Roadini as commuter?

[Patrick S.]

Hey there, not an RBW owner (yet) but had a question concerning the Roadini and thought you fine folks might be interested in giving your "unbiased" opinion. 

I've been commuting (approx 2400km / season) with a Surly LHT 26" for the past while and am really interested in the Roadini for its geometry (higher cockpit and shorter wheelbase) and looks (of course). I carry about 10/15lbs up front and ride in all types of weather. Just wondering if anyone here has built one up and what's their experience so far?

Cheers!

[Ed Carolipio]

Hi Patrick,

Maybe the Roadini is not a good option if you like that front load? It doesn't come with dedicated eyelets for a front rack, so you'll have to be creative in figuring out how to carry that 10-15 lbs. It does have rear rack eyelets, fender eyelets, and will fit most 32mm tires and a fender simultaneously, so there are other options that can make it work.

From other discussions about comparing the Roadini with other models, a Sam would likely fill that role much better. The Sam can take that front load but should have similar geometry and ride characteristics that you're looking for. Not a Sam owner, though, so I defer to others on those points.

--Ed C.

[Steve Palincsar]

On 01/08/2018 04:40 PM, Patrick S. wrote:
> Hey there, not an RBW owner (yet) but had a question concerning the
> Roadini and thought you fine folks might be interested in giving your
> "unbiased" opinion.
>
> I've been commuting (approx 2400km / season) with a Surly LHT 26" for
> the past while and am really interested in the Roadini for its
> geometry (higher cockpit and shorter wheelbase) and looks (of course).
> I carry about 10/15lbs up front

Carried "up front" how?

> and ride in all types of weather. Just wondering if anyone here has
> built one up and what's their experience so far?
>

--
Steve Palincsar
Alexandria, Virginia
USA

[Jonathan D.]

I think a Canti-Sam would work better. The Roadini sounds great but it doesn’t have the room for fenders or the options with racks. The Sam is just a great all around bike that can go as a lightish bike or a heavier commuter.

[Surlyprof]

+1 on Jonathan’s insight. I often commute with more than 15# on my Sam (often lopsided) but it is also my only road bike. I found it to be much more lively and comfortable than the LHT and Cross Check. Wheels and tires are an important part of that formula.

All that said, the Roadini is a beautiful bike.

John

[ascpgh]

Patrick, I'd hesitate saying  "10/15lbs up front and ride in all types of weather" would be OK on a Roadini from my experience.

I have a Rambouillet, connect by lineage to the Roadini when you consider it was for the riding uses below the capacities of the Atlantis before there was even a Sam or a Homer. For my all-season, all-weather commuter I have a dedicated Disc Trucker.  How "all types of weather" do you face in your commuting?

My heaviest loading of the Ram (20# max) is in my Carradice Nelson Longflap saddlebag. It just handles better that way, including on the trail surfaces of the GAP/C&O where I ride a lot of miles in a lot of different weather. My foray into using a front bag for anything beyond convenience of reach made the front end feel floppy and less telegraphing in it's feel of impending front end washout. Left unloaded it's a wonderful riding bike on all kind of surfaces and the Roadini seems to have lots of the Rambouillet's purpose in the Rivendell lineup.

I leave the lumps, bumps, risks of damage or loss to my less endearing Trucker. On the plus side, as I've said before, the long wheelbase helps account for my shallow or distracted attention riding it after work. It rides like it knows the way home, or more realistically it doesn't respond to minor erroneous steering inputs. My Ram is much more fun and rewarding to ride.

I'd get the Roadini and not rationalize it for commuting under your premise but keep the LHT for that. I'd get the Sam if the bike count has to stay at one and carry your stuff on the back.

Andy Cheatham

Pittsburgh

[Steve Palincsar]

On 01/09/2018 08:31 AM, ascpgh wrote:

Patrick, I'd hesitate saying  "10/15lbs up front and ride in all types of weather" would be OK on a Roadini from my experience.

I have a Rambouillet, connect by lineage to the Roadini when you consider it was for the riding uses below the capacities of the Atlantis before there was even a Sam or a Homer. For my all-season, all-weather commuter I have a dedicated Disc Trucker.  How "all types of weather" do you face in your commuting?

My heaviest loading of the Ram (20# max) is in my Carradice Nelson Longflap saddlebag. It just handles better that way, including on the trail surfaces of the GAP/C&O where I ride a lot of miles in a lot of different weather. My foray into using a front bag for anything beyond convenience of reach made the front end feel floppy and less telegraphing in it's feel of impending front end washout. Left unloaded it's a wonderful riding bike on all kind of surfaces and the Roadini seems to have lots of the Rambouillet's purpose in the Rivendell lineup.

This is why I asked earlier how he was planning to carry that load.  If the plan is panniers on lowriders, that will almost certainly be better than a front bag -- for that load on that bike.

I leave the lumps, bumps, risks of damage or loss to my less endearing Trucker. On the plus side, as I've said before, the long wheelbase helps account for my shallow or distracted attention riding it after work. It rides like it knows the way home, or more realistically it doesn't respond to minor erroneous steering inputs. My Ram is much more fun and rewarding to ride.

I'd get the Roadini and not rationalize it for commuting under your premise but keep the LHT for that. I'd get the Sam if the bike count has to stay at one and carry your stuff on the back.

Andy Cheatham

Pittsburgh

On Monday, January 8, 2018 at 9:23:48 PM UTC-5, Patrick S. wrote:

Hey there, not an RBW owner (yet) but had a question concerning the Roadini and thought you fine folks might be interested in giving your "unbiased" opinion. 

I've been commuting (approx 2400km / season) with a Surly LHT 26" for the past while and am really interested in the Roadini for its geometry (higher cockpit and shorter wheelbase) and looks (of course). I carry about 10/15lbs up front and ride in all types of weather. Just wondering if anyone here has built one up and what's their experience so far?

Cheers!

[Garth]

Roadini for commuting ? Sure !

Just say Yes !
Yes !

with front rack ... from Blue Lug flickr acct.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/bluelug/38895471702/in/photostream/

[Davey Two Shoes]

I really want a Roadini for my all purpose bike, but between my Clem, Salsa Vaya and Waterford Road that's being built there is literally no place for it. I imagine it would be a great commuter, like an All City Space Horse except more special.

[Jonathan D.]

Plus 1 for Andy. I also have a Ram and love to ride it. I was told by Will it is a Roadini with more lugs. I just use a backpack on my commute and wait for a sunny day (I still need fenders). It is setup with light wheels and I don’t want to weigh it down. If I switched components with the Sam I bet there would be some overlap with the Ram Just slightly more of a road bike. I think the build and wheels overlap a lot with the Sam but the steel does feel lighter.

If you want a go fast bike the Roadini is great but I wouldn’t carry 15 lbs upfront. I would plan on a small Sackville amount of weight and enjoy the ride. Or get a Canti Sam if you want to haul stuff to work and want bombproof wheels and tires.its also a great time to buy either and support Riv.

[Steve Palincsar]

On 01/09/2018 09:44 AM, Jonathan D. wrote:

I also have a Ram and love to ride it. I was told by Will it is a Roadini with more lugs.

Well, except that the Rambouillet had rear rack mounting points on the seat stays.  As far as I can tell from looking at the pictures on the Riv web site, the Roadini has no rack mounts of any kind anywhere.  That greatly limits its usefulness as a commuter in my book.  I've commuted carrying clothes and shoes in a large seat bag, and although it works, it's far less handy than carrying clothes and shoes in panniers.  (Yes, you could use P-clamps, but honestly - why would you want to?  And why does this frame have no rack mounting points if carrying a commuting or light touring load was considered in the design?) 

Riv's web site says this about the Roadini:

The Roadini is an all-around, all-weather road bike. It gives up nothing to modern extreme bikes on smooth, ideal roads, and is far better in every way when conditions are crappy. It has the classical clearances of the oldies, higher quality overall construction, is more comfortable, and rides like a Rivendell.

If up to now you’ve avoided road bikes because they’re so weird, extreme, and expensive, now there’s one that isn’t. This year we’re making just over 100 frames in 5 sizes (listed below) expected early this fall. We have a second run scheduled for early next year.

I think "road bike" in this context is meant the same way as with your LBS carbon fibre road racers.  I do not believe it is meant as "sport touring" - which the Rambouillet pretty clearly was.

[lconley]

Back in my late twenties (in the early eighties), I commuted to work on a fenderless full Campagnolo Masi Gran Criterium. I did not allow anyone to pass me on the bike path. A commuting bike is whatever you want it to be. If you want to commute on a Roadini, go for it.

Laing

[Jonathan D.]

I believe the Roadini was intentionally designed without the rack mounts to discourage folks from loading up the bike. Grant stated that rack mounts encourage carrying loads and eventually this bike would end up like all his others. This bike
Is meant to be a tripped down light bike. The Sam is the do it all.

[Steve Palincsar]

On 01/09/2018 10:37 AM, Jonathan D. wrote:
> I believe the Roadini was intentionally designed without the rack mounts to discourage folks from loading up the bike. Grant stated that rack mounts encourage carrying loads and eventually this bike would end up like all his others. This bike
> Is meant to be a tripped down light bike. The Sam is the do it all.
>

Confirming that it wasn't designed to be used as a commuter...

[Jonathan D.]

Ageeed. Though a Riv not designed to be a commuter is still probably a better commuter then most other brands commuter bike.

[Tim Gavin]

On Tue, Jan 9, 2018 at 9:55 AM, Steve Palincsar <pali...@his.com> wrote:

On 01/09/2018 10:37 AM, Jonathan D. wrote:

I believe the Roadini was intentionally designed without the rack mounts to discourage folks from loading up the bike. Grant stated that rack mounts encourage carrying loads and eventually this bike would end up like all his others. This bike
Is meant to be a tripped down light bike. The Sam is the do it all.

Confirming that it wasn't designed to be used as a commuter...

But any Rivendell can be used outside its main design focus.  Grant espouses "under-biking", where you push a bike outside its parameters, just for the fun or challenge.  

I have a Rivendell Road Standard, the first roadie Riv, basically a (very) fancy RB-1.  I tour on it, ride gravel, commute, and I've even done (easy) singletrack on it.  I carry a front randonneur bag on a Mark's rack (with long stays down to the fender eyelets, due to no rack eyelets).  

It handles a #10 commuting load pretty well, but I admit that a fork with low trail (wish list) would probably handle that load even better.  And that a fork with rack eyelets would have been easier to equip.  I also admit that it didn't have enough tire/fender clearance, which is why I changed it to 650b wheels and long-reach centerpull brakes. 

But, my point is it can do many things well that weren't its main focus, so long as you can adapt and compromise.

Patrick S, you just have to weigh your priorities.  

The Roadini has a lower price, less tire/fender clearance, fewer eyelets, decent commuting ability, and a little lower weight.

A Sam has more of each, and a canti-Sam would have even more.  

The Roadini will probably feel lighter and handle more sprightly than a Sam or other heavier Riv.  But each is fun to ride in its own way.

FYI, Rivendell's mid to high trail front geometry means they're happier with front panniers than with a top front load.  The Sam is no different than the Roadini in this regard.  So, if you prioritize carrying a load above the front wheel, you may be happier on a bike with a low trail fork.

[Patrick S.]

I ride in the sun, rain and sometimes snow and pretty much everything in between (I live in Quebec, Canada). One of the main attractions to the Roadini is also its price. USD to CAD exchange rate + shipping + brokerage fees would be just too much on a Sam for me at the moment.

 Good points all around thanks for the input everyone!

[Patrick S.]

I currently have a Sulry 24 pack rack + ILE Porteur bag. Not opposed to move everything to the back though. Used to carry loads this way but found that loading up a 26" sized wheel bike in the front helped stabilize the steering a bit. And I also like having quick access to my stuff in the front also. 

[Tim Gavin]

Yeah, that rack/bag combo may be a bit much on the Roadini.  And I don't know how you'd attach the 24-pack rack to any Riv without eyelets on the fork crown.  

A Mark's rack would fit the Roadini fine, with either p-clamps on the fork legs or long stays down to the fender eyelets.

But there are plenty of smart rack-less front bags available from bike-packing bag makers, so don't let the rack be a limit.   

For example, I also have a plastic (CF) cyclocross bike, and I've Rivved it out somewhat with fenders, bags, and Brooks tape and saddle.  It handles a #20 load in the Revelate Harness on front even better than my Riv carries a #10 load in its randonneur bag.

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[Mark in Beacon]

You certainly do not need p-clamps to enjoy a super solid rack on your bike. I've had these before and they work just great. This one is on a bike new to me, which still needs a handlebar wrap, and when I removed the brakes I did not level the rack. It's now going on another bike anyway. As has been said many times, this kind of connection has carried countless loads millions of miles. Seat stay braze-ons are nice and might make it a bit more secure in theory, but this rack would look killer on a grilver Roadini.

The only possible stumbling block to using the Roadini as your dedicated commuter is you are going to loose significant tire width over a 26" LHT, especially if you outfit it with fenders for all weather. Maybe a dual role--the Roadini on fair weather days when you might want to throw on some extra miles, the LHT for the more challenging weather. The LHT could be your camping/gravel bike, the Roadini fast solo or club riding, day trips, packed dirt road, etc. Perfect!

On Tuesday, January 9, 2018 at 7:03:40 AM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:

...you could use P-clamps, but honestly - why would you want to?  And why does this frame have no rack mounting points if carrying a commuting or light touring load was considered in the design?) 

[Mark in Beacon]

Didn't quite finish my thoughts. So a rack on back with a saddlesack or panniers in back and a banana sack up front (or equivalents). This is assuming your commuting route features average decent road surfaces, or if you are a large person, especially if you will be running fenders. I always appreciated having the option of a more spritely commuter rig for the fair weather days. You are often also carrying less. 

[Tim Gavin]

I agree, Mark, but I was referring to using the Mark's rack up front (p-clamps to the fork legs), as Patrick S is asking about front loading.  The Mark's rack uses a tang to the brake post for its upper mount, just like your example.

[Tim Gavin]

Oops, and I mistakenly thought you were responding directly to my mention of P-clamps, not Steve's.  :)

[Mark in Beacon]

Hi Tim. Yes, the Mark's Rack is great. I've used it front and back, with and without p-clamps, which, in my opinion, are a wonderful example of a first world problem. I also think Marks should get a nice discount on Mark's Racks.

On Tuesday, January 9, 2018 at 9:06:57 AM UTC-8, Tim Gavin wrote:

I agree, Mark, but I was referring to using the Mark's rack up front (p-clamps to the fork legs), as Patrick S is asking about front loading.  The Mark's rack uses a tang to the brake post for its upper mount, just like your example.

On Tue, Jan 9, 2018 at 10:59 AM, 'Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch <rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

You certainly do not need p-clamps to enjoy a super solid rack on your bike. I've had these before and they work just great. This one is on a bike new to me, which still needs a handlebar wrap, and when I removed the brakes I did not level the rack. It's now going on another bike anyway. As has been said many times, this kind of connection has carried countless loads millions of miles. Seat stay braze-ons are nice and might make it a bit more secure in theory, but this rack would look killer on a grilver Roadini.

The only possible stumbling block to using the Roadini as your dedicated commuter is you are going to loose significant tire width over a 26" LHT, especially if you outfit it with fenders for all weather. Maybe a dual role--the Roadini on fair weather days when you might want to throw on some extra miles, the LHT for the more challenging weather. The LHT could be your camping/gravel bike, the Roadini fast solo or club riding, day trips, packed dirt road, etc. Perfect!

On Tuesday, January 9, 2018 at 7:03:40 AM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:

...you could use P-clamps, but honestly - why would you want to?  And why does this frame have no rack mounting points if carrying a commuting or light touring load was considered in the design?) 

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[lum gim fong]

I commuted 30 miles round trip in my 54 Ram with 6cm stem with Noodles and front rack bag it was fantastic. So I dont see why it cant be done on a roadini.

[Kevin Lindsey]

Patrick -

Although my normal commute is via a Rivendell (Hunq or Bleriot), I'll often take one of my road bikes ('73 Pugeot PX-10 or Moots) and they work fine.  Couple of caveats, though:

a) I load my clothes and other items in a backpack, not in a pannier; 

b) My route is entirely on pavement; and

c) I typically won't bike if there's to be a heavy rain or other weather-inspired unpleasantness.

My commute is 30 miles each way, and I keep it up year round except when there's ice.  It's a lot of fun to commute with a light and fast road bike, although I might think twice before loading one down with panniers, as it'll affect the handling, and probably not for the better.

Kevin

On Monday, January 8, 2018 at 9:23:48 PM UTC-5, Patrick S. wrote:

[Patrick Moore]

I expect that the Roadini would do better with rear loads than front ones, given Rivendells' typical geometry for their roady models. If it is much like the Ram, then doubleplusgood for that opinion.

I commuted for years on 2 Road Customs (serially, not simultaneously), and still do grocery errands on the later Road Custom, with rear loads in large saddlebags (Nelson LF, Adam, Med Sackville) but have always gone back to rear panniers on a stiff rack (Tubus Fly, various customs). I also owned a Sam Hill and a Ram and both did fine with rear loads of up to 40 lb, but oddly, IME, the Ram better than the Sam which, heavily rear laden, became unpleasantly light in front steering. (I once just to try it put 50 lb in low riders attached to custom braze ons on the front of the Sam: I couldn't steer!)

IME, a bike as stout as the Ram can handle rear loads up to 25 lbs without a waggle, on a good rack (I am about 175). I've also been carrying smaller loads up to 20 lbs on front low riders on the later custom; the bike handles them fine, but this one, and the earlier one, were noticeably better with rear loads. I've carried 40 lbs in the rear on the 2 bikes with little problem, though my usual commuting loads were well under 20 lb.

On Mon, Jan 8, 2018 at 2:40 PM, Patrick S. <plu...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hey there, not an RBW owner (yet) but had a question concerning the Roadini and thought you fine folks might be interested in giving your "unbiased" opinion. 

I've been commuting (approx 2400km / season) with a Surly LHT 26" for the past while and am really interested in the Roadini for its geometry (higher cockpit and shorter wheelbase) and looks (of course). I carry about 10/15lbs up front and ride in all types of weather. Just wondering if anyone here has built one up and what's their experience so far?

Cheers!

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[Patrick Moore]

+1. I don't think Tubus still makes the Fly, but it might make a similar rack. I've carried any number of 30 lb + loads on that 11 oz rack: stiff as a girder, no wagging, and rated to 20 kg.

[Patrick Moore]

Make that 35, and 45 in a pinch; again, good rack. But 25? Easily.

Note that it seems to be geometry that makes a good loader, front or rear. The best rear loader I owned was a light (by Riv standards) all 531 skinny tubed 1973 Motobecane Grand Record racing frame; for some reason it handled rear loads better than any of the 5 Rivs I've owned; certainly better than the Sam. Short front center, long stays (45 cm). But the Rivs, well, 4 of them, handled better than the Motobecane unladen.

[iamkeith]

The fact that the Sams are again being offered in a canti version makes them a hard option to ignore but, if you really want to try the lighter bike or it is more in lines with your budget, I agree with the minority here who predict that the Roadini would be perfectly adequate.

For what it's worth, there are many examples of Rams set up with front racks illustrated on the Cyclofiend website, from the days when in-between options like the Sam or Homer were not readily available.   Yes, most of them use P-clamps which aren't gorgeous, but I can't recall complaints about handling or fork failures from those who used them:   http://www.cyclofiend.com/cc/cc-maker.html#rivendell

Also, If you're comfortable redistributing some of the load to the rear, you really don't need ANY racks for the kinds of weights you're talking about.  This is what I do on my Ram, with a seat-mounted saddle back support and a handlebar bag.   It's perfect for long day rides or commuting.  If I want to go fast, I just take them off:

[Bill Lindsay]

Steve claims to have looked at pictures of the Roadini to conclude that it has no rack mounts anywhere.

I see rack mounts at the rear dropouts and barrel style rack mounts up on the seat stays. That’s all you need to mount a rear rack.

Commute away! APPROVE.

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, Ca

[Max S]

Have been reading this thread with interest, as I’m hoping to start bike commuting again soon, once the clavicle heals and the snow and ice are off the roads.

I’m wondering what the OP’s requirements are with regard to locking the bike up vs. being able to bring it inside at work, leaving the bags on the bike vs. having to take them with, etc?..

My most preferred set up for ride quality is either a front bag on a rack or a saddlebag, but only if I can bring the bike in with me. (None of the saddlebags or front bags that I’ve seen or used seem to be very good for easily releasing and then easily carrying...) Often I cannot bring the bike inside, so some kind of quick release and good portage option are needed. In those cases, I find that the inexpensive Wald basket up front works (I just put my work bag in, go, lock, grab, go), as long as the load is not too heavy. In either case, I find that a road bike with a decently long wheelbase does pretty well.

[Belopsky]

Might be a few months for snow and ice to be off the roads. Think the clavicle will heal before that?

My favorite quick release are Ortlieb but they're not exactly rivvy ;)

[Steve Palincsar]

On 01/09/2018 08:10 PM, Bill Lindsay wrote:

Steve claims to have looked at pictures of the Roadini to conclude that it has no rack mounts anywhere. 

I see rack mounts at the rear dropouts and barrel style rack mounts up on the seat stays. 

Didn't see those before, but do see them now.  Missed that picture, definitely my bad and thanks for pointing it out.

That’s all you need to mount a rear rack. 

Agreed. 

Commute away!  APPROVE. 

I'd have to agree - at least as well set up for it as a Rambouillet.

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, Ca

[adam leibow]

I'd say go for it. I commute on all my bikes, and I can usually get away with riding my stupid-aggressive road bike with carbon fork and no braze-ons whatsoever to work when I use my sackville bar tube and roadrunner wedge half frame bag. I am interested in a Roadini myself, and imagine my Makeshifter Outback saddlebag to be a perfect option for carrying the fresh clothes, lunch, and occasional laptop I portage on my commutes. Personally, I'd steer clear of using P clamps, a nitto rack & wald basket, in favor of the more elegant Makeshifter or something like a carradice. In my eyes a roadini is "commuter-lite" or "creative commuter" and your LHT is "commuter proper" or "commuter pro"

[lum gim fong]

Whats wrong with p clamps?

[Patrick S.]

Yep, that would be a good solution. Tubus makes a great rack with this attachment. 

[Mark in Beacon]

As it turns out, the Roadini has braze-ons for a rear rack. Either way, the Roadini is a bicycle in the old school sense in that it is not a hot house flower, but can handle most any regular road and weather conditions, and then some. New school in the sense its designer has been working on ways to further tweak and improve this basic idea his entire career, as well as explore new parameters (sloped tt, long stays, etc.) and it takes advantage of modern materials. Based on what the OP already has in the stable, unless his body requires the extra cush of super wide rubber, or he commutes with a desktop and 3 changes of clothing and a set of encyclopedias, I say Roadini all the way.

[Patrick S.]

@Max - I'm really lucky. I park my bike in an locked cage with security cameras which is situated in an underground parking under our building. 

On Tuesday, January 9, 2018 at 8:25:01 PM UTC-5, Max S wrote:

[John W]

I've long used a Carradice Super C with an SQR quick release. It has an ample ~20L capacity and I use all of the space. (You need slightly more than a fistful of seatpost for the SQR clamp.) I've done this with a variety of bikes including ones that wouldn't fall into the typical "commuter" species and its worked just fine. Just another consideration.

[Kainalu V.]

I commute on a Quickbeam quite a bit and want to share one concern of mine. This Quickbeam of mine is my 2nd as I murdered the first's bottom bracket shell with a crack from front to back. On my "new" Quickbeam I have some lowriders up front I carry any load I might on, keeping the rear clear of anything but my butt. My reasoning is that rear loading killed the old frame because those times when I was cranking up a hill standing on the pedals with weight on my bars caused undue stress from those rear loads riding along side to side without me in the seat to keep it all copacetic. I might be wrong, but so far so good (except for that one point when it wasn't). 

-Kai of the two beautiful green 'beams

BK NY

On Tuesday, January 9, 2018 at 3:34:02 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:

I expect that the Roadini would do better with rear loads than front ones, given Rivendells' typical geometry for their roady models. If it is much like the Ram, then doubleplusgood for that opinion.

I commuted for years on 2 Road Customs (serially, not simultaneously), and still do grocery errands on the later Road Custom, with rear loads in large saddlebags (Nelson LF, Adam, Med Sackville) but have always gone back to rear panniers on a stiff rack (Tubus Fly, various customs). I also owned a Sam Hill and a Ram and both did fine with rear loads of up to 40 lb, but oddly, IME, the Ram better than the Sam which, heavily rear laden, became unpleasantly light in front steering. (I once just to try it put 50 lb in low riders attached to custom braze ons on the front of the Sam: I couldn't steer!)

IME, a bike as stout as the Ram can handle rear loads up to 25 lbs without a waggle, on a good rack (I am about 175). I've also been carrying smaller loads up to 20 lbs on front low riders on the later custom; the bike handles them fine, but this one, and the earlier one, were noticeably better with rear loads. I've carried 40 lbs in the rear on the 2 bikes with little problem, though my usual commuting loads were well under 20 lb.

On Mon, Jan 8, 2018 at 2:40 PM, Patrick S. <plu...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hey there, not an RBW owner (yet) but had a question concerning the Roadini and thought you fine folks might be interested in giving your "unbiased" opinion. 

I've been commuting (approx 2400km / season) with a Surly LHT 26" for the past while and am really interested in the Roadini for its geometry (higher cockpit and shorter wheelbase) and looks (of course). I carry about 10/15lbs up front and ride in all types of weather. Just wondering if anyone here has built one up and what's their experience so far?

Cheers!

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[adam leibow]

Nothing is altogether wrong with P clamps, I just see them as an inelegant solution both visually and in concept.

On Tuesday, January 9, 2018 at 10:55:34 PM UTC-8, lum gim fong wrote:

Whats wrong with p clamps?

[Patrick Moore]

How much do you weigh? It's hard to imagine anyone but a 225 lb East German elite track sprinter on steroids breaking a good steel frame across the bb shell, loads or no loads.

I've heavily torqued much lighter frames up steep hills, with heavy rear loads, for years, with no problems. I suspect a cause different from mere rear loading. 

[Kainalu V.]

I'm a 220lb 6'8" Fresian non sprinter, but the bike came gently used. Might've been under a roid raging monster at some point, but the man who I purchased it from certainly seemed perfectly calm and kind, and about 200lb wet. It was an oddity for sure.
-Kai
BK NY

[Toshi Takeuchi]

I setup my Ram bike with a Mark's rack up front--yes with P-clamps, but it did the job just fine.  I rode 2 600k brevets on it and it held up fine, and I had to carry a good amount up front and in my saddlebag.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/42771204@N00/8176967200/in/dateposted-public/

Toshi

[Davin Dahl]

I built up a 57cm Roadini to be my commuter bike/roadish riding bike. I have an Albatross out front with an X-Small Saddle Sack. In the rear, I have a Mark's Rack with p-clamps for the lower struts. I attach my bag with the Frost and Seker quick release. With ten pounds or so, it rides really well. Riding a light commuter is a thing of beauty! It's pretty tough to go back to my bad weather steel hardtail. 

[Ash]

If the budget permits, I'd say, MIT Homer is worth considering.

Last week I took one for a spin when I visited Riv HQ to pick up some accessories.   It felt as light and nimble as any other steel road bikes I've ridden.  Also as comfortable and smooth as my Rivs.

On Tuesday, 9 January 2018 08:22:34 UTC-8, Patrick S. wrote:

I ride in the sun, rain and sometimes snow and pretty much everything in between (I live in Quebec, Canada). One of the main attractions to the Roadini is also its price. USD to CAD exchange rate + shipping + brokerage fees would be just too much on a Sam for me at the moment.

 Good points all around thanks for the input everyone!

On Tuesday, January 9, 2018 at 8:31:34 AM UTC-5, ascpgh wrote:

Patrick, I'd hesitate saying  "10/15lbs up front and ride in all types of weather" would be OK on a Roadini from my experience.

I have a Rambouillet, connect by lineage to the Roadini when you consider it was for the riding uses below the capacities of the Atlantis before there was even a Sam or a Homer. For my all-season, all-weather commuter I have a dedicated Disc Trucker.  How "all types of weather" do you face in your commuting?

My heaviest loading of the Ram (20# max) is in my Carradice Nelson Longflap saddlebag. It just handles better that way, including on the trail surfaces of the GAP/C&O where I ride a lot of miles in a lot of different weather. My foray into using a front bag for anything beyond convenience of reach made the front end feel floppy and less telegraphing in it's feel of impending front end washout. Left unloaded it's a wonderful riding bike on all kind of surfaces and the Roadini seems to have lots of the Rambouillet's purpose in the Rivendell lineup.

I leave the lumps, bumps, risks of damage or loss to my less endearing Trucker. On the plus side, as I've said before, the long wheelbase helps account for my shallow or distracted attention riding it after work. It rides like it knows the way home, or more realistically it doesn't respond to minor erroneous steering inputs. My Ram is much more fun and rewarding to ride.

I'd get the Roadini and not rationalize it for commuting under your premise but keep the LHT for that. I'd get the Sam if the bike count has to stay at one and carry your stuff on the back.

Andy Cheatham

Pittsburgh