Re: webmaker Digest, Vol 33, Issue 23

[Lucy Harris]

Hey Lawrence,

Thanks for this email! We're currently reviewing those updates and trying
to gauge community interest so it's great to know that you enjoy them and
I'm going to pass your message along. If they do come back someone else
will be doing them as Hannah has moved over to another team!

Thanks for your feedback!

Lucy

----

Hey Jeremie,

This is a great idea! I added a few more Webmaker teaching kits into the
pad you shared and also found this HTML & CSS Crash Course <Crash Course
HTML & CSS: https://mozteach.makes.org/thimble/crash-course-html-and-css>created
by MozTeach. It's part of the HTML Basics module
<https://training.webmakerprototypes.org/en/html/concepts/> that is
currently under construction on training.webmakerprototypes.org. It looks
like it is doing a lot of the things you were thinking of and so could
possibly be developed instead of building something new from scratch!

Looking forward to seeing how this works and happy to help!

Lucy

----

Hey Mario,

I've forwarded your email onto Bobby!

Best,

Lucy



>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2015 01:45:15 +0300
> From: Lawrence Kisuuki <lawr...@mozilla-uganda.org>
> To: Mozilla Webmaker list <webm...@lists.mozilla.org>
> Subject: [Webmaker] Weekly Update
> Message-ID:
> <
> CAB1ZAtOy4xczZEK4EHLnVLTK...@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> Hey all,
>
> I hope I don't come off as sentimental but I really miss the weekly updates
> from Hannah, so many things we would catch up on now it's dark again :(
>
> Will this ever be revived?
>
>
>
> *Regards,*
>
> *Lawrence*
> *Lead MozFestEA*
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2015 13:39:54 +0100
> From: Jeremie Patonnier <jeremie....@gmail.com>
> To: dev-mdc <dev...@lists.mozilla.org>
> Cc: Mozilla Webmaker list <webm...@lists.mozilla.org>, Laura Hilliger
> <la...@mozillafoundation.org>
> Subject: [Webmaker] In search for the perfect HTML tutorial
> Message-ID:
> <CAEi838=
> 17S4R+Bz6dgoGnjVPE_9d...@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> Hello everybody :)
>
> As you might know, MDN is a great resource for information about the HTML
> language. However we are currently missing a comprehensive full tutorial
> for total beginner who wish to start learning HTML.
>
> To improve that, I'm starting working on drafting one and find people to
> help us writing all this. But before writing anything I wish to have your
> feedback about what is needed to learn HTML, what resources you are using
> to learn or teach HTML already, what exercices you are recommending, how to
> test knowledge, etc.
>
> If you have ideas or feedback, if you want to help us creating the best
> HTML tutorial ever, please, feel free to comment and provide feedback just
> here. I you want to follow up in the long run, I will gather everything on
> that Eherpad:
>
> - https://etherpad.mozilla.org/HTML-tutorial
>
> Thank you all for your help, I'm looking forward to shape this up with you
> :)
> Best,
> --
> Jeremie
> .............................
> Web : http://jeremie.patonnier.net
> Twitter : @JeremiePat <http://twitter.com/JeremiePat>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2015 20:20:53 +0100
> From: Mario Behling <m...@mariobehling.de>
> To: Mozilla Reps - General Discussion mailing list
> <reps-g...@lists.mozilla.org>
> Cc: Hong Phuc Dang <h...@fossasia.org>, webm...@lists.mozilla.org
> Subject: Re: [Webmaker] [Reps-General] Looking for community members
> to help make featured Webmaker app content
> Message-ID:
> <
> CALaXfOVYzhjgC0sV8+kbR4LE...@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> Hi Bobby,
>
> it would be great, if we could provide data of FOSSASIA (
> http://fossasia.org)
> and create an app. We are working on an Android app already here:
> https://github.com/fossasia/fossasia-companion-android
>
> The discussion how we import data into the app:
> https://github.com/fossasia/fossasia-companion-android/issues/3
>
> The idea is to import data from a spreadsheet that generates a JSON for the
> app, e.g.:
>
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/13O8ysuMtDGU69JnyZ6yDbzajGQJuDeoLv1zZW94ELXk/gviz/tq?pli=1
>
> Would that suit your idea of content?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Mario
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 20, 2015 at 7:56 PM, Bobby Richter <
> bo...@mozillafoundation.org>
> wrote:
>
> > Hello all!
> >
> > Over the past few months, we've been working hard on a new mobile tool
> > called Webmaker App, which is designed for creating web content
> > (pages/apps) on mobile devices, for mobile devices.
> >
> > Now, we're looking for help from the community to create content and
> > explore the features of the app. Our hope is that volunteers will try it
> > out, create something fun or useful, and let us share it with the wider
> > public.
> >
> > Let me know if you're interested! If you are, send me an email (no need
> to
> > reply-all), and we can talk about how to get you involved.
> >
> > Thanks a lot!
> >
> > --
> > Bobby Richter
> > Producer, Mozilla Foundation
> > t/i/s/g: secretrobotron
> > ?( ?)?
> > _______________________________________________
> > reps-general mailing list
> > reps-g...@lists.mozilla.org
> > https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/reps-general
> > https://wiki.mozilla.org/ReMo/SOPs/Mailing_List_Policy
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
> _______________________________________________
> webmaker mailing list
> webm...@lists.mozilla.org
> https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/webmaker
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of webmaker Digest, Vol 33, Issue 23
> ****************************************
>

[Jeremie Patonnier]

Hi Lucy

2015-02-25 16:59 GMT+01:00 Lucy Harris <lu...@mozillafoundation.org>:

> Hey Jeremie,
>
> This is a great idea! I added a few more Webmaker teaching kits into the
> pad you shared
>

Yes thanks, those are great resources I wasn't aware of. It will help a lot.


> and also found this HTML & CSS Crash Course created by MozTeach. It's

> part of the HTML Basics module
> <https://training.webmakerprototypes.org/en/html/concepts/> that is
> currently under construction on training.webmakerprototypes.org. It looks
> like it is doing a lot of the things you were thinking of and so could
> possibly be developed instead of building something new from scratch!
>

Yes, it looks like it overlaps somewhat what we are doing on MDN. That
said, it's not necessary an issue to have several resources of that nature
both on WebMaker and MDN (we do not address the same kind of audience).
However, I had the impression that WebMaker were addressing teacher and
trainers, but this module looks more like some self-teaching content so I'm
a bit confused about the exact goals of that module.

> Looking forward to seeing how this works and happy to help!
>

Thanks :D

[Laura Hilliger]

Hey Jeremie,

The HTML module (on training) is about 5 years old. I was going to update it (hence the “in development note”) when I threw it up on the training site sometime last year. Then, after we met in London, I redirected my attention, but left the content where it was. I agree with Lucy, perhaps you could just finish / remix that as opposed to bringing a new tutorial?

As you can see in your etherpad, there’s tons of basic HTML content in the Mozilla Universe, including things from the MDN community itself. I might have missed a step, but I think there are more pressing topics? I would encourage you to work on intermediate and advanced resources, or maybe start with Javascript instead. I do kind of think it’s problematic to have several resources for the same thing when we have so many holes in our content offering...

Also, I think it’s important to note that the Webmaker target audience was not always trainers and teachers. Nor will it always continue to be. In any case many people in our audience, while teachers, are also learners. We have loads of content for them as well. Webmaker and the MDN will always have a bit of audience overlap, which is part of the reason it’s so important for us to work together ;)

—laura
<https://webmaker.org/> Laura Hilliger
Training & Educational Lead
Mozilla Foundation

Email: la...@mozillafoundation.org <mailto:la...@mozillafoundation.org>
Twitter: @epilepticrabbit <http://twitter.com/epilepticrabbit>

[Jeremie Patonnier]

Hi Laura :)

2015-02-26 10:57 GMT+01:00 Laura Hilliger <la...@mozillafoundation.org>:

> Hey Jeremie,
>
> The HTML module (on training) is about 5 years old. I was going to update
> it (hence the “in development note”) when I threw it up on the training
> site sometime last year. Then, after we met in London, I redirected my
> attention, but left the content where it was. I agree with Lucy, perhaps
> you could just finish / remix that as opposed to bringing a new tutorial?
>

Regardless where this content is hosted (webmaker or MDN) it is needed, so
yes: I will do something with it. Currently, I'm in the early phase of the
work on that content which is basically figuring out what exist and what's
needed and how to shape that up.

As you can see in your etherpad, there’s tons of basic HTML content in the
> Mozilla Universe, including things from the MDN community itself.
>

Absolutely and we need to find them all. The question is not "Do we have
content", we have plenty all over the place. Actually the real issue is
that all that content is unorganized, uncategorized, unsorted,
unadvertised. It's a mess and even ourselves are totally unable to find
what we need (well, at least I'm unable to do it) so what about potential
learners... it's even worth for them so it's normal that they found
centralized ressources such as codecademy or w3school more appealing. Our
experience on MDN shown us that when we spend some time organizing and
sorting content we reach more users. The whole point of the Learning Area
is to do so: filling the gaps we have for beginners on MDN and providing
better organization and guidance through our content for learners (and if
it imply to rewrite half our content, we will do so).

> I might have missed a step, but I think there are more pressing topics?
>

To whom? Regarding MDN, HTML introductory material is one of our biggest
gap and therefor one of our top priority.

> I would encourage you to work on intermediate and advanced resources, or
> maybe start with Javascript instead.
>

Regarding intermediate and advanced resources, the whole MDN writing team
is dedicated to them. I'm the only one working on beginner content and only
part time. About JavaScript, yes, you're right. All our indicators show us
that there is a great expectation on that area. So yes, revamping, cleaning
and improving our existing JavaScript guide on MDN is part of our Q2 goals
(after the cleaning of our JS and API references which is close to done).

> I do kind of think it’s problematic to have several resources for the same
> thing when we have so many holes in our content offering...
>

Mmmh... this worth digging up a bit. As WebMaker and MDN are not addressing
the same audience, I see no problem on presenting the same content in two
different ways. I don't think this is something directly related to any
hole in our content offering. The problem is that such hole is highly
dependent on who is looking at what. I will only speak for MDN as I do not
have a full view of what Mozilla is doing (and FWIW I don't think anyone is
able to have such a full view).

So on an MDN stand point, we have good reference material and we are
covering many very advance features. What we seriously miss is content for
beginners or covering basic concepts of the most common technologies. MDN
competitors are web sites such as codecademy or w3schools. We definitely
bit them on the quality of our reference documentation but we are way
behind them in term of addressing the learning needs of beginners. Because
of that our plan are to focus on that. MDN strategy and plan on that area
have been defined months ago and nothing indicate that it needs to be
changed so far.

That said, with the whole Mozilla University project, I guess that, at some
point, we will have a better view of that global gap in the Mozilla content
offering. But currently, without better insight about what is needed where,
MDN cannot change its current content strategy as we have clear gap to fill
on our own (and performance goals attach to it. Obviously that can be
changed but it's not up to me).

> Also, I think it’s important to note that the Webmaker target audience was
> not always trainers and teachers. Nor will it always continue to be.
>

I would love to see any roadmap you could have in that area, that could
help the MDN team to adjust its own strategy if needed.

> In any case many people in our audience, while teachers, are also
> learners. We have loads of content for them as well. Webmaker and the MDN
> will always have a bit of audience overlap, which is part of the reason
> it’s so important for us to work together ;)
>

Indeed it is, and that's the main reason why I share MDN plan and ask for
help from everybody, including the whole WebMaker community :)

Best,