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fingerprints or dna in Interstellar?
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a425couple
May 9, 2016, 4:13:40 PM5/9/16
to
fingerprints or dna in "Interstellar" ?
In search of a SF movie recently I saw "Interstellar"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstellar_%28film%29
includes a part,
"CASE warns Cooper that Endurance is slipping toward Gargantua's pull.
Cooper makes a quick decision to use Gargantua as a gravitational slingshot
to propel the ship toward Edmunds' planet. To shed weight, Cooper and
TARS jettison themselves toward the black hole, so that Amelia and CASE
can complete the journey. Slipping past the event horizon, Cooper and
TARS find themselves inside a tesseract,---"
Today, I was reading lal truckee's citation:
"Lists of lists of lists over at SF Signal:"
<http://www.sfsignal.com/archives/2016/04/how-well-read-are-you-in-science-fiction/>
and happened to read
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gateway_%28novel%29
which included
"When the ships arrive, their crews find to their horror that they are
in the gravitational grip of a black hole without enough power to break
free. The crews devise a desperate escape plan: Move everyone into one
ship and eject the other toward the black hole, thus gaining enough of a
boost to escape. Working frantically to transfer unnecessary equipment
to make room, Broadhead finds himself alone in the wrong ship ---
due to the gravitational time dilation due to the black hole's immense
gravity field, time is passing much more slowly for his former crewmates
and none of them has actually died yet. Broadhead, however, concludes that
this means that they will still be dying when he dies in several decades"
Hmmm?
Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
selves, -- agh!
Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
In search of a SF movie recently I saw "Interstellar"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstellar_%28film%29
includes a part,
"CASE warns Cooper that Endurance is slipping toward Gargantua's pull.
Cooper makes a quick decision to use Gargantua as a gravitational slingshot
to propel the ship toward Edmunds' planet. To shed weight, Cooper and
TARS jettison themselves toward the black hole, so that Amelia and CASE
can complete the journey. Slipping past the event horizon, Cooper and
TARS find themselves inside a tesseract,---"
Today, I was reading lal truckee's citation:
"Lists of lists of lists over at SF Signal:"
<http://www.sfsignal.com/archives/2016/04/how-well-read-are-you-in-science-fiction/>
and happened to read
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gateway_%28novel%29
which included
"When the ships arrive, their crews find to their horror that they are
in the gravitational grip of a black hole without enough power to break
free. The crews devise a desperate escape plan: Move everyone into one
ship and eject the other toward the black hole, thus gaining enough of a
boost to escape. Working frantically to transfer unnecessary equipment
to make room, Broadhead finds himself alone in the wrong ship ---
due to the gravitational time dilation due to the black hole's immense
gravity field, time is passing much more slowly for his former crewmates
and none of them has actually died yet. Broadhead, however, concludes that
this means that they will still be dying when he dies in several decades"
Hmmm?
Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
selves, -- agh!
Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
Brian M. Scott
May 9, 2016, 5:57:03 PM5/9/16
to
On Mon, 9 May 2016 13:12:29 -0700, a425couple
<a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
in<news:ngqr0...@news1.newsguy.com> in
rec.arts.sf.written,alt.fan.heinlein:
[...]
> Today, I was reading lal truckee's citation:
> "Lists of lists of lists over at SF Signal:"
> <http://www.sfsignal.com/archives/2016/04/how-well-read-are-you-in-science-fiction/>
> and happened to read
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gateway_%28novel%29
> which included
> "When the ships arrive, their crews find to their horror
> that they are in the gravitational grip of a black hole
> without enough power to break free. The crews devise a
> desperate escape plan: Move everyone into one ship and
> eject the other toward the black hole, thus gaining
> enough of a boost to escape. Working frantically to
> transfer unnecessary equipment to make room, Broadhead
> finds himself alone in the wrong ship --- due to the
> gravitational time dilation due to the black hole's
> immense gravity field, time is passing much more slowly
> for his former crewmates and none of them has actually
> died yet. Broadhead, however, concludes that this means
> that they will still be dying when he dies in several
> decades"
> Hmmm?
Indeed. The classic treatment is Poul Anderson’s excellent
‘Kyrie’.
> Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
> I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for
> me! Characters in future, leaving messages for their
> younger selves, -- agh!
Why not?
> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising to marry
> an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
Again, why not? If the attraction is still there, there’s
no problem, and if it isn’t, the promise needn’t be kept.
Brian
--
It was the neap tide, when the baga venture out of their
holes to root for sandtatties. The waves whispered
rhythmically over the packed sand: haggisss, haggisss,
haggisss.
<a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
in<news:ngqr0...@news1.newsguy.com> in
rec.arts.sf.written,alt.fan.heinlein:
[...]
> Today, I was reading lal truckee's citation:
> "Lists of lists of lists over at SF Signal:"
> <http://www.sfsignal.com/archives/2016/04/how-well-read-are-you-in-science-fiction/>
> and happened to read
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gateway_%28novel%29
> which included
> "When the ships arrive, their crews find to their horror
> that they are in the gravitational grip of a black hole
> without enough power to break free. The crews devise a
> desperate escape plan: Move everyone into one ship and
> eject the other toward the black hole, thus gaining
> enough of a boost to escape. Working frantically to
> transfer unnecessary equipment to make room, Broadhead
> finds himself alone in the wrong ship --- due to the
> gravitational time dilation due to the black hole's
> immense gravity field, time is passing much more slowly
> for his former crewmates and none of them has actually
> died yet. Broadhead, however, concludes that this means
> that they will still be dying when he dies in several
> decades"
> Hmmm?
‘Kyrie’.
> Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
> I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for
> me! Characters in future, leaving messages for their
> younger selves, -- agh!
> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising to marry
> an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
no problem, and if it isn’t, the promise needn’t be kept.
Brian
--
It was the neap tide, when the baga venture out of their
holes to root for sandtatties. The waves whispered
rhythmically over the packed sand: haggisss, haggisss,
haggisss.
a425couple
May 9, 2016, 10:35:10 PM5/9/16
to
"Brian M. Scott" <b.s...@csuohio.edu> wrote in message...
> a425couple <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
>> Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
>> I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
>> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
>> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for
>> me! Characters in future, leaving messages for their
>> younger selves, -- agh!
>
> Why not?
Ahh,
#1, as I just said, time travel or time changing, tends
(the time distortion in Heinlein's "Time for the Stars" &
similar is fine.)
#3, I've done quite well for myself as it was, and the thought
of enabling my older self, to give my younger self,
advice and directions, would just seeem a total cheat!!!
>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising to marry
>> an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>
> Again, why not? If the attraction is still there, there’s
> no problem, and if it isn’t, the promise needn’t be kept.
Ok, you can do as you wish.
It appears to me, that you are thinking that a promise of marriage
made to an 11 year old girl by about the only adult she trusts,
(who then disappears for decades)
will not have consequences for her growing up. Hmmm.
I think adults should be very careful in avoiding putting
themselves into conflicts of interest for youth.
Hmmm, how much time would we let Justin Beiber
spend in private talk with 11 year old fans?
There is a VERY large body of discussion on that topic
on the net. I can see both sides. But I would not have
said the things Dan did.
> a425couple <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
>> Today, I was reading lal truckee's citation:
>> "Lists of lists of lists over at SF Signal:"
>> <http://www.sfsignal.com/archives/2016/04/how-well-read-are-you-in-science-fiction/>
>> and happened to read
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gateway_%28novel%29
> -----snip
>> "Lists of lists of lists over at SF Signal:"
>> <http://www.sfsignal.com/archives/2016/04/how-well-read-are-you-in-science-fiction/>
>> and happened to read
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gateway_%28novel%29
>> Hmmm?
>
> Indeed. The classic treatment is Poul Anderson’s excellent
> ‘Kyrie’.
Thanks for the information.
>
> Indeed. The classic treatment is Poul Anderson’s excellent
> ‘Kyrie’.
>> Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
>> I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
>> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
>> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for
>> me! Characters in future, leaving messages for their
>> younger selves, -- agh!
>
> Why not?
#1, as I just said, time travel or time changing, tends
to make my head hurt.
#2, I am not seeing anything that makes me think it is possible.
(the time distortion in Heinlein's "Time for the Stars" &
similar is fine.)
#3, I've done quite well for myself as it was, and the thought
of enabling my older self, to give my younger self,
advice and directions, would just seeem a total cheat!!!
>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising to marry
>> an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>
> Again, why not? If the attraction is still there, there’s
> no problem, and if it isn’t, the promise needn’t be kept.
It appears to me, that you are thinking that a promise of marriage
made to an 11 year old girl by about the only adult she trusts,
(who then disappears for decades)
will not have consequences for her growing up. Hmmm.
I think adults should be very careful in avoiding putting
themselves into conflicts of interest for youth.
Hmmm, how much time would we let Justin Beiber
spend in private talk with 11 year old fans?
There is a VERY large body of discussion on that topic
on the net. I can see both sides. But I would not have
said the things Dan did.
patmp...@gmail.com
May 9, 2016, 10:37:06 PM5/9/16
to
On Monday, May 9, 2016 at 10:35:10 PM UTC-4, a425couple wrote:
>
> Hmmm, how much time would we let Justin Beiber
> spend in private talk with 11 year old fans?
>
Uh...
>
> Hmmm, how much time would we let Justin Beiber
> spend in private talk with 11 year old fans?
>
Kevrob
May 9, 2016, 10:51:06 PM5/9/16
to
Just enough to say "sorry."
He's Canadian. It is never too late, nor too early, to
say "sorry." :)
Kevin R
Don Bruder
May 9, 2016, 11:20:34 PM5/9/16
to
In article <7c068c2f-aaff-4e73...@googlegroups.com>,
Q: How do you find the Canadian in a crowded room?
A: Walk around stepping on feet until somebody says "sorry." :)
--
Brought to you by the letter Q and the number .357
Security provided by Horace S. & Dan W.
A: Walk around stepping on feet until somebody says "sorry." :)
--
Brought to you by the letter Q and the number .357
Security provided by Horace S. & Dan W.
Greg Goss
May 10, 2016, 12:06:17 AM5/10/16
to
"a425couple" <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gateway_%28novel%29
>which included
>"When the ships arrive, their crews find to their horror that they are
>in the gravitational grip of a black hole without enough power to break
>free. The crews devise a desperate escape plan: Move everyone into one
>ship and eject the other toward the black hole, thus gaining enough of a
>boost to escape. Working frantically to transfer unnecessary equipment
>to make room, Broadhead finds himself alone in the wrong ship ---
>due to the gravitational time dilation due to the black hole's immense
>gravity field, time is passing much more slowly for his former crewmates
>and none of them has actually died yet. Broadhead, however, concludes that
>this means that they will still be dying when he dies in several decades"
>
>Hmmm?
>
>Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
>I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
The novel "Gateway" itself was written in an expermental proto-MTV
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gateway_%28novel%29
>which included
>"When the ships arrive, their crews find to their horror that they are
>in the gravitational grip of a black hole without enough power to break
>free. The crews devise a desperate escape plan: Move everyone into one
>ship and eject the other toward the black hole, thus gaining enough of a
>boost to escape. Working frantically to transfer unnecessary equipment
>to make room, Broadhead finds himself alone in the wrong ship ---
>due to the gravitational time dilation due to the black hole's immense
>gravity field, time is passing much more slowly for his former crewmates
>and none of them has actually died yet. Broadhead, however, concludes that
>this means that they will still be dying when he dies in several decades"
>
>Hmmm?
>
>Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
>I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
style skipping among many stylistic bits that sort of self-assemble
into a story. Normally I detest that kind of thing, but Gateway
actually worked for me. The time compression thing wasn't a big issue
in Gateway. I consider Gateway to be an "Odyssey" type story, where a
story pushes people through strange places where they see strange
things, but the story isn't really that important otherwise.
The sequel takes that storyline and retroactively makes it critically
important, while straightening out the new-wave storytelling into a
somewhat saner style. The time compression is the magic upbeat ending
of the second novel, and wasn't critical or much noticed till it
solved everyone's problems at the end of book two. (in book three or
five or whatever, they pull the girlfriend and crewmates out of the
black hole, but I had stopped caring.)
--
We are geeks. Resistance is voltage over current.
Juho Julkunen
May 10, 2016, 8:10:49 AM5/10/16
to
In article <ngrjrc$ve5$1...@dont-email.me>, dak...@sonic.net says...
I find the stereotype of them as polite really strange.
--
Juho Julkunen
>
> In article <7c068c2f-aaff-4e73...@googlegroups.com>,
> Kevrob <kev...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > On Monday, May 9, 2016 at 10:37:06 PM UTC-4, patmp...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > On Monday, May 9, 2016 at 10:35:10 PM UTC-4, a425couple wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hmmm, how much time would we let Justin Beiber
> > > > spend in private talk with 11 year old fans?
> > > >
> > >
> > > Uh...
> >
> > 2 seconds each.
> >
> > Just enough to say "sorry."
> >
> > He's Canadian. It is never too late, nor too early, to
> > say "sorry." :)
> >
> > Kevin R
>
> Q: How do you find the Canadian in a crowded room?
> A: Walk around stepping on feet until somebody says "sorry." :)
As someone who mostly observes Canadians in the context of ice hockey,
> In article <7c068c2f-aaff-4e73...@googlegroups.com>,
> Kevrob <kev...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > On Monday, May 9, 2016 at 10:37:06 PM UTC-4, patmp...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > On Monday, May 9, 2016 at 10:35:10 PM UTC-4, a425couple wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hmmm, how much time would we let Justin Beiber
> > > > spend in private talk with 11 year old fans?
> > > >
> > >
> > > Uh...
> >
> > 2 seconds each.
> >
> > Just enough to say "sorry."
> >
> > He's Canadian. It is never too late, nor too early, to
> > say "sorry." :)
> >
> > Kevin R
>
> Q: How do you find the Canadian in a crowded room?
> A: Walk around stepping on feet until somebody says "sorry." :)
I find the stereotype of them as polite really strange.
--
Juho Julkunen
Gene Wirchenko
May 10, 2016, 3:23:33 PM5/10/16
to
On Mon, 9 May 2016 19:33:43 -0700, "a425couple"
<a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>"Brian M. Scott" <b.s...@csuohio.edu> wrote in message...
>> a425couple <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
[snip]
<a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>"Brian M. Scott" <b.s...@csuohio.edu> wrote in message...
>> a425couple <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
>>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising to marry
>>> an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>> Again, why not? If the attraction is still there, there’s
>> no problem, and if it isn’t, the promise needn’t be kept.
>
>Ok, you can do as you wish.
>It appears to me, that you are thinking that a promise of marriage
>made to an 11 year old girl by about the only adult she trusts,
>(who then disappears for decades)
>will not have consequences for her growing up. Hmmm.
mind, it is not she who made the promise.
>I think adults should be very careful in avoiding putting
>themselves into conflicts of interest for youth.
>Hmmm, how much time would we let Justin Beiber
>spend in private talk with 11 year old fans?
>
>There is a VERY large body of discussion on that topic
>on the net. I can see both sides. But I would not have
>said the things Dan did.
Gene Wirchenko
Robert Carnegie
May 10, 2016, 6:27:19 PM5/10/16
to
the scientific theory of "General Relativity" says about
the relationship between actual time and intense gravity.
In practice it will give you more than a headache.
If you don't like any of this about black holes then
I recommend that you stay well away from them, in stories
and in real life. And they won't come to get you if you
don't go near to them.
> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
> Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
> selves, -- agh!
> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
> to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
I suppose _The Time Traveller's Wife_ isn't on your list then.
Michael Black
May 10, 2016, 7:13:10 PM5/10/16
to
On Mon, 9 May 2016, a425couple wrote:
> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
> Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
> selves, -- agh!
> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
> to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>
I never noticed that part until I read other people talking about it.
> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
> Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
> selves, -- agh!
> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
> to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>
But I'd point out, my great, great, great grandmother was about 14 years
old when she went with my great, great, great grandfather, who was around
29 at the time. They didn't even get married by European standards until
about 1824, 12 years after they first got together. But it was 200 years
ago, so times are different. On one hand it does seem exploitive, but on
the other that was they way it was. He stayed with her for forty years,
until he died.
I assume my great, great, great, great grandparents gave some level of
approval, though word is they didn't trust white people after the pair
moved away.
I think the Heinlein book that represents my great, great, great
grandmother is "The Star Beast", I'd like to think it was curiosity that
made her go with this guy who might have been the first white man she met.
Michael
Robert Carnegie
May 11, 2016, 6:12:49 AM5/11/16
to
a /long/ time ahead, from <http://www.friends-tv.org/zz423.html>
Monica: Ross, how long have you been planning this wedding?
Ross: I don't know. A month?
Monica: Emily has probably been planning it since she was five!
Ever since the first time she took a pillowcase and hung it off
the back of her head. That's what we did! We dreamed about the
perfect wedding, and the perfect place, with the perfect
four-tiered wedding cake, with the little people on top.
But the most important part is that we had the perfect guy
who understood just how important all that other stuff was.
Ross: I had no idea. And that... that pillowcase thing,
I thought you guys were just doing "The Flying Nun".
Monica: Sometimes we were -
----
Also the scene in _Shrek 2_ where Shrek finds
Fiona's early teenage diary that maps out a future life
as Mrs. Prince Charming in some detail.
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
May 11, 2016, 9:20:03 AM5/11/16
to
On 5/10/16 7:13 PM, Michael Black wrote:
> On Mon, 9 May 2016, a425couple wrote:
>
>
>> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
>> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
>> Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
>> selves, -- agh!
>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
>> to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
> I never noticed that part until I read other people talking about it.
>
> But I'd point out, my great, great, great grandmother was about 14 years
> old when she went with my great, great, great grandfather, who was
> around 29 at the time.
My wife's grandmother was 12 when she got married here, to an immigrant
> On Mon, 9 May 2016, a425couple wrote:
>
>
>> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
>> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
>> Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
>> selves, -- agh!
>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
>> to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
> I never noticed that part until I read other people talking about it.
>
> But I'd point out, my great, great, great grandmother was about 14 years
> old when she went with my great, great, great grandfather, who was
> around 29 at the time.
who was 21 that she'd never seen, but who was sent here to marry her.
--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.livejournal.com
a425couple
May 11, 2016, 12:49:18 PM5/11/16
to
"Gene Wirchenko" <ge...@telus.net> wrote in message ...
involvement in an adult to 11 year old girl relationship.
As to the 'eww!' factor, I think one of the deepest anti "Uncle Dan"
comments was along the lines of, "I don't think there's anything
remotely creepy about an 11-year old girl wanting to marry a
father-figure. Happens all the time. What I think is creepy is the
father-figure coming up with a way for it to happen."
But as I'm seeing it, to Dan's defense, he had just been
horribly shaken up, and hurt, he did no crime, it appears
he always wished the best for Rikky, and at least a half year
or so into their marriage both seemed quite happy.
As I'd said,
here are a few of the many sources:
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=558450
http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=912884
https://relentlessreading.com/2014/10/11/the-door-into-summer/
> "a425couple" <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>"Brian M. Scott" <b.s...@csuohio.edu> wrote in message...
>>> a425couple <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
>
>>"Brian M. Scott" <b.s...@csuohio.edu> wrote in message...
>>> a425couple <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
>
>>>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising to marry
>>>> an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>
> *She* asked *him*.
I do not think the above 'defense' does much to justify
>>>> an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>
> *She* asked *him*.
involvement in an adult to 11 year old girl relationship.
As to the 'eww!' factor, I think one of the deepest anti "Uncle Dan"
comments was along the lines of, "I don't think there's anything
remotely creepy about an 11-year old girl wanting to marry a
father-figure. Happens all the time. What I think is creepy is the
father-figure coming up with a way for it to happen."
But as I'm seeing it, to Dan's defense, he had just been
horribly shaken up, and hurt, he did no crime, it appears
he always wished the best for Rikky, and at least a half year
or so into their marriage both seemed quite happy.
As I'd said,
>>There is a VERY large body of discussion on that topic
>>on the net. I can see both sides. But I would not have
>>said the things Dan did.
For those who wish to read more on the topic,
>>on the net. I can see both sides. But I would not have
>>said the things Dan did.
here are a few of the many sources:
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=558450
http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=912884
https://relentlessreading.com/2014/10/11/the-door-into-summer/
a425couple
May 11, 2016, 1:01:15 PM5/11/16
to
"Greg Goss" <go...@gossg.org> wrote in message ...
> The sequel takes that storyline and retroactively makes it ----
> --- (in book three or
With my current slow reading speed, and short attention span,
I'm quite sure, I'd have quit caring or reading WAY before that!
> "a425couple" <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
>>I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
>
> The novel "Gateway" itself was written in an expermental proto-MTV
> style -------------
>>
>>Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
>>I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
>
> The novel "Gateway" itself was written in an expermental proto-MTV
> The sequel takes that storyline and retroactively makes it ----
> --- (in book three or
> five or whatever, they pull the girlfriend and crewmates out of the
> black hole, but I had stopped caring.)
Thanks for the information.
> black hole, but I had stopped caring.)
With my current slow reading speed, and short attention span,
I'm quite sure, I'd have quit caring or reading WAY before that!
Gene Wirchenko
May 11, 2016, 4:46:26 PM5/11/16
to
On Wed, 11 May 2016 09:48:49 -0700, "a425couple"
<a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>"Gene Wirchenko" <ge...@telus.net> wrote in message ...
>> "a425couple" <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>"Brian M. Scott" <b.s...@csuohio.edu> wrote in message...
>>>> a425couple <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
>>
>>>>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising to marry
>>>>> an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>>
>> *She* asked *him*.
>
>I do not think the above 'defense' does much to justify
>involvement in an adult to 11 year old girl relationship.
What involvement? He then goes for the Long Sleep.
<a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>"Gene Wirchenko" <ge...@telus.net> wrote in message ...
>> "a425couple" <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>"Brian M. Scott" <b.s...@csuohio.edu> wrote in message...
>>>> a425couple <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
>>
>>>>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising to marry
>>>>> an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>>
>> *She* asked *him*.
>
>I do not think the above 'defense' does much to justify
>involvement in an adult to 11 year old girl relationship.
[snip]
Sincerely,
Gene Wirchenko
Chris Zakes
May 13, 2016, 2:00:36 PM5/13/16
to
On Wed, 11 May 2016 09:48:49 -0700, an orbital mind-control laser
caused "a425couple" <a425c...@hotmail.com> to write:
>"Gene Wirchenko" <ge...@telus.net> wrote in message ...
>> "a425couple" <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>"Brian M. Scott" <b.s...@csuohio.edu> wrote in message...
>>>> a425couple <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
>>
>>>>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising to marry
>>>>> an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>>
>> *She* asked *him*.
>
>I do not think the above 'defense' does much to justify
>involvement in an adult to 11 year old girl relationship.
What "relationship"? They were friends becase Danny and her father
caused "a425couple" <a425c...@hotmail.com> to write:
>"Gene Wirchenko" <ge...@telus.net> wrote in message ...
>> "a425couple" <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>"Brian M. Scott" <b.s...@csuohio.edu> wrote in message...
>>>> a425couple <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote
>>
>>>>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising to marry
>>>>> an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>>
>> *She* asked *him*.
>
>I do not think the above 'defense' does much to justify
>involvement in an adult to 11 year old girl relationship.
were business partners
>As to the 'eww!' factor, I think one of the deepest anti "Uncle Dan"
>comments was along the lines of, "I don't think there's anything
>remotely creepy about an 11-year old girl wanting to marry a
>father-figure. Happens all the time. What I think is creepy is the
>father-figure coming up with a way for it to happen."
...and giving her ten-to-thirty years to change her mind. With the
>comments was along the lines of, "I don't think there's anything
>remotely creepy about an 11-year old girl wanting to marry a
>father-figure. Happens all the time. What I think is creepy is the
>father-figure coming up with a way for it to happen."
Hired Girl stock Danny gave her, she would have been financially
independent once she was a legal adult (21 in that story.) She could
have moved away, or married a high school or college boyfriend and
Danny, being in Cold Sleep at the time could have done nothing to stop
her. She could have been in Kalamazoo, under her husband's name with a
couple of kids by the time he woke up.
But note that her revival instructions say to *only* wake her when
Danny showed up (which was *not* part of his instructions to her.)
That says she *did* want the relationship, even grown up and with
years to think about changing her mind.
-Chris Zakes
Texas
--
GNU Terry Pratchett
Mind how you go.
Michael F. Stemper
May 13, 2016, 3:43:58 PM5/13/16
to
On 05/10/2016 05:25 PM, Robert Carnegie wrote:
> On Monday, 9 May 2016 21:13:40 UTC+1, a425couple wrote:
>> fingerprints or dna in "Interstellar" ?
> On Monday, 9 May 2016 21:13:40 UTC+1, a425couple wrote:
>> fingerprints or dna in "Interstellar" ?
>> Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
>> I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
>
> The stories are similar because they are based on what
> the scientific theory of "General Relativity" says about
> the relationship between actual time and intense gravity.
> In practice it will give you more than a headache.
>
> If you don't like any of this about black holes then
> I recommend that you stay well away from them, in stories
> and in real life. And they won't come to get you if you
> don't go near to them.
>
>> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
>> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
>> Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
>> selves, -- agh!
>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
>> to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>
> Um. Yes.
>
> I suppose _The Time Traveller's Wife_ isn't on your list then.
It sounds as if "— All You Zombies —" is contra-indicated, as well.
>> I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
>
> The stories are similar because they are based on what
> the scientific theory of "General Relativity" says about
> the relationship between actual time and intense gravity.
> In practice it will give you more than a headache.
>
> If you don't like any of this about black holes then
> I recommend that you stay well away from them, in stories
> and in real life. And they won't come to get you if you
> don't go near to them.
>
>> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
>> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
>> Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
>> selves, -- agh!
>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
>> to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>
> Um. Yes.
>
> I suppose _The Time Traveller's Wife_ isn't on your list then.
--
Michael F. Stemper
a425couple
May 19, 2016, 11:16:50 PM5/19/16
to
"Michael F. Stemper" <michael...@gmail.com> wrote in...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Time_Traveler's_Wife
Considered.
"his feet are amputated when he returns to the present. Henry and Clare
both know that without the ability to escape when he time travels, Henry
will certainly die within his next few jumps. On New Year's Eve 2006
Henry time travels into the middle of the Michigan woods in 1984 and
is accidentally shot by Clare's brother, a scene foreshadowed earlier
in the novel. Henry returns to the present and dies in Clare's arms.
Clare is devastated by Henry's death. She later finds a letter from Henry
asking her to "stop waiting" for him, but which describes a moment in
her future when she will see him again. The last scene in the book takes
place when Clare is 82 years old and Henry is 43. She is waiting for
Henry, as she has done most of her life."
You are correct, although also rejected by entire tragic
nature of a fate they can not avoid, as much as anything.
I generally avoid fiction, and for me, why read fiction if it
is totally sad?
> It sounds as if "— All You Zombies —" is contra-indicated, as well.
> Michael F. Stemper
Also correct Michael. It was FAR from my favorite.
> Robert Carnegie wrote:
>> a425couple wrote:
>>> fingerprints or dna in "Interstellar" ?
>
>>> Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
>>> I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
>>
>> a425couple wrote:
>>> fingerprints or dna in "Interstellar" ?
>
>>> Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
>>> I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
>>
>>> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
>>> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
>>> Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
>>> selves, -- agh!
>>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
>>> to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>>
>> Um. Yes.
>>
>> I suppose _The Time Traveller's Wife_ isn't on your list then.
Thank you Robert, for offering a consideration.
>>> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
>>> Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
>>> selves, -- agh!
>>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
>>> to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>>
>> Um. Yes.
>>
>> I suppose _The Time Traveller's Wife_ isn't on your list then.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Time_Traveler's_Wife
Considered.
"his feet are amputated when he returns to the present. Henry and Clare
both know that without the ability to escape when he time travels, Henry
will certainly die within his next few jumps. On New Year's Eve 2006
Henry time travels into the middle of the Michigan woods in 1984 and
is accidentally shot by Clare's brother, a scene foreshadowed earlier
in the novel. Henry returns to the present and dies in Clare's arms.
Clare is devastated by Henry's death. She later finds a letter from Henry
asking her to "stop waiting" for him, but which describes a moment in
her future when she will see him again. The last scene in the book takes
place when Clare is 82 years old and Henry is 43. She is waiting for
Henry, as she has done most of her life."
You are correct, although also rejected by entire tragic
nature of a fate they can not avoid, as much as anything.
I generally avoid fiction, and for me, why read fiction if it
is totally sad?
> It sounds as if "— All You Zombies —" is contra-indicated, as well.
Also correct Michael. It was FAR from my favorite.
J. Clarke
May 20, 2016, 4:07:40 AM5/20/16
to
In article <nhlvi...@news3.newsguy.com>, a425c...@hotmail.com
says...
If you avoid fiction why are you hanging out on a fiction newsgroup?
>
> > It sounds as if "? All You Zombies ?" is contra-indicated, as well.
says...
>
> > It sounds as if "? All You Zombies ?" is contra-indicated, as well.
a425couple
May 20, 2016, 3:04:20 PM5/20/16
to
"J. Clarke" <j.clark...@gmail.com> wrote in message ...
("generally" is mostly, mainly, normally, & on average.
The word certainly does not mean any total avoidance!)
I read here because I'm interested in leads or ideas
for the about 1/4 of the time that I read fiction.
> a425c...@hotmail.com says...
>> "Michael F. Stemper" <michael...@gmail.com> wrote in...
>> > Robert Carnegie wrote:
>> >> a425couple wrote:
>> >>> fingerprints or dna in "Interstellar" ?
>> "Michael F. Stemper" <michael...@gmail.com> wrote in...
>> > Robert Carnegie wrote:
>> >> a425couple wrote:
>> >>> fingerprints or dna in "Interstellar" ?
>> >> I suppose _The Time Traveller's Wife_ isn't on your list then.
>>
>> Thank you Robert, for offering a consideration.
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Time_Traveler's_Wife
>> Considered.
>> "his feet are amputated when he returns to the present. Henry and Clare
>> both know that without the ability to escape when he time travels, Henry
>> will certainly die within his next few jumps. On New Year's Eve 2006
>> Henry time travels into the middle of the Michigan woods in 1984 and
>> is accidentally shot by Clare's brother, a scene foreshadowed earlier
>> in the novel. Henry returns to the present and dies in Clare's arms.
>> Clare is devastated by Henry's death. She later finds a letter from Henry
>> asking her to "stop waiting" for him, but which describes a moment in
>> her future when she will see him again. The last scene in the book takes
>> place when Clare is 82 years old and Henry is 43. She is waiting for
>> Henry, as she has done most of her life."
>>
>> You are correct, although also rejected by entire tragic
>> nature of a fate they can not avoid, as much as anything.
>> I generally avoid fiction, and for me, why read fiction if it
>> is totally sad?
>
> If you avoid fiction why are you hanging out on a fiction newsgroup?
Seems like you are jumping a 'bridge too far'!
>>
>> Thank you Robert, for offering a consideration.
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Time_Traveler's_Wife
>> Considered.
>> "his feet are amputated when he returns to the present. Henry and Clare
>> both know that without the ability to escape when he time travels, Henry
>> will certainly die within his next few jumps. On New Year's Eve 2006
>> Henry time travels into the middle of the Michigan woods in 1984 and
>> is accidentally shot by Clare's brother, a scene foreshadowed earlier
>> in the novel. Henry returns to the present and dies in Clare's arms.
>> Clare is devastated by Henry's death. She later finds a letter from Henry
>> asking her to "stop waiting" for him, but which describes a moment in
>> her future when she will see him again. The last scene in the book takes
>> place when Clare is 82 years old and Henry is 43. She is waiting for
>> Henry, as she has done most of her life."
>>
>> You are correct, although also rejected by entire tragic
>> nature of a fate they can not avoid, as much as anything.
>> I generally avoid fiction, and for me, why read fiction if it
>> is totally sad?
>
> If you avoid fiction why are you hanging out on a fiction newsgroup?
("generally" is mostly, mainly, normally, & on average.
The word certainly does not mean any total avoidance!)
I read here because I'm interested in leads or ideas
for the about 1/4 of the time that I read fiction.
Robert Carnegie
May 20, 2016, 5:14:01 PM5/20/16
to
any more of it."
But, there's also sex in the book. Skilfully and persuasively
described.
I liked Alba too. Alba is fun.
Joe Bernstein
May 21, 2016, 1:35:59 PM5/21/16
to
On Friday, May 20, 2016 at 2:14:01 PM UTC-7, Robert Carnegie wrote:
> On Friday, 20 May 2016 04:16:50 UTC+1, a425couple wrote:
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Time_Traveler's_Wife
> On Friday, 20 May 2016 04:16:50 UTC+1, a425couple wrote:
> I liked Alba too. Alba is fun.
Niffenegger has for some time been saying, including on her own website,
that she's working on a "sequel" to <The Time Traveler's Wife>, and that
Alba would be its focus. She doesn't really do cheerful (<Her Fearful
Symmetry> is *much* darker than <Wife>), but making Alba into her usual
conflicted protagonist might be kinda hard.
Joe Bernstein
--
Joe Bernstein, writer and tax preparer <j...@sfbooks.com>
Jaimie Vandenbergh
May 21, 2016, 7:22:45 PM5/21/16
to
On Thu, 19 May 2016 20:16:06 -0700, "a425couple"
<a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>"Michael F. Stemper" <michael...@gmail.com> wrote in...
>> Robert Carnegie wrote:
>>> a425couple wrote:
>>>> fingerprints or dna in "Interstellar" ?
>>
>>>> Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
>>>> I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
>>>
>>>> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
>>>> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
>>>> Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
>>>> selves, -- agh!
>>>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
>>>> to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>>>
>>> Um. Yes.
>>>
>>> I suppose _The Time Traveller's Wife_ isn't on your list then.
>
>Thank you Robert, for offering a consideration.
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Time_Traveler's_Wife
>Considered.
Dude. Spoilers. You just posted a complete precis of the end of the
<a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>"Michael F. Stemper" <michael...@gmail.com> wrote in...
>> Robert Carnegie wrote:
>>> a425couple wrote:
>>>> fingerprints or dna in "Interstellar" ?
>>
>>>> Time changing tends to make my head hurt.
>>>> I do not intend to buy "Gateway".
>>>
>>>> And the recent read, Heinlein's "The Door into Summer"
>>>> that included 'time play' also, was not a favorite for me!
>>>> Characters in future, leaving messages for their younger
>>>> selves, -- agh!
>>>> Without going into a 30 year old guy promising
>>>> to marry an 11 year old girl after she becomes an adult!
>>>
>>> Um. Yes.
>>>
>>> I suppose _The Time Traveller's Wife_ isn't on your list then.
>
>Thank you Robert, for offering a consideration.
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Time_Traveler's_Wife
>Considered.
book. Don't do that, particularly if you are just copying from wikipedia
and not even making your own comment.
>You are correct, although also rejected by entire tragic
>nature of a fate they can not avoid, as much as anything.
>I generally avoid fiction, and for me, why read fiction if it
>is totally sad?
foreshadowing, surprise and an inevitable denouement, contains much joy,
hints to the future of the novel's world, and is memorable and haunting.
Of course, now you've spoiled it for yourself (as well as others) you've
lost a lot of that impact. Never mind.
Cheers - Jaimie
Brian M. Scott
May 21, 2016, 11:22:23 PM5/21/16
to
On Sun, 22 May 2016 00:22:42 +0100, Jaimie Vandenbergh
<jai...@sometimes.sessile.org> wrote
in<news:k4r1kbp5otlvm1s4h...@4ax.com> in
rec.arts.sf.written:
[...]
>> I generally avoid fiction, and for me, why read fiction
>> if it is totally sad?
> Because it's very well written with character, pacing,
> emotion, foreshadowing, surprise and an inevitable
> denouement, contains much joy, hints to the future of
> the novel's world, and is memorable and haunting.
Which is fine for those for whom it’s finek; for some of us
it simply is not. I’ve read enough of those books in my
life; two very good ones that I’ll almost certainly never
re-read are _Flowers for Algernon_ and _The Trial of
Callista Blake_. Oh, and ‘Portrait of Jennie’.
> Of course, now you've spoiled it for yourself (as well as
> others) you've lost a lot of that impact. Never mind.
Or not, as the case may be. Some of us prefer to avoid
that impact even when we’re willing to read the book in the
first place and don’t find that the foreknowledge spoils
anything.
I’m well aware that so-called spoilers really do spoil a
work for some people, and in general I try to avoid them,
but I wish that others would recognize that not only do
they *not* spoil a work for some of us, some of us actually
prefer to have them, or at least to have them available at
need.
<jai...@sometimes.sessile.org> wrote
in<news:k4r1kbp5otlvm1s4h...@4ax.com> in
rec.arts.sf.written:
[...]
>> I generally avoid fiction, and for me, why read fiction
>> if it is totally sad?
> Because it's very well written with character, pacing,
> emotion, foreshadowing, surprise and an inevitable
> denouement, contains much joy, hints to the future of
> the novel's world, and is memorable and haunting.
it simply is not. I’ve read enough of those books in my
life; two very good ones that I’ll almost certainly never
re-read are _Flowers for Algernon_ and _The Trial of
Callista Blake_. Oh, and ‘Portrait of Jennie’.
> Of course, now you've spoiled it for yourself (as well as
> others) you've lost a lot of that impact. Never mind.
that impact even when we’re willing to read the book in the
first place and don’t find that the foreknowledge spoils
anything.
I’m well aware that so-called spoilers really do spoil a
work for some people, and in general I try to avoid them,
but I wish that others would recognize that not only do
they *not* spoil a work for some of us, some of us actually
prefer to have them, or at least to have them available at
need.
Don Bruder
May 22, 2016, 1:21:49 AM5/22/16
to
In article <1nfz7e1asvu6n.1...@40tude.net>,
You'll never hear me say anything less about it. And it's so damned sad
that, like you, it's unlikely in the extreme that I'll ever re-read it.
Sadder still, to watch it die, than never to have known it
- N. Peart
"Brian M. Scott" <b.s...@csuohio.edu> wrote:
> On Sun, 22 May 2016 00:22:42 +0100, Jaimie Vandenbergh
> <jai...@sometimes.sessile.org> wrote
> in<news:k4r1kbp5otlvm1s4h...@4ax.com> in
> rec.arts.sf.written:
>
> > On Thu, 19 May 2016 20:16:06 -0700, "a425couple"
> > <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> >> I generally avoid fiction, and for me, why read fiction
> >> if it is totally sad?
>
> > Because it's very well written with character, pacing,
> > emotion, foreshadowing, surprise and an inevitable
> > denouement, contains much joy, hints to the future of
> > the novel's world, and is memorable and haunting.
>
> Which is fine for those for whom it's finek; for some of us
> it simply is not. I've read enough of those books in my
> life; two very good ones that I'll almost certainly never
> re-read are _Flowers for Algernon_
Agreed - And then some. Perfect example. It's an INCREDIBLY GOOD story.
> On Sun, 22 May 2016 00:22:42 +0100, Jaimie Vandenbergh
> <jai...@sometimes.sessile.org> wrote
> in<news:k4r1kbp5otlvm1s4h...@4ax.com> in
> rec.arts.sf.written:
>
> > On Thu, 19 May 2016 20:16:06 -0700, "a425couple"
> > <a425c...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> >> I generally avoid fiction, and for me, why read fiction
> >> if it is totally sad?
>
> > Because it's very well written with character, pacing,
> > emotion, foreshadowing, surprise and an inevitable
> > denouement, contains much joy, hints to the future of
> > the novel's world, and is memorable and haunting.
>
> Which is fine for those for whom it's finek; for some of us
> it simply is not. I've read enough of those books in my
> life; two very good ones that I'll almost certainly never
> re-read are _Flowers for Algernon_
You'll never hear me say anything less about it. And it's so damned sad
that, like you, it's unlikely in the extreme that I'll ever re-read it.
Sadder still, to watch it die, than never to have known it
- N. Peart
Don Kuenz
May 23, 2016, 10:16:12 AM5/23/16
to
Joe Bernstein <j...@sfbooks.com> wrote:
> On Friday, May 20, 2016 at 2:14:01 PM UTC-7, Robert Carnegie wrote:
>
>> On Friday, 20 May 2016 04:16:50 UTC+1, a425couple wrote:
>
>> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Time_Traveler's_Wife
>
>> I liked Alba too. Alba is fun.
>
> That she is.
>
> Niffenegger has for some time been saying, including on her own website,
> that she's working on a "sequel" to <The Time Traveler's Wife>, and that
> Alba would be its focus. She doesn't really do cheerful (<Her Fearful
> Symmetry> is *much* darker than <Wife>), but making Alba into her usual
> conflicted protagonist might be kinda hard.
different from a sad state.
spoiler space
Henry dies *near* the end of _Wife_. Although his death is sad it
doesn't make the whole story *sad*, not for me.
"Did you have a good world when you died? Enough to base a movie on?"
asks Jim Morrison. Henry's life does indeed have enough to base a movie
on.
Live Fast, Die Young, and Leave a Beautiful Corpse [1]
Henry certainly lived fast. He popped up all over creation completely
naked. Henry made the dead young rock stars of yesteryear look as
cautious as burglars by way of comparison.
Although the young rock stars died younger than Henry himself died
younger than most. So by induction Henry left a corpse more beautiful
than most.
The endless thrill of popins enabled Henry to live a full life, even
though it was temporally cut short. He also knew the time of his death.
Henry also enjoyed a good marriage. There simply wasn't enough time for
many arguments. "Absence Makes the Heart Grow Fonder."
In his wake, Henry seems to leave behind Clare, Alba, and the rest. Yet
younger Henrys see elderly Clares.
They spend their lives together, but only one grows old. Sadder things
happen.
_Wife_ brings to mind _The Man Who Folded Himself_ by David Gerrold.
_Wife_ feels more grounded than _Folded_, perhaps due to the gender of
the author.
Note.
1. http://quoteinvestigator.com/2013/01/31/live-fast/
--
Don Kuenz KB7RPU
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