What games use an FPU?
Ross Yahnke
question arises whether games like Falcon or Flight Simulator or
Maelstrom work better or faster with the presence of an FPU.
There would seem to be a lot of math going on to do some of the
graphics involved, yet these games run fine on non-FPU'ed Macs.
Do FPUs speed up any of these or other games???
- Ross
Madison Academic Computing Center
University of Wisconsin
608.262.8626
Robert Dorsett
>Now that there are more Macs that may or may not sport FPUs, the
>question arises whether games like Falcon or Flight Simulator or
>Maelstrom work better or faster with the presence of an FPU.
>
>There would seem to be a lot of math going on to do some of the
>graphics involved, yet these games run fine on non-FPU'ed Macs.
>Do FPUs speed up any of these or other games???
Despite the popularity of FPU's for business software, the sad reality is
that integer math, used by any competent games programmer, still outperforms
FPU-based math. So there is no reason for these games to switch to FPU
support.
Also, note that you don't automatically get "FPU performance" by just
plugging one in--the programmer has to code explicitly for it.
On the other hand, games with complex models, such as flight simulators,
could conceivably benefit from a more straightforward *coding style,* which
requiring an FPU would help facilitate. A rumor on AOL had it that Microsoft
Flight Simulator 5.0 (PC) will require an FPU; they're probably willing
to take the performance hit in order to achieve better maintainability.
The hardware people would like us all to think that the solution to all
ills is to get the fastest, shiniest computer on the block--but good coding
practices, and efficient algorithms, are what really count.
---
Robert Dorsett
r...@cactus.org
...cs.utexas.edu!cactus.org!rdd
the End
flame away.
Jim
the End
Tristan, the pinball simulator, uses the FPU as well. Don't be fooled by
Apples marketing claim that you don't need one. Who knows what might
use it in the future. Its simply the current quality hardware.
Jim
Juri Munkki
IMHO, no self-respecting game designer should use the FPU. Fixed point is
faster than floating point and it's just as good for almost all games.
Apple has some really nice machines that do not have FPUs. If you just
do word processing, simple illustrations and play games, there's absolutely
no need for an FPU. Come to think of it, you don't need the FPU for software
development either.
--
Juri Munkki Windsurf: fast sailing
jmu...@hut.fi Macintosh: fast software
Babak Gohari
------------------
This is the New Mac Games List, where all the latest in Macintosh
Game Software is briefly mentioned. The first part deals with all
the new and updated information, while the second part shows the
full list.
All Games fall into one or more of the following categories:
AC Arcade/Action (e.g. Oids) - shoot 'em ups. Games that don't
require deep thought, but do require very good eye-hand
coordination.
AO Add-On (e.g. SimCity Graphics Sets) - modules that require
another game to play. Usually not required to purchase, but
they can add a whole new level to many games.
CD CD-ROM game (e.g. Spaceship Warlock) - games that are on a
CD-ROM disk. Usually have extensive graphics and sound.
FR Fantasy Role Playing (e.g. Might & Magic) - games that have
characters with attributes, classes, etc. You go around,
kill monsters, get experience, go up in levels. Similar to
the Dungeons & Dragons pen and paper games.
GA Graphic Adventure (e.g. Space Quest IV) - graphic adventures
are those games in which you control the hero as he moves
around the screen, interacting with other people and onjects
on the screen.
NT Networkable Game (e.g. Spectre) - a game which can be played
with other players via a network or modem.
SI Simulation (e.g. Hellcats) - simulations are those games
which allows you to "go inside" some sort of object, whether
an airplane, car, or even a living being. You then have
complete control of the object you're in, and it reacts to
your commands. Does not include games like Civilization or
SimCity, even though they're technically "simulations".
SP Sports (e.g. Club Racquetball) - any game that deals with a
sport or sporting activity.
ST Strategy (e.g. SimEarth) - games that require you to think
about the future, and plan your moves accordingly.
WG War Game (e.g. Strategic Conquest) - games that deal with
war. Most of these types of games are also strategic.
FULL LIST:
----------
Title Date Description
------------------------------------------------------------------
Caesar's Palace Overdue (ST) A Collection of casino
(Virgin Games) type games. [port]
Carriers at War Overdue (ST,WG) WWII Carrier naval
(SSG) battle simulation game.
[port]
Castles II - Siege & May (ST) The sequel to Castles.
Conquest (MacPlay) 1993 The first was never made,
but this has a lot of new
features. [port]
Cerulean Spring 1993 (AC) Defend a 2001-like
(Casady & Greene) space station from an
alien attack. [mac]
Crystal Crazy Spring 1993 (AC) Sequel to Crystal
(Casady & Greene) Quest. [mac]
Darkseed May 1993 (GA) A great PC game that is
(Cyberdreams) supposed to be a well-ported
adventure game. Real music,
graphics, and sound. [port]
Dragonsphere ??? (GA) Set in the medieval
(Microprose) times with lots of magic and
fantasy creatures. [port]
El Fish 1993 (ST) Another maxis port.
(Maxis) Don't know exactly what it
is. [port]
F117A - Stealth Summer 1993 (SI) Simulation of the F117A
Fighter (Microprose) stealth fighter. [port]
F/A 18 - Hornet Spring 1993 (SI) Simulation of the F/A 18
(Graphic Simulations) fighter. [mac]
Flyer (Delta Tao) ??? (NT,SI) A networked flight
simulator. [mac]
The Incredible Machine 1993 (ST) Solve all types of
(Sierra-OnLine) puzzles. [port]
In Search of the Fall (GA) A macromind director
Fabulous Fuzzbox 1993 comic-book like CD-ROM
(MacPlay) game. [mac]
The Iron Helix March 1993 (CD,GA) Explore an abandoned
(Spectrum Holobyte) spaceship. [mac]
King's Quest VI - 1993 (GA) The 6th of Roberta
Heir Today, Gone Williams' series. New mac
Tomorrow (Sierra) engine. [port]
The Lost Admiral Quarter 2 (ST) I believe it's a
(QQP) 1993 strategy game. [port]
Might & Magic IV - Late 1993/ (FR) The one after M&MIII.
Clouds of Xeen Early 1994 It should have a great mac
(New World Computing) interface. [port]
NAG - Network Arcade ??? (AC,NT) A virtual reality
Game (Delta Tao) tag game. Not sure if
it will be made into a
real game. [mac]
Omar Sharif on Bridge Summer 1993 (ST) The PC game ported to
for Mac (MacPlay) mac. Spiffied up. [port]
Phantom ??? (GA) Yet another graphic
(Microprose) adventure. [port]
Pinball Windows 1993 (AC,SI) Another pinball type
(Sierra-OnLine) game. [port]
Rex Nebular & The Late Spring (GA) Another futuristic
Cosmic Gender Benders 1993 graphic adventure game.
(Microprose) [port]
Route 66 Spring/Summer (AC) A Spy Hunter like game
(Casady & Greene) 1993 set in space. [mac]
Screaming Metal Spring 1993 (CD,GA) From the guys of S.
(Reactor) Warlock. A cyber-punk type
adventure. [mac]
Shattered Lands Late Fall/ (FR) AD&D game in the Dark
(SSI) Early Winter Sun world. Supposed to use
1993 full mac interface. [port]
SimCity 2000 Summer 1993 (ST) Complete rewrite of the
(Maxis) classic SimCity. LOTS of
new features. [mac]
SimFarm "Later" (ST) Yet another "software
(Maxis) 1993 toy." Take control of a
modern farm. [port]
Space Madness Spring 1993 (AC) Defend the universe from
(High Risk aliens of another
Ventures) dimension. [mac]
Super Mines Released (ST) A commercial Minesweeper
(Callisto Corp) type game with 100 levels
and lots of extras and
goodies. [mac] {NTL}
Total Distortion Spring 1993 (CD,GA) Explore strange new
(Pop Rocket) worlds to create a music
video?!? [mac]
Uninvited March 1993 (GA) Rerelease of the classic
(ICOM) adventure game. [mac]
V for Victory - Summer 1993 (ST,WG) 4th installment of
Casserine Pass V4V series. [mac]
(Three-Sixty)
V for Victory - Fall 1993 (ST,WG) 5th installment of
Stalingrad the V4V series. [mac]
(Three-Sixty)
Wilderland Last Week of (FR) Sequel to Legends of
(Avalon Hill) March 1993 the Lost Realm. [port]
Wizard Poker ??? (NT,ST) A networked poker
(Delta Tao) where cheating is allowed
and encouraged. [mac]
Wizardry: Crusaders Early Fall (FR) The seventh chapter in
of the Dark Savant 1993 Wizardry role playing game.
(Sir-Tech) [port]
---
RELEASED GAMES LIST:
--------------------
Title (March 1993)
---------------------
Eight Ball Classic (AMTEX Software)
Pax Imperia 1.0.2 (Changeling Software)
Super Mines (Callisto Corporation)
V For Victory: Market Garden (Three-Sixty)
Title (February 1993)
---------------------
The Journeyman Project (Presto Studios)
Sailing Master (Starboard Software)
Title (January 1993)
---------------------
A-Train Construction Set (Maxis)
Battlechess CD-ROM (MacPlay)
Civilization (Microprose)
Might & Magic III - Isles of Terra (New World Computing)
Out of This World (MacPlay)
Spaceward Ho!, v3.0 (Delta Tao)
Spectre Supreme (Velocity)
Tom Landry Strategy Football (Merit Software)
Vengeance of Excalibur (Virgin Games)
Title (December 1992)
----------------------
A-Train (Maxis)
Club Racquetball (Virgin Games)
Falcon MC (Spectrum Holobyte)
Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis (LucasArts)
Monkey Island 2 (LucasArts)
Stellar 7 (Sierra/Dynamix)
Pax Imperia (Changeling)
V For Victory, Velikiyie Luki (Three-Sixty)
---
Please mail us your information of new games. All information is
kept confidential. This is a not-for-profit service. We are in
no way affiliated with any publisher, and the information is not
guaranteed to be correct (though we try our best!) This list or
any information in this list cannot be copied or used in any shape
or form, for either commercial or non-commercial purposes, without
the expressed consent of BOTH the authors. All mail should go to:
Michael, Internet address: mo...@svcdudes.com
CompuServe address: 70733,457
Bob, Internet address: bgo...@wam.umd.edu
America-OnLine address: Bob n ski
(c) 1993
PRAIRIE danny
I'm looking for good demo's that can show off the graphics and
sound capabilities of the MAC LC III. Could anyone send me sites where
I could find these types of demo's.
Thanks,
Danny Prairie
pra...@cs.concordia.ca
Juri Munkki
>> IMHO, no self-respecting game designer should use the FPU. Fixed point is
>> faster than floating point and it's just as good for almost all games.
In <1993Mar17.0...@ifi.uio.no> erl...@ifi.uio.no (Erling Mork) writes:
>Guys, guys...there is an easy solution to the question "Should I use the FPU?"
>The answer is :SANE!! SANE is Apple's mathematics library that programs
>can access, and it uses the FPU is there is one, thereby speeding up
>computations. If there is no FPU, the same computations are done without it.
If floating point with direct FPU access is around 2 times slower than fixed
point (just a wild guess, could be less especially on the 68040-based machines),
then SANE routines are usually 10 times slower.
My point still remains valid. Fixed point is just fine for most games.
Arashi/STORM uses SANE for some calculations between the levels. During
the actual game play, floating point is not used (except that Mike added
a few floating point operations, which I only removed recently).
STAY AWAY FROM FLOATING POINT IF YOU WANT HIGH PERFORMANCE!
Ron_Hu...@bmug.org
>found they could speed things up by directly accessing the FPU. However,
>this required that the machine had one, and so the confusion ensued.
>Especially
>when Apple starting making Mac IIs without FPUs. But anyway, that is fixed
>now, and SANE-routines are sped up to the tune of 30%-50% in some cases.
Ok, so now SANE is less inefficient (relative to the FPU) than it was
before. It is still a LOT faster to go directly to the FPU. Even if
SANE transfers the work to the FPU, it still spends more time doing it
than the the FPU does doing the work. Further hampering SANE is the fact
that SANE has to return an answer for every calculation. The FPU can
hold intermediate results between calculations. If you want to compute
A+B+C, you can send A,B, and C to the FPU, tell it to do two adds, and
then send back the result. SANE has to ask the FPU to send back A+B so
it can give it to your program so your program can give it back to SANE
so SANE can give it back to the FPU.
**** From Planet BMUG, the FirstClass BBS of BMUG. The message contained in
**** this posting does not in any way reflect BMUG's official views.
Steven_D...@magic-bbs.corp.apple.com
Some demos would be nice wouldn't they... Try some QuickTime movies
followed by a dose of .MOD files ( Sound Module Files ).
Call Apple and see if they will send you an LCIII demo program or any
other computers demo for that matter. I've seen some of them at certain
retailers and they're nice...
..... Steven_...@magic-bbs.corp.apple.com .....
Ryan_A....@magic-bbs.corp.apple.com
a couple MOD's, have some kind of graphics with the MOD music, and send
messages to people through sine scrolls on the demo. I saw two in
particular that caught my eye. One stared off like a TV that was on static
(shades of Poltergeist? :-) And then went into the MOD. At certain
intervals in the MOD itself, there would be a drum solo, and on the screen
a vector drummer would drum to it. At another time a voice would say "Hit
Fido" which meant something like click the mouse to continue. and when the
voice said hit fido, a vector face would mouth the words. The next cool
Demo was called Barbrian. It had 4 rows of 2 barbarians (1 row for each
voice on the MOD) and the mod had sounds like "Come on!", "Die!", and
"HAHAHA!" as well as sword clinking and other cool sounds. Each sound
would trigger a differnt action in the barbarians, so the entire MOD made
the barbarians fight ( and some other sick things too) It was hillarious.
I asked my friend who had it to send me the MOD, he did, but it would not
work on SoundTreker, so I jut took the sounds.