Repairs are Disabled

[gtr]

I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
and noted this:

"warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."

I ran it again after rebooting in recovery mode. Same conclusion

How do I "enable" repairs?

[nospam]

<https://www.alsoft.com/DiskWarrior/index.html>

[Your Name]

You can't repair the boot drive since the system is using it. You will
need to boot from another drive instead and repair the "faulty" drive.
Make sure you have a good backup first though, just incase.

[gtr]

On 2019-06-09 01:54:44 +0000, Jolly Roger said:

> You can't repair a volume you are booted on. Reboot in macOS Recovery
> and do it that way instead.

Isn't that what I did? I held command-R to boot, then ran First Aid.

[nospam]

In article <gm3774...@mid.individual.net>, Jolly Roger

> You can't repair a volume you are booted on. Reboot in macOS Recovery
> and do it that way instead.

he did that.

[gtr]

Hmm. I have TechTool Pro 11, and though I've never used it for anything
significant, maybe creating an "edrive" on an outboard drive will allow
me to external access to the issues.

I'll check into that.

[nospam]

In article <qdi43g$eh$1...@news.albasani.net>, gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:

> >>> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
> >>> and noted this:
> >>>
> >>> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
> >>>
> >>> I ran it again after rebooting in recovery mode. Same conclusion
> >>>
> >>> How do I "enable" repairs?
> >>
> >> You can't repair a volume you are booted on. Reboot in macOS Recovery
> >> and do it that way instead.
> >
> > he did that.
>
> Hmm. I have TechTool Pro 11, and though I've never used it for anything
> significant, maybe creating an "edrive" on an outboard drive will allow
> me to external access to the issues.

no need for tech tool and i wouldn't trust it over diskwarrior.

you could try booting from an external drive and run disk utility,
however, that's effectively what recovery does, so it's not likely to
make a difference.

as i said, get diskwarrior.

or, if you don't want to buy it, you can always backup/reformat/restore.

definitely do the first of those, because if there is directory
corruption, you are going to need it, and it won't be at a convenient
time either.

[gtr]

So this "repairs are disabled"; does that mean anything?

[nospam]

In article <qdi6hm$mo0$1...@news.albasani.net>, gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:

> >> Hmm. I have TechTool Pro 11, and though I've never used it for anything
> >> significant, maybe creating an "edrive" on an outboard drive will allow
> >> me to external access to the issues.
> >
> > no need for tech tool and i wouldn't trust it over diskwarrior.
> >
> > you could try booting from an external drive and run disk utility,
> > however, that's effectively what recovery does, so it's not likely to
> > make a difference.
> >
> > as i said, get diskwarrior.
> >
> > or, if you don't want to buy it, you can always backup/reformat/restore.
> >
> > definitely do the first of those, because if there is directory
> > corruption, you are going to need it, and it won't be at a convenient
> > time either.
>
> So this "repairs are disabled"; does that mean anything?

from what i can find online, it ultimately means reformat/restore,
however, diskwarrior can probably fix it.

[David Empson]

According to previous posts, gtr is running macOS 10.14.5. A Mojave
system drive will be APFS, which the current version of DiskWarrior
(5.2) cannot repair.

TechTool Pro 11 claims to support repairing APFS volumes but who knows
how good a job it will do.

Personally I'd just copy off anything which might not have been backed
up, wipe it and restore from a backup.

--
David Empson
dem...@actrix.gen.nz

[nospam]

In article <1o8x2gk.1slzx2w12xo29qN%dem...@actrix.gen.nz>, David

Empson <dem...@actrix.gen.nz> wrote:

> > > So this "repairs are disabled"; does that mean anything?
> >
> > from what i can find online, it ultimately means reformat/restore,
> > however, diskwarrior can probably fix it.
>
> According to previous posts, gtr is running macOS 10.14.5. A Mojave
> system drive will be APFS, which the current version of DiskWarrior
> (5.2) cannot repair.

good point. that won't work.

> TechTool Pro 11 claims to support repairing APFS volumes but who knows
> how good a job it will do.

given how well it works with hfs, not good.

> Personally I'd just copy off anything which might not have been backed
> up, wipe it and restore from a backup.

yep

[Lewis]

In message <qdhlec$eob$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance

Don't do that.

> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."

Are you actually having problems?

--
Qui me amat, amat et canem meam

[Lewis]

I would not run a 3rd party utility on an APFS drive. Not TTP (even
though it claims to work with APFS) and certainly not DiskWarrior which
has not been updated for APFS at all as far as I know.

You cannot "repair" SSDs in the sense that you could repair spinning
rust.

If you are having problems, the solution is to reformat and reinstall
from backups. If you are not having problems, then reformat and
reinstall from backup when you do start having problems, if ever.

Unless the machine is under warranty/Applecare, in which case open a
ticket now.

--
I went to a restaurant that serves "breakfast at any time". So I ordered French Toast during the Renaissance.

[JF Mezei]

Question:

on APFS drives, does the "restore" partition being in use preclude
certain operations in the other partitions?

In other words, do certain operations require you either boot from a
different GPT partition or separate physical drive in order to ensure
that the APFS container is not in use ?


Booting from the restore partition would have the APFS container "in
use" so I am thinking perhaps some types of repairs would not be allowed.

The free disk space for instance is shared across volumes insde an APFS
container, so checking/fixing free disk space on a volume would affect
the Restore partition volume (which is in use).


Please see this message as a question, not statement of what happens.

[gtr]

On 2019-06-09 14:34:15 +0000, Lewis said:

> In message <qdhlec$eob$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
>
> Don't do that.

Why not? If I hadn't done it, I wouldn't find out there's an issue.

>> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
>
> Are you actually having problems?

Yes, but they are odd, inconsistent and really seem more related to
program operation than system stuff.

[gtr]

On 2019-06-09 14:38:35 +0000, Lewis said:

> If you are having problems, the solution is to reformat and reinstall
> from backups. If you are not having problems, then reformat and
> reinstall from backup when you do start having problems, if ever.

Duly stashed. Assuming that's the course of action, does one reformat
the internal drive by running Disk Utilities and doing it from there?
Or recovery mode. Or perhaps by initially booting from an outboard
drive?

[David B.]

On 09/06/2019 19:34, gtr wrote:
> On 2019-06-09 14:34:15 +0000, Lewis said:
>
>> In message <qdhlec$eob$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>>> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
>>
>> Don't do that.
>
> Why not?  If I hadn't done it, I wouldn't find out there's an issue.

I agree with what you are doing! ;-)

>>> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
>>
>> Are you actually having problems?
>
> Yes, but they are odd, inconsistent and really seem more related to
> program operation than system stuff.

FWIW, I started up with Cmd +R and then carried out a First Aid using
the Disk Utility

Then I elected to carry out the Reinstall macOS

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201314

Before doing all that though, if I were you I'd run a scan with
Malwarebytes for Mac - Free! https://www.malwarebytes.com/mac/

--
David B.
Devon, UK

[nospam]

either of the last two. you can't format the boot drive.

[Lewis]

In message <qdjjg1$qfj$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
> On 2019-06-09 14:34:15 +0000, Lewis said:

>> In message <qdhlec$eob$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>>> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
>>
>> Don't do that.

> Why not? If I hadn't done it, I wouldn't find out there's an issue.

IF there is an issue. "Disk first aid" is not a "periodic maintenance
tool" and should not be used as it it were.

>>> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
>>
>> Are you actually having problems?

> Yes, but they are odd, inconsistent and really seem more related to
> program operation than system stuff.

In the case, reformat the drive and reinstall from backup, Unless it's
under warranty/Apple Care in which case contact Apple.


--
"How good bad music and bad reasons sound when we march against an
enemy." - Friedrich Nietzsche

[Lewis]

Recovery mode can reformat the drive you boot from. There is no need for
a second drive.

--
'We get that in here some nights, when someone's had a few. Cosmic
speculation about whether the gods exist. Next thing, there's a bolt of
lightning through the door with a note wrapped round it saying, "Yes, we
do" and a pair of sandals with smoke coming out.' (Small Gods)

[Lewis]

You absolutely can reformat the boot drive when you boot from recovery
unless that has changed VERY recently. (like since Mojave .0 came out).

--
Penny! *Everything* is better with BlueTooth

[nospam]

In article <slrnqfqrcc....@darth.lan>, Lewis

<g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> >>
> >> > If you are having problems, the solution is to reformat and reinstall
> >> > from backups. If you are not having problems, then reformat and
> >> > reinstall from backup when you do start having problems, if ever.
> >>
> >> Duly stashed. Assuming that's the course of action, does one reformat
> >> the internal drive by running Disk Utilities and doing it from there?
> >> Or recovery mode. Or perhaps by initially booting from an outboard
> >> drive?
>
> > either of the last two. you can't format the boot drive.
>
> You absolutely can reformat the boot drive when you boot from recovery
> unless that has changed VERY recently. (like since Mojave .0 came out).

recovery is a separate partition and can format the main partition. if
he boots normally, he cannot do that.

[Jolly Roger]

Nowhere in his original post did he say that’s what he did.

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

[Jolly Roger]

Nowhere in your original post did you say that’s what you did.

[Jolly Roger]

Yep. This is what backups are for. Wipe it and restore. Done deal. No need
for DiskWarrior or other additional expense.

[Jolly Roger]

Lewis <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> In message <qdjjg1$qfj$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>> On 2019-06-09 14:34:15 +0000, Lewis said:
>
>>> In message <qdhlec$eob$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>>>> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
>>>
>>> Don't do that.
>
>> Why not? If I hadn't done it, I wouldn't find out there's an issue.
>
> IF there is an issue. "Disk first aid" is not a "periodic maintenance
> tool" and should not be used as it it were.
>
>>>> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
>>>
>>> Are you actually having problems?
>
>> Yes, but they are odd, inconsistent and really seem more related to
>> program operation than system stuff.
>
> In the case, reformat the drive and reinstall from backup

Yup. This is what backups are for.

[nospam]

In article <gm5d3k...@mid.individual.net>, Jolly Roger

<jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:

> >>> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
> >>> and noted this:
> >>>
> >>> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
> >>>
> >>> I ran it again after rebooting in recovery mode. Same conclusion
> >>>
> >>> How do I "enable" repairs?
> >>
> >> You can't repair a volume you are booted on. Reboot in macOS Recovery
> >> and do it that way instead.
> >
> > Isn't that what I did? I held command-R to boot, then ran First Aid.
>

> Nowhere in your original post did you say that零 what you did.

yes he did:

[nospam]

In article <gm5d3l...@mid.individual.net>, Jolly Roger

<jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:

> >>> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
> >>> and noted this:
> >>>
> >>> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
> >>>
> >>> I ran it again after rebooting in recovery mode. Same conclusion
> >>>
> >>> How do I "enable" repairs?
> >>
> >> You can't repair a volume you are booted on. Reboot in macOS Recovery
> >> and do it that way instead.
> >
> > he did that.
>

> Nowhere in his original post did he say that零 what he did.

yes he did:

[David B.]

On 09/06/2019 22:47, Jolly Roger wrote:
> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>> On 2019-06-09 01:54:44 +0000, Jolly Roger said:
>>
>>> On 2019-06-09, gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>>>> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
>>>> and noted this:
>>>>
>>>> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
>>>>
>>>> I ran it again after rebooting in recovery mode. Same conclusion
>>>>
>>>> How do I "enable" repairs?
>>>
>>> You can't repair a volume you are booted on. Reboot in macOS Recovery
>>> and do it that way instead.
>>
>> Isn't that what I did? I held command-R to boot, then ran First Aid.
>
> Nowhere in your original post did you say that’s what you did.

Yes, he did! ;-)

He said ..... "I ran it again after rebooting in recovery mode."

[Your Name]

It can depend on where the problems are on the drive. The Recovery
Partition is actually still part of the same physical drive.

[David B.]

I'm not 100% sure you are right about that! ;-)

How to use *Internet Recovery* to reinstall macOS

https://www.macworld.co.uk/how-to/mac/restore-mac-without-recovery-3636668/

I did do this on my old iMac! ;-)

[Your Name]

Recovery Mode and Internet Recover are two differnt things.

Recovery Mode is a specific, protected, partition on your local drive
(Carbon Copy Cloner can make a backup of it). Internet Recover connects
to the Internet instead of booting on the local drive.

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-09 21:04, Your Name wrote:

> Recovery Mode is a specific, protected, partition on your local drive
> (Carbon Copy Cloner can make a backup of it). Internet Recover connects
> to the Internet instead of booting on the local drive.

Question: does Internet recovery give the same functionality as booting
from recovery partition (terminal, running disk util etc), or is it a
"blind install onto a blank disk" function because it is espected to be
involked only when the system disk has been zapped/replaced ?

[Jolly Roger]

JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> On 2019-06-09 21:04, Your Name wrote:
>
>> Recovery Mode is a specific, protected, partition on your local drive
>> (Carbon Copy Cloner can make a backup of it). Internet Recover connects
>> to the Internet instead of booting on the local drive.
>
> Question: does Internet recovery give the same functionality as booting
> from recovery partition (terminal, running disk util etc),

Try it yourself, you lazy fuck.

[gtr]

On 2019-06-09 21:47:34 +0000, Jolly Roger said:

> Lewis <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>> In message <qdjjg1$qfj$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>>> On 2019-06-09 14:34:15 +0000, Lewis said:
>>
>>>> In message <qdhlec$eob$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>>>>> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
>>>>
>>>> Don't do that.
>>
>>> Why not? If I hadn't done it, I wouldn't find out there's an issue.
>>
>> IF there is an issue. "Disk first aid" is not a "periodic maintenance
>> tool" and should not be used as it it were.
>>
>>>>> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
>>>>
>>>> Are you actually having problems?
>>
>>> Yes, but they are odd, inconsistent and really seem more related to
>>> program operation than system stuff.
>>
>> In the case, reformat the drive and reinstall from backup
>
> Yup. This is what backups are for.

Okay, all other options have pooped out and I still have a mismatch
between extent references.

To ensure I've got the drill straight, "reformat/reinstall" is comprised of:

1) Using Disk Utility to "erase" the base drive "Apple SSD SM102...",
and not my personally named "gtr's drive".
1b) I assume there's no need to do a reinstall of OSX.
2) Then do a restore from Time Machine Backup.

I also assume I will not have a chance between these two tasks to
rename my drive again "gtr's drive", but that Time Machine will give me
a pass on that by simpy picking from among my (one) time machine
backups...? I'll rename my drive when I've survived the process.

[David B.]

Far be it for me to tell you what to do, 'gtr' but, if you have the
time, may I suggest that you *DO* reinstall macOS and *NOT* restore from
your Time Machine back-up in the first instance.

I say this because you may, like me, be amazed at how much of your data
is already just there, from the cloud!

If things ARE missing, you can then carry out the exercise again and
restore from your Time Machine.

[nospam]

In article <qhWLE.204449$9X3.1...@fx02.fr7>, David B.

<BDo...@REMOVE.gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Far be it for me to tell you what to do,

then don't.

> 'gtr' but, if you have the
> time, may I suggest that you *DO* reinstall macOS and *NOT* restore from
> your Time Machine back-up in the first instance.

incredibly stupid advice.

[Your Name]

On 2019-06-11 22:06:34 +0000, gtr said:

> On 2019-06-09 21:47:34 +0000, Jolly Roger said:
>
>> Lewis <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>>> In message <qdjjg1$qfj$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>>>> On 2019-06-09 14:34:15 +0000, Lewis said:
>>>
>>>>> In message <qdhlec$eob$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>>>>>> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
>>>>>
>>>>> Don't do that.
>>>
>>>> Why not? If I hadn't done it, I wouldn't find out there's an issue.
>>>
>>> IF there is an issue. "Disk first aid" is not a "periodic maintenance
>>> tool" and should not be used as it it were.
>>>
>>>>>> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
>>>>>
>>>>> Are you actually having problems?
>>>
>>>> Yes, but they are odd, inconsistent and really seem more related to
>>>> program operation than system stuff.
>>>
>>> In the case, reformat the drive and reinstall from backup
>>
>> Yup. This is what backups are for.
>
> Okay, all other options have pooped out and I still have a mismatch
> between extent references.
>
> To ensure I've got the drill straight, "reformat/reinstall" is comprised of:
>
> 1) Using Disk Utility to "erase" the base drive "Apple SSD SM102...",
> and not my personally named "gtr's drive".

We don't know what the "gtr's drive" is.

If it's a separate external drive, then no, there's no point reformatting that.

If it's a partition on the main drive, then it depends on the issues
that need to be fixed. All the partitions may well need to be erased
and then recreated.

ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS do a new full backup before reformatting a drive.

[JF Mezei]

A couple of points to understand:

Formatting the *drive* requires you boot from a different physical
device. You will create 1 APFS partition (the APFS container) and
inside, create the main drive volume. The Time Machine backup you have
will populate this main drive volume, but will not create/populate the
recovery volume also inside the APFS container.

So before you do that, you want to look for utilities that will populate
the recovery partition for you, (usually needs the istaller .dmg image
for the utility to source the components). The instructions for that
utiility will describe whether it will create the recovery volume inside
APFS container or if you will need to create it.


If you only reformat the system volume, it leaves the APFS container and
the recovery partition inside it intact.

This saves you from having to recreate/populate the recovery partition.

But I am not 100% certain that Disk Util would fix any problems that
reside in structures common to all volumes in an APFS container (the
free boocks list appears to be common for instance).

Running Disk Util "verify" on the recovery volume without any problems
would point to problems in your system volume being local to it and not
in the APFS portion, so mere rformatting of system volume would solve it.

I have not seen architecture documentation on APFS, but know that
volumes inside the APFS container share free space. Not sure how much
more is shared and whether Disk Utility will repair APFS level
structures when only reformatting a volume inside the APFS container.

Others may chime in with more complete/correct info. This may be helpful
to you IF you encounter problemns when recreating the system.

[gtr]

On 2019-06-12 01:31:47 +0000, Your Name said:

> On 2019-06-11 22:06:34 +0000, gtr said:
>
>> On 2019-06-09 21:47:34 +0000, Jolly Roger said:
>>
>>> Lewis <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>>>> In message <qdjjg1$qfj$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>>>>> On 2019-06-09 14:34:15 +0000, Lewis said:
>>>>
>>>>>> In message <qdhlec$eob$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>>>>>>> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Don't do that.
>>>>
>>>>> Why not? If I hadn't done it, I wouldn't find out there's an issue.
>>>>
>>>> IF there is an issue. "Disk first aid" is not a "periodic maintenance
>>>> tool" and should not be used as it it were.
>>>>
>>>>>>> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Are you actually having problems?
>>>>
>>>>> Yes, but they are odd, inconsistent and really seem more related to
>>>>> program operation than system stuff.
>>>>
>>>> In the case, reformat the drive and reinstall from backup
>>>
>>> Yup. This is what backups are for.
>>
>> Okay, all other options have pooped out and I still have a mismatch
>> between extent references.
>>
>> To ensure I've got the drill straight, "reformat/reinstall" is comprised of:
>>
>> 1) Using Disk Utility to "erase" the base drive "Apple SSD SM102...",
>> and not my personally named "gtr's drive".
>
> We don't know what the "gtr's drive" is.

It's the base internal drive, the one within "Apple SSD..."

> If it's a separate external drive, then no, there's no point reformatting that.

Certainly not. My problems are in the internal drive.

> If it's a partition on the main drive, then it depends on the issues
> that need to be fixed. All the partitions may well need to be erased
> and then recreated.
>
> ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS do a new full backup before reformatting a drive.

Of course, superduped and time machine, and then a few other drives in
the closet too.

>
>> 1b) I assume there's no need to do a reinstall of OSX.
>> 2) Then do a restore from Time Machine Backup.
>>
>> I also assume I will not have a chance between these two tasks to
>> rename my drive again "gtr's drive", but that Time Machine will give me
>> a pass on that by simpy picking from among my (one) time machine
>> backups...? I'll rename my drive when I've survived the process.

So these, my questions, remain confusing. If I erase the drive but do
no reinstall of OSX, I'm not sure how my small "restore" drive
partition comes to be.

[gtr]

On 2019-06-12 03:03:38 +0000, JF Mezei said:

> A couple of points to understand:
>
> Formatting the *drive* requires you boot from a different physical
> device.

So anyone with mismatches in their extents would first need to buy
another physical harddrive?

> You will create 1 APFS partition (the APFS container) and
> inside, create the main drive volume. The Time Machine backup you have
> will populate this main drive volume, but will not create/populate the
> recovery volume also inside the APFS container.
>
> So before you do that, you want to look for utilities that will populate
> the recovery partition for you, (usually needs the istaller .dmg image
> for the utility to source the components). The instructions for that
> utiility will describe whether it will create the recovery volume inside
> APFS container or if you will need to create it.

I've never heard of recovery-drive installer utilities before. That's
a new one on me.

> If you only reformat the system volume, it leaves the APFS container and
> the recovery partition inside it intact.
>
> This saves you from having to recreate/populate the recovery partition.
>
> But I am not 100% certain that Disk Util would fix any problems that
> reside in structures common to all volumes in an APFS container (the
> free boocks list appears to be common for instance).
>
> Running Disk Util "verify" on the recovery volume without any problems
> would point to problems in your system volume being local to it and not
> in the APFS portion, so mere rformatting of system volume would solve it.
>
> I have not seen architecture documentation on APFS, but know that
> volumes inside the APFS container share free space. Not sure how much
> more is shared and whether Disk Utility will repair APFS level
> structures when only reformatting a volume inside the APFS container.
>
> Others may chime in with more complete/correct info. This may be helpful
> to you IF you encounter problemns when recreating the system.

I've surprised to find previous recommendations to wipe the drive and
restore from Time Machine, left out so many other additional tasks
and/or utilities that need to be procured!

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-12 02:44, gtr wrote:

> So anyone with mismatches in their extents would first need to buy
> another physical harddrive?

NORMALLY, the disk utility should be able to repair in-site by booting
from recovery or a USB stick.

So you present a problem because you don't appear to be able to repair
the disk normally.

> I've never heard of recovery-drive installer utilities before. That's
> a new one on me.

You need to google them, they arean't from Apple. And if you have a
APFS dirve, you need to make sure you get a recent one that manages APFS
recovery volumes.

> I've surprised to find previous recommendations to wipe the drive and
> restore from Time Machine, left out so many other additional tasks
> and/or utilities that need to be procured!

If you only recreate the system volume, leave the APFS container and
recovery volumes alone, then you don't need to worry. But if you
reformat the whole drive then you have to worry about it.

[David B.]

On 12/06/2019 00:38, nospam wrote:
> In article <qhWLE.204449$9X3.1...@fx02.fr7>, David B.
> <BDo...@REMOVE.gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Far be it for me to tell you what to do,
>
> then don't.

But I wanted to!

>> 'gtr' but, if you have the
>> time, may I suggest that you *DO* reinstall macOS and *NOT* restore from
>> your Time Machine back-up in the first instance.
>
> incredibly stupid advice.

Explain *WHY*.

[Lewis]

In message <eYZLE.43944$VL4....@fx19.iad> JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> A couple of points to understand:

> Formatting the *drive* requires you boot from a different physical
> device.

Not true. I reformatted my iMac internal drive by booting from recovery
and reformatting it. The Recovery drive is loaded entirely into RAM.

<https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201314>
"How to use macOS Recovery"

...

"Disk Utility: Use Disk Utility to repair or erase your startup disk or
other hard disk."

> You will create 1 APFS partition (the APFS container) and inside,
> create the main drive volume.

No you will not, You will reformat the drive, then install the OS. You
will NOT go around creating volumes.


--
Y is for YORRICK whose head was knocked in
Z is for ZILLAH who drank too much gin

[Lewis]

In message <qdq70r$4oo$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
> On 2019-06-12 03:03:38 +0000, JF Mezei said:

>> A couple of points to understand:
>>
>> Formatting the *drive* requires you boot from a different physical
>> device.

> So anyone with mismatches in their extents would first need to buy
> another physical harddrive?

No, JF is full of shit.

> I've never heard of recovery-drive installer utilities before. That's
> a new one on me.

See above.

> I've surprised to find previous recommendations to wipe the drive and
> restore from Time Machine, left out so many other additional tasks
> and/or utilities that need to be procured!

See above.

--
I always take life with a grain of salt, plus a slice of lime and a
shot of tequila.

[André G. Isaak]

If you think about this for awhile, you should be able to figure out the
answer yourself.

[Hint: You claimed to be "amazed" by how much of your data was in the
cloud. ["worried" might have been a better word-choice] Did you notice
how much of your data *wasn't* stored in the cloud?].

André

--
To email remove 'invalid' & replace 'gm' with well known Google mail
service.

[David B.]

On 12/06/2019 14:28, André G. Isaak wrote:
> On 2019-06-12 3:07 a.m., David B. wrote:
>> On 12/06/2019 00:38, nospam wrote:
>>> In article <qhWLE.204449$9X3.1...@fx02.fr7>, David B.
>>> <BDo...@REMOVE.gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Far be it for me to tell you what to do,
>>>
>>> then don't.
>>
>> But I wanted to!
>>
>>>> 'gtr' but, if you have the
>>>> time, may I suggest that you *DO* reinstall macOS and *NOT* restore
>>>> from
>>>> your Time Machine back-up in the first instance.
>>>
>>> incredibly stupid advice.
>>
>> Explain *WHY*.
>
> If you think about this for awhile, you should be able to figure out the
> answer yourself.
>
> [Hint: You claimed to be "amazed" by how much of your data was in the
> cloud. ["worried" might have been a better word-choice] Did you notice
> how much of your data *wasn't* stored in the cloud?].

Of course - how could it have been?!!!

André, I was endeavouring to help 'gtr' better understand the operating
system he's using.

I'm sure 'gtr' will have understood that items/data which he has
personally stored on his own hard drive will *have* to be recovered from
his Time Machine or other back-up(s).

[nospam]

In article <5j7ME.2$vt...@fx16.fr7>, David B. <BDo...@REMOVE.gmail.com>
wrote:

> >>>> 'gtr' but, if you have the
> >>>> time, may I suggest that you *DO* reinstall macOS and *NOT* restore
> >>>> from your Time Machine back-up in the first instance.
> >>>
> >>> incredibly stupid advice.
> >>
> >> Explain *WHY*.
> >
> > If you think about this for awhile, you should be able to figure out the
> > answer yourself.
> >
> > [Hint: You claimed to be "amazed" by how much of your data was in the
> > cloud. ["worried" might have been a better word-choice] Did you notice
> > how much of your data *wasn't* stored in the cloud?].
>
> Of course - how could it have been?!!!
>
> André, I was endeavouring to help 'gtr' better understand the operating
> system he's using.

no you weren't.

> I'm sure 'gtr' will have understood that items/data which he has
> personally stored on his own hard drive will *have* to be recovered from
> his Time Machine or other back-up(s).

changing your story so soon?

[gtr]

On 2019-06-09 00:55:40 +0000, gtr said:

> I ran first aid on my 1T internal SSD drive, just periodic maintenance

> and noted this:

>
> "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are disabled."
>

> I ran it again after rebooting in recovery mode. Same conclusion
>
> How do I "enable" repairs?

Ah, the inscrutable Time Machine...

Yesterday I ran SuperDuper on my startup drive as a safety. Just
before I started I noticed that TM was starting a back up and I clicked
"cancel this backup" and continued. Afterwards, I rebooted from that
external drive and attempted a Disk Utility First Aid on my internal
drive. It found the same extent mismatch. Oh well.

I then rebooted from my internal drive. Soon thereafter I noted that
TM was beginning its back up again. I noticed it was backing up 780G,
which was the full content of my drive. It was 4:00pm and I left the
house for the evening. This morning it had the last 30G to go. It
just finished and did a *complete* backup, rather than incremental.

Any guesses as to why?

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-12 08:33, Lewis wrote:

> Not true. I reformatted my iMac internal drive by booting from recovery
> and reformatting it. The Recovery drive is loaded entirely into RAM.

You did not format the drive while booted on that drive. You reformatted
one APFS volume on that drive.

> No you will not, You will reformat the drive, then install the OS. You
> will NOT go around creating volumes.

Then please explain how you can zap the drive, which zaps the very
recovery volume from which you have booted and running the disk utility
software which zaps the disk.

[André G. Isaak]

When you boot into recovery mode, the system and all utilities are first
copied to a RAM-disk very early in the boot-process. It's from that
RAM-disk that the boot process completes.

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-12 14:53, André G. Isaak wrote:

> When you boot into recovery mode, the system and all utilities are first
> copied to a RAM-disk very early in the boot-process. It's from that
> RAM-disk that the boot process completes.

Wonder how they played the proper tricks to unmap virtual memory of the
already loaded code to the on-disk code. akal elikminate ALL links to
the original recovery drive disk. Or if they are able to create a RAM
disk that survives a reboot and then boot from the RAM disk.


If recovery does allow you to zap the drive itself, it does mean that
you MUST use time machine right after to restore your data otherwise you
have an empty unbootable hard drive and can't reboot to use Time Machine
to restore disk.

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-12 15:02, Jolly Roger wrote:

> That's an incorrect assumption. After you erase the drive, you need to
> install macOS onto it.

Can't you restore the systen volume from Time Machine backup?

Installing a virgin OS-X copy means that when you restore from Time
Machine, you have to tell it to overwrite all existing files anyways
since you want all your config files to be restored over the virgin
ones, and want your more recent systen in Tiome Machine (with all
patches, security updates) to replace potentially older ones in the
virgin OS distribution.

Ideally, one could also backup the recovery partition and recreate it
too, but that seems harder to do with all the right flags to mark it as
a recovery partition isntead of any partition.


> The macOS installer will ask you if you want to transfer your data from
> a backup drive. Follow the prompts to select the backup drive when you
> get to this point, and Migration Assistant will take care of the rest.

Does Migration Assistant handle ALL customizations even parameters you
changed with ThinkerTool of "defaults write" commands?

[gtr]

On 2019-06-12 19:02:14 +0000, Jolly Roger said:

> On 2019-06-11, gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>> On 2019-06-09 21:47:34 +0000, Jolly Roger said:
>>
>>> Yup. This is what backups are for.
>>
>> Okay, all other options have pooped out and I still have a mismatch
>> between extent references.
>>
>> To ensure I've got the drill straight, "reformat/reinstall" is comprised of:
>>
>> 1) Using Disk Utility to "erase" the base drive "Apple SSD SM102...",
>> and not my personally named "gtr's drive".
>> 1b) I assume there's no need to do a reinstall of OSX.
>

> That's an incorrect assumption. After you erase the drive, you need to
> install macOS onto it.
>

>> 2) Then do a restore from Time Machine Backup.
>

> The macOS installer will ask you if you want to transfer your data from
> a backup drive. Follow the prompts to select the backup drive when you
> get to this point, and Migration Assistant will take care of the rest.

> You'll end up with a new install of macOS with all of your data and
> settings transferred to the new system.

>
>> I also assume I will not have a chance between these two tasks to
>> rename my drive again "gtr's drive", but that Time Machine will give me
>> a pass on that by simpy picking from among my (one) time machine
>> backups...? I'll rename my drive when I've survived the process.
>

> You can provide a name for the drive when you do the erase.
>
> Just boot into macOS Recovery, erase the drive, reinstall macOS, and
> transfer your data when prompted. Done deal.
>
> <https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204904>

Sooner or later, I figured you'd come to my rescue. Thanks for clarifying.

[gtr]

On 2019-06-12 19:31:13 +0000, JF Mezei said:

> On 2019-06-12 15:02, Jolly Roger wrote:
>
>> That's an incorrect assumption. After you erase the drive, you need to
>> install macOS onto it.
>
> Can't you restore the systen volume from Time Machine backup?

Say, JF, do you realize how extraordinary off-the-mark your advice
regarding cleaning up my situation was? I mean really: extraordinarily
wrong it seems.

I think I've gotten good feedback one topic or another from you over
the years. But honestly: Where the hell would I be tomorrow if I'd gone
off on such a wild goose chase as you recommended to fix my issues?

I never *ever* hold the crew here responsible for my actions, no matter
what the hell they are. It's always my decision to accept one view and
reject another. And perhaps I've become complacent or gullible or
simply made too many assumptions, but generally have gotten good tips
and information about all kids of simple and not-so-simple things. So
I appreciate the crew mightily, even those that are quick to irritation
or disrespect.

Still, I have to ask, where did you get this "cure" for me? Just off
the top of your head? Something that just seemed logical to you? If
so, you really should have underscored that your remarks were in that
context.

Really, man!

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-12 16:02, gtr wrote:

>> Can't you restore the systen volume from Time Machine backup?
>
> Say, JF, do you realize how extraordinary off-the-mark your advice
> regarding cleaning up my situation was? I mean really: extraordinarily
> wrong it seems.

was told long ago by the Apple apol;igists here that a Time Machine
backup will restore the whole volume into bootable state. Now, because
I state what I learned from them, they negate what they told me just
because they always negate what I say.

What Time Machines does NOT have are folders explicitely exluded in the
Time Machine advanced setup. And I would assume there is an internal
list such as page/swap files that are not backed up.

Re-installing from scratch solves the problem of creating the recovery
partition. But after erasing your drive comoletely, and "living" only
on RAM, you can't reboot, so you better have that OS system disk ready
to lauch and install;.

If you live off RAM, make sure that whatever files that were in your
recovery partition and needed to re-install from scratch are actually
copied to the RAM disk.

The goalsd of these discusssions is to provide the "Gotchas" that you
have to check for. At the end of the day, it is your system and your
decision.

[nospam]

In article <1kdME.2437$Cu....@fx16.iad>, JF Mezei

<jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> >> Can't you restore the systen volume from Time Machine backup?
> >
> > Say, JF, do you realize how extraordinary off-the-mark your advice
> > regarding cleaning up my situation was? I mean really: extraordinarily
> > wrong it seems.
>
> was told long ago by the Apple apol;igists here that a Time Machine
> backup will restore the whole volume into bootable state. Now, because
> I state what I learned from them, they negate what they told me just
> because they always negate what I say.

you're confused.

> What Time Machines does NOT have are folders explicitely exluded in the
> Time Machine advanced setup.

no backup will have what's excluded, not just time machine.

> And I would assume there is an internal
> list such as page/swap files that are not backed up.

no need to back that up. you could back up and restore it, but it will
be overwritten the next time the system boots, so why bother.

[gtr]

On 2019-06-12 20:16:28 +0000, Jolly Roger said:

> On 2019-06-12, gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>>
>> I appreciate the crew mightily, even those that are quick to irritation
>> or disrespect.
>

> You got me, there. Luckily, my patience level varies from individual to
> individual. My patience with JF Mezei ran out long, long ago. You and
> others, not so much! : D

Well, there's still time...

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-12 16:12, Jolly Roger wrote:

> Nonsense. Migration Assistant does the right thing. There's no need for
> you to lift a finger. Just follow the prompts to tell it what to restore
> and you are done.

I don't trust a utility that asks me what to restore since it was
desigend for selective restore onto a new system, not a full restore.

Migration Assistant also has a lot of logic to covert config files and
various built-in application databases (Mail, Photos, iTunes etc) and
can only copy or upgrade them to a target OS of equal or higher version
than the backup.

If you were running X.3 and the "fresh" copy of OS-X you install is X.0,
consider the risk that Migration Assistant will fail or refuse to work
because it is not equipped to do downgrades, at which point, you need to
install all the updates your your new virgin system and then run
miugration assistant. You end up wasting much more time compared to just
using Time Machine to restore the system disk. You can still install
OS-X as first step as this will recreate your recovery partition with
all the right flags. And then whjen doing Time Machine, just tell it to
overwrite all files.

Tkem Machine blindly copies files without interpreting their content, so
you get an exact copy of what you had before. Not an interrpeted copy
which may or may not have copied everything from obscure directories.

Note: if between X.0 and X.3, some files were removed from the system
directories, doing an install of X.0 and then using Time Machine to
overwite the system disk may leave those files around even if no longer
needed.

[gtr]

On 2019-06-12 20:33:01 +0000, JF Mezei said:

> On 2019-06-12 16:02, gtr wrote:
>
>>> Can't you restore the systen volume from Time Machine backup?
>>
>> Say, JF, do you realize how extraordinary off-the-mark your advice
>> regarding cleaning up my situation was? I mean really: extraordinarily
>> wrong it seems.
>
> was told long ago by the Apple apol;igists here that a Time Machine
> backup will restore the whole volume into bootable state. Now, because
> I state what I learned from them, they negate what they told me just
> because they always negate what I say.

I accept your apology.

> What Time Machines does NOT have are folders explicitely exluded in the
> Time Machine advanced setup. And I would assume there is an internal
> list such as page/swap files that are not backed up.

They don't matter.

> Re-installing from scratch solves the problem of creating the recovery
> partition.

This, instead of the "go-find-the-software" utility you mentioned? Did
"apple apologists" confer this view, and you're now proffering it again
as your own opinion? For which you'll assign blame to them for what
you said. Again?

> But after erasing your drive comoletely, and "living" only
> on RAM, you can't reboot, so you better have that OS system disk ready
> to lauch and install;.

I thought they stopped producing system disks for installation a long
time ago. I'll continue with my own belief on that.

> If you live off RAM, make sure that whatever files that were in your
> recovery partition and needed to re-install from scratch are actually
> copied to the RAM disk.

Sure. I'll put that on my WTF lisk to check off before I begin.

> The goalsd of these discusssions is to provide the "Gotchas" that you
> have to check for. At the end of the day, it is your system and your
> decision.

I already stated who is reponsible for what I do. These decisions are
always more difficult when people effect a tone of authority about
soutions they are relaying--apparently from people they don't even
respect!

Nothing addresses a valid complaint like honesty and direct contrition.

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-12 16:41, nospam wrote:
>
> you're confused.

So please confirm then that a Time Machine backup being restored to an
empty drive will NOT be bootable and will not contain an exact copy of
your original system (minus the items you specifically exlcuded and
those not worth packing up such as page/swap files).

I was told by many to stop using Disk Util to create .dmgs as backups
and use Time AMchine as it will recreate your system disk exactly as it
was before.

[nospam]

In article <XBdME.10872$t_3....@fx18.iad>, JF Mezei

<jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:

>
> > Nonsense. Migration Assistant does the right thing. There's no need for
> > you to lift a finger. Just follow the prompts to tell it what to restore
> > and you are done.
>
> I don't trust a utility that asks me what to restore since it was
> desigend for selective restore onto a new system, not a full restore.

it's designed for both.

> Migration Assistant also has a lot of logic to covert config files and
> various built-in application databases (Mail, Photos, iTunes etc) and
> can only copy or upgrade them to a target OS of equal or higher version
> than the backup.

and it works exceptionally well.

> Tkem Machine blindly copies files without interpreting their content, so
> you get an exact copy of what you had before. Not an interrpeted copy
> which may or may not have copied everything from obscure directories.

which is exactly what is desired for a full restore.

[nospam]

In article <oTdME.32112$3T5....@fx45.iad>, JF Mezei

<jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> >
> > you're confused.
>
> So please confirm then that a Time Machine backup being restored to an
> empty drive will NOT be bootable and will not contain an exact copy of
> your original system (minus the items you specifically exlcuded and
> those not worth packing up such as page/swap files).

you're confused.

a full restore will normally be bootable.

there is also no need to specifically exclude anything, unless for some
reason, you don't want it backed up. an example would be vmware or
parallels guest files, which may have their own backup tools.

> I was told by many to stop using Disk Util to create .dmgs as backups
> and use Time AMchine as it will recreate your system disk exactly as it
> was before.

yep.

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-12 17:03, gtr wrote:

> This, instead of the "go-find-the-software" utility you mentioned? Did
> "apple apologists" confer this view, and you're now proffering it again
> as your own opinion? For which you'll assign blame to them for what
> you said. Again?

Before I stop interacting with you:

I tried to show potential pitfals and options to makesure you know of
potential problems and avoid them.

Your apple apologist buddies justy provide you with a "sky is blue, just
press this button all will be fine, don't worry about anything".

I did not blame them. Your stating I blame them for some unspecified
thing makes it look like you have an agenda other than to learn what the
various and bvest ways to accom]lish your task is.

So, considering your attiutude, I urge you to totally forget everyuthing
I receommended and go strictly by what your Apple apologists recommended
and press on onat one button without checking for any of the pitfals I
warned abouts icne obviously those don't exists according to the people
you beleive.

An an Apple Shareholder, I will therefore suggest a better and easier
solution:

Buy a new Mac and get the blue/gree/red shirted ones at the Apple Store
to do the transfer from old to new Mac for you for free. Much simpler.

And I did not apoligize BTW. I will however say "FUCK YOU" for not
appreciating that I took the time to answer your queries and try to find
possible avenues and things to check for instead of the assholes who
just tell you to press one button and get it all done easily.

[nospam]

In article <J2eME.36533$cZ6....@fx47.iad>, JF Mezei

<jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> I urge you to totally forget everyuthing
> I receommended

ok!

> and go strictly by what your Apple apologists recommended
> and press on onat one button without checking for any of the pitfals I
> warned abouts icne obviously those don't exists according to the people
> you beleive.

they aren't actually pitfalls.

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-12 17:20, nospam wrote:

>> I was told by many to stop using Disk Util to create .dmgs as backups
>> and use Time AMchine as it will recreate your system disk exactly as it
>> was before.
>
> yep.

So why did you state I was confused to discredit my statement that Time
Machine will fully restore your dick in one go?

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-12 17:25, nospam wrote:

> they aren't actually pitfalls.

Are you confirming that Migration Assistant is now able to convert files
from newer OS down to an older version of the OS ?

[nospam]

In article <PleME.21656$Sf1....@fx33.iad>, JF Mezei

<jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:

>
> > they aren't actually pitfalls.
>
> Are you confirming that Migration Assistant is now able to convert files
> from newer OS down to an older version of the OS ?

nobody said it would.

like i said, they aren't actually pitfalls.

[nospam]

In article <kkeME.21655$Sf1....@fx33.iad>, JF Mezei

because you got a lot of the details wrong, and you *really* should
proofread your posts, because that is a rather amusing typo...

[David Empson]

gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:

> On 2019-06-12 03:03:38 +0000, JF Mezei said:
>
> > A couple of points to understand:
> >
> > Formatting the *drive* requires you boot from a different physical
> > device.
>
> So anyone with mismatches in their extents would first need to buy
> another physical harddrive?

No. Booting from the Recovery Volume is sufficient.

Or booting from the backup of the recovery volume on your Time Machine
drive (assuming you use Time Machine to back up your computer to a drive
that plugs into the computer via USB or similar, not over a network).

Or using Internet Recovery.

In all three cases, you can run Disk Utility from the menu and erase the
internal drive.

> > You will create 1 APFS partition (the APFS container) and
> > inside, create the main drive volume. The Time Machine backup you have
> > will populate this main drive volume, but will not create/populate the
> > recovery volume also inside the APFS container.

Wrong. Doing a full restore from a Time Machine backup also recreates
the recovery volume.

> > So before you do that, you want to look for utilities that will populate
> > the recovery partition for you, (usually needs the istaller .dmg image
> > for the utility to source the components). The instructions for that
> > utiility will describe whether it will create the recovery volume inside
> > APFS container or if you will need to create it.

Also wrong. If for some reason you did end up without a recovery volume,
you can create it again by running the normal macOS installer for the
version you are already running, and install the OS on top of the
existing installation.

> I've never heard of recovery-drive installer utilities before. That's
> a new one on me.

New one for everyone except JF Mezei's imagination, I think.

> > If you only reformat the system volume, it leaves the APFS container and
> > the recovery partition inside it intact.
> >
> > This saves you from having to recreate/populate the recovery partition.
> >
> > But I am not 100% certain that Disk Util would fix any problems that
> > reside in structures common to all volumes in an APFS container (the
> > free boocks list appears to be common for instance).

It has already been established that Disk Utility can't fix the problem.
If that problem is in container-level data structures then erasing just
the volume is not going going to help. It is easiest to erase the entire
drive (therefore the APFS container).

> > Running Disk Util "verify" on the recovery volume without any problems
> > would point to problems in your system volume being local to it and not
> > in the APFS portion, so mere rformatting of system volume would solve it.
> >
> > I have not seen architecture documentation on APFS, but know that
> > volumes inside the APFS container share free space. Not sure how much
> > more is shared and whether Disk Utility will repair APFS level
> > structures when only reformatting a volume inside the APFS container.
> >
> > Others may chime in with more complete/correct info. This may be helpful
> > to you IF you encounter problemns when recreating the system.

>
> I've surprised to find previous recommendations to wipe the drive and
> restore from Time Machine, left out so many other additional tasks
> and/or utilities that need to be procured!

That's because they are not necessary.

--
David Empson
dem...@actrix.gen.nz

[Andreas Rutishauser]

In article <gmd4l3...@mid.individual.net>,
Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:

> On 2019-06-12, JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> > On 2019-06-12 15:02, Jolly Roger wrote:
> >
> >> That's an incorrect assumption. After you erase the drive, you need to
> >> install macOS onto it.
> >
> > Can't you restore the systen volume from Time Machine backup?
>

> Who cares? Reboot into macOS Recovery, erase the drive, reinstall macOS,
> transfer your data when prompted with Migration Assistant. It's
> brain-dead simple. You end up with a pristine operating system and all
> of your settings and data.

why should I erase the drive, pull macOS from the internet, install it,
run Installation assistant?

Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
backup.

Cheers
Andreas

--
MacAndreas Rutishauser, <http://www.MacAndreas.ch>
EDV-Dienstleistungen, Hard- und Software, Internet und Netzwerk
Beratung, Unterstuetzung und Schulung
<mailto:and...@MacAndreas.ch>, Fon: 044 / 721 36 47

[David B.]

On 13/06/2019 07:30, Andreas Rutishauser wrote:
> In article <gmd4l3...@mid.individual.net>,
> Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2019-06-12, JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>>> On 2019-06-12 15:02, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>
>>>> That's an incorrect assumption. After you erase the drive, you need to
>>>> install macOS onto it.
>>>
>>> Can't you restore the systen volume from Time Machine backup?
>>
>> Who cares? Reboot into macOS Recovery, erase the drive, reinstall macOS,
>> transfer your data when prompted with Migration Assistant. It's
>> brain-dead simple. You end up with a pristine operating system and all
>> of your settings and data.
>
> why should I erase the drive, pull macOS from the internet, install it,
> run Installation assistant?
>
> Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
> backup.

Exactly HOW does one do that, Andreas?!!

Ah! It's all described here for anyone who wants to know! ;-)

https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT203981

[gtr]

On 2019-06-13 06:30:52 +0000, Andreas Rutishauser said:

> In article <gmd4l3...@mid.individual.net>,
> Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2019-06-12, JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>>> On 2019-06-12 15:02, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>
>>>> That's an incorrect assumption. After you erase the drive, you need to
>>>> install macOS onto it.
>>>
>>> Can't you restore the systen volume from Time Machine backup?
>>
>> Who cares? Reboot into macOS Recovery, erase the drive, reinstall macOS,
>> transfer your data when prompted with Migration Assistant. It's
>> brain-dead simple. You end up with a pristine operating system and all
>> of your settings and data.
>
> why should I erase the drive, pull macOS from the internet, install it,
> run Installation assistant?
>
> Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
> backup.

Restoring wouldn't fix the inherent disk issue. Remember the topic and
first post: "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are
disabled."

[David B.]

What *DID* you do to 'fix' it?

Is your computer running properly now?

[Lewis]

In message <_ubME.34325$en1....@fx02.iad> JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> On 2019-06-12 08:33, Lewis wrote:

>> Not true. I reformatted my iMac internal drive by booting from recovery
>> and reformatting it. The Recovery drive is loaded entirely into RAM.

> You did not format the drive while booted on that drive. You reformatted
> one APFS volume on that drive.

You are wrong.

>> No you will not, You will reformat the drive, then install the OS. You
>> will NOT go around creating volumes.

> Then please explain how you can zap the drive, which zaps the very
> recovery volume from which you have booted and running the disk utility
> software which zaps the disk.

If you do not believe me you can 1) read the link I posted that you
snipped. 2) Ask Apple 3) try it yourself.


--
'The only reason we're still alive now is that we're more fun alive than
dead,' said Granny's voice behind her. --Lords and Ladies

[Lewis]

In message <gmd0hm...@mid.individual.net> Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
> On 2019-06-11, gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>> On 2019-06-09 21:47:34 +0000, Jolly Roger said:
>>
>>> Yup. This is what backups are for.
>>
>> Okay, all other options have pooped out and I still have a mismatch
>> between extent references.
>>
>> To ensure I've got the drill straight, "reformat/reinstall" is comprised of:
>>
>> 1) Using Disk Utility to "erase" the base drive "Apple SSD SM102...",
>> and not my personally named "gtr's drive".
>> 1b) I assume there's no need to do a reinstall of OSX.

> That's an incorrect assumption. After you erase the drive, you need to
> install macOS onto it.

If you restore from Time Machine in Recovery I believe it takes care of
the system and the restore all at once. Assuming you included the system
files. You can also simply boot from the Time Machine drive itself to do
the restore.

I haven't done this myself, but I hear it can be done.

>> 2) Then do a restore from Time Machine Backup.

> The macOS installer will ask you if you want to transfer your data from
> a backup drive.

Restore from Time Machine is right there at the top-level of the
recovery partition menu.

--
Nihil est--in vita priore ego imperator Romanus fui.

[Lewis]

In message <XBdME.10872$t_3....@fx18.iad> JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> On 2019-06-12 16:12, Jolly Roger wrote:

>> Nonsense. Migration Assistant does the right thing. There's no need for
>> you to lift a finger. Just follow the prompts to tell it what to restore
>> and you are done.

> I don't trust a utility that asks me what to restore since it was
> desigend for selective restore onto a new system, not a full restore.

That's YOUR problem, not a problem with Migration Assistant.

> If you were running X.3 and the "fresh" copy of OS-X you install is X.0,
> consider the risk that Migration Assistant will fail or refuse to work

You are so entirely full of FUDster shit.

--
'They were myths and they were real,' he said loudly. 'Both a wave and a
particle.' --Guards! Guards!

[Lewis]

In message <qdrlo2$30v$1...@news.albasani.net> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
> Say, JF, do you realize how extraordinary off-the-mark your advice
> regarding cleaning up my situation was? I mean really: extraordinarily
> wrong it seems.

He always finds a way to fuck everything up.

--
<div id="me"><div id="Dennis Miller>It's just my opinion. I could be
wrong.</div>But I'm not.</div>

[Lewis]

In message <J2eME.36533$cZ6....@fx47.iad> JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> On 2019-06-12 17:03, gtr wrote:

>> This, instead of the "go-find-the-software" utility you mentioned? Did
>> "apple apologists" confer this view, and you're now proffering it again
>> as your own opinion? For which you'll assign blame to them for what
>> you said. Again?

> Before I stop interacting with you:

Ooooo! Promise?

> I tried to show potential pitfals and options to makesure you know of
> potential problems and avoid them.

No, you spread lies, misinformation, and idiocy.

--
The quality of our thoughts and ideas can only be as good as the quality
of our language.

[nospam]

In article <gmfbhd...@mid.individual.net>, Jolly Roger

<jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:

> > Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
> > backup.
>

> Booting from a backup volume means the OS will change files on the
> backup volume as it boots and runs from it, which is a bad idea because
> it puts your backup data at risk of being changed or corrupted since the
> last backup was made. If that happens, you're fucked. It is a much
> better practice to boot from macOS Recovery instead, which is why it
> exists in the first place. But far be it for me to try to stop people
> from doing stupid things. You do you.

true, but does not apply to booting from a time machine archive, which
has its own boot partition.

[David B.]

On 13/06/2019 17:23, Jolly Roger wrote:

> Wrong. Nowhere does Apple advise you to boot from the Time Machine
> backup volume.

I will accept an apology from you! ;-)

(It's right up there in the article - *First choice*!)

[nospam]

In article <BfvME.972$fv7...@fx08.fr7>, David B.

<BDo...@REMOVE.gmail.com> wrote:

> >>> Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
> >>> backup.
> >>
> >> Exactly HOW does one do that, Andreas?!!
> >>
> >> Ah! It's all described here for anyone who wants to know! ;-)
> >>
> >> https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT203981
> >
> > Wrong. Nowhere does Apple advise you to boot from the Time Machine
> > backup volume.
>
> I will accept an apology from you! ;-)

how about a kick to the head?

> (It's right up there in the article - *First choice*!)

it isn't.

[David B.]

On 13/06/2019 18:23, nospam wrote:
> In article <BfvME.972$fv7...@fx08.fr7>, David B.
> <BDo...@REMOVE.gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>>> Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
>>>>> backup.
>>>>
>>>> Exactly HOW does one do that, Andreas?!!
>>>>
>>>> Ah! It's all described here for anyone who wants to know! ;-)
>>>>
>>>> https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT203981
>>>
>>> Wrong. Nowhere does Apple advise you to boot from the Time Machine
>>> backup volume.
>>
>> I will accept an apology from you! ;-)
>
> how about a kick to the head?

If that's what you need to understand the facts, I'm sure some folk here
will willingly give you such a kick in your head, Dickhead.

>> (It's right up there in the article - *First choice*!)
>
> it isn't.

*YES* - it is! Proof here:- https://imgur.com/a/5K80xs6

[nospam]

In article <ZYwME.406$vt...@fx16.fr7>, David B.

<BDo...@REMOVE.gmail.com> wrote:

> >>>>> Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
> >>>>> backup.
> >>>>
> >>>> Exactly HOW does one do that, Andreas?!!
> >>>>
> >>>> Ah! It's all described here for anyone who wants to know! ;-)
> >>>>
> >>>> https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT203981
> >>>
> >>> Wrong. Nowhere does Apple advise you to boot from the Time Machine
> >>> backup volume.
> >>
> >> I will accept an apology from you! ;-)
> >
> > how about a kick to the head?
>
> If that's what you need to understand the facts, I'm sure some folk here
> will willingly give you such a kick in your head, Dickhead.

i understand it quite well. you do not.

people have already begun to queue to kick you in places you didn't
even know existed. word on the street is many of them brought large
metal pipes and at least one has a gun.

> >> (It's right up there in the article - *First choice*!)
> >
> > it isn't.
>
> *YES* - it is! Proof here:- https://imgur.com/a/5K80xs6

that doesn't say what you think it does.

you haven't a clue.

[David B.]

On 13/06/2019 20:00, nospam wrote:
> In article <ZYwME.406$vt...@fx16.fr7>, David B.
> <BDo...@REMOVE.gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>>>>> Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
>>>>>>> backup.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Exactly HOW does one do that, Andreas?!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ah! It's all described here for anyone who wants to know! ;-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT203981
>>>>>
>>>>> Wrong. Nowhere does Apple advise you to boot from the Time Machine
>>>>> backup volume.
>>>>
>>>> I will accept an apology from you! ;-)
>>>
>>> how about a kick to the head?
>>
>> If that's what you need to understand the facts, I'm sure some folk here
>> will willingly give you such a kick in your head, Dickhead.
>
> i understand it quite well. you do not.

Rubbish!

> people have already begun to queue to kick you in places you didn't
> even know existed. word on the street is many of them brought large
> metal pipes and at least one has a gun.

‎Psalm 23:4 KJV ·

>>>> (It's right up there in the article - *First choice*!)
>>>
>>> it isn't.
>>
>> *YES* - it is! Proof here:- https://imgur.com/a/5K80xs6
>
> that doesn't say what you think it does.

Oh yes it does! :-D

> you haven't a clue.

More than you'll ever know, dopey! ;-)

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-13 10:48, Lewis wrote:

> Restore from Time Machine is right there at the top-level of the
> recovery partition menu.

You and uyour ilk have been advising the OP to reinstall OS-X from
scratch and use Migration Assistant, negating my suggestion to use Time
Machine which you now say should be done.

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-13 12:26, Jolly Roger wrote:

> You're right! I often overlook the "Restore from Time Machine Backup"
> option at the top of the macOS Utilities screen and go straight to
> "Reinstall macOS" instead as a habit:

Yet, you insulted my suggestion to do exactly that, told the OP to
ognore my suggestion and to re-install OS-X and use Migration Asisstant
instead ("you = you, nospam, lewis, I don't diofferentiate between these).

[David Empson]

Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:

> On 2019-06-13, Andreas Rutishauser <and...@macandreas.ch> wrote:
> > Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
> > backup.
>

> Booting from a backup volume means the OS will change files on the
> backup volume as it boots and runs from it

No it doesn't.

Time Machine (when using a directly connected backup drive) keeps a
backup of the recovery volume. It has a special boot loader so that if
you boot from the TM drive, it loads the recovery volume (if there are
multiple computers being backed up, it picks a recovery volume backup
which is compatible with the Mac on which it is booting).

Once booted you are in the standard recovery system, from which you can
do a full system restore from the Time Machine backup (or run Disk
Utility, or whatever else you need to do).

At no point does it attempt to boot from the backup copy of the main OS
(impossible because the files are in the wrong place), nor will it
modify the backup volume while booting from it.

> which is a bad idea because it puts your backup data at risk of being
> changed or corrupted since the last backup was made.

Clearly you haven't tried this. It does none of that.

> If that happens, you're fucked. It is a much better practice to boot from
> macOS Recovery instead, which is why it exists in the first place. But far
> be it for me to try to stop people from doing stupid things. You do you.

Booting from a Time Machine backup drive _is_ booting from macOS
Recovery (a backup copy of it).

The point is that someone with a Mac that has no Internet connection can
do a full system restore from their TM backup drive, even if they lose
the entire content of the main drive (including the recovery volume) and
have no other bootable system handy.

For completeness: this mechanism requires macOS 10.7 Lion or later (I
think it was added in an update of Lion, not the original release).
Earlier macOS versions don't have a recovery volume and a Time Machine
backup drive only used on Macs running Leopard or Snow Leopard will not
be bootable.

TM network backups aren't as easy: in that case you need a working
recovery volume (e.g. Internet recovery) from which you can log in to
the server and mount the TM backup, but again no need to do a full macOS
reinstall unless there is some other reason you want to do that.

--
David Empson
dem...@actrix.gen.nz

[David Empson]

Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:

> That I was not aware of. Thanks.

Small correction to nospam's description: there is no boot "partition"
(or even separate volume) on a TM backup drive. It is just hidden files
in the same partition as the TM backup.

Here are the gory details as far as I have bothered to examine them.

Backups of recovery volumes are stored in a hidden ".RecoverySets"
folder at the top level of the Backups.backupdb folder.

.RecoverySets has a subfolder with a decimal number that starts at 0 for
the first recovery volume backup, and there may be more than one with
ascending sequence numbers (typically if you back up multiple computers
to the same drive, but for some reason I've ended up with four of them
on a drive which has only been connected to one Mac, and there is a gap
in my number sequence).

Each recovery set has a com.apple.recovery.boot subfolder.

Inside that are the files that normally live in the root directory of
the recovery volume, including boot.efi, BaseSystem.dmg,
PlatformSupport.plist, etc.

Booting from the TM backup drive uses a hidden EFI bootloader file
"tmbootpicker.efi" in the root directory of the TM partition, which goes
through the subfolders in Backups.backupdb/.RecoverySets looking for a
recovery set which is compatible with the computer on which you are
booting (referencing PlatformSupport.plist, which lists Board IDs
supported by that recovery volume).

I expect it just picks the newest recovery set which says it supports
this Mac's board ID.

Once a recovery set is picked, it goes through a boot process similar to
the normal recovery volume, loading BaseSystem.dmg into RAM and running
from the system inside that.

--
David Empson
dem...@actrix.gen.nz

[Lewis]

In message <1o95u32.4898uf1dywu6uN%dem...@actrix.gen.nz> David Empson <dem...@actrix.gen.nz> wrote:
> Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:

>> On 2019-06-13, nospam <nos...@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>> > In article <gmfbhd...@mid.individual.net>, Jolly Roger
>> ><jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> > Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
>> >> > backup.
>> >>
>> >> Booting from a backup volume means the OS will change files on the
>> >> backup volume as it boots and runs from it, which is a bad idea because
>> >> it puts your backup data at risk of being changed or corrupted since the
>> >> last backup was made. If that happens, you're fucked. It is a much
>> >> better practice to boot from macOS Recovery instead, which is why it
>> >> exists in the first place. But far be it for me to try to stop people
>> >> from doing stupid things. You do you.
>> >
>> > true, but does not apply to booting from a time machine archive, which
>> > has its own boot partition.
>>
>> That I was not aware of. Thanks.

> Small correction to nospam's description: there is no boot "partition"
> (or even separate volume) on a TM backup drive. It is just hidden files
> in the same partition as the TM backup.

> Here are the gory details as far as I have bothered to examine them.

> Backups of recovery volumes are stored in a hidden ".RecoverySets"
> folder at the top level of the Backups.backupdb folder.

Yep. Here is exa output of it:

% exa -laT .RecoverySets --level=2 [/Volumes/BlueBox/Backups.backupdb]
drwxr-xr-x - root 13 Jun 13:42 .RecoverySets
drwxr-xr-x - root 5 Oct 2018 ├── 0
drwxr-xr-x - root 5 Oct 2018 │ └── com.apple.recovery.boot
drwxr-xr-x - root 10 Apr 2015 ├── 1
drwxr-xr-x - root 10 Apr 2015 │ └── com.apple.recovery.boot
drwxr-xr-x - root 21 Dec 2016 ├── 2
drwxr-xr-x - root 7 Dec 2016 │ └── com.apple.recovery.boot
drwxr-xr-x - root 12 Jul 2018 ├── 4
drwxr-xr-x - root 12 Jul 2018 │ └── com.apple.recovery.boot
drwxr-xr-x - root 23 Jan 19:21 ├── 5
drwxr-xr-x - root 23 Jan 19:21 │ └── com.apple.recovery.boot
drwxr-xr-x - root 14 May 17:22 └── 6
drwxr-xr-x - root 14 May 17:22 └── com.apple.recovery.boot

> .RecoverySets has a subfolder with a decimal number that starts at 0 for
> the first recovery volume backup, and there may be more than one with
> ascending sequence numbers (typically if you back up multiple computers
> to the same drive, but for some reason I've ended up with four of them
> on a drive which has only been connected to one Mac, and there is a gap
> in my number sequence).

Sometimes new versions will create a new one, it seems.

--
Passion is the pill you can swallow forever Taking them one by one One
by One --Agents of Good Roots "Come On"

[Andreas Rutishauser]

In article <gmfbhd...@mid.individual.net>,

Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:

> On 2019-06-13, Andreas Rutishauser <and...@macandreas.ch> wrote:

> > In article <gmd4l3...@mid.individual.net>,
> > Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
> >> On 2019-06-12, JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> >>> On 2019-06-12 15:02, Jolly Roger wrote:
> >>>> That's an incorrect assumption. After you erase the drive, you
> >>>> need to install macOS onto it.
> >>>
> >>> Can't you restore the systen volume from Time Machine backup?
> >>
> >> Who cares? Reboot into macOS Recovery, erase the drive, reinstall
> >> macOS, transfer your data when prompted with Migration Assistant.
> >> It's brain-dead simple. You end up with a pristine operating system
> >> and all of your settings and data.
> >
> > why should I erase the drive
>

> In this case the reason to erase the drive is the volume has errors that
> cannot be easily fixed.
>
> > pull macOS from the internet
>
> In most cases, there's no need to boot to internet macOS Recovery, since
> you can just boot to the local macOS Recovery volume.

>
> > install it, run Installation assistant?
>

> You install macOS because you need an operating system.

>
> > Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
> > backup.
>

> Booting from a backup volume means the OS will change files on the
> backup volume as it boots and runs from it, which is a bad idea because
> it puts your backup data at risk of being changed or corrupted since the
> last backup was made. If that happens, you're fucked. It is a much
> better practice to boot from macOS Recovery instead, which is why it
> exists in the first place. But far be it for me to try to stop people
> from doing stupid things. You do you.

no. A Time Machine Volume has a special recovery partition it boots from.

Nothing changes on the Time Machine Backup volume.

You should learn about the capabilities of Time Machine.

[Andreas Rutishauser]

restoring from Time Machine backup while booted from Tie Machine volume
will erase the drive as first action.

[gtr]

On 2019-06-14 05:58:35 +0000, Andreas Rutishauser said:

> In article <qdtmgf$5o5$1...@news.albasani.net>, gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>
>> On 2019-06-13 06:30:52 +0000, Andreas Rutishauser said:
>>
>>> In article <gmd4l3...@mid.individual.net>,
>>> Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2019-06-12, JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>>>>> On 2019-06-12 15:02, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> That's an incorrect assumption. After you erase the drive, you need to
>>>>>> install macOS onto it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Can't you restore the systen volume from Time Machine backup?
>>>>
>>>> Who cares? Reboot into macOS Recovery, erase the drive, reinstall macOS,
>>>> transfer your data when prompted with Migration Assistant. It's
>>>> brain-dead simple. You end up with a pristine operating system and all
>>>> of your settings and data.
>>>
>>> why should I erase the drive, pull macOS from the internet, install it,
>>> run Installation assistant?
>>>
>>> Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
>>> backup.
>>
>> Restoring wouldn't fix the inherent disk issue. Remember the topic and
>> first post: "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are
>> disabled."
>
> restoring from Time Machine backup while booted from Tie Machine volume
> will erase the drive as first action.

This seems to be getting easier and easier.

I have say to it's fascinating the way this thread has been endlessly
refined--seemingly all to my (eventual) advantage.

It also underscores the utility of a bona fide Time Machine manual, for
which I was soundly and repeatedly thrashed for wanting at all!

[David B.]

> Nope.

Yes! At least *I* think it is!

> 1. Make sure that your Time Machine backup disk is connected and turned on.

Agreed

> 2. Turn on your Mac, then immediately press and hold Command (⌘)-R to
> start up from macOS Recovery.

Agreed

> 3. When you see the macOS Utilities window, choose the option to restore
> from a Time Machine Backup.

Agreed. This is what one sees:- https://imgur.com/a/5K80xs6

> You are booted from macOS Recovery - not your Time Machine backup
> volume.

If I'm mistaken, how do YOU suggest that I boot from my Time Machine
backup volume?

--
David

[gtr]

On 2019-06-14 05:58:35 +0000, Andreas Rutishauser said:

> In article <qdtmgf$5o5$1...@news.albasani.net>, gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>
>> On 2019-06-13 06:30:52 +0000, Andreas Rutishauser said:
>>
>>> In article <gmd4l3...@mid.individual.net>,
>>> Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2019-06-12, JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>>>>> On 2019-06-12 15:02, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> That's an incorrect assumption. After you erase the drive, you need to
>>>>>> install macOS onto it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Can't you restore the systen volume from Time Machine backup?
>>>>
>>>> Who cares? Reboot into macOS Recovery, erase the drive, reinstall macOS,
>>>> transfer your data when prompted with Migration Assistant. It's
>>>> brain-dead simple. You end up with a pristine operating system and all
>>>> of your settings and data.
>>>
>>> why should I erase the drive, pull macOS from the internet, install it,
>>> run Installation assistant?
>>>
>>> Much more simple to boot from Time Machime Volume and restore from
>>> backup.
>>
>> Restoring wouldn't fix the inherent disk issue. Remember the topic and
>> first post: "warning: found physical extent corruption but repairs are
>> disabled."
>
> restoring from Time Machine backup while booted from Tie Machine volume
> will erase the drive as first action.

In System Preferences > Startup Disc I find no selection option for the
Time Machine drive. How would I select it for startup? In googling I
find others with this situation but their TM drive is encrypted. Mine
is not.

[David Ritz]

On Friday, 14 June 2019 12:24 -0700,
in article <qe0s97$e09$1...@news.albasani.net>,

gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:

> In System Preferences > Startup Disc I find no selection option for
> the Time Machine drive. How would I select it for startup? In
> googling I find others with this situation but their TM drive is
> encrypted. Mine is not.

Try rebooting, then immediately holding down the option key. With a
little luck, your TM backup disk should be among the options available
as this time.

If the computer boots normally, it is an indication that the firmware
password is set. If this is the case, you need to boot to the local
recovery disk, by selecting command-R at boot. Next, use the security
tool, under the Utilities menu, to remove the password. Once this is
accomplished, follow the steps, above.

--
David Ritz <dr...@mindspring.com>
Be kind to animals; kiss a shark.

[Lewis]

Yeah. I had no idea booting from Time Machine and restoring would erase
the internal drive. I mean, it makes sense, but I've never restored that
way (I have booted from the Time Machine disk one or twice just to see
that it worked... but never in anger.

> It also underscores the utility of a bona fide Time Machine manual, for
> which I was soundly and repeatedly thrashed for wanting at all!

Time Machine is undergoing some changes RSN that will make it much
faster, much more reliable, and much more flexible. It doesn't look like
it will be this year, but all the ground work is now in the system to
switch TM over to APFS and make it entirely work off snapshots.

--
"A politician is a man who approaches every problem with an open mouth."

[Lewis]

Nor for the recovery partition.

> How would I select it for startup?

Hold down option during boot, I believe. Doesn't matter if the drive is
encrypted, you will be prompted to unlock it. I can't reboot right now
to double check, but Pretty sure the TM volume shows up on the option
boot menu (unlike the internal Recovery image).

--
If lawyers are disbarred and clergymen defrocked, doesn't it follow that
electricians can be delighted, musicians denoted?

[JF Mezei]

On 2019-06-14 01:58, Andreas Rutishauser wrote:

> restoring from Time Machine backup while booted from Tie Machine volume
> will erase the drive as first action.

Can you confirm "erase the drive" ?

Does it offer you list of APFS containers and you choose one and then it
erases all volumes inside the APFS container and recreates one for the
restored system and one for recovery volume?

Or does it zap only the system volume and would only recreate the
recovery partition if it is missing?

or does it just replace all files in the existing system volume (which
is what happens when you run Time Machine from fully booted OS-X).

[David B.]

On 14/06/2019 21:02, David Ritz wrote:
> On Friday, 14 June 2019 12:24 -0700,
> in article <qe0s97$e09$1...@news.albasani.net>,
> gtr <x...@yyy.zzz> wrote:
>
>> In System Preferences > Startup Disc I find no selection option for
>> the Time Machine drive. How would I select it for startup? In
>> googling I find others with this situation but their TM drive is
>> encrypted. Mine is not.
>
> Try rebooting, then immediately holding down the option key. With a
> little luck, your TM backup disk should be among the options available
> as this time.

I did as you suggested, David. :-)

I was presented with a choice of start-up options as you intimated and
duly selected my Time Machine.

The iMac booted and the screen then showed, alternately, an image of a
magic mouse - on it's back - and then what looked a bit like an iPad,
looking edge on. My mouse pointer was in the top left hand corner of the
screen; nothing I did would move it.

I left the iMac idle for about 15 minutes - there was no change, so I
used the on/off switch at the back of the iMac to turn off the machine.

Because I can (!) I restarted again whilst holding down the shift key
and started my iMac in Safe Boot mode. All seemed OK and 'Safe Boot' was
eventually shown, in a red font, in the top right hand corner of the screen.

I then restarted normally and all now seems to be working as it should be.

--
David B.