Street number names in NYC
Garrett Wollman
In article <31FFA4...@fsg.com>, Steve Hudson <ste...@fsg.com> wrote:
>Americas. This happened sometime in the 1940's but people still call
>it 6 Ave. Signs put up in the last 10 years say 6 Ave.
This is something that's always confused my about New York street
labeling. Do people in NYC really call it ``six avenue'', or do they
call it ``sixth avenue''? One would think the latter, which makes me
want to know what it is that the various government agencies have
against writing standard ordinal numbers like the rest of the
country....
The only other place I know of where this is done is in the
introduction to ``Wall Street Week with Louis Rukeyser'', where the
program is always introduced as being ``produced Friday, August two'',
rather than ``...August second'' as everyone I know would say it.
(Of course, the Boston Globe also uses slightly odd ordinals,
preferring to wrote ``2d'' rather than ``2nd'', but at least it is
still recognizable for what it is.)
-GAWollman
--
Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same
wol...@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom
Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame
MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick
Truly Donovan
Garrett Wollman wrote:
>
> In article <31FFA4...@fsg.com>, Steve Hudson <ste...@fsg.com> wrote:
> >Americas. This happened sometime in the 1940's but people still call
> >it 6 Ave. Signs put up in the last 10 years say 6 Ave.
>
> This is something that's always confused my about New York street
> labeling. Do people in NYC really call it ``six avenue'', or do they
> call it ``sixth avenue''?
Sixth Avenue.
Truly Donovan, who worked on Sixth Avenue for 11 years.
Eric Newman
wol...@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) wrote:
>In article <31FFA4...@fsg.com>, Steve Hudson <ste...@fsg.com> wrote:
>>Americas. This happened sometime in the 1940's but people still call
>>it 6 Ave. Signs put up in the last 10 years say 6 Ave.
>This is something that's always confused my about New York street
>labeling. Do people in NYC really call it ``six avenue'', or do they
>call it ``sixth avenue''? One would think the latter, which makes me
>want to know what it is that the various government agencies have
>against writing standard ordinal numbers like the rest of the
>country....
It's "Sixth Avenue." Saying "Avenue of the Americas" is a sure way to
identify yourself as a rube.
Aaron J. Dinkin
In article <4toeb1$4...@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu>,
wol...@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) wrote:
<snip>
> The only other place I know of where this is done is in the
> introduction to ``Wall Street Week with Louis Rukeyser'', where the
> program is always introduced as being ``produced Friday, August two'',
> rather than ``...August second'' as everyone I know would say it.
> (Of course, the Boston Globe also uses slightly odd ordinals,
> preferring to wrote ``2d'' rather than ``2nd'', but at least it is
> still recognizable for what it is.)
What's so odd about that? I use <2d> and <3d> for "second" and "third"
myself. But then, I may have picked that up from reading the Boston Globe.
-Aaron J. Dinkin
Dr. Whom
Robert Lipton
Garrett Wollman (wol...@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu) wrote:
: This is something that's always confused my about New York street
: labeling. Do people in NYC really call it ``six avenue'', or do they
: call it ``sixth avenue''? One would think the latter, which makes me
: want to know what it is that the various government agencies have
: against writing standard ordinal numbers like the rest of the
: country....
The name is "Sixth Avenue" and well we know it: First Avenue,Second
Avenue, Third Avenue, Fifth Avenue (Fourth Avenue ends at 14th Street
and, in Midtown, is referred to as Madison Avenue) and so on through
Twelve Avenue.
However, because of the difficulty of correctly pronouncing the "xth"
trigraph, it is cut down to "Six Avenue" or "Sixt Avenue."
Bob
John Taber
On 1 Aug 1996, Robert Lipton wrote:
> Garrett Wollman (wol...@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu) wrote:
> : This is something that's always confused my about New York street
> : labeling. Do people in NYC really call it ``six avenue'', or do they
> : call it ``sixth avenue''? One would think the latter, which makes me
> : want to know what it is that the various government agencies have
> : against writing standard ordinal numbers like the rest of the
> : country....
I've seen street signs in other cities (such as Seattle) do the same
thing as New York. Nashville spells out ordinals through "tenth"; that's
how I learned how they're spelled. Salt Lake City adds two zeroes.
> The name is "Sixth Avenue" and well we know it: First Avenue,Second
> Avenue, Third Avenue, Fifth Avenue (Fourth Avenue ends at 14th Street
> and, in Midtown, is referred to as Madison Avenue) and so on through
> Twelve Avenue.
No, that's PARK Avenue that Fourth becomes. Madison is between Fifth and
Park, I believe. There is a distinction between a name change and an
additional name. Fourth to Park, Sixth to Lenox, Eighth to Central Park
West and back to Eighth, Ninth to Columbus, Tenth to Amsterdam, and
Eleventh to West End are all genuine changes. However, many avenues, for
some or all length, have an additional name, that receives a second
street sign. Fifth gets "Museum Mile", Sixth gets "Avenue of the
Americas", Lenox gets "Malcolm X Blvd", Seventh gets "Fashion Avenue" in
the fashion district, and "Adam Clayton Powell Blvd" in Harlem, and
Eighth gets "Frederick Douglass Blvd" in Harlem.
The other difference with additional names is that for those that aren't
over the entire length, the house numbers don't start over at zero when
they kick in, like they do for Columbus, Amsterdam, and West End.
Nonetheless, the U.S. Postal Service, in their infinite wisdom, has
declared that the additional names are the preferred names for addressing
mail. Go fig - although it does make sense in Harlem.
Eric Scouten
In article <4toeb1$4...@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu>,
wol...@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) wrote:
> In article <31FFA4...@fsg.com>, Steve Hudson <ste...@fsg.com> wrote:
> >Americas. This happened sometime in the 1940's but people still call
> >it 6 Ave. Signs put up in the last 10 years say 6 Ave.
>
> This is something that's always confused my about New York street
> labeling. Do people in NYC really call it ``six avenue'', or do they
> call it ``sixth avenue''? One would think the latter, which makes me
> want to know what it is that the various government agencies have
> against writing standard ordinal numbers like the rest of the
> country....
FWIW, the city of Rochester MN has something against ordinal numbers as
well. You can tell whether the state or the city has posted a particular
street sign in that city by the presence or absence of the ordinal.
(Street markers on the overhead signal lights are often posted by the
state along the state-owned route US 63, which runs through downtown
Rochester.)
-es
__________________________________________________________________________
Eric Scouten Constructor Constructor Metrowerks Corp.
MW: mailto:sco...@metrowerks.com http://www.metrowerks.com
Me: mailto:sco...@gofast.net http://www.delivery.com/~scouten/
** PHOTO GALLERY: new pictures added 7/21/96 **
** see http://www.delivery.com/~scouten/gallery.html **
Our lawyers are happy.
-Last paragraph of Aladdin Systems license agreement
Benjamin D Lukoff
John Taber <tab...@cougarnet.byu.edu> writes:
>On 1 Aug 1996, Robert Lipton wrote:
>> Garrett Wollman (wol...@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu) wrote:
>> : This is something that's always confused my about New York street
>> : labeling. Do people in NYC really call it ``six avenue'', or do they
>> : call it ``sixth avenue''? One would think the latter, which makes me
>> : want to know what it is that the various government agencies have
>> : against writing standard ordinal numbers like the rest of the
>> : country....
>I've seen street signs in other cities (such as Seattle) do the same
>thing as New York. Nashville spells out ordinals through "tenth"; that's
>how I learned how they're spelled. Salt Lake City adds two zeroes.
In Seattle, most of the numbered streets/avenues are indeed signed "12
AVE" or "NE 55 ST". However, from First to Ninth Avenues the signs do
read "1st AVE", "6th AVE", etc. I believe "9th AVE" is the last one to do
this, and then 10th Avenue is signed "10 AVE".
However, the official names of the numbered streets/avenues, at least as
far as the USPS is concerned, are ordinals: NE 55th St., 5th Ave. N., etc.
BDL
Nathan Mitchum
wol...@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) wrote:
------------
> The only other place I know of where this is done is in the
> introduction to ``Wall Street Week with Louis Rukeyser'', where the
> program is always introduced as being ``produced Friday, August two'',
> rather than ``...August second'' as everyone I know would say it.
Then probably Rukeyser is just echoing the speech habits of people
who deal constantly in numbers and must make themselves clearly
understood over the phone and in meetings. My wife is one such,
and when she speaks in her official voice she is apt to say
something like, "We need to firm up that thirteen point four
million before the August fifteen deadline." (Often as not,
she'll even turn the date into "eight fifteen.")
--Nathan Mitchum [Post&Email]
Exile on Market Street
wol...@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) wrote:
>This is something that's always confused my about New York street
>labeling. Do people in NYC really call it ``six avenue'', or do they
>call it ``sixth avenue''? One would think the latter, which makes me
>want to know what it is that the various government agencies have
>against writing standard ordinal numbers like the rest of the
>country....
My guess is that omitting the ordinal suffix on the signs saves on
materials. I've only been in two cities, though, that omit the
ordinals on numbered street/avenue signs: New York and Washington,
DC.
____________________________________________________________________________
Sandy Smith, Exile on Market Street, Philadelphia smi...@pobox.upenn.edu
Univ of Pennsylvania, News and Public Affairs 215.898.1423/fax 215.898.1203
I speak for myself here, not Penn http://pobox.upenn.edu/~smiths/
"When your name is on the store, then you can say no to a customer."
--Stockton Strawbridge, whose family name will remain on the store even
---though the family will no longer own it, to a sales clerk in the 1950's--
ds...@cameonet.cameo.com.tw
Garrett Wollman (wol...@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu) wrote --
> This is something that's always confused my about New York street
> labeling. Do people in NYC really call it ``six avenue'', or do they
> call it ``sixth avenue''? One would think the latter, which makes me
> want to know what it is that the various government agencies have
> against writing standard ordinal numbers like the rest of the
> country....
As others have pointed out, New Yorkers say "Sixth Avenue" (dough us
REAL Noo Yawkuhs say "Sixt Avnyuh").
Note that most editors will accept "August 3, 1996" but not "August 3rd,
1996" in running text, although most people will read it "August third,
nineteen ninety-six."
Dan Strychalski ds...@cameonet.cameo.com.tw
Disclaimer beats datclaimer any day.
Exile on Market Street
John Taber <tab...@cougarnet.byu.edu> wrote:
>No, that's PARK Avenue that Fourth becomes. Madison is between Fifth and
>Park, I believe. There is a distinction between a name change and an
>additional name. Fourth to Park, Sixth to Lenox, Eighth to Central Park
>West and back to Eighth, Ninth to Columbus, Tenth to Amsterdam, and
>Eleventh to West End are all genuine changes. However, many avenues, for
>some or all length, have an additional name, that receives a second
>street sign. Fifth gets "Museum Mile", Sixth gets "Avenue of the
>Americas", Lenox gets "Malcolm X Blvd", Seventh gets "Fashion Avenue" in
>the fashion district, and "Adam Clayton Powell Blvd" in Harlem, and
>Eighth gets "Frederick Douglass Blvd" in Harlem.
Just a minor note: "Avenue of the Americas" is the official name for
6th Avenue, not a secondary name as the others above -- it was
officially renamed to honor the creation of the Organization of
American States (sort of a mini-UN for the hemisphere) ~1946. From
then until ~1985, street signs along the street read *only* "Ave of
the Americas".
But, as we all know, New Yorkers never quit calling the street "Sixth
(or Sixt') Avenue", and in the mid-1980's, by way of acknowledging
this (and helping confused tourists who were told by the natives that
some destination was on 6th Ave), the city re-erected street signs
*beneath* those reading "Ave of the Americas" that read "6 Ave".
BTW, that's how you can tell whether a street name in NYC is official
or "secondary"/"honorary": The official name for the street is always
on the top sign. (Along 5th Ave, "Museum Mile" appears as a sublegend
on the main sign.)
Lenox, FWIW, would continue 6th Ave above Central Park. I thought
that 7th above the park had been *officially* renamed Adam Clayton
Powell Blvd -- but I wasn't paying attention to the street signs when
last I was up there, so I can't say this for sure.