First-timer buying AS/400 and have questions
Dan Foster
AS/400 system about 12 years ago. It was interesting, and I'd like to
buy an used AS/400 for home use to rediscover the joys of OS/400. :)
I'm more familiar with the pSeries hardware that we have at work, but
have some familiarity with IBM's ways of things -- PTFs, APARs, and so
forth.
I've found a place that appears to be reputable and specializes in
selling new and refurbished AS/400s as an IBM business partner.
There's a decent price for a 9406-170 (2289) system with minimum memory,
minimum disk, and a twinax controller, along with V5R2 preloaded.
Since it's for personal home use, I'm looking to keep the machine as
physically small as possible. :) I don't believe I need a lot of
'horsepower' for this system, as it is more for exploratory purposes
than for any serious heavy CPW workload. So I think the 170 would work
out ok (50 CPW total; 15 CPW interactive) in the P05 software tier.
My concern is that I might potentially shred the setup at some point, or
experience hardware failure (e.g. dead drives), and would like to have
original CD media to do a reinstallation as a worst case scenario. The
system doesn't come with media.
1. Would it be possible to purchase V5R2 or V5R3 CDROM media from IBM?
If so, how much do they typically cost?
2. I presume the system I'm buying is already licensed. Would the seller
typically send license keys or do I have to obtain a license from IBM?
If so, how much does it typically cost?
Would I need to do a license transfer? How much does that cost?
3. What is 'minimum memory' configuration for the 170 (2289)?
I know the hardware minimum memory is 64 MB, but what does V5R2
require as a minimum?
I'm pretty sure I'd need to buy more memory. How could I find out what
memory type/model numbers are valid options for this particular 170?
Would I need them in pairs for this system?
4. I presume TCP/IP would require an additional licensed option / key?
If so, how much does it typically cost?
5. Should I buy a 5250 terminal? Is there any laptop PCMCIA adapters
that one could use instead?
I know I'll need something for the system console, but trying to cut
down on additional hardware / power cords needed because I'm almost out
of power at home.
I'm guessing I would realistically need to look at buying the BOS
Native Plus PCI 5250 emulation card and install it in my Windows XP
Pro desktop machine.
Alternatively, does anyone have a favorite 5250 terminal from a
particular vendor and model they'd recommend? I'm looking for these
functionality: text support, twinax and Ethernet connectivity.
6. I take it the 170/270/etc were previous generations, and 8xx is current?
7. The 170 isn't part of the iSeries i5 family, correct? i5 is for the
newer POWER5-based systems?
8. Are there any affordable 100 Mbit Ethernet cards for that AS/400 or
should I just stick to a 10 Mbit card for around USD $200?
9. How much internal disk space do you suggest to have a comfortable
single-user AS/400 experience, without having to frantically worry
about if I have enough space for PTFs and a few LPPs, and so forth?
9 GB? 18 GB? More?
10. Does OS/400 support mirrored (software RAID-1) internal drives?
If so, is that an additional licensed feature?
11. With AIX on pSeries, the PTFs are downloadable from IBM's web site.
With OS/400, is this downloadable, or do I have to explicitly order
them from IBM? Does this require an active software support contract?
If so, how much would a basic support contract that entitled me to
PTFs cost?
What is the procedure for obtaining PTFs from IBM? Does one have to
call IBM AS/400 support and request it?
12. Is there any good source of LPPs for OS/400? In particular,
developer tools. Compilers and such.
13. Is there an inexpensive way of doing backups? At work, we've got
nice LTO tape libs, and formerly used 8mm, DDS-3 (DAT), and Magstar
MP tapes... but as this will be out of my own pocket, I am sensitive
to cost.
I'm thinking about a possible mirrored 18 GB drive setup, so
ideally, I would do backups to a third drive but not likely supported.
If not, next ideal thing would be backing up to tape with at least
20 GB capacity (DLT or LTO) or a small 8mm, AIT-3, or Magstar MP
library with an autoloader, as frankly, I really don't want to do
tape swaps for every single backup session.
14. If I bought the system with V5R2 preloaded and did a license
transfer of an existing valid license to my name, what would the
cost of upgrading to V5R3 be like?
(I'm not sure if it's just the cost of media, or if upgrading
requires a valid active support contract, or if upgrade cost is tied to
hardware model and tier, etc...)
I see the 2289 processor is a RS64-II Northstar CPU; I used to have some
RS6Ks with this CPU, so I'm familiar with it. Probably on the SP/2.
That's a nice processor.
I'll probably have more questions as I think of them. Please bear with
me. :-)
Thank you very much for any pointers or suggestions. Much appreciated!
-Dan
Ken Pate
I just inherited a 170 from my office. I will try to answer a few of your
questions..
170-2290 with v5r2 lic should run you around $600. That has 16gb disk,
128mb memory.
You might want to look at a 9401-150. Those can be found for less than
$1000 with v4r5 and most if not all lic. pgms. This is the last version on
the 150 that requires no key.
1. Yes, you can purchase from IBM. Not sure on the cost.
2. The seller should supply you with the lic key. I don't think IBM
charges for a transfer (someone correct me if I am wrong).
3. Minimum memory for V5R2 would probably be 128mb. Look around for IBM
feature 3002 (these are 128mb memory chips). I just purchased 4 sticks
(512mb total) for $56.00. They should be installed in pairs.
4. TCP/IP is 5769-TC1. There is a charge...not sure how much.
5. Twinax terminals are cheap...they can be found for ~$25.00. Make sure
your 170 has feature 2722 and comes with a twinax brick. You need this for
system console. Or you can get another feature (forget the code for it)
that will allow you to connect the as400 to your PC as system console
through PC Serial Port. IBM terminals are my favorite.
6. 170/270 are older, 8xx are somewhat newer, newest are the i5/5xx. Don't
get this confused with earlier 500 models.
7. I think you are correct.
8. Ethernet card for 170 would be IBM 2838. This is a 10/100mb card. Can
be found for ~$40.
9. 8gb minimum. Depends on what software you install. I have 16gig and
after updating to v5r2 and installing most lic pgms, I was using 65% of
storage.
10. Yes, it will support RAID. I can't remember the feature number.
11. Not sure, I am not a systems guy.
12. Compilers ... only IBM (again, someone correct me if I am wrong). Some
brokers will from time to time have POE's available for sale. They are
usually about half the cost of buying the LPP direct from IBM or a business
partner.
13. Most 170's will come with a tape backup unit. They are usually a 4/8
gig QIC tape drive. Media costs will run ~$20 for a single tape. I would
back up the system to tape. Then the user libraries I will save to a save
file and then download to a PC.
14. Don't know the pricing information for software upgrades.
Hope this helps just a little.
Ken
"Dan Foster" <use...@evilphb.org> wrote in message
news:slrndohp7n...@zappy.catbert.org...
Dan Foster
>
> I just inherited a 170 from my office. I will try to answer a few of your
> questions..
It's been a big help, thanks!!
More follow-up questions for anyone here:
If I get a 20GB/40GB 8mm tape drive (7208-342), will I need BRMS to
manage backups/restores with it?
Does the 170 have a built-in SCSI port? If so, what type is it?
(Fast/wide, narrow, LVD vs HVD, etc.)
Or if not, what feature code for a suitable IOA to hook up a fast/wide
differential SCSI tape drive? (The 7208-342.)
Is firmware microcode for the system or components user-installable or
does it require a CE to do the work?
Is there a site somewhere that would list what devices has been dropped
from V5R2 and V5R3 support?
I presume it's easy to set up a remote print queue to point to a
networked HP LaserJet 4050se (via TCP/IP)? It supports LPD on port 9100.
How much space do I need for a typical V5R2 OS installation? (I.e., how
much space will the base OS occupy when installed on the DASDs?)
Ken mentioned that a 'complete setup' including LPPs was about 65% of 16
GB but wondering how much of that was the base OS, out of curiosity.
Is V5R2 or V5R3 single or multiple installation CDs?
Should I refer to OS/400 as 'i5/OS' now? Is that only for V5R3 or later,
or is that new name retroactive, too?
I will have only a single 5250 twinax terminal hooked up as the console;
will I need a terminator for an unused twinax port?
How long does it take to do the IPL on a 170?
I'm not real clear on what the difference is between the AS/400 and
AS/400e? Is it CISC vs RISC? (The older 1-5 CPW systems vs 50+ CPW?)
When I create files, will they be ASCII or will they be EBCDIC-encoded?
I still also more than welcome any comments on my earlier query, even if
Ken has very helpfully covered most of the things.
Thanks again!
(I'm still reading huge piles of documentation, doing due diligence.)
-Dan
Lou
of us who have toyed with the idea.
I've looked through the original questions, Ken's answers and your
follow-up questions. I will try to add to Ken's very good, detailed
and thorough answers. (Think of me as the systems guy Ken was needing.)
I am going to skip over the numbers I have nothing to contribute on.
I've been a "systems guy" on the AS/400 since V1R0M0. Please
don't ask me what dinosaur rides were like...
2. License keys are how IBM controls everything. If you don't get
them from the seller, you are at the mercy of IBM's list price. I
would make license keys a requirement of the purchase.
3. Memory. I can solve a lot of performance problems with memory. That
is, you can use memory to substitute for other deficiencies. For this
project, your CPU power is fixed-but memory size is not. Consider how
many slots you have and what the largest sticks are. I would use up the
slots judiciously with the largest sticks possible, to keep my options
open for adding memory later.
5. The AS/400 does not like its console going missing. Early AS/400s
would crash if the console was unplugged. I wholeheartedly endorse the
idea of an old IBM 5250 compatible clunker as a console. The old IBM
Infowindows were at least color.
6&7. The key is you have a box upon which V5R2 will run. If you can run
that version you are in a very good place. The "i5" and "i5/OS"
are a re-branding. "i5/OS" is really V5R3 of OS/500.
9. Keep the number of actuators (disk arms) in mind. The OS/400 single
level store (SLS) needs arms to work efficiently. 8 arms is a critical
minimum for the math behind SLS.
10. You can get the equivalent of raid with a checksum disk
configuration. Unfortunately this has to be done before the OS is
loaded. Checksum was released with OS/400 V1R0M0. It is a way to make
the AS/400 do striping like RAID does. The other downside to checksum
is the CPU winds up doing the striping instead of a RAID controller.
You could always load the OS on a non checksum ASP and create a second
ASP out of new drives which does have checksum. Send me an email if you
want to discuss. Keep in mind that once a disk drive is configured, you
have to scratch the whole ASP to pull it out and reconfigure. (ie. You
have to get this right during planning.)
11. I order PTFs online all the time. Unfortunately part of the process
is connecting your AS/400 to IBM (even when you do a web download). I
think IBM checks the serial number to see if you have paid for
maintenance. Beyond the ordering process, there are no serial
number/customer number checks. If you have any plans to use Java, you
will need a constant source of PTFs. (It is very unstable right now.)
Also, if you find a source for cumulative PTFs, be aware that the Java
and HTTP groups are not on those CDs and have to be obtained
separately.
12. This has always been the major gotcha in my mind to building an
AS/400. The compilers and development tools cost a fortune.
Other questions:
BRMS is a tool to automate backups. You don't need it. You can run
the SAVxxx commands without it.
If I recall correctly, the 170 was SCSI-2. Be warned that IBM likes to
rename everything and matching up IBM names to industry standard
designations can be arduous.
Firmware/microcode upgrades are shipped via PTFs to the machine group
and are user installable.
IBM lists what is supported. If the cards are electrically compatible
(no +12v fingers aligning on a -12v slot) I would try plugging things
in and trying them. (If you smell something burning you are in dinosaur
dung.)
LAN printer gives you more functionality that remote output queue.
Remote output queue is easier to configure.
Not much DASD needed for the base OS, but you have to add up all of the
licensed programs.
V5R2 and V5R3 come on a stack of installation CDs. You boot off the
first one.
Most people are still saying OS/400. Hell, the AS/400 has been called
by several new names (eServer, iSeries, etc.) and I still use AS/400.
i5/OS only means V5R3.
Twinax has to be terminated.
The IPL should take 30 minutes or less on your config.
AS/400e was a marketing thing.
The mixed CPW numbers are for Interactive/Batch. On your config, things
will run a lot fast if you use the SBMJOB (Submit Job) command and run
them in batch. The first number is the interactive CPW and governs how
much you can run from an interactive session (command line). The
machine really does not have two speeds. IBM ships some system tasks
that eat up the CPU if you step over the line on interactive CPW.
(These are named CFINTnn.)
CISC was way back in the models with letter designations like B70, Dnn,
Enn, Fnn. CISC boxes won't run much. A 170 is a RISC box.
The AS/400 likes to create everything as EBCDIC. In the QSYS file
system you will see mostly EBCDIC. Every object has a CCSID, so you can
make everything whatever code set you want. In the root file system
(aka "slash file system" or simply "/") you will see more
ASCII. Both QSYS and "/" are part of the Integrated File System or
IFS. Most people use the term IFS to mean the "/" file system. The
"/" file system is very UNIX/DOS/Windows like. You can also add
your own file systems and mount them. This comes in very handy if you
need a file system with case sensitive names. (ex. Byte and byte both
allowed as separate objects.) The root or "/" file system is case
insensitive.
René H. Hartman
tape, unless you have one with an extension box (sidecar). The 270 does
take a SCSI card in the system itself, a 170 does not.
For what you want, disk arms are not a problem. The main unit takes 4
drives max., which gets you 25,5 GB with 4x 8,5GB in RAID-5. With the
expansion unit you can have more. Nice thing about RAID-5, apart from
the protection, is that it can improve performance if you get a caching
controller.
--
Best regards,
René H. Hartman
www.hac-maarssen.nl
Dan Foster
> Hi. Cool project Dan. I suggest you blog this, because there are a lot
> of us who have toyed with the idea.
Not a bad idea. I'm keeping notes so that should be easy to convert into
blog format later.
> I've been a "systems guy" on the AS/400 since V1R0M0. Please
> don't ask me what dinosaur rides were like...
:)
V1R0M0? Impressive!
> 2. License keys are how IBM controls everything. If you don't get
> them from the seller, you are at the mercy of IBM's list price. I
> would make license keys a requirement of the purchase.
Ok. I'll double check on this angle.
> 3. Memory. I can solve a lot of performance problems with memory. That
> is, you can use memory to substitute for other deficiencies. For this
> project, your CPU power is fixed-but memory size is not. Consider how
> many slots you have and what the largest sticks are. I would use up the
> slots judiciously with the largest sticks possible, to keep my options
> open for adding memory later.
Aye. I'm planning on making sure the system has at least 512 MB.
Offloads need for relatively expensive disk I/O and such. Good with that.
> 5. The AS/400 does not like its console going missing. Early AS/400s
> would crash if the console was unplugged. I wholeheartedly endorse the
> idea of an old IBM 5250 compatible clunker as a console. The old IBM
> Infowindows were at least color.
Ok. Power shouldn't be a problem if I put the AS/400 and 5250 in a
different room, and one that is just as secure.
> 6&7. The key is you have a box upon which V5R2 will run. If you can run
> that version you are in a very good place. The "i5" and "i5/OS"
> are a re-branding. "i5/OS" is really V5R3 of OS/500.
Ahh-ha!
> 9. Keep the number of actuators (disk arms) in mind. The OS/400 single
> level store (SLS) needs arms to work efficiently. 8 arms is a critical
> minimum for the math behind SLS.
Makes sense... how does one determine number of actuators for any given
hard drive? Is this specification listed somewhere?
> 10. You can get the equivalent of raid with a checksum disk
> configuration. Unfortunately this has to be done before the OS is
> loaded. Checksum was released with OS/400 V1R0M0. It is a way to make
> the AS/400 do striping like RAID does. The other downside to checksum
Well, there are several different types of RAID. One is striping
(RAID-0), and one is mirroring (RAID-1).
I was thinking more along the lines of mirroring; a situation where the
OS maintains two identical writes to two DASDs such that it can continue
to operate without downtime even if one fails. Or at least, is capable
of booting from the other DASD.
Is this an available feature of current OS/400? (V5R2 or later) Or is it
an additional cost feature, if so?
For all of my servers, I have this type of feature for the internal
DASDs so can't imagine going without it, especially for something as
important and complex as the AS/400.
> 11. I order PTFs online all the time. Unfortunately part of the process
> is connecting your AS/400 to IBM (even when you do a web download). I
Can it be connected via the Internet, or does it only do it via a modem?
> think IBM checks the serial number to see if you have paid for
> maintenance.
Ahh-ha. Makes sense. I'll have to make sure I have software maintenance,
then.
> Beyond the ordering process, there are no serial number/customer
> number checks. If you have any plans to use Java, you will need a
> constant source of PTFs. (It is very unstable right now.)
Hmm. I'll probably stick to Java on the Linux and Solaris boxes.
> Also, if you find a source for cumulative PTFs, be aware that the Java
> and HTTP groups are not on those CDs and have to be obtained
> separately.
Ah! Good to know.
> 12. This has always been the major gotcha in my mind to building an
> AS/400. The compilers and development tools cost a fortune.
Can imagine. I only really need RPG IV and C, but bet they charge an arm
and leg for 5722-WDS (WebSphere Development Studio) which bundled all of
what used to be individual LPPs into a single set.
Will have to research price further, as well.
> Other questions:
>
> BRMS is a tool to automate backups. You don't need it. You can run
> the SAVxxx commands without it.
Ahh! Ok.
> If I recall correctly, the 170 was SCSI-2. Be warned that IBM likes to
> rename everything and matching up IBM names to industry standard
> designations can be arduous.
Ha! Ok. I'll have to double check with the IBM business partner about
that angle, then.
> Firmware/microcode upgrades are shipped via PTFs to the machine group
> and are user installable.
Excellent.
> IBM lists what is supported. If the cards are electrically compatible
> (no +12v fingers aligning on a -12v slot) I would try plugging things
> in and trying them. (If you smell something burning you are in dinosaur
> dung.)
Aka "Who let the magic blue smoke out?"
> LAN printer gives you more functionality that remote output queue.
> Remote output queue is easier to configure.
Makes sense. LAN printer it is, then.
> Not much DASD needed for the base OS, but you have to add up all of the
> licensed programs.
I'm sure ~18 GB should be fine. Base OS would be 300-400 MB?
Does OS/400 have concept of 'swap space' or equivalent? A backing store
file or partition for virtual memory use. Asking because wondering if I
need to account for this, if so.
> V5R2 and V5R3 come on a stack of installation CDs. You boot off the
> first one.
Ok.
> Most people are still saying OS/400. Hell, the AS/400 has been called
> by several new names (eServer, iSeries, etc.) and I still use AS/400.
> i5/OS only means V5R3.
Ahh! Ok.
> Twinax has to be terminated.
Ok. Terminator is on my list of things to get, then.
> The IPL should take 30 minutes or less on your config.
Not bad. Guess I'm a little spoiled by the RS6Ks, Suns, and Linux/BSD.
But 30 mins or less is certainly reasonable. And I'm guessing, a lot
faster than some of the bigger setups of yesteryear.
> AS/400e was a marketing thing.
Ok.
> The mixed CPW numbers are for Interactive/Batch. On your config, things
> will run a lot fast if you use the SBMJOB (Submit Job) command and run
> them in batch. The first number is the interactive CPW and governs how
> much you can run from an interactive session (command line). The
> machine really does not have two speeds. IBM ships some system tasks
> that eat up the CPU if you step over the line on interactive CPW.
> (These are named CFINTnn.)
Interesting, hadn't known that last bit.
> CISC was way back in the models with letter designations like B70, Dnn,
> Enn, Fnn. CISC boxes won't run much. A 170 is a RISC box.
Ok. Figured it was RISC since the 170 was late '98/early '99 vintage; I
believe the first RISC boxes came on the scene in '95 or so?
> The AS/400 likes to create everything as EBCDIC. In the QSYS file
> system you will see mostly EBCDIC. Every object has a CCSID, so you can
> make everything whatever code set you want. In the root file system
> (aka "slash file system" or simply "/") you will see more
> ASCII. Both QSYS and "/" are part of the Integrated File System or
> IFS. Most people use the term IFS to mean the "/" file system. The
> "/" file system is very UNIX/DOS/Windows like. You can also add
> your own file systems and mount them. This comes in very handy if you
> need a file system with case sensitive names. (ex. Byte and byte both
> allowed as separate objects.) The root or "/" file system is case
> insensitive.
That's interesting. There's a document on the IFS, which I've been
perusing.
The only real reason why I asked about EBCDIC vs ASCII is that Ken
suggested backing up user data to a save file and then transporting the
save file to a PC as a cheap way of having multiple copies without
having to resort to expensive tape.
My concern was in potential of accidentally shredding data if I
transported EBCDIC files to a PC, or as to the readability of any
generated text files (in *STRL format).
I'm used to locally-generated EBCDIC files on AS/400 and mainframes like
the 9370 (which I worked on, long ago), but not used to cross-platform
handling in that area. I remember doing FTP file transfers was tricky.
-Dan
Dan Foster
> To add to the elaborate answers: the 170 does not support fast external
> tape, unless you have one with an extension box (sidecar). The 270 does
> take a SCSI card in the system itself, a 170 does not.
>
> For what you want, disk arms are not a problem. The main unit takes 4
> drives max., which gets you 25,5 GB with 4x 8,5GB in RAID-5. With the
> expansion unit you can have more. Nice thing about RAID-5, apart from
> the protection, is that it can improve performance if you get a caching
> controller.
Hallo, René --
Thank you very much for the good suggestions. I will have to
rethink choice of tape or 170, or employ a different strategy for doing
backups.
Ken did suggest a possible strategy that might work out well.
Met vriendelijke groeten,
-Dan
Dan Foster
>
> My concern was in potential of accidentally shredding data if I
> transported EBCDIC files to a PC, or as to the readability of any
> generated text files (in *STRL format).
Correcting myself:
Whoops, STMF, I meant.
-Dan
Ken Pate
I don't want to give my age away or anything... but I actually started on
this system in the late '70's on a System/34 SSP (My mom had to go to work
with me to change my diapers ;)! Graduated to a S/36, then in early '90s
when the first 400's drove the price of S/38 way down, I was actually
running 3 s/38's. My family owned a large data company at the time, which I
just sold about a year ago and have since entered back into the business. I
am just an old RPG programmer, kind of tinkered with system stuff a little.
Let me expand a little on the backup -- I just finished saving my
development library at work, downloading to my work pc, FTP'ing it to my
home PC and then uploading to my home 400. Worked without a flaw. The
library was ~160 mb. I had a 9401-150 running in my home for about a year.
Backed up daily using this method. I had only 1 backup of my production on
tape and accidentally left it in the machine when I sold it :O(
Twinax terminator -- usually built into the terminal. You probably want to
have the console in the same room with the server so you can see the SRC
codes in case something goes wrong, as well as being able to answer system
messages when loading/re-loading the OS.
512mb of main memory works well. I don't know what the max is, but the 170
has 8 memory slots.
I THINK WDS in the P05 tier is somewhere around $10-11k. If you can find
someone that has scrapped the machine, I think you can buy their PoE and
take over their LPP.
Plan on spending about 6-8 hours loading the Internal Lic Code, OS, LPP's &
PTF's. The first IPL takes ~30 minutes, subsequent ones (assuming a normal
power down) will only take about 10-15 minutes. But once going, there is
rarely a need to IPL. There was a story floating around that a small
company let their IT guy go and 3 years later someone found the AS400 in a
closet, still running their day to day operations.
"Dan Foster" <use...@evilphb.org> wrote in message
news:slrndok2h0...@zappy.catbert.org...
Dave McKenzie
Dan Foster wrote:
> Does OS/400 have concept of 'swap space' or equivalent? A backing store
> file or partition for virtual memory use. Asking because wondering if I
> need to account for this, if so.
No, OS/400 has no separate swap space. Essentially, the entire disk
farm is the swap space. It uses the concept of "Single Level Storage"
(SLS), which is the central architectural innovation of OS/400. All
disks constitute a single flat 64-bit virtual address space.
--Dave
Steve Richter
Dan Foster wrote:
> I'm most familiar with UNIX and OpenVMS, but once briefly worked on an
> AS/400 system about 12 years ago. It was interesting, and I'd like to
> buy an used AS/400 for home use to rediscover the joys of OS/400. :)
on the hardware side I would sit on ebay and wait for a 170 or 270
system to come along. Possibly emailing the sellers of systems that
dont move with the price you are willing to pay. There are two types
of 170s. One being the size of a large tower PC, the other being twice
that size. The large 170 is too large for one person to move - make
sure you get the smaller one if size is an issue. The 270 is about 4
years newer than the 170 so it should be a bit lighter and being much
newer there might be less problems.
on the software side, be aware that once you have everything installed,
you dont need the install CDs. Once the system is loaded you do a save
entire system to tape. Then use that tape whenever you have to reload
the system.
You should know that if you have a set of install CDs you can install
the OS and languages and use it for 70 days until the install expires.
Once it expires you can do a scratch reload from your save system tape
and the 70 day trial period starts over again.
good luck!
-Steve
Lou
them to make a soft landing when the power goes out. It is just enough
battery to do the equivalent of a laptop going into a deep sleep
(writes memory to disk for the next boot). You will want to check if
the 170 has a battery, which you will probably need to replace it
unless the person selling you the 170 already has.
For V5R2 there is an IBM manual for calculating the minimum number of
disk arms needed for any configuration. You can get it at this URL
http://www-03.ibm.com/servers/eserver/iseries/perfmgmt/pdf/V5R2FiSArmct.pdf.
I have an Excel spreadsheet I built from the manual, which I can email
you.
The AS/400 has supported mirroring for a long time. I've never seen
one set up, so I can't recall if you have to buy a licensed program to
support it or not.
PTFs can be obtained via the Internet or this crappy 9,600baud
synchronous modem IBM ships with the AS/400. The modem connects to IBM
only. I use the Internet to get PTFs and FTP them to the AS/400. They
download as CD images. You have to create a virtual optical device for
the FTPs, so the AS/400 can read the images. It's a bit like reaching
in your ear to scratch your nose, but it works.
WebSphere Development Studio is very pricey, even at the P05 tier.
Be aware the RPG and C were retroactively named as part of WebSphere a
few releases ago. This drove me nuts one release when I could not find
the manuals, until I looked under WebSphere. You do NOT need WebSphere
Development Studio to use RPG or C.
Blue smoke (aka avoid turning your AS/400 into Puff the Magic Dragon).
At ~18 GB I would quit worrying about space for the load source and
licensed programs.
A few more words on Single Level Store:
The AS/400 (then project Silverlake) was built upon the System/38
architecture. Some folks used to joke the OS/400 was really Control
Program Five (CPF) version 8. You will notice all the system messages
still start CPFhhhh. The AS/400 was envisioned to eventually not have
disk drives. IBM was thinking bubble memory or some form of solid-state
memory would replace disks by the time the architecture went to market
(This was 1978 thinking, by a bunch of Star Trek fans. When you see
memory pool *BASE, pronounce it Star Base-and you will start getting
their sense of humor.) Consequently, disk access was added as an
external layer of sorts. Some people will say the AS/400 does not know
it even has disk drives. The single level store is described as a giant
two-dimensional plane of addresses. The fact that the contents of an
address is on disk or in memory is a trick of the hardware. The CPU
does not really care. It is the job of the I/O Processors and I/O
Adapters (IOPs and IOAs) to move the contents of an address in and out
of main storage (kinda). The part that makes this a little complicated
is the AS/400 does use the concept of a HEAP. Every job has a HEAP
which moves in and out of unprotected storage. Unprotected storage is
the closest concept to a swap file. Before ten people write in and say
this is not a swap file, it isn't. It's just the closest hole to
the pigeon. It is on disk. The amount of unprotected storage is not
something that most people worry about (unless they are running out of
disk). You will not be concerned with configuring any of this, so the
simple answer is not to worry about a swap file. There is a swap-like
job setting called purge YES/NO. This setting controls if a job is
completely purged to disk or partially purged to disk when the system
starts running out of memory. Purge NO means partial. Most people set
the default to PURGE *NO. If OS/400 starts struggling for memory, it
will make a dynamic decision to automatically flip over to PURGE *YES
until the memory crisis is over. OS/400 has lots of features like this.
For example, if the system is having a CPU crisis-it changes all time
slices to 500ms. Getting back to the HEAP, IBM allocates DSA in the
HEAP and does other types of things with it you will be more familiar
with.
At the time of the CISC to RISK conversion, I was working for a company
that got new AS/400s before they were released-so my dates are a bit
premature to the GA (General Availability) dates. We had RISK boxes in
'93. I remember having an argument with Al Barsa over the phone about
my old company's support of RISK in '94. He might have had a pre-GA
box as well.
When you run any of the SAVxxx commands and specify the output to a
Save File (*SAVF or the .savf extension), you have a binary object that
can be handled by a PC. Just FTP as BINARY, as has already been
suggested. Also be aware that OS/400 has some FTP extensions you will
need to use. Running FTP from the AS/400 you use NAMEFMT 0 to mean the
old QSYS naming and NAMEFMT 1 to mean PC-like naming. From an FTP
client connected to an AS/400 the equivalent commands are QUOTE SITE
NAMEFMT 0 and QUOTE SITE NAMEFMT 1. When you want to transfer a Save
File, you use NAMEFMT 1 and GET/PUT your MySavedStuff.savf.
I am very glad to hear that I am not the oldest fart in this thread.
Dear, Ken Pate-what were dinosaur rides like? Okay, okay-I started
on the System 3 with 4.9 megabyte removable disk packs and 96 column
cards. I also worked on a 1401. I preferred bronto rides.
I love to sneak up on groups of old timers at user group meetings, when
their conversation goes like:
Old Timer # 1) I remember when we got our first PC!
Old Timer # 2) PC? I remember when we got our first CRT!
Old Timer # 3) CRT? I remember when we got rid of the damned punched
paper tape and started using punch cards!
Me) Punched paper tape? We used to dream about punched paper tape. We
use to have to tap the ends of 2 wires together-in the correct
sequence-and walk 20 miles through the snow to get to the other end
of the wires!
Dave McKenzie
The first program I ever wrote was a tiny bubble sort for an RCA
Spectra/70 (System/360 clone). It had 2 K of core memory (that's K, not
Meg). It was literally "core" memory -- you could take out the cards
and see the arrays of tiny cores (ferrite donuts about 1/16" dia.) with
fine wires threaded through them. They were said to be threaded by
hand by women in Mexico.
It had no disk; the OS would have been loaded from 80-column cards,
though the one I used had no OS. It was used to train hardware
repairmen (like me).
I entered my program in hex machine code on the console, a Teletype
machine. It was about 40 - 50 machine instructions, and it actually
worked after some fiddling, to my immense amazement.
That was in '68.
--Dave
Lou wrote:
<snip>
Steve Richter
Dave McKenzie wrote:
> "My first machine was..." contests are always fun. Here's my entry:
the first programming language I used was NCR NEAT/3. The best name
for a programming language I have seen to date. NEAT/3 level 1 was a
HLL type language. If the system administrator allowed it, there was
NEAT/3 level 2. That allowed the programmer to mix in assembler
instructions with the level 1 HLL code. That was followed a year or
two later with the S/38 release 2.
The first system I had was an Apple II. I recall vividly using
assembler to try to write code to read and write to the floppy drive on
the system. A lot of assembler code dumps to the display ( my TV ). I
could not get it to work and ended up getting a bios listing of the
system. I was amazed at the bios code Steve Wozniak had written for the
Apple II.
-Steve
Lou
I stopped putting that on my resume some years back. NEAT/3 (Levels 1,
2 & 3), NEAT/AM (for the old 399 & 499 clunkers) and the VRX version,
the name of which escapes me for the moment.
Dave McKenzie has me beat all over on the 2K business. The 1401 I
worked on had a massive 8K.
The NCR Century 101 I worked on did have a TeleType console, so I guess
I'm still in the running for honorable mention...
I resisted the temptation to get an Apple. (Sorry folks, these jokes DO
NOT get any better.) Actually I had two small kids then, and the money
probably went for a station wagon. Anybody remember station wagons?
I do remember walking into the Museum of Science and Industry in
Chicago and seeing a system I still remember the hex boot code for.
Trivia contest for today:
What 1 instruction did NEAT/3, Level 3 open up?
Extra credit: What was the most fun thing to do with that 1 instruction.
Lou
You ever bump into Art Madden?
Dave McKenzie
Probably because "Art" is a familiar name, as is "Madden" :-)
--Dave
Steve Richter
level 3?? I didn't know that existed. Did it do a core meltdown? At
my first job as a trainee I nagged the program manager constantly to
let me work at level II. Smart guy - he never let me. At my next job
I did get to work at level II ( assembler ) I remember the relieved
look on the manager's face after I returned from vacation. He said
something like "I was working on your code last week ...(pause )... I
finally figured out what you were doing" :)
-Steve
Dan Foster
>
> The first system I had was an Apple II. I recall vividly using
> assembler to try to write code to read and write to the floppy drive on
Ahh, yes, that was some fairly timing-sensitive coding, where you had to
do 6502 instruction cycle counting to make sure it'd fit within the 20
microseconds window for reading a single bit off or you'd miss it.
Dropped bits weren't too much fun, needless to say. :-) I think I recall
inserting a NOP or two to make it match precisely 20 us... that routine
must've been about 7 or 8 very simple one-cycle instructions.
Also had to juggle the timing of specific magnets to induce various disk
phase changes.
I never had an assembler (no money) so had to do everything via the
built-in mini assembler (after pre-planning every single instruction,
branch, looking up opcodes, addressing modes, etc) or just dumping in a
lot of hex bytes into RAM via the ROM monitor by hand, then commanding
the 6502 to start execution at a particular address.
I guess that's my generation's equivalent of dealing with punched cards. :-)
Taught self the disk operating system and how to hook into it early on
in its initialization to insert a password protection routine after I
got annoyed with people whom were unreasonably hogging the system.
> the system. A lot of assembler code dumps to the display ( my TV ). I
> could not get it to work and ended up getting a bios listing of the
> system. I was amazed at the bios code Steve Wozniak had written for the
> Apple II.
I still read the assembler source in an old Apple II manual (circa 1978)
and it's pretty tight and nicely done, and has held up very well, even
to this day.
I'm afraid I don't hold up a candle to anyone here who's worked on a
real OS / real hardware long before the Apple II, though. :-)
It's been interesting reading about the IBM work put into the Apollo
Guidance Computer (as in the moon shot's computer system), including use
of magnetic core memory for RAM and core rope memory for ROM -- which I
saw at the MIT museum.
Very nice freeware emulator of much of the AGC, including the DSKY
display I/O unit, along with much of actual original source code used to
build data files used by the emulator:
http://www.ibiblio.org/apollo/
Earliest hardware I worked with was the Apple II, late model VAXen,
early AS/400 but not until around V3?, a 9370 (which is pretty late,
circa 1986), various UNIX boxes. Nothing as exotic, I'm afraid. :-)
-Dan
Dan Foster
> A side note about power. AS/400s ship with an internal battery to allow
> them to make a soft landing when the power goes out. It is just enough
> battery to do the equivalent of a laptop going into a deep sleep
> (writes memory to disk for the next boot). You will want to check if
> the 170 has a battery, which you will probably need to replace it
> unless the person selling you the 170 already has.
Aye. Finding one without going through IBM sounds difficult, though?
Maybe easier if it's batteries in a somewhat more conventional form and
if its basic specs were known. I'm sure it's not AA batteries. :-)
Probably something a fair bit beefier, but if it at least conforms to a
common battery format sold commercially, should be doable.
> For V5R2 there is an IBM manual for calculating the minimum number of
> disk arms needed for any configuration. You can get it at this URL
Actually, was wondering how to tell how many a given drive had because I
don't normally see them listed on drive manufacturer's spec sheets, if
memory holds.
Should I assume that the average server class 10K RPM drive has 2
actuators, or some such rule of thumb?
> http://www-03.ibm.com/servers/eserver/iseries/perfmgmt/pdf/V5R2FiSArmct.pdf.
> I have an Excel spreadsheet I built from the manual, which I can email
> you.
That would be great! And thank you for the pointer, too.
> The AS/400 has supported mirroring for a long time. I've never seen
> one set up, so I can't recall if you have to buy a licensed program to
> support it or not.
I can be the trailblazing "pioneer" here, then. :-) Nothing to lose,
after all.
> PTFs can be obtained via the Internet or this crappy 9,600baud
> synchronous modem IBM ships with the AS/400. The modem connects to IBM
> only. I use the Internet to get PTFs and FTP them to the AS/400. They
> download as CD images. You have to create a virtual optical device for
> the FTPs, so the AS/400 can read the images. It's a bit like reaching
> in your ear to scratch your nose, but it works.
Was reading up on the VODs and image catalog. I must say that's an
extremely slick (nice) bit of functionality in V5R2 and later. I know it
was present in V5R1 but not quite 'fully' there.
> WebSphere Development Studio is very pricey, even at the P05 tier.
Sure sounds like it!
> Be aware the RPG and C were retroactively named as part of WebSphere a
> few releases ago. This drove me nuts one release when I could not find
> the manuals, until I looked under WebSphere. You do NOT need WebSphere
> Development Studio to use RPG or C.
Ahh, so they're still individual orderable items? For some reason, I was
under the impression they had been bundled into WDS and was only
orderable as that bundle now. Hmm. I must've misinterpreted something.
> A few more words on Single Level Store:
>
> The AS/400 (then project Silverlake) was built upon the System/38
Ahh, makes a little more sense now how Silverlake relates to Rochester,
MN. :-) (I live in the *other* Rochester... in NY)
> architecture. Some folks used to joke the OS/400 was really Control
> Program Five (CPF) version 8. You will notice all the system messages
> still start CPFhhhh. The AS/400 was envisioned to eventually not have
Ahh! That's interesting. :) Hadn't known that.
> disk drives. IBM was thinking bubble memory or some form of solid-state
> memory would replace disks by the time the architecture went to market
Ahh! Interesting.
> (This was 1978 thinking, by a bunch of Star Trek fans. When you see
> memory pool *BASE, pronounce it Star Base-and you will start getting
HAHAHA That's priceless!
> their sense of humor.) Consequently, disk access was added as an
> external layer of sorts. Some people will say the AS/400 does not know
> it even has disk drives. The single level store is described as a giant
> two-dimensional plane of addresses. The fact that the contents of an
> address is on disk or in memory is a trick of the hardware. The CPU
> does not really care. It is the job of the I/O Processors and I/O
> Adapters (IOPs and IOAs) to move the contents of an address in and out
Ahh, sort of like a conventional MMU shielding the CPU from the details
of how and where the memory comes from, exactly. CPU issues load
instructions for specific addresses, MMU goes out and figure out how to
fetch it using whatever mapping is active. Can relate, then.
> of main storage (kinda). The part that makes this a little complicated
> is the AS/400 does use the concept of a HEAP. Every job has a HEAP
> which moves in and out of unprotected storage. Unprotected storage is
> the closest concept to a swap file. Before ten people write in and say
> this is not a swap file, it isn't. It's just the closest hole to
> the pigeon. It is on disk. The amount of unprotected storage is not
So how does the administrator see it occupying disk space that he/she
can't touch? How does OS/400 report this area's existence in terms of
revealing totals of what has used what amount and where, on-disk?
> something that most people worry about (unless they are running out of
> disk). You will not be concerned with configuring any of this, so the
> simple answer is not to worry about a swap file. There is a swap-like
> job setting called purge YES/NO. This setting controls if a job is
> completely purged to disk or partially purged to disk when the system
> starts running out of memory. Purge NO means partial. Most people set
> the default to PURGE *NO. If OS/400 starts struggling for memory, it
> will make a dynamic decision to automatically flip over to PURGE *YES
> until the memory crisis is over. OS/400 has lots of features like this.
Interesting. Wouldn't a purge of memory contents to disk potentially
make the situation worse through a destructive self-feedback cycle of
increasing I/O activity?
I've seen what UNIX calls 'swap thrashing' that way when it's simply too
deep into swap to meaningfully recover due to the high cost of high I/O
activity.
> For example, if the system is having a CPU crisis-it changes all time
Interesting... that's a nice way of dealing with things.
> At the time of the CISC to RISK conversion, I was working for a company
> that got new AS/400s before they were released-so my dates are a bit
> premature to the GA (General Availability) dates. We had RISK boxes in
> '93. I remember having an argument with Al Barsa over the phone about
> my old company's support of RISK in '94. He might have had a pre-GA
> box as well.
Impressive! Haven't gotten many pre-GA boxes from IBM except for one.
Which we ended up buying in dozens once it hit GA because it was decent. :)
> When you run any of the SAVxxx commands and specify the output to a
> Save File (*SAVF or the .savf extension), you have a binary object that
> can be handled by a PC. Just FTP as BINARY, as has already been
Does EBCDIC format allow for NULL (00) characters in the file prior to EOF?
Or is that strictly verboten?
That's the *only* way a file transfer could abort prematurely.
> suggested. Also be aware that OS/400 has some FTP extensions you will
> need to use. Running FTP from the AS/400 you use NAMEFMT 0 to mean the
> old QSYS naming and NAMEFMT 1 to mean PC-like naming. From an FTP
> client connected to an AS/400 the equivalent commands are QUOTE SITE
> NAMEFMT 0 and QUOTE SITE NAMEFMT 1. When you want to transfer a Save
> File, you use NAMEFMT 1 and GET/PUT your MySavedStuff.savf.
Ahh! That's very good to know, thank you. Duly noted. I've run into
similar type of issues with OpenVMS boxes, so it's not an unfamiliar
kind of situation to encounter.
> I am very glad to hear that I am not the oldest fart in this thread.
> Dear, Ken Pate-what were dinosaur rides like? Okay, okay-I started
> on the System 3 with 4.9 megabyte removable disk packs and 96 column
> cards. I also worked on a 1401. I preferred bronto rides.
:-)
> I love to sneak up on groups of old timers at user group meetings, when
> their conversation goes like:
>
> Old Timer # 1) I remember when we got our first PC!
> Old Timer # 2) PC? I remember when we got our first CRT!
> Old Timer # 3) CRT? I remember when we got rid of the damned punched
> paper tape and started using punch cards!
> Me) Punched paper tape? We used to dream about punched paper tape. We
> use to have to tap the ends of 2 wires together-in the correct
> sequence-and walk 20 miles through the snow to get to the other end
> of the wires!
Hahaha :)
-Dan
Dan Foster
>
> on the hardware side I would sit on ebay and wait for a 170 or 270
> system to come along. Possibly emailing the sellers of systems that
> dont move with the price you are willing to pay. There are two types
> of 170s. One being the size of a large tower PC, the other being twice
> that size. The large 170 is too large for one person to move - make
> sure you get the smaller one if size is an issue. The 270 is about 4
Definitely size and weight is an issue. Will keep in mind, thanks.
> years newer than the 170 so it should be a bit lighter and being much
> newer there might be less problems.
That's an interesting thought (270). If it's roughly similar to the
lower end 170 in terms of weight and power, might be an attractive
option. Probably in the P-10 tier, but I'll check.
> on the software side, be aware that once you have everything installed,
> you dont need the install CDs. Once the system is loaded you do a save
> entire system to tape. Then use that tape whenever you have to reload
> the system.
True enough. As the tape backup administrator for my team, do know tape
eventually wears out (but then again, so do CDs), so I'm rather cautious
about having multiple means of installation in case of an emergency.
> You should know that if you have a set of install CDs you can install
> the OS and languages and use it for 70 days until the install expires.
> Once it expires you can do a scratch reload from your save system tape
> and the 70 day trial period starts over again.
Ahh, that's right. I'd read about that in passing, but forgot about it.
> good luck!
Thanks!! Looking forward to a most interesting adventure!
-Dan
NOQ
> In article
> <1133204593.3...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>, Lou
> <Lou...@OptOnline.net> wrote:
>> For V5R2 there is an IBM manual for calculating the minimum
>> number of disk arms needed for any configuration. You can get it
>> at this URL
>
> Actually, was wondering how to tell how many a given drive had
> because I don't normally see them listed on drive manufacturer's
> spec sheets, if memory holds.
>
> Should I assume that the average server class 10K RPM drive has 2
> actuators, or some such rule of thumb?
>
1 disk arm is 1 actuator - all the current disks are single arm so 1
per drive.
>> The AS/400 has supported mirroring for a long time. I've never
>> seen one set up, so I can't recall if you have to buy a licensed
>> program to support it or not.
>
> I can be the trailblazing "pioneer" here, then. :-) Nothing to
> lose, after all.
>
Disk mirroring support is built into the SLIC so is available
without charge. You need to configure it from DST during a manual
IPL. And to answer a point made elsewhere in the thread, you can do
this from a D-mode IPL (IPL from CD or Tape).
>> Be aware the RPG and C were retroactively named as part of
>> WebSphere a few releases ago. This drove me nuts one release when
>> I could not find the manuals, until I looked under WebSphere. You
>> do NOT need WebSphere Development Studio to use RPG or C.
>
> Ahh, so they're still individual orderable items? For some reason,
> I was under the impression they had been bundled into WDS and was
> only orderable as that bundle now. Hmm. I must've misinterpreted
> something.
>
You are correct, The 5722-WDS licenced product contains almost all
the compilers (things like PL/I are available as a PRPQ but not in
WDS), PDM and Websphere development studio client.
--
Mike Buglass
Lou
little light bulbs representing 0 and 1? I would load a program, throw
the halt switch, and enter my patch. Drove everybody crazy. I finally
had to start using hex patch cards to make them quit vomiting every
time I walked over to the console.
The old COBOL '68 compiler did not know how to write variable length
records to tape files, and would always write the maximum length. I
would put a bunch of dummy instructions and the end of the program, and
patch in the math to compute the VLIs.
I had another hex patch to make the cassettte reader keep its head
loaded. I figured out the reason cassette tapes took so long to read
was they kept loading and unloading the heads (click, click, click,
click...) I patched in a way to force the heads to stay loaded. The
hardware repair guys complained that I was going to break the drive. I
told them not to worry, it was under maintenance.
Neat/3 level 3 opened up physical I/O via the INOUT instruction. That
is, real time--physical I/O. The kewl trick was to make a freestanding
disk drive (like a model 636) read the highest track then the lowest
track--real quick, over and over. In a nice tight loop, you could make
the drive wobble across the floor. The hardware reapir guys never
caught me doing this one, but they did always wonder why they had to
keep reailgning the heads so much.
Lou
soldering iron. They will have to be rechargeable. If you can't get the
right size, you will have to mount externally. I suggest you look at
replacement batteries for UPSs from APC or a similar small UPS makers.
You will want a Gell Cell or a sealed lead/acid battery. (Gell cells
are more expensive but are safer and don't have to be vented.) They key
differences between different batteries are:
1) Connector type (plugs)
2) Voltage
3) Maximum wattage
You can make up different voltages by adding the voltage of each
battery. To add voltages, you connect batteries in serial. You can
increase the maximum wattage by adding the wattage of each battery. To
add wattage, your connect batteries in parallel.
Serial:
[+BAT_A-]<-WIRE->[+BAT_B-]
Parallel:
| [+BAT_A-] |
W W
I I
R R
E E
| [+BAT_B-] |
IBM does not make batteries. I know the guy who got the contract for
ThinkPad replacement batteries. When you pull out an old battery it
will have some markings on it, which you should be able to identify.
You may have to peel off some plastic coating. Whatever you do, do NOT
crack open the battery itself. They have some truly nasty stuff in
them.
Disk Arms:
The only company I know of that ever made disks with two arms for the
AS/400 is IBM. IBM OEMs the drive nowadays. You will see a lot of
Seagate drives in the 170 vintage equipment. These are not garden
variety drives. The device electronics on them (the chips soldered to
the little card on the drive) are special. For example, before IBM
merged the hardware for the pSeries and the iSeries you could not
transplant drives even between those two platforms.
The best assumption to make with the drives you will be dealing with is
1 arm per. The document I suggested says this.
My email address is in my posts. The one in your posts looks like a
NOSPAM dummy. Send an email to my address, and I will send you back the
spreadsheet.
There are many development tool bundles. I doubt there is one with just
RPG and C in it.
There are displays of total storage, unprotected storage, etc. all on
the WRKSYSSTS screen (Work with System Status). With the System Service
Tools (STRSST) you can drill down some more into the rack
configuration, etc. and get yourself into all manner of trouble.
The PURGE is only for a job, not the whole system.
You can make an AS/400 thrash. What you will see is the page faulting
rate go way up and your work not getting done.
On the subject of pre-GA boxes, IBM owned 11% of the company I worked
for. I used to tell people 11% of me worked for IBM.
Q) Does EBCDIC format allow for NULL (00) characters in the file prior
to EOF?
A) I have no bloody idea whatsoever.
René H. Hartman
them as a replacement battery pack for my old Texas Instruments
scientific calculator. Basically it's a set of three box standard, AA
size NiCD cells, spot-welded in serial, providing 3.6 V, 700mAH, packed
in crimp-wrap. They have a very short lead with a small connector that
plugs into the board. I've seen the same packs in cordless telephone
sets.
As these batteries are so common, you can make up a pack yourself and
reuse the old connector. Make sure you get batteries with a soldering
lip, as it's almost impossible to solder wires onto standard penlite
cells. You should be able to get replacement packs from your online
electronics shop for a good price (i.e. non-IBM price, here in NL you
can order what looks like exactly the same pack for 9 euros (about $
8,-; GP pack 3,6V 700mAh) plus shipping, or even 4 euros, if you're
prepared to accept 600mAh and reuse the lead).
Just make sure to wait for the alert that tells you to replace the
battery pack. Replacing will reset the counter, but only after the
warning has been issued. Early replacement can be done (e.g. if you have
more cache controllers and you want to replace all batteries at the same
time) but then you need to reset the counter through SST, Alter/Dump.
Just can't remember which option it was after that, and I haven't found
it when looking for it. :-(
--
Best regards,
René H. Hartman
www.hac-maarssen.nl
"Lou" <Lou...@OptOnline.net> schreef in bericht
news:1133286515....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Lou
grandmother (a physics professor) showed me how to do it with a high
wattage soldering gun she had.
You scratch up the place on the cell you want to solder to on the
battery. Then you heat the heck out of it with the highest wattage
setting you can muster. (If they are labelled, go for the
melt-rock-into-lava setting.) One of two things will eventually happen:
a) The solder will whet with a hot joint.
b) The battery casing will melt.
Fortunately my grandmother had lots of batteries, and lots of patience.
but...@gmail.com
similar to my situation.
Here's an ad about an AS400 for sale in my area:
The ad says.
"This came into our computer recycling center and it seems to work. We
don't have a terminal to hook up to it, but it booted up and displays
"B1 N1" on the front status display. It's been 8 years since I worked
on AS/400s but I seem to recall that's a good code.
I can see 8 hard drives through the front cover, the entire case is in
great shape with no signs of abuse, and the power supply and fans all
work and are nice and quiet.
If you're looking for parts or an interesting conversation piece this
is just what you need. The photo below is what this system looks like,
I don't have a camera with me right now.
How about $100? Offers?? I'd rather see it go to a good home than be
torn down and recycled.
The box is 24" high x 17" wide x 21" deep, and the serial number is
10-46PCM."
I've contacted the seller and will schedule a trip, it's like a two
hour drive from where I live. BTW, I'm an AS400 pgmr for several
years, started on the S/38. Although I've been trying to move out of
the midrange environment at my new work and getting into .NET, thought
it would be cool to have an AS400 at home for stuff. I'm not really a
systems guy which concerns me of any major problems I'd encounter with
this box. Any advice would be great. Thanks,
Butch
Steve Richter
but...@gmail.com wrote:
> Sorry to add my post here but this is the only thread I can find that's
> similar to my situation.
>
> Here's an ad about an AS400 for sale in my area:
>
> The ad says.
> "This came into our computer recycling center and it seems to work. We
> don't have a terminal to hook up to it, but it booted up and displays
> "B1 N1" on the front status display. It's been 8 years since I worked
> on AS/400s but I seem to recall that's a good code.
>
> I can see 8 hard drives through the front cover, the entire case is in
> great shape with no signs of abuse, and the power supply and fans all
> work and are nice and quiet.
>
> If you're looking for parts or an interesting conversation piece this
> is just what you need. The photo below is what this system looks like,
> I don't have a camera with me right now.
>
> How about $100? Offers?? I'd rather see it go to a good home than be
> torn down and recycled.
>
> The box is 24" high x 17" wide x 21" deep, and the serial number is
> 10-46PCM."
those are the dimensions of a double wide 170. be aware - you are not
going to be able to lift and carry the system yourself! hardware wise,
it is likely to be a good system. My guess on the drives is they are
4GB each. With all those drives it is likely to have a decent CPW to
run the large applications it could support.
Other than lifting the thing, you will need a copy of the OS to
install. Even if the OS has not been scratched from the system when it
was disposed of, you probably will not have the QSECOFR password needed
to administer the system. If you can borrow a copy of the OS you can
do a scratch install from the front panel and use it for 70 days before
it expires.
-Steve
Pjotr
Or power up and do a DSPLICKEY and write down the license code for the OS.
You will need that if you do a scratch install and bypass the 70-days
problem.
Pjotr