Amethyst?
skru*hljrdn*fans
I've read that name in this newsgroup before but don't know who he\she
is. Who is Amethyst? What character(s) is he\she related to?
Spidra Webster
In article <34dbb195...@nntp.netcruiser>, jam...@ix.netcom.com
(skru*hljrdn*fans) wrote:
> I've read that name in this newsgroup before but don't know who he\she
> is. Who is Amethyst? What character(s) is he\she related to?
Amethyst was a book that was written more from a fantasy perspective and
was probably intended to appeal to an audience of young girls. It focused
on Amy, who finds out that she was actually a foundling. Her past catches
up with her and she finds out she was the last scion of the royal house of
Amethyst on Gemworld.
I enjoyed the symbolism of the gem houses, the escapism of Amy being able
to ditch her earthly troubles and return to Gemworld, and the fact that it
was a book with a heroine.
I don't have a complete run, but it should be pretty easy to find a
significant amount of Amethyst - Princess of Gemworld issues by checking
the cheap bins at your local con.
Spidra Webster
Help me celebrate the release of my brother's first major label album- visit http://www.bayscenes.com/ind/spidra/brendan.html !
http://www.sirius.com/~spidra/brendan.html
__________________________________________________________________
"What a gyp - no last request! I'm gonna notify the Executioner's Guild!" - Joxer the Mighty
DScottDoty
Be warned, though- the original 12-issue run was great, but the ongoing
series that followed it up began mediocre, and went downhill to the point
that I was wishing it had been cancelled 4 issues earlier than it was.
I won't get into the 4-issue mini failed revival.
Dave Doty
JohannaLD
>Who is Amethyst? What character(s) is he\she related to?
Amethyst was Amy Winston, a young girl who discovered that she was
a princess in Gemworld, a mystical land with twelve ruling houses,
each named after a different gemstone. In Gemworld, she was a young
woman who could do magic, and the stories dealt with her trying to
save that world from evil while worrying about her "normal" life.
In pre-Zero Hour Legion of Super-Heroes, Gemworld was revealed to
be related to Zerox, the Sorceror's Planet, and Mordru, an evil wizard
archvillain of the LSH was revealed to be descended from one of the
Gemworld houses. The spirit of Amethyst took over Kono, one of the
LSH members at one point. However, that link may no longer exist.
Johanna
NoSpam@mikecoffin@monmouth.com
The spirit of Amethyst took over Kono, one of the
>LSH members at one point. However, that link may no longer exist.
Actually I believe the spirit of Amethyst took over Mysa aka The White Witch.
And yes, that link no longer exists (as far as we know) Post Zero Hour.
Adam
WRH Bill
DC really ought to publish the original AMETHYST limited series as a trade
paperback-- and find a way to market it to the teenage girl fantasy fan
audience who would appreciate it (though I'm not a teenage girl, and I
appreciated it).
Maybe it could be shelved in the stores near the SUGAR AND SPIKE collections DC
would also be publishing if they were serious about expanding their readership
beyond the shrinking superhero-fan audience.
Dan McEwen
Really? I liked the 4-issue mini. Too bad it was retconned out by
the Legion reboot.
Lyle Masaki
I think the spirit of Amethyst took over both Kono and Mysa, tho' she
left Kono after Mysa managed to defeat Mordu. Mysa continued to have
Amethyst's power until End of an Era.
Lyle
spi...@aloha.net
Carl Fink
I suggested just this on rac.dcu, and a DC employee who shall remain
nameless (unless she feels like posting) said something like, "But
that would create demand for similar books, and we couldn't fill that
demand."
--
Carl Fink ca...@dm.net
"Ready to begin speaking in technobabble, Sir."
Alien technician in "Buck Godot" by Phil Foglio
JohannaLD
From: spi...@aloha.no-spam.net (Lyle Masaki)
>I think the spirit of Amethyst took over both Kono and Mysa, tho' she
>left Kono after Mysa managed to defeat Mordu.
Leading to a line I enjoyed: after Kono was no longer "possessed",
she looks at herself and asks why she's dressed as a cheerleader.
But yes, I forgot the Mysa possession, mainly because it looked
painful. All that crystal forming her armor.
Johanna
Luis Dantas
ca...@panix.com (Carl Fink) wrote:
>I suggested just this on rac.dcu, and a DC employee who shall remain
>nameless (unless she feels like posting) said something like, "But
>that would create demand for similar books, and we couldn't fill that
>demand."
Funny as that statement is, it is also revealing of a problem that
looks very real: comic book publishers are losing ground on the
variety arena. Writing is probably the deciding factor here. Both DC
and Marvel give me the impression of being somewhat unsecure about
what to do to keep stories interesting, because at current prices, a
book must be very attractive to survive.
And so the demand on writers grows a lot. I keep seeing statements of
how hard it is to find suitable replacements for Miller on DD,
Claremont on X-Men, Byrne on FF, Simonson on Thor. And, I assume, we
may well hear about David's Aquaman, Supergirl and Hulk for some ten
years after he leaves.
Why is that bad? Because good writers have definite styles. David,
for instance, likes redefining characters' personalities, goals and
powers, for instance. That is great for characters with decades of
continuity, a breath of fresh air. But if you look hard enough, you
see the pattern. If you take truly unusual titles such as Sugar &
Spike or a properly written Amethyst (IMO, her first series was quite
unproperly written), it's even harder and riskier to choose writers.
Perhaps the publishers should consider having more "experimental"
comics, possibly in less expensive formats. It has been done for
decades now in most of the world, with titles that often reprint
american stories in smaller formats, with more stories per book, and
sometimes even in black and white. Since few if any titles in the US
market cost less than 1.95 or so nowadays, it seems to me there is an
untapped market here. It would be a good way of trying out new talent
and concepts, as well as keeping continuity of otherwise unused
characters - such as, say, Swamp Thing, Captain Atom or Animal Man.
I guess I'm proposing something very similar for early #600's Action
Comics, but with a more affordable price and more pages per story.
And quite possibly smaller, black and white and, please, with a few
inspired stories in each issue, as well as a few "experimental" ones.
Come to think of it, most limited series would best be made part of
such a title. It'd be a perfect (and comparatively inexpensive) to
keep readers exposed to the variety of the publishers' universes
without making them feel pressured into buying cross-overs. And the
increased accessibility of stories with continuity importance would
allow for greater freedom on other titles, too.
Am I crazy (about this particular proposal, that is)?
My God Wichita Is Boring Elmo
lu...@dantas.com (Luis Dantas) writes:
> a properly written Amethyst (IMO, her first series was quite
> unproperly written),
Boggle.
The creators of the character wrote her series "unproperly"?
Needless to say, I disagree strongly. I feel that the writers who followed
Mishkin & Cohn (especially Giffen) were the ones to get the character
incorrect.
--
"Hello. My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die."
"Hello. My name is Oedipus. I killed my father and married my mother. Prepare
to watch me tear out my eyes."
"Hello. My name is Hamlet. You killed my father and married my mother. Should
I do something about it or not?"--unknown
elmo mor...@physics.rice.edu
http://www.bonner.rice.edu/morrow
Daniel Henschel
Wasn't Gemworld also linked to the Lords of Order and Chaos somehow?
And wasn't there some tie-in to Skartaris?
Steven Grant
Luis Dantas wrote in message
>>I suggested just this on rac.dcu, and a DC employee who shall remain
>>nameless (unless she feels like posting) said something like, "But
>>that would create demand for similar books, and we couldn't fill that
>>demand."
>
>Funny as that statement is, it is also revealing of a problem that
>looks very real: comic book publishers are losing ground on the
>variety arena. Writing is probably the deciding factor here. Both DC
>and Marvel give me the impression of being somewhat unsecure about
>what to do to keep stories interesting, because at current prices, a
>book must be very attractive to survive.
In the case of SUGAR AND SPIKE, it's a very literal concern. I don't think
DC CAN produce any more S&S than they already have. They're not allowed to.
In terms of writing, most writers in the business are capable of a much
wider range of material than the business is interested in publishing.
Bala Menon
Daniel Henschel <LEA...@webtv.net> wrote in article
<6bl670$8gs$1...@newsd-124.bryant.webtv.net>...
> Wasn't Gemworld also linked to the Lords of Order and Chaos
> somehow?
Through a retcon. It was established that Amethyst's father was
a Lord of Order, and Dark Opal was an agent of a Lord of Chaos.
Also, a Lord of Chaos possessed a Gemworld Prince, who later
became known as Mordru, the Legion's sorcerous foe.
> And wasn't there some tie-in to Skartaris?
I don't recall that.
--
Bala Menon (b.m...@worldnet.att.net)
Bard Sinister
Luis Dantas wrote:
> "Steven Grant" <sdg...@premier1.net> wrote:
> >Luis Dantas wrote in message
> >In the case of SUGAR AND SPIKE, it's a very literal concern. I don't think
> >DC CAN produce any more S&S than they already have. They're not allowed to.
> >In terms of writing, most writers in the business are capable of a much
> >wider range of material than the business is interested in publishing.
> I do not doubt you, but what do you mean by DC not being allowed to
> produce more S&S? I thought they had the rights, am I wrong?
As I understand it, and I may be wrong, DC has the
rights to Sugar & Spike, lock stock and barrel. However,
they promised Mayer that nobody else would ever write or
draw the characters and he is still respected enough at
DC that they will not break that promise.
That said, DC has about a hundred published issues
worth of material, as well as 'over a hundred' stories
that are unpublished in the US. I think they have more
than enough material to keep releasing it for several
years if it is successful. They could go even longer if
they padded the books with some of Mayer's funny animal
stories, which would fit very well. All of this stuff
is very hard to find, and I think most Mayer collectors
would jump on it even if they had most of it already, so
I don't think a lack of material is a real problem.
Eric Gimlin
NoSpam@mikecoffin@monmouth.com
In article <6bl9lq$h...@bgtnsc03.worldnet.att.net>, "Bala Menon" <b.m...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>Daniel Henschel <LEA...@webtv.net> wrote in article
><6bl670$8gs$1...@newsd-124.bryant.webtv.net>...
>> Wasn't Gemworld also linked to the Lords of Order and Chaos
>> somehow?
>
>Through a retcon. It was established that Amethyst's father was
>a Lord of Order, and Dark Opal was an agent of a Lord of Chaos.
>Also, a Lord of Chaos possessed a Gemworld Prince, who later
>became known as Mordru, the Legion's sorcerous foe.
I don't know if you'd necessarily call that a ret-con. It was more like
"never before revealed information". To me a ret-con is Donna Troy no longer
being Wonder Woman's sister, or Black Canary taking WW's place in the JLA.
Adam
Luis Dantas
"Steven Grant" <sdg...@premier1.net> wrote:
>Luis Dantas wrote in message
>>>I suggested just this on rac.dcu, and a DC employee who shall remain
>>>nameless (unless she feels like posting) said something like, "But
>>>that would create demand for similar books, and we couldn't fill that
>>>demand."
>>
>>Funny as that statement is, it is also revealing of a problem that
>>looks very real: comic book publishers are losing ground on the
>>variety arena. Writing is probably the deciding factor here. Both DC
>>and Marvel give me the impression of being somewhat unsecure about
>>what to do to keep stories interesting, because at current prices, a
>>book must be very attractive to survive.
Luis Dantas
LEA...@webtv.net (Daniel Henschel) wrote:
>Wasn't Gemworld also linked to the Lords of Order and Chaos somehow?
Bala Menon already covered this question. The foreshadowing was
Dr.Fate's rescuing Amethyst during Crisis.
>And wasn't there some tie-in to Skartaris?
The closer I can recall is Power Girl. She was urged by the Phantom
Stranger to fight the Lords of Chaos (Power Girl Limited Series), and
much latter lived for a while in Skartaris. Perhaps the Atlantean
agents of Order and Chaos are still active in Skartaris?
Dan McEwen
On Sun, 8 Feb 1998 12:57:04 -0800, LEA...@webtv.net (Daniel Henschel)
wrote:
>Wasn't Gemworld also linked to the Lords of Order and Chaos somehow?
>And wasn't there some tie-in to Skartaris?
Gemworld was linked to the Lords of Chaos namely because Amethyst was
a Lord of Order. Her father (Lord Amethyst "possessed" by his
amethyst gemstone) was also a Lord of Order. Catrina may have been
linked into it all somehow, though I can't remember for sure.
Dan McEwen
On 8 Feb 1998 21:56:10 GMT, "Bala Menon" <b.m...@worldnet.att.net>
wrote:
>Daniel Henschel <LEA...@webtv.net> wrote in article
><6bl670$8gs$1...@newsd-124.bryant.webtv.net>...
>> Wasn't Gemworld also linked to the Lords of Order and Chaos
>> somehow?
>
>Through a retcon. It was established that Amethyst's father was
>a Lord of Order, and Dark Opal was an agent of a Lord of Chaos.
>Also, a Lord of Chaos possessed a Gemworld Prince, who later
>became known as Mordru, the Legion's sorcerous foe.
This was, IMO, a nice idea. It nicely streamlined the 30th century
era into the present day. *sigh* Funny how rebooting the *future*
alters the past.
>> And wasn't there some tie-in to Skartaris?
>
>I don't recall that.
Me, neither. Skartaris was, AFAIK, an Atlantean colony.
Dan McEwen
On 8 Feb 98 15:00:57 -0600, mor...@riph5.rice.edu (My God Wichita Is
Boring Elmo) wrote:
>lu...@dantas.com (Luis Dantas) writes:
>> a properly written Amethyst (IMO, her first series was quite
>> unproperly written),
>
>Boggle.
>
>The creators of the character wrote her series "unproperly"?
>
>Needless to say, I disagree strongly. I feel that the writers who followed
>Mishkin & Cohn (especially Giffen) were the ones to get the character
>incorrect.
Hmm...I enjoyed the Amethyst preview in LSH, as well as the original
maxi-series. The Special was OK, but the ongoing was generally poor.
The follow-up mini-series was excellent, IMO. (Was the mini by PAD?
I had thought the same team on AMETHYST also did THE ATLANTIS
CHRONICLES.)
Greg Schienke
"Steven Grant" <sdg...@premier1.net> wrote:
>In the case of SUGAR AND SPIKE, it's a very literal concern. I don't think
>DC CAN produce any more S&S than they already have. They're not allowed to.
Please explain this. Did Mayer have a Charles Schultz-type deal in
that no one besides himself is allowed to create new stories of his
characters?
Greg
Jason Fliegel
In article <34DE7A2B...@swbell.net>,
Bard Sinister <etgi...@swbell.net> wrote:
>
> As I understand it, and I may be wrong, DC has the
>rights to Sugar & Spike, lock stock and barrel. However,
>they promised Mayer that nobody else would ever write or
>draw the characters and he is still respected enough at
>DC that they will not break that promise.
That's my understanding, too.
> That said, DC has about a hundred published issues
>worth of material, as well as 'over a hundred' stories
>that are unpublished in the US. I think they have more
>than enough material to keep releasing it for several
>years if it is successful. They could go even longer if
>they padded the books with some of Mayer's funny animal
>stories, which would fit very well. All of this stuff
>is very hard to find, and I think most Mayer collectors
>would jump on it even if they had most of it already, so
>I don't think a lack of material is a real problem.
Every chance I get, I agitate for a big, cheap, black and white "Best of
Sheldon Mayer" book. Just think -- 75-100 pages each of Red Tornado,
Scribbly, and Sugar and Spike. I am so confident that no sane person
could fail to enjoy a collection like this that I make the following
guarantee: If DC publishes it, and you buy it, and you don't like it, you
can spit on Elmo.
--
Jason Fliegel
j-fl...@uchicago.edu
2L, University of Chicago Law School
Bob Heer
gs...@execpc.com (Greg Schienke) wrote
Mayer reportedly asked, and DC reportedly agreed, that no one else would
create SUGAR & SPIKE stories. This from reliable sources. Whether the
agreement is written or not (as I believe the Schulz one is) I haven't
heard, but it would be dishonourable for DC to allow new S&S stories to be
created. Not that "dishonourable" has always proven to be a completely
effective barrier at DC in the past....
Anecdotal evidence suggests that not everybody in DC editorial is aware of
this, so there have been rumblings from those areas about doing non-Mayer
S&S stories. Hopefully them that's higher up the food chain are aware
enough to prevent that from ever going beyond rumbling.
Not that they =need= any non-Mayer stories. For gods sake, there are
about 2500 pages of S&S available (just among those published in
english. I think you can safely round up to 3000 with the reported
only-foreign-published material). I don't think running out of material
can be called a serious "concern".
On another Mayer note, and speaking of variety, I recently got the Bible
adaptation Mayer did with Nestor Redondo. Neat stuff. DC should reprint
it, maybe under the Vertigo imprint. Call it a PREACHER spin-off...
Bob Heer bg...@torfree.net http://www.geocities.com/area51/dimension/1428
--
I need no aid! Groo is beyond any help!
--
Luis Dantas
fe...@lsh.org (Dan McEwen) wrote:
>>lu...@dantas.com (Luis Dantas) writes:
>>> a properly written Amethyst (IMO, her first series was quite
>>> unproperly written),
>>
>>Boggle.
>>
>>The creators of the character wrote her series "unproperly"?
Yes, Elmo, that's what I say. Just like the recently-cancelled Steel,
Amethyst is a concept with some potential, but which was mishandled on
its very first storyline. It's simply a matter of creators who
conceived a good character, but failed to develop it well. What's so
strange about that?
>>Needless to say, I disagree strongly. I feel that the writers who followed
>>Mishkin & Cohn (especially Giffen) were the ones to get the character
>>incorrect.
The original Amethyst was rather incoherent. For one thing, she had
the sexuality of a 16-years-old (or older), with a fitting fashion
sense and personality, but the dialogue of a 8-to-12-years-old. And I
couldn't stand plot points such as "the future of the whole Gemworld
relies on that little dog". Way too cheesy, and needlessly so.
>Hmm...I enjoyed the Amethyst preview in LSH, as well as the original
>maxi-series. The Special was OK, but the ongoing was generally poor.
>The follow-up mini-series was excellent, IMO. (Was the mini by PAD?
>I had thought the same team on AMETHYST also did THE ATLANTIS
>CHRONICLES.)
I believe her first series is that featuring her origin, her
acquaintance with Topaz and friends, and her long fight with Dark
Opal, right? It lasted for about 12 issues, and it's the one I find
inadequated. Didn't see any latter stories, except for the Crisis
cameos. It was inovative, yes, but undecided between being sexy,
politically correct, epical, or just plain naive. At times, real hard
to read.
One thing that I found interesting was how obvious (from the facial
expressions) was for the reader to locate Dark Opal's spies, and yet
Amethyst failed to realize their loyalties.
Elayne Wechsler-Chaput
Carl Fink (ca...@panix.com) wrote:
: On 8 Feb 1998 04:14:15 GMT, WRH Bill <wrh...@aol.com> wrote:
: >DC really ought to publish the original AMETHYST limited series as a trade
: >paperback-- and find a way to market it to the teenage girl fantasy fan
: >audience who would appreciate it (though I'm not a teenage girl, and I
: >appreciated it).
: >
: >Maybe it could be shelved in the stores near the SUGAR AND SPIKE collections DC
: >would also be publishing if they were serious about expanding their readership
: >beyond the shrinking superhero-fan audience.
: I suggested just this on rac.dcu, and a DC employee who shall remain
: nameless (unless she feels like posting) said something like, "But
: that would create demand for similar books, and we couldn't fill that
: demand."
Sure they could. Leah could sell them on ARI OF LEMURIA. :) :) :)
- Elayne
--
"The kiss originated when the first male reptile licked the first female
reptile, implying in a subtle, complimentary way that she was as succulent
as the small reptile he had for dinner the night before."
- F. Scott Fitzgerald
Greg Schienke
jbfl...@midway.uchicago.edu (Jason Fliegel) wrote:
>Every chance I get, I agitate for a big, cheap, black and white "Best of
>Sheldon Mayer" book. Just think -- 75-100 pages each of Red Tornado,
>Scribbly, and Sugar and Spike. I am so confident that no sane person
>could fail to enjoy a collection like this that I make the following
>guarantee: If DC publishes it, and you buy it, and you don't like it, you
>can spit on Elmo.
As if I don't have enough thinks on my mind, now this is going to
pop-up in my head as another thing missing from life. One of the best
things about THE GREATEST GOLDEN AGE STORIES EVER TOLD was the
SCRIBBLY reprint, still fresh after all these years. I'd be satisfied
with just a b&w reprinting of SCRIBBLY, if only in honor of Sheldon
Mayer. Think of it as a tribute similar to the one Marvel paid
Gruenwald when they printed the SQUADRON SUPREME TPB, only without the
ash in the ink.
Greg
Greg Schienke
bg...@torfree.net (Bob Heer) wrote:
>Mayer reportedly asked, and DC reportedly agreed, that no one else would
>create SUGAR & SPIKE stories. This from reliable sources. Whether the
>agreement is written or not (as I believe the Schulz one is) I haven't
>heard, but it would be dishonourable for DC to allow new S&S stories to be
>created. Not that "dishonourable" has always proven to be a completely
>effective barrier at DC in the past....
Would it be cynical of be to think that they only made this agreement
because, like giving PAM the rights to Thunderbolt, DC sees no profit
potential in Sugar & Spike. The nicer side of me would hope that the
gesture was made as a reward to a guy who really did help make DC
Comics in the first. As far as I'm concerned, without Sheldon Mayer,
ther never would have been a DC for us to complain about today.
>Anecdotal evidence suggests that not everybody in DC editorial is aware of
>this, so there have been rumblings from those areas about doing non-Mayer
>S&S stories. Hopefully them that's higher up the food chain are aware
>enough to prevent that from ever going beyond rumbling.
I would think that the trouble might lie higher up the food chain,
those executives who are part of Time Warner, but not DC itself. For
instance, let's say that the WB wants to produce a SUGAR & SPIKE
cartoon to compete against RUGRATS with a concurrent comic book.
Would the higher powers be satisfied with Mayer reprints (I'd be) or
would they want stories reflecting the television version?
Greg
My God Wichita Is Boring Elmo
jbfl...@midway.uchicago.edu (Jason Fliegel) writes:
> Every chance I get, I agitate for a big, cheap, black and white "Best of
> Sheldon Mayer" book. Just think -- 75-100 pages each of Red Tornado,
> Scribbly, and Sugar and Spike. I am so confident that no sane person
> could fail to enjoy a collection like this that I make the following
> guarantee: If DC publishes it, and you buy it, and you don't like it, you
> can spit on Elmo.
Just to give that some teeth, I'll second that guarantee.
I enjoyed the Scribbly/Red Tornado section of the Smithsonian Book of
Comic-Book Comics so much that I've made nefarious plans of evil to buy the
company.
--
"Cream is the stuff that floats to the top of unprocessed milk. It's
apparently good to be considered cream. Go figure. So when Paul Levitz said
`the fighting cream of the Legion', he meant that if good fighters floated
to the top of the Legion, they must have flight rings. Or something."
--Frothing-at-the-Mouth Lad
elmo mor...@physics.rice.edu
http://www.bonner.rice.edu/morrow
Kevin J. Maroney
mor...@riph5.rice.edu (My God Wichita Is Boring Elmo) wrote:
>Needless to say, I disagree strongly. I feel that the writers who followed
>Mishkin & Cohn (especially Giffen) were the ones to get the character
>incorrect.
At the time of the Giffen Amethysts, Giffen was doing some decent work
elsewhere, and the first couple of issues, scripted by Robert Loren
Fleming, were at least readable. It took a stunning nosedive when
Mindy Newell started scripting over Giffen's plots, inspiring possibly
my harshest review ever of a comic: "My God! Does anyone know where we
can dump Mindy Newell's body?"
Newell did much better work both before and after and didn't deserve
that blanket condemnation, but Christ, those were wretched comics.
--
Kevin J. Maroney | Crossover Technologies | kmar...@crossover.com
"There is a better world. There has to be."--Kay Challis
Kevin J. Maroney
NoSpam@mikecoffin@monmouth.com wrote:
>>Through a retcon. It was established that Amethyst's father was
>>a Lord of Order, and Dark Opal was an agent of a Lord of Chaos.
>
>I don't know if you'd necessarily call that a ret-con. It was more like
>"never before revealed information". To me a ret-con is Donna Troy no longer
>being Wonder Woman's sister, or Black Canary taking WW's place in the JLA.
It was definitely a continuity implant. It feels like a retcon because
it tied the Amethyst continuity (which, tho' within the DCU, was
relatively self-contained and complete) into the Lords of Order/Lords
of Chaos continuity in a way that was unnecessary, unconvincing, and
unwanted.
JohannaLD
From: lu...@dantas.com (Luis Dantas)
>The original Amethyst was rather incoherent. For one thing, she had
>the sexuality of a 16-years-old (or older), with a fitting fashion
>sense and personality, but the dialogue of a 8-to-12-years-old.
Sounds like an appropriate metaphor for adolescence to me. As a girl,
I could identify with Amethyst going through these worries.
>I believe her first series is that featuring her origin, her
>acquaintance with Topaz and friends, and her long fight with Dark
>Opal, right? It lasted for about 12 issues, and it's the one I find
>inadequated.
First miniseries was 12 issues.
Then came an annual, a 16-issue series, a special wrapping that up,
and the four-issue miniseries.
>It was inovative, yes, but undecided between being sexy,
>politically correct, epical, or just plain naive.
I disagree with all of this. Is it possible that you're reacting as
though you were the target audience, when you may not have been?
>One thing that I found interesting was how obvious (from the facial
>expressions) was for the reader to locate Dark Opal's spies, and yet
>Amethyst failed to realize their loyalties.
The omniscient reader is a long-standing characteristic of this
type of thing.
Johanna
DScottDoty
In article <19980212192...@ladder02.news.aol.com>, joha...@aol.com
(JohannaLD) writes:
>First miniseries was 12 issues.
Then came an annual, a 16-issue series, a
>special wrapping that up,
and the four-issue miniseries.
Just in case anyone is using this as a purchase list, I wanted to point
out that there was also a preview that came out in some comic (can
anyone remember which?) which led into the first series, as well as
a DC Comics presents that played a big part in the overall first mini
storyline.
Dave Doty
Jonathan L. Miller
It's wonderful to see a thread on what is one of my faves from DC's past! I
was dismayed when I saw Amy was left off the Zero Hour timeline (actually,
I was pissed is probably stating it more honestly), and a tad unhappy when
she was completely left out of the Mysa/Mordru storyline in LSH. (Of
course, I was always unhappy with the Giffen Post-Crisis retconn connecting
her with Mordru anyway.) Does anyone know Amy's status in continuity?
(Not that it'll keep me from sragging out the comics again and having a
good read now!)
jonathan, not the taget audience, sure, but loved 'em enough when he was a
kid to track 'em down when he became an adult!
Bala Menon
DScottDoty <dscot...@aol.com> wrote in article
<19980212203...@ladder03.news.aol.com>...
The Preview appeared in the Legion of Super-Heroes (#298, IIRC;
possibly #297). The DCCP story was important, since it
explained how Carnelian obtained one of his tools (specifics
not mentioned, as it might be a spoiler for someone who hasn't
read it, but wants to). The DCCP issue (Superman and Amethyst)
was late #50's or early #60's.
--
Bala Menon (b.m...@worldnet.att.net)
JohannaLD
From: jlmi...@oz.net (Jonathan L. Miller)
>Does anyone know Amy's status in continuity?
You're not going to like it -- she's an evil witch involved with some
sort of council on magic. Seen in the Weirdverse Convergence crossover
and later issues of Book of Fate.
Johanna
Ranma Al'Thor
JohannaLD (joha...@aol.com) wrote:
: From: jlmi...@oz.net (Jonathan L. Miller)
So what authors are responsible for this travesty so they can be hunted
down with an Axe?
--
John Walter Biles : MA-History, Ph.D Wannabe at U. Kansas
ra...@falcon.cc.ukans.edu
rh...@tass.org http://www.tass.org/~rhea/falcon.html
rh...@maison-otaku.net http://www.maison-otaku.net/~rhea/
"But he's weird! What are the customers gonna think?"
"Come on, a giant space monster ate the sun last year. People get
used to stuff."
--HITMAN
Four-Elmo Bobsled
joha...@aol.com (JohannaLD) writes:
> From: jlmi...@oz.net (Jonathan L. Miller)
>>Does anyone know Amy's status in continuity?
>
> You're not going to like it -- she's an evil witch involved with some
> sort of council on magic. Seen in the Weirdverse Convergence crossover
> and later issues of Book of Fate.
No, no, that doesn't make sense. You must be mistaken.
(How many people would like Mike Doran to have an online interview with
Keith Giffen just so they could ask the question "What were you
*thinking*?"--about just about anything?)
--
"I married beneath me. All women do."--Nancy, Lady Astor
elmo mor...@physics.rice.edu
http://www.bonner.rice.edu/morrow
DScottDoty
In article <19980213160...@ladder02.news.aol.com>, joha...@aol.com
(JohannaLD) writes:
>You're not going to like it -- she's an evil witch involved with some sort
>of council on magic. Seen in the Weirdverse Convergence crossover and later
>issues of Book of Fate.
Hmm. Does it establish whether the 4-issue is in continuity?
Don't want to start a flamewar with Weirdverse fans, so I'll keep what
I'd like to say to myself.
Dave Doty
Steven Grant
JohannaLD wrote in message
>You're not going to like it -- she's an evil witch involved with some
>sort of council on magic. Seen in the Weirdverse Convergence crossover
>and later issues of Book of Fate.
Don't worry about it.
Steven Grant
DScottDoty wrote in message
>Hmm. Does it establish whether the 4-issue is in continuity?
I don't believe so, no, but we may as well assume it was. (I don't remember
what happened in the mini, so...)
>Don't want to start a flamewar with Weirdverse fans, so I'll keep what
>I'd like to say to myself.
You don't have to do that. Speak freely. As a Weirdoverse writer, I want
to hear your thoughts.
Rick Jones
Steven Grant <sdg...@premier1.net> wrote:
> DScottDoty wrote in message
> >Don't want to start a flamewar with Weirdverse fans, so I'll keep what
> >I'd like to say to myself.
> You don't have to do that. Speak freely. As a Weirdoverse writer, I want
> to hear your thoughts.
I enjoyed the Challengers issue, and, aside from the general
incomprehensible mess it was stuck with, the Scare Tactics issue.
I thought the bit with the magic union turning over the proverbial keys
to a now-evil Amethyst made negative sense. Regular sense was just
sucked out of my brain. But I get that from most of Giffen's work
these days.
After reading it, I learned: some wierd stuff happened, none of which
has been refered to since then (probably for the best).
--
Rick Jones "Ooh, stretchy! Where was I?"
ri...@blkbox.com "You were pretending that seeing scantily-clad girls in
revealing postures was a spiritual experience."
"Who said I was pretending?"
http://www-ece.rice.edu/~rickj/ --Xander & Willow, Buffy The Vampire Slayer
Steven Grant
Rick Jones wrote in message <6c2g9n$kar$2...@news.blkbox.com>...
>I enjoyed the Challengers issue, and, aside from the general
>incomprehensible mess it was stuck with, the Scare Tactics issue.
Thanks very much.
>I thought the bit with the magic union turning over the proverbial keys
>to a now-evil Amethyst made negative sense. Regular sense was just
>sucked out of my brain. But I get that from most of Giffen's work
>these days.
Let me just say that I in no way had anything to do with the Amethyst
business.
Jonathan L. Miller
Ok everybody, I hate to admit it, but I have no clue what the Weirdoverse
is. I never bought Scare Tactics, and apparently haven't bought any issues
that tie in with it. (Sorry Steve!) Would anyone care to explain exactly
*what* DC has done to Amy?!! And whether Mishkin and Cohn (not to mention
Karen Berger, who also had an emotional investment in the character) hurt
anyone for it?
jonathan.
Steven Grant
Carl Fink wrote in message
>Under Mark Evanier's "Krypto-Revisionism", I declare the whole
>Convergence thing never to have happened.
As the father of the term "Krypto-Revisionism" (in Mark's office, if I
recall correctly), I have to say that you can't do that.
>The Weirdoverse has *fans*? I know that SCARE TACTICS and CHALLENGERS
>have fans, but the Weirdoverse as a whole?
Yeah, there were a few...
Carl Fink
On 13 Feb 1998 19:38:56 GMT, DScottDoty <dscot...@aol.com> wrote:
>In article <19980213160...@ladder02.news.aol.com>, joha...@aol.com
>(JohannaLD) writes:
>
>>of council on magic. Seen in the Weirdverse Convergence crossover and later
>>issues of Book of Fate.
Under Mark Evanier's "Krypto-Revisionism", I declare the whole
Convergence thing never to have happened.
>Don't want to start a flamewar with Weirdverse fans, so I'll keep what
>I'd like to say to myself.
The Weirdoverse has *fans*? I know that SCARE TACTICS and CHALLENGERS
have fans, but the Weirdoverse as a whole?
--
Carl Fink ca...@dm.net
"Ready to begin speaking in technobabble, Sir."
Alien technician in "Buck Godot" by Phil Foglio
Steven Grant
Jonathan L. Miller wrote in message ...
First, Dan and Gary wouldn't hurt anyone. Karen would, but she has other
preoccupations these days.
Back in the first issue of FATE I wrote, I introduced a sort of metaphysical
governing body of magic called The Conclave, sort of a UN of magic with a
large general body of sorcerers throughout the cosmos and a rotating roster
composing a sort of Security Council. In BOOK OF FATE, the descendent of
FATE, Keith Giffen had Amethyst, her purposes now turned grandiose,
functionally depose the Conclave and replace it with the Gemlords, under her
dominance, whereupon Topaz opposed her plans and ran to Earth for help, and
Amethyst sent storm troopers to either bring him back or kill him, thus
functionally turning her into a villain.
The situation has not been addressed since, but it will soon, so keep the
faith...
Dwight Williams
"Steven Grant" (sdg...@premier1.net) writes:
> Carl Fink wrote in message
>
>>Under Mark Evanier's "Krypto-Revisionism", I declare the whole
>>Convergence thing never to have happened.
>
> As the father of the term "Krypto-Revisionism" (in Mark's office, if I
> recall correctly), I have to say that you can't do that.
???
>>The Weirdoverse has *fans*? I know that SCARE TACTICS and CHALLENGERS
>>have fans, but the Weirdoverse as a whole?
>
> Yeah, there were a few...
"Were"?!?
--
Dwight Williams(ad...@freenet.carleton.ca) -- Orleans, Ontario, Canada
NoSpam@mikecoffin@monmouth.com
>
>Back in the first issue of FATE I wrote, I introduced a sort of metaphysical
>governing body of magic called The Conclave, sort of a UN of magic with a
>large general body of sorcerers throughout the cosmos and a rotating roster
>composing a sort of Security Council. In BOOK OF FATE, the descendent of
>FATE, Keith Giffen had Amethyst, her purposes now turned grandiose,
>functionally depose the Conclave and replace it with the Gemlords, under her
>dominance, whereupon Topaz opposed her plans and ran to Earth for help, and
>Amethyst sent storm troopers to either bring him back or kill him, thus
>functionally turning her into a villain.
>
>The situation has not been addressed since, but it will soon, so keep the
>faith...
Perhaps this has to do with the war between Order and Chaos. Remember that
Amethyst was a Lord of Order. Maybe she was finally consumed by the power of
Chaos.
This brings to mind a question I've had for awhile. Was DC ever planning a
mjor crossover concerning the Order-Chaos War? I seem to remember alot of the
DC titles circa 1987-1988 began to have ties to the whole Chaos-Order thing.
There was Amethyst, Dr. Fate, a Power Girl mini-series, and Suicide Squad kept
mentioning the coming of the "Kali Yuga". Whatever happened with that?
Adam
DScottDoty
In article <34e4b...@satellite.premier1.net>, "Steven Grant"
<sdg...@premier1.net> writes:
>I don't believe so, no, but we may as well assume it was. (I don't
>remember what happened in the mini, so...)
Well, in the special that wrapped up the ongoing, Amethyst was turned
into a statue while saving the Gemworld.
In the mini, she turned back into an older, more mature human being
to save the Gemworld again from Topaz' evil son Mordru, whom she
buried alive (perhaps *the* LSH villain a thousand years later). She
then stole Emmy's child and whisked her off to Gemworld, IIRC,
before reverting to a statue.
Pretty inconsequential in the scheme of things Amethyst, but it's
pretty vital to the LSH, if it is in continuity. Also, if Emmy's ever
referred to.
>You don't have to do that. Speak freely. As a Weirdoverse writer, I want
>to hear your thoughts.
Well, what I wanted to say at the time would have been pretty counter-
productive.
Many young girls fantasize that they're really adopted, and that their
true parents are royalty, and that they'll be whisked away to a wonder-
ful, fantastic land. Amethyst obviously tied right into that. Even though
my childhood fantasies were strictly "blue-blannket," I think the
appeal of that fantasy still hooked me, and that's why I loved it so much.
Turning her into a villain takes that aspect, which I consider integral,
away. It would be like taking away Superman's secret ID.
I'm not saying she should remain an adolescent forever. After all,
Superman pretty clearly draws on those "blue-blanket" fantasies
I mentioned. However, I'd like to see that concept transformed form
a literal to a metaphorical state, that would allow stories about an
adult woman which can still tap that childhood fantasy.
Now, I haven't read the stories with Amethyst, so I'm not commenting
on the story itself, that's just my reaction to the *idea* of Amy
turning bad. It sounds like you at least tied it into her identity-
in other words, there was a compelling reason to use Amethyst,
rather than an established villain or new character, other than shock
value. So that's a point in your favor.
You've definitely interested me enough to at least check out the issues.
Which issues of which series dealt with her?
Dave Doty
JohannaLD
From: ca...@panix.com (Carl Fink)
>Under Mark Evanier's "Krypto-Revisionism", I declare the whole
>Convergence thing never to have happened.
What's that?
>The Weirdoverse has *fans*? I know that SCARE TACTICS and CHALLENGERS
>have fans, but the Weirdoverse as a whole?
We used to have great fun at the Weirdoverse chats. And I liked the idea
of it, generally.
Johanna
JohannaLD
From: "Steven Grant" <sdg...@premier1.net>
>JohannaLD wrote in message
>>You're not going to like it -- she's an evil witch involved with some
>>sort of council on magic. Seen in the Weirdverse Convergence crossover
>>and later issues of Book of Fate.
>
You know, that's what Mr. Thorsland told me when the storyline was
first announced. Why should I trust you? :)
Johanna
Steven Grant
>Perhaps this has to do with the war between Order and Chaos. Remember that
>Amethyst was a Lord of Order. Maybe she was finally consumed by the power
of
>Chaos.
No.
>This brings to mind a question I've had for awhile. Was DC ever planning a
>mjor crossover concerning the Order-Chaos War? I seem to remember alot of
the
>DC titles circa 1987-1988 began to have ties to the whole Chaos-Order
thing.
>There was Amethyst, Dr. Fate, a Power Girl mini-series, and Suicide Squad
kept
>mentioning the coming of the "Kali Yuga". Whatever happened with that?
And the PHANTOM STRANGER mini-series, and all kinds of other things. The
powers of Order and Chaos were exiled at one point, and that was pretty much
the end of that.
Steven Grant
JohannaLD wrote in message
>>Under Mark Evanier's "Krypto-Revisionism", I declare the whole
>>Convergence thing never to have happened.
>
>What's that?
I was over at Mark's for lunch one day during my Los Angeles years, and we
were discussing the then-rampant trend for writers to come onto a book and
in some story twist suddenly declare part or all of the previous continuity
invalidated. (The "everything you know about _____________ is wrong"
syndrome.) Specifically we were discussing the John Byrne reboot of
Superman. He referred to it as "revisionism," as in historical revisionism,
the reinterpretation of past invents from other than canonical points of
view, and I named it "Krypto-revisionism," as a pun on the concept
"crypto-revisionism."
Steven Grant
DScottDoty wrote in message
>Many young girls fantasize that they're really adopted, and that their
>true parents are royalty, and that they'll be whisked away to a wonder-
>ful, fantastic land. Amethyst obviously tied right into that. Even though
>my childhood fantasies were strictly "blue-blannket," I think the
>appeal of that fantasy still hooked me, and that's why I loved it so much.
>Turning her into a villain takes that aspect, which I consider integral,
>away. It would be like taking away Superman's secret ID.
Don't know why you'd think that was counterproductive. I happen to agree
with you, on all points.
>Now, I haven't read the stories with Amethyst, so I'm not commenting
>on the story itself, that's just my reaction to the *idea* of Amy
>turning bad. It sounds like you at least tied it into her identity-
>in other words, there was a compelling reason to use Amethyst,
>rather than an established villain or new character, other than shock
>value. So that's a point in your favor.
I didn't do anything with it. It wasn't me. I wouldn't have done it.
I interpret it less as Amethyst becoming a villainess, and more as an
apparently grown-up woman attempting to achieve sweeping goals, but with
immature (I mean, in her head, she IS only 13) methods and reasoning. What
would you have done had you gained virtually limitless power at the age of
13?
Which at least makes the situation salvageable.
>You've definitely interested me enough to at least check out the issues.
>Which issues of which series dealt with her?
BOOK OF FATE #6, and maybe a couple afterward.
Steven Grant
JohannaLD wrote in message
>You know, that's what Mr. Thorsland told me when the storyline was
>first announced. Why should I trust you? :)
Because I never lie and I'm always right.
BHMarks
"Steven Grant" <sdg...@premier1.net> said:
>Speak freely. As a Weirdoverse writer, I want
>to hear your thoughts.
Okay.
I really like ideas like Gemworld and the Lords of Order and Chaos. But I like
them primarily as background ideas.
A single Lord of Order, pursuing his own interests, is interesting. (Near-by
example: two Lords, one Order and one Chaos, fall in love, leading to Hawk &
Dove. Sweet!)
But it seems like almost every writer who uses these concepts nowadays feel
that they can't write an interesting story with "BLOWING UP EVERTHING REAL
GOOD!" The Lords of Chaos and Order wage all-out war to the death. The Lords
of Chaos and Order abandon this plane altogether. The Lords of Chaos and Order
commit seppuku.
Sometimes these stories are okay. Often they're not: they sacrifice
story-telling for cosmicization, and, because of the power levels involved,
they tend to have massive plot holes.
*And* they destory the background, making it difficult for subsequent writers
to use it effectively. It's slash-and-burn.
I feel the same way about Gemworld. I quite enjoyed the first AMETHYST series
(despite never having been a teenage girl . . .). But once the story is over,
let it be over for a while! I would rather see some very occasional
interaction between Gemworld and DC Earth than: "in this issue, Amethyst turns
evil and tries to conquer both worlds!" Same-old same-old. It better be a
*great* story to undermine that much.
Of course, movies have the same problem - every adventure flick has to blow up
bigger things and produce more corpses. But I see some evidence that that
trend is slacking off. I'd like to see it in the comics, also.
Steve, were you the one who said "it's one thing to mention a Geen Lantern
Corps with 3600 members, but you don't have to *show* them in every story"? Or
words to that effect.
I like that sentiment.
As ever,
Bennet
Jonathan L. Miller
> Back in the first issue of FATE I wrote, I introduced a sort of metaphysical
> governing body of magic called The Conclave, sort of a UN of magic with a
> large general body of sorcerers throughout the cosmos and a rotating roster
> composing a sort of Security Council. In BOOK OF FATE, the descendent of
> FATE, Keith Giffen had Amethyst, her purposes now turned grandiose,
> functionally depose the Conclave and replace it with the Gemlords, under her
> dominance, whereupon Topaz opposed her plans and ran to Earth for help, and
> Amethyst sent storm troopers to either bring him back or kill him, thus
> functionally turning her into a villain.
>
> The situation has not been addressed since, but it will soon, so keep the
> faith...
*sigh* You know, I just don't understand where Giffen's head has been for
the past, oh, 10 years or so. Fist he kills Karate Kid not once, but
*twice* (the main reason I don't want him to touch post-boot, actually),
then this?! Ok, ok, he's done a lot of pretty ok stuff (some of L.E.
G.I.O.N. spring to mind), but.....
So what do y'all think? Should I track down these issues and wait to see
how it turns out, or should I just live with the mini and the first 13
issues of her regular series (before Giffen, altho I like Mindy Newell's
keen dialogue) and my memories?
jonathan.
Steven Grant
Carl Fink wrote in message
>>As the father of the term "Krypto-Revisionism" (in Mark's office, if I
>>recall correctly), I have to say that you can't do that.
>
>Stop me.
You're already stopped. It doesn't count until it appears in an officially
published story (meaning under the auspices of whatever company or person
owns the character). Rules of the game, man...
Steven Grant
JohannaLD wrote in message
>You forgot "answer questions politely and rapidly", too. Kay. I look
>forward to seeing whatever-it-is.
Dan Thorsland also answers questions politely and rapidly, so I dismissed
those are criteria.
DScottDoty
In article <34e61...@satellite.premier1.net>, "Steven Grant"
<sdg...@premier1.net> writes:
>Don't know why you'd think that was counterproductive. I happen to
>agree with you, on all points.
That's not what I was going to say originally. It would have started more
like, "That's the most ridiculous. . . ." What you got was my mulling it
over for a day. :)
Dave Doty
JohannaLD
From: jlmi...@oz.net (Jonathan L. Miller)
>Should I track down these issues and wait to see
>how it turns out, or should I just live with the mini and the first 13
>issues of her regular series (before Giffen, altho I like Mindy Newell's
>keen dialogue) and my memories?
Go with the second choice. I couldn't figure out the current stuff,
and I read all the relevant issues. Twice.
Johanna
JohannaLD
From: "Steven Grant" <sdg...@premier1.net>
>JohannaLD wrote in message
>>You know, that's what Mr. Thorsland told me when the storyline was
>>first announced. Why should I trust you? :)
>
>Because I never lie and I'm always right.
You forgot "answer questions politely and rapidly", too. Kay. I look
forward to seeing whatever-it-is.
Johanna
Carl Fink
On Fri, 13 Feb 1998 23:52:31 -0800, Steven Grant <sdg...@premier1.net> wrote:
>Carl Fink wrote in message
>
>>Convergence thing never to have happened.
>
>recall correctly), I have to say that you can't do that.
Stop me.
--
Carl Fink ca...@dm.net
Manager, Dueling Modems Computer Forum
<http://dm.net>
Carl Fink
On Sat, 14 Feb 1998 14:48:53 -0800, Steven Grant <sdg...@premier1.net> wrote:
>JohannaLD wrote in message
>
>>>Under Mark Evanier's "Krypto-Revisionism", I declare the whole
>>>Convergence thing never to have happened.
>>
>
>I was over at Mark's for lunch one day during my Los Angeles years, and we
>were discussing the then-rampant trend for writers to come onto a book and
>in some story twist suddenly declare part or all of the previous continuity
>invalidated. (The "everything you know about _____________ is wrong"
>syndrome.) Specifically we were discussing the John Byrne reboot of
>Superman. He referred to it as "revisionism," as in historical revisionism,
>the reinterpretation of past invents from other than canonical points of
>view, and I named it "Krypto-revisionism," as a pun on the concept
>"crypto-revisionism."
Well, no. In a CBG column, Mark defined "Krypto-Revisionism" as a
fan's right to refuse to accept "continuity" that he/she doesn't like.
In Mark's personal DC Universe, Krypto the superdog is still alive.
He just isn't being written into stories any more -- he's off in space
having adventures without Superboy.
Eric Harding
In article <34e61...@satellite.premier1.net>, "Steven Grant" <sdg...@premier1.net> wrote:
>JohannaLD wrote in message
>
>>first announced. Why should I trust you? :)
>
>
>Because I never lie and I'm always right.
>
>
>
Eric
DScottDoty
In article <6c5gmu$11i$3...@carlf.dialup.access.net>, ca...@panix.com (Carl Fink)
writes:
>Well, no. In a CBG column, Mark defined "Krypto-Revisionism" as a fan's
>right to refuse to accept "continuity" that he/she doesn't like.
You mean like Hank and Dawn being alive, well, and happily married to their
respective love interests? :)
Dave Doty
DScottDoty
In article <jlmiller-ya023580...@news.oz.net>, jlmi...@oz.net
(Jonathan L. Miller) writes:
>So what do y'all think? Should I track down these issues and wait to see how
>it turns out, or should I just live with the mini and the first 13 issues of
>her regular series (before Giffen, altho I like Mindy Newell's keen dialogue)
>and my memories?
13? Didn't 12 have that keen cover, and tie a lot of stuff up?
Dave Doty
supe...@brigadoon.com
In article <6c5gmu$11i$3...@carlf.dialup.access.net>,
ca...@dm.net wrote:
>
> On Sat, 14 Feb 1998 14:48:53 -0800, Steven Grant <sdg...@premier1.net>
wrote:
> >JohannaLD wrote in message
> >
> >>>Convergence thing never to have happened.
> >>
> >>What's that?
> >
> >I was over at Mark's for lunch one day during my Los Angeles years, and we
> >were discussing the then-rampant trend for writers to come onto a book and
> >in some story twist suddenly declare part or all of the previous continuity
> >invalidated. (The "everything you know about _____________ is wrong"
> >syndrome.) Specifically we were discussing the John Byrne reboot of
> >Superman. He referred to it as "revisionism," as in historical
revisionism,
> >the reinterpretation of past invents from other than canonical points of
> >view, and I named it "Krypto-revisionism," as a pun on the concept
> >"crypto-revisionism."
>
> fan's right to refuse to accept "continuity" that he/she doesn't like.
> He just isn't being written into stories any more -- he's off in space
> having adventures without Superboy.
> --
> Carl Fink ca...@dm.net
>
> "Ready to begin speaking in technobabble, Sir."
> Alien technician in "Buck Godot" by Phil Foglio
>
Well DC wanted Byrne to revamp SUPERMAN, and now he's better than ever, and
BTW Krypto is still alive- He may get powers too! You can check it out, it's
from Karl Kesel's mouth at
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Oracle/3485/index.html
Superboy is agreat book now too, no knowing of what's to come next! Will he
become Superman> We can only hope, but who knows?
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
Mark Evanier
On Sat, 14 Feb 1998 14:48:53 -0800, "Steven Grant"
>I was over at Mark's for lunch one day during my Los Angeles years, and we
>were discussing the then-rampant trend for writers to come onto a book and
>in some story twist suddenly declare part or all of the previous continuity
>invalidated. (The "everything you know about _____________ is wrong"
>syndrome.) Specifically we were discussing the John Byrne reboot of
>Superman. He referred to it as "revisionism," as in historical revisionism,
>the reinterpretation of past invents from other than canonical points of
>view, and I named it "Krypto-revisionism," as a pun on the concept
>"crypto-revisionism."
ME: I'm sorry, Steven. I've decided that never happened.
---------------------------
Mark Evanier - 363 S. Fairfax Ave., #303 - Los Angeles, CA 90036
Elayne Wechsler-Chaput
: >You know, that's what Mr. Thorsland told me when the storyline was
: >first announced. Why should I trust you? :)
: Because I never lie and I'm always right.
The Firesign Theatre would like their $5 royalty for using that line,
Steven. :)
- Elayne (personal secretary to George Leroy Tirebiter)
--
"The kiss originated when the first male reptile licked the first female
reptile, implying in a subtle, complimentary way that she was as succulent
as the small reptile he had for dinner the night before."
- F. Scott Fitzgerald
Dan McEwen
On 13 Feb 1998 18:26:35 GMT, ra...@falcon.cc.ukans.edu (Ranma Al'Thor)
wrote:
>JohannaLD (joha...@aol.com) wrote:
>: From: jlmi...@oz.net (Jonathan L. Miller)
>
>: >Does anyone know Amy's status in continuity?
>
>: You're not going to like it -- she's an evil witch involved with some
>: sort of council on magic. Seen in the Weirdverse Convergence crossover
>: and later issues of Book of Fate.
>
>So what authors are responsible for this travesty so they can be hunted
>down with an Axe?
>
Why, it's Keith Giffen. Where do I send the axe? :)
Dan McEwen
On Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:26:32 -0800, "Steven Grant"
<sdg...@premier1.net> wrote:
>Rick Jones wrote in message <6c2g9n$kar$2...@news.blkbox.com>...
>>I thought the bit with the magic union turning over the proverbial keys
>>to a now-evil Amethyst made negative sense. Regular sense was just
>>sucked out of my brain. But I get that from most of Giffen's work
>>these days.
>
>Let me just say that I in no way had anything to do with the Amethyst
>business.
>
I had no doubt. After all, your writing is =good=, and doesn't make
me want to drop anything you write.
Now, since you seem to be working on some magic-related project, can't
you play the good guy and help Amethyst become a sweet princess Lord
of Order again?
Dan McEwen
>Back in the first issue of FATE I wrote, I introduced a sort of metaphysical
>governing body of magic called The Conclave, sort of a UN of magic with a
>large general body of sorcerers throughout the cosmos and a rotating roster
>composing a sort of Security Council. In BOOK OF FATE, the descendent of
>FATE, Keith Giffen had Amethyst, her purposes now turned grandiose,
>functionally depose the Conclave and replace it with the Gemlords, under her
>dominance, whereupon Topaz opposed her plans and ran to Earth for help, and
>Amethyst sent storm troopers to either bring him back or kill him, thus
>functionally turning her into a villain.
>
>The situation has not been addressed since, but it will soon, so keep the
>faith...
YES!! Man, I =knew= you weren't going to let me down!
Dan McEwen
On Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:18:19 -0800, "Steven Grant"
<sdg...@premier1.net> wrote:
>DScottDoty wrote in message
>
>>Hmm. Does it establish whether the 4-issue is in continuity?
>
>I don't believe so, no, but we may as well assume it was. (I don't remember
>what happened in the mini, so...)
Um, Amethyst reawoke (she was an amethyst statue) and fought Mordru,
imprisoning him in the ground for a few centuries.
>>Don't want to start a flamewar with Weirdverse fans, so I'll keep what
>>I'd like to say to myself.
>
>You don't have to do that. Speak freely. As a Weirdoverse writer, I want
>to hear your thoughts.
>
My thoughts? OK, here it is. Emmy, rather than Amethyst, lost it
while living on Earth. Just as she took Amy Winston's place on Earth,
so too did she begin to believe she was Amethyst. Emmy used her magic
to make herself look like Amethyst, and joined the Witch's Council (or
whatever it was). This leaves Amethyst pure, and accounts for
Giffen's hideous and unforgiveable attempt at rewriting Amethyst into
an evil character.
Dan McEwen
On 14 Feb 1998 21:14:25 GMT, dscot...@aol.com (DScottDoty) wrote:
>In article <34e4b...@satellite.premier1.net>, "Steven Grant"
><sdg...@premier1.net> writes:
>
>>I don't believe so, no, but we may as well assume it was. (I don't
>>remember what happened in the mini, so...)
>
>Well, in the special that wrapped up the ongoing, Amethyst was turned
>into a statue while saving the Gemworld.
>
>In the mini, she turned back into an older, more mature human being
>to save the Gemworld again from Topaz' evil son Mordru, whom she
>buried alive (perhaps *the* LSH villain a thousand years later). She
>then stole Emmy's child and whisked her off to Gemworld, IIRC,
>before reverting to a statue.
I thought the opposite happened. Didn't Amethyst present Emmy (now on
Earth as an adult) with a child of her own? As I remember, this child
was named (duh!) after a gem. The child had no parents. The
implication was that Amethyst had created the girl out of the Gemworld
and gave her to Emmy to raise.
>Pretty inconsequential in the scheme of things Amethyst, but it's
>pretty vital to the LSH, if it is in continuity. Also, if Emmy's ever
>referred to.
I would like to see Emmy referred to. She should be a sorceress on
Earth, or perhaps linked to the plant elementals.
Dan McEwen
On 15 Feb 1998 09:02:54 GMT, dscot...@aol.com (DScottDoty) wrote:
>In article <6c5gmu$11i$3...@carlf.dialup.access.net>, ca...@panix.com (Carl Fink)
>writes:
>
>>Well, no. In a CBG column, Mark defined "Krypto-Revisionism" as a fan's
>>right to refuse to accept "continuity" that he/she doesn't like.
>
>You mean like Hank and Dawn being alive, well, and happily married to their
>respective love interests? :)
>
Yup. And Monarch =was= just a bad dream, right?
Steven Grant
Mark Evanier wrote in message
>ME: I'm sorry, Steven. I've decided that never happened.
I decided it did, so there. And don't forget, I know where you live.
mike jozic
Dan McEwen wrote:
>
> On Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:26:32 -0800, "Steven Grant"
> >
> >business.
> >
> I had no doubt. After all, your writing is =good=, and doesn't make
> me want to drop anything you write.
>
> Now, since you seem to be working on some magic-related project, can't
> you play the good guy and help Amethyst become a sweet princess Lord
> of Order again?
Sorry to just jump in here, but you seem to be forgetting who made
Amethyst into a Lord Of Order in the first place.
Having her appear as an evil witch was a surprise to me as well, but
bear in mind that the "new" Amethyst was only around for a few months.
We never really learned the reasons behind her transformation (at least
not in the pages of BOOK OF FATE we didn't...please correct me if I'm
wrong and there's some backstory I'm missing) or where the storyline was
heading.
TTFN!!!
mike jozic, MEANWHILE... The Web's Snappiest 'Zine On Comics & More!
http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/4380
Dan McEwen
On Fri, 20 Feb 1998 02:57:08 -0600, mike jozic <jo...@quadrant.net>
wrote:
>Dan McEwen wrote:
>>
>> On Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:26:32 -0800, "Steven Grant"
>> >
>> >Let me just say that I in no way had anything to do with the Amethyst
>> >business.
>> >
>> I had no doubt. After all, your writing is =good=, and doesn't make
>> me want to drop anything you write.
>>
>> Now, since you seem to be working on some magic-related project, can't
>> you play the good guy and help Amethyst become a sweet princess Lord
>> of Order again?
>
>Sorry to just jump in here, but you seem to be forgetting who made
>Amethyst into a Lord Of Order in the first place.
Keith Giffen wrote the Amethyst ongoing? That's news to me.
>Having her appear as an evil witch was a surprise to me as well, but
>bear in mind that the "new" Amethyst was only around for a few months.
>We never really learned the reasons behind her transformation (at least
>not in the pages of BOOK OF FATE we didn't...please correct me if I'm
>wrong and there's some backstory I'm missing) or where the storyline was
>heading.
Never read it. BoF couldn't hold my interest past three issues. All
my info comes from this newsgroup.
The Great and Powerful Danny Sichel
DScottDoty wrote:
>>Well, no. In a CBG column, Mark defined "Krypto-Revisionism" as a fan's
>>right to refuse to accept "continuity" that he/she doesn't like.
> You mean like Hank and Dawn being alive, well, and happily married to their
> respective love interests? :)
I'm working on it. Trust me.
The Great and Powerful Danny Sichel
Dan McEwen wrote:
> >>Well, no. In a CBG column, Mark defined "Krypto-Revisionism" as a fan's
> >>right to refuse to accept "continuity" that he/she doesn't like.
> >You mean like Hank and Dawn being alive, well, and happily married to their
> >respective love interests? :)
> Yup. And Monarch =was= just a bad dream, right?
HELL, no.
One of the main _points_ of my story (still in the proposal stage) is
that Monarch was a real, definite threat. A being of sheer perfidy and
evil. Far more dangerous than portrayed in the Armageddon stories, in
fact.
It just wasn't Hank.
Of course, it sure _looked_ like Hank. But that was for a very good
reason.
DScottDoty
In article <6cl9lm$d...@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net>, fe...@lsh.org (Dan McEwen)
writes:
>Keith Giffen wrote the Amethyst ongoing? That's news to me.
He wrote the last batch of issues, including the "Lord of Order" issues
(the LoO bit wasn't added until the tail end of the series, recall. I thought
"sweet lord of order" was an oxymoron, since that was when the concept
derailed.)
Dave Doty