Sonchus oleraceus? ABAUG2016/60

[Ashwini Bhatia]

This tall sow thistle is very common these days. The upper leaves are narrow while the lower ones are lobed and large. Could this be S. oleraceus? Please advise.

Sonchus oleraceus—Sow Thistle

Mcleodganj, HP

1750m 

19 July 2016

Thanks.

Ashwini

[J.M. Garg]

Wonderful images, Ashwini ji.

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna'

Winner of Wipro-NFS Sparrow Awards 2014 for efloraofindia. 

For identification, learning, discussion & documentation of Indian Flora, please visit/ join our Efloraofindia Google e-group (largest in the world- around 2700 members & 2,40,000 messages on 31.3.16) or Efloraofindia website (with a species database of more than 11,000 species & 2,20,000 images).

The whole world uses my Image Resource of more than a thousand species & eight thousand images of Birds, Butterflies, Plants etc. (arranged alphabetically & place-wise). You can also use them for free as per Creative Commons license attached with each image.

Also author of 'A Photoguide to the Birds of Kolkata & Common Birds of India'.

[J.M. Garg]

Appears close to images at Sonchus oleraceus (L.) L. 

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[J.M. Garg]

Thanks, Mahadeswara ji.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: M Swamy <swamy...@gmail.com>
Date: 28 August 2016 at 16:57
Subject: Re: [efloraofindia:249923] Sonchus oleraceus? ABAUG2016/60
To: "J.M. Garg" <jmg...@gmail.com>

For me it looks ID by Ashwini ji and Garg ji is correct.

[Ashwini Bhatia]

Thank you Mr Garg. I now doubt my guess as I had overlooked the fact that this plant had hairy upper stems and glandular calyx, clearly visible in this photo I am including here. My apologies to you and Mr Swamy for not editing and filing this photo for better analysis earlier.

It now looks closer to Sonchus brachyotus. 

Please advise.

Thanks.

Ashwini

On 27 Aug 2016, at 10:56, J.M. Garg <jmg...@gmail.com> wrote:

Appears close to images at Sonchus oleraceus (L.) L. 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Ashwini Bhatia <ash...@ashwinibhatia.com>
Date: 23 August 2016 at 14:25
Subject: [efloraofindia:249923] Sonchus oleraceus? ABAUG2016/60
To: indian...@googlegroups.com

This tall sow thistle is very common these days. The upper leaves are narrow while the lower ones are lobed and large. Could this be S. oleraceus? Please advise.

Sonchus oleraceus—Sow Thistle

Mcleodganj, HP

1750m 

19 July 2016

Thanks.

Ashwini

<_MG_7027_19Aug2016.jpg><_MG_7028_19Aug2016.jpg><_MG_7018_19Aug2016.jpg><_MG_7012_19Aug2016.jpg>

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[Gurcharan Singh]

In S. brachyotes peduncles and phyllaries are mostly glabrous, rarely white tomentose apically. Here glandular hairs are seen suggesting S. wightianus.

  Please also check phyllaries (outer 1.5-3 mm wide in S. brachyotes, 1-1.5 mm in S. wightianus), pappus (10-12 mm long in S. brachyotes, 6-9 mm in S. wightianus) for final decision..

Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/

[Ashwini Bhatia]

Thank you Dr Singh. I will check these details and report back.

Regards,

Ashwini

On 28 Aug 2016, at 22:51, Gurcharan Singh <sing...@gmail.com> wrote:

In S. brachyotes peduncles and phyllaries are mostly glabrous, rarely white tomentose apically. Here glandular hairs are seen suggesting S. wightianus.

  Please also check phyllaries (outer 1.5-3 mm wide in S. brachyotes, 1-1.5 mm in S. wightianus), pappus (10-12 mm long in S. brachyotes, 6-9 mm in S. wightianus) for final decision..

Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/

On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 7:54 AM, Ashwini Bhatia <ash...@ashwinibhatia.com> wrote:

Thank you Mr Garg. I now doubt my guess as I had overlooked the fact that this plant had hairy upper stems and glandular calyx, clearly visible in this photo I am including here. My apologies to you and Mr Swamy for not editing and filing this photo for better analysis earlier.

It now looks closer to Sonchus brachyotus. 

Please advise.

Thanks.

Ashwini

<_MG_7009_19Aug2016.jpg>

[Samir Mehta]

These keys for Sonchus (below URL) will help:

http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=130683

They are partly explained on the thread already.

Best Wishes,

Samir Mehta

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna'

Winner of Wipro-NFS Sparrow Awards 2014 for efloraofindia. 

For identification, learning, discussion & documentation of Indian Flora, please visit/ join our Efloraofindia Google e-group (largest in the world- around 2700 members & 2,40,000 messages on 31.3.16) or Efloraofindia website (with a species database of more than 11,000 species & 2,20,000 images).

The whole world uses my Image Resource of more than a thousand species & eight thousand images of Birds, Butterflies, Plants etc. (arranged alphabetically & place-wise). You can also use them for free as per Creative Commons license attached with each image.

Also author of 'A Photoguide to the Birds of Kolkata & Common Birds of India'.

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[J.M. Garg]

Forwarding again for Id confirmation or otherwise please.

Some earlier relevant feedback:

In S. brachyotes peduncles and phyllaries are mostly glabrous, rarely white tomentose apically. Here glandular hairs are seen suggesting S. wightianus. Please also check phyllaries (outer 1.5-3 mm wide in S. brachyotes, 1-1.5 mm in S. wightianus), pappus (10-12 mm long in S. brachyotes, 6-9 mm in S. wightianus) for final decision.. Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Thank you Dr Singh. I will check these details and report back. Regards, Ashwini

These keys for Sonchus (below URL) will help:

http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=130683 They are partly explained on the thread already. Best Wishes, Samir Mehta

Efi page on Sonchus wightianus with images.

[Giby Kuriakose]

New plant to me. Nice analysis as well.

Regards

Giby