Any stepper motors around?

[Jerry HM]

Hey gang-

 

I'm looking for a stepper motor or two for some projects coming up...

 

Are there any on the hack rack or someone willing to sell 1 or two for cheap?

 

NEMA 17 or other perhaps?

 

I can swing by today and pick it up if some are available/on the hack rack..

 

thanks!

-Jerry

[the_digital_dentist]

There are usually a few on the hack-rack, but you'll have to dig for them.  They are mostly high voltage (30V or so) type, so not overly useful unless you have a driver that can handle the voltages/current.

[J.Dugan]

Thanks for the heads up!

Those will NOT work..  (as you suspected)..

I guess I'll look around for some old printers.. or just grab one or two off ebay.

Thanks!

[J.Dugan]

Are there any 5v steppers out there that people have worked with?

I -can- work with a 12v one.. but just got me thinking.  I see there is a +3v one available from Sparkfun?

https://www.sparkfun.com/products/13656


Any downsides to this? (besides price... yikes!)
says its whats used in the Shapoko's??

[Tom Gralewicz]

Remember to get good torque out of a stepper you need your power supply voltage to be higher than the motor rated voltage.  I would not be surprised to see this motor driven from a 12V power supply.

Tom

Tom Gralewicz

Chronic Maker

(414) 380-1716

milwaukeemakerspace.org

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[J.Dugan]

I'm in the beginning stages of building a 'bar-bot'..

and I'm looking into the stepper part...

I have these drivers: (DRV8825) that I plan on using:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Stepper-Motor-Driver-Module-DRV8825-3D-Printer-RepRap-4-RAMPS1-4-StepStick/282489408372

I also have 1 or 2 of these laying around as a backup: (in case they are preferred, although the DRV8825 seems to provide more current)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/A3967-Easy-Driver-Shield-Stepper-Motor-Driver-Module-V44-for-Arduino-3D-PrinVN/273015155002


I still have NOT found a linear rail/slide set-up...  (**suggestions welcome)..  

but the 'weight' shouldnt be that bad (class, with ice and some liquid eventually).. and it should have any torque/push back outside of its own weight  (not to be used for drilling/milling or anything)

So I'm looking for a small footprint, cheap stepper that can handle the job.


From what I gather so far.. most of my project will work at +5v... 
Arduino,  = +5v
Stepper Driver ---- 

Well I guess I wasnt as prepared as I thought.. seems as if the driver boards need an input of at least 8v - 45v??  (is that correct?)

So maybe I start thinking of this as a 12v system, and I need to dumb things down to +5v for the Arduino..etc..


I will also need to source some paristaltic pumps (which I have never used before)..  and not sure what voltage those generally run off of.. 12v as well?  Any tips or suggestions in this area is also appreciated.  (like can I use aquarium one?)

Do they need to be a special 'food grade'...  I'm thinking Id need like 4-6 of them.. so price is also a concern..

Thanks for the feedback.. (gets me thinking about things I over looked)  :)

[the_digital_dentist]

The motor linked on sparkfun is a NEMA-23 size part and probably bigger than you need.  If you look on ebay, you can find a lot of NEMA-17 motors for about $8-15 each.  Look for low voltage motors that use 1.5-2A.

If you're running motors you're going to want a 12V or 24V power supply and a 5V regulator or buck converter for the arduino.

I've seen some designs for 3D printed peristaltic pumps that use bearings as rollers to push fluid through silicone tubing.

[Pete Prodoehl]

Use 12 volts... many Arduino boards (UNO, Nano) accept 12 volt in through the barrel jack, and then drop it to 5 volt via a regulator for the board itself. I use this feature a lot with 12 volt things so I can use just one power supply. (You can also use more than one power supply, just connect the grounds together.)

Pump: https://www.adafruit.com/product/1150

You can still find cheap NEMA 17 stepper motors that are used a lot for 3D printing. Run them at 12 volts.


Pete

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[J.Dugan]

Thanks for the replies guys!

I am no EE.. (although I play one at home!)  ;)  ... haha..

But I always operated under the ideology of always trying to make my power source as close to the voltage my system will run off..  as  way not wasting energy and making to much heat in the project/regulator.

12v to 5v using the Arduino regulator, seems like a big 'cut'?  (over half)..  Is that not something I should be concerned about?



So to recap:

So I'll plan on running things off a 12v (highest amp one I can find) wal-wart then!@

Dont bother with a 3v or 5v stepper motor (even if available.........correct?)


@Pete

Thanks for the link to the pump, I saw that one before...  I'll have to look for a 'clone' or knock-off somewhere... I'll need anywhere from 4-6 of these.. and at that price point, that would kill my project!

Thanks guys!

[Tom Gralewicz]

I like to use these guys when I'm stepping down from a higher voltage:

Tom Gralewicz

Chronic Maker

(414) 380-1716

milwaukeemakerspace.org

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[Tom Gralewicz]

https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/cui-inc/V7805-2000/102-2175-ND/2352134?WT.srch=1&gclid=Cj0KCQiAiKrUBRD6ARIsADS2OLnNC4DUGdvmhoCwwGRtqYn3a6_E32K_6WoqcGGAlN8cIdv0DGK6Aj8aAjh1EALw_wcB

There are plenty of different varieties from various manufacturers and with other current capacities:

https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/recom-power-inc/R-785.0-0.5/945-1037-ND/2256217&?gclid=Cj0KCQiAiKrUBRD6ARIsADS2OLlKAyxDi3qIHZoqEifM3RuHCYuuseSv7gjHopr7G175GUZCTdAdHEUaApQmEALw_wcB

And if you don't mind waiting for delivery you can some really cheap:

https://www.banggood.com/search/5v-regulator.html

Tom Gralewicz

Chronic Maker

(414) 380-1716

milwaukeemakerspace.org

[J.Dugan]

Thanks for the link!

I like this one:
https://www.banggood.com/DC-DC-5V-3A-Power-Supply-Module-Buck-Step-Down-Regulator-Module-24V-12V-9V-To-5V-Fixed-Output-p-1177912.html?rmmds=search&cur_warehouse=CN

cheap.. and SMALL!...

Is there anything to be aware of for these modules?  A reason to perhaps pick one over another?


Also.. pump question..

Form reading how the Peristaltic pumps work....  I'm not sure if this the solution for me.

Seems these work by having a bearing/roller squeeze the tube to 'squirt' out an 'amount' of liquid.

If I was trying to fill up a glass this way.. that doesnt seem very efficient, or fast?

What are my other options?  Are there any affordable 'continuous' liquid pumps out there?  What would the key word be that I'm looking for to search with?  non-peristalitic?  haha..

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[Tom Gralewicz]

I usually order at least 3 of something this cheap, I have occasionally gotten a bad one - and they're just plain handy to keep around :-)

Peristaltic are great for metering but not for high flow, it isn't hard to make your own with larger diameter tubing to speed things up a bit.

Tom

Tom Gralewicz

Chronic Maker

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milwaukeemakerspace.org

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[jeff mann]

Peristaltic pumps are good for small amounts and you can find some with bigger flow, the problem when you switch away from that style for your application is the flow will likely become too much, you’re probably looking to dose between 1/4oz to 1.5 oz and a paristaltic pump is the best method for precise dosing. But if you search a little bit at what others have done for their Barbots https://www.barproducts.com/upside-down-chrome-wood-dispenser-chrome-dispenser-heads they use something similar to this, a dosing pump or a solenoid valve they time to get the correct amounts. Personally I think something like the dosing pump would be easiest but maybe you could find a paristaltic pump with a flow of around 150-200ml/sec that would be about an oz ever 6-10sec which is a reasonable speed for a drink I think.

[Markus]

Also since we are talking about food grade I really only see two options. Peristaltic or an air over water pressure system. Anything with moving parts within the liquid will be hard to clean and could hide mold.
I would think about using an air pump to pressurize your bottles and then using a simple valve. (maybe just silicone tubing being pinched off by a spring and released by a solenoid)
You would only need a single pump/compressor or CO2 canister to pressurize. Then however many valves as you want bottles.
Keep the pressure constant.
You can then use smaller hoses for spirits (finer control). For things like coke, soda etc. you use a larger hose so it flows faster.

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[Markus]

Here is an example of a simple solenoid controlled pinch valve someone threw together.  http://www.thegatesofdawn.ca/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/img_0098a.jpg

 

-----Original Message-----
From: milwaukee...@googlegroups.com [mailto:milwaukee...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of jeff mann
Sent: Montag, 19. Februar 2018 19:54
To: milwaukeemakerspace <milwaukee...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [MakerSpace] Re: Any stepper motors around?

 

Peristaltic pumps are good for small amounts and you can find some with bigger flow, the problem when you switch away from that style for your application is the flow will likely become too much, you’re probably looking to dose between 1/4oz to 1.5 oz and a paristaltic pump is the best method for precise dosing. But if you search a little bit at what others have done for their Barbots https://www.barproducts.com/upside-down-chrome-wood-dispenser-chrome-dispenser-heads they use something similar to this, a dosing pump or a solenoid valve they time to get the correct amounts. Personally I think something like the dosing pump would be easiest but maybe you could find a paristaltic pump with a flow of around 150-200ml/sec that would be about an oz ever 6-10sec which is a reasonable speed for a drink I think.

 

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[Jerry HM]

Hi Jeff-

I am not planning on using the pumps for the alcohol..

I am doing exactly as you linked to, (well similar)..

see image here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcoholic_spirits_measure


The pumps were initially for the other liquid types, orange juice, coke, etc..etc

The liquid that usually fills the rest of the cup after the 'shot' has been dumped.

For that I'd rather not try and do it in 'pumps/squirts'... but something with more flow and most importantly speed.

I dont think the exact measurement of this is too critical (or at least not -as- critical) as the alcohol portion.

-----Original Message-----
From: milwaukee...@googlegroups.com [mailto:milwaukee...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of jeff mann
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2018 7:54 PM
To: milwaukeemakerspace
Subject: Re: [MakerSpace] Re: Any stepper motors around?

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[Jerry HM]

Hmm... definitely another aspect to explore..

Cost is always a concern... and I'm not really experienced enough to understand how a set up like this would be done? (hardware/mechanically)..

I guess, Id' first need the cost of a CO2 canister (and a small enough size (physically) but be able to work for a while?)..

but then also 4-6 matching 'containers' to hold this pressurized medium/liquid?

Some quick close valves..

and some food grade hose?

Am I missing anything? (worth researching for sure, to see about costs)

Thanks

[the_digital_dentist]

I would think that making pumps using disposable syringes would work- the fluid volume is a linear function of the displacement of the plunger, so it could be very accurate.

Instead of pumping fluid through hoses that are hard to clean, have a series of dedicated syringes- 1 per fluid type- and mount them on a rotating ring.  The fluid reservoirs sit under the home position of all the syringes, and one position has a glass.  Lower the syringes into the fluid reservoirs, suck up the correct amount of each fluid into its syringe, then rotate the syringes over the glass and empty them one by one.

Or, use large syringes as the fluid reservoirs, and move the glass under them, dispensing a metered amount into the glass as needed.  

If you put the drink fluids into bladders inside tanks, and each tank had a second bladder for water, you could pump water into the second bladder to dispense the drink fluid from the first bladder.  The water system could be sealed and it would never touch the drink fluids, so you wouldn't have to worry about cleaning it.

[Markus]

You would need some screw caps to fit your bottles that can hold about 7-10 psi of pressure. Each cap has two holes, one for co2 to enter and a hose that reaches to the bottom for the drink. Or you can build a small low pressure chamber and have all your bottles sit in there with one hose in each. (a side advantage is that your bottles won't be exposed to oxygen and are under pressure so juices should keep longer and soda wont loose its fizz)
You use a C02 regulator as used for beer kegs.
https://www.theweekendbrewer.com/products/co2-injection-system-for-paintball-tanks
With a 12oz paintball canister you should be able to pour about 20 gallons per refill. (a refill should cost about 5$)
https://www.amazon.com/Valken-Aluminum-DOT-TC-Paintball-12-Ounce/dp/B00BYHJV30/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1519103249&sr=8-3&keywords=paintball%2Bcanister&th=1&psc=1

Markus

[Markus]

Yes the fluid/water bladders would work pretty much the same way as the C02. (assuming you are still using valves, if you don’t carbonated drinks would self pour)

--

[Jerry HM]

Question:

If using CO2... will it make non-carbonated fluids... now carbonated?

As in the lemonade or orange juice? I can see it being 'ok' for sodas... but for other non (initially) carbonated liquids?

[Markus Schneider]

No it won't you would be filling the CO2 on top of the juice. To really carbonate it you would need to run the gas through your beverage. Though I could see a tiny bit being absorbed. I guess it would depend on how much pressure you use and how long it sits. It should be pretty pretty easy to do a test with a soda stream machine where you only have a half full bottle and turn the machine on it's side.

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[the_digital_dentist]

Peristaltic pump:  https://hackaday.com/2018/02/20/diy-peristaltic-pump-keeps-the-booze-flowing/#more-295661

[Jerry HM]

HA!..

 

Funny..

 

I woke up this morning, and saw that post in my inbox as well!

 

 

Thanks for remembering/sharing!

 

-Jerry

 

 

From: milwaukee...@googlegroups.com [mailto:milwaukee...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of the_digital_dentist
Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2018 6:53 AM
To: milwaukeemakerspace
Subject: [MakerSpace] Re: Any stepper motors around?

 

Peristaltic pump:  https://hackaday.com/2018/02/20/diy-peristaltic-pump-keeps-the-booze-flowing/#more-295661

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