75 Years After or, Sic transit gloria mundi

Ahasuerus

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Jul 26, 2017, 10:32:28 AM7/26/17

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From _Fantastic Adventures_, October 1941:

... we took a poll of several thousand readers' comments and
discovered that the ten most liked authors were (in order):

1. Don Wilcox
2. William P. McGivern
3. John York Cabot [pseudonym of David Wright O'Brien]
4. Nelson S. Bond
5. David Wright O'Brien
6. James Norman
7. Edgar Rice Burroughs
8. Robert Moore Williams
9. David V. Reed
10. Eando Binder [Otto Binder as of 1941]

[quote from "Editor's Preface" in _The Best of Don Wilcox, Volume 1_
since I can't get to my pulps at the moment]

Granted, _Fantastic Adventures_ was no _Astounding_, but still...

James Nicoll

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Jul 26, 2017, 10:49:33 AM7/26/17

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In article <07e05601-b973-4eb3...@googlegroups.com>,

The books I review for the Tears series often have ad sections for
best sellers and popular books from the 1970s and so many of them
are completely forgotten now after only a few decades.

I have knowingly heard of Bond, Burrough and Binder, but I may not have
actually read Bond.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My Livejournal at http://www.livejournal.com/users/james_nicoll
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll

Michael F. Stemper

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Jul 26, 2017, 11:01:37 AM7/26/17

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On 2017-07-26 09:32, Ahasuerus wrote:
> From _Fantastic Adventures_, October 1941:
>
> ... we took a poll of several thousand readers' comments and
> discovered that the ten most liked authors were (in order):
>
> 1. Don Wilcox
> 2. William P. McGivern
> 3. John York Cabot [pseudonym of David Wright O'Brien]
> 4. Nelson S. Bond
> 5. David Wright O'Brien
> 6. James Norman
> 7. Edgar Rice Burroughs
> 8. Robert Moore Williams
> 9. David V. Reed
> 10. Eando Binder [Otto Binder as of 1941]

I've read one short by Bond, and three novels by Binder.

Is the 1942 reader poll available? Did Heinlein show up?

--
Michael F. Stemper
I feel more like I do now than I did when I came in.

Michael F. Stemper

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Jul 26, 2017, 11:03:04 AM7/26/17

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On 2017-07-26 09:49, James Nicoll wrote:
> In article <07e05601-b973-4eb3...@googlegroups.com>,
> Ahasuerus <ahas...@email.com> wrote:
>>From _Fantastic Adventures_, October 1941:
>>
>> ... we took a poll of several thousand readers' comments and
>> discovered that the ten most liked authors were (in order):
>>
>> 1. Don Wilcox
>> 2. William P. McGivern
>> 3. John York Cabot [pseudonym of David Wright O'Brien]
>> 4. Nelson S. Bond

> I have knowingly heard of Bond, Burrough and Binder, but I may not have
> actually read Bond.

You probably have. He has a story, "Magic City", in _A Treasury of Great
Science Fiction_.

Kevrob

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Jul 26, 2017, 11:09:17 AM7/26/17

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David V Reed became a prolific comics writer, especially
on BATMAN AND ROBIN in the 1950s. Julie Schwartz used his
scripts on THE BATMAN again in the 1970s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Vern_Reed

He passed away in 1989.

Otto Binder may have written more comics than anybody.

Kevin R

Ahasuerus

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Jul 26, 2017, 11:40:38 AM7/26/17

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On Wednesday, July 26, 2017 at 11:01:37 AM UTC-4, Michael F. Stemper wrote:
> On 2017-07-26 09:32, Ahasuerus wrote:
> > From _Fantastic Adventures_, October 1941:
> >
> > ... we took a poll of several thousand readers' comments and
> > discovered that the ten most liked authors were (in order):
> >
> > 1. Don Wilcox
> > 2. William P. McGivern
> > 3. John York Cabot [pseudonym of David Wright O'Brien]
> > 4. Nelson S. Bond
> > 5. David Wright O'Brien
> > 6. James Norman
> > 7. Edgar Rice Burroughs
> > 8. Robert Moore Williams
> > 9. David V. Reed
> > 10. Eando Binder [Otto Binder as of 1941]
>
> I've read one short by Bond, and three novels by Binder.

Bond wrote a number of decent stories. On the novel side, I thought
that _Exiles of Time_ was readable, but it's been a long time and I
am not sure whether it's still readable in the 21st century.

> Is the 1942 reader poll available?

Someone would have to check the 1942 issues. My pulp collection is
currently unavailable.

> Did Heinlein show up?

The "poll" was based on readers' comments known as "locs" ("letters of
comment".) They typically commented on stories which had appeared in
earlier issues. Since Heinlein didn't appear in _Fantastic Adventures_,
it would have been uncommon for a loc to mention him except in passing.

One thing that I should have mentioned is that _FA_, like its sibling
magazine _Amazing Stories_, was run by Ray Palmer at the time. Given
Palmer's subsequent career ("The Shaver Mystery", UFOs, etc), I wouldn't
be too surprised if a careful review of these locs revealed that his
polling methodology was imperfect.

The results were also most likely skewed by the extensive use of
pseudonyms in early SF pulps in general and in Palmer's magazines in
particular. Consider the issue where the poll results were published,
http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?58172 . It contains 4 stories by
McGivern: 2 as by "William P. McGivern", 1 as by "P. F. Costello" and
1 as by "Gerald Vance" (later on a house name.) It also contains 2
stories by David Wright O'Brien: 1 as by "Duncan Farnsworth" and 1 as
by "John York Cabot".

Robert Woodward

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Jul 26, 2017, 12:19:51 PM7/26/17

to

In article <07e05601-b973-4eb3...@googlegroups.com>,
Ahasuerus <ahas...@email.com> wrote:

I have only heard of five of them (1, 4, 7, 8, & 10). Of course, if such
a poll (I have to check) was made in _Astounding_, the top two authors
would had been Robert A. Heinlein and Anson MacDonald.

--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.
—-----------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward robe...@drizzle.com

Ahasuerus

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Jul 26, 2017, 12:35:38 PM7/26/17

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On Wednesday, July 26, 2017 at 12:19:51 PM UTC-4, Robert Woodward wrote:
> In article <07e05601-b973-4eb3...@googlegroups.com>,
> Ahasuerus <ahas...@email.com> wrote:
>
> > From _Fantastic Adventures_, October 1941:
> >
> > ... we took a poll of several thousand readers' comments and
> > discovered that the ten most liked authors were (in order):
> >
> > 1. Don Wilcox
> > 2. William P. McGivern
> > 3. John York Cabot [pseudonym of David Wright O'Brien]
> > 4. Nelson S. Bond
> > 5. David Wright O'Brien
> > 6. James Norman
> > 7. Edgar Rice Burroughs
> > 8. Robert Moore Williams
> > 9. David V. Reed
> > 10. Eando Binder [Otto Binder as of 1941]
> >
> > [quote from "Editor's Preface" in _The Best of Don Wilcox, Volume 1_
> > since I can't get to my pulps at the moment]
> >
> > Granted, _Fantastic Adventures_ was no _Astounding_, but still...
>
> I have only heard of five of them (1, 4, 7, 8, & 10). Of course, if such
> a poll (I have to check) was made in _Astounding_, the top two authors
> would had been Robert A. Heinlein and Anson MacDonald.

Oh yes, the competition was fierce!

Quadibloc

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Jul 26, 2017, 3:00:04 PM7/26/17

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On Wednesday, July 26, 2017 at 8:32:28 AM UTC-6, Ahasuerus wrote:

> 10. Eando Binder [Otto Binder as of 1941]

Not _quite_. Eando Binder was a pen name used for stories Otto Binder co-wrote
with his wife.

John Savard

Ted Nolan <tednolan>

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Jul 26, 2017, 3:11:17 PM7/26/17

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In article <olaakt$dki$1...@dont-email.me>,

I had occasion to look up Wilcox recently. Apparently he sold
mostly to Palmer, an dwhen Palmer retired his career largely ended.
I did recently pick up some of his stuff for kindle and will probably
do a review eventually.
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..

David Johnston

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Jul 26, 2017, 3:35:46 PM7/26/17

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His wife was his brother?

Jul 26, 2017, 4:23:34 PM7/26/17

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Jack and Otto certainly collaborated on the CAPTAIN MARVEL
and other MARVEL FAMILY stories in the comics, and for other
publishers than Fawcett.

Kevin R

Dorothy J Heydt

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Jul 26, 2017, 4:30:04 PM7/26/17

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In article <ad3d3b71-5cfc-43ae...@googlegroups.com>,

His wife???? His brother, I thought.

Ahasuerus

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Jul 26, 2017, 4:31:53 PM7/26/17

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On Wednesday, July 26, 2017 at 4:15:08 PM UTC-4, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
[snip-snip]

> But IIRC, he saved the "Heinlein" and
> "Anson MacDonald" by-lines for Campbell; if something didn't sell
> to Campbell, he put another name on it and sold it to one of the
> cheaper publishers.

Yes, usually as "Lyle Monroe".

> _Fantastic Universe_ may or may not have
> been one of these; but if they did publish any of his, it
> wouldn't be "by Heinlein".

Just to make sure that we are all on the same page: the pulp magazine
_Fantastic Adventures_ (1939-1953) and the digest magazine _Fantastic
Universe_ (1953-1960) were very different beasts.

Ahasuerus

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Jul 26, 2017, 4:38:46 PM7/26/17

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Sorry, I meant on the fiction side rather than on the art side of things.

Lynn McGuire

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Jul 26, 2017, 5:01:01 PM7/26/17

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I read everything of Edgar Rice Burroughs that I could find in the 1960s
and 70s. There were about 20 or 30 Tarzan books IIRC.

Lynn

Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)

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Jul 26, 2017, 7:50:45 PM7/26/17

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I've heard of most of those and read something by most of them, but
boy, that's still a pretty good perspective shot.

--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.dreamwidth.org

D B Davis

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Jul 26, 2017, 10:15:04 PM7/26/17

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Ahasuerus <ahas...@email.com> wrote:
> On Wednesday, July 26, 2017 at 11:01:37 AM UTC-4, Michael F. Stemper wrote:
>> On 2017-07-26 09:32, Ahasuerus wrote:
>> > From _Fantastic Adventures_, October 1941:
>> >
>> > ... we took a poll of several thousand readers' comments and
>> > discovered that the ten most liked authors were (in order):
>> >
>> > 1. Don Wilcox
>> > 2. William P. McGivern
>> > 3. John York Cabot [pseudonym of David Wright O'Brien]
>> > 4. Nelson S. Bond
>> > 5. David Wright O'Brien
>> > 6. James Norman
>> > 7. Edgar Rice Burroughs
>> > 8. Robert Moore Williams
>> > 9. David V. Reed
>> > 10. Eando Binder [Otto Binder as of 1941]
>>
>> I've read one short by Bond, and three novels by Binder.
>
> Bond wrote a number of decent stories. On the novel side, I thought
> that _Exiles of Time_ was readable, but it's been a long time and I
> am not sure whether it's still readable in the 21st century.

Edgar Rice Burroughs is the only /name/ familiar to me. None of
Burroughs stories have been read by me, mind you, but his name is
familiar to me.

Bond's an interesting author. Although _Time Machines_ (Nahin) neglects
to include _Exiles of Time_, it /does/ include a plethora of other Bond
short stories that fall into the time travel genre. That's my sweet spot.
Short stories with time travel.

Here's a list of Bond shorts in reverse chronological order. A link to
archive.org is provided when available, otherwise the pulp issue or
anthology is cited.

"Uncommon Castaway"
https://archive.org/details/Donald_A._Wollheim_ed._Avon_Fantasy_Reader_no._11_1949

"The Magic Staircase"
"Johnny Cartwright's Camera"
"The Einstein Inshoot"
"Dr. Fuddle's Fingers"
"The Bacular Clock"
_Mr. Mergenthwirker's Lobblies and Other Fantastic Tales_

"Horsesense Hank in the Parallel Worlds"
https://archive.org/details/Amazing_Stories_v16n08_1942-08_Ziff-Davis

"The Geometrics of Johnny Day"
_Astounding_ July 1941

"The Fountain"
https://archive.org/details/Unknown_v05n01_1941-06_PDF_unz.org

"Parallel in Time"
https://archive.org/details/Thrilling_Wonder_Stories_v24n02_1943-06_images

"The Monster from Nowhere"
https://archive.org/details/Fantastic_Adventures_v01n02_1939-07_cape1736

"Lightship, Ho!"
_Astounding_ July 1939

"Down the Dimensions"
_Astounding_ April 1937

What do you know? With a little help from archive.org, /all/ of the
Bond shorts that appear in pulp are available to me. The anthology,
_Mr. Mergenthwirker's_, is available at abebooks.com.

The earliest story, "Down the Dimensions," was just read by me for the
very first time. The story begins with the H G Wellian view of time as
the fourth dimension.

Bond then adds a twist. Instead of traveling through time, he has his
protagonist travel through dimensions; from three dimensions, through
two dimensions, to a one dimensional singularity. There's a surprise at
the end.

Thank you,

--
Don

Anthony Nance

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Jul 27, 2017, 8:33:03 AM7/27/17

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James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:
> In article <07e05601-b973-4eb3...@googlegroups.com>,
> Ahasuerus <ahas...@email.com> wrote:
>>From _Fantastic Adventures_, October 1941:
>>
>>... we took a poll of several thousand readers' comments and
>>discovered that the ten most liked authors were (in order):
>>
>>1. Don Wilcox
>>2. William P. McGivern
>>3. John York Cabot [pseudonym of David Wright O'Brien]
>>4. Nelson S. Bond
>>5. David Wright O'Brien
>>6. James Norman
>>7. Edgar Rice Burroughs
>>8. Robert Moore Williams
>>9. David V. Reed
>>10. Eando Binder [Otto Binder as of 1941]
>>
>>[quote from "Editor's Preface" in _The Best of Don Wilcox, Volume 1_
>>since I can't get to my pulps at the moment]
>>
>>Granted, _Fantastic Adventures_ was no _Astounding_, but still...
>
> The books I review for the Tears series often have ad sections for
> best sellers and popular books from the 1970s and so many of them
> are completely forgotten now after only a few decades.
>
> I have knowingly heard of Bond, Burrough and Binder, but I may not have
> actually read Bond.

Wilcox is often credited with publishing the first generation ship story
(1940's "The Voyage That Lasted 600 Years"[1]), but I don't recall
reading it.

I have golden-age fond memories of Bond's "And Lo! The Bird", but
I have no idea if it would hold up today.

Tony

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Jul 27, 2017, 10:54:07 AM7/27/17

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That's all right, then.

While many comics artists would contribute to story, rather than
working from a strictly dictated script, the Binder/Beck shop would
have mostly worked from full script.

Jack Binder did contribute the comic strip "Zarnak" to THRILLING
WONDER STORIES.

Kevin R

David Johnston

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Jul 27, 2017, 1:06:21 PM7/27/17

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It's online. I read it a few days ago to answer the question "Who the hell is Don Wilcox?". It hits the usual notes but I was a bit baffled by the premise. If you have working cryogenic suspension technology...why the hell would you launch a generation ship?

-dsr-

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Jul 27, 2017, 3:08:08 PM7/27/17

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So that there are people who can do maintenance on the ship and the cryotanks,
of course. Those vacuum tubes don't change themselves.

-dsr-

James Nicoll

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Jul 27, 2017, 3:48:55 PM7/27/17

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In article <olcma9$308$3...@dont-email.me>,

Collected in an Asimov-helmed anthology! Which I never read.

--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My Livejournal at http://www.livejournal.com/users/james_nicoll
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll

Michael F. Stemper

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Jul 27, 2017, 3:53:36 PM7/27/17

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This recommendation (I missed your previous mention) send me to the
ISFDB and sure, enough, it's been republished within the last two
decades.

Looking at Bond's works, I find that "Magic City" was the third of
four stories involving Meg, and not a stand-alone as I'd always
thought:

<http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pe.cgi?9416>

--
Michael F. Stemper
Always use apostrophe's and "quotation marks" properly.

David Johnston

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Jul 27, 2017, 7:01:02 PM7/27/17

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That's why you have the cryogenic tubes set up to revive the occupants at regular intervals...the way the protagonist is in the story so he can watch the ship go to hell the way they always do.

Robert Woodward

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Jul 28, 2017, 12:57:40 AM7/28/17

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In article <oldg4a$dc$1...@dont-email.me>,

"Michael F. Stemper" <michael...@gmail.com> wrote:

The entry for the 4th title ("Pilgrimage") states that it was a revised
version of "The Priestess Who Rebelled" (i.e., the first story in the
series) and it was included in the Asimov&Greenberg anthology _The Great
Science Fiction Stories Volume 1, 1939_ rather than the original
version. I wonder what the differences are.

--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.
—-----------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward robe...@drizzle.com

Robert Woodward

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Jul 28, 2017, 1:04:09 AM7/28/17

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In article <be9c4110-655c-428f...@googlegroups.com>,

Perhaps the cryogenic suspension was VERY expensive. The generation ship
would then be a cheaper way to deliver X number of potential colonists
to a world. Our protagonist is there to ensure that the ship arrives at
the destination world.