open vms

[Bill Cunningham]

I have found some files called "open vms..." as part of there names.
They are in a zip file. Now the files inside are in zipexe format. Is that
something new? I can't find anything that wants to uncompress this format.

Bill

[Stephen Hoffman]

That's probably an unnecessary repackaging of a self-extracting zip file.

Either run the file (if you're on the same architecture it was created
for), or use unzip to decompress it.

Related: <http://labs.hoffmanlabs.com/node/127>


--
Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC

[Simon Clubley]

They are probably self contained executables designed to run under
VMS on whatever architecture they were created for.

Be sure you trust the source before running them.

Also make sure to create a temporary directory and run them from within
that directory in case the zip files don't have a top level directory
within them.

Simon.

--
Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP
Microsoft: Bringing you 1980s technology to a 21st century world

[Simon Clubley]

That's a good point; I forget you could just unzip them. My advice
about making sure there's a top level directory within the zip
file before unpacking stands however.

[Bill Cunningham]

"Simon Clubley" <clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP> wrote in
message news:n0jji2$8k3$2...@dont-email.me...

> On 2015-10-25, Stephen Hoffman <seao...@hoffmanlabs.invalid> wrote:
>> On 2015-10-25 22:52:46 +0000, Bill Cunningham said:

> That's a good point; I forget you could just unzip them. My advice
> about making sure there's a top level directory within the zip
> file before unpacking stands however.

Here's the thing. I'm running linux and was going to use simh for this.
An emulator. I don't know how to get a hold of HP for a hobbyist license for
open vms. I've tried. Do they send a cd or dvd or what? I have some really
old vms v 4-v6 tapes too. Ok here's what the file is called,

openvms_i64_8_4_08250607.zip

There's three files inside with .zipexe files. Hum. Do I need to already
have vms to do this?

Bill

[Simon Clubley]

On 2015-10-25, Bill Cunningham <nos...@nspam.invalid> wrote:
>

> "Simon Clubley" <clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP> wrote in
> message news:n0jji2$8k3$2...@dont-email.me...

>> That's a good point; I forget you could just unzip them. My advice
>> about making sure there's a top level directory within the zip
>> file before unpacking stands however.
>
> Here's the thing. I'm running linux and was going to use simh for this.
> An emulator. I don't know how to get a hold of HP for a hobbyist license for
> open vms. I've tried. Do they send a cd or dvd or what? I have some really
> old vms v 4-v6 tapes too. Ok here's what the file is called,
>
> openvms_i64_8_4_08250607.zip
>
> There's three files inside with .zipexe files. Hum. Do I need to already
> have vms to do this?
>

No. As Hoff said, try doing "unzip -v" to see what's inside those files
before unzipping them.

[Stephen Hoffman]

On 2015-10-25 23:19:16 +0000, Bill Cunningham said:

> Here's the thing. I'm running linux and was going to use simh for this.
> An emulator.

Okay.

> I don't know how to get a hold of HP for a hobbyist license for open vms.

Go here and register http://plato.ccsscorp.com/hobbyist_registration.php

Licenses will be emailed to you. Usually within a day or so.

If you need a license membership number, then get yourself a free login
on the decuserve server — telnet to decuserve.org — if this follows the
usual course here, you'll try ssh and not telnet and hopefully that'll
work, but when it doesn't, please try telnet for the sign-up — and then
type the command "hobbyist" at the DCL prompt. That command will give
you your membership information for the HP/HPE OpenVMS hobbyist license
sign-up.

> I've tried.

Any URLs or errors or other details of the issues? Hard to
troubleshoot this stuff without that, after all...

> Do they send a cd or dvd or what?

You will want to ask for a download when you get the licenses. If the
credentials for the downloads are not already provided, which I'd
expect.

You'll get a disk image that you can then burn and boot on a "real"
system, or can transfer that image to a file using dd or analogous and
connect simh to that as a device.

When you get to simh, you can configure a device that's pointing to a
file containing the contents of the disk image
<http://labs.hoffmanlabs.com/node/922>. Use RAUSER for all of your
simh device types, too, as those can float in size; they're not fixed
to the actual size of the RA device being emulated.

License management facility (LMF) product authorization key (PAK)
registration sequence and background:
<http://labs.hoffmanlabs.com/node/31>
<http://labs.hoffmanlabs.com/node/259>

> I have some really old vms v 4-v6 tapes too. Ok here's what the file is called,
>
> openvms_i64_8_4_08250607.zip
>
> There's three files inside with .zipexe files. Hum. Do I need to
> already have vms to do this?

Based on the filename, that's probably either an OpenVMS I64 kit for
Itanium, or it could well be malware pretending to be the Itanium kit.

The self-extracting code pasted onto the front of that file is probably
Itanium code.

I'd hope that unzip will be able to unzip the file anyway —
disregarding the prefixed self-extracting executable — but you won't be
able to use the kit, so there's not much reason to try that.

Why? In either case, it's very likely not the VAX kit. You need the
VAX kit when you're using simh.

Release info: The last OpenVMS VAX version is V7.3. Which is from
2001; it's rather old. OpenVMS V8.4 is much more current. The most
current is V8.4-1H1, and that's only available for Itanium, and it's
provided by VSI and not by HP/HPE.

[BillPedersen]

This suggests that the files inside this zip are for OpenVMS 8.4 IA64. This is the typical file naming when you request files from the HP Support Center patch download if you ask for ZIP.

The files are pre-packaged in self-extracting ZIP files, ie, .ZIPEXE and then as a collection packaged in the .ZIP file if you so request. Other options are TAR and GZIP I believe for the download package collection options.

Bill.

[Jan-Erik Soderholm]

Den 2015-10-26 kl. 00:36, skrev BillPedersen:
> On Sunday, October 25, 2015 at 6:19:18 PM UTC-4, Bill Cunningham wrote:
>> "Simon Clubley" <clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP> wrote
>> in message news:n0jji2$8k3$2...@dont-email.me...
>>> On 2015-10-25, Stephen Hoffman <seao...@hoffmanlabs.invalid>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On 2015-10-25 22:52:46 +0000, Bill Cunningham said:
>>
>>> That's a good point; I forget you could just unzip them. My advice
>>> about making sure there's a top level directory within the zip file
>>> before unpacking stands however.
>>
>> Here's the thing. I'm running linux and was going to use simh for
>> this. An emulator. I don't know how to get a hold of HP for a hobbyist
>> license for open vms. I've tried. Do they send a cd or dvd or what? I
>> have some really old vms v 4-v6 tapes too. Ok here's what the file is
>> called,
>>
>> openvms_i64_8_4_08250607.zip
>>
>> There's three files inside with .zipexe files. Hum. Do I need to
>> already have vms to do this?
>>
>> Bill
>
> This suggests that the files inside this zip are for OpenVMS 8.4 IA64.
> This is the typical file naming when you request files from the HP
> Support Center patch download if you ask for ZIP.

And the three ZIPEXE files inside can be perfectly unusable
patch files, if you do not already have a running OpenVMS
system of the right architecture and version.

What are the names of the three files inside?

[Paul Sture]

On 2015-10-25, Bill Cunningham <nos...@nspam.invalid> wrote:

zipexe files are simply self-extracting zip archives. You don't actually
need to run them on VMS - you can feed them into unzip on any platform.

Similarly there's nothing to stop you from feeding Windows self-extracting
executables into unzip on Linux or OS X or VMS, and you might prefer that
from a security point of view too.

'unzip -l' will list the contents - I do this as a matter of course, firstly
as a sanity check, secondly to see whether or not the archive contains a
directory structure of its own.

--
If SpaceX can publish their pricing for going to space, your little SaaS
does NOT need "Contact us for pricing" -- @DanHarper7
http://www.spacex.com/about/capabilities

[David Froble]

If you're going to use SimH, you need VAX/VMS. V7.3 would be the newest. Not
sure where to get it anymore?

[Bob Koehler]

Typically a zipexe can be run on the host it is targetted at, and
it is a self-extractig archive on that platform.

I have unzipped zipexe on other platforms in the past, using an
ordinary unzip. The result is usually useless on the other platform.

[Bob Koehler]

In article <n0jkd2$cup$1...@dont-email.me>, "Bill Cunningham" <nos...@nspam.invalid> writes:
>
> openvms_i64_8_4_08250607.zip
>
> There's three files inside with .zipexe files. Hum. Do I need to already
> have vms to do this?

Based on the name, it looks like you have to have an Itanium
processor running VMS in order to self-extract them. But you should
be able to unzip the other file and unzip the inner files on other
platforms.

[Bob Koehler]

In article <n0k8lq$6mu$1...@dont-email.me>, David Froble <da...@tsoft-inc.com> writes:
>
> If you're going to use SimH, you need VAX/VMS. V7.3 would be the newest. Not
> sure where to get it anymore?

VAX, real or emulated, would not run an Itanium executable.

[Bill Cunningham]

"Stephen Hoffman" <seao...@hoffmanlabs.invalid> wrote in message
news:n0jnqi$rvr$1...@dont-email.me...

>> I don't know how to get a hold of HP for a hobbyist license for open vms.
>
> Go here and register http://plato.ccsscorp.com/hobbyist_registration.php
>
> Licenses will be emailed to you. Usually within a day or so.
>
> If you need a license membership number, then get yourself a free login on

> the decuserve server - telnet to decuserve.org - if this follows the usual

> course here, you'll try ssh and not telnet and hopefully that'll work,

...

Ok the webpages are not working. Should I open a telnet session. It's been
so long. The Encompass chapter evidently no longer works.

Bill

[Bill Cunningham]

"Stephen Hoffman" <seao...@hoffmanlabs.invalid> wrote in message
news:n0jnqi$rvr$1...@dont-email.me...

> On 2015-10-25 23:19:16 +0000, Bill Cunningham said:
>
>> Here's the thing. I'm running linux and was going to use simh for this.
>> An emulator.
>
> Okay.
>
>> I don't know how to get a hold of HP for a hobbyist license for open vms.
>
> Go here and register http://plato.ccsscorp.com/hobbyist_registration.php
>
> Licenses will be emailed to you. Usually within a day or so.
>
> If you need a license membership number, then get yourself a free login on

> the decuserve server - telnet to decuserve.org - if this follows the usual

> course here, you'll try ssh and not telnet and hopefully that'll work, but

> when it doesn't, please try telnet for the sign-up - and then type the

> I'd hope that unzip will be able to unzip the file anyway - disregarding
> the prefixed self-extracting executable - but you won't be able to use the

> kit, so there's not much reason to try that.
>
> Why? In either case, it's very likely not the VAX kit. You need the VAX
> kit when you're using simh.
>
> Release info: The last OpenVMS VAX version is V7.3. Which is from 2001;
> it's rather old. OpenVMS V8.4 is much more current. The most current
> is V8.4-1H1, and that's only available for Itanium, and it's provided by
> VSI and not by HP/HPE.

Well I received something back. A text file that was a license. There are
several PAKs there. What's that? What do I do next?

Bill

[Jan-Erik Soderholm]

> What do I do next?

I think your should do some homework. Such as looking
up some tutorials on getting VMS running on simh.

"OpenVM simh" in Google gave me:

http://www.wherry.com/gadgets/retrocomputing/vax-simh.html

https://vanalboom.org/node/18

I'm sure there are others...

[BillPedersen]

You need to carefully read the installation manual, which you can find here:

http://h30266.www3.hp.com/odl/vax/opsys/vmsos73/vmsos73/vmsos73.htm

Along with many more manuals for OpenVMS VAX.

The install of OpenVMS on VAX or a VAX emulator is DIFFERENT than the install on AXP or IA64. So if you are familiar with the latter forget that and make sure to carefully follow the procedure in the manual.

Bill.

[Bill Cunningham]

"Jan-Erik Soderholm" <jan-erik....@telia.com> wrote in message
news:n0ljm0$n24$1...@news.albasani.net...

ok. I've never had to go through so much red tape to get an OS before.
I've been in computers for years and this is the first 'm coming across
terms like LSE and PAKs.

B

[BillPedersen]

I think some of the "red tape" may be that we as a community might have assumed you were looking to run VMS on an emulator. What hardware do you have on which you intend to run VMS? A VAX, a MicroVAX, an Alpha? If none of these then that implies you need an emulator.

There are many different emulators, some free, some commercial.

SimH VAX is an open source, free emulator for VAX and there is also a version for MicroVAX.

Hope this helps.

Bill.

[Bill Cunningham]

"BillPedersen" <pede...@ccsscorp.com> wrote in message
news:81b5e88a-d81c-4a9d...@googlegroups.com...

No actually I guess I will need simh. That is the one I have used in the
past for freebsd for a vax machine.

I keep reading how in the texts persons fire up simh and boot into open
vms. Is it a network they're booting into? I have heard of decnet and have
no experience with it. How do you actually get open vms the software? I have
the license. I am assuming that PAKs are similar to a type of uuid or hash
key of sorts. Like a digital signature.

Do I log in somewhere and download software? I have this license and no
software. And many dead links that I'm coming across.

Bill

[BillPedersen]

The email that came from HP with the PAKs (product authorization keys) should have had a query as to what sort of media you needed or your target system type.

They send you a link to do the download of the distribution kit, a CD image. From there you will need to boot the CD image using SimH and follow the installation directions I mentioned earlier.

DECnet is another form of networking, similar but different to TCPIP. If you are not running between a couple VMS systems or a couple systems supporting DECnet then you do not need to worry about it to begin with.

There will be a kit for installing TCPIP on your media as well.

Bill.

[Bill Cunningham]

"BillPedersen" <pede...@ccsscorp.com> wrote in message

news:14fb2506-b70a-446f...@googlegroups.com...

> The email that came from HP with the PAKs (product authorization keys)
> should have had a query as to what sort of media you needed or your target
> system type.
>
> They send you a link to do the download of the distribution kit, a CD
> image. From there you will need to boot the CD image using SimH and
> follow the installation directions I mentioned earlier.
>
> DECnet is another form of networking, similar but different to TCPIP. If
> you are not running between a couple VMS systems or a couple systems
> supporting DECnet then you do not need to worry about it to begin with.
>
> There will be a kit for installing TCPIP on your media as well.

I didn't see any links but I will check again. I saved the attachment. I
might need to re-register though. It asked about emulator and I didnot
choose simh. I think it might've been no. I'm not quite sure how to do that.
If the link is not in the text license I will have to do something again
then.

Bill

[Paul Sture]

In the email containing the PAKs you should have a contact address. You
send an email asking for links to the VAX/VMS downloads. In my
experience I have got a reply fairly promptly, even at weekends, which
os pretty good considering I'm in a different time zone.

[BillPedersen]

You should not need to re-register. A VAX is a VAX is VAX, even the emulated versions as far as VMS is concerned.

If you are getting "immediate" response with a text file with what looks like commands to register licenses then that suggests there is a change in their processing. There used to be a bit of manual review as well as a query of what sort of media you needed (target of VAX, Alpha or IA64).

If nothing else I would suspect there is a "if you need help" or similar. Or if the email looks like it came from a "person" send a note that email address.

Bill.

[Bill Cunningham]

"BillPedersen" <pede...@ccsscorp.com> wrote in message

news:760dde10-c53b-49be...@googlegroups.com...

...

If nothing else I would suspect there is a "if you need help" or similar.
Or if the email looks like it came from a "person" send a note that email
address.

Ok I sent an email and was sent several ways to download. I have the ISO.
Whew! Ok I also downloaded something that said "TCPIP" in it and what looked
like could be a C compiler. Something in PSCI format. Never heard of it. I
got through simh to the $ prompt and don't know what to enter. So I am going
to have to hit the tutorials now and learn about vms.

And this is not /old/ DEC stuff is it? This is a modern version of a
*vms* OS? So this is tcp/ip ready isn't it as long as simh can access the
underlying linux network?

Bill

[Camiel Vanderhoeven]

Op maandag 26 oktober 2015 19:37:33 UTC+1 schreef Bill Cunningham:

Google "install vms simh", and one of the links you'll find is http://www.wherry.com/gadgets/retrocomputing/vax-simh.html, which gives you a walkthrough for installing VMS.

It's been a while since there's been a VMS version for VAX, so yes, this is relatively old stuff.

Camiel.

[Rich Alderson]

Stephen Hoffman <seao...@hoffmanlabs.invalid> writes:

> On 2015-10-25 22:52:46 +0000, Bill Cunningham said:

>> I have found some files called "open vms..." as part of there
>> names. They are in a zip file. Now the files inside are in zipexe
>> format. Is that something new? I can't find anything that wants to
>> uncompress this format.

> That's probably an unnecessary repackaging of a self-extracting zip file.

> Either run the file (if you're on the same architecture it was created
> for), or use unzip to decompress it.

> Related: <http://labs.hoffmanlabs.com/node/127>

Hoff et al.,

Mr. Cunningham is an enthusiast who wastes a lot of time for helpful people.
He seems to be a nice person, not a troll, though I eventually kill-files him
in alt.folklore.computers.

He claims to have a lot of computer experience, but as we learned in
alt.sys.pdp10, alt.sys.pdp8, and the SimH list, it started with (IIRC) a TRS-80
and continued on Intel-based processors until recently. It took several weeks
on the SimH mailing list to get through to him that the PDP-10 does not think
in 8-bit bytes.

I am not telling anyone not to help him. I am simply warning everyone about
the time sink into which they may thereby step.

--
Rich Alderson ne...@alderson.users.panix.com
the russet leaves of an autumn oak/inspire once again the failed poet/
to take up his pen/and essay to place his meagre words upon the page...

[Bill Cunningham]

"Rich Alderson" <ne...@alderson.users.panix.com> wrote in message
news:mddmvv5...@panix5.panix.com...

> Hoff et al.,
>
> Mr. Cunningham is an enthusiast who wastes a lot of time for helpful
> people.
> He seems to be a nice person, not a troll, though I eventually kill-files
> him
> in alt.folklore.computers.

I made 2 posts. I kind of regret it the first one seems to go on and
on...

> He claims to have a lot of computer experience, but as we learned in
> alt.sys.pdp10, alt.sys.pdp8, and the SimH list, it started with (IIRC) a
> TRS-80

Timex ( I believe) Sinclair zx81
First OS was MS-DOS I was around when CP/M was but never got into it at the
time.

> and continued on Intel-based processors until recently. It took several
> weeks
> on the SimH mailing list to get through to him that the PDP-10 does not
> think
> in 8-bit bytes.

Hum. I usually deal with PDPs 8 and 11. PDP10 not so much. I don't
recall that offhand.

> I am not telling anyone not to help him. I am simply warning everyone
> about
> the time sink into which they may thereby step.

I think I take on too much sometimes. But I have VMS now. And it seems
to be up to the tutorials on learning how to use vms. If I like it I'll get
more into it but as said; I am also looking at several other DEC OSes. I
like the *nixes very much.

Thanks all
Bill

[David Froble]

Rich Alderson wrote:
> Stephen Hoffman <seao...@hoffmanlabs.invalid> writes:
>
>> On 2015-10-25 22:52:46 +0000, Bill Cunningham said:
>
>>> I have found some files called "open vms..." as part of there
>>> names. They are in a zip file. Now the files inside are in zipexe
>>> format. Is that something new? I can't find anything that wants to
>>> uncompress this format.
>
>> That's probably an unnecessary repackaging of a self-extracting zip file.
>
>> Either run the file (if you're on the same architecture it was created
>> for), or use unzip to decompress it.
>
>> Related: <http://labs.hoffmanlabs.com/node/127>
>
> Hoff et al.,
>
> Mr. Cunningham is an enthusiast who wastes a lot of time for helpful people.
> He seems to be a nice person, not a troll, though I eventually kill-files him
> in alt.folklore.computers.
>
> He claims to have a lot of computer experience, but as we learned in
> alt.sys.pdp10, alt.sys.pdp8, and the SimH list, it started with (IIRC) a TRS-80
> and continued on Intel-based processors until recently. It took several weeks
> on the SimH mailing list to get through to him that the PDP-10 does not think
> in 8-bit bytes.
>
> I am not telling anyone not to help him. I am simply warning everyone about
> the time sink into which they may thereby step.
>

Understood. But I have to observe that he's showing more interest than most
people on the planet.

[Rich Alderson]

David Froble <da...@tsoft-inc.com> writes:

> Rich Alderson wrote:

>> I am not telling anyone not to help him. I am simply warning everyone about
>> the time sink into which they may thereby step.

> Understood. But I have to observe that he's showing more interest than most
> people on the planet.

Oh, I agree. I simply wore out.

[IanD]

On Tuesday, October 27, 2015 at 9:18:44 AM UTC+11, Bill Cunningham wrote:
> "Rich Alderson" <ne...@aldersonnnn.users.panix.com> wrote in message
> news:mddmvv5...@panix5.panixxxxx.com...
>
<snip>

> I
> like the *nixes very much.
>
> Thanks all
> Bill

Then have partially the best of both worlds

http://emuvm.com/downloads.php

It's an Alpha emulator (certainly more up to date than Vax) that can run on windows or a nix'y flavor (debian, redhat, bsd)

Free for non commercial use too

[Hans Vlems]

Because you've seen his posts on comp.lang.c as well? :-)

[John Reagan]

On Monday, November 9, 2015 at 4:48:48 PM UTC-5, Hans Vlems wrote:
> Because you've seen his posts on comp.lang.c as well? :-)

Even I can only take so much punishment...