Deportation raids to begin Sunday: report

[I-think4me]

Where you ask, will they put all these families that they round up? In those same already overcrowded detention centers in Texas of course.

Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) agents will launch massive raids on Sunday targeting undocumented immigrants scheduled for deportation, The New York Times reported early Thursday, in an operation that President Trump delayed weeks ago.

The ICE action had been set to take place in 10 major cities and target up to 2,000 immigrants, according to multiple reports.

According to the Times, officials will try to hold detained family members at centers in Texas and Pennsylvania, adding that ICE wants to deport families as quickly as possible.

[Irie]

"Immigration and Customs Enforcement says it plans to target 2,000 undocumented people who already have deportation orders or have missed court dates."

[I-think4me]

Even with removal orders, they have to be held somewhere. The process isn't as simple as rounding people up,driving them to the border and loading them onto buses. Unless they agree to voluntarily deport they can still challenge their removal order under certain circumstances. Not to mention the fact that there will be others without removal orders who will be swept up in raids.

[KCM7Alpha]

"Do, or do not.  There is no 'try'" ~ Yoda

[Fritz_da_Cat]

Hitler 2.0..... I mean Trump is sending out his Gestapo.... I mean ICE. How Republican of him.

[Irie]

How is this not an advocation for open borders if you just allow people who have deportation orders to stay in the country and refuse to enforce the law?

  

[I-think4me]

How is this not an advocation for open borders if you just allow people who have deportation orders to stay in the country and refuse to enforce the law?

--------
There isn't an either/or here. The law that you want enforced, allows for discretion in dealing with the complex realities that occur when dealing with real humans and the issue of immigration. By the time these court cases have wound their way through the process,these people have had children, taken on jobs, mortgages, put down roots in their communities, the conditions in their home countries have changed and most of them have proven that they pose no risk of danger to anyone. How does it further our security to tie up time and resources pursuing them and ripping their families apart? And is that not the whole point of "controlling our borders" in the first place?

[Irie]

Generalities aside.  If it was an either-or decision, we wouldn't just be talking about picking up 2000 people.

So you don't support deportation of people who openly flaunted our immigration laws, have had their day in court and have been ordered to leave, or skip court altogether.  

With respect to dealing with illegals already in the country, what immigration laws do you support?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[herman]

<<< Where you ask, will they put all these families that they round up? In those same already overcrowded detention centers in Texas of course. >>>

Will they continue to separate men from their wives and children?

What about those who are sick - will they do what they've been doing, quarantine but refuse to provide medical care?

No beds, just sleeping on the floor with an aluminum blanket?

How will they be fed, give the inadequate provisions already in place?

[herman]

What is the plan when they're confronted with family members - children - who are citizens?

Will they scoop them up and deport them, too?

IF they do distinguish between citizens and undocumented, what plans have they made to take children who are here legally (aka citizens) into CPS custody?  And what do they plan to do with them when their parents are deported?

On Thursday, July 11, 2019 at 11:49:30 AM UTC-4, I-think4me wrote:

[btdt100]

They support open borders which Pelosi stated this morning in a presser where she also gave advice to those illegals facing deportation on how to avoid law enforcement. In other words, she advocated anarchy until they get a bill passed destroying the sovereignty of the US, as if it would pass the Senate or be signed by the president.  

https://thehill.com/video/administration/452594-watch-live-pelosi-holds-a-press-conference

[plainolamerican]

Deportation raids to begin Sunday

---

what are the odds that most of those caught in the raids are hispanic?

https://www.hias.org/tagged/border-response

[I-think4me]

o you don't support deportation of people who openly flaunted our immigration laws, have had their day in court and have been ordered to leave, or skip court altogether.
With respect to dealing with illegals already in the country, what immigration laws do you support?

-------
In the interest of taking hyperbole out of the discussion, lets be clear. A removal order does not order a person to leave. such an order directs the government to remove the person. That entails making travel arrangement, procuring travel documents, receiving permission from the receiving country etc... If a person is already out on bail when a judge makes such an order, they are not taken from the court to the airport. They are sent home to go about their lives and wait for a letter from ICE telling them when to report for deportation. A letter that may come in weeks or years, simply because they are not a priority..often times they are simply told to check in at the office every 90 days so ICE has their current address and sent back home. The point being, that just because a person has a deportation order does not mean that they are some fugitive brazenly flaunting the law.
As to the 11 million already here, there has to be some form of amnesty. It simply is not logistically possible to arrest detain and deport 11 million people. It would devastate families, communities and local economies. Not to mention the crisis it would create in the receiving countries. That simply isn't going to happen so there has to be some pathway to citizenship.

[saint.bezark]

Hitler 2.0..... I mean Trump is sending out his Gestapo.... I mean ICE. How Republican of him.

=========

A GOPogrom.

[Irie]

The absolutely pathetic thing about the leftist's incessant caterwauling is that none of what is going on has anything to do with trump administration policy.  

He didn't get a wall, he doesn't have merit-based immigration, and he doesn't have any new visa legislation.  

The disingenuous left is pitiful.

[herman]

It's incredibly irresponsible of the feckless (I'm being ultra-generous) trump administration to lock up MORE people when it is incapable of providing for the people it has already detained.

[Irie]

Which begs the question....why is your party so resistant to funding border security?

[herman]

No, it doesn't.

HERE are questions appropriate to MY post:

Why the fuck didn't your party's leader insist that adequate provisions be available for those he detains?  Why the fuck did he go ahead when he knew facilities, personnel, and supplies were far from adequate?

And why the fuck is he demanding an already atrocious situation be made much worse?

Try answering those, irie.  I've been asking these questions for quite a while now, on numerous threads, yet neither you nor your fellow rumprepublicans has the guts to answer.

On Thursday, July 11, 2019 at 10:08:27 PM UTC-4, Irie wrote:

Which begs the question....why is your party so resistant to funding border security?

[I-think4me]

Which begs the question....why is your party so resistant to funding border security?

------
Because the money won't be spent making us more secure, it will be spent to expand jails for thousands of more people who's only crime is seeking the protection of this country. It will spent on hunting down and separating and punishing families who for years have proven themselves no risk and even assets to their communities.It will be spent to push a bigoted hateful agenda that is the antithesis of who I want to be as a person and what this country is supposed to stand for in the world. Any more questions?

[herman]

But Trump isn't going after those who illegally employ undocumented workers, is he?

On Thursday, July 11, 2019 at 11:49:30 AM UTC-4, I-think4me wrote:

[Irie]

No, like your previous dim leadership, he is not.  But that was then...right?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`

[Irie]

OK, now I get it...you are opposed to expanding facilities to house border jumpers, or funding a more expeditious deportation process for illegals, but you want to grant "amnesty" when they get in and subsequently skip their court dates, because, you know, they have "ties".

Seriously, why not just come out and espouse open borders? 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`

[herman]

Previous Presidents, Republican and Democratic, didn't demonize and fearmonger about immigrants.

Previous Administrations didn't insist that each and every undocumented immigrant be jailed indefinitely.

In fact, conservatives supported a legal path to citizenship for immigrants.  They WELCOMED them.

There are no conservatives left in your TRUMPrepublican party, irie.

[Irie]

Wise up, dullard, even your party has spoken of the need to fix the illegal immigration issue for decades.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[herman]

I see you refuse to address the points I raised:

But Trump isn't going after those who illegally employ undocumented workers, is he?

AND

Previous Presidents, Republican and Democratic, didn't demonize and fearmonger about immigrants.

Previous Administrations didn't insist that each and every undocumented immigrant be jailed indefinitely.

In fact, conservatives supported a legal path to citizenship for immigrants.  They WELCOMED them.

[Irie]

1) what point?

2) No shit moron, no administration has.

3) You have posted previous whines about "prosecutorial discretion", that position changes now, since it is a Republican administration, I suppose.

4)  There already is a legal path...I am astounded that this is news to you.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`

[herman]

A legal path for those here illegally, irie.  You know, the 11-12 million undocumented immigrants.  And for the Dreamers.

Moreover, Republicans USED to welcome additional immigration, including undocumented migrant workers. 

Now, what about these facts:

Previous Presidents, Republican and Democratic, didn't demonize and fearmonger about immigrants.

Previous Administrations didn't insist that each and every undocumented immigrant be jailed indefinitely.

[Irie]

How the hell do you know it's 11-12 million?  You cowards are scared stiff to actually count the illegal aliens.

Republican welcome immigrants, they just don't embrace illegal border jumpers.

Now, about your "facts"

Quit being a whiny little bitch because trump doesn't welcome illegal aliens with open arms...he didn't make the laws.

Previous administrations ignored the law IF your claim is accurate.  If your betters don't like the law why have they not changed it?

[herman]

That's the number both parties have accepted for quite a few years, irie.

Trump is the first President to demonize and fearmonger about undocumented immigrants.

And, no, there is NO "law" that forces trump to do what other Presidents have  not done:  demand that ALL undocumented immigrants be jailed indefinitely.

So, you still haven't address the two points (above, yellow-highlighted).

[I-think4me]

OK, now I get it...you are opposed to expanding facilities to house border jumpers, or funding a more expeditious deportation process for illegals, but you want to grant "amnesty" when they get in and subsequently skip their court dates, because, you know, they have "ties".
Seriously, why not just come out and espouse open borders?

-----
No clearly you don't "get it", because "open borders" is a right wing talking point with no foundation in any kind of reality. And I'm not sure to be quite honest that it is possible to explain my views on immigration to people who insist on referring to would be immigrants as "border jumpers" ,"illegals", rapist murders etc... And I think that is pretty much the impasse that the whole country is facing. One side sees human beings the other side sees monsters and can't conjure up enough sinister motives for why half the country wants to turn the monsters lose on them.

[herman]

<<< How the hell do you know it's 11-12 million?  You cowards are scared stiff to actually count the illegal aliens. >>>

I'm glad you asked that question, irie, because the number is slightly LOWER than 11-12 million.  AND Obama deported a hell of a lot of undocumented immigrants.  Moreover, the report concludes that visa "overstayers" account for more undocumented immigrants than those who enter illegally.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/27/us/illegal-immigrants-population-study.html

Shortly after then-candidate Donald Trump announced his presidential campaign, he suggested that the number of undocumented immigrants living in the United States could exceed 30 million. But a new study puts the number far lower and shows a significant decline over more than a decade.

The study, published by the Pew Research Center on Tuesday, put the number of undocumented immigrants in the United States at 10.7 million in 2016, down from a peak of 12.2 million in 2007.

As Pew analyzed new data from recent years, its researchers found that “it wasn’t just that the numbers declined, but also who these unauthorized immigrants are had changed since 2007,” said D’Vera Cohn, a senior writer at Pew Research.

The estimates are derived from figures published by sources like the Census Bureau, which accounts for foreign-born people living in the United States, along with other demographic data including death rates and legal border admissions.

The report showed that the immigration landscape was different from that portrayed by many politicians:

In 2016, as President Barack Obama left office, the number of undocumented immigrants living in the United States was at its lowest level in a decade.

As of 2016, the most recent data available, the number of people living in the United States without documents decreased to 10.7 million from a peak of 12.2 million in 2007. The sharp decline came largely during the Obama administration and in the wake of the Great Recession. Deportations also sharply rose during that time.

“The recession and the housing bust were certainly important events driving down these numbers, but it’s also possible that several other things were important as well,” Ms. Cohn said. “We know that border enforcement was stepped up during this period too, and smuggling fees increased. And we also know there has been a rise in deportations.”

Amid global economic and political shifts, there are fewer undocumented Mexican migrants today and more Central Americans.

In 2016 there were 1.5 million fewer unauthorized Mexicans living in the United States than in 2007. While they still make up a majority of illegal immigrants living in the United States today, migration out of Mexico has slowed. Pew notes that, according to survey data by the Mexican government, “the majority cited family reunification as the main reason” for returning to Mexico.

And there has also been a sharp decrease in the number of “recent arrivals” — immigrants who entered the country within the last five years. “There was an average of 386,000 annual unauthorized arrivals for the 2011-16 period, compared with 715,000 for the 2002-07 period. That amounts to a 46 percent decline,” according to the report. During that time, entering the country grew more difficult and, throughout the recession, jobs in construction and other fields grew more scarce.

But in contrast, the number of migrants from Central America living in the United States illegally rose somewhat between 2007 and 2016, amid increased violence and economic uncertainty in the Northern Triangle region.

The overwhelming majority of undocumented immigrants have lived in the country for a decade or longer.

The typical undocumented migrant living in the United States in 2016 had been here for about 15 years, up from a median of about nine years in 2007. Two-thirds of all undocumented immigrants, the researchers found, had lived in the United States for more than 10 years.

“This is a much more rooted, established population than it was in 2007,” Ms. Cohn said. “There are markedly fewer short-term residents and more long term residents.”

One million immigrants without papers are protected from deportation by the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program and other mechanisms.

Pew estimates that about 700,000 people in the United States who were brought to the country without documents as children have received protection from deportation through DACA. An additional 300,000 have Temporary Protected Status, which is applied to migrants from countries like El Salvador and Haiti that have experienced natural disasters.

Visa overstays have become an increasingly significant share of unauthorized migration.

Because of limited statistical data, it is hard to account for how many undocumented immigrants in the United States are here as a result of overstaying a visa. But those migrants increasingly appear to make up a significant share of overall illegal immigration.

“We don’t have exact numbers,” Ms. Cohn said, “but, from what we know, it appears that a majority of recent arrivals in 2016 are not unauthorized immigrants who crossed without documents, but people who arrived on legal visas and overstayed their deadlines to leave.”

Such immigrants, who typically have the means to enter the country legally but have not been granted permission to stay beyond a certain period, “probably constituted most of the recent unauthorized immigrant arrivals in 2016,” according to the report.

On Friday, July 12, 2019 at 12:30:21 AM UTC-4, Irie wrote:

[herman]

<<< No clearly you don't "get it", because "open borders" is a right wing talking point with no foundation in any kind of reality. And I'm not sure to be quite honest that it is possible to explain my views on immigration to people who insist on referring to would be immigrants as "border jumpers" ,"illegals", rapist murders etc... And I think that is pretty much the impasse that the whole country is facing. One side sees human beings the other side sees monsters and can't conjure up  enough sinister motives for why half the country wants to turn the monsters lose on them. >>>

*********

<<< One side sees human beings the other side sees monsters and can't conjure up  enough sinister motives for why half the country wants to turn the monsters lose on them. >>>

One side sees human beings, the other side sees monsters and insists they be mistreated, neglected, and abused as they are jailed indefinitely - even the children among them.

[Irie]

Fuck me...if I speed I am a speeder....if I ignore a countries laws and, as an alien,  jump the border I am a "migrant" but don't dare call me an "illegal alien" or a "border jumper", because dammit, my feelings will be hurt.  

If I recognize the fact that you gave me the big fuck you to my laws I am somehow the bad guy?  

When did it become taboo to expect a citizen of another nation to follow our laws if they want to come here?  

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Irie]

So your number is what...a guesstimate, then?  Lord knows an actual count scares the shit out of your ilk...for some reason.

Just curious though, why weren't you goofy fuckers whining when obummer was deporting illegal aliens?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

On Thursday, July 11, 2019 at 11:47:10 PM UTC-5, herman wrote:

<<< How the hell do you know it's 11-12 million?  You cowards are scared stiff to actually count the illegal aliens. >>>

[herman]

Trump and his supporters - and that includes you, irie - ARE the "bad guys", because you demonize undocumented immigrants and use them - hell, you lie about them - in order to gin up fear and hatred, which your party uses to gain votes.

You lie about what Democrats support.  You refuse to hold trump accountable for HIS huuuuuuuuuuuge lie/con game, that Mexico will "pay" for his wall.

You support our treating human beings, including CHILDREN, as subhumans - untermenschen - and that Americans have become monsters like this is just plain scary.

[Irie]

What "lie" did I "tell", troglodyte? 

Be specific now.

ROFL.....as if that shit is gonna happen

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[herman]

>>> So your number is what...a guesstimate, then?  Lord knows an actual count scares the shit out of your ilk...for some reason. <<<

There you go again, lying that "an actual count scares the shit out of your ilk."  If that were true, little trumpster, the nytimes would not be reporting the current numbers.  Jeezus, shit isn't restricted to your ass, it's in your brain.

About the study: Pew Research, using data from the Census Bureau and other demographic data.  Read the article, irie.

As for Obama:  whether Democrats supported his upping the number of deportations doesn't change the FACT he did it.  More evidence the tired out rabid right-wing lie that Democrats want open borders is just that:  shit from the assholes of each one of your trump cult followers who spews this never-proved crap.

The number of undocumented immigrants still in the country has decreased.  (And it sure as hell was never near the 30 million YOUR serial liar-in-chief said.  But that's just one of the thousands of lies you refuse to hold him accountable for.)

[Irie]

Fuck all...so the NY slimes got numbers the census could not even glean.  WOW!!

So, do tell spHermie, why are you leftists so opposed to asking a citizen question, NOW, you know, especially since you didn't say shit for, what, the last 100+- years....

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[herman]

It's happening already, and you damn well know what I mean:

You support our treating human beings, including CHILDREN, as subhumans - untermenschen - and that Americans have become monsters like this is just plain scary.

You and I have gone around and around about your boy donnie's refusal to provide decent accommodations for the people he demands be thrown and kept in jail.

You and I have gone aorund and around about your support for trump's ongoing mistreatment, abuse, and torture of human beings in US custody.

That trump does this is bad enough.

That 40% of the population of this country has become so monstrous it supports our treating human beings as untermenschen is not only scary, it's terrifying.

And YOU, cult follower, are one of the American monsters who refuses to acknowledge that these people don't deserve the inhumane treatment they are receiving from Americans and the American Government.

[herman]

YOU, trump, and the rest of the trashrepublican scum are turning the USA into a nation that abuses and tortures human beings.

Even children.

You've turned yourselves into monsters, and you're determined to dehumanize those for whom you have contempt.  Why?  Because you can.  Because you have the power.  And because you want to, irie.

You want to be cruel to other people.

Even to children.

[Irie]

It's almost like I can see the future.

LOL

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~