time of day to split?

[harold steinberg]

I need to split a hive and I’m contemplating the best time of day to do it so each new hive receives half the bees. One hive will remain in the same place and the other hive will be traveling far away.

I’m guessing this has already been worked out.

What do you think will be best:
Early morning before the workers start to leave?
Mid-day?
Late in the even when they are all home?

[mar...@chicagobees.com]

Do you want to make an even split? If that's the case then splitting when most bees are in makes sense.
Or are you splitting to make a nuc/prevent swarming? If so, then do it when it's convenient for you.

From: harold steinberg
Sent: Thursday, April 27, 10:29 AM
Subject: [madbees] time of day to split?
To: mad...@googlegroups.com

I need to split a hive and I’m contemplating the best time of day to do it so each new hive receives half the bees. One hive will remain in the same place and the other hive will be traveling far away. I’m guessing this has already been worked out. What do you think will be best: Early morning before the workers start to leave? Mid-day? Late in the even when they are all home? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "madbees" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to madbees+u...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[Joseph Bessetti]

Why make it more complicated than it needs to be?  Do a standard-side-by-side split and them move one of the hives 48 hours later after the foragers are redistributed between the two hives. 

If you need to find the queen it should easier when the foragers are flying.  24- to 48-hour queen cells are perfectly safe to transport; some people even ship them in the mail. 

Joe

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From: mad...@googlegroups.com <mad...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of harold steinberg <h.adam.s...@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2017 10:29 AM
To: mad...@googlegroups.com

Subject: [madbees] time of day to split?

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[marvin]

There are a lot of ways to make splits,  I guess I would want to know if you're adding an outside queen or letting them make their own, and how soon you have to move the one box to a new location (or if that is even mandatory).  

[harold steinberg]

Glad I asked!

I’d love to introduce a queen but the VHS queens are not ready. So the split is going to make their own queen and then I’ll replace it at a later date. I will check my Russian hive and see if they have any swarm cells, they usually keep them ready to go all season. If they have some, I will put that in the new split right before I move it to it’s new home.

I will not be splitting this hive until after the next few days of crappy bee weather.

So, split the hive and put the two of them side-by-side for a week, the one without eggs, gets the swarm cells and moves. Sound like a plan?

[Joseph Bessetti]

Queen cells can be delicate between the time they are capped and just before the queen emerges.  Unless someone has experience to the contrary, I would be hesitant to take them on a road trip that might bounce your developing queen around a lot.  

I'd err on the side of moving them within 2-3 days of the split.  The queen larvae will handle the move better than later developmental stages.

Joe

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From: mad...@googlegroups.com <mad...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of harold steinberg <h.adam.s...@gmail.com>

Sent: Friday, April 28, 2017 11:48 AM
To: mad...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [madbees] Re: time of day to split?

 

[Greg V]

Sounds to me that the move date is flexible (per the above talk).

Then why not just wait until your "to-be-moved" hive has a functioning queen and only *then* move? Much safer, no second-guessing, and you have your fail-over backup hive standing by right next.

On Fri, Apr 28, 2017 at 12:12 PM, Joseph Bessetti <jbes...@hotmail.com> wrote:

Queen cells can be delicate between the time they are capped and just before the queen emerges.  Unless someone has experience to the contrary, I would be hesitant to take them on a road trip that might bounce your developing queen around a lot.  

I'd err on the side of moving them within 2-3 days of the split.  The queen larvae will handle the move better than later developmental stages.

Joe

---

From: mad...@googlegroups.com <mad...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of harold steinberg <h.adam.s...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2017 11:48 AM
To: mad...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [madbees] Re: time of day to split?

 

Glad I asked!

I’d love to introduce a queen but the VHS queens are not ready. So the split is going to make their own queen and then I’ll replace it at a later date. I will check my Russian hive and see if they have any swarm cells, they usually keep them ready to go all season. If they have some, I will put that in the new split right before I move it to it’s new home.

I will not be splitting this hive until after the next few days of crappy bee weather.

So, split the hive and put the two of them side-by-side for a week, the one without eggs, gets the swarm cells and moves. Sound like a plan?

On Apr 27, 2017, at 3:40 PM, marvin <marvin...@gmail.com> wrote:

There are a lot of ways to make splits,  I guess I would want to know if you're adding an outside queen or letting them make their own, and how soon you have to move the one box to a new location (or if that is even mandatory).  

On Thursday, April 27, 2017 at 10:29:07 AM UTC-5, H. Adam Steinberg wrote:

I need to split a hive and I’m contemplating the best time of day to do it so each new hive receives half the bees. One hive will remain in the same place and the other hive will be traveling far away.

I’m guessing this has already been worked out.

What do you think will be best:
Early morning before the workers start to leave?
Mid-day?
Late in the even when they are all home?

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[harold steinberg]

I can delicately hand carry the frame with the queen cells in the car. It’s only 3 miles.

[harold steinberg]

Or wait until she emerges.

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[Greg V]

Well, exactly. :-)

[Matt H]

I'm with Joe here...it's not the best idea to move them.  If you know the progress the queen because you grafted them, there is about a 2 day period where you can handle the queen cells after they've been closed, but if you don't know the date you risk moving them during the sensitive period.  I don't touch my cell finisher during the sensitive period.  Maybe I'm overly cautious, but it's not worth the risk to me.  

Reference: http://www.thebeeyard.org/queen-rearing-calendar/ 

If you are going to move cells, you should put them in a nuc with plenty of bees and keep the frames upright.  The cells need to stay thermoregulated by the bees.  

If you can, I would wait until she emerges and gets mated or you risk her not finding the DCA because it's a new area and her escorts don't know the way.  

[harold steinberg]

to be clear I wouldn’t graft (I’m not at that level yet). I would simple take a brood frame from my Russian hive that already has swarm cells hanging off the bottom of it. The Russians pretty much keep swarm cells there all the time. I haven’t look recently to see if they do indeed have any, but it's about time for them to be there.

[Matt H]

I know, my point was that in the absence of knowing the age of the larva (like you do when you graft) moving a capped cell can be perilous because you don't know if you're in the safe 9-10 day period or sensitive period.