Maximum distance for propane tank?
Hillman
and installing a propane powered standby genset. However, our place is
up a steep driveway (in upstate New York, so there is snow and ice to
consider). This driveway could be tough for an LPG tanker truck.
So, is it feasible to put a tank down near the road and run a supply
line up to the house? Is there a limit on the length of such a supply
line?
Any input much appreciated.
Stephen
Hillman
Doug Miller
I'm sure there must be, but just what that is, I don't know.
>
>Any input much appreciated.
The local propane dealer(s) would be your best source of information on this,
particularly with respect to whether the steepness of your driveway would
really be a problem for them. Or the distance from the road to your house, for
that matter: the delivery trucks have fairly long hoses. Even if the driveway
is too steep for the truck, and the house too far from the road to put the
tank at the road, you may be able to put the tank somewhere in between, as
long as it's within reach of their hose from a place they can get the truck
to. IMO your best bet is to call a couple local propane dealers and ask them
to come out and look at your situation. They'll be able to tell you if they
can deliver to you or not.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
Goedjn
wrote:
I'd expect there to be serious problems with the propane liquifying,
unless the line was burried pretty deep, but why don't you ask the gas
company?
Larry Caldwell
cobb.s...@gmail.com (Hillman) says...
Any competent engineer can design the line for you. I suspect it would
be best to run a tank pressure line (~15 psi) up the hill and put the
regulator next to the house, like a standard natural gas utility
entrance.
--
For email, replace firstnamelastinitial
with my first name and last initial.
unsettled
As I understand matters the tank regulator drops the
pressure to about 10 psi. A liquid propane line
would have to withstand pressures up to 250 psi. While
that's occasionally done the idea scares me for a
residential application.
I am pulling a peak of 200,000 btu/h through a 1/2" buried
vinyl coated stainless tube installed in a 2" PVC pipe
sleeve. Overall length from tank regulator to the house
regulator is close to 200 feet. The stainless tube is
corrugated to make it flexible (roughness cuts flow
somewhat.) This system has given me no problems and
it is just about to start its second season in service.
The tubing came on a 225 foot reel and it takes special
ends that cost about $5 each.
Compared to black pipe or copper, the stainless tubing
was relatively inexpensive and it pulled around long
radius bends in the 2" sleeve easily enough though
to tell the truth I did add some dish detergent to
soap up the first 20 feet or so, and pulled it
through with a rope with a second person feeding
the tube in as I pulled.
HTH
Jim Elbrecht
Get a tank big enough to last 6months. [and make sure it has a gauge
so you can monitor it] That will take you through snow-ice-and mud
seasons.
I'm sure the local LP guys have other folks on hilltops & will be able
to advise what your best course is. Running a long high pressure LP
line on private property seems like the least desirable way to me-
even if the code allows it.
Jim
Hillman
> so you can monitor it] That will take you through snow-ice-and mud
> seasons.
>
> I'm sure the local LP guys have other folks on hilltops & will be able
> to advise what your best course is. Running a long high pressure LP
> line on private property seems like the least desirable way to me-
> even if the code allows it.
>
> Jim
Wow, thanks to everyone for their responses. It sort of revives my
faith in groups. The consensus seems to be 'talk to the local gas
company(s)' and I should probably have done that before posting. It is
also what the helpful Kelly Harris, Programs Manager, Propane Education
& Research Council advised (and she offered me a helpful link to find
said companies -- http://www.usepropane.com/find).
I suppose the reason I didn't ask them first is that a. I am new to the
area and b. I like to have some data of my own going into a question
like this. I had suspected that the 'long pipe' approach might be
expensive, especially given average temps in winter. What I had not
considered was the 'big tank' approach. If the local supplier can make
the hill and top us up before winter sets in and the tank will last
until spring, thenb we should be good. I will let you know how it goes.
Stephen
AL
That's (old tractor) owners, not old (tractor owners)...
My D17's gear shift rubber boot cracked allowing water into the
transmission so I drained the oil & headed down to the AGCO store to
pick up 24qt of 80w gear lube. But they said the oil to use these days
is Permatran 821XL for both the hydraulic system and tranny. I
questioned the recommendation - they pointed to the biggest machine on
their lot saying it was used in those trannys so it would be good for my
D17. I pondered this all the way home and could think of reasons why
they might be wrong, newer gear designs, materials, different bearing
designs, etc. Although they recommend the 821Xl for the tranny they
stressed the need for the 80w in the final drives recommended by the
manual - hmmm. The 821XL is a universal tractor fluid for tractors
having a shared tranny/hydraulic fluid system - a D17 has separate
compartments.
Anyone out there have experience with these new fangled lubricants in
old tractors?
AL
Nick Hull
AL <lit...@hamiltoncomwb.net> wrote:
My tractors are probably older than yours, and I use HyTrans fluids with
good results (currently using WalMart HyTrans).
--
Free men own guns - www.geocities/CapitolHill/5357/
Jim Ledford
yes.
>
> AL
Doug Miller
> What I had not
>considered was the 'big tank' approach. If the local supplier can make
>the hill and top us up before winter sets in and the tank will last
>until spring, thenb we should be good.
Better be a *damn* big tank... when we were on propane, heating a 1700sf house
(that, admittedly, was not too well insulated) in central Indiana, we went
through about 100 to 125 gallons a week in January and February.
Unless your house is small, *very* energy-efficient, *and* located in an area
with mild winters, I have to think that a six-month supply of propane is going
to be at least two thousand gallons.
Jim Ledford
>
[....]
> >
> > Anyone out there have experience with these new fangled lubricants in
> > old tractors?
>
> My tractors are probably older than yours, and I use HyTrans fluids with
> good results (currently using WalMart HyTrans).
as long as the fluids meet or exceed John Deere JD303 performance
characteristics you'll be using the good stuff. you might want to
check and be sure that wallyworld stuff meets that specification.
Matthew Beasley
"Goedjn" <pr...@mail.uri.edu> wrote in message
news:eil5i2t46cneo9l3b...@4ax.com...
If the first stage regulator at the tank is set to 10 PSI, the propane would
liquify at -20°F. At 5 PSI, it would liquify at -35°F.
Matthew Beasley
"unsettled" <unse...@nonsense.com> wrote in message
news:68e7a$4523936c$4fe767c$19...@DIALUPUSA.NET...
> As I understand matters the tank regulator drops the
> pressure to about 10 psi.
5, 10 or 15 PSI. 10 PSI is the most common. 15 PSI is used for long runs
where it doesn't get cold. 5 PSI is used where it can get really cold.
>A liquid propane line
> would have to withstand pressures up to 250 psi. While
> that's occasionally done the idea scares me for a
> residential application.
>
Liquid feed is done for very cold climates. I agree the idea doesn't sound
to safe.
Matthew Beasley
"Hillman" <cobb.s...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1159894516.5...@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
This table will give you an idea of the pipe size needed:
http://www.regoproducts.com/Old/pipetube02.htm
The table only goes to 400'. It sounds like you are going to talk to a
supplier, so they should be able to calculate drop for further distances.
NapalmHeart
"AL" <lit...@hamiltoncomwb.net> wrote in message
news:-JWdneio3vR1Wr7Y...@trueband.net...
Why did you post this as a reply to a thread about the distance a propane
tank can be from a house? Or did it somehow end up here as a flook of the
WWW?
Ken
AL
My bad - and lazy...
AL
Jim Elbrecht
>In article <1159971616.2...@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>, "Hillman" <cobb.s...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> What I had not
>>considered was the 'big tank' approach. If the local supplier can make
>>the hill and top us up before winter sets in and the tank will last
>>until spring, thenb we should be good.
>
>Better be a *damn* big tank... when we were on propane, heating a 1700sf house
>(that, admittedly, was not too well insulated) in central Indiana, we went
>through about 100 to 125 gallons a week in January and February.
Note the OP's opening line in this thread-
"We have been thinking of converting some of our appliances to propane
and installing a propane powered standby genset."
>Unless your house is small, *very* energy-efficient, *and* located in an area
>with mild winters, I have to think that a six-month supply of propane is going
>to be at least two thousand gallons.
I'm in NY [as is the OP] and I use propane for dryer, water heating,
stove, and a space heater. Total usage is under 500gallons a year.
[guessing 200 of that is heater.] A 500gallon tank is probably
doable on a rural property and that will give him loads of room to buy
mid-summer when the price looks right-- and not sweat running out
during that late spring ice storm.
Jim
Doug Miller
>spam...@milmac.com (Doug Miller) wrote:
>
>>In article <1159971616.2...@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>, "Hillman"
> <cobb.s...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> What I had not
>>>considered was the 'big tank' approach. If the local supplier can make
>>>the hill and top us up before winter sets in and the tank will last
>>>until spring, thenb we should be good.
>>
>>Better be a *damn* big tank... when we were on propane, heating a 1700sf house
>>(that, admittedly, was not too well insulated) in central Indiana, we went
>>through about 100 to 125 gallons a week in January and February.
>
>Note the OP's opening line in this thread-
>"We have been thinking of converting some of our appliances to propane
>and installing a propane powered standby genset."
Right, I don't think he specified which appliances. As long as he does *not*
include the furnace in that, he's probably ok.
>
>>Unless your house is small, *very* energy-efficient, *and* located in an area
>>with mild winters, I have to think that a six-month supply of propane is going
>>to be at least two thousand gallons.
>
>I'm in NY [as is the OP] and I use propane for dryer, water heating,
>stove, and a space heater. Total usage is under 500gallons a year.
>[guessing 200 of that is heater.]
I can believe that -- we typically didn't use more than about 250 gallons,
total, between April and October, for dryer, hot water, stove, and *heavy* use
of an outdoor grill. But if the OP is going to convert to a propane *furnace*
too, 500 gallons won't last even six weeks in the middle of the winter, let
alone six months.
> A 500gallon tank is probably
>doable on a rural property and that will give him loads of room to buy
>mid-summer when the price looks right-- and not sweat running out
>during that late spring ice storm.
Absolutely a 500-gallon tank is doable on a rural property -- that's what I
had. One or two of my neighbors had thousand-gallon tanks, but 500 was the
most common in the area.
Sheldon
I live in upstate NY, Capital region. When I moved here (4 years ago)
I had my boiler converted from oil to propane (oil stinks), changed the
stove from electric to propane, and had my Weber hard 'wired' into the
loop as well (no more little tanks to deal with). The propane company
I chose (there are many around here) installed a 500 gallon above
ground tank, about 50 feet from my house, up a 150 foot driveway . You
can have fiberglass tanks installed below ground too, if you're
concerned with aesthetics, I had a place to hide the tank in a thick
windbreask of Norway spruce.. The propane companies around here each
have a fleet of various type/size delivery trucks... if you can drive
up to your house so can they, regardless the weather... actually they
can make it when you can't. I'm on automatic delivery, rarely do I
even notice the delivery truck... I know I got a delivery by the yellow
envelop in my door. Obviously most of my propane use is for heating
(inc. domestic hw). My house is a 2000 sq ft ranch, 46 years old,
guessing fairly well insulated as the last owner, a typically frugal
Norwegian, built every stick of it himself. Winters here are long and
cold, hovering around 0ºF is typical but some nights the mercury falls
to -20ºF. I keep my two thermostats set at 70ºF. For the past 12
months I used 1,020 gallons, price at last delivery was $2.50/gal.
The propane company explained to me how they don't like the tank to
drop below half, they typically deliver when it's at about 2/3 full.
I'm very pleased with propane heating, it's more efficient than oil and
no maintenance to speak of as propane burns clean. Once a year they do
a service call to check the flame setting for the boiler furnace and to
check the entire system for leaks, this service is free... also if I
smell gas they will come out immediately (24/7), also free... only one
time I called, they found a weeper where my cookstove was connected
(the fitting that comes with the stove was cross threaded), installed a
new fitting, free.
NapalmHeart
No problem. I was just wondering if things had somehow gone haywire.
Lubricants for older tractors can be tricky. I'd go with the recommendation
of someone who has direct experience with your machine rather than a
retailer (unless you KNOW that they know their stuff).
You might want to post this to alt.fan.tractors. Lots of knowledge there.
Best Wishes,
Ken
AL
> "AL" wrote
>
>>NapalmHeart wrote:
>>
>>>"AL" wrote
After consulting with an old timer who has overhauled his share of older
ACs I've decided to return the 821XL. The UTF recommended by the
retailer was way to thin to my liking so I bought the manual recommended
80w90 EP - now *that* looks like the kind of lubricant that should be in
a gearbox - saved some money too...
AL
Larry Caldwell
lit...@hamiltoncomwb.net (AL) says...
I would put this up on the Allis-Chalmers discussion forum at
ssbtractor.com. The direct URL should be
http://www.ssbtractor.com/wwwboard/Allis_Chalmers_tractors.html
If in doubt, I would suggest sticking with the lubricant that AC
recommends.