Geisha in a tea cup
oo...@msu.oscs.montana.edu
Okay, so I ran across one...the handpainted, dragon-design tea cup and saucer,
the one where you hold it up to the light and there's a geisha in the bottom
of the cup. I think it's one of the neatest things I've ever seen, one of
those oh-my-gosh-I-have-to-have-this-where's-my-checkbook. :)
Anyway, could someone fill me in on a little background? I remember someone
discussing these a while ago, but I didn't pay much attention because I never
expected to see one. Go ahead, tell me it's a cheap souvenir from the
1980s, it won't hurt. Much. :)
Jus' wondering,
Cheryl oo...@trex.oscs.montana.edu
Sally Stearns
I'm interested also, my mother-in-law has a full teaset with the Geisha
cups and the teapot is a dragon's body with the tail being the handle and
the neck and head for the spout. I beleive she has luncheon plates that
match it (service is for 6). The set facinates me. I know the set has
been in the family but I don't know its history (*I should ask!!*).
Sally(I need a bigger china cabinet)
ste...@pixel.kodak.com
mo...@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Hi, Cheryl...
You need to look up a category called "lithophanes," which usually
discusses these in terms of European ceramics, but there is mention
of the Japanese ware, too. It often appears on what is called
Japanese "Geisha Ware" (features pictures of Geisha in more than
65 known patterns showing scenes of everyday life) and "Dragon Ware"
(a form of moriage ware featuring drag-painted slip decoration of
an undulating dragon, often on a gray background). There is also
a "Lithophane Collectors Club you could contact at P. O. Box 4557,
Toledo, OH 43620.
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Gail A. Lewis
Dragonware a few years ago, and much of it has lithopane geishas in
the bottom of teacups and saki cups. As far as I know, these are
always Japanese and none are recent.
Most are women's heads, but I have found two representations of nude
geishas, which are my favorite because they are the only two I've ever
seen. I'd heard about them, and watched for them and am grateful to
have these two. They are in grey dragonware teacups, as are most of
the other geishas. Grey is the most common color, although just about
everything else is represented.
The lithopane's are apparently molded into the bottom of the cup, but
making the molds must have taken great care to get the various depths
to create the detail required to produce the face which reflects
through the porcelain. I've seen many different "cameos" in the
bottom of these cups and quality varies ...
Speaking of detail. Have you looked closely at the dragons? Their
quality varies to even greater degrees, but the ones that are
carefully done are really remarkable! I have some Nippon Dragonware
that has the tiniest stokes of clay, and such detail ... beautiful!
This application is called moriage (more ee ah gee). It is
slip-trailed clay, done the way cake decorating is done today.
The dragons all have a pearl clasped in a claw, because they are
pursuing the pearl of great wisdom ... This concept was borrowed
by the Japanese from the Chinese, according to my sources. The
oldest pieces are the best done (Nippon - pre WWI) ... 1950's pieces
were produced as souvenirs and their quality reflects it.
I've loved it ever since I was a child gazing at my mother's orange
vase which her older sister had received as a high school graduation
gift in the 1920's. Sadly, she died shortly thereafter and my
mother got the vase. I've been collecting Dragonware for a few
years now and am overflowing a very large curio cabinet! :-)
Thanks,
Gail
Gail A. Lewis
Sorry ... it's late in the afternoon and I'm tired ... it's actually
spelled LITHOPHANE.
Thanks,
Gail
Mike Young
>always Japanese and none are recent.
My wife and I collect Blue Willow and a few months ago we were in a
shop where they obviously had higher quality glassware. After a rather
lengthy discussion of antique dealer treachery we purchased a geisha cup
in the Blue Willow design. The dealer told us it was a reproduction as
the $18.00 was no harm done. It was unusual and we wanted it. We
followed up on it and went to the local dealer who openly deals in
antique reproductions and found the wholesale price to be $6.00. We
have since seen these cups all over town and not one of them is marked
reproduction or new. I don't know how I feel about that because I go to
the same shops and get the really old willow for the prices of the new
also. I can't tell you how many times we have gone into the so called
antique dealers shops and seen them selling the "Churchill" pattern
mixed in with all of the other manufacturers and the newest still made
today stuff was priced highest. That's how were bought a W. S. And E,
150 year old plate in near mint condition for $10.00. She wanted $15.00
for the plate they sell in grocery stores today for $5.00 and they throw
in the cup and saucer.
Mike Young
mike....@macaw.cld9.com
---
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Gail A. Lewis
Dragonware is unlikely to become a candidate ... indicating that
lithophane geishas in Dragonware are going to be at least 40 plus
years old, and probably much older.
It seems unlikely to me that anything reproduced with the moriage
effect of applying clay would be cost effective, and I cannot
imagine how they could acquire that detail through any other method
of reproduction. Items like blue willow, however, are easier to
reproduce and are popular. Although Dragonware seems to be picking
up in popularity lately, I hope that its intricacy will eliminate
it from being reproduced. It amazes me that it was ever created
in the first place.
Early artisans of Nippon were very proud of their craft and took
great pains to produce "perfect" pieces of art. Later -- especially
after WWII -- pieces sent off to the U.S. for souvenir stands were
quickly and carelessly made. I have wondered whether they still
maintained one artist per piece, or if they ever set up assembly
lines where different people applied different portions of the
dragons...some of them can be very sloppy looking, while earlier
ones are (as I've said) remarkable!
Even with an assembly line, I doubt anyone would want to reproduce
Dragonware at its current price range ... it wouldn't be cost
effective -- thank goodness! Then again, a beautifully crafted,
new moriage piece of Dragonware might we well worth having! :-)
Thanks,
Gail
.
mo...@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Concerning "lithophanes," most guides and listings usually
discuss these in terms of European ceramics which date from the
1700s, but there is mention of the Japanese ware, too. It often
of Geisha in more than 65 known patterns showing scenes of everyday
Ben
Just a note of clarification on the issue of quality--pre-WWII vs. sloppy post-WW
II Dragonware:
Often times the difference in quality in moriage dragonware came not
from the period --although this is significant-- but from the maker.
Morimura Bros. were perhaps the best known and highest quality producers
of moriage, and their innovations in design were often copied by other
japanese Nippon-era china producers. Morimura pieces are often
impeccibly and meticulously executed...hence pieces produced by them
always fetch higher prices than the wares of their imitators. This is
not to say that if the dragonware piece was not made by morimura that it
is without value. Ofcourse there were others who made good-quality
dragonware. Truthfully, there are few examples of Morimura dragon
ware out there; most dragonware was produced by other makers, many of
whom did make quality pieces --but for every truly excellent piece
there are many more low quality ones.
Is there anyone else outthere buying/selling collecting Morimura Bros.
Nippon?
Linsey
Charleen Bunjiovianna
>
>Often times the difference in quality in moriage dragonware came not
>from the period --although this is significant-- but from the maker.
>Morimura Bros. were perhaps the best known and highest quality producers
>of moriage, and their innovations in design were often copied by other
>japanese Nippon-era china producers.
Are you talking about the Noritake Morimura brothers, who are the reason
why early Noritake marks often are an "M" inside a wreath?
Charleen
Ben
Yes... the Morimura Bros. who did indeed manufacture Noritake as well as
the earlier m-in-wreath mark (1916?-1921) and the 'hand painted'
mapleleaf mark. In 1921 they began to mass produce under the Noritake
name.
My favorite pieces were produced in the window between 1916-1921.
Linsey