Any advice on leaving Everest support?

[seeds]

Has anyone left everest support and do you have any advice?

[Paul Mandeltort]

At the prices they want, that's a whole lotta dev hours you could be getting...

We ran headless for a year before completely ditching the platform.
No regrets here.

Thanks,

--Paul
(from mobile)

On May 10, 2012, at 10:23 AM, Tom <tom.la...@gmail.com> wrote:

> We still have Everest support, but never use it. We have been using GreeneStep and they have been great.
>
> Thomas LaCicero
> t...@myknobs.com
> Office: 718.483.7912

>
> On 5/9/2012 10:01 PM, seeds wrote:
>> Has anyone left everest support and do you have any advice?
>>
>

> --
> Email sent to Google Groups: "Everest (Icode/Versata) ERP Users Group" group.
>
> - Post: evere...@googlegroups.com
> - Unsubscribe: everest-erp...@googlegroups.com
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> -------------------
> Access the Everest Resources Repository here: http://bit.ly/tbAy8L

[Doug Abrahamson]

We left Everest Support shortly after Versata acquired Icode.

When our maintenance renewal came up, Versata wanted to increase our
maintenance cost from 14K to 74K per year. Along with the increase,
the also wanted us to give up our perpetual 60 client licenses for
their new and improved license rental agreement. Due to the
significant cost increase, and the poor performance by Versata after
the acquisition, we felt there was no other choice. If we had signed
the license RENTAL agreement, if we stopped paying maintenance, we
could no longer run the application.

We are currently working with GreeneStep to extend Everest by building
add-in capabilities. We are also actively looking at new ERP systems
and plan to migrate in 2013.

[TheTomTom]

Check out GreeneStep. Some of the original guys are there and they are
very good and very fast. We called to spec out a change to a custom
project and the guy fixed the issue in 15 minutes with a simple SQL
trigger.

[Torbett]

 

we will be launching our new website shortly. We have intergrated it into Everest.

 

we're paying about 20K a year. Their new extortion is making you pay for additional users since they cant get anymore people go to the subscription program. They have lost lots of clients and no new revenue so this is the only way. I believe they will loose more clients as people migrate to more up to date & professionally supported products.

 

Its a shame, the back of the house product is exceptional. How a company can drive a product like Everest into the ground and heads not roll shows their intentions.

 

If you want to grow your company one must consider these things.

--
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-------------------
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--

C Torbett Crocker

 

[Brian And Cindy Turner]

I left Everest support when our contract was up an the end of last summer. I stated my complaints about how they had not delivered a usable update in over 2 years and that support had been unreliable for most of a year and a half. I had only called support for minor problems 3 times in 2 years. And that it was too much to pay for that. They made no efforts at concessions and instead kept telling me how much I would miss them and that they were going to stick it to me if I ever wanted to come back.

I have found 3 different third party support companies that have no problem supporting 5.0.2.5. You may have more trouble if your running 6.x but what I found is that any MS-SQL support person can deal with most the problems that I can't.

I can't print 2 copies on my Windows 7 workstations. I also can't bulk change browser preferences. It corrupted the whole preferences database and forced us to a backup. 5.0.2.5 is not officially supported on Win 7 but I think it has less bugs than 6.x.

Make sure you have 2 good backup systems that you have tested recovering from and then 95% of the time you can just recover to them when something goes wrong. I do one backup system to cover the databases and another that covers the system.

I know that eventually I will have to upgrade to another accounting system but that is always true to some degree. I actually don't think that staying with Everest support has much odds of extending that date anyway because Everest is finding ways to up-charge for the new features that a support contract was supposed to get you. Things like store front plus and faster speeds. Also I worry that Everest does not have a sustainable business and I could be left in a lurch if I upgrade to a buggy release and can't go back at the same time they shut their doors. Better to stick with a stable release that we have experience with and pick my exit time.

Start a relationship with one of the third parties and get them on retainer and speed dial. You don't want to be testing that water in an emergency.

Brian

On May 9, 2012, at 9:01 PM, seeds wrote:

> Has anyone left everest support and do you have any advice?
>

[Torbett]

Ditto Brian.

 

High points:

 

Dont leave V5

Get your own website

Dont expect Versata to live up to your contract of new releases but watch them chip away at what we have to find other revenue.

The tail in the tape was written on the wall when they removed the Everest Forum. Get it.

Dont live in Hope, move forward. These are not nice people.

 

Dont be stuck out in the cold when Versata closes, it is inevitable at the rate of people leaving Everest for more modern and up to date coding and design.

Don't believe you can count on these 3rd party people either. When you have a problem with their work and you need support they will vanish. They are not long term thinkers.

 

I have posted this before, consider co-oping. If we join together the cost to convert to a new solution can be shared. It doesnt take many. I have talked to several people that have left Everest and all doing the same thing and spending the same money. The expense would be hugely reduced if we co-oped.

 

If you dont make a change, you will continue to be handcuffed and extorted.

Brian, could you share your SQL guy? We are in need of one from time to time.

 

 

--

C Torbett Crocker

 

[Paul Mandeltort]

Just to follow up on Torbett's comments, we just finished migrating a few months ago. Wasn't easy or cheap but it's much smoother sailing now. Still have our migrations scripts and IP, the second as third folks to do it will have a much easier time.  Lemme know if you're interested.  The consultants we worked with are looking for new customers.  

Thanks,

--Paul

(from mobile)

[Rick Edrington]

Anyone looked at aspdotnetstorefront with links to the Everest database?

Rick Edrington

Thunderco, Inc.

909 Fisher Street

P.O. Box 920795

Houston, Tx 77292-0795

Ph:  713.681.4686x116

Cell: 713.922.9894

Fax: 713.681.4688

[Torbett]

I really hope that if people are ready to move forward that they want to co-op, why pay for everything 2-3-4 times?

 

Paul and I are using open source products and have both spent a lot to reach where we are. I dont know about Paul, but I am willing to work with other Everest clients that want to share in development and support personnel expenses. One outfit I work with started out charging 120.00/hr. Got them down to 60.00/hr and am now testing another outfit at 12.00 /hr. We know where the pot holes are. Why pay for it twice?  We are a strong force if we unite. If you do it alone as we have you will spend a lot more, and I mean a lot more.

 

Of course, if you think a closed coded product like Everest is your future then none of this matters.

[Torbett]

Is that a closed source product?

[Paul Mandeltort]

I can tell you from experience that at $12.00/hr, you will be increasing your hours billed by an order of magnitude.  :)

Aspdotnet is still closed source and locks you into the MS platform.  

We elected to ditch the Everest DB partly because I had a few database experts look at its schema and determined that it has a really lousy architecture that is nearly impossible to grow out for future business needs.  

Would definitely like to bring some other clients that are our size over to OFbiz, that would definitely reduce costs long term for us as well. 

Thanks,

--Paul

(from mobile)

[rick.ed...@gmail.com]

You can purchase the source code.

Rick Edrington

Thunderco, Inc.

909 Fisher Street

P.O. Box 920795

Houston, Tx 77292-0795

Ph:  713.681.4686x116

Cell: 713.922.9894

Fax: 713.681.4688

[Torbett]

Not sure I agree with your assessment that a 12.00 person would increase hours in magnitude. I have 6 full time people in India and this would  be an additional new source.

 

Planetshoes.com has over 10 people in China.  I dont beleive if I paid 120.00 means I'm getting better work. There are some great people in other parts of the world, not just in the US. I do beleive one needs a project manager in their firm in the US, as you have done.

[Paul Mandeltort]

I think it's highly dependent on the kind of work you're having done.  If you're just driving incremental changes and maintenance type updates, there is good value to be had. If you're trying to architect big new cool features, things go south quick without one or two folks that know the whole shebang and more importantly, best practices.  

Most of the outsourcing disasters I have seen have been because of the lack of a really capable project manager, like you said.  

Oh and I stand corrected on Aspdotnet source availability.  

Thanks,

--Paul

(from mobile)

[Torbett]

I agree completely.

[Evan Grill]

My company left at the end of 2010 after the price increase. We hired
an outside consultant as our go to guy on Everest and any
customizations. Everest 5.0.2.6 is very stable.

The consultant is Brian Chow from AIM. He is very good. If you need
addiitonal information, let me know.

Evan

[Torbett]

Yes, thank you for sharing, we would like his contact info please.

Torbett

--
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--

C Torbett Crocker

 

[Kevin Tinkelman]

Yes,

Leave, and do not look back

Greenestep will help you thru any transition/problems



Sincerely,

Kevin Tinkelman

Kevins Wholesale LLC
570.344.8985 Ext.205

[BR]

Thank you all. It's great to hear this advice. Evan could you share
Brian's contact info?

Thanks again

[NCI508]

We left Everest support when our contract expired at the end of March of this year.  We turned to GreeneStep for our Everest support, and we are very satisfied with their performance.  We backup our database every day, and we have copies of the server and client software installations in the event of a serious problem.  Fortunately we have perpetual licenses.  We are running 5.0.2.6.

[Surya Annamaneni]

I would recommend GreeneStep technologies PVT LTD. 

www.greenestep.com

(703)5464236

[Torbett]

Greenstep has poor support and will drop you if they cant fix something that they did. I have spent thousands with them and customizations are worthless since they wont repair. If his developers leave he has no one to figure anything out. So forget it if you upgrade and need the customization upgraded too.

I have tried and tried to get Sunny to 'step up to the plate' and fix his work and he just wont do it.  If thats the kind of outfit you want then go ahead with your eyes wide open. I understand others have gotten work done thats OK, thats not the issue. Its whether he will stick with you and fix problems in his work. He hasnt for us.

--

Email sent to Google Groups: "Everest (Icode/Versata) ERP Users Group" group.
 
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-------------------
Access the Everest Resources Repository here: http://bit.ly/tbAy8L

--

C Torbett Crocker

 

[Tom]

We have been working them a little while now and they have always been very responsive, even taken responsibility for code we have written.

I am surprised ( and troubled ) to hear that you have had such issues.

Thomas LaCicero
t...@myknobs.com
Office: 718.483.7912

[Rick Edrington]

I understand they are only supporting up to 5.2X? Has anyone taken the plunge to 6.X yet? What about support on 6.x? Now on 5.35.

 

 

Rick Edrington

Thunderco, Inc.

P.O. Box 920795

Houston, Texas 77292-0795

O.713.681.4686x116

F.713.681.4688

M.713.922.9894

[Tom]

yes that is correct, but we are only on 5.2 and not moving ...

[Rick Edrington]

If I could only go back….

[Tom]

that good huh?

[Rick Edrington]

Anyone using AspDotNetStorefront ?

 

Rick

[Victor Banta]

We left Everest Support after we upgraded to version 3.0.1. That's the version we are currently running.
We have built a number of php apps that integrate into the database and do various tasks. We even built an employee management page so we can list employees who go on vacation and display a page that is updated daily with who has vacation or who called in and will not be in today.

We are launching the newest update to our 'Portal' tonight.

Everest support has been no help since they went to whatever upgrade followed our current version.

So here is the advice of someone who hasn't paid for non service in years.... Make sure the version you are currently running is stable and you have redundant backups.
Find programmers like with our shop (consultants) who know this stuff inside and out then have them make web UIs to build a better inventory process or a page to create oders more tailored to what your company needs.

And like someone else wrote... Don't look back.

[Torbett]

Yes, but the trick is finding the 'consultants' to support you. Do you use anyone in the USA?

--

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-------------------
Access the Everest Resources Repository here: http://bit.ly/tbAy8L

--

C Torbett Crocker

 

[GP]

What if you need more seats?  Plan on leaving when you grow out of what you have?

 

From: evere...@googlegroups.com [mailto:evere...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Torbett
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 5:15 PM
To: evere...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [Everest-ERP] Re: Any advice on leaving Everest support?

 

Yes, but the trick is finding the 'consultants' to support you. Do you use anyone in the USA?

[Paul Mandeltort]

That's what we did... Haven't looked back. 

--Paul
---------
Paul Mandeltort
pma...@gmail.com

[Victor Banta]

Yes they are based in Des Moines, Iowa

[Victor Banta]

Purchasing more seats has been the only drawback, so I would suggest purchasing what you believe you will need before you drop support.

We might need to upgrade to the latest version "someday" . Fortunately because of the documentation the consultants have kept it should be the least amount of pain as possible when it comes to fixing broken reports and anything that breaks in  the "portal" after an upgrade. But we have gone 4 years or more without paying for non service. Up until now we have not outgrown the licenses ... but it seems we are up against the maximum number allowed.

I was kind of hoping someone on this discussion group might have a suggestion for this issue :-)

[Torbett]

 

do you mind sharing?

 

tor...@gmail.com

[Torbett]

Yes, that is the key point!

[Victor Banta]

It's a company called Source Allies, Inc on Ingersoll Avenue in Des Moines Iowa.

[Torbett]

thank you

[Brian And Cindy Turner]

I have used Dimesoft. They are in California. dimesoftinc.com

An add on that logs out idle users would help stretch the licenses. When I dropped support we went ahead and bought a couple more seats than we needed so we are still in good shape.

Another thing to look out for is that Everest added a clause to the support contract that is aimed at preventing you from working with any of their former employees. The clause was a penalty of two years of their salary. I don't know how much that is or who their former employees even are. That was one of the reasons that we dropped support. Because it was obvious that they were trying to trap us and eliminate their competition. The contract also auto-renewed every year and required 90 days notice to cancel.

Brian

[Torbett]

Its a shame Versata views is customers as a predator views it's prey. Unthinkable and bizarre business model. They know if they did what they where supposed to do they wouldnt have to take such a position.

 

Thanks for the lead.