This morning's crap idea.

[William Vetter]

Has there ever been a story published where a lousy SF author
time-travels back to the Golden Age to throw his trunk stories over the
transom and into a 1930's slushpile?

[Shawn Wilson]

Not that I can think of. I CAN think of a story where a successful writer wants to rub his teachers face in a story that the teacher said was crap. The denouement being that the writer ultimately agrees that the story WAS crap.

[pete...@gmail.com]

No, but I do recall one where a modern goes back to the 50s, and sells a
lot of future-for-then famous stories to a Campbell expy. He gets suspicious
when faced with manuscripts which (i) were clearly "typed" on continuous,
perforated paper, (ii) contain no typos whatsoever, (iii) are in a wide
variety of styles, and (iv) include a story he's seen from another
author, but had rejected.

He confronts the author, and she shows him some minor examples of future tech
(he's unimpressed by Star Wars, color, incredible effects, but clunky plot).

IIRC, the traveller was trying to get the future bootstrapped faster then
it happened, for reasons....

pt

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <mr2cek$4kn$1...@dont-email.me>,

There's something like it, a story by Harry Turtledove, let me
look up the title.

...

The title is "Hindsight," and it's collected in _Kaleidoscope_.
A woman from, hmmm, from her computer equipment I'll guess the
early 1990s, time-travels back to the early 1950s and starts
selling to the SF magazines stories that other people were going
to write in the intervening years. She also writes stories of
her own (she is a far-from-lousy writer) about what's going to
happen in the intervening years.

She gets found out when she gets published, in a thinly-veiled
_Astounding,_ a story that the viewpoint character had already
written and not yet submitted.

Turns out her motive is to change the public viewpoint toward
things like science and away from things like Nixon.

--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Should you wish to email me, you'd better use the gmail edress.
Kithrup's all spammy and hotmail's been hacked.

[pete...@gmail.com]

On Wednesday, August 19, 2015 at 1:15:06 PM UTC-4, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
> In article <mr2cek$4kn$1...@dont-email.me>,
> William Vetter <mdha...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >Has there ever been a story published where a lousy SF author
> >time-travels back to the Golden Age to throw his trunk stories over the
> >transom and into a 1930's slushpile?
>
> There's something like it, a story by Harry Turtledove, let me
> look up the title.
>
> ...
>
> The title is "Hindsight," and it's collected in _Kaleidoscope_.

Clearly, that is the story I was also trying to describe at the same
time.

pt

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <57ff9cfa-dc8b-4b85...@googlegroups.com>,

<pete...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Wednesday, August 19, 2015 at 12:57:33 PM UTC-4, William Vetter wrote:
>> Has there ever been a story published where a lousy SF author
>> time-travels back to the Golden Age to throw his trunk stories over the
>> transom and into a 1930's slushpile?
>
>No, but I do recall one where a modern goes back to the 50s, and sells a
>lot of future-for-then famous stories to a Campbell expy. He gets suspicious
>when faced with manuscripts which (i) were clearly "typed" on continuous,
>perforated paper, (ii) contain no typos whatsoever, (iii) are in a wide
>variety of styles, and (iv) include a story he's seen from another
>author, but had rejected.

Actually, it's the author who has written the story and not yet
submitted it. He confronts her with the title, and she says,
"Oh, shit. You were already working on it."

>
>He confronts the author, and she shows him some minor examples of future tech
>(he's unimpressed by Star Wars, color, incredible effects, but clunky plot).
>
>IIRC, the traveller was trying to get the future bootstrapped faster then
>it happened, for reasons....

It's Turtledove's "Hindsight," which I just looked up.

[William Vetter]

Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
> In article <mr2cek$4kn$1...@dont-email.me>,
> William Vetter <mdha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Has there ever been a story published where a lousy SF author
>> time-travels back to the Golden Age to throw his trunk stories over the
>> transom and into a 1930's slushpile?
>
> There's something like it, a story by Harry Turtledove, let me
> look up the title.
>
> ...
>
> The title is "Hindsight," and it's collected in _Kaleidoscope_.

Ah, see, I wake up with an idea that I think is so crappy, I might as
well post it on usenet; and then you're telling me some guy got a
publication out of it. Make my day, why don't cha.

[Don Bruder]

In article <mr2f0d$f46$1...@dont-email.me>,

A man's gotta know his limitations... :)

--
Security provided by Mssrs Smith and/or Wesson. Brought to you by the letter Q

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <mr2f0d$f46$1...@dont-email.me>,

Well, you weren't very far off. It's merely that the writer was
not lousy, and, face it, in the Golden Age really lousy writing
would probably not get bought either.

At one point the 1950s writer says, "It's an old theme, go back
in time and make a fortune..." and the time-traveler says, "A
fortune? At three cents a word?"

The nice thing about "Hindsight" is that Turtledove remembers
1950s California in detail, as I do, and put a lot of little
details in and got them right.

[William Vetter]

Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
> In article <mr2f0d$f46$1...@dont-email.me>,
> William Vetter <mdha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>> In article <mr2cek$4kn$1...@dont-email.me>,
>>> William Vetter <mdha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Has there ever been a story published where a lousy SF author
>>>> time-travels back to the Golden Age to throw his trunk stories over the
>>>> transom and into a 1930's slushpile?
>>>
>>> There's something like it, a story by Harry Turtledove, let me
>>> look up the title.
>>>
>>> ...
>>>
>>> The title is "Hindsight," and it's collected in _Kaleidoscope_.
>>
>> Ah, see, I wake up with an idea that I think is so crappy, I might as
>> well post it on usenet; and then you're telling me some guy got a
>> publication out of it. Make my day, why don't cha.
>
> Well, you weren't very far off. It's merely that the writer was
> not lousy, and, face it, in the Golden Age really lousy writing
> would probably not get bought either.
>

What I was thinking is that the intrepid timecop who's saved reality
fifty times already is angry how he's been stuck with staking out a
pulp magazine editor's brownstone, and then intercepts the criminal,
but when he reads the first three lines of the ms., he knows how
totally lousy the ms. is, that it would get rejected no matter what,
and feels so bad he waits until morning with the crappy author to see
Hugo Gernsback (or somebody) walk to the subway.

Such was my crappy idea which I decided wasn't worth wasting more
energy on.

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

There's also the classic story of an author submitting his awesome
stories and finding out that they were already published by an author
they had previously never heard of (who was obviously time-travelling to
steal the stories and publish them before the original submission).
"Who's Cribbing?" was the title, and the poor author was constantly
being told that his work was wonderful, since it was copying the work of
the great Todd Thromberry...


--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.livejournal.com

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <mr2td9$8vh$1...@dont-email.me>,

Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor) <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
>On 8/19/15 12:57 PM, William Vetter wrote:
>> Has there ever been a story published where a lousy SF author
>> time-travels back to the Golden Age to throw his trunk stories over the
>> transom and into a 1930's slushpile?
>
> There's also the classic story of an author submitting his awesome
>stories and finding out that they were already published by an author
>they had previously never heard of (who was obviously time-travelling to
>steal the stories and publish them before the original submission).
>"Who's Cribbing?" was the title, and the poor author was constantly
>being told that his work was wonderful, since it was copying the work of
>the great Todd Thromberry...
>

And there was an Analog story about a musician who was so tuned into
the zeitgeist/steam-engine-time that he was always writing famous composers'
pieces first, but of course since he was an unknown composition grad student,
nobody believed it..
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..

[Dimensional Traveler]

So he can wave at them as he runs past them.

--
Veni, vidi, snarki.

[William December Starr]

In article <mr2cek$4kn$1...@dont-email.me>,

"Time Patrol, sir. We're here to give you a citation for painfully
stupid use of a time machine."

-- wds

[Greg Goss]

Indeed, that WAS the plotline, as described further down the thread.

>What I was thinking is that the intrepid timecop who's saved reality
>fifty times already is angry how he's been stuck with staking out a
>pulp magazine editor's brownstone, and then intercepts the criminal,
>but when he reads the first three lines of the ms., he knows how
>totally lousy the ms. is, that it would get rejected no matter what,
>and feels so bad he waits until morning with the crappy author to see
>Hugo Gernsback (or somebody) walk to the subway.

--
We are geeks. Resistance is voltage over current.

[Don Kuenz]

Thank you sharing Dorothy.

"Hindsight" also appears under the pseudonym Eric G Iverson in Analog
Science Fiction/Science Fact, Mid-December 1984. "Hindsight" reminds me
of "Bob Dylan, Troy Jonson, and the Speed Queen" by F Paul Wilson.

The travelers in both stories take rock music records and turntables
back with them in time. And both travelers plagiarize future works.
"Hindsight" has literature stolen while "Bob Dylan" has music stolen.

The motives of the travelers also differ. "Hindsight" wants to save the
world, while "Bob Dylan" wants to be a rock star. Here's some dialog
from "Hindsight" for the lulz.
A couple of people were already waiting by the post
office boxes, and several more came in after Pete and
McGregor. "They can't *all* be writers," Pete whispered
behind his hand.
The editor rolled his eyes. "You'd be amazed."

--
,-. There was a young lady named Bright
\_/ Whose speed was far faster than light;
{|||)< Don Kuenz KB7RPU She set out one day
/ \ In a relative way
`-' And returned on the previous night.

What you do speaks so loud that I can not hear what you say. - Emerson.

[Kay Shapero]

In article <8ea25ada-89a3-4116...@googlegroups.com>,
ikono...@gmail.com says...

Did something similar (though not as a pro writer) - there was a story I
wrote and bounced off the usual batch of sf magazines, collecting form
rejection slips. I put it in a drawer and forgot about it. Dug it out
when a friend started a sf fanzine and offered to publish it if I would
type it onto the stencil. I reread it first, winced, and rejected it
myself.

--

Kay Shapero
Address munged, try my first name at kayshapero dot net.

[Dorothy J Heydt]

Heh. I can believe it.

Not *selling* writers, but *attempting* writers.

[William Vetter]

I think that editors like to buy this sort of thing, that talks about
their lives, but I'm not sure readers want to see it particularly. A
lot of stuff like this appears in small press magazines...the editor
suffers under a curse that forces her to read all the slush, things
like that.

[William Vetter]

Greg Goss wrote:
> wds...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote:
>
>> In article <mr2cek$4kn$1...@dont-email.me>,
>> William Vetter <mdha...@gmail.com> said:
>>
>>> Has there ever been a story published where a lousy SF author
>>> time-travels back to the Golden Age to throw his trunk stories
>>> over the transom and into a 1930's slushpile?
>>
>> "Time Patrol, sir. We're here to give you a citation for painfully
>> stupid use of a time machine."
>
> Indeed, that WAS the plotline, as described further down the thread.
>

If I ever have a smart idea, I won't post it on usenet.

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <mr4m4l$m62$1...@dont-email.me>,

FWIF, I think the story was in a "Kelvin Throop" issue of Analog.

[William Vetter]

The curse one I think of was in 1990's Fantastic or Weird Tales or
Absolute Magnitude or one of those, and I think the title was even
"Slush," but there are a lot when the slushpile comes alive and
attacks, something like that.

[Kevrob]

Does "Bob Dylan" have his own music stolen, or the stuff he put his name
on that was recycled folk tunes [For example: Words of "With God On Our
Side" but tune from the folk ballad "The Merry month Of May" by way
of Dominic Behan's "The Patriot Game." Or the tune of "Nottamun Town"]
is used for "Masters of War.]

More recent "borrowing" pointed out, here:

http://dissidentvoice.org/2013/12/bob-dylan-and-plagiarism/

[quote]

Modern Times was notable in that it saw Dylan make considerable use of the poems of Confederate Poet Henry Timrod as lyrical fodder. Many of Dylan's lyrical constructions and exact phrasings were shown to be direct borrows from Timrod, as well as from other sources including the Ovid. Further, the songs seemed to lack focus and felt as though they were simply assembled from snippets of various sources rather than carrying the crisper narratives that characterized Dylan's earlier work.

The liner notes carried no notation or footnotes on sources. Indeed, the songs were credited as "Words and music by Bob Dylan" a point that was particularly glaring as almost every single song on the album was a reworking of an old blues, jazz or R & B number. For example, "Rollin' and Tumblin'" was little more than the addendum of some new lyrics to the Muddy Waters' arrangement of the blues standard of the same name, "Beyond the Horizon" was identical musically and similar lyrically to "Red Sails In The Sunset", "When the Deal Goes Down" was musically identical to the Bing Crosby hit "Where The Blue of the Night (Meets The Gold Of The Day)", "Thunder on the Mountain" and "When the Levee Breaks" were borrowed Memphis Minnie numbers, "Ain't Talkin'" a remake of the Stanley Brothers song "River of Regret" and so on. While some of this can be thought of Dylan's use of the folk tradition, the decision to credit the songs both lyrically and musically to himself is telling. In light of Dylan's satellite radio program, it is strange that Dylan would not opt to credit this music to its writers, some of whom are still alive if not living in obscurity and likely could stand to earn royalties from their work following it's reuse.

[/quote]

It continues to critique parts of his memoir, "Chronicles," for lifting
from previous works.

Writing new lyrics to old folk tunes that no one knows who wrote, and would be long out of copyright even if we did, is one thing. Grabbing the work of living
authors due royalties is another. Even if the source material is in the public
domain, the handsome thing to do is to note the original version in the credits
of the work.

> >> Here's some dialog
> >> from "Hindsight" for the lulz.

> >> A couple of people were already waiting by the post
> >> office boxes, and several more came in after Pete and
> >> McGregor. "They can't *all* be writers," Pete whispered
> >> behind his hand.
> >> The editor rolled his eyes. "You'd be amazed."
> >>
> >
> > Heh. I can believe it.
> >
> > Not *selling* writers, but *attempting* writers.
>
> I think that editors like to buy this sort of thing, that talks about
> their lives, but I'm not sure readers want to see it particularly. A
> lot of stuff like this appears in small press magazines...the editor
> suffers under a curse that forces her to read all the slush, things
> like that.

Gaah! How many second-person-omniscient-middle-aged-English-
professor-having-midlife-crisis-and-an-affair-with-a-student
tales could one read before defenestrating oneself?

Kevin R

[Richard Hershberger]

FWIW, I remembered the story. I read it probably in the Turtledove collection, or possibly in the original magazine publication. Either way it is a good bet that I haven't read it in a quarter century, but it stuck. I particularly remember the discussion about the paper, which was perforated on the sides since the printer technology when the story was written still had to strips on either side with the holes.

Richard R. Hershberger

[Jack Bohn]

Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor) wrote:
>
> There's also the classic story of an author submitting his awesome
> stories and finding out that they were already published by an author
> they had previously never heard of (who was obviously time-travelling to
> steal the stories and publish them before the original submission).
> "Who's Cribbing?" was the title, and the poor author was constantly
> being told that his work was wonderful, since it was copying the work of
> the great Todd Thromberry...

There was a Clarke story...
"Herbert George Morely Roberts Wells, Esq." ISFDb has it listed as an essay, not fiction, and has a listing for "The Anticipator," so (unless they are just playing along) that is the story to reference. In a pre-Internet forum, Clarke had conflated the title of that story with "The New Accelerator" and written it as "The New Anticipator". He was surprised to find "The Anticipator" was not and H.G. Wells story, but by Morely Roberts. He then gave a brief synopsis: a writer is finding his stories published under another name before he submits them, eventually snapping, he plots a murderous solution, but he *is* dealing with a man who steals his plots... Clarke then notes that Roberts had not had many stories published; what ever happened to him, and where did Wells get his ideas, anyhow...

--
-Jack

[Lawrence Watt-Evans]

On Thu, 20 Aug 2015 10:35:08 -0400, William Vetter
<mdha...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Ted Nolantednolan> wrote:
>> In article <mr4m4l$m62$1...@dont-email.me>,
>> William Vetter <mdha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>> In article <2015...@crcomp.net>, Don Kuenz <gar...@crcomp.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Dorothy J Heydt <djh...@kithrup.com> wrote:
>>>>>> In article <mr2f0d$f46$1...@dont-email.me>,
>>>>>> William Vetter <mdha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>>>>>> In article <mr2cek$4kn$1...@dont-email.me>,
>>>>>>>> William Vetter <mdha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Has there ever been a story published where a lousy SF author
>>>>>>>>> time-travels back to the Golden Age to throw his trunk stories over
>>>>>>>>> the transom and into a 1930's slushpile?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There's something like it, a story by Harry Turtledove, let me
>>>>>>>> look up the title.
>>>>>

The attacking slushpile was in "It Came from the Slushpile." Don't
remember where it first appeared.




--
My webpage is at http://www.watt-evans.com

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

[Brian M. Scott]

On Thu, 20 Aug 2015 13:12:19 -0400, Lawrence Watt-Evans
<l...@sff.net> wrote
in<news:vg2ctap1g27nig0k3...@reader80.eternal-september.org>
in rec.arts.sf.written:

[...]

> The attacking slushpile was in "It Came from the
> Slushpile." Don't remember where it first appeared.

Aboriginal Science Fiction, July-August 1987, according to
ISFDB.

Brian
--
It was the neap tide, when the baga venture out of their
holes to root for sandtatties. The waves whispered
rhythmically over the packed sand: haggisss, haggisss,
haggisss.

[Don Kuenz]

The wannabe rock star hopes to arrange things so that Dylan picks him
over the Byrds for the upcoming debut cover of "Mr Tamborine Man." To
suitably impress Dylan the wannabe plays "originals" such as "Jumping
Jack Flash," "Summer in the City," "Taxman," "Bad Moon Rising," "Rikki
Don't Lose That Number," "Statesboro Blues," "American Tune," "Won't Get
Fooled Again," "Life During Wartime," and so on at a local club until a
suitably impressed Dylan shows up to catch wannabe's act. And that's
when the fun begins. :)

[Kevrob]

OK, 1965.

> To suitably impress Dylan the wannabe plays "originals" such as "Jumping

> Jack Flash [1968]," "Summer in the City[1966] ," [1966] "Taxman," [1966]
> "Bad Moon Rising [1969]," "Rikki Don't Lose That Number [1974],"
> "Statesboro Blues [1928*]," "American Tune[1973] ," "Won't Get
> Fooled Again [1971]," "Life During Wartime [1979]," and so on at

> a local club until a
> suitably impressed Dylan shows up to catch wannabe's act. And that's
> when the fun begins. :)

*Does alt-Zimmerman twig to the phony when he hears the fellow trying to
pass off Blind Wille McTell's song as his own, or does he figure they are
magpies of a feather?

https://archive.org/details/StatesboroBlues_822

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statesboro_Blues

Note how McTell "borrowed" from Sippoie Wallace.

Kevin R

[Robert Carnegie]

On Wednesday, 19 August 2015 17:57:33 UTC+1, William Vetter wrote:
> Has there ever been a story published where a lousy SF author
> time-travels back to the Golden Age to throw his trunk stories over the
> transom and into a 1930's slushpile?

To add distantly to all the branchings-off from this idea,
in the Star Trek novel _Prime Directive_ it's quite interesting
that inhabitants of the recently discovered planet are
fascinated by space travel and alien life despite having
not been contacted yet.

This only comes out after things have gone very badly
indeed and about all of the cast (I mean crew, or do I?)
have been fired. But it's quite interesting. And I
suppose a strong dose of fans-are-slans - an alien
planet populated by fans... or, perhaps, a warning
about how that would end up???

[Don Kuenz]

spoiler space

The wannabe gets busted when the speed queen (remember her?) stumbles
across Dylan's records in the secret room. Next she does what speed
queens do, she walks around Greenwich Village babbling about Dylan's
lost albums. At that point the story turns rather grim.

[Kay Shapero]

In article <mr4m4l$m62$1...@dont-email.me>, mdha...@gmail.com says...

>
> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:

> >>
> >
> > Heh. I can believe it.
> >
> > Not *selling* writers, but *attempting* writers.
>
> I think that editors like to buy this sort of thing, that talks about
> their lives, but I'm not sure readers want to see it particularly. A
> lot of stuff like this appears in small press magazines...the editor
> suffers under a curse that forces her to read all the slush, things
> like that.

Don't recall the author or title but I do remember being amused by a
tale in which a writer kept sending an editor an amazing variety of pact
with the devil stories which the latter kept turning down because they
were a drug on the market. It finally turned out the former had actually
MADE such a deal and could only get out of it if he succeeded. OTOH I
don't recall how it came out. (I do recall that one rejected title was
"Packed with the Devilfish"...)

[Michael R N Dolbear]

"Brian M. Scott" wrote

> The attacking slushpile was in "It Came from the
> Slushpile." Don't remember where it first appeared.

Aboriginal Science Fiction, July-August 1987, according to ISFDB.

ISFDB shows 13 hits for 'Slush' in including a 1955 Poem by Roger Zelazny
Slush, Slush, Slush

A search for slush found 13 matches

Title Type Variant Language Date Authors
A Game of Groans: A Sonnet of Slush and Soot NOVEL English 2012-03-27
George R. R. Washington
It Came from the Slushpile SHORTFICTION English 1987-07-00 Bruce Bethke
Slush SHORTFICTION 1979-05-00 K. J. Snow
Slush SHORTFICTION English 1998-00-00 Mary Soon Lee
Slush POEM 1992-05-00 Colleen Anderson
Slush COLLECTION English 2014-00-00 Glenn Rolfe
Slush Pile Author SHORTFICTION 1994-10-00 Darren O. Godfrey
Slush, Slush, Slush POEM 1955-00-00 Roger Zelazny
Slush-O-Matic SHORTFICTION 1993-00-00 Chuck Rothman
Stupefying Stories: "It Came From The Slushpile" ANTHOLOGY English
2010-00-00 Bruce Bethke
Tales from the Slushpile SHORTFICTION English 1998-00-00 Margaret Ball
The Slushpile Surfer SHORTFICTION 1996-00-00 Michael Andre-Driussi
The Thing from the Slush SHORTFICTION 1982-04-00 George Alec Effinger



-- --
Mike D

[Dimensional Traveler]

The slush pile, obviously. :P

--
Veni, vidi, snarki.

[Don Bruder]

In article <MPG.304003c4d...@news.eternal-september.org>,

John Varley wrote that one, but I can't recall the title either - lemme
see... where's my copy of The John Varley Reader - I know beyond a doubt
it's in there. But which box is it in... <sigh>

--
Security provided by Mssrs Smith and/or Wesson. Brought to you by the letter Q

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <55d67c65$0$1709$742e...@news.sonic.net>,

Come to think of it, I put a few slushpile licks into _Hell On High_:



The demon smirked knowingly. "Welcome," he said, "to
the Library of Lost Books. I am Lucien, your guide to
the stacks. How may I assist you?"

Rhea looked at Jack and shrugged. It was up to him
then: There was very little that didn't interest him
at least somewhat, but they were on a day trip not a
camping expedition. First things first. "Science fic-
tion," he said, "from the last two hundred years."

"Very good," Lucien said and steepled his fingers in
thought for a moment. "This way please."

They had entered through the doors in what Jack still
thought of as first gear. The demon lead them south to
the central corridor, then east towards the last wing.
He didn't offer any running commentary, in fact didn't
look back at them at all. Jack and Rhea were left to
make what guesses they could about all the statuary and
exhibits they passed in the spacious hallway. "Fertil-
ity goddess?" Jack speculated about a blatantly immod-
est little statue perched lustily on an otherwise
somber table.

"Or a prehistoric business card," Rhea responded.
"Maybe the glyphs on the tummy say For a good time,
call Basheeba, third cave on the left past the mastodon
skeleton. 'I'll make you Homo Errectus'.

As they left the sections of rock carvings and clay
tablets, the smell of musty paper and parchment gradu-
ally became overpowering. It seemed to Jack that they
had been walking much further than was possible given
what he had seen of the building from the outside.
"TARDIS," he murmured to Rhea.

"What?"

"Time And Relative Dimension in Space. It's bigger on
the inside." He considered. "Like my mother's pocket-
book."

Finally Lucien brought them to the end of the hall, and
ushered them north into the fifth gear area. They
passed countless rows of shelves arrayed with every
type of book, from leather-bound Victorian volumes to
CD-ROMS and chips. Their guide opened the door to a
side room and waved them ahead. "We have arrived," he
said.

Jack looked around. The room was divided into two
parts by a center aisle. Across the aisle to the left,
poorly lighted shelves stretched on almost as far as he
could see, while to the right a compact group of well
lighted, dust free shelves beckoned invitingly.

"What's the difference," Rhea asked pointing to the
left.

Lucien took off his glasses and wiped them medita-
tively. "Those books are lost because they were unpub-
lishable, unsubmitted or didn't find the right editor."

"My God," Jack said, "It's the grand, cumulative slush-
pile of SF!"

Rhea grabbed his arm. "Be afraid," she said, "be very
afraid."

"Indeed," Lucien agreed, "It's the largest such for any
of our genres. Seemingly of every two people who read
science fiction, one of them has a bad book to contri-
bute to it."

Fascinated, Jack walked to the first shelf and picked
up a dusty folder. Inside, the cover page was dated
May 7 1843 in precise early Victorian handwriting. He
turned to the last page and read: Whereat the man said,
'Good lady, I call myself Adam. And how might I pol-
itely address myself to you? Upon which words the
woman responded, 'Good sir, I have no other name than
Eve.

Jack shuddered and put the manuscript down. "Not a
book that should be put aside lightly," he quoted, "but
rather one which should be hurled with great force."

"And on the other side?" Rhea asked.

"Books by known authors," Lucien said, "or good ones.
Lost due to fire, war, the post or what have you. Not
nearly as big a set." He put his glasses back on and
settled them firmly on his nose. The lenses magnified
his distinctly demonic square pupils. "Now then," he
said, "there is a bell pull in the wall by the door.
Do pull it when you are done here, and I shall escort
you out, but for now I must attend to other business."

"Thank you," Jack said automatically.

"No thanks are necessary," the demon said primly, and
disappeared with a puff of imploding air.

"Well," Rhea said, looking around, "I guess we're on
our own."

Jack was already rifling through the good stacks.
"Yep," he agreed happily. "Hey!" he pulled a book and
leafed through it rapidly, then turned back to the
first page and started reading. Before long, he was
chuckling, then laughing out loud.

Rhea moved to look over his shoulder. "What is it?"
she asked.

"It's the sequel to The Witches of Karres," Jack said.
The one Schmitz lost when he moved. See what the
Leewit does here?" He pointed, and soon Rhea was
laughing too. He put the book aside with regret: So
little time. One day he, or someone, would have to
come in with a scanner.

[Gene Wirchenko]

Is that a smart idea?

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <3hddta1jk6oet1vfm...@4ax.com>,

Reminds me of a "Dr. Watchstop" comic. He's visited by a time traveller
from the future who tells him what a shame it is that he (Dr. W) never
invented a time machine when his journals show he came *so* close.

After the fellow leaves, Dr. W thinks to himself: "I believe I'll stop
keeping a journal".

[David Goldfarb]

In article <ef6fdef4-f2e5-48a0...@googlegroups.com>,

The Clarke essay is an explanation for a goof he made in a short-short
entitled "The Longest Science Fiction Story Ever Written". From memory,
it went something like this:

===
Dear Mr. Jenks,
I'm afraid your idea is not at all original. Stories about
writers telepathically stealing stories from other writers date
back to H.G. Wells' "The New Anticipator". About once a week we
receive a manuscript beginning:

Dear Mr. Jenks,
I'm afraid your idea is not at all original. Stories about
writers telepathically stealing stories from other writers date
back to H.G. Wells' "The New Anticipator". About once a week we
receive a manuscript beginning:

Dear Mr. Jenks,
I'm afraid your idea is not at all original.
Stories about writers telepathically stealing stories
from other writers date back to H.G. Wells' "The New
Anticipator". About once a week we receive a manuscript
beginning:

Dear Mr. Jenks,
...
...
...

...
...
Better luck next time!
Mark Belvedere
editor, _Flabbergasting Science Fiction_

Better luck next time!
Mark Belvedere
editor, _Flabbergasting Science Fiction_

Better luck next time!
Mark Belvedere
editor, _Flabbergasting Science Fiction_

Better luck next time!
Mark Belvedere
editor, _Flabbergasting Science Fiction_
===

I realize that I'm infringing on Clarke's copyright here, but as I
have quoted less than 10% of the story, I feel that I can claim "fair use".

--
David Goldfarb |From the fortune cookie file:
goldf...@gmail.com |
gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu |"You have at your command the wisdom of the ages."

[William Vetter]

My older self told me not to do it.

[Jerry Brown]

On Thu, 20 Aug 2015 16:34:06 -0700, Kay Shapero <k...@invalid.net>
wrote:

>In article <mr4m4l$m62$1...@dont-email.me>, mdha...@gmail.com says...
>>
>> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>
>> >>
>> >
>> > Heh. I can believe it.
>> >
>> > Not *selling* writers, but *attempting* writers.
>>
>> I think that editors like to buy this sort of thing, that talks about
>> their lives, but I'm not sure readers want to see it particularly. A
>> lot of stuff like this appears in small press magazines...the editor
>> suffers under a curse that forces her to read all the slush, things
>> like that.
>
>Don't recall the author or title but I do remember being amused by a
>tale in which a writer kept sending an editor an amazing variety of pact
>with the devil stories which the latter kept turning down because they
>were a drug on the market. It finally turned out the former had actually
>MADE such a deal and could only get out of it if he succeeded.

"If at first you don't succeed, to hell with it!" by Charles E Fritch.

>OTOH I
>don't recall how it came out. (I do recall that one rejected title was
>"Packed with the Devilfish"...)

The final correspondence with the author is a rejection from a
publishing house in Hell for yet another "pact with the editor" story.

--
Jerry Brown

A cat may look at a king
(but probably won't bother)

[David Goldfarb]

In article <MPG.304003c4d...@news.eternal-september.org>,
Kay Shapero <k...@invalid.net> wrote:

>Don't recall the author or title but I do remember being amused by a
>tale in which a writer kept sending an editor an amazing variety of pact
>with the devil stories which the latter kept turning down because they
>were a drug on the market. It finally turned out the former had actually
>MADE such a deal and could only get out of it if he succeeded. OTOH I
>don't recall how it came out. (I do recall that one rejected title was
>"Packed with the Devilfish"...)

"Absolutely the Last, This Is It, No More, the Final Pact With the
Devil Story" by Michael Armstrong, in the February 1981 _Fantasy and
Science Fiction_.

The writer ultimately managed to sell a story to either Harlan Ellison
or an HE expy. (I forget exactly which it was.) And the anthology
was just about to come out...but wouldn't you know it, an unfortunate
accident delayed publication of the book.

(The story was in one of the first issues of _F&SF_ that I ever
bought off the newsstand. I was 12.)

--
David Goldfarb |"The Carson/Johnson Law of Human Behavior:
goldf...@gmail.com | 80% of all questions that begin with the word
gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu | 'why' can be answered with the phrase
| 'People are stupid.'" -- Ted Faber

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <ntH20...@kithrup.com>,

David Goldfarb <goldf...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>The writer ultimately managed to sell a story to either Harlan Ellison
>or an HE expy.

What's expy?

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

On 8/22/15 9:46 AM, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
> In article <ntH20...@kithrup.com>,
> David Goldfarb <goldf...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> The writer ultimately managed to sell a story to either Harlan Ellison
>> or an HE expy.
>
> What's expy?
>

Short for "exported character", it's a character who is an obvious
duplicate of some other real person or copyrighted character, just with
a different name and enough tweaks to keep from being sued. Marvel
Comics has about half a dozen Superman expies, for instance, most
prominent being "Gladiator" (the name of the story on which the original
Superman was based) who has an outfit very similar to Superman's with
some color changes, a "G" that's contoured rather like a certain "S"
symbol, a similar face but with a high Mohawk hairdo, and pretty much
identical powers.

An Expy of Harlan Ellison would be someone with a similar name,
description/key features obviously drawn from the real thing, etc.


--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.livejournal.com

[David Harmon]

On Sat, 22 Aug 2015 10:27:00 -0400 in rec.arts.sf.written, "Sea Wasp
(Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote,

>On 8/22/15 9:46 AM, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>> In article <ntH20...@kithrup.com>,
>> David Goldfarb <goldf...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> The writer ultimately managed to sell a story to either Harlan Ellison
>>> or an HE expy.
>>
>> What's expy?
>
> Short for "exported character", it's a character who is an obvious
>duplicate of some other real person or copyrighted character, just with
>a different name and enough tweaks to keep from being sued.

Wouldn't that be an "imported character"?

[Kevrob]

That'd be an Impy, and the Impossible Man is a Mr Mxyzptlk Expy...

It's actually "No Celebrities Were Harmed," anyway, since
Harlan is arguably a real person.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NoCelebritiesWereHarmed

If you had a whole novel about renamed real folks, it'd be a
"roman à clef."

Kevin R



Kevrob





or Alternate Company Equivalent

[Shawn Wilson]

On Saturday, August 22, 2015 at 4:30:47 PM UTC-7, Kevrob wrote:


> That'd be an Impy, and the Impossible Man is a Mr Mxyzptlk Expy...

I saw a (DC) Comic once that all but flatly stated that the Impossible Man was how Mxyz got his jollies in another universe. But I don't recall it being perfectly explicit that it was the Marvel universe they were showing.

[Kevrob]

Take a look at the artwork, blogged about, here:

http://www.comicscube.com/2013/06/easter-eggs-mxyzptlk-and-impossible-man.html

Part 1 of the story starts in SUPERMAN V2 #49, Nov 1990:

"Krisis of the Krimson Kryptonite"

http://www.comics.org/issue/48699/#261983

Collected under the same title as

http://www.comics.org/issue/349241/

Kevin R

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <fP2dnaRS2p-AnUTI...@earthlink.com>,

Depends on where you're standing, perhaps.

[Cryptoengineer]

David Harmon <sou...@netcom.com> wrote in news:fP2dnaRS2p-AnUTInZ2dnUU7-K-
dn...@earthlink.com:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Expy

pt

[Robert Carnegie]

Post-Crisis, his first (I suppose) appearance looked a lot
like "The Beyonder" (Secret Wars II version).

I think that by definition, the Impossible Man stories
never happened.

Then again, since The Beyonders got mad, /no/ Marvel stories
ever happened.

Which I suppose it pretty much accurate, give or take the
career of iconic Marvel character Pope John Paul II.

[Kevrob]

In comics, nobody stays dead except /B/u/c/k/y/ Pope JPII.

Kevin R

[William Vetter]

Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
> In article <fP2dnaRS2p-AnUTI...@earthlink.com>,
> David Harmon <b...@example.invalid> wrote:
>> On Sat, 22 Aug 2015 10:27:00 -0400 in rec.arts.sf.written, "Sea Wasp
>> (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote,
>>> On 8/22/15 9:46 AM, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>> In article <ntH20...@kithrup.com>,
>>>> David Goldfarb <goldf...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> The writer ultimately managed to sell a story to either Harlan Ellison
>>>>> or an HE expy.
>>>>
>>>> What's expy?
>>>
>>> Short for "exported character", it's a character who is an obvious
>>> duplicate of some other real person or copyrighted character, just with
>>> a different name and enough tweaks to keep from being sued.
>>
>> Wouldn't that be an "imported character"?
>>
> Depends on where you're standing, perhaps.

I thought that was MacGuffin.

[Kevrob]

Nope. A MacGuffin is an object, piece of information, that motivates the
characters' action: plot fuel. Related to "plot coupons."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macguffin

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PlotCoupon
(Credit given to Nick Lowe, see http://news.ansible.uk/plotdev.html )

Kevin R

[William Vetter]

sorry. I was thinking of the one where you put your friends, cat, fans
who give you ten bucks...into the story, but I can't remember the word
for it.

[Ahasuerus]

> sorry. I was thinking of the one where you put your friends, cat, fans
> who give you ten bucks...into the story, but I can't remember the word
> for it.

Tuckerization?

[William Vetter]

Yeah.

[Shawn Wilson]

On Saturday, August 22, 2015 at 5:53:49 PM UTC-7, Kevrob wrote:


> > > That'd be an Impy, and the Impossible Man is a Mr Mxyzptlk Expy...
> >
> >
> > I saw a (DC) Comic once that all but flatly stated that the Impossible Man was how Mxyz got his jollies in another universe. But I don't recall it being perfectly explicit that it was the Marvel universe they were showing.
>
> Take a look at the artwork, blogged about, here:
>
> http://www.comicscube.com/2013/06/easter-eggs-mxyzptlk-and-impossible-man.html

Yep, exactly what I recall, except I wouldn't have gotten KKK from memory.

[William December Starr]

In article <685b28ac-73d1-48b3...@googlegroups.com>,

Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com> said:

> I think that by definition, the Impossible Man stories
> never happened.
>
> Then again, since The Beyonders got mad, /no/ Marvel stories
> ever happened.

Oh gods, what's happened _now_?

And: "Beyonders," plural? Are they all equally omnipotent?

-- wds

[Robert Carnegie]

On Monday, 24 August 2015 13:37:21 UTC+1, William December Starr wrote:
> In article <685b28ac-73d1-48b3...@googlegroups.com>,
> Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com> said:
>
> > I think that by definition, the Impossible Man stories
> > never happened.
> >
> > Then again, since The Beyonders got mad, /no/ Marvel stories
> > ever happened.
>
> Oh gods, what's happened _now_?

I told you: nothing. Nothing has ever happened.

Except for "Battleworld" - a new one - which was made up
by Doctor Doom, or, as he's now known, "God". Including
to Thor, or anyway most of the Thors.

(It's just /so/ Doom.)

Don't panic, Marvel are going to put everything back.

Well, they're going to put Earth-616 back; I don't know
about the rest, but apparently Ultimate Spider-Man and
Spider-Man 2099 will live on Earth-616 now.

> And: "Beyonders," plural? Are they all equally omnipotent?

You judge. <http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Beyonders>

"The Beyonder" was previously retconned as a sapient
Cosmic Cube.

In the end, Rabum Alal does what Rabum Alal does best. (Ish.)

[William Vetter]

William Vetter wrote:
> Has there ever been a story published where a lousy SF author time-travels
> back to the Golden Age to throw his trunk stories over the transom and into a
> 1930's slushpile?

Here's my extended crap idea:

Lousy SF author time-travels back to the Golden Age, throws his
manuscipt over the transom. The manuscript is rejected by _Amazing
Stories_.
Then, in desperation, he types his story onto a mimeo stencil, goes to
1970, and swaps it for the stencil of "Eye of Argon."

[William Vetter]

This story title hit me this morning:

"Tom Swift and his Battery-Operated Personal Stimulator"

I don't have a plot yet.

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <n02v3d$i9t$1...@dont-email.me>,

It will come to you.

[Don Bruder]

In article <d8kdvp...@mid.individual.net>,

t...@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) wrote:

> In article <n02v3d$i9t$1...@dont-email.me>,
> William Vetter <mdha...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >This story title hit me this morning:
> >
> >"Tom Swift and his Battery-Operated Personal Stimulator"
> >
> >I don't have a plot yet.
>
> It will come to you.

he said, slickly.

--
Security provided by Mssrs Smith and/or Wesson. Brought to you by the letter Q

[Walter Bushell]

In article <n02v3d$i9t$1...@dont-email.me>,
William Vetter <mdha...@gmail.com> wrote:

"Oh come on now!" said Tom Swiftly.

--
Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greed. Me.

[Kevrob]

On Monday, October 19, 2015 at 5:19:56 PM UTC-4, Walter Bushell wrote:
> In article <n02v3d$i9t$1...@dont-email.me>,
> William Vetter <mdha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > This story title hit me this morning:
> >
> > "Tom Swift and his Battery-Operated Personal Stimulator"
> >
> > I don't have a plot yet.
>
> "Oh come on now!" said Tom Swiftly.
>

"Oops! I'm so sorry.. This has never..I don't usually...,"
said Tom, prematurely.

Kevin R

[William Vetter]

I've found my science-fictional idea:
"This invention makes me obsolete!" Tom ejaculated swiftly.

[leif...@dimnakorr.com]

Kevrob <kev...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
>
> "Oops! I'm so sorry.. This has never..I don't usually...,"
> said Tom, prematurely.
>

"T-t m-minus t-ten, n-nine, e-eight...," said Tom,
jerkingly.

--
Leif Roar Moldskred

[Gene Wirchenko]

But when you do, it will be a seminal idea.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko