Old time stories about the millionaire rocket developer?
Robert Clark
then not only the current fiction but the SF of the early years like
in the 30's and 40's. It seemed quaint though the stories from that
period of the millionaires who hired the scientists to build or built
themselves the rockets that allowed them to become the first men in
space. In the 70's it seemed only the largest governments could afford
to do this.
Well maybe such iconoclastic millionaires won't be the first in space
but it is becoming increasingly likely they will be able to produce
their own space vehicles capable of taking passengers to orbit. I'm
thinking of Richard Branson of Virgin Galactic, Elon Musk of SpaceX,
Jeff Bezos of Blue Origin, John Carmack of Armadillo Aerospace, and
some others.
What are some of the best stories of the early years of SF with this
theme?
BTW, I'm of the opinion that the rapidly decreasing cost of
lightweight composite materials will soon make possible single stage
rockets of the kind Robert Heinlein and the other early guys used to
write about:
Newsgroups: sci.space.policy, sci.astro, sci.physics
From: Robert Clark <rgregorycl...@yahoo.com>
Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2009 07:18:40 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: A kerosene-fueled X-33 as a single stage to orbit
vehicle.
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.space.policy/msg/a8c511e5d30761fd?hl=en
Newsgroups: sci.space.policy, sci.astro, sci.physics
From: Robert Clark <rgregorycl...@yahoo.com>
Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2009 08:15:23 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: A kerosene-fueled X-33 as a single stage to orbit
vehicle.
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.space.policy/msg/834d710b2786c92b?hl=en
Newsgroups: sci.space.policy, sci.astro, sci.physics
From: Robert Clark <rgregorycl...@yahoo.com>
Date: Sat, 28 Nov 2009 08:24:23 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: A kerosene-fueled X-33 as a single stage to orbit
vehicle.
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.space.policy/msg/c52a76fed257d380?hl=en
Bob Clark
SolomonW
Not quite what you asked but similar
http://www.universetoday.com/2009/11/30/new-zealand-launches-first-rocket/
Marcus L. Rowland
<07a0e3f1-069d-485d...@m3g2000yqf.googlegroups.com>,
Robert Clark <rgrego...@yahoo.com> writes
> I grew up in the 70's and started reading SF then. I liked reading
>then not only the current fiction but the SF of the early years like in
>the 30's and 40's. It seemed quaint though the stories from that period
>of the millionaires who hired the scientists to build or built
>themselves the rockets that allowed them to become the first men in
>space. In the 70's it seemed only the largest governments could afford
>to do this.
> Well maybe such iconoclastic millionaires won't be the first in space
>but it is becoming increasingly likely they will be able to produce
>their own space vehicles capable of taking passengers to orbit. I'm
>thinking of Richard Branson of Virgin Galactic, Elon Musk of SpaceX,
>Jeff Bezos of Blue Origin, John Carmack of Armadillo Aerospace, and
>some others.
> What are some of the best stories of the early years of SF with this
>theme?
_Stories of Other Worlds_ by George Griffith, 1900, novelised as _A
Honeymoon In Space_
The hero, Lord Redgrave, builds an anti-gravity spaceship, sweeps an
American heiress off her feet and marries her, and they set off to
explore the Solar System, meet interesting aliens, and blow them away
with their trusty Maxim guns.
On line on my web site - I used it as source material for my RPG.
http://www.forgottenfutures.com/game/ff2/
--
Marcus L. Rowland www.forgottenfutures.com
www.forgottenfutures.org
www.forgottenfutures.co.uk
Forgotten Futures - The Scientific Romance Role Playing Game
Diana: Warrior Princess & Elvis: The Legendary Tours
The Original Flatland Role Playing Game
James Burns
> I grew up in the 70's and started reading SF then.
> I liked reading then not only the current fiction
> but the SF of the early years like in the 30's and 40's.
> It seemed quaint though the stories from that period
> of the millionaires who hired the scientists to build
> or built themselves the rockets that allowed them to
> become the first men in space. In the 70's it seemed
> only the largest governments could afford to do this.
>
> Well maybe such iconoclastic millionaires won't be
> the first in space but it is becoming increasingly
> likely they will be able to produce their own space
> vehicles capable of taking passengers to orbit.
> I'm thinking of Richard Branson of Virgin Galactic,
> Elon Musk of SpaceX, Jeff Bezos of Blue Origin,
> John Carmack of Armadillo Aerospace, and some others.
>
> What are some of the best stories of the early years
> of SF with this theme?
Any list of stories about iconoclastic millionaires
going to the moon has to include Robert Heinlein's
"The Man Who Sold The Moon"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Man_Who_Sold_the_Moon
What I especially liked was Heinlein's description
of the the political/economic scams that the
tycoon Harriman pull on everyone else not only in
order to walk on the moon himself, but to control
the moon himself as well.
Jim Burns
Louann Miller
9087-72f...@m3g2000yqf.googlegroups.com:
> the SF of the early years like
> in the 30's and 40's. It seemed quaint though the stories from that
> period of the millionaires who hired the scientists to build or built
> themselves the rockets that allowed them to become the first men in
> space.
People were writing Howard Hughes fanfiction.
Remus Shepherd
> I grew up in the 70's and started reading SF then. I liked reading
> then not only the current fiction but the SF of the early years like
> in the 30's and 40's. It seemed quaint though the stories from that
> period of the millionaires who hired the scientists to build or built
> themselves the rockets that allowed them to become the first men in
> space. In the 70's it seemed only the largest governments could afford
> to do this.
> Well maybe such iconoclastic millionaires won't be the first in space
> but it is becoming increasingly likely they will be able to produce
> their own space vehicles capable of taking passengers to orbit. I'm
> thinking of Richard Branson of Virgin Galactic, Elon Musk of SpaceX,
> Jeff Bezos of Blue Origin, John Carmack of Armadillo Aerospace, and
> some others.
> What are some of the best stories of the early years of SF with this
> theme?
Don't know many of the early SF stories with this theme, but the
example that I remember the best is Poul Anderson's _Harvest of Stars_.
I seem to recall a prequel to that book, with the millionaire Guthrie
assembling his Fireball corporation, but I can't find the title.
... ...
Remus Shepherd <re...@panix.com>
Journal: http://www.livejournal.com/users/remus_shepherd/
art...@yahoo.com
> I grew up in the 70's and started reading SF then. I liked reading
> then not only the current fiction but the SF of the early years like
> in the 30's and 40's. It seemed quaint though the stories from that
> period of the millionaires who hired the scientists to build or built
> themselves the rockets that allowed them to become the first men in
> space. In the 70's it seemed only the largest governments could afford
> to do this.
> Well maybe such iconoclastic millionaires won't be the first in space
> but it is becoming increasingly likely they will be able to produce
> their own space vehicles capable of taking passengers to orbit. I'm
> thinking of Richard Branson of Virgin Galactic, Elon Musk of SpaceX,
> Jeff Bezos of Blue Origin, John Carmack of Armadillo Aerospace, and
> some others.
> What are some of the best stories of the early years of SF with this
> theme?
Not early, and not exactly what you want, but Terry Bisson's Voyage to
the Red Planet has a space trip sponsored by Disney
alie...@gmail.com
> I grew up in the 70's and started reading SF then. I liked reading
> then not only the current fiction but the SF of the early years like
> in the 30's and 40's. It seemed quaint though the stories from that
> period of the millionaires who hired the scientists to build or built
> themselves the rockets that allowed them to become the first men in
> space. In the 70's it seemed only the largest governments could afford
> to do this.
> Well maybe such iconoclastic millionaires won't be the first in space
> but it is becoming increasingly likely they will be able to produce
> their own space vehicles capable of taking passengers to orbit. I'm
> thinking of Richard Branson of Virgin Galactic, Elon Musk of SpaceX,
> Jeff Bezos of Blue Origin, John Carmack of Armadillo Aerospace, and
> some others.
> What are some of the best stories of the early years of SF with this
> theme?
You're familiar with John W. Campbell's Arcot-Wade-and-Morey tales,
beginning with _The Black Star Passes_?
Also, E. E. Smith's Skylark series?
> BTW, I'm of the opinion that the rapidly decreasing cost of
> lightweight composite materials will soon make possible single stage
> rockets of the kind Robert Heinlein and the other early guys used to
> write about:
Campbell and Smith were way too familiar with the rocket equation to
believe rockets were any good for story-usable long-distance
spaceflight; they had to "invent" workarounds like inertia redirectors
and total mass-energy conversion.
For NEO, much less Lunar trips, single-stage rockets are IMO very
unlikely.
Mark L. Fergerson
Kurt Busiek
Also not early, and not prose, but the graphic novel ASTRONAUTS IN
TROUBLE: LIVE FROM THE MOON fits into that genre. It's not "first men
in space," so much as "return to space," but other than that it has the
right elements.
kdb
--
Visit http://www.busiek.com -- for all your Busiek needs!
W. Citoan
> It seemed quaint though the stories from that period of the
> millionaires who hired the scientists to build or built themselves
> the rockets that allowed them to become the first men in space.
> What are some of the best stories of the early years of SF with this
> theme?
Not "best", but there is Randall Garrett's "By Proxy." Published in
1960 under the name David Gordon.
http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/24707
- W. Citoan
--
His mind his kingdom, and his will his law.
-- Cowper
Robert Clark
Thanks. That certainly qualifies.
Bob Clark
Robert Clark
I was thinking mostly of the early stories. But I'm a fan of
Anderson so I'll give his novel a read.
Bob Clark
Robert Clark
Thanks. I'll give those a look.
Heinlein also knew the limitations imposed by the rocket equation and
chose to make his rockets nuclear powered in his stories.
However, actually an SSTO is not technically impossible with current
materials and chemical propellants, just more technically difficult
and expensive than multi-stage rockets. Given the fact that they
result in lower payload fractions to orbit, the large aerospace
companies didn't want to invest the quite large amounts to develop
one.
A reusable SSTO theoretically should result in lower costs over time
than expendables, but given the actual large launch costs associated
to the semi-reusable space shuttle, that is not a given, making the
large aerospace companies even more leery of investing large amounts
in the development of a SSTO.
See the links here that discuss the fact that a chemical propulsion
SSTO is in fact technically feasible:
Newsgroups: sci.space.policy, sci.astro, sci.physics
From: Robert Clark <rgregorycl...@yahoo.com>
Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 06:26:56 -0800 (PST)
Local: Tues, Dec 1 2009 9:26 am
Subject: Re: A kerosene-fueled X-33 as a single stage to orbit
vehicle.
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.space.policy/msg/1af7d70b3c0392bf?hl=en
Bob Clark
Robert Clark
Another example would be the film co-written by Heinlein from 1950,
"Destination Moon."
This is available free over the internet:
Destination Moon.
http://www.archive.org/details/destinationmoon
Bob Clark
David DeLaney
>On Dec 2, 11:09�am, "n...@bid.nes" <alien8...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> beginning with _The Black Star Passes_?
>>
>> � Also, E. E. Smith's Skylark series?
> Thanks. I'll give those a look.
Just so you know, all three of the AWM books are on Project Gutenberg (The
Black Star Passes, Islands of Space, Invaders from the Infinite). [The E.
Cleveland Public Library had a three-in-one book club edition when I was young;
since then I've found all three in the tiny paperback version they seem to have
originally come out in, but that's labor-intensive.] Two of Smith's Skylark
series are as well.
Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from d...@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
Remus Shepherd
> > ? ?Don't know many of the early SF stories with this theme, but the
> > example that I remember the best is Poul Anderson's _Harvest of Stars_.
> > I seem to recall a prequel to that book, with the millionaire Guthrie
> > assembling his Fireball corporation, but I can't find the title.
> I was thinking mostly of the early stories. But I'm a fan of
> Anderson so I'll give his novel a read.
Note that Harvest of Stars is considered to be the weakest book in the
Fireball series. The setup pays off in later novels, but that one is a
bit meandering.
I still can't find that prequel. Maybe it was a short story.
Robert Carnegie
I know I recently mentioned _Edison's Conquest of Mars_ - on casual
inquiry it's one of a genre of "Edisonades", just as there were
"Robinsonades" based on _Robinson Crusoe_, of which _The Swiss Family
Robinson_ is conspicuous. I think /that/ term is German. I don't
know whether "Edisonades" always featured Thomas Edison himself, or
whether e.g. the original Tom Swift counts.
And it belatedly occurs to me that I bear a famous name that things
might be said about. Apparently included in
<http://www.archive.org/stream/erchiemydrollfri00munriala/
erchiemydrollfri00munriala_djvu.txt>
- I've read it in print - is a short speculative account of the home
life of "Carnegie's Wee Lassie", but otherwise?
Robert Clark
> then not only the current fiction but the SF of the early years like
> in the 30's and 40's. It seemed quaint though the stories from that
> period of the millionaires who hired the scientists to build or built
> themselves the rockets that allowed them to become the first men in
> space. In the 70's it seemed only the largest governments could afford
> to do this.
> Well maybe such iconoclastic millionaires won't be the first in space
> but it is becoming increasingly likely they will be able to produce
> their own space vehicles capable of taking passengers to orbit. I'm
> thinking of Richard Branson of Virgin Galactic, Elon Musk of SpaceX,
> Jeff Bezos of Blue Origin, John Carmack of Armadillo Aerospace, and
> some others.
> What are some of the best stories of the early years of SF with this
> theme?
>
> BTW, I'm of the opinion that the rapidly decreasing cost of
> lightweight composite materials will soon make possible single stage
> rockets of the kind Robert Heinlein and the other early guys used to
> write about:
>
> Newsgroups: sci.space.policy, sci.astro, sci.physics
> From: Robert Clark <rgregorycl...@yahoo.com>
> Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2009 07:18:40 -0800 (PST)
> Subject: Re: A kerosene-fueled X-33 as a single stage to orbit
>
> Newsgroups: sci.space.policy, sci.astro, sci.physics
> From: Robert Clark <rgregorycl...@yahoo.com>
> Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2009 08:15:23 -0800 (PST)
> Subject: Re: A kerosene-fueled X-33 as a single stage to orbit
>
> Newsgroups: sci.space.policy, sci.astro, sci.physics
> From: Robert Clark <rgregorycl...@yahoo.com>
> Date: Sat, 28 Nov 2009 08:24:23 -0800 (PST)
> Subject: Re: A kerosene-fueled X-33 as a single stage to orbit
>
I looked up one of my books containing S/F stories of the early
period. This one was "The Early Del Rey." It contained the short story
"The Stars Look Down". This was written in the 40's. It concerned two
millionaire business men competing against each other to become the
first men in space. One of them uses atomic power for his ship, the
other explosives.
Being written during war time, del Rey chose to have the two mens
competing teams actually battle each other with firearms in the race
to have their rocket reach space first. This was one of del Rey's
early writing efforts. You can tell he was still improving his writing
skills.
Still it is interesting in that it presented a view common in science
fiction during that period that individual, wealthy visionaries would
be responsible for building the first rockets to space, not giant
government agencies.
As I said, we are close to achieving that.
Bob Clark
Robert Clark
his book of collected stories _The Early Asimov_. This story was
entitled "Trends", first published in July, 1939 in _Astounding
Science Fiction_. It's set in 1973.
Asimov is my favorite S/F author. He's been criticized sometimes for
his lack of artistry in his writing style, but you don't read Asimov
for great art, you read him for his wealth of ideas. There a few good
ideas in this story. Asimov says in the prefatory notes to the story
that he had a part-time job in college typing the manuscript for a
sociologist studying resistance to technological change in history.
This gave Asimov the idea that there might not be a great welcoming of
someone attempting for the first time to reach the heavens but a
resistance to it. To support this plot point he had the U.S.
undergoing an extreme religious fundamentalism during the period that
restricted rather than promoted science.
Such resistance in reality was certainly not widespread, as it
actually turned out. But Asimov did make an interesting prediction
that could be regarded as true. He wrote this in 1939. He expected the
U.S. as many people did to be drawn into the war in Europe. But an
interesting prediction he made then would be that in the post-war
period after World War II there would be a great deal of moral and
social conservatism. This did indeed happen in the 1950's.
The title of story come from the idea that there are pendulum swings
in the attitudes towards technological and social advances. The story
was set in a time of severe social and technological restriction. But
as Asimov noted the pendulum does swing ...
Bob Clark