Fwd: Notes 8/25

[Mar]

Notes from Monday's meeting. We need your voices! 

The only disagreement was, Denhac is pretty adamant on keeping their name, at least those six letters (they are willing to add a subtitle).

Though not a total deal breaker for me, I personally believe that the name change is crucial to a fair merging. It demonstrates coming together under a common banner. I believe continuing in a new space under the denhac name may feel like an absorption of Concoctory, and could be damaging to preserving our culture.

So, if you have an opinion on the name, please speak up. If you disagree with me, that's fine too! Say it. If you're a member, please speak up. If you aren't, speak up anyway. 

Notes below. 

>1 hr of talking about names in circles; time for talking-stick exercise!
Straw poll:
Denhac: are you willing to change the name or not?
Concoctory: if we don't change the name, is it a deal-breaker?

DENHAC
8 want to keep specifically 'Denhac', but don't mind changing the tagline and/or logo
2 would rather keep Denhac, but not married to it
2 indifferent; if there's a new cool name, might support it, but need to be convinced
1 name change could be a positive thing, support it

CONCOCTORY
4 indifferent about the name, concerned about the culture, but would give it a try if it seems a good fit
3 really want name to change, but not a final deal breaker, lowered enthusiasm/acceptance
1 doesn't like culture, may still join, but doesn't think they'll mix
1 want to combine both names together in some way
1 would not want to be a member, but occasionally help


NEXT STEPS / ACTION ITEMS

ME:

• Call Tony and get a time set up for Denhac + Concoctory to view the space.
• Possible times:
• Not wed or thu or tue
• Ask about Friday afternoon, later in the day
• Get another day next week too!!
• Research tax impact 501c3 merging with a CO nonprofit
• Research OMF lease to see if a CO nonprofit could sublease/merge/cohabit the new space
  

Both groups:

• Send our "agreed so far" bullet points to both sets of members for discussion (3):
• Denhac members want to keep "Denhac" but open to discussion of changing tagline/logo/branding joint projects/anything else
• Concoctory members would prefer a name change, may feel less included without, not necessarily a deal-breaker for all
  
• Creating a combined culture inclusive of both hackerspaces' members is a mutual goal of all parties
  
• Assuming both groups' members affirm the bullet points above:
• Mutually plan out use of new space
• Any member from each group - think of a few new taglines/logos/etc
  
• Combined groups from both orgs - meet and discuss that  ---^
  
• Plan out October First Friday party
  

[Jason Bosch]

I'm in agreement with you Mar. I do not support the name Denhac because I think it's a dull name but also the way I understood it was that the purpose of the merger was to create something new and better, which is more inviting to more people with diverse interests. If it's going to remain Denhac then it's just a takeover.

 

Jason

 

 

 

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From: "Mar" <m...@sudux.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2014 9:08 PM
To: conco...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [Concoctory] Fwd: Notes 8/25

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[Daryl Lyn]

What does the Concoctory need to stay afloat, and what does it need to thrive / grow?

I just landed a 3-6mo contract, and will have a more flexible budget for awhile.

What are the other members ability to cover the shortfall in funds?  How many new members would we need in order to keep it afloat at current rates?

I am willing to put an extra $100 next month (September).  What do other people have the ability to offer?

If we have people and willingness to set up the 3D scan booth, I have several potential venues, but now that I have a contract, I am not as physically available.

Thoughts?

Daryl Lyn

720-327-9416

[Mar]

At this point we're pretty locked in to the merger.

Denhac has found a great space on 6th and right off sante fe. The current concoctory space is becoming an art co-op (Cabal) and tentatively opening October 3rd. The classes will keep going, and funding the new space.

Daryl, we definitely need this kind of enthusiasm going forward. We'll have a great new space to grow in, and the funds and resources we need to thrive.

Jason, I feel ya. I do...

I don't think any of us want to see concoctory just blink out of existence. We all put a ton of love in to it and built a very unique little  community.

The question becomes, how do we mingle our culture with denhac's to create the sort of fusion that is, at its root, what hackerspaces are all about?

I think it's possible under the denhac banner if the collective can get behind it. I think it's possible under a new banner if the collective is vocal enough.

So I'd like to see this thread light up. What makes you enthusiastic about this? Where do you want to put your energy? How do we build something amazing together, and what problems can we head off that might hurt your enthusiasm?

[Lafe Spietz]

I'm going to regret doing this, but I'm going to post my opinion here.

To me the Concoctory was never really a hacker space, it was a largely art space and maker space.  To me what that means is that a lot of people were making not just art but anything that's NOT computer/software type stuff.  I.e. not linux, not raspberry pi, not open source politics etc.  It was a hacker space in name but the people who actually showed up were often basically doing art, and that was fun.  This was the only time I'd been in a hacker space that I actually stayed more than 25 minutes precisely because of the ways it was NOT a hacker space.  

Personally, I hate hacker spaces and hacker culture, and there were many times in the last year when I almost packed up my shit and left because of interactions I had with people from that culture.  But the good outweighed the bad, the hacker part stayed in name only and I stayed.  Until a couple weeks ago, after which the negatives topped what remained of the positives and I did finally pack my shit up and leave.  

So.  On the one hand my opinion of how to go ahead with a hacker space is a very bad opinion to listen to because I've already left and because I don't really buy into the hacker space movement in general.  But as a person who likes to be in creative spaces but not hacker spaces, this whole Denhack thing is one of several deal breakers and I will not be part of a new hacker space under any banner.  Maybe there is a way to keep some of the art space spirit in the way Cabal is run, and keep some of the same people involved?  If so, I'm interested.  As would probably other people who liked the art aspects but were scared off by hacker culture from our old space. 

If people want to take this opportunity to flame me for not liking hacker culture, please just don't.  I'll unsubscribe and not read it.  

Lafe

[Daryl Lyn]

I agree with Lafe on that aspect of it.  I have mostly used my time creating things that are on the art side of hacking, and very much liked the creatively charged environment of the Concoctory.

I do have a strong agreement with the importance of open software and hardware and the associated movements, as these are valuable tools for the creation of beautiful and useful things and the development of innovative and improved technology.

>> "The question becomes, how do we mingle our culture with denhac's to create the sort of fusion that is, at its root, what hackerspaces are all about?"

Is the difference between the "creative, artistic, makerspace" and the "hackerspace" such that the two should be combined in a distinct kind of way?  ie, "Denhac & Concoctory" "<logo> & <logo>"?

[Jason Bosch]

How about Dencoc for a name :D

 

 

 

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From: "Daryl Lyn" <daryllynp...@gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 30, 2014 1:22 PM
To: conco...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [Concoctory] Fwd: Notes 8/25

[Mar]

I've gotten a few more emails privately that people are not so happy about the denhac naming issue and culture mixing...

Another option... 

Let's pretend for a moment that Concoctory can teach workshops at any space. Cabal, denhac, coffee shops, etc. Instead of putting that money in to a new hackerspace, instructors could keep a much larger share, because we wouldn't have the overhead. We could sell off some equipment, donate some, and hang on to what we use for classes. (Soldering irons, 3D printer, etc). 

Is this route interesting to any of you? It likely wouldn't take much to get organized this way. 

[Mar]

And to be clear here, Concoctory would continue, but it would no longer be a physical space. Thoughts?

[Fred Roybal]

Cabal?

Sent from Gmail Mobile

[Mar]

Oops. Cabal is the name of the art co-op moving in. 

[Mar]

So whatever we do here, decision needs to happen soon.

We have until the 15th to start selling, donating or moving the equipment. (Or some combination).

[Christopher Chadwick]

Sorry I have been quiet.. I think this is the best idea yet. If ppl want to join denhac cool. (I am a member)

I don't see a benefit that makes sense to "merge". 

Chris

[David L. Willson]

Lafe,

As a person who believes deeply in the free software, free culture, free society movement, and as a person who believes that hacker-spaces and the like are an important part of that movement, I'd really love to know what it is that you don't like about them. I've heard your negative feelings, and I've read and re-read your message, searching for the causes thereto, but I'm unable to find them.

Would you mind saying plainly what it is *you* dislike about hacker-spaces and hacker culture?

I can tell you what *I* dislike:

- filth, clutter, failure to keep the commons clean
- immature/entitled attitudes
- failure to minimize waste / do recycling

But I am unable to ascribe these traits to the freedom movement or hacker-spaces, when I see the same traits everywhere. For example: I go to Chipotle, which is kept clean by the employees, and steered by owners with very mature attitudes, who present the opportunity to minimize waste with 3 clearly labelled cans, and I see that the *customers* just don't care enough to take the time to sort their waste into recycle/compost/trash. I don't see that as Chipotle's problem; I see it as a cultural problem. And, I don't see a simple solution.

Please don't take this as a flame; it's not meant as one. I am genuinely curious about the cause(s) of your aversion to hacker-spaces.

--
David L. Willson
Teacher, Engineer, Evangelist
RHCE+Satellite CCAH Network+ A+ Linux+ LPIC-1 UbuntuCP NovellCLA
Mobile 720-333-LANS(5267)
http://sofree.us

This is a good time for a r3VOLution.

---

[Daryl Lyn]

I like the idea of keeping The Concoctory as a teaching and educational group. I noticed that there is a significant difference between the Concoctory and the other hackerspaces. I think that the artist and educator flavor to it has a lot to do with this.

I think calling it a makerspace is a much better term.

[Daryl Lyn]

PS, if it comes to it I might want to buy the Taz 3. Hopefully it does not though.