What is that in the background?

[Bob Flanders]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tb0cRL2mnbA

At about 7:40 in the video, what is that in the background?

;)

Bob

[Peter Vaughan (TNMOC)]

Yep, it's an 1130 without the top label plate above the indicator panel... but how many 1130s do you actually see in that sequence... hint it's more than 1

- Peter 

Sent from my Samsung device

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[Brian Knittel]

I count two of 'em

--

[dey]

Peter,

 

Let’s answer your question this way.  IBM was the world’s largest user of the 1130 series computer (in all of its variations) in its manufacturing process.  It was that way past the 370 series platform.

 

derrick

[Bob Flanders]

I will have to watch again.

Thanks for the note.

Bob

[Bob Flanders]

There may actually be four, but two are really obscure. Of course there's the two behind the 3330 he is showing, but there MAY be one to his left @7:33. (look at the panel from the side sticking up, and paper coming out of the console in back.) And maybe ... just maybe .. way at the back behind the techs @7:48 just barely visible. Is that another one?

Bob

[peter....@tnmoc.org]

Yes, I counted 4. Apart from the one back right, which I can't see clearly, they all appear to be 4 or 8KW systems (no blister expansion).

Also I see no 1442's (unless they are all out of shot) or any other peripherals, so it is unclear how they booted them?

- Peter

[dey]

As far as I have been able to determine, there are only four (04) in the photo.  You have identified them all.

 

Derrick

[Carl Claunch]

Since they are connected to disk drives, they should have an 1133 connected to each 1131.  That box is where the 1130 would implement the selector channel which provides the bus and tag connection to 2310 and 2311 in a supported 1130 system (and to other bus and tag based disk controllers for the disks they are supporting in the factory). 

As for boot up, they could have some custom gear, other than a 1442 or 2501, but I would bet on a 2501 located off camera, near the 1133. It is even possible to toggle in the 80 words of a boot card via the control panel, avoiding any need for a card reader, assuming some customized version of the monitor were installed on the internal disk and did not need to read monitor control cards. 

Carl

[Jeff Jonas]

Carl:

> Since they are connected to disk drives,
> they should have an 1133 connected to each 1131.

I wish I had photos of the 1133 mux I used.
It was mostly empty: just the minimal gates required for
two single platter drives.
Quite the closet!

> That box is where the 1130 would implement the selector channel
> which provides the bus and tag connection to 2310 and 2311
> in a supported 1130 system (and to other bus and tag based disk controllers
> for the disks they are supporting in the factory).

Does that mean the controller translates the 1130's XIO instruction
into the bus-and-tag commands?

One of the 2 System 1130s donated to my college (around 1980)
had a Calcomp DS-12 diskpack that connected directly to the SAC.
It used an 11 platter diskpack for 20 surfaces,
each surface emulating one drive.
It emulated 5 drives at a time in compatibility mode.
I never had the software to access more than 5 surfaces at a time.
I wish the manual had survived for it would've been a great start
for how to emulate ALL the hard drives with one unit
(a 4004 based controller at the time).
Did IBM ever have a similar device?

That system had 2 Calcomp peripherals: the 565 plotter (IBM 1627)
and the DS-12.

> As for boot up, they could have some custom gear,
> other than a 1442 or 2501

I thought there was a jumper for booting from paper tape,
which might also beat the 80 word limit.
And if it read 2: 8 bits for each word, then no need for
expanding the 12 bit card column into a 16 bit word.

-- jeff jonas

[Paul Tremblett]

Our SE had a fit when he saw we were keeping pizzas warm inside the 1133 :-)

Sent from my iPhone

[miles sandin]

That is cool.

We had a 1403 slow speed on ours. At a COMMON meeting someone talked about how that was really just a crippled higher speed model. I remember looking at the manuals and finally finding a jumper which caused the processing to wait until the print chain was at the home position. It was with great fear that I finally pulled one end of it. Lived in constant fear that a CE would notice.

---

From: Paul Tremblett
Sent: ‎5/‎9/‎2016 3:56 PM
To: ibm...@googlegroups.com
Cc: Carl Claunch / diagonalboard

Subject: Re: [IBM1130] What is that in the background?

[Paul Tremblett]

I remember a CE telling us how our upgrade to something faster/more powerful often involved removing/disabling some inhibit circuitry.

Sent from my iPhone

[Jeff Jonas]

> We had a 1403 slow speed on ours.
> At a COMMON meeting

Did any newsletters, flyers or shareware survive?
I scanned a few newsletters
ferretronix.com/1130/newsletters

> Lived in constant fear that a CE would notice.

How many others have stories of fearing the CE?

Around 1982, a client was still running a heavily modified IBM system 3.
No console Selectric, just the 2 digit front panel display.
Memorex memory, line printer and diskpack drives.

When it ran, it was quite nice.
But when anything broke, the IBM and Memorex CEs pointed fingers at each other.
I heard stories of pure extortion where IBM made it clear
any shop that was not "true blue" with all IBM peripherals & supplies
would not get anywhere near the prompt service of those who were.
It took a brave soul to use non-IBM peripherals
such as AT&T/Teletype sync terminals & controllers.


On the other hand, many CEs were very clever and showed us things
we'd never otherwise have known.
I remember the enlightenment of being shown the 1442
safety override switch that let it run with the covers open :-)

What CE tricks and wisdoms do you remember?

-- jeff jonas

[miles sandin]

We also ordered a Logicon Async adapter so we could communicate to TI-942 programmable terminals. We had to have SAC-II installed in the 1133.  When all was done, it didn't work. Lots of finger-pointing. Finally, I disconnected the 1133 from SAC-I and plugged the Async into it. Worked great.  Invited the CEs back in. That was enough proof for them to look closely ay SAC-II.  After a couple of days they were able to determine a factory mis-wire. We had a good relationship with our CEs and SEs. We're a small town and those guys were our friends.

---

From: Jeff Jonas
Sent: ‎5/‎9/‎2016 5:51 PM
To: ibm...@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: [IBM1130] What is that in the background?

[Carl Claunch]

The 1133 could have several modules installed, depending on the devices being attached.

A gate with SMS cards provides the 1403 control unit if a 1403 printer is installed.

A gate with SLT cards is installed for the selector channel capability, which provides bus and tag and implements the 360 channel interface protocols. The 1130 XIO commands are used to transfer CCWs and do the Start IO and other functions - so kind of a two step process. Devices such as the 2420 tape drives can be hooked to the bus and tag. 

The 1133 was mostly empty unless you filled it with all the options - SAC II, 1403, 2310, selector channel etc.

An 1131 can be configured to boot from one of three devices (but only one can be configured at a time) - 1442 reader, 2501 and 1134. 

Paper tape boot mode is not 8 + 8, it is odder. It is 4  bits per character, so four characters are read for each word transferred into core. This leaves other paper tape channels free for control purposes, e.g. end of boot or skip. The skip character is used as a header to ensure that damage to the beginning of a tape doesn't stop it from working with boot - use a stream of skip characters which are ignored until the first non-skip character is read. End of boot stops reading boot words to memory, resets the IAR to 0x0000 and begins execution. 

Carl

[Yvette Seifert Hirth, CCP, CDP]

From: ibm...@googlegroups.com [mailto:ibm...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Paul Tremblett
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2016 2:37 PM
To: ibm...@googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: [IBM1130] What is that in the background?

> I remember a CE telling us how our upgrade to something faster/more powerful often involved removing/disabling some inhibit circuitry.

I remember IBM upgrading the speed of some tape drives from 800 to 1600, iirc, for a retail firm in the midwest.

The SE's opened up the drive, cut one wire, and closed the drive.

The retail firm was *not* happy.

yvette

[Eddy Quicksall]

We did that with the 1403 printer. Just removed a board and put a liver of paper over the "wire" then re-inserted the card. It made the slow 1403 into a fast 1403. On the 1800 they charged according to the meter on the computer. But sometimes we had to put a job on that ran past our quitting time. So one of the guys rigged up a plunger that worked off of a signal and when our job was done the program would energize the signal and shut down the computer.

Eddy

-----Original Message-----
From: ibm...@googlegroups.com [mailto:ibm...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Yvette Seifert Hirth, CCP, CDP
Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2016 12:48 PM
To: ibm...@googlegroups.com

[Bob Flanders]

Another sighting!

On NetFlix, the movie "Is Genesis History?" at 17:40 or so... what's that in the background? I can't quite make it out....

[Paul Tremblett]

The same SE who told us about how many upgrades were performed by severing “disable” circuits once showed us what REALLY happened if you pulled the Emergency Pull switch. He showed us how to reset it and told us that we were now sworn to nver tell but to keep alive forever the myth that it would instalntly fuse every component in the computer.

[Bob Flanders]

One more ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQcnECbkD3s at 1:24 ... not quite the background

[Jeff Jonas]

>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tb0cRL2mnbA
>> At about 7:40 in the video, what is that in the background?

> One more ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQcnECbkD3s at 1:24

IBM may have been its own best customer for the 1130,
using it for HVAC, test rigs, "smart" remote terminals, etc.

[Eddy Quicksall]

IBM did use a lot of 1130's. When I was at the IBM typewriter HQ installing
my IBM3780 terminal simulator, they told me the building was full of them
... I can't remember how many I sold but it was enough to pay for the flight
& hotel plus make me plenty of money.

When I was there I showed them how to speed up their slow 1403 to full speed
by simply slipping a thin cut of paper to block the "slow down" signal. That
was funny.

Eddy

-----Original Message-----
From: ibm...@googlegroups.com [mailto:ibm...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf

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