[GMCnet] Help Needed near Oklahoma City

[D C _Mac_ Macdonald]

I got a "Black's List" call last night from a California GMCer with apparently severe engine problems some 15 or so miles east of Oklahoma City. Kaitlin is driving a 77 (455 engine) and is overnighted in a church parking lot (safely off I-40) with solar battery power and a good supply of propane and food.

I am aware that there are several ignition components that are recommended as "universal" spares for travel; module, rotor, cap, etc. I don't know if a NAPA is open on Sundays but O'Reilly's, Auto Zone, and Advance are. Would those places have the likely suspect parts and if so what part numbers (if possible).

My mechanic neighbor seems to have come down with the flu overnight, so I don't know what good I can do, but Kaitlin does have at least some rudimentary tools and has already had other assorted malfunctions.

Any ideas, help, etc. would be greatly appreciated.


D C "Mac" Macdonald
Amateur Radio K2GKK
Since 30 November '53
USAF and FAA, Retired
Member GMCMI & Classics
Oklahoma City, OK
"The Money Pit"
TZE166V101966
'76 ex-Palm Beach
k2gkk + hotmail dot com

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[John Wright]

Mac,
Without know what the symptom are it would be hard to recommend the necessary parts. Would suggest a module and a coil and look at the cap and rotor to see if they need to be replaced. Always do parts search as a 1975 or 76 Oldsmobile Toronado

AZ Module part numbers DR100 and the AC Delco model is D1906
AZ Coil Part numbers C833 or C834

Ask if it just quit or was backfiring out the back, check to see if fuel is in carb or has no spark. No spark would be the first choice.

JR Wright
GMC Great Laker MHC
GMC Eastern States Charter Member
GMCGL Tech Editor
GMCMI
78 GMC Buskirk 30’ Stretch
1975 GMC Avion (Under Reconstruction)
Michigan

[Ty Hardiman]

Mac could you put me in touch with the GMCer and I will see what I can do? You can reach me by text message or call at 405-833-4384. I submitted for
the blacklist after Elkhart but I'm not sure that my name is up there yet.
--
Ty Hardiman, Norman, OK / Member FMCA-GMCMI-GMC Classics / August 1977 Kingsley TZE167V102390 / 26' / 403 / 3.55 / 16" Wheels / Quadrajet / HEI /
Previous Owners: Basil LeBlanc, Dan Ramker / Original Owner: William Strahm, Loveland, CO

[Billy Massey]

You're on there, Ty. Thanks for being a part of it.
bdub

On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 1:07 PM, Ty Hardiman wrote:

> Mac could you put me in touch with the GMCer and I will see what I can
> do? You can reach me by text message or call at 405-833-4384. I submitted
> for
> the blacklist after Elkhart but I'm not sure that my name is up there yet.

[Jeanette Hodges]

Ty you are a gem.

Sent from my iPhone

[D C _Mac_ Macdonald]

I bought ignition module, coil, distributor cap and rotor at Auto Zone and took them to Kaitlin and Paul. Paul installed the ignition module. Dizzy cap and rotor looked okay and we put new coil, cap and rotor back in the box. Those will become MY traveling spares someday.

Ty came by and engine was started. Very noisy, much worse than my own. Ty went back to his shop for timing light. I went home for supper.

Ty went back to coach and set timing.

All set off to attempt a slow trip to Ty's shop but attempt was aborted after about 8 miles and arrival at a gas station as a safe place for overnight stay.

Towing to an as yet unknown destination will be done on Monday, probably to Ty's shop location.

Billy Massey knows of a possible replacement engine in SE Oklahoma from a coach with a wrecked aft end (as I understand it).

Adequate food and propane are available.

Stay tuned for the latest in "The Adventures of Kaitlin and Paul.|

73 de Mac, K2GKK/5
(Since 30 Nov '53)
Oklahoma City, OK
USAF Retired 61-81
FAA Retired 94-10



________________________________
From: Gmclist <gmclist...@list.gmcnet.org> on behalf of Jeanette Hodges <rjh...@gmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2017 14:58
To: gmc...@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Help Needed near Oklahoma City

Ty you are a gem.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 19, 2017, at 1:27 PM, Billy Massey <bd...@bdub.net> wrote:
>
> You're on there, Ty. Thanks for being a part of it.
> bdub
>
>
>> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 1:07 PM, Ty Hardiman wrote:
>>
>> Mac could you put me in touch with the GMCer and I will see what I can
>> do? You can reach me by text message or call at 405-833-4384. I submitted
>> for
>> the blacklist after Elkhart but I'm not sure that my name is up there yet.
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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[Ken Burton]

k2gkk wrote on Sun, 19 November 2017 19:34

> I bought ignition module, coil, distributor cap and rotor at Auto Zone and took them to Kaitlin and Paul. Paul installed the ignition module.
> Dizzy cap and rotor looked okay and we put new coil, cap and rotor back in the box. Those will become MY traveling spares someday.
>
> Ty came by and engine was started. Very noisy, much worse than my own. Ty went back to his shop for timing light. I went home for supper.
>
> Ty went back to coach and set timing.
>
> All set off to attempt a slow trip to Ty's shop but attempt was aborted after about 8 miles and arrival at a gas station as a safe place for
> overnight stay.
>
> Towing to an as yet unknown destination will be done on Monday, probably to Ty's shop location.
>
> Billy Massey knows of a possible replacement engine in SE Oklahoma from a coach with a wrecked aft end (as I understand it).
>
> Adequate food and propane are available.
>
> Stay tuned for the latest in "The Adventures of Kaitlin and Paul.|
>
> 73 de Mac, K2GKK/5
> (Since 30 Nov '53)
> Oklahoma City, OK
> USAF Retired 61-81
> FAA Retired 94-10

Had I realized that you were going to buy ignition stuff at AZ,
I would have sent this warning earlier. The HEI ignition coil
for a GMC (and TORONADO) is different that the rest of the
Oldsmobile V-8 line. The ignition coil is matched to the pick
up coil in the base of the distributor. There are 3 different
pickup coils used and 2 different ignition coils used across the
GM product V8 line. What you want to buy is an IGNITION COIL that
has RED and YELLOW wires. If you are buying the PICK UP COIL
it must have a YELLOW plastic connector on the end. The
problem at AZ (and others) is the tube jockey (Discount Tires's
TIRE MONKEY's cousin) sees both types and the only difference
he sees is the price. So usually people get the cheaper wrong
coil.

If it has RED and WHITE wires it is WRONG. If it has
RED and YELLOW wires, it is CORRECT.

--
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana

[D C _Mac_ Macdonald]

On Sunday evening, Kaitlin attempted to drive the coach to Ty Hardiman's business location but could hardly get up any upgrades so she parked it at a gas station about half way there. They had a pizza delivered there for a late supper.

Coach was towed to Ty's shop on Monday morning. Ty ran a bunch of tests on Monday including compression and leak down. Found two suspicious spark plugs and one missing bolt on exhaust manifold.

Just before 10 pm Monday, Kaitlin reported, "She lives!! She sounds and is running great."

Analysis: 2 bad plugs; missing bolt on passenger exhaust manifold,; BOTH manifold gaskets worn out; exhaust system had not been supported under the coach, causing manifold to pull away from the engine; distributor timing incorrect. All buttoned up around noon Tuesday.

Kaitlin and Paul got underway about 6 pm on Tuesday evening.

All this is a result of the superb level of assistance by Ty Hardiman, a fairly recent convert to the GMC motorhome obsession!

Bon Voyage, Kaitlin and Paul!

D C "Mac" Macdonald
Amateur Radio K2GKK
Since 30 November '53
USAF and FAA, Retired
Member GMCMI & Classics
Oklahoma City, OK
"The Money Pit"
TZE166V101966
'76 ex-Palm Beach
k2gkk + hotmail dot com



________________________________

From: D C _Mac_ Macdonald <k2...@hotmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2017 19:34
To: gmc...@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: UPDATE: Re: [GMCnet] Help Needed near Oklahoma City

[D C _Mac_ Macdonald]

http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org

[D C _Mac_ Macdonald]

I just received a text from Kaitlin. They made it to Memphis last night and expect to make the rest of the trip to Florida by tonight.

Coach running great and getting 1.5 mpg better than previously.

D C "Mac" Macdonald
Amateur Radio K2GKK
Since 30 November '53
USAF and FAA, Retired
Member GMCMI & Classics
Oklahoma City, OK
"The Money Pit"
TZE166V101966
'76 ex-Palm Beach
k2gkk + hotmail dot com



________________________________

From: Gmclist <gmclist...@list.gmcnet.org> on behalf of D C _Mac_ Macdonald <k2...@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 11:58
To: GMC Mail List
Subject: [GMCnet] UPDATE #2: Re: Help Needed near Oklahoma City

On Sunday evening, Kaitlin attempted to drive the coach to Ty Hardiman's business location but could hardly get up any upgrades so she parked it at a gas station about half way there. They had a pizza delivered there for a late supper.

Coach was towed to Ty's shop on Monday morning. Ty ran a bunch of tests on Monday including compression and leak down. Found two suspicious spark plugs and one missing bolt on exhaust manifold.

Just before 10 pm Monday, Kaitlin reported, "She lives!! She sounds and is running great."

Analysis: 2 bad plugs; missing bolt on passenger exhaust manifold,; BOTH manifold gaskets worn out; exhaust system had not been supported under the coach, causing manifold to pull away from the engine; distributor timing incorrect. All buttoned up around noon Tuesday.

Kaitlin and Paul got underway about 6 pm on Tuesday evening.

All this is a result of the superb level of assistance by Ty Hardiman, a fairly recent convert to the GMC motorhome obsession!

Bon Voyage, Kaitlin and Paul!

D C "Mac" Macdonald

[Jon Roche]

Thanks for the update. That is a great success story. The way it started out I thought another engine failure.


--
Jon Roche
75 palm beach
St. Cloud, MN
http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/

[Ty Hardiman]

I have been waiting to make sure Kaitlin and Paul and Theodore the dog made it OK before posting an update, hope this post doesn't jinx them! They
left Oklahoma City Tuesday night and made it to Memphis. I spoke to them today and they are well into Mississippi and hope to make their Florida
destination for the holidays.

When I got to them on Sunday night, Kaitlin's coach ran terrible. It was the worst running thing I've heard. Mac had been helping them diagnose the
ignition and so we decided the first step was to set the timing and confirm plug wire hookups. We also cut the zip tie holding all wires together to
eliminate the possibility of the 5-7 crossfire. We pulled the #1 plug to confirm that TDC matched our harmonic balancer timing mark. Thanks to Dick
Paterson teaching me all this over the phone when I was troubleshooting my coach this summer.

Once we trusted the timing we tried to drive the coach the 16 miles to my shop but there was just no way. It was gutless and terribly loud. They
overnighted at a gas station Sunday night and Monday we had the truck towed to my shop. Over the summer I had met with my tow operator so that he was
familiar with the right truck and hoist he would need to move our GMCs safely. Kaitlyn and Paul and Theodore the dog had to endure a few off-color tow
operator jokes on the ride in but he only charged them $165 for the 8-mile run, which seemed fine considering he did it with the right equipment.

We dug into the coach Monday night while Mac and his wife provided moral support. I wanted to set a baseline for the engine so we pulled the plugs and
ran a compression test and leak-down test and recorded for her log book. We checked the plug wires and looked over all the spark plugs, recording the
condition of each, gapping them, and numbering all of them to return to the same cylinders. It was immediately obvious that there were a couple of bad
plugs in the mix which would have put us down two cylinders.

I was suspicious of the exhaust gaskets contributing to the noise of the engine, so we decided to pull the manifolds and here's what we found first
of all the exhaust gaskets were blown out on the topside, then we found that the donut gaskets were bad as well, but the big surprise was when we
unhooked both sides of the exhaust pipes from the manifolds. The entire Y assembly with the flowmasters on it banged onto the ground. We got under the
coach and realized that there were no muffler or pipe hangers reinstalled when Kaitlin had the flowmasters put on her coach recently. The result was
that the entire assembly forward of the fuel tanks was hanging from the back of the manifolds. This, combined with loose bolts on the manifolds,
compromised all of the exhaust gaskets on the engine. We knew this had to be fixed in order to listen to the engine closely enough to diagnose further
issues.

I wanted to install Jim K's Remflex gaskets or Dave Linzi's copper ones, but I knew that we could acquire Fel-Pro's on Monday night so we decided to
proceed in that direction after visually inspecting the manifolds for cracks or warping. Tuesday we were able to pick up a couple of donuts and put
them in, then we jacked the exhaust system up and temporarily anchored it long enough to get the coach on my four post lift where we raised it and
secured the exhaust pipes back in place. New plugs, torqued everything down, and I wish I could describe the look on Kaitlin's face when she fired up
her coach to hear the engine running normally. This, after she spent the entire weekend worrying that her nice Dave M.-built 455 was gonna have to
come out. She got out for the cost of a tow and some exhaust gaskets. Couldn't ask for a better outcome over Thanksgiving.

Kaitlin is going to check the plugs and the torque on the manifold bolts daily right now and she will take the coach to a muffler shop for long-term
exhaust pipe hangers and probably install locking retainers for the exhaust bolts. She is very mechanically inclined and she understands and is
willing to learn what makes these coaches tick. We need to get her out to GMCMI Tucson this spring. She's one of the young, technically minded owners
that our community needs more of. It was a good team effort by everyone giving Kaitlin advice over the phone and some good, actually great, luck on
our part. Kaitlin and Paul took me to dinner at my favorite restaurant Monday night so I made out pretty well also!

Ty

--
Ty Hardiman, Norman, OK / Member FMCA-GMCMI-GMC Classics / August 1977 Kingsley TZE167V102390 / 26' / 403 / 3.55 / 16" Wheels / Quadrajet / HEI /
Previous Owners: Basil LeBlanc, Dan Ramker / Original Owner: William Strahm, Loveland, CO

[Kerry Pinkerton]

Tip of the hat to you Ty. I love this community!
--
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama

Had 5 over the years. Still have the first a 76 that will be rebodied into an art deco car hauler.

http://www.bdub.net/pinkerton/

'03 Fleetwood Discovery 39L

[Mike Kelley]

Glad to hear Kaitlin did not need the Illinois GMC hauler she inquired about - Dave Marchiando will be glad to hear it also.
Mike/The Corvair a holic

Sent from my iPhone

[Billy Massey]

Great report, Ty! Thanks so much for being there and taking care of them.
You are a GMC hero!

bdub

On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 1:49 PM, Kerry Pinkerton <Pinke...@mchsi.com>
wrote:

[Mike Kelley]

Way to go - Ty - you are amazing.
Thanks for letting us know the details.
Mike/The Corvair a holic

Sent from my iPhone

[Johnny Bridges via Gmclist]

If you can Ty, let her know several of us will be at Wekiwa Springs State Park in Apopka 10 - 18 December. Skycraft, The Co-Op, and Ikea are likely
junkets during the week. And Theodore can meet 3,000 or so of his closest buds at the week long dog shows.

--johnny
--
76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
"I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell" - ol Andy, paraphrased

[Jim Kanomata]

In our shop, we catch ourselves jumping into the middle of a engine issue
instead of starting with the basic and moving up.
Where your on the road and develope problems, we sometimes do not use our
talent but jump to conclusions and then need to backtrack.

--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
ji...@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502

[Carey Bryan]

Ty,

With reference to your troubleshooting Kaitlin's coach with the bad exhaust gaskets, no hangers, two bad plugs, etc, it was the best thing I have read
today. It's great to hear some difficult problems solved quickly. And cheaply. Thanks from all of us for your big heart and skills you share.

Carey
--
Carey from Ennis, Texas
78 Royale, 500 Cadillac, Rance Baxter EFI.

[Adrien Genesoto via Gmclist]

Ty,

Thanks for your report, and a good outcome to what sounded as a real problem.
Sometimes we don't get to read about the final out come.

Wishing you and the forum members a good Thanksgiving.

--
”When we avoid the mistakes we might have made, we sometimes make the mistakes that we might have avoided.”

Adrien & Jenny Genesoto
75 Glenbrook 26-3
Yuba City,Ca. Text 530-nine-3-three-3-nine-nine-6