What do Rivendell Riders use for head coverings for riding in the sun?

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lungimsam

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Mar 21, 2015, 1:12:55 AM3/21/15
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What's good at blocking sunlight, while at the same time not getting overheated from too thick a material for a covering?

Helmets are vented and I get burned. What do you find that works? I notice some of you do all day riding so I figured you would have good ideas.

I'm talking 80-105F and in direct sunlight. What works?
cockpit1.JPG

Jim Bronson

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Mar 21, 2015, 2:46:54 AM3/21/15
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I use Pearl Izumi sun sleeves if the humidity is not too high, they work great.

However, if it's really humid and 90+, they're worse than useless,
better just to go with bare arms/legs and an extra helping of
sunscreen.

Or are you talking about only your head? I don't know, I have tons of
hair and don't get burnt on top.
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Deacon Patrick

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Mar 21, 2015, 7:10:33 AM3/21/15
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I don't wear a helmet. I love getting an hour or two of peak sun exposure for Vitamin D and other intangibles that only get produced by our skin via sun exposure when the sun is higher than 45˚. Outside that, I wear either a Tilley hat (medium brim, I prefer their cotton one, but mine is too small as the cotton runs smaller than the other ones) or a cotton biking hat (with a bandana tucked under if full coverage is desired), which would work under your helmet. My daughters and wife wear a cotton bonnet (think Laura Ingalls Wilder. 

You didn't ask, but for a shirt, I've found Grant's approach of a thin cotton work shirt is fantastic. Just be sure the arms are long enough to cover wrists when in your forward most position.

It sure feels good to start getting sun exposure questions again! Snow must be melting. Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick 

Tim

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Mar 21, 2015, 7:59:50 AM3/21/15
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I'm with Patrick. I mostly don't wear a helmet except when required by brevets. And I'm bald. So I slowly get my head used to the sun each spring by wearing a cotton cycling cap, then taking it off and putting it in the handlebar bag or jersey pocket to get 15, then 30 then 45 minutes, until I can get 2-3 hours or more without burning (because a sunburned noggin is miserable!) I sweat so much that after a short time I have to wear the cap backwards because sweat runs down the bill and funnels right onto my sunglasses. It snowed in CT yesterday and my 200km brevet in DC today was rescheduled. I can't wait to worry about sun again!

Matthew J

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Mar 21, 2015, 8:01:34 AM3/21/15
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If I'm not wearing a helmet I wear an older version of this from Tilley: http://www.tilley.com/us_en/men/hats/warm-weather/ltm6is-insect-shieldr.html

If I'm wearing a helmet I wear this: http://www.solararmourinc.com/neckvizor.cfm

I have thick hair atop my head and have never been burned through my helmet.  

Garth

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Mar 21, 2015, 8:42:50 AM3/21/15
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 If I do wear a hat, mostly to keep the sun out of eyes, it's a Headsweats Cycle cap .  It's not cheapie generic cycle cap either, the bill is a little longer and flexible . The high quality fabric is great for warm weather, Coolmax .  I too find most headwear too warm , but these caps I can wear in any temp and I don't notice it at all.  In really hot conditions I keep it wet and the natural evaporative cooling is wonderful :)  Better than a bare head .

Edwin W

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Mar 21, 2015, 8:51:13 AM3/21/15
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If I think the road or ride is dangerous I wear a cotton cycling cap under my helmet and just sweat a lot. The evaporation makes it tolerable.
When riding around town I wear a panama style hat from my local hardware store. Good shade and keeps me cool.

Gonna start heating up here in Nashville.
Edwin

Pondero

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Mar 21, 2015, 9:05:24 AM3/21/15
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I ride a great deal in wide open ranch land through long Texas summers. Last year I switched to what the ranchers wear...a well-ventilated straw cowboy hat. I choose a not-too-snug fit and added a stampede string to keep the thing on during faster downhill runs and gusty days. The advantages are light weight, well ventilated, and lots wide-brim shade. The biggest drawback (but no big deal for me) is the occasional wind-on-brim leverage to your head. It has been the best solution for me yet...and it it just about time start using it again.

Chris Johnson
Sanger, Texas

Pondero

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Mar 21, 2015, 9:12:44 AM3/21/15
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Bringing my shade with me...

http://instagram.com/p/sauukJnPxU/

Chris Johnson
Sanger, Texas

Cyclofiend Jim

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Mar 21, 2015, 10:24:41 AM3/21/15
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I ended up with a Solar Sombrero from Simms Fishing.  Nice, light, rollable. Easy to tuck into the bag. Ended up with a couple of their sunblocking arm covers as well.  And I have a bunch of the sunblocking Buff headwear neck gaiters (both in merino wool for winter and their superlight UV material for summer). 

But, the Sombrero's floppy brim is pretty intolerable for riding.  If I look down, it flips down in front.  As much as I enjoy the zen of cycling, I do not want to ride while under a fabric analog of Luke Skywalker training helmet...

I have a whole series of cycling caps (I mean, it _is_ what they were designed for after all.)   I have tucked the Buff under my helmet and let it flap like a doo-rag tail, but find I can stay pretty comfy with it loose on my neck.  

 Spent most of last year helping my mom go through a succession of surgeries to replace her nose for recurring skin cancer, so I figure I'm going to err on the side of serious sunscreen and fabric layers. 


Madam Xylene

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Mar 21, 2015, 10:36:10 AM3/21/15
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I'm fair skinned and use a Buff over my hair, ears and back of my neck to prevent sunburn but don't ride in hot and humid weather. Most I ever did was 107 miles in 107 heat and quit. Cheers Eileen

Liesl

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Mar 21, 2015, 10:42:56 AM3/21/15
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I have an inordinate fondness of hats and have tried lots and lots of types while bicycling.  Here are some fav's:

+2 on tilly brimmed hats; cotton, oilcloth, or wool.  Both Erin and I love them. The curve of the brim from back to front is good with wind and can be coupled with the chin strap on the cotton and oilskin models.  the aussie style snap-up sides can be helpful.  Also, slip a business card and a couple bills in the crown pocket. MAKE SURE you try it on first; the tilly sizing is sometimes whacky and they tend to run small.

+1 on panama but be sure that it fits well.  best with a leather sweatband. Can blow off in strong wind/downhill.  Hold on.

others with brims/bills:
*bowlers are surprisingly good for cooler riding.  Harder to find; if you find a good one with a leather sweatband that fits. snap it up.  Plus they are totally dapper.
*Gorin caps, if you find a model you like, have worked well for both Erin and me—but they discontinue styles so quickly that if you like it, get it.
*Stormy Kromers are really quite good and now come in lots of fabrics and colors.  Has ear protection that can be deployed.
*radar o'reilly style knit caps are great for colder weather and can drop over your ears
*and the many bike-specific caps of course

haberdasheringly yours,
RCW

hangtownmatt

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Mar 21, 2015, 11:24:36 AM3/21/15
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Here's what I use:

http://www.treadley.com.au/
 
This little cottage industry was developed by a concerned mother in Australia.  They can look a bit goofy but work fantastic.  If I remember correctly she had a big sale right around Easter last year.

Matt

WETH

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Mar 21, 2015, 1:47:47 PM3/21/15
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Cycling cap under helmet and sunscreen on my fave and neck.
Jim, sorry to hear about your mom's surgeries. I lost my mother to melanoma; hers developed on her scalp.
So to all, wear sunscreen and protect your scalp, whether you are balding or not! Skin cancer kills!

Fullylugged

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Mar 22, 2015, 6:52:02 AM3/22/15
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Thin wool caps. Wool keeps you cool when it's hot and warm when it's cool. (and when it's wet, like in rain)  Like this one:

Chris in Redding, Ca.

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Mar 22, 2015, 10:01:48 AM3/22/15
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Some where out there is a company that makes a sombrero like thing that goes under a helmet. I know folks with them and they like them. Sorry I can't remember the name but maybe someone here will.
Chris

Joe Hogg

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Mar 22, 2015, 11:35:51 AM3/22/15
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On 03/22/2015 07:01 AM, Chris in Redding, Ca. wrote:
Some where out there is a company that makes a sombrero like thing that goes under a helmet. I know folks with them and they like them. Sorry I can't remember the name but maybe someone here will.
Chris

John

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Mar 22, 2015, 1:00:15 PM3/22/15
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Chris, 

    What make is your Stetson?

thanks,

John

Deacon Patrick

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Mar 22, 2015, 2:04:47 PM3/22/15
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Isn't that like asking what make my Rivendell is? Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

Patrick Moore

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Mar 22, 2015, 4:15:34 PM3/22/15
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Hair!

Patrick "ain't got no money, but I got hair!" Moore

Pondero

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Mar 22, 2015, 5:33:44 PM3/22/15
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John,

My straw hat is made by Resistol.

Chris Johnson
Sanger, Texas

John

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Mar 23, 2015, 2:13:07 PM3/23/15
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Thanks Chris, much appreciated.

Love your photos. They make me want to take a trip out to see the in-laws, though they're a bit south of you, down near Corpus Christi.

Happy Trails!

John

Eunice Chang

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Mar 26, 2015, 12:20:11 PM3/26/15
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I agree with the cycling/baseball cap endorsements. Also, wanted to give a shout out to button down shirts or anything with collars- because if you raise the collars, they can protect back of your neck. Or you can use a wet bandanna- it will cool your neck/head.

-E.

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Montclair BobbyB

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Mar 30, 2015, 3:53:04 PM3/30/15
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I shave my head every day, and have fair skin... No naked dome for me... If riding without a helmet, I'll typically wear a baseball cap with suncreen on my neck and ears.  Otherwise I wear a Doo rag or bandana under my helmet and/or LOTS of sunscreen and my helmet.

In transitional weather (Sping and Fall), WOOL baby, WOOL... It's the BEST.

BB
.

Steve Palincsar

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Mar 30, 2015, 4:16:10 PM3/30/15
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but one thing for sure: if I went around constantly telling the world
how f*cked up my brain was due to repeated head traumas I'd damn sure be
wearing that helmet, no matter what I wore or didn't wear under it.

Deacon Patrick

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Mar 30, 2015, 4:30:39 PM3/30/15
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Och, Steve! If you needed help following my reasoning all you had to do was ask. It can be challenging keeping up with the brain bludgeoned. Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

Bill Lindsay

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Mar 30, 2015, 4:54:46 PM3/30/15
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Deacon Patrick may have received a few blows to the head, but he expertly ducked Steve's punch!  Bravo.  

Montclair BobbyB

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Mar 30, 2015, 5:11:31 PM3/30/15
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Hah!! Snark-o-meter in the RED!!

Patrick, a poke from Steve is kinda like a badge of honor, only different. (Sardonic grin).

Peace, amigo.
BB

Bill Lindsay

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Mar 30, 2015, 5:33:01 PM3/30/15
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Badge of Honor!  Genius. 

You know the Bruce Gordon story?  Bruce Gordon has kind of a pretty widely held rep as a sourpuss.  One year, Bruce showed an excellent sense of humor at his own expense by handing out "Bruce Gordon was rude to me" pins.  He has a limited edition version for the exceptions that read "Bruce Gordon was nice to me".  Lovely Bicycle blog has a nice story about a typical exchange with Bruce (who I happen to like a lot).  

We should make "Steve P snarked at me"  pins for people to pin on their Saddlesacks, right next to the "UnRacer", "Early Adopter", "Just Ride" and "ACW" pins.  

Edwin W

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Mar 30, 2015, 6:42:21 PM3/30/15
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That response put the "Deacon" in Deacon Patrick.

Steve Palincsar

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Mar 31, 2015, 8:10:39 AM3/31/15
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On 03/30/2015 04:54 PM, Bill Lindsay wrote:
Deacon Patrick may have received a few blows to the head, but he expertly ducked Steve's punch!  Bravo.  

On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 1:30:39 PM UTC-7, Deacon Patrick wrote:
Och, Steve! If you needed help following my reasoning all you had to do was ask. It can be challenging keeping up with the brain bludgeoned. Grin.

Ducked?   Ha!  Morelike, demonstrated the truth of what I said.

We now know head trauma is cumulative.  It's one thing with a pristine, undamaged brain; it's quite another to add further injury.   How far is it from "bludgeoned brain" to "vegetative state"?



Deacon Patrick

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Mar 31, 2015, 9:19:45 AM3/31/15
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Dear Steve,

I am sorry something happened to you and/or those you love that causes you great anger toward me because I do not wear a helmet. Should you ever email me directly, either in the group or privately, I am happy to explain why I ride without a helmet, but that, I suspect, is not the real issue here. I wish pray you experience the peace of Christ's healing balm and that God may startle you with joy.

With abandon,
Patrick

DMG

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Mar 31, 2015, 11:00:26 AM3/31/15
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Did it get a little passive-aggressive in here, or is it just me?

Liesl

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Mar 31, 2015, 11:32:38 AM3/31/15
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Ever the high road.  Thank you Deacon Patrick. 
-RCW

Jim Bronson

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Mar 31, 2015, 1:20:54 PM3/31/15
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We also know crabon fiber bikes are lighter than steel ones.  So what does it prove, exactly?

If riding without a helmet is his joy, then let him have it.  There's only so much changing of hearts and minds you're going to do on an email list.

I take a risk riding my bike also, for a different health related reason I'm not going to get into here, but it would leave my life so much more empty if I could not ride, that it's worth it to me to take the risk.

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Keep the metal side up and the rubber side down!

John

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Mar 31, 2015, 1:54:28 PM3/31/15
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This is getting away from the sun hat topic, and I also hate wearing a helmet, but at least Steve cares enough about all of us to call us ninnies for not wearing one.

If he didn't care about us, he would keep quiet.

My wife is a psychologist who has treated a large number of people suffering from head trauma and the permanent damage to their cognitive abilities and personalities.

She has also treated emergency room professionals traumatized by what they have seen & treated. So you can guess where she comes down on the helmet issue, and whether I have to wear one.

BACK ON TOPIC:  I also like the Grant solution of long sleeve cotton shirts, but I have yet to find as cool a hat as Chris's cowboy hat.

After about 15 straight months of record breaking temps, I could wear one of those year round here in Berkeley, if only my wife would let me. :(

John (Dreaming of a steel steeds & straw Stetsons) Phillips

Anne Paulson

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Mar 31, 2015, 2:22:53 PM3/31/15
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Are Treadley helmet hats available in the US, or do I have to send to Australia?
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It isn't a contest. Enjoy the ride.

René Sterental

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Mar 31, 2015, 2:25:58 PM3/31/15
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Not to perpetuate any discussion on the helmet topic, my position on the issue is that if I'm going to wear one (and I do), I want to make it as bold and awesome as my bikes are. Therefore, I just replaced my aging Specialized helmet with a new POC Octal MIPS bright orange helmet that cost a fortune for a helmet, but gives my wife peace of mind: http://news.pocsports.com/2014/08/21/poc-unveils-the-octal-avip-mips-and-eye-park/

Since its vents are so large (and it feels awesome when riding with it), I'm going to explore some of the great suggestions that have been shared in this thread to ride with warm temperatures and additional sun protection as we're getting summer temperatures here in the SF Bay Area now. When it's colder, I just wear and love the Icebreaker Chase Beanies: http://www.icebreaker.com/en/web-specials/chase-beanie/100746_WS.html?dwvar_100746__WS_color=302&cts=110%7C501%7CD87%7C302%7C401

René 

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Steve Palincsar

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Mar 31, 2015, 3:16:10 PM3/31/15
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On 03/31/2015 09:19 AM, Deacon Patrick wrote:
> Dear Steve,
>
> I am sorry something happened to you and/or those you love that causes
> you great anger toward me because I do not wear a helmet. Should you
> ever email me directly, either in the group or privately, I am happy
> to explain why I ride without a helmet, but that, I suspect, is not
> the real issue here. I wish pray you experience the peace of Christ's
> healing balm and that God may startle you with joy.

Do what you like. I said what *I* would do. I would not do what you
do, for the reason I stated. I'm not angry, I just think you are being
very foolish (or, as they say in the vernacular, "being an idiot").

It is now well known head trauma is cumulative, and you have on numerous
occasions made it very well known around here that you are already
suffering the effects of multiple head traumas. You may be willing to
risk more; as I said, if it were me, I would not.

As for the rest of you, by all means wear or don't wear whatever you
like. I truly do not care, and was not speaking about you.


Bill Lindsay

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Mar 31, 2015, 3:59:11 PM3/31/15
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Deacon, if you want Steve to be friendly and tolerant in his expression of his opinions, I guess you'll have to re-engage with him over on i-Bob, the Group he moderates.  "i-Bobs are expected to be friendly and tolerant", or so the i-Bob rules state.....

Montclair BobbyB

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Mar 31, 2015, 10:26:27 PM3/31/15
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It is now well known grouchiness is cumulative, and you have on numerous 
occasions made it very well known around here that you are already 
suffering the effects of multiple outbursts.   You may be willing to 
risk more; if it were me, I would not. 

Fear not, Steve... I have the perfect helmet for YOU, my friend...

In all sincerity, Peace to you, Steve.

And God bless you, Deacon Patrick.

Bobby

hangtownmatt

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Mar 31, 2015, 11:07:19 PM3/31/15
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I'm 89.999% sure these are only available from Australia.  But it really is a non-issue nowadays.  She's responsive to e-mail if you have any questions and shipping was fast and cheap for me; On my 2nd purchase I bought four "on sale" and shipping was free.  For the past couple years I've been using the Tourer model. Starting tomorrow I'm going to try the Explorer in preparation for a hilly metric century I'm doing this weekend (Party ay Pardee).  The Explorer has a bit more coverage and straps that attach to your helmet straps to keep the Legionnaires flap from lifting in the breeze.  The full size baseball hat brim on all models is out of this world for sheilding your eyes and the front of your face from the sun and is a great platform for my particular rear view mirror.

Give it a try.   I do not think you can go wrong.  The only issue is it does look kinda goofy.  But wearing it you can't tell so that's the other peoples problem. I will say it definitely protects you from the sun, definitely keeps you cooler, and does not interfere with the impact protectiion of the helmet.

Matt

hangtownmatt

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Apr 1, 2015, 12:14:40 AM4/1/15
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Personally,  I do not see how anyone can disagree with Steve.   Maybe his delivery is harsh but the message true.  Bangs on the head are cumulative and the long term results have been proven.  If I had a bludgeoned brain I would be taking measures to protect it.  I'm not saying helmets are perfect or the only answer, but if you need further proof just look at what's going on in the NFL.   As inferior as helmets may be, I do not see anyone choosing to play in the NFL without a helmet   I do not like wearing helmets either, and for me, someone who doesn't have a post-bludgeoned brain, I probably stand a better chance of getting melanoma than a brain trauma riding a bike.  That's why I wear a Treadley helmet hat!  It allows me to continue to wear a helmet to help protect me from potential brain trauma and also helps protect me from the sun ...without all the chemicals in suntan lotion..  But hey ... if I ate Deacon's recommended Paleo diet (or whatever variance it may be) I wouldn't have to worry about melanoma or getting run over by a car because that diet alone would kill me first.

Deacon,  I mean no harm to you personally.   But you put this stuff out there, and you are free to speak and do as you wish, but we are also entitled to our opinions based on our own personal knowledge and experience.  I don't think Christ's healing balm has anything to do with Steve opinion, or mine for that matter. 

Your brother in Christ,

Matt




On Tuesday, March 31, 2015 at 12:16:10 PM UTC-7, Steve Palincsar wrote:

Deacon Patrick

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Apr 1, 2015, 10:04:11 AM4/1/15
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Och! Tell  me this is an elaborately planned, well ramped up, April Fool's joke!

This is utterly fascinating and quizzically amusing and stunningly illustrative of people who seem remarkably large in number and include the highly educated, doctors, and nurses, and more, so as to perhaps be a trait other than one institutional learning can alleviate, who choose slightly informed, highly illogical ignorance over easily informed, reasoned understanding through inquiry and listening. My apologies to those following this thread for the off-topic nature of this rabbit hole, which my choice to respond only seems to promote rather than resolve. I had hoped mocking and pointing out stupidity would serve to at lease dissuade further stupidity rather than doubling down. Because of the ignorance and arrogance of these responses from Steve and now Matt on this group, I will take more license than I usually would, for it reveals one of the challenges people with brain injury encounter often in finding stunning anger and ignorance from many people, including their own doctors who are supposedly experts in brain injury.

Dear Matt,

Why are you choosing to remain in ignorance?

Your first sentence indicates you are in a position of ignorance, and you know it. "I do not see how anyone can disagree with Steve." It is a stunning shame there is no resource to which you could turn to inform your ignorance of why I choose what I choose. Yet there you stand. Firm in your believe that though I clearly have arrived at a conclusion different than you can see any possibility of, you choose to remain ignorant rather than inquire as to whether there are perhaps things of which you are as yet unaware. Do you realize you just gave a diatribe justifying your non-inquiry? You exude a stunning amount of effort to support this intellectual inertia, citing a singular fact as if it is Highly Informative to me-the-ignorant-one, that brain injuries are cumulative. Were you aware that I've had 8+ concussions since I was 12? Even a slight modicum of logic on your part would indicate that perhaps I am aware of the cumulative nature of concussions, and that, perhaps, there is more to the story, more that explains the apparent contradictions. (By the way, such surface-level contradictions are common with brain injury and most all chronic health issues. I have constant vertigo and can't take two steps in most shoes without needs days or weeks to recover, but I run and bike mountain trails. Unless one understands proprioception via going barefoot, this makes no sense.)

Were one to apply logic, from your position, combined with a presumption of goodness that at the very least I clearly have reasons, whether good or not, for doing what I do, the following thread-of-though might occur:

I, Matt, stand on the outside of brain injury, looking at the outside choices of someone with brain injury. His choice directly contradicts everything that I know to be true about common sense and self-preservation. Thus, either I have superior common sense and capacity and need to help this person see how stupid he is being, or there are things below the surface I do not yet see that make the apparent contradictions make sense and at the very least more of a judgement call than I realize. What possible means at my disposal is there to help shed light on which of these two possibilities contains the truth? Is there anyone I could ask to learn why this poor and utter fool chooses not to wear a helmet when riding a bicycle.

Should you find a way to inform your ignorance, please let me know. I'm here to help, if I may.

"I don't think Christ's healing balm has anything to do with Steve opinion, or mine for that matter."
I am sorry your Christ is so small! If you believe Christ is fully divine and fully human and thus not only the savior of humanity but also the height of humanity to which we should all aspire (we are like Christ in all ways but sin), would not Christ have something to say on every aspect of human experience, including one as seemingly piffling as this? Every choice we make impacts our eternal body and soul, either bringing us closer toward Christ or taking further away. No choice, therefore, is trivial. Perhaps your understanding of Christ is too small? Perhaps you can look for a way to choose the Best Good Christ reveals in every choice you make today? What a perfect week, this Holy Week, to discover who He is and how much bigger he is, and thus how much bigger he calls each of us to become. The truth is that wherever any of us fall short of our human potential, we sin. I fall short of my fullest human potential and turn to His healing balm to help me become more fully who He created me to be, and I pray that same peace and healing balm for everyone, including you and Steve.

May God startle you with joy!

With abandon,
Patrick

Bruce Herbitter

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Apr 1, 2015, 10:53:31 AM4/1/15
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Time for this thread to die 

Sent from my iPhone
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Allingham II, Thomas J

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Apr 1, 2015, 10:53:53 AM4/1/15
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Anton Tutter

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Apr 1, 2015, 2:16:52 PM4/1/15
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I'm glad I stayed out of it-- since I don't own a Rivendell and therefore am not a Rivendell Rider. :-o

Anton

Justin August

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Apr 1, 2015, 3:01:41 PM4/1/15
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I have a really good joke about this thread coming back after 3 days but I'll just keep it to myself.


Oh, shit.

-Justin, agnostic to helmets and gods in Oakland

cyclotourist

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Apr 1, 2015, 4:33:17 PM4/1/15
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I totally ignored this thread up until I saw Liesl refer to it in another post... wow, I've been missing out!!!




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"it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal



John

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Apr 1, 2015, 5:00:18 PM4/1/15
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I sure hope there a future resurrection, the price tag on those new POC Octal AVIP MIPS road helmets almost put me in an early grave!


John

dougP

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Apr 1, 2015, 6:08:36 PM4/1/15
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Same here.  FOMO (fear of missing out) made me look.  Whew!  I think I'll go change the air in my tires.....

dougP

ScottM

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Apr 1, 2015, 9:28:20 PM4/1/15
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I think perhaps what Deacon is referring to is that no one here ever asked him WHY he doesn't wear a helmet, but instead simply judged him (very harshly, I might add) for his own choice.  He never judged any of you for doing so, and even offered some "on-topic" suggestions for those who wear helmets.

As implied in his most recent reply, there may be a reason he doesn't wear a helmet that has nothing to do with the simple logic of personal safety.  I'm only guessing here, but it's possible that the wearing of a helmet would prevent him from being ABLE to ride a bike, since his extreme vertigo has a whole bunch of triggers by everyday things that most of us never give thought to.  For example ... he can't even wear what we see as normal everyday shoes.  Given the choice of either riding without a helmet, or not being able to ride because only an "idiot" rides without a helmet, I think I'd choose to be an "idiot".  In more simple terms, if wearing a helmet made it impossible for me to ride a bike, I'd ride without it ... even knowing the risk.  It's that whole "quality of life" thing, you know?  Barefoot and helmet-less may be the only way Deacon can do those "normal" things we call walking and riding a bike.  But nobody bothered to ask before berating him as an "idiot" for not wearing a helmet with his well-known head trauma.  Very nice.

Everyone's situation is unique ... and there are very often reasons for one's choices that, by necessity, go beyond everyday logic.  We shouldn't judge others ... but if you absolutely can't help yourself, at least make sure you have all of the information pertinent to the particular situation at hand.  If you do that, you might find yourself understanding more, and doing a lot less finger-pointing and name-calling.  Of course, I know not everyone here is so judgmental ... almost everyone here is incredibly kind and open-minded ... but those individuals who always feel the need to judge and be negative can really ruin the pleasant mood.  Please stop.

Deacon Patrick

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Apr 1, 2015, 10:15:47 PM4/1/15
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Got it in one, Scott! You've given me a wonderful gift by seeing what was there to be seen. Thank you. 

I find it truly wonderful and humbling how some people have a gift for putting themselves into another's shoes (or bare feet in my case. Grin.), with the information available and have remarkable accuracy in understanding the nuances and oddities. What a beautiful gift. I'd be blessed to ride with you should you ever find yourself near Pikes Peak.

If there's more to say on sun coverage, say it please, but it is time for this aspect of the thread to be done.

With abandon,
Patrick

rob markwardt

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Apr 1, 2015, 11:21:14 PM4/1/15
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I learned a new word last week and think it applies (though not sure if it's a real word)...sonder.  Sonder is" the realization that each random passerby is living a life as vivid and complex as your own—populated with their own ambitions, friends, routines, worries and inherited craziness...  "

It's like when you space out at the light it's because you were a little sleepy and listening to an interview on the radio and it took you back to a special time in your life and you were trying to remember a fuzzy detail and.... HONK!  Meanwhile the guy who you honked at earlier was just a frickin idiot.  I've been "sondering" on my rides and trips to the store and find it an interesting thought exercise.  I know we're not all random strangers here  but I think we all could use a little sonder walk now and then.  I personally find I still keep encountering idiots on the road, but now I at least think there must be a myriad of reasons why they became idiots.  

Rob

hangtownmatt

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Apr 1, 2015, 11:23:35 PM4/1/15
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Where can I buy a pair of these rose colored lenses that will allow me to interpret everything written by Deacon to be sensitive enlightened  wisdom?  Because the lenses I'm looking through aren't working.  Here's what I see in his response:

-  "Tell  me this is an elaborately planned, well ramped up, April Fool's joke!"   (Referring to my opinion on the matter)
-  "I had hoped mocking and pointing out stupidity would serve to at lease dissuade further stupidity rather than doubling down"  (Apparently I didn't get it initially so I'm double stupid)
-  "Because of the ignorance and arrogance of these responses from Steve and now Matt on this group"  (This helps. Maybe it's not my fault I'm stupid?  Maybe it's just my ignorance and arrogance getting in the way)

He goes on to say more cutting remarks and finishes with "I am sorry your Christ is so small!"

Give me a break.  All I did was agree with Steve that head injuries are cumulative and someone that had multiple concussions should wear protection.

Nuff said.  This is ridiculous,

Matt

Cyclofiend Jim

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Apr 2, 2015, 10:09:25 AM4/2/15
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I'm just having trouble following the idea that a thread that went from sun protection to helmet use.

I think we're all better than that.  Helmets as a topic always seem to be "third rail" interchanges. It's one thing if it's the proffered topic at the outset.  But, it wasn't here.

I'd hate to kill this thread, as there's a bunch of good stuff in it.

So, let's all go back to our booths and let this drop for good.  

Thanks!

- Jim / group admin

Jim Bronson

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Apr 2, 2015, 12:19:40 PM4/2/15
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On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 5:53 PM, ScottM <meadiap...@gmail.com> wrote:
  We shouldn't judge others ... but if you absolutely can't help yourself, at least make sure you have all of the information pertinent to the particular situation at hand. 

Very good point! 

David Yu Greenblatt

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Apr 2, 2015, 3:37:08 PM4/2/15
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Sun protection, and wearing clothing in general, aside from MUSA sailor panties, is overrated


David G in San Diego 




On Mar 20, 2015, at 10:12 PM, lungimsam <john1...@gmail.com> wrote:

What's good at blocking sunlight, while at the same time not getting overheated from too thick a material for a covering?

Helmets are vented and I get burned. What do you find that works? I notice some of you do all day riding so I figured you would have good ideas.

I'm talking 80-105F and in direct sunlight. What works?

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Justin August

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Apr 2, 2015, 7:05:45 PM4/2/15
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If I looked like that in sailor panties then sailor panties it would be!

-J

Liesl

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Apr 2, 2015, 10:35:35 PM4/2/15
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Sailor panties! What a delightful end to this story!
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