Odor in hive?

[Diane Packett]

I split my hive last Thursday (it was packed with bees and syrup, there were drones, and I'd seen open queen cups with larvae), and I gave each hive a new box of frames with foundation, but no drawn comb. The split with the queen and 10 frames of brood/pollen/syrup, I've been feeding because it's small and I wanted them to draw comb. A few people said don't feed, they'll draw just fine, so the parent hive, which still has two boxes of brood nest, I haven't been feeding. Lot of foraging activity from both hives all week.

 

Today I peeked under the inner cover of the parent hive (two boxes brood nest, one box foundation) to see if they had started to draw comb. They hadn't, but there's a sour smell coming from the hive. I'm thinking fermented syrup or some odorous pollen, but could it be something worse? Should I do anything? I wasn't planning on opening either hive for a couple of weeks to see if there were queen cells in the parent. I emailed a couple of people for advice after I split, but haven't heard anything.

 

Thank you, everyone!

 

Diane

[jeanne hansen]

Diane,

I get nervous when I hear you say, you weren't planning on opening either hive for a couple of weeks.  You can't tell a thing, without inspecting the hives in detail.  Especially if you smell something.  By all means!  Inspect the hives.  Even if you did just inspect them when you made the split, inspect again.  If everything looks fine, then you can ignore the odor.

As for feeding, a hive needs one or two frames of "honey" in it at all times, in case of a bad-weather spell.  If  not, feed syrup.  Well, since you presumably looked at every frame in order to do the split, you know if they need to be fed.

 

Good Luck!
Jeanne Hansen
824 Jacobson Ave
Madison, WI 53714
608-244-5094

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From: Diane Packett <dlpa...@gmail.com>
To: mad...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2015 10:01 AM
Subject: [madbees] Odor in hive?

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[jeanne hansen]

Diane,

By the way, when you give each hive a new super full of foundation, do you take about 3 frames of brood and move them up into the new box?  Putting the displaced frames at the sides of the boxes below?  It helps the bees realize they have space up above.

In other words, the brood that was in 2 boxes is now evenly distributed in 3 boxes.

 

Thanks!

Jeanne Hansen
824 Jacobson Ave
Madison, WI 53714
608-244-5094

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From: Diane Packett <dlpa...@gmail.com>
To: mad...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2015 10:01 AM
Subject: [madbees] Odor in hive?

[Paul Zelenski]

I second this comment. So, it takes what, 8 days before the queen cell is capped? I don't like inspecting too much during this time, but it is definitely worth seeing what is going on. I definitely want to inspect once there should be cells. I would want to see that they made a good queen cell. And everything seems to be on track. Especially if there is a strange odor. Once I think the queen is emerged, I don't like to inspect until I expect there to be eggs. I like to leave the hive alone while she should be on her mating flights. 

Personally, I also like to make sure they don't have too many queen cells. Just because you spilt doesn't mean they can't swarm. I've had hives throw secondary swarms after the first "swarm" split. If they have like 20 queen cells, I usually remove all but the best 3-4. But, more experienced people may tell us this is unnecessary. 

I'm sure everything is fine, but go ahead and take a look to be sure. 

[Diane Packett]

Thanks guys! I'll look in there today after it warms up, or Saturday. I'm still trying to learn how to balance the looking vs leaving alone, feeding vs not feeding. (I also realize that one school of thought is to not feed in most cases because bees don't normally have access to sugar syrup, but I find myself in the feeding camp) The feeding of one vs the other was sort of an experiment, and I wanted the split with the queen to have the feed. Joe mentioned that maybe neither hive is drawing comb because they now have enough space as brood hatches, and it's been cold. The temperature part, I didn't realize--I was thinking of the people at the last meeting who had installed packages early, when it was really cold, and reported comb being drawn.

 

So, I will look and report back.

 

Diane

[Diane Packett]

Well, I guess it looks okay in there. Nothing growing or dead that shouldn't be.

 

The parent hive (no queen, no feeding) is boiling over with bees in the two bottom boxes, but no new comb in the top box with the foundation, so I took Jeanne's suggestion and moved a couple of frames of brood and resources up there and put empty foundation on the edges of the middle box--where I expect they'll ignore it forever. There were about a dozen capped queen cells built out from the comb and several hanging from a bottom frame. I also think there's more nectar than there was even when I was feeding them--whole frames of it. That's where the sour odor is coming from, so I'm guessing fermented syrup or nectar/pollen that smells bad, much as goldenrod pollen is said to smell bad.

 

The split, with the queen, hadn't taken much syrup and hadn't drawn any comb in the new box of foundation, except a bunch of cross comb between the boxes, so I moved some frames around there too. There's a bit of an odor in that hive too. The queen is laying.

 

So fingers crossed that the parent hive makes a good queen.

 

Thanks!

 

Diane

 

 

[Mary Celley]

Watch out for foul brood or the hive beetle. Foul brood is a sour smell.  The hive beetle  also turns honey into a slimmey mess with an ordor. I have been warning people about the hive beetle for many months now.  It is not a good deal.  Mary

[Diane Packett]

Foulbrood was my concern, Mary. I didn't see anything icky in either hive, and the smell is more sour-sweet as opposed to putrefied. But I'm a beginner. I'm in Oregon--would you be willing to come take a look? You've been to visit my next-door neighbors, Dave & Mary Jane Osborne, to treat their yard for yellow jackets.

 

Diane 

[Larry Lindokken]

Look at the larva they should be white--if not if yellow and / or black grey you may have European foulbrood.  Larry

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From: "Diane Packett" <dlpa...@gmail.com>
To: mad...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Saturday, May 2, 2015 8:15:12 AM
Subject: [madbees] Re: Odor in hive?

Foulbrood was my concern, Mary. I didn't see anything icky in either hive, and the smell is more sour-sweet as opposed to putrefied. But I'm a beginner. I'm in Oregon--would you be willing to come take a look? You've been to visit my next-door neighbors, Dave & Mary Jane Osborne, to treat their yard for yellow jackets.

 

Diane 

[Diane Packett]

Thanks, Larry. No, nothing like that. White larvae, the ones that were uncapped. 

[kac...@gmail.com]

In a fb group I'm in they discussed that the dandelion nectar has an off scent to it.

Kathy Kruk

On May 2, 2015, at 9:53 AM, Diane Packett <dlpa...@gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks, Larry. No, nothing like that. White larvae, the ones that were uncapped. 

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