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JCL Conversion
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Glenn Schneck
Jul 25, 2016, 1:38:41 PM7/25/16
to
Hello all! I am looking for any information on converting existing JCL to Windows scripts. Anyone have any information?
Thanks!
Glenn
Ed Jaffe
Jul 25, 2016, 2:23:24 PM7/25/16
to
On 7/25/2016 10:38 AM, Glenn Schneck wrote:
> Hello all! I am looking for any information on converting existing
> JCL to Windows scripts. Anyone have any information?
What are Windows scripts?
> Hello all! I am looking for any information on converting existing
> JCL to Windows scripts. Anyone have any information?
Do you mean MSDOS *.BAT files that run under Microsoft Windows?
Is there software on z/VSE that can process them in some meaningful way?
--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/
_______________________________________________
VSE-L mailing list
VS...@lists.lehigh.edu
https://lists.lehigh.edu/mailman/listinfo/vse-l
Stuart, David
Jul 25, 2016, 2:30:16 PM7/25/16
to
I received the impression that he wanted to go the other way. To convert z/VSE JCL into a 'script' that would run on Windows.
Dave
Dave Stuart
Principal Information Systems Support Analyst
Information Technology Services
County of Ventura, CA
805-662-6731
David....@ventura.org
Dave
Dave Stuart
Principal Information Systems Support Analyst
Information Technology Services
County of Ventura, CA
805-662-6731
David....@ventura.org
Glenn Schneck
Jul 25, 2016, 3:14:29 PM7/25/16
to
Yes, sorry for the confusion. I want to be able to download VSE JCL and run a script to convert it to either JScript or Powershell.
Hope this makes more sense.
Thanks!
Glenn
Tony Thigpen
Jul 26, 2016, 9:03:52 AM7/26/16
to
I am sure there are some out there that would say "yes, we can do that
for $xxx", but the nature of the beast is that they are just too different.
The JCL is just a small part of any move to Windows. The executiables,
the utility programs (sort, idcams, ditto, etc.), vsam files, and the
way print is handled is the big items. The JCL is just a support structure.
Based on your question, I don't think you have that much experience with
VSE, and maybe not z/OS. So, I guess someone asked you "can you do
this?" If so, tell them 'No'. You don't want to be the one that costs a
company millions leaving them with a sub-standard system that may
"work", but will not get the job done. We have seen that many times.
Most of the time the dollars are wasted and the conversion scraped. Many
times, the company goes under because of the money-pit they end up with.
Tony Thigpen
for $xxx", but the nature of the beast is that they are just too different.
The JCL is just a small part of any move to Windows. The executiables,
the utility programs (sort, idcams, ditto, etc.), vsam files, and the
way print is handled is the big items. The JCL is just a support structure.
Based on your question, I don't think you have that much experience with
VSE, and maybe not z/OS. So, I guess someone asked you "can you do
this?" If so, tell them 'No'. You don't want to be the one that costs a
company millions leaving them with a sub-standard system that may
"work", but will not get the job done. We have seen that many times.
Most of the time the dollars are wasted and the conversion scraped. Many
times, the company goes under because of the money-pit they end up with.
Tony Thigpen
Kevin Corkery
Jul 26, 2016, 9:13:45 AM7/26/16
to
Just my $0.02 on Tony's response. I would think that if a vendor was
proposing moving something from z/VSE to a Windows environment and providing
an infrastructural items that Tony enumerates, a solution for handling JCL
would need to be in their wheelhouse. If, by your question, it is not, then
RRRRRuuunnnnnnnnnnnnn!!!!!!!
-----Original Message-----
From: VSE-L [mailto:vse-l-bounces+kcorkery=live...@lists.lehigh.edu] On
Behalf Of Tony Thigpen
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 9:04 AM
To: VSE Discussion List
proposing moving something from z/VSE to a Windows environment and providing
an infrastructural items that Tony enumerates, a solution for handling JCL
would need to be in their wheelhouse. If, by your question, it is not, then
RRRRRuuunnnnnnnnnnnnn!!!!!!!
-----Original Message-----
From: VSE-L [mailto:vse-l-bounces+kcorkery=live...@lists.lehigh.edu] On
Behalf Of Tony Thigpen
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 9:04 AM
To: VSE Discussion List
Edward M. Martin
Jul 26, 2016, 9:22:58 AM7/26/16
to
Hello Glenn,
I agree with Kevin and Tony.
If the vendor of the new product needs JCL turned into scripts, the vendor should have the process defined.
In the meetings, this is where your Tech consultant, wears the Black Hat, and tells the vendor that right in front of management.
Played the bad guy to vendors, it works.
Edward M. Martin
Aultman Health Foundation
HealthQuest
330-363-9666
Internal EXT 39666
-----Original Message-----
From: VSE-L [mailto:vse-l-bounces+edward.martin=aultm...@lists.lehigh.edu] On Behalf Of Kevin Corkery
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 9:14 AM
To: 'VSE Discussion List'
Subject: RE: JCL Conversion
Just my $0.02 on Tony's response. I would think that if a vendor was proposing moving something from z/VSE to a Windows environment and providing an infrastructural items that Tony enumerates, a solution for handling JCL would need to be in their wheelhouse. If, by your question, it is not, then RRRRRuuunnnnnnnnnnnnn!!!!!!!
-----Original Message-----
From: VSE-L [mailto:vse-l-bounces+kcorkery=live...@lists.lehigh.edu] On Behalf Of Tony Thigpen
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 9:04 AM
To: VSE Discussion List
Subject: Re: JCL Conversion
I am sure there are some out there that would say "yes, we can do that for $xxx", but the nature of the beast is that they are just too different.
The JCL is just a small part of any move to Windows. The executiables, the utility programs (sort, idcams, ditto, etc.), vsam files, and the way print is handled is the big items. The JCL is just a support structure.
Based on your question, I don't think you have that much experience with VSE, and maybe not z/OS. So, I guess someone asked you "can you do this?" If so, tell them 'No'. You don't want to be the one that costs a company millions leaving them with a sub-standard system that may "work", but will not get the job done. We have seen that many times.
Most of the time the dollars are wasted and the conversion scraped. Many times, the company goes under because of the money-pit they end up with.
Tony Thigpen
Glenn Schneck wrote on 07/25/2016 01:38 PM:
> Hello all! I am looking for any information on converting existing
> JCL to Windows scripts. Anyone have any information?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Glenn
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> VSE-L mailing list
> VS...@lists.lehigh.edu
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CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail (including the information it contains and attachments) is a business communication intended for the authorized use by the person who requested it, or for the authorized use by the intended recipient to perform an employment duty or business function. This e-mail may contain confidential, privileged, or proprietary information, including (but not limited to) Protected Health Information covered by the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA). It also may be protected by the Electronic Communications Act. If you received this e-mail by mistake, either directly or inadvertently as a recipient on a copied or forwarded e-mail, promptly notify us by return e-mail. Destroy this e-mail, the information, and attachments you received by mistake. You must not print, use, forward, or disclose to any third party by electronic, written or oral means any information you received by mistake. We do not waive any privilege. We may take le
gal steps or other appropriate action, as needed, to protect the confidentiality and privilege of any information inadvertently disclosed.
I agree with Kevin and Tony.
If the vendor of the new product needs JCL turned into scripts, the vendor should have the process defined.
In the meetings, this is where your Tech consultant, wears the Black Hat, and tells the vendor that right in front of management.
Played the bad guy to vendors, it works.
Edward M. Martin
Aultman Health Foundation
HealthQuest
330-363-9666
Internal EXT 39666
-----Original Message-----
From: VSE-L [mailto:vse-l-bounces+edward.martin=aultm...@lists.lehigh.edu] On Behalf Of Kevin Corkery
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 9:14 AM
To: 'VSE Discussion List'
Subject: RE: JCL Conversion
Just my $0.02 on Tony's response. I would think that if a vendor was proposing moving something from z/VSE to a Windows environment and providing an infrastructural items that Tony enumerates, a solution for handling JCL would need to be in their wheelhouse. If, by your question, it is not, then RRRRRuuunnnnnnnnnnnnn!!!!!!!
-----Original Message-----
From: VSE-L [mailto:vse-l-bounces+kcorkery=live...@lists.lehigh.edu] On Behalf Of Tony Thigpen
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 9:04 AM
To: VSE Discussion List
Subject: Re: JCL Conversion
I am sure there are some out there that would say "yes, we can do that for $xxx", but the nature of the beast is that they are just too different.
The JCL is just a small part of any move to Windows. The executiables, the utility programs (sort, idcams, ditto, etc.), vsam files, and the way print is handled is the big items. The JCL is just a support structure.
Based on your question, I don't think you have that much experience with VSE, and maybe not z/OS. So, I guess someone asked you "can you do this?" If so, tell them 'No'. You don't want to be the one that costs a company millions leaving them with a sub-standard system that may "work", but will not get the job done. We have seen that many times.
Most of the time the dollars are wasted and the conversion scraped. Many times, the company goes under because of the money-pit they end up with.
Tony Thigpen
Glenn Schneck wrote on 07/25/2016 01:38 PM:
> Hello all! I am looking for any information on converting existing
> JCL to Windows scripts. Anyone have any information?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Glenn
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> VSE-L mailing list
> VS...@lists.lehigh.edu
> .lehigh.edu%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2fvse-l&data=01%7c01%7cEdward.Martin%
> 40aultman.com%7c04ecd17fef5a4eca104508d3b556a792%7cb91830d1006447288b5
> 657e8943c3565%7c0&sdata=43z7dv3bTDkpnxLIgppOZge6Gq4GR%2fWneY8b3YOBVbc%
> 3d
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3a%2f%2flists.lehigh.edu%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2fvse-l&data=01%7c01%7cEdward.Martin%40aultman.com%7c04ecd17fef5a4eca104508d3b556a792%7cb91830d1006447288b5657e8943c3565%7c0&sdata=43z7dv3bTDkpnxLIgppOZge6Gq4GR%2fWneY8b3YOBVbc%3d
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CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail (including the information it contains and attachments) is a business communication intended for the authorized use by the person who requested it, or for the authorized use by the intended recipient to perform an employment duty or business function. This e-mail may contain confidential, privileged, or proprietary information, including (but not limited to) Protected Health Information covered by the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA). It also may be protected by the Electronic Communications Act. If you received this e-mail by mistake, either directly or inadvertently as a recipient on a copied or forwarded e-mail, promptly notify us by return e-mail. Destroy this e-mail, the information, and attachments you received by mistake. You must not print, use, forward, or disclose to any third party by electronic, written or oral means any information you received by mistake. We do not waive any privilege. We may take le
gal steps or other appropriate action, as needed, to protect the confidentiality and privilege of any information inadvertently disclosed.
Tom Huegel
Jul 26, 2016, 9:23:16 AM7/26/16
to
My $0.02 is first hand experience starting in the mid 1990's the company I worked for bought into the idea that VSE was dead and they needed to convert everything to UNIX... This project was estimated to cost $10 million dollars over 5 years (but in the long run, according to the consultants, we would save ten times that amount). Well five years later the company had dumped over $50 million into the project and were no closer that they were on day one. The CEO, VP's etc. built themselves a nice golden parachute, declared bankruptcy, locked the doors and drove off into the sunset...
Glenn Schneck
Jul 26, 2016, 9:24:38 AM7/26/16
to
Tony and Kevin,
Thanks. I am looking to move a small batch application, hence my question. I don't want to reinvent the wheel if someone already has done this. I looked on the CBT tape and didn't see anything so I thought I would ask the experts!
Glenn
Kevin Corkery
Jul 26, 2016, 9:34:48 AM7/26/16
to
OK. This is a small internal project. I don’t think you’ll find anything that automates this without spending money. That being said, it can’t be too difficult to figure it out to do manually yourself. JCL is just a way to connect external resources to the internal resources used by the program at its simplest. Connect a few of these together and you get a “job”. Put a few jobs together and you get an “application”. I would suggest to start with the programming package (let’s say a COBOL compiler) and see how that package relates external resources. You then need to pick the environment for execution, usually the windows command line (.cmd or .bat), but you did suggest other scripting methods.
Tony Thigpen
Jul 26, 2016, 11:44:34 AM7/26/16
to
If a small job, look at using Rexx. Check out http://rexx.org and
http://www.rexxla.org/
I have written REXX that is portable to VM and Linux (workstation). I
have also written REXX that is portable to VM and VSE. So, writing
something you can run on VSE, then port to Windows should not be too
hard. Get it working on VSE, then port it.
Tony Thigpen
> > VS...@lists.lehigh.edu <mailto:VS...@lists.lehigh.edu>
http://www.rexxla.org/
I have written REXX that is portable to VM and Linux (workstation). I
have also written REXX that is portable to VM and VSE. So, writing
something you can run on VSE, then port to Windows should not be too
hard. Get it working on VSE, then port it.
Tony Thigpen
> > https://lists.lehigh.edu/mailman/listinfo/vse-l
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
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> >
>
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Ken and Mary Meyer
Jul 26, 2016, 12:21:21 PM7/26/16
to
There has been a bit of speculation, but without more information about
what you are trying to accomplish for the project and what type of data
is being used to produce the desired result, we can't provide much
assistance.
Ken
On Tue, Jul 26, 2016 at 10:44 AM, Tony Thigpen <to...@vse2pdf.com> wrote:
> If a small job, look at using Rexx. Check out http://rexx.org and
> http://www.rexxla.org/
snip..
what you are trying to accomplish for the project and what type of data
is being used to produce the desired result, we can't provide much
assistance.
Ken
On Tue, Jul 26, 2016 at 10:44 AM, Tony Thigpen <to...@vse2pdf.com> wrote:
> If a small job, look at using Rexx. Check out http://rexx.org and
> http://www.rexxla.org/
Allan Peterson
Jul 26, 2016, 4:58:24 PM7/26/16
to
I have a passing interest in this as to how the many JCL sets that run the insurance companies are migrated to proposed Virtualised system.
-----Original Message-----
From: VSE-L [mailto:vse-l-bounces+allan.peterson=revera...@lists.lehigh.edu] On Behalf Of Ken and Mary Meyer
Sent: Wednesday, 27 July 2016 04:21
To: VSE Discussion List
Subject: Re: JCL Conversion
-----Original Message-----
From: VSE-L [mailto:vse-l-bounces+allan.peterson=revera...@lists.lehigh.edu] On Behalf Of Ken and Mary Meyer
Sent: Wednesday, 27 July 2016 04:21
To: VSE Discussion List
Subject: Re: JCL Conversion
Tony Thigpen
Jul 26, 2016, 5:44:31 PM7/26/16
to
I know one that crashed and burned. Vendor was kicked out and new z box
was ordered. I think it was in excess of $5m.
Tony Thigpen
was ordered. I think it was in excess of $5m.
Tony Thigpen
John Mycroft
Jul 27, 2016, 7:29:15 AM7/27/16
to
I've done a few of these using Python to write a one-off conversion program or, more often, several conversion programs. You'll need to accept that the best you're going to get is an n% complete job where n is between about 50 and 80, depending on how much work you plan to put into the Python (or REXX or whatever). One important point to remember is that it's the hard part that that gets left undone - is there a Windows equivalent of an IDCAMS DEFINE for an index component?
So, if you are happy to spend some weeks writing the conversion program and accept that the best you are going to get out of it is some "fill in the blanks" forms, you could be flogging a dead horse. And as several people have already said, if the vendor of your Windows product is not prepared to come up with a conversion tool that will do a hefty part of the conversion, you may want to ask them why before your project winds up as an expensive tombstone on Reboot Hill http://www.planetmainframe.com/2016/03/reboot-hill-revisited/.
Cheers and good luck!
John Mycroft
So, if you are happy to spend some weeks writing the conversion program and accept that the best you are going to get out of it is some "fill in the blanks" forms, you could be flogging a dead horse. And as several people have already said, if the vendor of your Windows product is not prepared to come up with a conversion tool that will do a hefty part of the conversion, you may want to ask them why before your project winds up as an expensive tombstone on Reboot Hill http://www.planetmainframe.com/2016/03/reboot-hill-revisited/.
Cheers and good luck!
John Mycroft
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