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clipboard problems with Firefox
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HoneyBun
Feb 9, 2016, 5:58:14 AM2/9/16
to
If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44, then rightclick,
it offers the usual Copy operation. However it won't Paste directly into a text
database such as MS Works. I must Paste it into something else first, like
Notepad, then it will Copy/Paste from there. Weird.
I blame Firefox. Typing a URL into the navigation pane sometimes
hangs for a second or two between keystrokes because it has become a
super resource & memory hog. It is often sucking
off 95%+ of processor time and 350+MB RAM.
I've tried turning off the new push operation in Firefox 44, as well as
running it in safe mode (all add-ons disabled). No effect. It isn't related
to the number of open tabs, same problem with just 1 tab open.
Also this is a fairly new, clean install of Firefox.
The above problems happen with a non-SSE2 processor and 1 GB RAM (the
max) on Windows XP. Yes, I know it's over the hill, but it's still a good
workhorse for me.
Firefox is also noticably slower than normal on my big &
fast Haswell W8.1 box. A good test is the oscars website, which
sucks resources bigtime!
WaltS48
Feb 9, 2016, 7:37:11 AM2/9/16
to
On 02/09/2016 05:58 AM, HoneyBun wrote:
> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44, then
> rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However it won't Paste
> directly into a text database such as MS Works. I must Paste it into
> something else first, like Notepad, then it will Copy/Paste from there.
> Weird.
>
Are you sure it isn't the MS Works-last released in 2007-that is the
> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44, then
> rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However it won't Paste
> directly into a text database such as MS Works. I must Paste it into
> something else first, like Notepad, then it will Copy/Paste from there.
> Weird.
>
problem?
> I blame Firefox. Typing a URL into the navigation pane sometimes hangs
> for a second or two between keystrokes because it has become a
> super resource & memory hog. It is often sucking off 95%+ of processor
> time and 350+MB RAM.
>
> I've tried turning off the new push operation in Firefox 44, as well as
> running it in safe mode (all add-ons disabled). No effect. It isn't
> related to the number of open tabs, same problem with just 1 tab open.
> Also this is a fairly new, clean install of Firefox.
>
> The above problems happen with a non-SSE2 processor and 1 GB RAM (the
> max) on Windows XP. Yes, I know it's over the hill, but it's still a
> good workhorse for me.
>
> Firefox is also noticably slower than normal on my big & fast Haswell
> W8.1 box. A good test is the oscars website, which sucks resources bigtime!
> http://oscar.go.com/
5.7 seconds using Firefox 45.0b3, on my PC with a a 3.2Ghz CPU and 8 GB RAM.
--
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B00ze
Feb 9, 2016, 8:44:54 PM2/9/16
to
On 2016-02-09 05:58, HoneyBun <sw...@as.silk> wrote:
> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44, then
> rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However it won't Paste
> directly into a text database such as MS Works. I must Paste it into
> something else first, like Notepad, then it will Copy/Paste from there.
> Weird.
There's a thread on the firefox newsgroup about someone with problems
> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44, then
> rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However it won't Paste
> directly into a text database such as MS Works. I must Paste it into
> something else first, like Notepad, then it will Copy/Paste from there.
> Weird.
pasting text-only starting with FF44. Might be related, since you say
you must go through Notepad to get it to paste...
From: PietB <opt...@opt-in.invalid>
Subject: FF 44.0 and Paste special
Date: Thu, 4 Feb 2016 12:43:05 +0100
Newsgroups: mozilla.support.firefox
Message-ID: <mailman.556.1454586222...@lists.mozilla.org>
Regards,
--
! _\|/_ Sylvain / B00...@hotmail.com
! (o o) Member-+-David-Suzuki-Fdn/EFF/Red+Cross/Planetary-Society-+-
oO-( )-Oo "Captain ... one ... harmless ... little ... Tribble?"
HoneyBun
Feb 9, 2016, 11:01:45 PM2/9/16
to
"B00ze" <B00...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:QJadnaJ0uJyICyfL...@mozilla.org...
I can look at it from google if they still handle it(?).
news:QJadnaJ0uJyICyfL...@mozilla.org...
> On 2016-02-09 05:58, HoneyBun <sw...@as.silk> wrote:
>
>> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44, then
>> rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However it won't Paste
>> directly into a text database such as MS Works. I must Paste it into
>> something else first, like Notepad, then it will Copy/Paste from there.
>> Weird.
>
> There's a thread on the firefox newsgroup about someone with problems
> pasting text-only starting with FF44. Might be related, since you say you
> must go through Notepad to get it to paste...
Thanks, but can't get the firefox NG to work for the last year or so. Maybe
>
>> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44, then
>> rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However it won't Paste
>> directly into a text database such as MS Works. I must Paste it into
>> something else first, like Notepad, then it will Copy/Paste from there.
>> Weird.
>
> There's a thread on the firefox newsgroup about someone with problems
> pasting text-only starting with FF44. Might be related, since you say you
> must go through Notepad to get it to paste...
I can look at it from google if they still handle it(?).
Ed Mullen
Feb 9, 2016, 11:05:44 PM2/9/16
to
- what program are you using to try to access it?
- what settings do you have?
Provide some details and we can help.
--
Ed Mullen
http://edmullen.net/
A conclusion is the place where you got tired of thinking.
HoneyBun
Feb 11, 2016, 2:04:20 AM2/11/16
to
"WaltS48" <thali...@REMOVEaim.om> wrote in message
news:8dWdnXv_fq3rQCTL...@mozilla.org...
The same thing happens whether I'm highlighting and trying to copy text from
the body of a website, or the URL from the navigation pane. It won't paste
into MS Works. I must paste into something else first, such as Notepad, then
it will Copy/Paste into MS Works from there.
Problem discovered with Firefox 44 and MS Works 7 on XP.
Exactly same problem with Firefox 44 and MS Work 9 on W8.1.
No problems with IE8 and MS Works 7 on XP.
No problems with Chrome34 and MS Works 7 on XP.
No problems with IE11 with MS Works 9 on W8.1.
I don't have an older version of Firefox available to test, but suspect the
problem starts in recent versions (probably 40+).
Recent versions of Firefox are screwing up the basic Copy & Paste operations
of Windows via the clipboard, no doubt whatsoever.
Or I suppose we could call it an incompatibility between Firefox and MS
Works. I hope others running MS Works will confirm. Those running other
databases might also try it and report back.
No, I won't bother to try to report it as a bug to Mozilla. How could I
argue that it's important to keep Firefox compatible with MS Works which was
deserted by MS years ago, yet many such as I still use it? The Mozilla bug
reporting process is a nightmare anyway. I only know enough to stay far far
far away! :)
But maybe someone should let them know(?).
I've done all I can, and intend to do, hereby.
I'll simply use a different browser when MS Works is involved.
news:8dWdnXv_fq3rQCTL...@mozilla.org...
> On 02/09/2016 05:58 AM, HoneyBun wrote:
>> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44, then
>> rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However it won't Paste
>> directly into a text database such as MS Works. I must Paste it into
>> something else first, like Notepad, then it will Copy/Paste from there.
>> Weird.
>>
>
> Are you sure it isn't the MS Works-last released in 2007-that is the
> problem?
>
>> I blame Firefox. Typing a URL into the navigation pane sometimes hangs
>> for a second or two between keystrokes because it has become a
>> super resource & memory hog. It is often sucking off 95%+ of processor
>> time and 350+MB RAM.
>>
>> I've tried turning off the new push operation in Firefox 44, as well as
>> running it in safe mode (all add-ons disabled). No effect. It isn't
>> related to the number of open tabs, same problem with just 1 tab open.
>> Also this is a fairly new, clean install of Firefox.
>>
>> The above problems happen with a non-SSE2 processor and 1 GB RAM (the
>> max) on Windows XP. Yes, I know it's over the hill, but it's still a
>> good workhorse for me.
Yes, I'm sure Firefox is the culprit.
>> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44, then
>> rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However it won't Paste
>> directly into a text database such as MS Works. I must Paste it into
>> something else first, like Notepad, then it will Copy/Paste from there.
>> Weird.
>>
>
> Are you sure it isn't the MS Works-last released in 2007-that is the
> problem?
>
>> I blame Firefox. Typing a URL into the navigation pane sometimes hangs
>> for a second or two between keystrokes because it has become a
>> super resource & memory hog. It is often sucking off 95%+ of processor
>> time and 350+MB RAM.
>>
>> I've tried turning off the new push operation in Firefox 44, as well as
>> running it in safe mode (all add-ons disabled). No effect. It isn't
>> related to the number of open tabs, same problem with just 1 tab open.
>> Also this is a fairly new, clean install of Firefox.
>>
>> The above problems happen with a non-SSE2 processor and 1 GB RAM (the
>> max) on Windows XP. Yes, I know it's over the hill, but it's still a
>> good workhorse for me.
The same thing happens whether I'm highlighting and trying to copy text from
the body of a website, or the URL from the navigation pane. It won't paste
into MS Works. I must paste into something else first, such as Notepad, then
it will Copy/Paste into MS Works from there.
Problem discovered with Firefox 44 and MS Works 7 on XP.
Exactly same problem with Firefox 44 and MS Work 9 on W8.1.
No problems with IE8 and MS Works 7 on XP.
No problems with Chrome34 and MS Works 7 on XP.
No problems with IE11 with MS Works 9 on W8.1.
I don't have an older version of Firefox available to test, but suspect the
problem starts in recent versions (probably 40+).
Recent versions of Firefox are screwing up the basic Copy & Paste operations
of Windows via the clipboard, no doubt whatsoever.
Or I suppose we could call it an incompatibility between Firefox and MS
Works. I hope others running MS Works will confirm. Those running other
databases might also try it and report back.
No, I won't bother to try to report it as a bug to Mozilla. How could I
argue that it's important to keep Firefox compatible with MS Works which was
deserted by MS years ago, yet many such as I still use it? The Mozilla bug
reporting process is a nightmare anyway. I only know enough to stay far far
far away! :)
But maybe someone should let them know(?).
I've done all I can, and intend to do, hereby.
I'll simply use a different browser when MS Works is involved.
HoneyBun
Feb 11, 2016, 2:27:55 AM2/11/16
to
"Ed Mullen" <ejEM...@edmullen.net> wrote in message
news:P4idnUvmbeKFKifL...@mozilla.org...
Really!
I thought everyone here was far too arrogant to try to help poor little ole
me, but here goes nothing...
Exactly same software and settings as I'm using with this NG.
Outlook Express in Windows XP, port 119 NNTP.
It works fine with all newsgroups I've ever tried over the past 15+ years
except the Mozilla.Firefox one. It used to work, but my posts stopped
appearing there a year or two ago, so I lost interest and deleted it. It's
no help without 2-way communications.
I understand that's because they've got some weirdo moderator who thinks his
sh*t smells and tastes like ice cream, so he threw a monkey wrench into it
somehow. He responds here too occasionally with his snide remarks,
apparently doesn't like criticism. Same as any dictator, anytime, anywhere.
So far he hasn't been able to cut off this NG too, but probably will if he
can.
Thus I'm now using this Mozilla.General NG for all Firefox-related
questions.
At least, that's my story, and I'm sticking to it... :o))
news:P4idnUvmbeKFKifL...@mozilla.org...
I thought everyone here was far too arrogant to try to help poor little ole
me, but here goes nothing...
Exactly same software and settings as I'm using with this NG.
Outlook Express in Windows XP, port 119 NNTP.
It works fine with all newsgroups I've ever tried over the past 15+ years
except the Mozilla.Firefox one. It used to work, but my posts stopped
appearing there a year or two ago, so I lost interest and deleted it. It's
no help without 2-way communications.
I understand that's because they've got some weirdo moderator who thinks his
sh*t smells and tastes like ice cream, so he threw a monkey wrench into it
somehow. He responds here too occasionally with his snide remarks,
apparently doesn't like criticism. Same as any dictator, anytime, anywhere.
So far he hasn't been able to cut off this NG too, but probably will if he
can.
Thus I'm now using this Mozilla.General NG for all Firefox-related
questions.
At least, that's my story, and I'm sticking to it... :o))
WaltS48
Feb 11, 2016, 6:53:33 AM2/11/16
to
> Thus I'm now using this Mozilla.General NG for all Firefox-related
> questions.
>
> At least, that's my story, and I'm sticking to it... :o))
>
>
You could still read the Firefox support newsgroup. Your problem might
> questions.
>
> At least, that's my story, and I'm sticking to it... :o))
>
>
have been already covered there, or others that may crop up for you.
Wolf K.
Feb 11, 2016, 9:20:26 AM2/11/16
to
On 2016-02-11 02:04, HoneyBun wrote:
[...]
I have no problem Copy/Pasting URLs and other text from Firefox into
miscellaneous documents. See below.
The problem is with MS Works, a discontinued program. Replace it. Tip:
Before you replace it, Save As all your documents as *.txt or *.rtf
files. "File compatibility" is a bit iffy between MS programs.
Copy pasted from FF:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Works
Microsoft Works is a discontinued office suite developed by Microsoft.
I suggest you read the article, it will help you transition to a new
product.
Have a good day,
--
Best,
Wolf K.
kirkwood40.blogspot.ca
[...]
> The same thing happens whether I'm highlighting and trying to copy text from
> the body of a website, or the URL from the navigation pane. It won't paste
> into MS Works. I must paste into something else first, such as Notepad, then
> it will Copy/Paste into MS Works from there.
[...]
> the body of a website, or the URL from the navigation pane. It won't paste
> into MS Works. I must paste into something else first, such as Notepad, then
> it will Copy/Paste into MS Works from there.
I have no problem Copy/Pasting URLs and other text from Firefox into
miscellaneous documents. See below.
The problem is with MS Works, a discontinued program. Replace it. Tip:
Before you replace it, Save As all your documents as *.txt or *.rtf
files. "File compatibility" is a bit iffy between MS programs.
Copy pasted from FF:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Works
Microsoft Works is a discontinued office suite developed by Microsoft.
I suggest you read the article, it will help you transition to a new
product.
Have a good day,
--
Best,
Wolf K.
kirkwood40.blogspot.ca
PietB
Feb 11, 2016, 10:58:54 AM2/11/16
to
HoneyBun wrote:
> Yes, I'm sure Firefox is the culprit.
>
> The same thing happens whether I'm highlighting and trying to copy text from
> the body of a website, or the URL from the navigation pane. It won't paste
> into MS Works. I must paste into something else first, such as Notepad, then
> it will Copy/Paste into MS Works from there.
>
> Problem discovered with Firefox 44 and MS Works 7 on XP.
> Exactly same problem with Firefox 44 and MS Work 9 on W8.1.
> No problems with IE8 and MS Works 7 on XP.
> No problems with Chrome34 and MS Works 7 on XP.
> No problems with IE11 with MS Works 9 on W8.1.
>
> I don't have an older version of Firefox available to test, but suspect the
> problem starts in recent versions (probably 40+).
> Recent versions of Firefox are screwing up the basic Copy & Paste operations
> of Windows via the clipboard, no doubt whatsoever.
Agreed. Sounds similar to the "FF 44.0 and Paste special" problem
> Yes, I'm sure Firefox is the culprit.
>
> The same thing happens whether I'm highlighting and trying to copy text from
> the body of a website, or the URL from the navigation pane. It won't paste
> into MS Works. I must paste into something else first, such as Notepad, then
> it will Copy/Paste into MS Works from there.
>
> Problem discovered with Firefox 44 and MS Works 7 on XP.
> Exactly same problem with Firefox 44 and MS Work 9 on W8.1.
> No problems with IE8 and MS Works 7 on XP.
> No problems with Chrome34 and MS Works 7 on XP.
> No problems with IE11 with MS Works 9 on W8.1.
>
> I don't have an older version of Firefox available to test, but suspect the
> problem starts in recent versions (probably 40+).
> Recent versions of Firefox are screwing up the basic Copy & Paste operations
> of Windows via the clipboard, no doubt whatsoever.
I described in m.s.firefox, a problem that started with FF 44.0 and
that doesn't show up with *any* other browser. Enough reason for me
to revert to FF 43.0.4 and stay there.
You may want to revert to FF 43.0.4 too:
https://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/firefox/releases/43.0.4/win32/en-US/Firefox%20Setup%2043.0.4.exe
-p
HoneyBun
Feb 11, 2016, 11:00:29 AM2/11/16
to
"Wolf K." <wol...@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:2cKdnSojV480BSHL...@mozilla.org...
Not the solution for me. I've used MS Works for 15+ years and it does
everything I want. I will never change it. However I may change browsers
unless Firefox fixes this bug.
news:2cKdnSojV480BSHL...@mozilla.org...
everything I want. I will never change it. However I may change browsers
unless Firefox fixes this bug.
HoneyBun
Feb 11, 2016, 11:07:52 AM2/11/16
to
"PietB" <opt...@opt-in.invalid> wrote in message
news:FK2dndpA2fQgMiHL...@mozilla.org...
back. If that fixed it, should be very strong proof when combined with my
prior tests, plus whatever you've done...
HoneyBun
Feb 11, 2016, 11:13:19 AM2/11/16
to
"WaltS48" <thali...@REMOVEaim.om> wrote in message
news:he6dnS1Yvcmg6yHL...@mozilla.org...
that sh*t for brains moderator...
HoneyBun
Feb 11, 2016, 12:35:32 PM2/11/16
to
"HoneyBun" <sw...@as.silk> wrote in message
news:TKednQzgUo1KLCHL...@mozilla.org...
Yes, that fixes it!
Firefox 43.0.4 works fine to copy/cut/paste from Firefox into MS Works!
So Firefox version 44.0 definitely introduces a bug which wreaks havoc on
Windows copy/cut/paste operations!? Zero percent doubt now, IMO.
My hunch, something to do with clipboard pointers or javascript, but I'm
just guessing. Hopefully someone will send the Mozilla team a smoke signal.
In the meantime I'll stick with 43.0.4 or until I hear this is fixed.
Thanks for everyone's help here... :)
news:TKednQzgUo1KLCHL...@mozilla.org...
Firefox 43.0.4 works fine to copy/cut/paste from Firefox into MS Works!
So Firefox version 44.0 definitely introduces a bug which wreaks havoc on
Windows copy/cut/paste operations!? Zero percent doubt now, IMO.
My hunch, something to do with clipboard pointers or javascript, but I'm
just guessing. Hopefully someone will send the Mozilla team a smoke signal.
In the meantime I'll stick with 43.0.4 or until I hear this is fixed.
Thanks for everyone's help here... :)
PietB
Feb 11, 2016, 12:52:47 PM2/11/16
to
HoneyBun wrote:
but it's quite clear that the way FF 44 copies to the clipboard breaks
*backward compatibility*, which is a Bad Thing.
-p
>> PietB wrote:
>>> Agreed. Sounds similar to the "FF 44.0 and Paste special" problem
>>> I described in m.s.firefox, a problem that started with FF 44.0 and
>>> that doesn't show up with *any* other browser. Enough reason for me
>>> to revert to FF 43.0.4 and stay there.
>>>
>>> You may want to revert to FF 43.0.4 too:
>>> https://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/firefox/releases/43.0.4/win32/en-US/Firefox%20Setup%2043.0.4.exe
>
>>> Agreed. Sounds similar to the "FF 44.0 and Paste special" problem
>>> I described in m.s.firefox, a problem that started with FF 44.0 and
>>> that doesn't show up with *any* other browser. Enough reason for me
>>> to revert to FF 43.0.4 and stay there.
>>>
>>> You may want to revert to FF 43.0.4 too:
>>> https://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/firefox/releases/43.0.4/win32/en-US/Firefox%20Setup%2043.0.4.exe
>
> Yes, that fixes it!
>
> Firefox 43.0.4 works fine to copy/cut/paste from Firefox into MS Works!
>
> So Firefox version 44.0 definitely introduces a bug which wreaks havoc
> on Windows copy/cut/paste operations!? Zero percent doubt now, IMO.
Not in general, because it works with newer software (e.g. LibreOffice),
>
> Firefox 43.0.4 works fine to copy/cut/paste from Firefox into MS Works!
>
> So Firefox version 44.0 definitely introduces a bug which wreaks havoc
> on Windows copy/cut/paste operations!? Zero percent doubt now, IMO.
but it's quite clear that the way FF 44 copies to the clipboard breaks
*backward compatibility*, which is a Bad Thing.
-p
WaltS48
Feb 11, 2016, 12:53:06 PM2/11/16
to
HoneyBun
Feb 11, 2016, 3:24:19 PM2/11/16
to
"WaltS48" <thali...@REMOVEaim.om> wrote in message
news:OJKdnVaH0bsfVyHL...@mozilla.org...
> You can send a smoke signal here.
Jim Fisher
Feb 11, 2016, 3:50:02 PM2/11/16
to gen...@lists.mozilla.org
and MS Excel (all part of the old Office 2000 suite) and Libre Office 5 Base
with no problems. It looks to me like a specific FF/Works incompatibility (I've
never used Works so I can't test that).
Jim Fisher
--
http://www.jimella.me.uk - my personal web site covering many subjects (not
currently working - hosting company problems)
http://jimellame.tumblr.com - My thoughts on freedom
http://jimella.wordpress.com - political snippets, especially economic policy
http://jimella.livejournal.com - misc. snippets, some political, some not
Forget Google! I search with https://duckduckgo.com which doesn't spy on you
Ron Hunter
Feb 11, 2016, 4:07:50 PM2/11/16
to
Ron Hunter
Feb 11, 2016, 4:09:54 PM2/11/16
to
Ed Mullen
Feb 11, 2016, 10:19:44 PM2/11/16
to
"I have not failed, I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work." -
Thomas Edison
Ed Mullen
Feb 11, 2016, 10:21:47 PM2/11/16
to
interoperability issues with it. Move on, grow up, get real, get into
the 21st century.
PietB
Feb 12, 2016, 5:01:02 AM2/12/16
to
Ed Mullen wrote:
> MS Works is obsolete and no one is ever going to do anything
> address any interoperability issues with it.
MS Works is not the issue. Backward compatibility is the issue,
> MS Works is obsolete and no one is ever going to do anything
> address any interoperability issues with it.
in something as basic as the clipboard. Whole generations have
learned to conserve backward compatibility.
> Move on, grow up, get real, get into the 21st century.
it's the moz devs who have to "get real". Maybe they should
consult the devs of other browser, who have shown that they
still manage to do things properly.
Even so I'm not convinced that breaking backward compatibility
in copying to the clipboard is intentional. Rather I suspect
that it's a glitch, accidentally introduced along with some
"improvement" (which Ballmer types try to sell you as "getting
into the 21st century").
-p
HoneyBun
Feb 12, 2016, 7:05:56 AM2/12/16
to
"PietB" <opt...@opt-in.invalid> wrote in message
news:KYydnS4S1Y3AMCDL...@mozilla.org...
come for free on OEM computers so many millions of people adopted it as
their first office suite. It still continues today via free MS Works 9 which
works fine on W7/W8/W10. My old MS Works documents going back 15+ years are
still compatible. It does everything I want/need to do. Newer is not better.
Wolf K.
Feb 12, 2016, 9:27:32 AM2/12/16
to
On 2016-02-12 05:01, PietB wrote:
> Ed Mullen wrote:
>> >MS Works is obsolete and no one is ever going to do anything
>> >address any interoperability issues with it.
> MS Works is not the issue. Backward compatibility is the issue,
> in something as basic as the clipboard. Whole generations have
> learned to conserve backward compatibility. [...]
> Ed Mullen wrote:
>> >MS Works is obsolete and no one is ever going to do anything
>> >address any interoperability issues with it.
> MS Works is not the issue. Backward compatibility is the issue,
> in something as basic as the clipboard. Whole generations have
"Backwards compatibility" is easy for file formats, but it's difficult
and often impossible to do with programs and OSs. Windows has made the
clipboard an applet inside the OS. To rewrite the clipboard so that MS
Works can use it would mean that other programs would have to be rewritten.
There comes a time when an old program is no longer usable. Case in
point: Mozilla no longer guarantees operability of updated Firefox on XP
and earlier. If OP really wants to keep MS Works, they could of course
go back to an earlier Windows version, or even to DOS.
Ideally, OSs would be mere kernels, adaptable to whatever hardware you
want to use. The bothersome bit are the interfaces between OS and
programs, the APIs. These are proprietary, so that programs have to be
"ported" between OSs. There's no technical reason we couldn't have a
universal API, so that the variable, proprietary part would be only on
the OS side. That would concentrate development on making both OS and
programs more efficient. Keep in mind that the user interface is a
program. As it is, both OSs and programs are becoming more intertwined,
and more bloated. Even Linux are drifting apart so that some programs
now have to be tweaked for different Linuxes.
Oh well, occasional fantasising ideal worlds is fun. :-)
Wolf K.
Feb 12, 2016, 9:48:00 AM2/12/16
to
On 2016-02-12 05:01, PietB wrote:
[...]
> Even so I'm not convinced that breaking backward compatibility
> in copying to the clipboard is intentional. Rather I suspect
> that it's a glitch, accidentally introduced along with some
> "improvement" (which Ballmer types try to sell you as "getting
> into the 21st century").
MS Works is no longer an MS program:
> in copying to the clipboard is intentional. Rather I suspect
> that it's a glitch, accidentally introduced along with some
> "improvement" (which Ballmer types try to sell you as "getting
> into the 21st century").
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Works
The current MS Works seems to be a development by a 3rd party:
http://msworks.com/
As such, I wouldn't bet on backward compatibility with anything except
old file formats.
Nor would I bet one way or the other on whether the glitch is in MS
Works or in Firefox.
Have a good day,
HoneyBun
Feb 12, 2016, 11:51:44 AM2/12/16
to
"Wolf K." <wol...@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:HqadnRHArvQCbSDL...@mozilla.org...
with MS Works, Firefox 44 doesn't...
PietB
Feb 16, 2016, 5:08:17 AM2/16/16
to
Wolf K. wrote:
> PietB wrote:
>> Ed Mullen wrote:
>>>> MS Works is obsolete and no one is ever going to do anything
>>>> address any interoperability issues with it.
>>
>> MS Works is not the issue. Backward compatibility is the issue,
>> in something as basic as the clipboard. Whole generations have
>> learned to conserve backward compatibility. [...]
>
> "Backwards compatibility" is easy for file formats, but it's difficult
> and often impossible to do with programs and OSs. Windows has made the
> clipboard an applet inside the OS. To rewrite the clipboard so that MS
> Works can use it would mean that other programs would have to be rewritten.
Plain nonsense. Read what I wrote. It's *not* about MS works.
> PietB wrote:
>> Ed Mullen wrote:
>>>> MS Works is obsolete and no one is ever going to do anything
>>>> address any interoperability issues with it.
>>
>> MS Works is not the issue. Backward compatibility is the issue,
>> in something as basic as the clipboard. Whole generations have
>> learned to conserve backward compatibility. [...]
>
> "Backwards compatibility" is easy for file formats, but it's difficult
> and often impossible to do with programs and OSs. Windows has made the
> clipboard an applet inside the OS. To rewrite the clipboard so that MS
> Works can use it would mean that other programs would have to be rewritten.
It's *not* about old OS's like Win XP. It's about old programs
that work just fine under Win7, Win8 and Win10. And it's about
new software that knows how to deal with the clipboard. Which
implies it has nothing to do with 'clipboard as an applet' or
'rewriting the clipboard'. It just works. Period. Except for
one broken browser: FF 44.
> There comes a time when an old program is no longer usable.
software is no longer usable. Like FF 44.
> Case in point: Mozilla no longer guarantees operability of updated Firefox
> on XP and earlier. If OP really wants to keep MS Works
is that they'll keep *changing*.
> they could of course go back to an earlier Windows version, or even to DOS.
productive approach.
-p
WaltS48
Feb 16, 2016, 8:29:24 AM2/16/16
to
Although I could not reproduce it, with my 44.0.2, and I don't have
version 40 mentioned in the original post.
HoneyBun
Feb 16, 2016, 12:08:47 PM2/16/16
to
"WaltS48" <thali...@REMOVEaim.om> wrote in message
culprit was 44.0, while 43.0.4 works fine.
There are way too many Firefox versions to try everything! So I never tried
your 44.0.2, and have no idea if it fixed the problem. I suppose we might
find out in 45.
Firefox 44.0 is incompatible with MS Works 7 on XP, and MS Works 9 on W8.1
re the copy/cut/paste commands going from Firefox into MS Works. The Paste
command is grayed out in the context menu and doesn't work via the keyboard
shortcut Ctrl-V either. The only way is to use an intermediary such as
Notepad.
I looked briefly but couldn't find any stats on how many people still use MS
Works, but suspect it's in the million+ range. It used to come for free on
most OEM computers. It's not dead because MS Works 9 is still available,
works fine on all Windows versions, and is backward compatible with former
versions of Works.
Ron Hunter
Feb 16, 2016, 2:08:25 PM2/16/16
to
'feature' of clearing the Windows clipboard when exiting Firefox.
Annoying! It has long had a problem with inputting things into other
apps from the clipboard.
Mike Easter
Feb 16, 2016, 6:14:28 PM2/16/16
to
HoneyBun wrote:
> I looked briefly but couldn't find any stats on how many people still use MS
> Works, but suspect it's in the million+ range. It used to come for free on
> most OEM computers. It's not dead because MS Works 9 is still available,
> works fine on all Windows versions, and is backward compatible with former
> versions of Works.
I have a Compaq XP machine with MS Works 8 which I still use on that
> I looked briefly but couldn't find any stats on how many people still use MS
> Works, but suspect it's in the million+ range. It used to come for free on
> most OEM computers. It's not dead because MS Works 9 is still available,
> works fine on all Windows versions, and is backward compatible with former
> versions of Works.
machine. Most of the time I'm on other machines or in other OSes and
use Libre Office, usually in a linux.
--
Mike Easter
Mike Easter
Feb 16, 2016, 8:30:41 PM2/16/16
to
HoneyBun wrote:
> The above problems happen with a non-SSE2 processor
That non-sse2 cpu is a significant problem/deficiency. I have one of
> The above problems happen with a non-SSE2 processor
those; it can't run browsers like chromium or chrome. So, that is the
only machine I use Firefox as a browser (which does tolerate non-sse2),
except when I'm running live linux distros which typically have firefox
as the default.
sse2 was first intro'd by intel in the P4 in 2001. My cpu deficiency is
because of an old AMD cpu called Geode. The AMD Athlon XP was intro'd
in 2001 and it did NOT do SSE2, which AMD didn't get around to until 2003.
--
Mike Easter
»Q«
Feb 17, 2016, 12:26:58 PM2/17/16
to
In <news:ZI2dnX9cHZvdUF7L...@mozilla.org>,
<https://chuttenblog.wordpress.com/2016/02/10/sse2-support-in-firefox-users/>.
It has a quick overview of the history of instruction sets, some
telemetry data, and some thoughts about why they may drop support for
non-sse2 processors eventually, in the author's opinion "soon".
Excerpts:
If Mozilla can’t assume that everyone running Firefox has a computer
capable of running SSE2, Firefox has to detect, at runtime, whether
the user’s computer is capable of using that fast path.
This makes Firefox bigger, slower, and harder to test and maintain.
and
SSE2 will probably be coming soon as a system requirement for
Firefox. I hope all of our users are ready for when that happens.
Mike Easter <Mi...@ster.invalid> wrote:
> That non-sse2 cpu is a significant problem/deficiency. I have one of
> those; it can't run browsers like chromium or chrome. So, that is
> the only machine I use Firefox as a browser (which does tolerate
> non-sse2), except when I'm running live linux distros which typically
> have firefox as the default.
You might be interested in
> That non-sse2 cpu is a significant problem/deficiency. I have one of
> those; it can't run browsers like chromium or chrome. So, that is
> the only machine I use Firefox as a browser (which does tolerate
> non-sse2), except when I'm running live linux distros which typically
> have firefox as the default.
<https://chuttenblog.wordpress.com/2016/02/10/sse2-support-in-firefox-users/>.
It has a quick overview of the history of instruction sets, some
telemetry data, and some thoughts about why they may drop support for
non-sse2 processors eventually, in the author's opinion "soon".
Excerpts:
If Mozilla can’t assume that everyone running Firefox has a computer
capable of running SSE2, Firefox has to detect, at runtime, whether
the user’s computer is capable of using that fast path.
This makes Firefox bigger, slower, and harder to test and maintain.
and
SSE2 will probably be coming soon as a system requirement for
Firefox. I hope all of our users are ready for when that happens.
Mike Easter
Feb 17, 2016, 1:34:03 PM2/17/16
to
»Q« wrote:
follow a similar history line.
He sez 99.5% of those reporting telemetry are sse2 capable, and they are
almost all XP, not linux.
And that they are almost all running current v./s of ffx, not older
v./s. So HoneyBun would shift into the group who is non-sse2 but
running an older ffx because of the issue of this thread
So, what I would 'have to do' on this machine would be run some older v.
of ffx when the newer v./s drop support of non-sse2.
I have an XP machine on which I prefer Chrome which won't update for XP,
so I run an older Chrome there. It can sse2. Eventually old browsers
won't work satisfactorily, but I don't use that machine for websurfing
anyway.
For that machine, I would eventually abandon the XP in favor of some
linux plus some Win7. For this machine I would continue to use some
older v. of ffx until that didn't work satisfactorily any more.
Typically, eventually old hardware has something 'major' die, at which
time I scrap the hardware and salvage anything in there which is worth
keeping.
--
Mike Easter
> Mike Easter wrote:
>
>> That non-sse2 cpu is a significant problem/deficiency. I have one of
>> those; it can't run browsers like chromium or chrome. S
>
>> That non-sse2 cpu is a significant problem/deficiency. I have one of
>> those; it can't run browsers like chromium or chrome. S
> You might be interested in
> <https://chuttenblog.wordpress.com/2016/02/10/sse2-support-in-firefox-users/>.
That's a nice article. One has to 'hop around' in the wikipedia to
> <https://chuttenblog.wordpress.com/2016/02/10/sse2-support-in-firefox-users/>.
follow a similar history line.
He sez 99.5% of those reporting telemetry are sse2 capable, and they are
almost all XP, not linux.
And that they are almost all running current v./s of ffx, not older
v./s. So HoneyBun would shift into the group who is non-sse2 but
running an older ffx because of the issue of this thread
So, what I would 'have to do' on this machine would be run some older v.
of ffx when the newer v./s drop support of non-sse2.
I have an XP machine on which I prefer Chrome which won't update for XP,
so I run an older Chrome there. It can sse2. Eventually old browsers
won't work satisfactorily, but I don't use that machine for websurfing
anyway.
For that machine, I would eventually abandon the XP in favor of some
linux plus some Win7. For this machine I would continue to use some
older v. of ffx until that didn't work satisfactorily any more.
Typically, eventually old hardware has something 'major' die, at which
time I scrap the hardware and salvage anything in there which is worth
keeping.
--
Mike Easter
HoneyBun
Feb 17, 2016, 3:53:40 PM2/17/16
to
"Mike Easter" <Mi...@ster.invalid> wrote in message
news:zfCdne5R9-KEIFnL...@mozilla.org...
Maybe they could include a fix. Malwarebytes does for non-SSE2 processors.
Works fine. All it would require would be a quick check to see if the
processor is SSE2 capable, then sets some flags or goes into an appropriate
code subroutine, surely easy enough for smart programmers. Alternately
include a user option, although I realize they're trying to get rid of as
many of those as possible.
news:zfCdne5R9-KEIFnL...@mozilla.org...
Works fine. All it would require would be a quick check to see if the
processor is SSE2 capable, then sets some flags or goes into an appropriate
code subroutine, surely easy enough for smart programmers. Alternately
include a user option, although I realize they're trying to get rid of as
many of those as possible.
HoneyBun
May 2, 2016, 6:45:15 PM5/2/16
to
"HoneyBun" <sw...@as.silk> wrote
in message news:kZ-dnSx2C5zYWyTL...@mozilla.org...
If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44, then rightclick,
it offers the usual Copy operation. However it won't Paste directly into a text
database such as MS Works. I must Paste it into something else first, like
Notepad, then it will Copy/Paste from there. Weird.
...
==================
That glitch has been fixed in Firefox 46.0
--
HoneyBun
geo
May 2, 2016, 8:11:34 PM5/2/16
to
On 05/02/16 17:45, HoneyBun wrote:
> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44,
> then rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However
> it won't Paste directly into a text database such as MS Works.
> I must Paste it into something else first, like Notepad, then
> it will Copy/Paste from there. Weird.
>
try this, double left click location in url bar, then center click
in ms works and notepad.
does that paste to both?
--
peace out.
If Bill Gates got a dime for every time Windows crashes...
...oh, wait. He does. THAT explains it!
-+-
in a world with out fences, who needs gates.
CentOS GNU/Linux 6.7
tc,hago.
g
.
WaltS48
May 2, 2016, 9:13:24 PM5/2/16
to
On 05/02/2016 08:11 PM, geo wrote:
>
> On 05/02/16 17:45, HoneyBun wrote:
>
>> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44,
>> then rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However
>> it won't Paste directly into a text database such as MS Works.
>> I must Paste it into something else first, like Notepad, then
>> it will Copy/Paste from there. Weird.
>>
> ===>
>
> try this, double left click location in url bar, then center click
> in ms works and notepad.
>
> does that paste to both?
>
>
I thought the part you snipped indicated it was fixed in Firefox 46?
>
> On 05/02/16 17:45, HoneyBun wrote:
>
>> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44,
>> then rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However
>> it won't Paste directly into a text database such as MS Works.
>> I must Paste it into something else first, like Notepad, then
>> it will Copy/Paste from there. Weird.
>>
> ===>
>
> try this, double left click location in url bar, then center click
> in ms works and notepad.
>
> does that paste to both?
>
>
--
Linux Mint 17.3
Go Pens! Go Bucs!
geo
May 2, 2016, 10:30:41 PM5/2/16
to
On 05/02/16 20:13, WaltS48 wrote:
> On 05/02/2016 08:11 PM, geo wrote:
>> On 05/02/16 17:45, HoneyBun wrote:
>>
>>> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44,
>>> then rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However
>>> it won't Paste directly into a text database such as MS Works.
>>> I must Paste it into something else first, like Notepad, then
>>> it will Copy/Paste from there. Weird.
>>>
>> ===>
>>
>> try this, double left click location in url bar, then center click
>> in ms works and notepad.
>>
>> does that paste to both?
>
> I thought the part you snipped indicated it was fixed in Firefox 46?
>
such may be so.
my reply was to Honey Bun and problem s/he is having with
firefox 44.
what i posted should work with any release of near all programs
because it is a 'standard' operation of mouse pointer operations.
or so i have found to be for many years.
then again, with oos, who knows what is 'standard' any more. ;=)
HoneyBun
May 3, 2016, 3:30:36 AM5/3/16
to
"geo" <gel...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:u_KdnXqWQO_NkLXK...@mozilla.org...
I've seldom used center click, by which you presumably mean clicking the
roller wheel on the mouse. That's not very reliable with my mouse so I
ignore it. I only use the roller wheel to scroll.
To copy...
Highlight what you want to copy, then rightclick and select copy, or press
Ctrl-C on the keyboard. Either method should load the item into clipboard.
Then to paste...
Rightclick the destination and select paste, or press Ctrl-V on keyboard.
Both methods failed with Firefox 44 to copy/paste something from the Firefox
navigation bar directly into MS Works. But it works fine with Firefox 46.
That's all I care about.
Thanks, and have a nice day!
news:u_KdnXqWQO_NkLXK...@mozilla.org...
>
>
> On 05/02/16 20:13, WaltS48 wrote:
>> On 05/02/2016 08:11 PM, geo wrote:
>>> On 05/02/16 17:45, HoneyBun wrote:
>>>
>>>> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44,
>>>> then rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However
>>>> it won't Paste directly into a text database such as MS Works.
>>>> I must Paste it into something else first, like Notepad, then
>>>> it will Copy/Paste from there. Weird.
>>>>
>>> ===>
>>>
>>> try this, double left click location in url bar, then center click
>>> in ms works and notepad.
>>>
>>> does that paste to both?
>>
>> I thought the part you snipped indicated it was fixed in Firefox 46?
>>
> ===>
>
> such may be so.
>
> my reply was to Honey Bun and problem s/he is having with
> firefox 44.
>
> what i posted should work with any release of near all programs
> because it is a 'standard' operation of mouse pointer operations.
> or so i have found to be for many years.
>
> then again, with oos, who knows what is 'standard' any more. ;=)
>
I am not going to roll back to Firefox 44 to test the center click method.
>
> On 05/02/16 20:13, WaltS48 wrote:
>> On 05/02/2016 08:11 PM, geo wrote:
>>> On 05/02/16 17:45, HoneyBun wrote:
>>>
>>>> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44,
>>>> then rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However
>>>> it won't Paste directly into a text database such as MS Works.
>>>> I must Paste it into something else first, like Notepad, then
>>>> it will Copy/Paste from there. Weird.
>>>>
>>> ===>
>>>
>>> try this, double left click location in url bar, then center click
>>> in ms works and notepad.
>>>
>>> does that paste to both?
>>
>> I thought the part you snipped indicated it was fixed in Firefox 46?
>>
> ===>
>
> such may be so.
>
> my reply was to Honey Bun and problem s/he is having with
> firefox 44.
>
> what i posted should work with any release of near all programs
> because it is a 'standard' operation of mouse pointer operations.
> or so i have found to be for many years.
>
> then again, with oos, who knows what is 'standard' any more. ;=)
>
I've seldom used center click, by which you presumably mean clicking the
roller wheel on the mouse. That's not very reliable with my mouse so I
ignore it. I only use the roller wheel to scroll.
To copy...
Highlight what you want to copy, then rightclick and select copy, or press
Ctrl-C on the keyboard. Either method should load the item into clipboard.
Then to paste...
Rightclick the destination and select paste, or press Ctrl-V on keyboard.
Both methods failed with Firefox 44 to copy/paste something from the Firefox
navigation bar directly into MS Works. But it works fine with Firefox 46.
That's all I care about.
Thanks, and have a nice day!
geo
May 3, 2016, 7:55:31 AM5/3/16
to
On 05/03/16 02:30, HoneyBun wrote:
> "geo" <gel...@bellsouth.net> wrote
>> On 05/02/16 20:13, WaltS48 wrote:
>>> On 05/02/2016 08:11 PM, geo wrote:
>>>> On 05/02/16 17:45, HoneyBun wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44,
>>>>> then rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However
>>>>> it won't Paste directly into a text database such as MS Works.
>>>>> I must Paste it into something else first, like Notepad, then
>>>>> it will Copy/Paste from there. Weird.
>>>>>
>>>> ===>
>>>>
>>>> try this, double left click location in url bar, then center click
>>>> in ms works and notepad.
>>>>
>>>> does that paste to both?
>>>
>>> I thought the part you snipped indicated it was fixed in Firefox 46?
>>>
>> ===>
>>
>> such may be so.
>>
>> my reply was to Honey Bun and problem s/he is having with
>> firefox 44.
>>
>> what i posted should work with any release of near all programs
>> because it is a 'standard' operation of mouse pointer operations.
>> or so i have found to be for many years.
>>
>> then again, with oos, who knows what is 'standard' any more. ;=)
>>
>
> I am not going to roll back to Firefox 44 to test the center click method.
>
===>
>>> On 05/02/2016 08:11 PM, geo wrote:
>>>> On 05/02/16 17:45, HoneyBun wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> If I highlight a URL in the navigation pane of Firefox 44,
>>>>> then rightclick, it offers the usual Copy operation. However
>>>>> it won't Paste directly into a text database such as MS Works.
>>>>> I must Paste it into something else first, like Notepad, then
>>>>> it will Copy/Paste from there. Weird.
>>>>>
>>>> ===>
>>>>
>>>> try this, double left click location in url bar, then center click
>>>> in ms works and notepad.
>>>>
>>>> does that paste to both?
>>>
>>> I thought the part you snipped indicated it was fixed in Firefox 46?
>>>
>> ===>
>>
>> such may be so.
>>
>> my reply was to Honey Bun and problem s/he is having with
>> firefox 44.
>>
>> what i posted should work with any release of near all programs
>> because it is a 'standard' operation of mouse pointer operations.
>> or so i have found to be for many years.
>>
>> then again, with oos, who knows what is 'standard' any more. ;=)
>>
>
> I am not going to roll back to Firefox 44 to test the center click method.
>
i miss read what you wrote and confused which you are having problem
with.
> I've seldom used center click, by which you presumably mean clicking the
> roller wheel on the mouse. That's not very reliable with my mouse so I
> ignore it. I only use the roller wheel to scroll.
>
funky mice tend to have scroll wheel too low. when i have to use such
on other folks computer, i use my fingernail to actuate switch.
my choice of _pointer_control_ is now a logitech m570 wireless trackball.
scroll wheel is at proper height so switch is easy to activate. i have
been using a thumb trackball for over 30 yrs when i bought my first
'tailed' trackball.
> To copy...
> Highlight what you want to copy, then rightclick and select copy, or press
> Ctrl-C on the keyboard. Either method should load the item into clipboard.
>
> Then to paste...
> Rightclick the destination and select paste, or press Ctrl-V on keyboard.
>
a lot of wasted movement. ;=)
> Both methods failed with Firefox 44 to copy/paste something from the
> Firefox navigation bar directly into MS Works. But it works fine with
> Firefox 46.
> That's all I care about.
>
what ever keeps you happy. 8=)
> Thanks, and have a nice day!
>
most welcome. have a great life.
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