What do Rivendell riders use for GPS computers?

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lum gim fong

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Aug 24, 2017, 5:44:03 PM8/24/17
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Next in the series (https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rbw-owners-bunch/what$20do$20rivendell$20riders%7Csort:relevance):

What do you all use for gps units on your bikes?

I am looking for minimal features:

total distance
trip distance
climbing feet


That is all I need. Nuttin' fancy.
I don't care about speed, in fact i don't even want or need to see it.


In fact, the only reason I want a GPS is to not have wireless sensors on my bike.

I know that Sigma makes a minimal one. Was wondering if anyone knows of other makers besides Garmin, Sigma, Cateye.

Steve Palincsar

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Aug 24, 2017, 5:53:03 PM8/24/17
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How about a nice wired computer?  You could always look up the elevation gain on RWGPS on your computer...

Marc Nolte

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Aug 24, 2017, 6:01:11 PM8/24/17
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Use your smartphone and map my ride. 
Marc
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Deacon Patrick

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Aug 24, 2017, 6:05:23 PM8/24/17
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Map and compass normally. Computer at home if I ever care to know or share the elevation and distance profiles.

"That is all I need. Nuttin' fancy."

Is any of that a need? Try riding without any of it. No computer, no tracking, of anything. See what happens. Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

WETH

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Aug 24, 2017, 6:13:08 PM8/24/17
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I use my cellphone and Cyclemeter app mostly to track annual mileage for each of my bikes.

dougP

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Aug 24, 2017, 6:14:35 PM8/24/17
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I've been using a Garmin Edge 25 so I can monitor my heart rate.  The Edge 20 is similar without the HRM feature.  One downside is non-replaceable battery that only lasts about 8 hours.  They are easy to read in bright sun and don't take up a lot of room.  I like the clever quarter turn attachment to the mount, and that the mount uses a simple rubber band system for connection to handlebar.  Price is a bit stiff @ $170 for Edge 35 plus about $30 for HRM belt.  The Edge 20 is $130, still a bit pricey. 

dougP

Orc

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Aug 24, 2017, 6:38:46 PM8/24/17
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On Thursday, August 24, 2017 at 2:44:03 PM UTC-7, lum gim fong wrote:
If trip distance, total distance,and climb are all you're interested in & you've got a smartphone + an external battery, strava, ridewithgps, mapmyride, or the like are basically what you're looking for; you can start the program, plug the phone into the battery, then hurl the both of them into your rando bag and leave them there until you're done with the ride.      (I use ridewithgps for this;  I occasionally have dropouts when the gps can't get a good satellite connection, but I also had that happen with the garmin I used before the usb port broke loose and converted the thing into a very tiny boatanchor.)

-david parsons
 

Eric Norris

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Aug 24, 2017, 6:43:00 PM8/24/17
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Wahoo just released a very small computer called the “Elemnt Mini,” that uses wireless sensors for speed , cadence, etc. http://www.wahoofitness.com/devices/bike-computers The Bolt doesn’t have GPS, but it can pair with your phone to offer that functionality.

I use the Wahoo Elemnt ($499 direct from Wahoo) and highly recommend it, but I think it’s more than you’re looking for. A smaller version, the “Elemnt Bolt,” is available, but it costs $429 and is likely also more of a computer than you need.

--Eric Norris
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Eric Norris

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Aug 24, 2017, 6:46:01 PM8/24/17
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Have you considered a “hiking” GPS unit? I rode with a fellow randonneur recently who used a unit something like this:


Benefits include no speed display, replaceable AA batteries.


--Eric Norris
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islaysteve

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Aug 24, 2017, 7:27:21 PM8/24/17
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Before I got a smartphone, I was looking into this question myself.  As of New Year of this year, I have a smartphone, so problem solved.  I also use Map My Ride, but there are other apps of course.  If you don't have a smartphone, you might want to look into it and do the dollars and cents analysis vs. purchasing a single-purpose GPS unit.  Phones now do so much; IMO it's totally worth it to take the plunge.  Just having a decent camera in your pocket (or Saddlesack XS) is practically worth it.  YMMV, Steve

Reed Kennedy

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Aug 24, 2017, 7:42:45 PM8/24/17
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We talked about this a bit ago: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rbw-owners-bunch/FaA2YGcIwMo/qy_Ijc8mCgAJ

I sang the praises of the Wahoo Elemnt back then. I still adore my Elemnt, so I'll just paste here what I wrote back then:

******
The only thing I really like using a bike computer for is finding and following new routes without stopping to check the way.

The Wahoo Elemnt is really, really great for that. It syncs with RideWithGPS and other sites via either your phone or wifi and displays a map on a nice black and white screen that is easy to read even in direct sunlight. 

I could use my iPhone for this, but the Elemnt is easier to read and I don't have to worry about running out of battery on my phone, which always causes me some anxiety.

The Elemnt also does a great job with speed, Strava, and sensor stuff (power, heart rate, cadence, etc) but it turns out I don't care a whole lot about most of that stuff most of the time. I bring it with me when I want directions and leave it home the rest of the time. I find it far, far nicer to interact with than the Garmin I had before, which always felt like work.

Oh, and the Element does track the temperature, which is kind of nice. I felt like I wasn't riding so well the other week, and it turned out it was over 100 degrees!
******

Reed

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Reed Kennedy

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Aug 24, 2017, 7:46:16 PM8/24/17
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Sent too soon! I meant to add: One of the great things about the Elemnt is that you set it up and configure it with your phone, and the app is actually quite good. You can make it show a whole bunch of data, or only one or two things. 

So, Lum, you could set it up to show only the stuff you're looking for and not show speed. Nice!


Reed

Sean Cleary

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Aug 24, 2017, 10:10:39 PM8/24/17
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I always liked traditional wired or wireless computers because they rarely died and provided all I really need to know; distance, time of day, average speed and the all important odometer.

HOWEVER, I regularly ride 4 bikes and one tandem, some with alternating sets of tires that all require unique calibration settings. 

After 20 years of endless calibration each time I changed tires or the batteries died, I had it and bought a Garmin Edge 200. It's no longer made but similar models are a relatively affordable way to tally mileage from multiple bikes without fuss. When I mountain bike, I occasionally scrap a day's log because the tree canopy interrupts the GPS signal but other than that, for 4 years, it's been an otherwise champion of reliability for the price paid.

I personally can't stomach anything much above a hundred dollars for computing a bike ride. But I understand the desire for cutting edge technology including Wahoo models that display texts. Once a year that would be helpful... : )

Sean in Eden Prairie, MN 

Aaron Russell

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Aug 24, 2017, 10:35:20 PM8/24/17
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I use the Wahoo Elemnt Bolt and am very satisfied with it. You can currently get them for $250 (I got mine at REI).

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Orc

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Aug 24, 2017, 10:52:29 PM8/24/17
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On Thursday, August 24, 2017 at 3:46:01 PM UTC-7, Eric Norris wrote:
Have you considered a “hiking” GPS unit? I rode with a fellow randonneur recently who used a unit something like this:


Benefits include no speed display,


I don't know if that's necessarily so.  The eTrex 10 looks like it uses the standard Garmin OS with geocatching additions, and at least the Garmin website shows an eTrex with a very much bike-computer-style speed/distance/elevation/time display   (and the eTrex is about a cheap as a (used) iPhone, so if you're starting from a blank slate you'd get a better GPS receiver in exchange for not having a Unix system in your rando bag.)

-david parsons 

Bruce Baker

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Aug 25, 2017, 7:54:20 AM8/25/17
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Easy been using mapmyride app for smartphone.  All rides are archived location, distance, avg speed, elapsed time and you can look at speed for different intervals of time and they are archived and you can download them to an excel spreadsheet. Essentialy has worked flawlessly since 2010.

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Mark in Beacon

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Aug 25, 2017, 8:09:21 AM8/25/17
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I'm pretty sure real dyed in the wool Riv Riders use one of these puppies to make their own, out of hickory. Hot tip: Start off with marshmallow sticks and spoons for practice, then slowly work your way up to more advanced tool-making.


On Thursday, August 24, 2017 at 5:44:03 PM UTC-4, lum gim fong wrote:

Jay in Tel Aviv

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Aug 25, 2017, 8:38:30 AM8/25/17
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A stone sun dial.

Ron Mc

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Aug 25, 2017, 9:35:00 AM8/25/17
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Surveyor's compass on a camera mount

  

I navigate the coast flats in a kayak with chart compass, Ritchie deck compass, and Steiner Navigator glasses.  

the chart is in the milk crate (with "plano" style lure boxes, and the glasses are between the seat back and the cooler (fly gear is in the bow hold, and a Scotty fly rod holder behind the seat - rigging kayaks is the next most fun to building bikes)


On Friday, August 25, 2017 at 7:38:30 AM UTC-5, Jay in Tel Aviv wrote:
A stone sun dial.

Marc Irwin

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Aug 25, 2017, 11:21:15 AM8/25/17
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On Friday, August 25, 2017 at 8:38:30 AM UTC-4, Jay in Tel Aviv wrote:
A stone sun dial.

That's the ticket!
 

Marc Irwin

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Aug 25, 2017, 11:23:09 AM8/25/17
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I keep my Droid phone in the saddlebag.  If I get too lost, I look at Google Maps.  Anymore than that is a distraction.

Marc


On Thursday, August 24, 2017 at 5:44:03 PM UTC-4, lum gim fong wrote:

Clayton

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Aug 25, 2017, 11:34:56 AM8/25/17
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I use my phone. I have an Iphone and with all the available apps, it is all I could ever need. I use the Avenza map app and it has a few different maps of the Central Oregon trail system, road ride maps and an overall Oregon recreation map. They are interactive, showing a little blue dot where I am. I find it indispensable. Cyclemeter, another app, is what I use for distance, speed, elevation climbed etc.  I also have a small simple wireless computer that I use for checking my speed and distance while riding. The phone stays in a pocket. I only check on it when I need some route clarification. 

Clayton B.


On Thursday, August 24, 2017 at 2:44:03 PM UTC-7, lum gim fong wrote:

Patrick Moore

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Aug 25, 2017, 12:04:57 PM8/25/17
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+ 1 for Cyclemeter; of the 3 apps I've tried (Strava, and one other I forget), Cycle meter is the easiest to use and it shows you pretty graphs of your speed, elevation, and calories. (That last phrase is ironic.) But non-ironically, it also has a good map feature that lets you see your route with mile markers. 

Has anyone here sprung for the paid version of Cyclemeter? What does it add? In you're opinion, is this addition worth the cost? I've just used the freebie, not updated for about a year or so -- good enough for me.

The defect of course is that its use is limited by your phone's battery life, but of course there are solutions to that.

Patrick Moore, going out shortly, God willing, on the Matthews to seek out some new dirt paths, and who will track his ride on his iPhone 5, in pleasant, monsoon-season ABQ, NM.

On Thu, Aug 24, 2017 at 4:13 PM, WETH <erlho...@gmail.com> wrote:
I use my cellphone  and Cyclemeter app mostly to track annual mileage for each of my bikes.
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Garth

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Aug 25, 2017, 1:35:04 PM8/25/17
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Despite all the maps and technology that are "supposed" to make your life easier , of all the times I have left my home without them, just get up and go regardless of the means,  I have never failed to return home .   How 'bout that !!!


I re-call once I just got in my car and headed west from Minnesota. I ended up going all the Washington state and down to San Francisco where I slept in my car next to the Golden Gate bridge for a few nights in  a parking lot.  Lots of fond memories of which I could of which no map could ever find and experience. The point is I suppose that Life is in the living, the here and now, and really there is nothing else, since even all my "memories" are of right here and now.

 Life has this beautiful way of Living, regardless of any personal ideas about it, of which no words or compiling of them could ever encompass and express.  Life seems to be in the truly inseparability in being Life itself, where there are no alternatives, only Life.

EasyRider

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Aug 25, 2017, 1:57:05 PM8/25/17
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I have used the free version of Cyclemeter and I like it, but using any GPS app drains my iphone battery in a hurry. In cold weather, the phone dies after a few miles.

I don't care about stats while I'm riding, but it's nice to record a gpx file of longer rides, as a sort of souvenir. I have an Garmin etrex handheld unit that I use for hiking and backpacking and have started using it on the bike that way, passively.

Marc40a

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Aug 25, 2017, 2:16:13 PM8/25/17
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I use the Garmin Edge 25 for daily commutes, and day trips. Its a bare bones model that looks like the body of a Casio G Shock watch. It's battery runs 6-7 hours ad allows me to save precious phone juice. 

For extended trips I use an Etrex 30 - definitely overkill for what you are looking for. 

Ty Graham

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Aug 25, 2017, 3:58:24 PM8/25/17
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Hi,

I don't like the battery life impact on long rides, but other than that I like Cyclemeter on my iphone.

I get the paid version for 2 reasons: I tend to click ads on accident when I'm tired. I'm a software guy - I feel like i should pay for software that I use.

A feature of the paid version (I think) is the automatic email of a ride summary to multiple recipients. I really found this handy as a way to update my wife every day while I was on my Pacific Coast trip. She got the email and could stop worrying; I could hydrate, shower, eat, and then check in at my leisure.

I haven't really found the voice prompts or other paid features to be useful.

I did like having all the GPS tracks when I was done to make maps: https://flic.kr/p/oPnQoY

I had to use a supplemental battery on some long days to keep my phone from draining completely. This was with an iPhone 5s in 2014. I'll update with my newer phone and app, once I get some longer rides in this year.  

Ty Graham
Seattle
2000 Atlantis

Patrick Moore

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Aug 25, 2017, 4:17:21 PM8/25/17
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I hate those g*&^%!@%n voice prompts! But good to know that I'm not missing much by using the freebie.

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Daniel D.

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Aug 25, 2017, 4:51:17 PM8/25/17
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Strava on my smartphone stowed away in a bag or pocket. After a ride, I like seeing a map of my route, where I shoulda zigged instead of zagging. Also like seeing a log of my mileage and climbing.

SeanMac

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Aug 25, 2017, 7:36:22 PM8/25/17
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I also use the paid version of Cyclometer.  In addition to the benefits that Ty spelled out, I believe that the paid version also tracks the weather conditions during each ride - temperature, wind speed and direction and humidity.  I actually find this information to be interesting.  Besides, as I recall, the cost of accessing the "Elite" version is only about $10 per year.  I figure that this is a pretty small investment for an app that I utilize on a frequent basis (and one that is updated fairly regularly.

Sean,
Buffalo, NY


Patrick Moore

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Aug 25, 2017, 8:09:43 PM8/25/17
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Now wind recording might be worth 83 cents a month. thanks.

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Davey Two Shoes

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Aug 25, 2017, 10:27:09 PM8/25/17
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the biggest most heaviest one they can find... just like our bikes :)

Bill M.

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Aug 26, 2017, 4:15:03 PM8/26/17
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I use a Garmin Vivoactive HR to integrate HRM, speed/time/distance/climb and route tracking.  Sometimes I wear it on my wrist, sometimes strap it to the handlebar and use a 'bra strap' HR belt.  My wife likes that the Live Track feature of the Garmin software (running on my phone) can show my location to her during the ride.  She worries about that kind of thing, having had to pick me up once on a ride when I was having what turned out to be a heart attack.  I use the HRM to make sure I don't over-stress my ticker on those days when I feel strong.
  
Bill
Stockton, CA

On Thursday, August 24, 2017 at 2:44:03 PM UTC-7, lum gim fong wrote:

R. Alexis

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Aug 27, 2017, 5:16:35 PM8/27/17
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I personally don't use anything at the moment. I haven't even replaced the dead battery in my Cateye wireless or got to the point of mounting on of the Trek Time simple cycle computers on any of my bikes. A friend of mine that I have been riding with lately uses her Apple iWatch along with her Apple iPhone to track our rides using one of the features on it. The phone will give a map, but the watch will give distance, time, elevation gain and average speed. Gives some other readings also. It is nice that the info is available, but not sitting on your handlebar as a distraction. I know there are those on the list that are not crazy about a computer sitting on the handlebar taking up space or being a distraction.

Reginald Alexis

Patrick Moore

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Aug 27, 2017, 6:17:46 PM8/27/17
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That's one reason I bother with a "smart" phone -- it tracks mileage and routes and even elevation, but stays demurely in a rear jersey or side pants pocket, and it basically is one gadget in place of half a dozen -- more if you count computers for each of 4 bikes.

("Smart" phone my ass. Electronic gear is no smarter than a hammer or window, because the essential element of "smart" -- consciousness or subjectivity -- is just as much absent -- essentially absent. So much for "AI," unless something happens as happened with "The Head" in CS Lewis's blackly comic "That Hideous Strength.")

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Lum Gim Fong

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Feb 23, 2018, 2:42:13 AM2/23/18
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Updatum:

Been using the biologic bike brain app to track miles.

I like it alot. Easy to use customizable ride screen, ride histories. And I just turn it on and put it in my bag while I ride. I use it to record miles and then track my weekly miles.

Ryan Merrill

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Feb 23, 2018, 9:05:30 AM2/23/18
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I went through a time of using varuiys cateye wired computers, then to a Garmin 500, a Garmin 1000 explore and now I use a Garmin fenix watch. The garmins are nice because you don't have to clutter your bike up with a bunch of sensors and they seem to really work well. I've had no issues out of them; heck, my wife is using the 500 now. I think I have a few cateyes in drawers throughout the house.

I like the watch the best because I always have it with me and I can use it when I race cyclocross without fearing losing the garmin on the course (I crash a lot). I got my Garmin 1000 explore up for sale (if anybody wants it just give me a holler).

On Thursday, August 24, 2017 at 4:44:03 PM UTC-5, Lum Gim Fong wrote:

William!

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Feb 23, 2018, 10:01:30 AM2/23/18
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If you are looking for something that *automatically* tracks your rides (great for trips around town), check out Ride Report. And in case you are wondering, yes you will earn a virtual trophy if you ride to Rivendell HQ and/or Rivelo with the app installed.

(disclosure: I work on Ride Report 🤓)

Best,
William

Bill Lindsay

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Feb 23, 2018, 10:22:51 AM2/23/18
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RideReport looks cool. Will I be able to run RideReport and Strava simultaneously on my iPhone? Seems like I should since they would both just simple consumers of GPS data.

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito Ca

William Henderson

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Feb 23, 2018, 10:27:28 AM2/23/18
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Yep, many folks do just that – use Ride Report for quick daily trips and Strava for longer rides out of town.

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Deacon Patrick

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Feb 23, 2018, 2:05:46 PM2/23/18
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Wooden sign on a pine tree on a dirt road turn off on one of my favorite rides: “Your GPS is WRONG!”

I chuckle every time I see this as I crank up the slope of Pikes Peak. Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

Steve Palincsar

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Feb 23, 2018, 2:18:51 PM2/23/18
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On 02/23/2018 02:05 PM, Deacon Patrick wrote:
Wooden sign on a pine tree on a dirt road turn off on one of my favorite rides: “Your GPS is WRONG!”


I googled "GPS is wrong" looking for image results.  Here are a few:
Image result for GPS is wrong
Image result for GPS is wrong
Image result for GPS is wrong
Image result for GPS is wrong
Image result for GPS is wrong
Image result for GPS is wrong
Related image
Image result for GPS is wrong


Patrick Moore

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Feb 23, 2018, 2:39:00 PM2/23/18
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The last one alone is worth the price of admission. 

Patrick "Brain? What brain?" Moore

Lum Gim Fong

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Feb 23, 2018, 4:00:24 PM2/23/18
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"Your bike could be impounded" should be added to those signs.

I remember a cyclist who twice did not honor no tresspassing signs and once he was detained by cops and fined after quite a wait. I was thinking that I wonder why he wasn't ever worried about his ~10,000$US bike being impounded if he would have been arrested.
They probably would have thrown it on top of the heap of other bikes they keep in their yard. Many scratches and bent derailer and dented tubes later...

Steve Palincsar

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Feb 23, 2018, 5:19:57 PM2/23/18
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On 02/23/2018 02:38 PM, Patrick Moore wrote:
The last one alone is worth the price of admission. 

Patrick "Brain? What brain?" Moore

https://www.popsci.com/navigating-with-gps-is-making-our-brains-lazy

Home
Navigating with GPS is making our brains lazy

Close Google Maps to get a mental workout

By Rob Verger April 4, 2017
Manhattan street map

A map of Manhattan showing a metric called "closeness centrality" that describes how connected a street is to the whole larger network of streets, with red indicating more connections and blue the opposite.

Kinda Al Sayed and Joao Pinelo Silva

Navigation apps like Google’s Waze reduce the amount of mental power it takes to get from one place to another—and researchers can now literally see the difference in brain activity. A recent study is helping scientists get a better grasp of just how our brain function changes when navigating from memory versus following turn-by-turn directions.

To learn more about how our brains process networks like city streets, neuroscientists and cognitive scientists from University College London (UCL) and other institutions conducted a study in which two dozen participants first walked around the London neighborhood of Soho. None of the participants were familiar that busy neighborhood, which is a “really dense pack of streets with lots of cafes and bars—really colorful place,” says Hugo Spiers, the study’s senior author and a neuroscientist in the department of behavioral psychology at UCL. The subjects then took a test to see how well they’d learned the urban landscape. “It’s pointless scanning someone who is completely lost,” he says.

The next day, in the lab, the subjects were asked to navigate those streets virtually by looking at an interactive film, while an fMRI machine monitored their brain activity. (The machine tracked the flow of oxygenated blood in their brains, which many scientists consider to be an indicator of brain activity.)

Half the time, the participants had to figure out how to get to the destination themselves, by pushing buttons when they got to an intersection to say which way they wanted to turn. It was “very much as if you were in the car with your partner driving, and they just keep turning to you and asking which way do we go now?” Spiers says. “It wasn’t relaxing.”

The other half of the time, the same participants had a much easier task. They were simply told which way to turn at each intersection, much like following commands on Google Waze or a GPS unit on the dashboard.

What the investigators found was clear. When participants had to do the hard mental work of figuring out which way to turn, the researchers saw more activity in the subjects’ hippocampus—a part of the brain associated with memory and spatial navigation. Not only that, there was a direct connection between the amount of brain activity and how many connections (and thus route options) the street at hand had with other roads. In short, the more complex the street, the more activity in that part of the brain.

The result was like a “rollercoaster of hippocampal activity depending on the street network,” Spiers says.

But that wasn’t the case in the scenario that simulated using GPS. In fact, the relationship between brain activity and street complexity was totally “abolished,” Spiers says, when people were just following directions.

They recently published their findings in the journal Nature Communications. Past research has pointed towards similar results: taxi drivers learning London’s thousands of streets actually gained grey matter in their hippocampi.

Spiers points out that in an era where getting turn-by-turn directions is as easy as looking at a smartphone, something may be lost—just like how a muscle you don’t use atrophies. People using a navigation service to tell them where to go aren’t stimulating their hippocampus, he says. “And that might well not be good for you,” he adds. “It might be better to actually give your brain a bit more of a workout.”

Of course, there are obvious benefits to GPS navigation, including a considerable reduction in stress, but Spiers hopes to find a balance between making navigation easy and teaching us about the environment through which we’re moving. He adds: “I’m hoping in the future we’ll start making technology that more empowers us.”


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