ATOC Cif data - Bus Replacement

[Richard Steele]

Hi
Looking at the ATOC Cif file (MCA) for timetabled data - Can anyone throw any light on how you correlate BUS Replacement (Train CAT ="BR") - BS record and the corresponding Train BS Record - in order to display the Bus Replacement schedule for this service, how do you find the TRAIN service and do the QI records need to be suspended

Hope this makes sense

Thanks
Richard

[Paul Kelly]

On 30/03/15 11:01, Richard Steele wrote:
> Hi
> Looking at the ATOC Cif file (MCA) for timetabled data - Can anyone
> throw any light on how you correlate BUS Replacement (Train CAT ="BR") -
> BS record and the corresponding Train BS Record - in order to display
> the Bus Replacement schedule for this service, how do you find the TRAIN
> service and do the QI records need to be suspended

There is no correlation between specific rail replacement buses and
specific trains that would usually run, if that's what you were asking?
What is a QI record?

Paul

[Peter Hicks]

The ‘QI’ record is in the ATCO CIF spec (see http://travelinedata.org.uk/CIF/atco-cif-spec.pdf) and is an intermediate location on a bus journey, a bit like the ‘LI’ record for an intermediate location in ‘BR CIF’.

Yes, it really is called ATCO CIF, despite the opportunity for confusion with ATOC.

Peter

[Richard Steele]

Sorry, QI is what we convert to regular CIF - QI would be LI for ATOC -
Would the Bus replacement service be linked in the AA record - is this how we find the correlation?
Thanks

[Peter Hicks]

Hi Richard

On 30 Mar 2015, at 11:28, Richard Steele <rst...@basemap.co.uk> wrote:

Sorry, QI is what we convert to regular CIF - QI would be LI for ATOC - 
Would the Bus replacement service be linked in the AA record - is this how we find the correlation?

As Paul said, there isn’t any link between a schedule and a bus in the CIF data either from Network Rail or from ATOC.

Road replacement services don’t necessarily follow the same route as the rail service they’re replacing.  For example, when the St Albans Abbey branch line was shut in December, the replacement service ran to and from St Albans City station, calling at St Albans Abbey and stations to Watford Junction.  Similarly, when there have been closures at Watford in the past, buses run to other locations such as Stanmore.

There may be something in the Darwin timetable that can identify linking between rail and road services - but the Darwin timetable doesn’t cover more than the next day or so.

Peter

[Richard Steele]

Hi Peter

 

Many thanks for your reply – In this data, what would the AA records be specially used to denote?

 

Thanks

 

Richard

[Peter Hicks]

Hi Richard

On 30 Mar 2015, at 12:27, Richard Steele <rst...@basemap.co.uk> wrote:

Many thanks for your reply – In this data, what would the AA records be specially used to denote?

Association records are either:

  * Split - where a train splits en-route, e.g. a train from A to B which splits at an intermediate location, with the ‘front’ train calling at stations to B, and a rear portion calling at stations to another destination, C.  The ‘main’ train is the one from A to B, the ‘associated’ train is the one from the intermediate location to C, and is a completely separate schedule

  * Join - where a train joins en-route - the reverse of the above

  * Next Train - where a train runs from A to B and the forms another service from B to C (or even back to A), this association links the two together

Peter

[Richard Steele]

Many thanks for your reply Peter

 

Can we assume that then for Bus replacement, there is simply a BS record with dates and the original train service just terminates  at the appropriate stop and then another BS record is created for when the Bus Replacement terminates so in other words there will be 3 x BS records – Rail – Bus – Rail for the route

 

Many thanks

 

Richard

 

From: Peter Hicks [mailto:peter...@poggs.co.uk]
Sent: 30 March 2015 12:44
To: Richard Steele
Cc: openrail...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [openraildata-talk] ATOC Cif data - Bus Replacement

 

Hi Richard

[Peter Hicks]

Hi Richard

On 30 Mar 2015, at 12:52, Richard Steele <rst...@basemap.co.uk> wrote:

Can we assume that then for Bus replacement, there is simply a BS record with dates and the original train service just terminates  at the appropriate stop and then another BS record is created for when the Bus Replacement terminates so in other words there will be 3 x BS records – Rail – Bus – Rail for the route

It may not be that simple - the destination of the first train may be a TIPLOC for the station, and the origin of the bus service may be a different TIPLOC - or it could be the same, I’m not sure there’s any hard and fast rule.

Take, for example, Willesden Junction - see http://www.opentraintimes.com/location/WLSDJHL/2015-05-17/14:13.  Services would normally run from Richmond to Willesden Junction, but the bus replacement is from Gunnersbury (so, use the District Line presumably from Richmond).  These buses terminate at Willesden Junction when the rail services would normally run through to Stratford (see http://www.opentraintimes.com/location/WLSDJHL/2015-05-03/14:13).

Also, some bus replacements (e.g. http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/V86769/2015-05-24) run from a TIPLOC that isn’t the same as the rail station - however, many services are just timed to leave from platform ‘BUS’.

You may need to do some fuzzy matching here.

Peter