water seeks it's own level

[The Starmaker]

water seeks it's own level



What does that mean?

[Sylvia Else]

On 4/05/2015 1:02 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> water seeks it's own level
>
>
>
> What does that mean?
>

It's just a statement in fluid mechanics. For example, take a flexible
tube, and partially fill it with water, and lift the ends of the tube.
The level of water at the two ends will be the same, regardless of the
path taken by the tube between its ends.

Caveat - there must be no difference in atmospheric pressure at the two
ends of the tube.

It's a useful result - it provides a convenient way of levelling
objects. But it's not philosophically deep and meaningful, if that's
what you imagined.

Sylvia.

[Dirk Van de moortel]

Sylvia Else schreef op 04-mei-2015 om 05:46:

Add water, makes its own sauce.

Dirk Vdm

[HVAC]

On 5/3/2015 11:02 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> water seeks it's own level
>
>
>
> What does that mean?

It's a tautology. It's right up there with "Shit rolls downhill".




--
Cut off one head, two more shall take its place.
HAIL HYDRA!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZcG5UOY224

[Sesiom]

use to find if you foundation is level

[bil...@m.nu]

Great answer sylvia; however, it is a bit out of context. You must
consider the source of the question. In this case it is starmaker,
therefore the correct answer of what does it mean when water seeks its
on level is that starmaker is an idiot. Later he will repeat what you
said exept he will say something like it is only done by the grace of
god...

[benj]

Actually not true unless you stretch it. The standard mason tool is a
bubble level.

--
___ ___ ___ ___
/\ \ /\ \ /\__\ /\ \
/::\ \ /::\ \ /::| | \:\ \
/:/\:\ \ /:/\:\ \ /:|:| | ___ /::\__\
/::\~\:\__\ /::\~\:\ \ /:/|:| |__ /\ /:/\/__/
/:/\:\ \:|__| /:/\:\ \:\__\ /:/ |:| /\__\ \:\/:/ /
\:\~\:\/:/ / \:\~\:\ \/__/ \/__|:|/:/ / \::/ /
\:\ \::/ / \:\ \:\__\ |:/:/ / \/__/
\:\/:/ / \:\ \/__/ |::/ /
\_:/__/ \:\__\ /:/ /
\/__/ \/__/

[Sylvia Else]

I didn't entirely ignore the source. My comment about philosophy would
not have been included if I'd been sure the question was intended to be
purely about physics.

Sylvia.

[The Starmaker]

Of course the question is purely physics...it's just the answers are a
little confusing to me.

I don't get the "lift the ends of the tube".


That is the tube doing the leveling, not the water.

[Sylvia Else]

If you don't lift the ends of the tube, then the water will get out.

With the ends lifted, the water level will be below the level of the
ends of the tube. The level of the water will be the same at both ends,
even though the ends of the tube will be higher, and need not be the same.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-r12l904ow

Sylvia.

[The Starmaker]

i don't get it.


I imagined "water" seeking it's own level...without help ... "it's own level".

"water seeks it's own level"

i'm still trying to figure out what it really means...

i mean, what is the water doing to reach it's own level.

[Sylvia Else]

It's just a saying. It's not meant to be a description of the physical
mechanism.

It is easy enough to demonstrate, by means of fluid mechanics, that if
the levels are different, then there will be a net force on the water
that pushes it in a direction that reduces the difference in the levels.
The levels will oscillate above and below their equal positions, with
the oscillation being rapidly damped by friction.

Sylvia.

[art...@yahoo.com]

On Sunday, May 3, 2015 at 11:47:02 PM UTC-4, Sylvia Else wrote:
> On 4/05/2015 1:02 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> > water seeks it's own level

> > What does that mean?

> It's just a statement in fluid mechanics. For example, take a flexible
> tube, and partially fill it with water, and lift the ends of the tube.
> The level of water at the two ends will be the same, regardless of the
> path taken by the tube between its ends.
>
> Caveat - there must be no difference in atmospheric pressure at the two
> ends of the tube.

Is there an SF story where water doesn't seek it's own level? Other than out of ignorance of the author? (Or a bad SF movie)

[Greg Goss]

Aren't the two ends of the Panama canal at slightly different average
levels?
--
We are geeks. Resistance is voltage over current.

[Don Bruder]

In article <cqs18m...@mid.individual.net>,

That's why there's a lock-system on the canal. It's been years since I
studied the canal in school, but unless I'm mis-remembering, the pacific
end is a good deal higher than the atlantic end - Exactly how much "a
good deal" is, I don't remember without looking it up, but as I
understand things, without the locks, the canal would be a saltwater
river flowing from the pacific to the atlantic, with several "white
water" sections in between.

--
Security provided by Mssrs Smith and/or Wesson. Brought to you by the letter Q

[Alan Baker]

That wouldn't happen...

...because while the Pacific may be higher than the Atlantic at the
Panamanian isthmus, the middle of the canal system is higher than both.

[Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy]

Don Bruder <dak...@sonic.net> wrote in
news:miaqj0$8p6$1...@dont-email.me:

> In article <cqs18m...@mid.individual.net>,
> Greg Goss <go...@gossg.org> wrote:
>
>> "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >On Sunday, May 3, 2015 at 11:47:02 PM UTC-4, Sylvia Else
>> >wrote:
>> >> On 4/05/2015 1:02 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
>> >> > water seeks it's own level
>> >
>> >> > What does that mean?
>> >
>> >> It's just a statement in fluid mechanics. For example, take
>> >> a flexible tube, and partially fill it with water, and lift
>> >> the ends of the tube. The level of water at the two ends
>> >> will be the same, regardless of the path taken by the tube
>> >> between its ends.
>> >>
>> >> Caveat - there must be no difference in atmospheric pressure
>> >> at the two ends of the tube.
>> >
>> >Is there an SF story where water doesn't seek it's own level?
>> >Other than out of ignorance of the author? (Or a bad SF movie)
>>
>> Aren't the two ends of the Panama canal at slightly different
>> average levels?
>
> That's why there's a lock-system on the canal.

Er, no, not really. One side is higher than thwe other, yes, but
the reason for the locks is that the middle is rather higher than
either end, and digging a sea level channel all the way through
proved too difficult and expensive.

--
Terry Austin

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

[The Starmaker]

Now I'm more confused.."It's just a saying."??? Is has nothing to do
with...physics?

[The Starmaker]

pnal...@gmail.com wrote:

>
> On Tuesday, May 5, 2015 at 1:24:15 AM UTC-7, The Starmaker wrote:
>
> > i mean, what is the water doing to reach it's own level.
>

> Duh.... flowing downwards constantly... unless it finds its own level, whereupon it ceases flowing at all.



"it finds its own level"? How does this 'finding' process works? I mean, ...I know how to find things, I look for it
with my eyes or hands...is the "water"...finding things? Does the 'water' know where to look?

[benj]

On 05/05/2015 02:20 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> Sylvia Else wrote:
>>
>> On 5/05/2015 6:24 PM, The Starmaker wrote:

>> It's just a saying. It's not meant to be a description of the physical
>> mechanism.
>
> Now I'm more confused.."It's just a saying."??? Is has nothing to do
> with...physics?

OF course you are confused! This has to do with science and physics so
you and Herb are left in the dust.

It's just a practical observation of the behavior of water based upon
several scientific misconceptions.

So people in ancient times noticed that if you have a U shaped pipe, the
water in one leg is the same height as the water in the other leg. Hence
the "water seeks its own level".

But the physics is rather more complex than that (which is why people
like YOU should never be allowed to write popular science articles or
produced shows like Nova) As "Sylvia" mentioned there is a requirement
that atmospheric pressure be the same at both ends of the tube. Also
there is the requirement that the force of gravity be the same. And
finally there is an implicit assumption that "your" universe is composed
of Euclidean space.

Naturally all these assumptions while reasonably true in the case of
just general observations (as in the case of "shit rolls downhill") are
NOT true when one measures them in great detail. This is the normal
thing for science. Gravity is not constant everywhere. Barometric
pressure varies from here to there, and finally the Earth is NOT flat.
The Ocean is not "flat". Water in "seeking its own level" actually
follows a curved path like the surface of the seas.

So "Starmaker" Quick and dirty soundbites and slogans like you and
wormley like to brainwash the public with may have a certain loose
validity but they are certain NOT careful science.

Got it?

Why am I bothering with you?

>> It is easy enough to demonstrate, by means of fluid mechanics, that if
>> the levels are different, then there will be a net force on the water
>> that pushes it in a direction that reduces the difference in the levels.
>> The levels will oscillate above and below their equal positions, with
>> the oscillation being rapidly damped by friction.
>>
>> "Sylvia".

[The Starmaker]

benj wrote:
>
> On 05/05/2015 02:20 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> > Sylvia Else wrote:
> >>
> >> On 5/05/2015 6:24 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
>
> >> It's just a saying. It's not meant to be a description of the physical
> >> mechanism.
> >
> > Now I'm more confused.."It's just a saying."??? Is has nothing to do
> > with...physics?
>
> OF course you are confused! This has to do with science and physics so
> you and Herb are left in the dust.
>
> It's just a practical observation of the behavior of water based upon
> several scientific misconceptions.

"behavior"? So 'water' acts in a certain way? It...seeks?

[Alan Baker]

Once again, you are demonstrating your ignorance of the English language...

[benj]

So it does. Water is smart! In physics, however they say that water
exper4iences a "behavior field" which is to day that behavior exits
without anything doing the behaving. This is why "modern" physics is so
hard for the layman to understand! (basically because it is nonsense)

I see the fact that the earth is not flat did not interest you at all!

[The Starmaker]

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/seek

seek
verb \'sek\

: to search for (someone or something) : to try to find (someone or something)

: to ask for (help, advice, etc.)

: to try to get or achieve (something)


If water seeks it's own level...then it is trying to find something. It must have a mind of it's own...

[Sylvia Else]

The statement is not to be taken literally. Water doesn't seek anything.

Sylvia.

[benj]

No.

Does Sam Wormley have a mind of his own or does he simply follow rules?
What would we characterize by the word "mind". What do YOU mean by
"mind"? So you want to play word games instead of science? Well that is
the "modern" thing. But in your case, FAR more appropriate because words
and the meanings of them IS something you do.

So let us begin with "mind". The meaning we wish to discuss here with
respect to water would be #2. "An element or of complex of elements in
an individual that feels, perceives, thinks, wills and especially reasons".

So the first thing we have to ascertain would be is water an
"individual"? Well. that sort of implies that mind is something limited
to humans, but we can ask do animals think or even reason in perhaps a
crude way? And most of us now believe they do. Well, what about
something not alive? Well does a stone feel, perceives, think and
reason? Most agree they do not. However let us not be too restrictive
here and jump to conclusions about "mind". Could water actually feel,
perceive, think and reason? in truth since we have not much communicated
with water nor have we seen any reactions indicating "perception" it is
not clear, but it COULD be possible and just that we really simply can't
talk to water to find out what it's internal processes are.

But that is speculation. What we do know is that water "seeks it's own
level." And what that means is that water follows certain rules so that
when subjected to certain conditions it ALWAYS reacts in the same way.
This gives those who believe that all science MUST be repeatable to be
valid a huge orgasm. But it also places water out of the "individual"
category. Thus rule following is NOT "reason" or "thinking". That is why
even true individuals like Wormley have no minds to speak of.

But since we are playing journalist word games let us note that the word
"mind" is also a transitive verb meaning to "follow orders or
instructions of", which is to say to "make children "mind"". And water
clearly is indeed following the rules of physics when "seeking it's own
level". So clearly there is much more here than meets the eye not only
at a material observational level but also at a philosophical one as well.

So do you believe water has ghosts? HVAC wants to know because he
believes in them, and like you he is a "wordsmith" (His
self-characterization) and like you knows nothing of real science.

[benj]

On 05/05/2015 11:40 PM, Sylvia Else wrote:
> On 6/05/2015 12:27 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
>> benj wrote:
>>>
>>> On 05/05/2015 07:22 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
>>>> benj wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On 05/05/2015 02:20 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
>>>>>> Sylvia Else wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 5/05/2015 6:24 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's just a saying. It's not meant to be a description of
>>>>>>> the physical mechanism.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Now I'm more confused.."It's just a saying."??? Is has
>>>>>> nothing to do with...physics?
>>>>>
>>>>> OF course you are confused! This has to do with science and
>>>>> physics so you and Herb are left in the dust.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's just a practical observation of the behavior of water
>>>>> based upon several scientific misconceptions.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "behavior"? So 'water' acts in a certain way? It...seeks?
>>>
>>> So it does. Water is smart! In physics, however they say that
>>> water exper4iences a "behavior field" which is to day that behavior
>>> exits without anything doing the behaving. This is why "modern"
>>> physics is so hard for the layman to understand! (basically because
>>> it is nonsense)
>>>
>>> I see the fact that the earth is not flat did not interest you at
>>> all!

>> http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/seek
>>
>> seek verb \'sek\
>>
>> : to search for (someone or something) : to try to find (someone or
>> something)
>>
>> : to ask for (help, advice, etc.)
>>
>> : to try to get or achieve (something)
>>
>>
>> If water seeks it's own level...then it is trying to find something.
>> It must have a mind of it's own...
>>
>
> The statement is not to be taken literally. Water doesn't seek anything.
>
> Sylvia.

Sure it does, "Sylvia"! It "seeks" it's own level. You yourself said it
oscillates about it's own level homing in on it! That sure sounds like
"seeking" to most of us here!

[Sylvia Else]

To seek implies some degree of volition. Water has none, and Starman has
a world view that makes him easily confused.

Sylvia.

[benj]

So the question is what does "try" mean? if we say a missile is
"seeking" a target and it's simply using an algorithm to center it's
trajectory on say some image, is it "trying"? It is DOING something. But
is it "volition"? I would argue that the "rules" that make water find
it's own level are indeed a primitive kind of volition. But then we are
careening dangerously close back to the discussion what is "mind".

As to Starfaker being easily confused, there nothing but pure scientific
consensus in that regard.

[Sylvia Else]

Or just the meaning of words, which is rarely useful.

Sylvia.

[Paul Colquhoun]

It's a language problem. English does not have the words to cover these
situations, because when it was evolving these distinctions were not
being made. Everything was thought to have some kind of spirit or
guiding being, so assigning volition to things made sense at the time.


--
Reverend Paul Colquhoun, ULC. http://andor.dropbear.id.au/
Asking for technical help in newsgroups? Read this first:
http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#intro

[Greg Goss]

Don Bruder <dak...@sonic.net> wrote:

> Greg Goss <go...@gossg.org> wrote:

>> Aren't the two ends of the Panama canal at slightly different average
>> levels?
>
>That's why there's a lock-system on the canal. It's been years since I
>studied the canal in school, but unless I'm mis-remembering, the pacific
>end is a good deal higher than the atlantic end - Exactly how much "a
>good deal" is, I don't remember without looking it up, but as I
>understand things, without the locks, the canal would be a saltwater
>river flowing from the pacific to the atlantic, with several "white
>water" sections in between.

That might be true for the Suez, but the Panama has to cross a set of
hills, using fresh water from a hilltop lake.

[benj]

Agreed, but nevertheless word games are the essence of "modern" physics.
We find such ideas as probability waves in nothing at all or behavior
fields where there is nothing to do the behaving. Yet, to discuss that
such illogical things defy the definition of the words involved is seen
to have little utility.

The beauty of expressing idea in ill-defined words is that the illogic
and ambiguities that result give the impression to the layman (and
unthinking specialist) that since the discussion is so obscure and
complex that you must be really, really smart!

[The Starmaker]

the mind is mostly made of...water.

[bil...@m.nu]

or in your case, sewage run off

[benj]

Starfaker, as usual this is nothing but babbling drooling gibberish.

Is there ANY hope for you? The thought of you influencing people who
don't know any better is absolutely frightening!

[The Starmaker]

What percentage of the mind is made of water?

[The Starmaker]

water seeks it's own level because water has self-determination

[The Starmaker]

The Starmaker wrote:
>
> water seeks it's own level because water has self-determination

mind comes from...water..


from a warm little pond.

[The Starmaker]

The Starmaker wrote:

> the mind is mostly made of...water.

I'll explain How it works...


The mind...that part...thinking, feeling..is produced by ...water.


The brain is mostly made of water.


It needs the water to generate...electricity.


Water....makes..electricity, electricity makes...thinking. Or mind..


Go drink a glass of water...