrote:
>> Also a first for me was "The Circus of Dr. Lao" which I can only
>> recommed (picked up after a recent mention in the ng).
>
> I could start a branching thread here, "Stories/novels that were
> not as good as the movies they spawned," but I won't. It would
> be a fairly short thread.
>
With the first canonical answer being "Jaws".
David Mitchell
> Highjacking the thread:
Go for it - anything which is actually pertinent to SF is a welcome
change from Shawn-bashing (fun though it is) and the increasingly
psychotic sounding <chuckle> of Pastor Dave.
> Pullman's "His Dark Materials". I am not sure how many times I'll have
> to read this to mine all the psychological, philosophical, sociological
> and theological goodies out of these books. Well done, Mr. Pullman, and
> I am certainly not done with you. I'm sure it can be read by young
> adults on a different level, as an adventure story, but, well ... that's
> not the way I read them.
Gosh, MMV significantly on this one, I bounced right out of it, and never
went back - I thought the writing was unbelievably clumsy.
David Mitchell
> I have found that there is a significant difference reading something as
> a youth and rereading
> much later as an adult.
I'm biased, as I came to science fiction when I was quite young (nine or
so), so I read all the classics as a youth - E.E. Smith, Heinlein,
Clarke, Vonnegut.
I loved it all, if, perhaps, less critically as I do now.
I wish I could be myself at that age once more, encountering it for the
first time again.
David Mitchell
> David Mitchell <david.robo...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>>I'm having a book-buying dry spell at the moment, forcing me to re-read
>>even books I didn't necessarily like first time round.
>
> I have found the solution to that a good while back: have Too Many
> Books.
Too Little Money :-(
>>_The Bridge_ by Janine Ellen Young which was so unmemorable that I
>>accidentally bought it twice.
>
> Occurrences like this are why I long ago started keeping a list of what
> I actually had. (How long ago? Well, it was on floppy ... on an Apple
> ][e...) I only recently got the technology to actually have it WITH me
> in the BOOKSTORE - which helps a great deal.
It's not something I've done very often, so I'd never considered it worth
the trouble - I've only got a few thousand books.
Hmm. There's another thread...
Mike Schilling
"Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote in message
news:i3h84p$ct5$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>> In article <MPG.26c6e2567...@news.individual.net>,
>> Peter Huebner <no....@this.address> wrote:
>>> Also a first for me was "The Circus of Dr. Lao" which I can only
>>> recommed (picked up after a recent mention in the ng).
>>
>> I could start a branching thread here, "Stories/novels that were
>> not as good as the movies they spawned," but I won't. It would
>> be a fairly short thread.
>>
>
> With the first canonical answer being "Jaws".
Second to, at least, The Godfather.
Michael Stemper
>David Mitchell <david.robo...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>>_The Bridge_ by Janine Ellen Young which was so unmemorable that I
>>accidentally bought it twice.
>
>Occurrences like this are why I long ago started keeping a list of what I
>actually had. (How long ago? Well, it was on floppy ... on an Apple ][e...)
The problem with only listing the books that you have is that you might,
like Mr. Mitchell [1], end up buying something a second time because it
sounded good in the store. I, years ago, supplemented my catalog with a
list of books that I had gotten rid of or was going to. What really
bothers me is the possibility that, before I started this, I might not
have merely bought the same *title* more than once, but possibly the
same *book*.
[1] It's nice to have the other first names outnumber the Mikes in a thread.
--
Michael F. Stemper
#include <Standard_Disclaimer>
Always use apostrophe's and "quotation marks" properly.
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
No, I loved Jaws, I couldn't even watch The Godfather.
Norm D. Plumber
>On Fri, 06 Aug 2010 07:31:38 -0700, tphile wrote:
>
>
>> I have found that there is a significant difference reading something as
>> a youth and rereading
>> much later as an adult.
>
>I'm biased, as I came to science fiction when I was quite young (nine or
>so), so I read all the classics as a youth - E.E. Smith, Heinlein,
>Clarke, Vonnegut.
>
>I loved it all, if, perhaps, less critically as I do now.
>
>I wish I could be myself at that age once more, encountering it for the
>first time again.
If you live long enough your wish could become effectively true.
--
Murphy's Law? Never underestimate superstition that works!
Lynn McGuire
> even books I didn't necessarily like first time round.
Money or lack of interest ? If money then try the local library.
If lack of interest then I am surprised. To me, we are living in
the golden age now with McDevitt, Weber, Hamilton, Ringo, Bujold,
etc pumping out massive quantities of new books.
Here are a few I reread time to time:
"Mutineer's Moon" by David Weber
http://www.amazon.com/Mutineers-Moon-Dahak-David-Weber/dp/0671720856/
"The Moon is a Harsh Mistress" by Robert Heinlein
http://www.amazon.com/Moon-Harsh-Mistress-Robert-Heinlein/dp/0312863551/
"Citizen of the Galaxy" by Robert Heinlein
http://www.amazon.com/Citizen-Galaxy-Robert-Heinlein/dp/1416505520/
"Shards of Honor" and all subsequent books by Lois Bujold
http://www.amazon.com/Shards-Honor-Lois-McMaster-Bujold/dp/0671655744/
"Barrayar" by Lois Bujold
http://www.amazon.com/Barrayar-Vorkosigan-Lois-McMaster-Bujold/dp/0743468414/
"The Tar-Aiym Krang" by Alan Dean Foster
http://www.amazon.com/Tar-Aiym-Krang-Alan-Dean-Foster/dp/034530280X/
"March Upcountry" by David Weber and John Ringo
http://www.amazon.com/March-Upcountry-David-Weber/dp/0743435389/
Lynn
Brian M. Scott
<tph...@cableone.net> wrote in
<news:41be793b-6b4b-4df4...@t20g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>
in rec.arts.sf.written:
[...]
> Juvenile works such as Danny Dunn, Three Investigators,
> Hardy Boys etc. have lost some of their charm, novelty
> and wonder.
They never had much for me: they were fill-in when there
wasn't anything better available that I hadn't already read.
Twice. I *will* make an exception for _David and the
Phoenix_, though.
[...]
Brian
Mike Schilling
> [1] It's nice to have the other first names outnumber the Mikes in a
> thread.
Not for long!
Mike Schilling
"Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote in message
news:i3hgar$rhg$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
The book Jaws was OK. The Godfather was, in places, unreadable.
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
>
>
> "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote in message
> news:i3hgar$rhg$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>> Mike Schilling wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote in
>>> message news:i3h84p$ct5$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>>> In article <MPG.26c6e2567...@news.individual.net>,
>>>>> Peter Huebner <no....@this.address> wrote:
>>>>>> Also a first for me was "The Circus of Dr. Lao" which I can only
>>>>>> recommed (picked up after a recent mention in the ng).
>>>>>
>>>>> I could start a branching thread here, "Stories/novels that were
>>>>> not as good as the movies they spawned," but I won't. It would
>>>>> be a fairly short thread.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> With the first canonical answer being "Jaws".
>>>
>>> Second to, at least, The Godfather.
>>
>> No, I loved Jaws, I couldn't even watch The Godfather.
>
> The book Jaws was OK. The Godfather was, in places, unreadable.
Again, we differ, though not by as much (not surprising given the basic
premise that the book must be worse); the novel Jaws was sluggish,
wandering, petty, and unfocused. I read it to the end only because I was
waiting to get to the shark and I had nothing else to read at the time.
Mike Schilling
"Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote in message
news:i3hl8i$82s$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
The unusual book that suffers from *not* jumping (to) the shark. I don't
entirely disagree with you -- it's the kind of book you speed-read through
because it doesn't reward paying attention to the details. It's always
puzzled me how not-very-competently written books become huge best-sellers.
Take Grisham's _The Firm_. The premise (a naïve law-school graduate taking
a job with a law firm that's a front for the Mob) is great, and the setup is
well-done. But once the protagonist figures it out, his clever plan is to
run for it, and the rest of the book is a series of random chase scenes,
where he doesn't get caught no matter what dumb things he does, and it all
just happens to come out OK at the end.
Anthony Nance
Mike Schilling <mscotts...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote in message
> news:i3hl8i$82s$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>> Mike Schilling wrote:
>>>
>>> "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote in message
>>> news:i3hgar$rhg$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>> Mike Schilling wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:i3h84p$ct5$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>>>> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>>>>> I could start a branching thread here, "Stories/novels that were
>>>>>>> not as good as the movies they spawned," but I won't. It would
>>>>>>> be a fairly short thread.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With the first canonical answer being "Jaws".
>>>>>
>>>>> Second to, at least, The Godfather.
>>>>
I'll toss Moby Dick in for consideration as well.
>>>> No, I loved Jaws, I couldn't even watch The Godfather.
>>>
>>> The book Jaws was OK. The Godfather was, in places, unreadable.
>>
>> Again, we differ, though not by as much (not surprising given the basic
>> premise that the book must be worse); the novel Jaws was sluggish,
>> wandering, petty, and unfocused. I read it to the end only because I was
>> waiting to get to the shark and I had nothing else to read at the time.
>
> The unusual book that suffers from *not* jumping (to) the shark. I don't
> entirely disagree with you -- it's the kind of book you speed-read through
> because it doesn't reward paying attention to the details. It's always
> puzzled me how not-very-competently written books become huge best-sellers.
Dan Brown leaps to mind (with seven-league boots).
- Tony
> Take Grisham's _The Firm_. The premise (a naive law-school graduate taking
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
I disagree; I think The Firm is quite well-written in the sense that
the prose carries you along. Benchley's didn't carry me through Jaws --
I had to slog through it. I never had to make an effort reading
Grisham's novels, at least those I've read.
Kurt Busiek
<sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> said:
How'd you like the book?
kdb
--
Visit http://www.busiek.com -- for all your Busiek needs!
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
I couldn't get through the book Godfather, either. I got through the
book Jaws, but it was hard going and only the promise of a killer shark
got me there. The Godfather didn't promise a bunch of sharks lunging out
of the city sewers or anything to lure me onward.
art...@yahoo.com
> > Peter Huebner <no....@this.address> wrote:
> >> Also a first for me was "The Circus of Dr. Lao" which I can only
> >> recommed (picked up after a recent mention in the ng).
>
> > I could start a branching thread here, "Stories/novels that were
> > not as good as the movies they spawned," but I won't. It would
> > be a fairly short thread.
>
> With the first canonical answer being "Jaws".
Should I bother reading "Planet of the Apes"?
Kurt Busiek
<sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> said:
> Kurt Busiek wrote:
>> On 2010-08-06 10:21:31 -0700, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)"
>> <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> said:
>>
>>> Mike Schilling wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:i3h84p$ct5$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>>> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>>>> In article <MPG.26c6e2567...@news.individual.net>,
>>>>>> Peter Huebner <no....@this.address> wrote:
>>>>>>> Also a first for me was "The Circus of Dr. Lao" which I can only
>>>>>>> recommed (picked up after a recent mention in the ng).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I could start a branching thread here, "Stories/novels that were
>>>>>> not as good as the movies they spawned," but I won't. It would
>>>>>> be a fairly short thread.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> With the first canonical answer being "Jaws".
>>>>
>>>> Second to, at least, The Godfather.
>>>
>>> No, I loved Jaws, I couldn't even watch The Godfather.
>>
>> How'd you like the book?
>
> I couldn't get through the book Godfather, either.
So you're not really in a position to judge whether the movie's better
than the book, since you didn't finish either of 'em.
Kurt Busiek
I read it, back in the 1970s, and enjoyed it well enough. Don't
remember it very well now, though.
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I remember it not being as good as the movie by a longshot, but I was
probably 12. It's almost completely different from the movie, and definitely
does not have the famous "shock" ending.
I also thought the movie of Boulle's other famous book was better too.
(Presumably both that I read were translations into English, so that
may factor in as well).
Ted
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
tphile
>
> Another kid's book I recently re-read and which held up very well as
> what it was meant to be was "Runaway Robot" (generally credited to Del
> Rey but actually by Paul W. Fairman based on an outline); I found it
> extremely effective, and one of the most THOUGHTFUL kid's books I've
> ever seen.
>
>
have not read it since. It's
long gone from the public library shelves and afaik out of print
I would love to see an ebook or for it to show up at Half Price Books.
It must have made quite an impression because I can recall many scenes
and details
of it, unlike many other books more recently read.
another book I want to read again is the Chris Godfrey series by Hugh
Walters
especially Terror by Satellite. Which I reread a lot back then.
All of those titles are on my Grail/Wish list. It's easier to manage
a list of
books I want and on a quest for than what I already have on my
shelves.
I may have a title, but there is still the need for backup copies,
different editions,
hard and soft cover. cover artists.
yes it is probably easy to get online and ebay. but that's cheating/
lazy.
the fun is in the quest and joy of discovery rummaging thru second
used book stores
and garage sales.
often cheaper too.
tphile
tphile
> In article <MPG.26c6e2567e4717c2989...@news.individual.net>,
Go ahead and start that thread, it's not so short. ;-)
The Scarlet Pimpernel vs the Leslie Howard classic movie.
for me most any Steven King, especially Stand By Me and Shawshank
and this may be heresy but LotR trilogy. I still love reading the
books but Jacksons
changed for the most part made sense, Glorfindel and Bombadil was no
real loss.
and Galadriels gift to Sam of the magic soil box made no sense and
served no purpose
to completing the quest. and was pointless if they failed. unlike
elven rope that does.
Twilight of course.
tphile
tphile
point taken, but then book reading in the sixties was a different
experience than today.
Our senses and imagination were not overloaded by the internet, cable
tv,
video games and Star Wars.
today we are living much of the SF reality that we once dreamed about
tphile
Kurt Busiek
> In article <i3hr66$fr$1...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> Kurt Busiek <ku...@busiek.com> wrote:
>> On 2010-08-06 12:54:21 -0700, "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> said:
>>
>>> On Aug 6, 11:01 am, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)"
>>> <seaw...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
>>>> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>>> In article <MPG.26c6e2567e4717c2989...@news.individual.net>,
>>>>> Peter Huebner <no....@this.address> wrote:
>>>>>> Also a first for me was "The Circus of Dr. Lao" which I can only
>>>>>> recommed (picked up after a recent mention in the ng).
>>>>
>>>>> I could start a branching thread here, "Stories/novels that were
>>>>> not as good as the movies they spawned," but I won't. It would
>>>>> be a fairly short thread.
>>>>
>>>> With the first canonical answer being "Jaws".
>>>
>>> Should I bother reading "Planet of the Apes"?
>>
>> I read it, back in the 1970s, and enjoyed it well enough. Don't
>> remember it very well now, though.
>>
>> kdb
>> --
>> Visit http://www.busiek.com -- for all your Busiek needs!
>>
>
> I remember it not being as good as the movie by a longshot, but I was
> probably 12. It's almost completely different from the movie, and definitely
> does not have the famous "shock" ending.
It did, sort of. Not the same scene but the same idea, and then another
twist at the end.
SPOILERS
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
0
0
9
8
7
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3
2
1
In the novel, the planet of the apes is not Earth, but the astronaut
escapes and return to Earth, time-dilation winding him up far in his
subjective future, and he finds that Earth, too, has become a planet of
the apes. He (and his family) flee back into space.
The whole novel is presented as their record of the adventure, which is
found by two space travelers, and at the end of the book we discover
that the two travelers are chimpanzees, who scoff at the notion that
humans could ever be that smart.
The movie certainly takes the idea and does it much, much more
powerfully, but the idea at least comes from the book.
Konrad Gaertner
>
> We'd be here all day ... I'll just note that I'm currently rereading the
> Malazan Books of the Fallen series (now in: House of Chains), due only partly
> to the reread-blog series on tor.com .
I'm rereading those during my breaks at work. Halfway through #7
right now, and should be able to finish that and the next two before
the final book comes out.
--
Konrad Gaertner - - - - - - - - - - - - email: kgae...@tx.rr.com
http://kgbooklog.livejournal.com/
"I don't mind hidden depths but I insist that there be a surface."
-- James Nicoll
Howard Brazee
<david.robo...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>> I have found the solution to that a good while back: have Too Many
>> Books.
>
>Too Little Money :-(
I'm pulling these numbers out of thin air, but you'll get the idea:
I'd love to be wealthy - then instead of being able to do 1% of
everything I want to do, I'll be able to do 2% of everything I want to
do!
--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."
- James Madison
Howard Brazee
<sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
>> Second to, at least, The Godfather.
>
> No, I loved Jaws, I couldn't even watch The Godfather.
I loved The Godfather, couldn't sit through Jaws. Admittedly that
latter was on TV.
But even so - for that "No" to be accurate, you must have found the
book to be at least as good as the movie. Did you like Puzzo's book?
Gene Wirchenko
My middle name is "Michael". Does that count?
Sincerely,
Gene Wirchenko
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
>> Another kid's book I recently re-read and which held up very well as
>> what it was meant to be was "Runaway Robot" (generally credited to Del
>> Rey but actually by Paul W. Fairman based on an outline); I found it
>> extremely effective, and one of the most THOUGHTFUL kid's books I've
>> ever seen.
>>
>>
> I have very vivid memories of Runaway Robot as a kid decades ago but
> have not read it since. It's
> long gone from the public library shelves and afaik out of print
> I would love to see an ebook or for it to show up at Half Price Books.
At Abebooks:
http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?kn=del+rey&tn=runaway+robot&x=0&y=0
You can get it for $1.50 plus $3.00 shipping -- less than a paperback
today.
>
> yes it is probably easy to get online and ebay. but that's cheating/
> lazy.
If I want a book, there is neither cheating nor lazy, there is only do
or do not. There is no try.
> the fun is in the quest and joy of discovery rummaging thru second
> used book stores
> and garage sales.
> often cheaper too.
Alas, often filled with allergens, mold, and especially cats.
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
> On Fri, 06 Aug 2010 13:21:31 -0400, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)"
> <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
>
>>> Second to, at least, The Godfather.
>> No, I loved Jaws, I couldn't even watch The Godfather.
>
> I loved The Godfather, couldn't sit through Jaws. Admittedly that
> latter was on TV.
>
> But even so - for that "No" to be accurate, you must have found the
> book to be at least as good as the movie. Did you like Puzzo's book?
>
Couldn't finish it. I'd judge them about equal in yawniness.
tphile
> On Fri, 06 Aug 2010 13:21:31 -0400, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)"
>
> >> Second to, at least, The Godfather.
>
> > No, I loved Jaws, I couldn't even watch The Godfather.
>
> I loved The Godfather, couldn't sit through Jaws. Admittedly that
> latter was on TV.
>
> But even so - for that "No" to be accurate, you must have found the
> book to be at least as good as the movie. Did you like Puzzo's book?
>
> --
> "In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
> than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
> to the legislature, and not to the executive department."
>
> - James Madison
a lot of people couldn't sit through Jaws either, and with multiple
viewings.
Which made it the blockbuster that it is ;-)
tphile
Lynn McGuire
> http://www.amazon.com/Mutineers-Moon-Dahak-David-Weber/dp/0671720856/
>
> "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress" by Robert Heinlein
> http://www.amazon.com/Moon-Harsh-Mistress-Robert-Heinlein/dp/0312863551/
>
> "Citizen of the Galaxy" by Robert Heinlein
> http://www.amazon.com/Citizen-Galaxy-Robert-Heinlein/dp/1416505520/
>
> "Shards of Honor" and all subsequent books by Lois Bujold
> http://www.amazon.com/Shards-Honor-Lois-McMaster-Bujold/dp/0671655744/
>
> "Barrayar" by Lois Bujold
> http://www.amazon.com/Barrayar-Vorkosigan-Lois-McMaster-Bujold/dp/0743468414/
>
> "The Tar-Aiym Krang" by Alan Dean Foster
> http://www.amazon.com/Tar-Aiym-Krang-Alan-Dean-Foster/dp/034530280X/
>
> "March Upcountry" by David Weber and John Ringo
> http://www.amazon.com/March-Upcountry-David-Weber/dp/0743435389/
And a couple more:
"Old Man's War" by John Scalzi
http://www.amazon.com/Old-Mans-War-John-Scalzi/dp/0765348276/
"Red Thunder" by John Varley
http://www.amazon.com/Red-Thunder-John-Varley/dp/0441011624/
Lynn
W. Citoan
> On Fri, 06 Aug 2010 10:21:00 -0400, David DeLaney wrote:
> >
> > I have found the solution to that a good while back: have Too Many
> > Books.
>
> Too Little Money :-(
I've found myself getting more books from the library than the bookstore
recently. Not really to save money (though that's a result), but rather
because I've been trying to expand my reading habits. I'm more willing
to take a chance if I don't have to pay for it - and feel less pressure
to finish it if I don't like it.
- W. Citoan
--
Behold the dreamer, let us slay him and see what becomes of his dream.
-- Genesis
tphile
> On 2010-08-06 13:35:17 -0700, t...@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) said:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Kurt Busiek <k...@busiek.com> wrote:
> >> On 2010-08-06 12:54:21 -0700, "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> said:
>
> >>> On Aug 6, 11:01 am, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)"
> >>> <seaw...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
> >>>> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
> >>>>> In article <MPG.26c6e2567e4717c2989...@news.individual.net>,
> >>>>> Peter Huebner <no....@this.address> wrote:
> >>>>>> Also a first for me was "The Circus of Dr. Lao" which I can only
> >>>>>> recommed (picked up after a recent mention in the ng).
>
> >>>>> I could start a branching thread here, "Stories/novels that were
> >>>>> not as good as the movies they spawned," but I won't. It would
> >>>>> be a fairly short thread.
>
> >>>> With the first canonical answer being "Jaws".
>
> >>> Should I bother reading "Planet of the Apes"?
>
> >> I read it, back in the 1970s, and enjoyed it well enough. Don't
> >> remember it very well now, though.
>
> >> kdb
> >> --
>
> - Show quoted text -
wouldn't a jumping alternate reality dimension explanation work better
than time-dilation?
I don't see how Dr Milo and team could have salvage, study and launch
Taylors
spaceship before the doomsday bomb went off,
in the movies anyway.
more hand waving or in this case Ape foot waving?
tphile
and that was a rather rapid chain of events from Escape to Planet.
Kurt Busiek
> wouldn't a jumping alternate reality dimension explanation work better
> than time-dilation?
Beats me. Relativistic time passage was what it was, though.
> I don't see how Dr Milo and team could have salvage, study and launch
> Taylors spaceship before the doomsday bomb went off,
> in the movies anyway.
> more hand waving or in this case Ape foot waving?
It's PLANET OF THE APES.
Nit-picking it for realistic consistency seems like criticizing the
etiquette of a pie fight.
kdb
--
Visit http://www.busiek.com — for all your Busiek needs!
tphile
>
> - Show quoted text -
well given the circumstances, it should be Banana Cream Pies.
Sweeny Todd meat pies are not allowed
no mud pies either
tphile
David Mitchell
> In article <slrni5o58...@gatekeeper.vic.com>,
> d...@gatekeeper.vic.com (David DeLaney) writes:
>>David Mitchell <david.robo...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
>>>_The Bridge_ by Janine Ellen Young which was so unmemorable that I
>>>accidentally bought it twice.
>>
>>Occurrences like this are why I long ago started keeping a list of what
>>I actually had. (How long ago? Well, it was on floppy ... on an Apple
>>][e...)
>
> The problem with only listing the books that you have is that you might,
> like Mr. Mitchell [1], end up buying something a second time because it
> sounded good in the store. I, years ago, supplemented my catalog with a
> list of books that I had gotten rid of or was going to. What really
> bothers me is the possibility that, before I started this, I might not
> have merely bought the same *title* more than once, but possibly the
> same *book*.
>
>
> [1] It's nice to have the other first names outnumber the Mikes in a
> thread.
Hmm, I have 43 Van Vogt titles, containing all six of his stories ;-)
--
=======================================================================
= David --- If you use Microsoft products, you will, inevitably, get
= Mitchell --- viruses, so please don't add me to your address book.
=======================================================================
David Mitchell
>> I'm having a book-buying dry spell at the moment, forcing me to re-read
>> even books I didn't necessarily like first time round.
>
> Money or lack of interest ? If money then try the local library.
Lack of money, and the well of my library has run dry (they have far
fewer SF books than I have).
> If
> lack of interest then I am surprised. To me, we are living in the
> golden age now with McDevitt
...makes me cross. The way he kills everyone involved just as you start
caring for them.
>, Weber,
Read all of the free stuff, actually bought a couple of dead-tree copies.
> Hamilton,
Buy on sight, sadly I'm up to date.
> Ringo,
Read all of the free stuff, not actually bought any dead-tree copies.
> Bujold, etc
Read all of the free stuff, borrowed most of the rest, not really to my
taste.
Because my finances are currently shared with my partner, and she doesn't
read much (she _buys_ books, just doesn't read them), it's not reasonable
for me to just buy what I want to.
We allow ourselves a small budget at Christmas and birthdays, and I
normally manage to squeeze about fifteen books into mine, so I just about
keep up with the latest from Hamilton, Stross, Banks, Asher and so on
(with the welcome addition last year of WJW and Scalzi), but it's a slow
process.
Brian M. Scott
<tph...@cableone.net> wrote in
<news:6f3891c2-3849-4848...@i24g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>
in rec.arts.sf.written:
> On Aug 6, 1:29 pm, "Brian M. Scott" <b.sc...@csuohio.edu> wrote:
>> On Fri, 6 Aug 2010 07:31:38 -0700 (PDT), tphile
>> <tph...@cableone.net> wrote in
>> <news:41be793b-6b4b-4df4...@t20g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>
>> in rec.arts.sf.written:
>> [...]
>>> Juvenile works such as Danny Dunn, Three Investigators,
>>> Hardy Boys etc. have lost some of their charm, novelty
>>> and wonder.
>> They never had much for me: they were fill-in when there
>> wasn't anything better available that I hadn't already read.
>> Twice. I *will* make an exception for _David and the
>> Phoenix_, though.
> point taken, but then book reading in the sixties was a
> different experience than today.
Or in the 50s, when I read them. I agree that they'd be
less attractive to kids today; I was just noting that for me
they hadn't suffered much from the passage of time, because
I didn't have a very high opinion of them 50 years ago,
either.
[...]
Brian
David Loewe, Jr.
<mscotts...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> [1] It's nice to have the other first names outnumber the Mikes in a
>> thread.
>
>Not for long!
Right back at you...
--
"He either fears his fate too much,
Or his deserts are small,
Who dares not put it to the touch,
To win or lose it all."
- James Graham, Marquis of Montrose
Gene Wirchenko
wrote:
[snip]
>Go ahead and start that thread, it's not so short. ;-)
>
>The Scarlet Pimpernel vs the Leslie Howard classic movie.
>
>for me most any Steven King, especially Stand By Me and Shawshank
>
>and this may be heresy but LotR trilogy. I still love reading the
>books but Jacksons
>changed for the most part made sense, Glorfindel and Bombadil was no
>real loss.
>and Galadriels gift to Sam of the magic soil box made no sense and
>served no purpose
>to completing the quest. and was pointless if they failed. unlike
>elven rope that does.
She said that about her gift to him. Is it really so horriblle
to think of after the war? I rather like it myself. Reading about
what Sam did with it was a fun part of LOTR for me.
[snip]
Sincerely,
Gene Wirchenko
tphile
not so horrible but just an example of a logical and necessary change
for the better.
The Scouring of the Shire and Sam is a big fun part for me also. but
to do it would
have required another movie. What was important was to show how much
the war/adventure
had changed them. They left as boys and came back as adults.(should
say men but they are hobbits lol)
Which the riding back in splendor and the tavern scene attempted to
show.
but maybe we will someday get the cable version accurate and
unabridged.
In the case of Harry Potter, the movies come across as condensed
abridged Reader Digest versions of the books.
and there is plenty of room for a remake. That does not mean I didn't
enjoy both. I did.
But Potter is a classic example of doing movies with a book series
still in progress. Had the books been all written first
I bet the movies would have been done significantly different.
tphile
Brian M. Scott
<tph...@cableone.net> wrote in
<news:6fd91b0a-166a-49e2...@d17g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>
in rec.arts.sf.written:
[...]
> The Scouring of the Shire and Sam is a big fun part for me
> also. but to do it would have required another movie.
The Scouring of the Shire is the closing of the largest
story arc; omitting it is like throwing up a stone and
having it stop for no reason before it hits the ground. Not
that it really mattered by then, since Jackson had already
substituted his own characters for Tolkien's and quite
changed the spirit of the work.
[...]
Brian
Butch Malahide
<david.robot.mitch...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> I'm biased, as I came to science fiction when I was quite young (nine or
> so), so I read all the classics as a youth - E.E. Smith, Heinlein,
> Clarke, Vonnegut.
Classic sci-fi is Smith, Heinlein, Clarke, and . . . Vonnegut? And in
music it would be Bach, Beethoven, Brahms, and Britney?
Mike Schilling
"Butch Malahide" <fred....@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:2133d64a-2c27-4552...@t20g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
How many SF works can you name in which a character from the future says
something like "I love all the classics -- Bach, Mozart, Beethoven,
G'orthop"? WJW does this a lot in the Maijstral books, but he'll throw in
Elvis too.
Mike Ash
<2133d64a-2c27-4552...@t20g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>,
Butch Malahide <fred....@gmail.com> wrote:
The comparison does not seem apt. I'm not sure exactly what point you're
trying to make, but I can't find one that works. If you're complaining
about the quality of Vonnegut's work (which is what first comes to mind
upon seeing "Britney"), I thoroughly object, as Vonnegut is entirely
deserving of his stature. If you're complaining about the genre, much of
his work is very firmly SF, albeit of a very unconventional sort. If
it's simply a timeframe thing, Vonnegut's first published SF novel came
in 1952, just a year after Clarke's first novel, and meanwhile your
first three composers cover well over a century.
So please, clarify. :)
--
Mike Ash
Radio Free Earth
Broadcasting from our climate-controlled studios deep inside the Moon
Butch Malahide
> In article
> <2133d64a-2c27-4552-8603-a7b5e5634...@t20g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>,
> Butch Malahide <fred.gal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Aug 6, 10:55 am, David Mitchell
> > <david.robot.mitch...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> > > I'm biased, as I came to science fiction when I was quite young (nine or
> > > so), so I read all the classics as a youth - E.E. Smith, Heinlein,
> > > Clarke, Vonnegut.
>
> > Classic sci-fi is Smith, Heinlein, Clarke, and . . . Vonnegut? And in
> > music it would be Bach, Beethoven, Brahms, and Britney?
>
> The comparison does not seem apt. I'm not sure exactly what point you're
> trying to make, but I can't find one that works. If you're complaining
> about the quality of Vonnegut's work (which is what first comes to mind
> upon seeing "Britney"), I thoroughly object, as Vonnegut is entirely
> deserving of his stature. If you're complaining about the genre, much of
> his work is very firmly SF, albeit of a very unconventional sort. If
> it's simply a timeframe thing, Vonnegut's first published SF novel came
> in 1952, just a year after Clarke's first novel, and meanwhile your
> first three composers cover well over a century.
>
> So please, clarify. :)
I don't know as I *had* a point. It was just an ordinary pointless
usenet post, subjective, ill-considered, and hardly defensible. My
musical examples were certainly inapt; it seems I was mainly going for
alliteration. And I didn't mean to imply that Vonnegut couldn't write
(or that Britney can sing); _The Sirens of Titan_ and _Cat's Cradle_
were favorites of mine at the time I read them. I guess I was trying
to say that that quartet of writers sounded funny to me because one of
them was not like the others, regarding genre and timeframe. Three
real sci-fi writers and a writer of, I don't know, is "slipstream" the
word I'm looking for? I'm not sure what that means. Three old-timers
and a modern guy. I read Clarke's "The Fires Within" in 1949, at the
age of 12. The first Vonnegut I read was _Sirens_ in 1959, at age 22
or 23, i.e., eons later. So I have a hard time thinking of Vonnegut as
classic science fiction.
David Mitchell
There was no real intent behind the grouping, that's just the order they
popped into my head as I reminisced.
Mike Ash
<3638e0d5-4548-4cb8...@p7g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>,
Butch Malahide <fred....@gmail.com> wrote:
Fair enough. I can see why the inclusion of Vonnegut would appear
strange, as he's not usually put in that category. All I intended to say
was that, if you look at it more deeply, he really does belong even if
it isn't normal to include him.
Greg Goss
>Take Grisham's _The Firm_. The premise (a naïve law-school graduate taking
>a job with a law firm that's a front for the Mob) is great, and the setup is
>well-done. But once the protagonist figures it out, his clever plan is to
>run for it, and the rest of the book is a series of random chase scenes,
>where he doesn't get caught no matter what dumb things he does, and it all
>just happens to come out OK at the end.
As I read that book, I was hoping for a "Burning Chrome" ending. I
think it would have worked far better than either the ending in the
book or the ending in the movie.
--
Tomorrow is today already.
Greg Goss, 1989-01-27
T Guy
> On Fri, 6 Aug 2010 07:31:38 -0700 (PDT), tphile
> <tph...@cableone.net> wrote in
> <news:41be793b-6b4b-4df4...@t20g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>
> in rec.arts.sf.written:
>
> [...]
>
> > Juvenile works such as Danny Dunn, Three Investigators,
> > Hardy Boys etc. have lost some of their charm, novelty
> > and wonder.
>
> They never had much for me: they were fill-in when there
> wasn't anything better available that I hadn't already read.
> Twice.
It's just occurred to me, reading this post, that I read a few of the
Three Investigators books when I was about 13... a good three years
after i'd first read the Sherlock Holmes canon, or as much as I could
get my hands on.
I can no longer remember whether I read Christie before Doyle, I'm
afraid.
David DeLaney
>Mike Ash <m...@mikeash.com> wrote:
>> Butch Malahide <fred.gal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > On Aug 6, 10:55 am, David Mitchell
>> > <david.robot.mitch...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>> > > I'm biased, as I came to science fiction when I was quite young (nine or
>> > > so), so I read all the classics as a youth - E.E. Smith, Heinlein,
>> > > Clarke, Vonnegut.
>>
>> > Classic sci-fi is Smith, Heinlein, Clarke, and . . . Vonnegut? And in
>> > music it would be Bach, Beethoven, Brahms, and Britney?
>>
>> The comparison does not seem apt. I'm not sure exactly what point you're
>>
>> So please, clarify. :)
>
>I don't know as I *had* a point. It was just an ordinary pointless
ObTvTropes:
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ArsonMurderAndJaywalking
and possibly
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MyFriendsAndZoidberg
but probably not
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BreadEggsMilkSquick
Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from d...@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
Howard Brazee
>Fair enough. I can see why the inclusion of Vonnegut would appear
>strange, as he's not usually put in that category. All I intended to say
>was that, if you look at it more deeply, he really does belong even if
>it isn't normal to include him.
And times change. We no longer include A. E. Van Vogt in such a
list, although at one time he was right up there.
If we wanted to pick someone who would be elevated there sometime in
the future, Vonnegut is as good of a choice as many.
Peter Huebner
b.s...@csuohio.edu says...
Mpffh. Agreed. After seeing the second film and how it was mostly just
battle and action scenes subsuming the quest and the journey and all the
_interesting_ bits I decided I'd save myself the bother of suffering
through the third. By all accounts I was given it was even more deviant
than the second. The very fact that they left out the return to the
shire made up my mind for me.
Rather liked the first one though if memory serves.
-P.
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
> In article <19c31nsnqufcn.u6oyj6gbixfr$.d...@40tude.net>,
> b.s...@csuohio.edu says...
>> On Sun, 8 Aug 2010 06:27:41 -0700 (PDT), tphile
>> <tph...@cableone.net> wrote in
>> <news:6fd91b0a-166a-49e2...@d17g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>
>> in rec.arts.sf.written:
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>> The Scouring of the Shire and Sam is a big fun part for me
>>> also. but to do it would have required another movie.
>> The Scouring of the Shire is the closing of the largest
>> story arc; omitting it is like throwing up a stone and
>> having it stop for no reason before it hits the ground. Not
>> that it really mattered by then, since Jackson had already
>> substituted his own characters for Tolkien's and quite
>> changed the spirit of the work.
>>
>> [...]
>>
>> Brian
>
> Mpffh. Agreed. After seeing the second film and how it was mostly just
> battle and action scenes subsuming the quest and the journey and all the
> _interesting_ bits I decided I'd save myself the bother of suffering
> through the third.
Actually, the second was the weakest and overall most divergent of the
three (modulo the fact that any changes in either 1 or 2 had to be
remembered in 3); the only really annoying change was Denethor -- a
change which remains inexplicable for me, one of two changes in that
category (the other changes, while I didn't AGREE with some, I could at
least figure out the purpose behind). And by not seeing Return of the
King, you miss the Charge of the Rohirrim, which was by itself worth the
price of admission.
By all accounts I was given it was even more deviant
> than the second. The very fact that they left out the return to the
> shire made up my mind for me.
They RETURNED to the Shire, but they didn't do the Scouring. Which was
the right decision. In a book, you can have that sort of slowly dialing
it down, picking up the pieces ending. In a movie it's at the very least
tremendously difficult, and in this particular case would be crazy.
You'd add an hour onto a movie that's already over 3 hours long, and
you'd be doing it for the sake of including a piece of the story which
would be anticlimactic in the extreme compared to what went before. As
it is, people complained vehemently about how it had "too many endings",
and there's some justice in that view.
William December Starr
server ]
In article <8caqtp...@mid.individual.net>,
Greg Goss <go...@gossg.org> said:
> "Mike Schilling" <mscotts...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Take Grisham's _The Firm_. The premise (a naïve law-school
>> graduate taking a job with a law firm that's a front for the Mob)
>> is great, and the setup is well-done. But once the protagonist
>> figures it out, his clever plan is to run for it,
I'd say "the author's clever plan is to have him run for it." The
protagonist did have a clever(ish) plan for collecting massive piles
of evidence from the inside; he just got derailed when a sell-out
high up in the FBI sold him out and he had to run like hell.
-- wds
William December Starr
"Mike Schilling" <mscotts...@hotmail.com> said:
> How many SF works can you name in which a character from the
> future says something like "I love all the classics -- Bach,
> Mozart, Beethoven, G'orthop"? WJW does this a lot in the
> Maijstral books, but he'll throw in Elvis too.
[Captain Kirk] stepped closer to the console, followed by
Harb, and stood there watching the proceedings along with
several other curious crewpeople. "Captain," one of them
said to him, knotting several tentacles in a gesture of
respect. "Well rested?"
"Very well, Mr. Athende," Jim replied absently. "How's
Lt. Sjveda's musical appreciation seminar coming?"
"Classical period still, sir. Beethoven, Stravinsky,
Vaughan Williams, Barber, Lennon, Devo. Head hurts."
-- a scene on the Enterprise's Rec Deck, in
Diane Duane's MY ENEMY, MY ALLY (1984)
-- wds
Mike Ash
[Fry is playing a compact disc recording of Sir Mix-a-Lot's "Baby Got
Back;" Leela turns it off.]
Leela: Fry, you can't just sit here in the dark listening to classical
music.
Of course Futurama isn't quite "written", but Mike did say "SF works".
Moriarty
> In article <i6673o$d2...@panix2.panix.com>,
> wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > In article <i3n5r4$jm...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> > "Mike Schilling" <mscottschill...@hotmail.com> said:
>
> > > How many SF works can you name in which a character from the
> > > future says something like "I love all the classics -- Bach,
> > > Mozart, Beethoven, G'orthop"? WJW does this a lot in the
> > > Maijstral books, but he'll throw in Elvis too.
>
> > [Captain Kirk] stepped closer to the console, followed by
> > Harb, and stood there watching the proceedings along with
> > several other curious crewpeople. "Captain," one of them
> > said to him, knotting several tentacles in a gesture of
> > respect. "Well rested?"
>
> > "Very well, Mr. Athende," Jim replied absently. "How's
> > Lt. Sjveda's musical appreciation seminar coming?"
>
> > "Classical period still, sir. Beethoven, Stravinsky,
> > Vaughan Williams, Barber, Lennon, Devo. Head hurts."
>
> > -- a scene on the Enterprise's Rec Deck, in
> > Diane Duane's MY ENEMY, MY ALLY (1984)
>
> [Fry is playing a compact disc recording of Sir Mix-a-Lot's "Baby Got
> Back;" Leela turns it off.]
> Leela: Fry, you can't just sit here in the dark listening to classical
> music.
>
> Of course Futurama isn't quite "written", but Mike did say "SF works".
Also non-written, from Red Dwarf:
Rimmer: Why don't you listen to something really classical, like
Mozart, Mendelssohn or Motörhead?
-Moriarty
Michael Stemper
>In article <i6673o$d2u$1...@panix2.panix.com>, wds...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote:
>> In article <i3n5r4$jmr$1...@news.eternal-september.org>, "Mike Schilling" <mscotts...@hotmail.com> said:
>> > How many SF works can you name in which a character from the
>> > future says something like "I love all the classics -- Bach,
>> > Mozart, Beethoven, G'orthop"? WJW does this a lot in the
>> > Maijstral books, but he'll throw in Elvis too.
>> "Very well, Mr. Athende," Jim replied absently. "How's
>> Lt. Sjveda's musical appreciation seminar coming?"
>>
>> "Classical period still, sir. Beethoven, Stravinsky,
>> Vaughan Williams, Barber, Lennon, Devo. Head hurts."
>[Fry is playing a compact disc recording of Sir Mix-a-Lot's "Baby Got
>Back;" Leela turns it off.]
>Leela: Fry, you can't just sit here in the dark listening to classical
>music.
>
>Of course Futurama isn't quite "written", but Mike did say "SF works".
If we can throw in TV shows, there's
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chase_%28Doctor_Who%29#Plot>
in which "Ticket to Ride" is referred to as "classical". Of course, now,
it nearly qualifies.
--
Michael F. Stemper
#include <Standard_Disclaimer>
There is three erors in this sentence.
Jerry Brown
Also, also non-written, from Doctor Who: The Chase - Episode 1 (1965):
Barbara: Well, what do you think of them [The Beatles], Vicki?
Vicki: Well, they're marvellous, but I didn't know they played
classical music.
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBw5tOeXWkY>
Jerry Brown
--
A cat may look at a king
(but probably won't bother)
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Maybe we need another word than "written". Futurama, at least, was very
cleverly "written".
Ted
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