A few sentences

[Erik Natanael Gustafsson]

coi ro do

I have started practising making sentences in Lojban and I just want to know if I have made any big (or small) mistakes.

You have nothing to fear. (I had difficulties with this one, how do you reference the concept of an emotion?)=
.i lo krinu .ii na zasti
.i lo se terpa be do na zasti
.i lo se terpa pe do cu claxu lo krinu

The music that they were playing was a part of a bigger work. =
.i le zgike poi ra pu zgipli ku'o pagbu le se finti poi bramau

On his way to the store, Erik fell on a marble. =
.i la .erik. pu farlu ri'a lo bolci be lo rokci vau ca'o lonu ra klama le zaisle

Accompanied by the whisper of the trees, I dance. =
.i po'o lo se smasku be lei tricu cu kansa lonu mi dansu

The ink will soon shine red by the life-giving force of the words. =
.i le xinmo cu bazi xunre gusycai ri'a lo nunji'e bapli pe lei valsi

When the bus left the stop, he kissed me tenderly in his thoughts. =
.i iu. ra cinba mi ne'i lo menli vau ca'o lonu lo sorprekarce cu cliva

The door locks itself automatically. =
.i lo stela po le ganlo cu zmiku

With only one hand, Klas won the whole tournament. =
.i la klas. pu jinga fo ro le terjvi se pi'o po'o pa lo xance

I am grateful for any corrections!

co'o
Erik

[Ian Johnson]

On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 10:34 AM, Erik Natanael Gustafsson <eriknatanae...@gmail.com> wrote:

You have nothing to fear. (I had difficulties with this one, how do you reference the concept of an emotion?)=
.i lo krinu .ii na zasti
.i lo se terpa be do na zasti
.i lo se terpa pe do cu claxu lo krinu

You really can't use attitudinals except to express that you are feeling some emotion. You'll need to use {terpa} necessarily. The second one seems sort of close, except it does exist in *some* sense, because you're talking about it. Maybe {lo se terpa be do na zasti fi lo vajni}: what they fear exists but not in a sense that matters.

The music that they were playing was a part of a bigger work. =
.i le zgike poi ra pu zgipli ku'o pagbu le se finti poi bramau

This is a bit redundant. You could just say {le [pu] te zgipli [be fi ra] cu pagbu le se finti noi bramau}. I also see no particular need for {le} here necessarily, though I suppose there's some style to be said.

On his way to the store, Erik fell on a marble. =
.i la .erik. pu farlu ri'a lo bolci be lo rokci vau ca'o lonu ra klama le zaisle

Two problems, both fairly minor. First a cause is an event, so you need either {ri'a tu'a ...} or to actually spell out "because of an event of stepping on a marble". Second, when you use a ZAhO like {ca'o} as a tag, what you get is that the outer event is assigned the contour and is said to be simultaneous with the other event. That is, {broda ca'o ko'a} === {ca'o broda ca ko'a}. The falling is probably not very continuative, so you can just use {ca}.

Accompanied by the whisper of the trees, I dance. =
.i po'o lo se smasku be lei tricu cu kansa lonu mi dansu

kansa1 and kansa2 are generally objects, where kansa2 satisfies kansa3 and kansa1 is present (usually but not always also satisfying kansa3). So you should have {.... kansa mi lo ka [ce'u] dansu}. What "..." should be depends somewhat on your stance on metaphors.

The ink will soon shine red by the life-giving force of the words. =
.i le xinmo cu bazi xunre gusycai ri'a lo nunji'e bapli pe lei valsi

I think this is OK.

When the bus left the stop, he kissed me tenderly in his thoughts. =
.i iu. ra cinba mi ne'i lo menli vau ca'o lonu lo sorprekarce cu cliva

The {iu} is not actually translating anything from the original, though it's appropriate. I wouldn't say {ne'i lo menli} (it comes off as literal in Lojban). I'd probably spell out "imagined kissing me tenderly" or something to that effect instead.

The door locks itself automatically. =
.i lo stela po le ganlo cu zmiku

{pe} is fine, as it usually is. {po} is a little weird with an entity that can't actually possess something. Otherwise I think this is OK.

With only one hand, Klas won the whole tournament. =
.i la klas. pu jinga fo ro le terjvi se pi'o po'o pa lo xance

This has a very subtle problem having to do with quantifier scope, which is that as written, the hand he used to win each part of the tournament could depend on the tournament. That is, it says that he used one hand in each part, but it does not say that the hand was the same in all of the parts. If you just move the {ro} inside the article, you remove this. I would probably also move the {pa} inside the article although this is somewhat of a stylistic choice.

I am grateful for any corrections!

.i fi'i co'o do'u .i mi'e la latro'a mu'o

[Jorge Llambías]

On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 12:34 PM, Erik Natanael Gustafsson <eriknatanae...@gmail.com> wrote:

You have nothing to fear. (I had difficulties with this one, how do you reference the concept of an emotion?)=
.i lo krinu .ii na zasti
.i lo se terpa be do na zasti
.i lo se terpa pe do cu claxu lo krinu

The first one doesn't work because by using "ii" the speaker is expressing fear, not talking about fear. The other two are fine. You could also say something like "no da ckape", "no da te'apra", or just "ko na terpa" or "ko terpa no da".

On his way to the store, Erik fell on a marble. =
.i la .erik. pu farlu ri'a lo bolci be lo rokci vau ca'o lonu ra klama le zaisle

For me that doesn't work because "ca'o" is the aspect of "farlu", not of "klama", so it seems like you are talking about the time during the fall. ( ~"Eric was falling when he went to the store.")  I would just use "ca lo nu ra klama", or "ca lo nu ra ca'o klama". (But there are other opinions on how to use ZAhOs as tags.)

When the bus left the stop, he kissed me tenderly in his thoughts. =
.i iu. ra cinba mi ne'i lo menli vau ca'o lonu lo sorprekarce cu cliva

Same here, although in this case "he was kissing me in his thoughts when the bus left" makes sense too.

The door locks itself automatically. =
.i lo stela po le ganlo cu zmiku

Not sure why "po" here (I never use it). I would say "lo stela cu zmiku lo ka ga'orbi'o".

With only one hand, Klas won the whole tournament. =
.i la klas. pu jinga fo ro le terjvi se pi'o po'o pa lo xance

If "with only one hand" means "using only one hand", that works. If it means "having only one hand", then "la klas noi se xance lo pa po'o xance cu pu jinga..."

The others seem fine to me, well done!

mu'o mi'e xorxes

[Ian Johnson]

Typo:

This has a very subtle problem having to do with quantifier scope, which is that as written, the hand he used to win each part of the tournament could depend on the part of the tournament.

[Erik Natanael Gustafsson]

Thank you for your thorough replies! .i mi kirsku fi lo do spuda noi tisna lo kevna pe lo se jimpe be mi

A few follow up questions:

What does "ga'orbi'o" mean? I can't seem to find it on jbovlaste.

So ca'o can be defined as "bridi is continuously happening during sumti (event)" ? I am a bit confused by how the position of the ca'o changes its scope and effect. Does ".i la .erik. pu farlu ri'a lo bolci be lo rokci vau ca lo nu ra ca'o klama" mean that only the going is continuous? Also, is the use of vau correct and necessary here?

Is there a better way to translate the sentence "Accompanied by the whisper of the trees, I dance." without using kansa and stressing that the dancing is a continuous event, because what I really mean is more like a musical accompaniment.

I couldn't find a translation for tenderly, which is why I added iu. Would something like "ka racyju'i sepi'o lo ka prami" work and how would I insert it as an adverb? Also, could I stress the metaphorical meaning of "in his thoughts" by using pe'a like ".i iu. ra cinba mi pe'a ne'i lo menli vau ca lonu lo sorprekarce cu ca'o cliva"

[Jorge Llambías]

On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 8:03 AM, Erik Natanael Gustafsson <eriknatanae...@gmail.com> wrote:

Thank you for your thorough replies! .i mi kirsku fi lo do spuda noi tisna lo kevna pe lo se jimpe be mi

A few follow up questions:

What does "ga'orbi'o" mean? I can't seem to find it on jbovlaste.

"ganlo zei binxo"

"ga'o" is the rafsi for "ganlo" and "bi'o" for "binxo", and the -r- hyphen is required to make the lujvo because "ga'obi'o" would just be two cmavo "ga'o bi'o". 

So ca'o can be defined as "bridi is continuously happening during sumti (event)" ?

That would be "ru'i" for "continuously", but yes "bridi is happening during sumti". 

 

I am a bit confused by how the position of the ca'o changes its scope and effect. Does ".i la .erik. pu farlu ri'a lo bolci be lo rokci vau ca lo nu ra ca'o klama" mean that only the going is continuous?

It means that Eric falls at a time when the going is going on (i.e. afer it started and before it is finished).  "ca'o" indicates that the event is in the midst of happening (already started and not yet finished), not so much that it is continuous.

 

Also, is the use of vau correct and necessary here?

No, "vau" terminates the bridi, so you can't add a new term "ca lo nu ra ca'o klama" after it.

Is there a better way to translate the sentence "Accompanied by the whisper of the trees, I dance." without using kansa and stressing that the dancing is a continuous event, because what I really mean is more like a musical accompaniment.

You could use the place structure of "dansu": "mi dansu lo se smasku be lo tricu"

I couldn't find a translation for tenderly, which is why I added iu. Would something like "ka racyju'i sepi'o lo ka prami" work and how would I insert it as an adverb?

"ra ralci cinba mi", "ra racyju'i cinba mi", "ra ralci je prami cinba mi", "ra racpa'i cinba mi", ...

 

Also, could I stress the metaphorical meaning of "in his thoughts" by using pe'a like ".i iu. ra cinba mi pe'a ne'i lo menli vau ca lonu lo sorprekarce cu ca'o cliva"

That would be "ne'i pe'a". "pe'a", like all words in UI, modifies the preceding word. (Or a whole clause if the preceding word starts a clause.)

[Erik Natanael Gustafsson]

 

I am a bit confused by how the position of the ca'o changes its scope and effect. Does ".i la .erik. pu farlu ri'a lo bolci be lo rokci vau ca lo nu ra ca'o klama" mean that only the going is continuous?

It means that Eric falls at a time when the going is going on (i.e. afer it started and before it is finished).  "ca'o" indicates that the event is in the midst of happening (already started and not yet finished), not so much that it is continuous.

 

Also, is the use of vau correct and necessary here?

No, "vau" terminates the bridi, so you can't add a new term "ca lo nu ra ca'o klama" after it.

OK. So either
.i la .erik. pu farlu ri'a lo bolci be lo rokci ca lo nu ra ca'o klama
or
.i la .erik. pu farlu ri'a lo bolci be lo rokci .i ca bo ra ca'o klama
?

ki'e mu'o

[Jorge Llambías]

On Fri, Feb 20, 2015 at 8:32 AM, Erik Natanael Gustafsson <eriknatanae...@gmail.com> wrote:

OK. So either
.i la .erik. pu farlu ri'a lo bolci be lo rokci ca lo nu ra ca'o klama
or
.i la .erik. pu farlu ri'a lo bolci be lo rokci .i ca bo ra ca'o klama
?

The first one is:

  In the past:

    Caused by the marble:

       At the time he was going:

          Eric falls.

The second one is:

  In the past:

     Caused by the marble:

         Eric falls.

  At the same time:

     He was going.

If you don't want the simultaneity to be part of what is caused, which makes a subtle difference, you would need to change the order in the first one: "la .erik pu farlu ca lo nu ri ca'o klama kei ri'a lo bolci be lo rokci":

  In the past:

     At the time of his going:

        Caused by the marble:

            Eric falls.