Carradice Bagman Support versus SQR Support System versus Tout Terrain Sherpa

[JimPop...@comcast.net]

To all:

 

I'm relatively new to the group and wanted to solicit some feedback from anyone that has used one of the three support items and the associated bag above.

 

I'm going to follow through on a couple of New Years "cycling resolutions" which will require one of the three.

 

First resolution is to commute a lot more to work and for errands. 

 

Second resolution is to join the New England Randonneurs and completed their brevet series.  

 

Planning to commute on my cross bike which is a Kona Major Jake and ride the brevet series on my Rambouillet.  

 

Ideally, I'd like to buy one bag and two mounting clips (for lack of a better term) so that I can move the bag from one bike to another.   Also, probably the most important feature, I'm looking for a bag that  removes from the bike easily so I can carry it into work, stores and such. 

 

All three seem to fit the bill to some extent.  And, while it doesn't have the panache that the Carridice bags have, I'm leaning toward the Tout terrain. 

 

Again, I would welcome input from anyone that's used one of the three.  

 

Thanks - Jim

[Dan Emery]

I don't have too much helpful but since no one else has replied, I'll
toss in my $.02. I have a Bagman (bought recently) which I use with a
Camper Longflap. It works well, but I wouldn't want to take the bag
off and on a couple times per day (I have the Standard, not the Quick
Release, so I can't comment on the QR). Also, I'm not sure what bag
you would use, but I don't think the Camper would be very convenient
to carry around. I have heard reports from a good source that the SQR
system works well, and that would seem better adapted to your proposed
use, but I haven't used it. The Tout Terrain looks to me like it
might work well, but again, no experience.

Dan

On Mar 22, 2:33 pm, JimPopovi...@comcast.net wrote:
> To all:
>
> I'm relatively new to the group and wanted to solicit some feedback from anyone that has used one of the three support items and the associated bag above.
>
> I'm going to follow through on a couple of New Years "cycling resolutions" which will require one of the three.
>
> First resolution is to commute a lot more to work and for errands. 
>
> Second resolution is to join the New England Randonneurs and completed their brevet series.  
>
> Planning to commute on my cross bike which is a Kona Major Jake and ride the brevet series on my Rambouillet.  
>

> Ideally, I'd like to buy one bag and two mounting clips ( for lack of a better term ) so that I can move the bag from one bike to another.   Also, probably the most important feature, I'm looking for a bag that  removes from the bike easily so I can carry it into work, stores and such. 

[Keith Ayres]

I have the QR Bagman, I've replaced the strap which is intended to
hold the bag to the seatpost with a nylon strap with snap-together
buckle.
On and off in seconds, safe while riding. I don't have the Bagman
support fitted while using pannier racks, just the QR attached to the
saddle. I would recommend it with or without the support.

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--
Keith Ayres
Oxfordshire, UK
Thorn Raven, Argos, Trevor Jarvis Flying Gate

[NickBull]

I've used a Carradice Lowsaddle Longflap for five years of
randonneuring. For the first of those I used a Bagman and after that
have just been hanging the Carradice on the bag loops of various
Brooks or Selle Anatomica saddles. It works great either way and
saves weight not to use the Bagman.

That Tout Terrain Sherpa rack doesn't look like it really can hold the
pack all that steady. If that means that the pack is rotating back
and forth about its vertical axis when you are standing and climbing,
then it seems like it'd be exhausting. And it looks like it needs a
lot of exposed seatpost. If your Ram has that much seatpost showing,
then I'd think the frame is too small for the Riv philosophy of a
hands-width of exposed seatpost. The Sherpa isn't really "quick
release", either. You'll still have to mount a bag securely to it,
which will likely involve multiple straps and buckles or whatever, all
of which have to be undone and redone. Also, that Sherpa system seems
to need a lot of vertical room. So it'll make it more of a pain to
swing your leg over the saddle. The Carradice never gets in the way.

What I use for commuting is just an old-fashioned pannier on a rack, I
use an Arkel T-42. Easy to put on and take off. The Carradice just
stays on the rando bike.

I think it's best not to mix commuting and rando because then you're
carrying a bunch of rando stuff on the commute that you probably don't
need, and simultaneously subjecting it to all the slings and arrows of
outrageous fortune that commuting can bring. Better to have a
separate rando bag that you know has all of the rando stuff in it and
that you can be confident that you can just grab and go.

You could buy a Carradice and hang it on your bag loops (or buy
something like Carradice's bolt-on bag loops, see

http://www.carradice.co.uk/index.php?page_id=product&under=other&product_id=88

That solves your rando problem, where quick-release doesn't matter,
but it does matter to have a bag that is optimized for rando-style
riding . And for work you could get a decent rack and pannier from
Nashbar for $60 and solve the QR problem. I'll bet the total cost is
probably about the same as buying the Sherpa system with two Sherpa
racks.

Nick

On Mar 22, 2:33 pm, JimPopovi...@comcast.net wrote:

> To all:
>
> I'm relatively new to the group and wanted to solicit some feedback from anyone that has used one of the three support items and the associated bag above.
>
> I'm going to follow through on a couple of New Years "cycling resolutions" which will require one of the three.
>
> First resolution is to commute a lot more to work and for errands. 
>
> Second resolution is to join the New England Randonneurs and completed their brevet series.  
>
> Planning to commute on my cross bike which is a Kona Major Jake and ride the brevet series on my Rambouillet.  
>

> Ideally, I'd like to buy one bag and two mounting clips ( for lack of a better term ) so that I can move the bag from one bike to another.   Also, probably the most important feature, I'm looking for a bag that  removes from the bike easily so I can carry it into work, stores and such. 

[Jon Shinefeld]

Hi Jim, 

I've used the SQR system and the Bagman. Never cared for the SQR because the bag (Nelson Longflap) swayed and as I recall, the whole shootin match is held onto the seatpost with a lightweight bandclamp. Also, a fistful of seatpost might not be enough to let you get the bag in and out of the SQR since the bag lifts up and out. 

On the other hand, the regular Bagman is simple and reliable and can be molded / bent to suit your needs. For years, I've used fastex buckles from REI to fasten my bag to multiple bikes. Makes on and off fast and easy.  2 buckles on the top of the bag looped through the top leather patches. The corresponding half gets zip tied through saddle hoops or seat frame.  Since I overpack, I added a nylon strap w/ fastex buckles at the bag base wrapped around some convenient bike part to take the sway out.

Word of caution: in my sample of 2, Bagmen with quick release features tend to fall apart if the little threaded pieces are not secured with blue loctite. 

Best, 

Jon in Philadelphia 

--

[MichaelH]

I used the SQR with both a Long Flap and more often the Barley bag to
commute for many years. It worked really well for me. The only time
I was aware of any sway (back and forth, not side to side) was when I
stood up. The leather strap that attaches to the rack seems to be set
a bit too high for the frame, but the bag is otherwise rock solid and
the Barley holds an amazing amount of stuff, which was useful on those
nights my wife would call with a last minute shopping list. The
Carradice SQR is the fastest on and off system you can buy, so if you
are leaving your bike outside and want to take the bag with you; it's
great. I bought a second bike mount and so could easily use the bags
on either bike with no additional effort. The carriers are also
lighter than any rack, although obviously heavier than a Bagman. I
did carry my Macbook in the LF occasionally but the additional sway
standing up was just enough to discourage me from doing it too often.
I never had a problem getting the bag on and off, but the attachment
would need to be moved if I wanted to get to the seat bolt. Also, you
cannot add or remove the attachment without removing the seat post.

michael

On Mar 23, 5:47 pm, Jon Shinefeld <ajsh...@comcast.net> wrote:
> Hi Jim,
> I've used the SQR system and the Bagman. Never cared for the SQR because the bag (Nelson Longflap) swayed and as I recall, the whole shootin match is held onto the seatpost with a lightweight bandclamp. Also, a fistful of seatpost might not be enough to let you get the bag in and out of the SQR since the bag lifts up and out.
> On the other hand, the regular Bagman is simple and reliable and can be molded / bent to suit your needs. For years, I've used fastex buckles from REI to fasten my bag to multiple bikes. Makes on and off fast and easy.  2 buckles on the top of the bag looped through the top leather patches. The corresponding half gets zip tied through saddle hoops or seat frame.  Since I overpack, I added a nylon strap w/ fastex buckles at the bag base wrapped around some convenient bike part to take the sway out.
> Word of caution: in my sample of 2, Bagmen with quick release features tend to fall apart if the little threaded pieces are not secured with blue loctite.
> Best,
> Jon in Philadelphia
>

[Martin Bernstein]

I have a Carradice Barley which I've used with an SQR.  The SQR has two parts:  One is affixed to the bag, the other is on the seat post.  Once the bag is threaded onto the structure on the bag, and the seat post mount everything just falls into place.  Easy on, easy off.

[Martin Bernstein]

With the Barley, you can attach the bag at the bottom (I recall, to the seat post). That keeps the bag from moving at all.

[sanjoser]

well, slightly off the chosen three, but I've been commuting with 

my ortlieb office bag for a few years now. 

it's indestructable, comes on and off the rear rack on my Atlantis,

waterproof and fits a ton of stuff when well packed. 

good luck

[MichaelH]

the one big advantage of a saddle bag (literally) over a pannier or
office bag (I have the carradice office bag) is that it sits above the
fender, and out of the road muck and spray. Of course if you live in
a dessert then the added room and stability for a computer etc, may be
worth the trade off. Here in VT, I find I prefer a saddle bag.

michael

[Will]

For the commuter bike you might find a simple Wald basket works best.

Cheap. Nobody's gonna steal it. More aerodynamic than a bag. More
flexible packing. You don't fiddle with buckles and straps: a piece of
old inner tube with a couple of S-hooks secures everything. More
panache than a Carridice, unless, of course, you are old... and still
believe the marketing fairies. ;-)

On Mar 22, 1:33 pm, JimPopovi...@comcast.net wrote:
> To all:
>
> I'm relatively new to the group and wanted to solicit some feedback from anyone that has used one of the three support items and the associated bag above.
>
> I'm going to follow through on a couple of New Years "cycling resolutions" which will require one of the three.
>
> First resolution is to commute a lot more to work and for errands. 
>
> Second resolution is to join the New England Randonneurs and completed their brevet series.  
>
> Planning to commute on my cross bike which is a Kona Major Jake and ride the brevet series on my Rambouillet.  
>

> Ideally, I'd like to buy one bag and two mounting clips ( for lack of a better term ) so that I can move the bag from one bike to another.   Also, probably the most important feature, I'm looking for a bag that  removes from the bike easily so I can carry it into work, stores and such. 

[Martin Bernstein]

Will,

Gotta love your style.  

Worry about aerodynamics on a commuter bike?  And a basket (on the handlebar, over the front wheel) no less.

[Martin Bernstein]

Another advantage to the bag is that it doesn't influence bike handling.  I had to take my SQR off to use the Thudbuster.  Now when I use the Barley I mount it by its straps onto the hooks on the B-17 saddle and anchor it to the seat post with velcro straps.

[Will]

I suppose aerodynamics might be relevant to commuting. If your commute
is 15 miles RT, there is a tendency to streamline.

That means... the basket is in back. On the rear rack.

Though I think you're on to something... an empty front basket has
less air resistance than an empty handlebar bag...

I used to have a seat bag... but then practicality hammered me... how
you gonna carry the beer, the box-o-wine, or the take-out in a seat
bag?

On Mar 24, 10:34 am, Martin Bernstein <centri...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Will,
>
> Gotta love your style.
>
> Worry about aerodynamics on a commuter bike?  And a basket (on the
> handlebar, over the front wheel) no less.
>

[Martin Bernstein]

Will,

You win. I'll give you the box-o-wine.  Take out I can easily put into my Barley, and a beer or two (not a big consumer of beer, tho one or two on a hot day works) and have been know to put several pastries from a W. VA. bakery in handle bar bag.  

Can't see doing anything beyond commuting w/basket.  Besides, couldn't get my leg over the rear wheel with a basket which to my mind, with the beer, wine and carry-out the equivalent of a large child/small adult.  Which is why I have that seat bag.   Trim down instead of bulking up.

[MichaelH]

This has gone on too long, but as someone who uses both front and rear
bags, and had a 30 mile commute ( and never thought much about aero,
other than refusing to get stuck on a sit up and beg bike).... Jan
Hein's wind tunnel tests suggest that a front bag is more aero than a
rear bag. But I don't think he ever tested a bag as small as a
Barley. Bottom line, a bag that's inside the riders profile has
little affect on aerodynamics. A basket probably has less, as long as
it's empty. A pannier probably has the most, but most commuting is
about dodging buses, not wind gusts.

michael

On Mar 24, 2:19 pm, Martin Bernstein <centri...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Will,
>

[Martin Bernstein]

Well, Michael.  Thanks for your observations.  As I'm retired and don't commute, but do ride tours mostly on my CoMotion, I can't say the Acorn handle bar bag and the Barley have barely made any difference.  I'm still slow.

[Paul Patterson]

I've used SQR, a borrowed bagman, and some other designs but never
really liked what was available. So I decided to come up with my own
home brew design. The prototype has been used for two years with no
problems. I am still working with a patent attorney on the design, but
for now I make two or three when requested.

Here is my online photo album.

http://s164.photobucket.com/albums/u11/bicycleflyer/New%20Saddlebag%20mounting%20system/

Unfortunately I've not been able to ride as much as I like. I lost a
job, got a new job that is not as good as the one I lost, and been
devoting the little extra time I have to my 4 yr old son. So I've not
been able to work on this as much as I would have liked. But look at
the album, if you like it let me know. I have three on my workbench
now. Hopefully I will finish them when I get home. Which at present
will not be until April 3rd.

Paul

On Mar 22, 2:33 pm, JimPopovi...@comcast.net wrote:

> To all:
>
> I'm relatively new to the group and wanted to solicit some feedback from anyone that has used one of the three support items and the associated bag above.
>
> I'm going to follow through on a couple of New Years "cycling resolutions" which will require one of the three.
>
> First resolution is to commute a lot more to work and for errands. 
>
> Second resolution is to join the New England Randonneurs and completed their brevet series.  
>
> Planning to commute on my cross bike which is a Kona Major Jake and ride the brevet series on my Rambouillet.  
>

> Ideally, I'd like to buy one bag and two mounting clips ( for lack of a better term ) so that I can move the bag from one bike to another.   Also, probably the most important feature, I'm looking for a bag that  removes from the bike easily so I can carry it into work, stores and such. 

[Keith Ayres]

On 25 March 2011 04:43, Paul Patterson <bicycl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I've used SQR, a borrowed bagman, and some other designs but never
> really liked what was available. So I decided to come up with my own
> home brew design. The prototype has been used for two years with no
> problems. I am still working with a patent attorney on the design, but
> for now I make two or three when requested.
>
> Here is my online photo album.
>
> http://s164.photobucket.com/albums/u11/bicycleflyer/New%20Saddlebag%20mounting%20system/
>
> Unfortunately I've not been able to ride as much as I like. I lost a
> job, got a new job that is not as good as the one I lost, and been
> devoting the little extra time I have to my 4 yr old son. So I've not
> been able to work on this as much as I would have liked. But look at
> the album, if you like it let me know. I have three on my workbench
> now. Hopefully I will finish them when I get home. Which at present
> will not be until April 3rd.
>
> Paul

Hi Paul,

Neat piece of work. If you google 'Lord Kwiklift saddlebag support',
you should find pictures of another homebrew support, made by a guy in
Warwickshire, UK. I like his support under the bag, but yours seems to
have a more positive attachment to the saddle.

Kind regards,

[Rob in Seattle]

That looks pretty slick Paul! I've been thinking about a saddlebag, but I often put my bike on the Metro bus rack, which requires a quick on and off in order to not hold up the bus. (My Ortleib pannier clips on and off in about a second.) This looks like it'd be close. I wonder if a small tab on the pin would help. Looks like the straps could get in the way of the holes when affixing the bag?

Rob in Seattle

[Paul Patterson]

It's never been a problem. The straps are pretty stiff and dont flop around too much. In addition I close the loops to about as small as they will go without them actually cinching down on the pin. There is not much left over that can get into the way.

Paul

---

From: Rob in Seattle <robh...@gmail.com>
To: bicyclel...@googlegroups.com
Cc: Paul Patterson <bicycl...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Fri, March 25, 2011 12:29:54 PM
Subject: Re: Carradice Bagman Support versus SQR Support System versus Tout Terrain Sherpa

[Kenny]

On Mar 24, 10:43 pm, Paul Patterson <bicyclefl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I've used SQR, a borrowed bagman, and some other designs but never
> really liked what was available. So I decided to come up with my own
> home brew design. The prototype has been used for two years with no
> problems. I am still working with a patent attorney on the design, but
> for now I make two or three when requested.
>

Does your patent attorney know you are selling these without a
patent ? From what little I know about patents, selling your product,
your idea, to the public before the patent is filed implies that your
are not interested in protecting the design and therefore your patent
isn't protected. I could be wrong, but I looked into patents a little
and got the impression that releasing any information that is not
protected by a non disclosure agreement puts you on shaky ground. Good
luck in any case

Kenny