Discombobulator

[Ted Meyers]

Wow, Sparkfun posted a short video of the "Discombobulator":  https://www.sparkfun.com/

My bot lost a bit of oil just watching the mayhem, yikes!  We're rethinking the shortcut.

It looks like the entrance is about 5-6 feet wide and maybe a foot off the ground with the ramp going out 3-4 feet and all the way across the opening.  It looks like the disk is making a revolution every 3 seconds (but it was hard to tell with the slow motion).  That is a lot faster than they implied in the earlier video.  It shouldn't be too hard to get on the disk, but getting off (in the right direction and in one piece may be another matter.

Ted

[jesse brockmann]

I hope it won't be running that fast tomorrow!   I'm guessing they did that just to be silly. Will be at testing today and see what I can find out.

JesseJay

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[Thomas Roell]

My rover got an extra set of masking tape and bumpers. Hopefully that is survivable.

[Matthew Mucker]

I must be the idiot of the group. I don't see the video. Does anyone have a direct link?

[Jon Watte]

Scroll down halfway on the page; It's two guys in a garage on the turntable.

Sincerely,

Jon Watte


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"I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have." -- Thomas Jefferson

On Fri, Jun 19, 2015 at 11:09 AM, Matthew Mucker <matthe...@gmail.com> wrote:

I must be the idiot of the group. I don't see the video. Does anyone have a direct link?

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[Wayne Holder]

While I won't be there this year (my daughter's HS graduation is on the 20th and I can't miss that!), I think that a magnetometer-based steering algorithm should, more or less, automatically adapt to the Discombobulator as long as the path takes it roughly though the center of the spinning disc and the disc is not spinning too fast.  For example, let's say the disc is spinning clockwise and you're entering from the bottom (6 o'clock position.)  When you first drive onto the disc, it's going to try and move your front end to the left as the rear wheels are not on the disc yet.  But, sensing this, the magnetometer should steer to the right to compensate.  Once all 4 wheels are on the disc, the clockwise rotation will now be turning the car to the right.  But, again, the magnetometer should sense this and turn to the left.  Then, once the front of the car makes if off the 12 o'clock position, the disc will move the rear wheels to the right while the front wheel stay fixed resulting in a net turn to the left.  But, again, I think magnetometer-based steering will handle this properly.  But, that's just a theory.  I'd love to get back some real world observations of someone trying this out, so please post some videos for us sad sacks that will miss all the fun this year.

Wayne 

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[jesse brockmann]

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[Wayne (gmail)]

Thanks.  Was anyone able to try it at practice?

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<IMG_20150619_143722.jpg>

<IMG_20150619_143326.jpg>

[jesse brockmann]

It wasn't spinning.  Several could complete runs going across it.  Running anyones guess.  I have heard it spins at 60rpm!!!!

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[Ted Meyers]

Yes, but it wasn't spinning today.  According to one of the Sparkfun guys I talked to, it spins somewhere around 70 rpm.  Crazy Fast.  It seems that the gasoline motor they are using is not geared enough to go any slower.  Also, it is a narrow target to hit, about 6 feet wide.  At that speed, it is going something like 20 fps out at the edge.  My bot could use it as a treadmill; I'm sure that the gyros could compensate, but my fear is that they can't compensate fast enough unless there is a way found to slow it down.  Maybe if I can get it going fast enough it can enough of the disk to make it across.

Ted

[wholder]

So, I heard chatter that a few bots found a way to jump over the Discombobulator.  Anyone manage to get a video that shows this, or shows any bit going up against it?

Wayne

[Minuteman]

Rich (roadrunner) and I (minuteman) both discovered on Friday that it was possible to jump the discombobulator at about 20-25mph, and land cleanly on the other side. It was not our original plan to do so, because it seemed too risky. But we dialed-in the course at slow speed, and continued cranking it up until we could do it consistently. At that point, it was less risky than going around the rest of the course.

Roadrunner jumped the discombobulator in all three heats. Minuteman did in the first 2 heats, as well as a solo run (with gopro) and during the mass start.

Here is a quick clip of minuteman, at about 25mph:

https://youtu.be/31mbCRszmEk?t=2h39m17s


Nathan

[Wayne Holder]

Wow, that goes by very quickly, but Nice job!

Wayne

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[jesse brockmann]

I have video of JRover launching over it I'll post later. And picture of attempt that did not go well.  But alas no video of when I broke the discombobulator. :)

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[Ted Meyers]

My bot doesn't go 25 mph :(  Need faster bot!!!!

[Ted Meyers]

Due to the placement of the discombobulator, it was very hard to see bots going over it or even attempting.

Ted

[Minuteman]

Ya, tell me about it! I could see it go around that corner, then I just had to watch the crowd's reaction. 

[Minuteman]

Here is a better video:

https://youtu.be/dn-9TqoLifY

On Monday, June 22, 2015 at 4:20:11 PM UTC-6, wholder wrote:

[Minuteman]

A video of roadrunner:
https://youtu.be/NqT5eNmb-Yw

[jesse brockmann]

A video of JRover:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1TRo62CTtc

On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 10:25 PM, Minuteman <nathan....@gmail.com> wrote:

A video of roadrunner:
https://youtu.be/NqT5eNmb-Yw

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[Jon Watte]

Seems like this mystery obstacle turned mainly into a jump.

Which is great for fast bots!

Sincerely,

jw

Sincerely,

Jon Watte


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[Ted Meyers]

Ha, yeah!  As it turns out the only bots that got over it (while running) jumped it.  But then again, the only bots that got to it (while running) jumped it.  (Many more bots got to it in practice, but it wasn't running).

Maybe if it is to work as a discombobulator the ramp (aka jump) should be removed.  Or at least moved about 10 feet back, so that fast bots that make the jump will _land_ on the discombobulator -- that would be interesting!  Oh yeah, I like that idea.  But, good grief, slow that sucker down a bit!

Ted

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[Rich B (Roadrunner)]

I found roadrunner (1/10th scale) performed flawlessly on the course and in jumping the discombobulator once its course was dialed in. It had 3 flawless runs in the competition.

wilie e. coyote (1/16th scale) was a different matter. It would run the course just fine, but wouldn't consistently launch over the discombobulator. I think the car's shorter length and higher speed needed to completely clear the obstacle resulted in it launching at different angles and that resulted in inconsistent results. During heat 1, it slammed into one of the discombobulator's walls and failed to complete the course. In between heat 1 and 2, I increased the speed and changed some waypoints. The last practice test resulted in a high speed crash with the fence. After hot gluing the front suspension back together, heat 2 resulted in the car the just spinning around in circles...turns out the high speed crash killed my gyro. After replacing the gyro, but doing no testing, heat 3 resulted in a low speed crash with a different fence. Lesson learned...smaller cars should avoid the discombobulator. I will be avoiding it with my smaller car next year.

[Jon Watte]

Physics says that the speed needed to clear the same hurdle from the same ramp is the same.

Unless air drag is a real part of the equation for the smaller car?

Sincerely,

jw

Sincerely,

Jon Watte


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"I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have." -- Thomas Jefferson

On Fri, Jun 26, 2015 at 5:40 AM, Rich B (Roadrunner) <ric...@burnsides.org> wrote:

I found roadrunner (1/10th scale) performed flawlessly on the course and in jumping the discombobulator once its course was dialed in. It had 3 flawless runs in the competition.

wilie e. coyote (1/16th scale) was a different matter. It would run the course just fine, but wouldn't consistently launch over the discombobulator. I think the car's shorter length and higher speed needed to completely clear the obstacle resulted in it launching at different angles and that resulted in inconsistent results. During heat 1, it slammed into one of the discombobulator's walls and failed to complete the course. In between heat 1 and 2, I increased the speed and changed some waypoints. The last practice test resulted in a high speed crash with the fence. After hot gluing the front suspension back together, heat 2 resulted in the car the just spinning around in circles...turns out the high speed crash killed my gyro. After replacing the gyro, but doing no testing, heat 3 resulted in a low speed crash with a different fence. Lesson learned...smaller cars should avoid the discombobulator. I will be avoiding it with my smaller car next year.

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[Rich B (Roadrunner)]

Speed relative to its size.

[Jon Watte]

Speed relative to its size.

Ah! Yeah, that makes more sense :-)

Sincerely,

jw

Sincerely,

Jon Watte


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[Thomas Roell]

Rich was running the same RC Base as we did. Trying to jump showed big instabilities along the longitudinal direction. Sometime it would start to backflip and sometimes it would start to frontflip. The speed/direction band where you had a decent arc was too small. N.b. Killer Kitty was heavier than W. E. Coyote, which certainly contributed to the instabilities. My son was running a similar chassis, but with a longer wheel base. That one did not have those roll issues.

- Thomas

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[Jon Watte]

Hmm. Is there a place for gyroscopes in the AVC? :-)

Sincerely,

Jon Watte


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[Minuteman]

Yes, first place...:)