cannibalism vs anthropophagy
Sara Moffat Lorimer
same thing. But what are their connotations? Is "cannibalism" the
everyday (um, in certain circles) term, and "anthropohagy" more academic
or clinical?
--
SML
Queens, New York
Evan Kirshenbaum
> As far as my dictionary goes, "cannibalism" and "anthropophagy" mean
> the same thing.
You may want to check a slightly better dictionary. When a shark eats
its own young, it is engaging in cannibalism, not anthropophagy.
> But what are their connotations? Is "cannibalism" the everyday (um,
> in certain circles) term, and "anthropohagy" more academic or
> clinical?
Pretty much. I don't think most people would understand
"anthropohagy" without seeing it written down and working it out
piecemeal, but "cannibalism" is well-understood.
It hadn't dawned on me before I looked it up that "cannibal" is one of
those terms (like "vandal") that comes from the name for an
identifiable group of people (the Carib, as pronounced by the Taino
and heard by the Spanish).
--
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
HP Laboratories |Never attempt to teach a pig to
1501 Page Mill Road, Building 1U |sing; it wastes your time and
Palo Alto, CA 94304 |annoys the pig.
| Robert Heinlein
kirsh...@hpl.hp.com
(650)857-7572
Sara Moffat Lorimer
> sl...@columbia.edu (Sara Moffat Lorimer) writes:
>
> > As far as my dictionary goes, "cannibalism" and "anthropophagy" mean
> > the same thing.
>
> You may want to check a slightly better dictionary. When a shark eats
> its own young, it is engaging in cannibalism, not anthropophagy.
The fault was with the reader, not the dictionary. Thanks.
Fabian
"Sara Moffat Lorimer" <sl...@columbia.edu> wrote in message
news:1ersy91.orvzmb1bhuydyN%sl...@columbia.edu...
That's about my analysis.
btw, what is teh origin of your middle name? Moffat isn't exactly common you
know.
--
--
Fabian
Hush now, he has something special to say
Can you put your hands together this way?
Sara Moffat Lorimer
> btw, what is teh origin of your middle name? Moffat isn't exactly common you
> know.
>
I picked it up when I got married -- it's my husband's last name. His
family's English on that side, but I've been told it's a Scottish name
(and usually spelled with another "t").
Neville X. Elliven
>Moffat isn't exactly common you know.
Look up "NASA Ames Space Center".
Alec "Skitt" P.
"Neville X. Elliven" <Li0N...@NoSpam.Com> wrote in message
news:9bdp10$8p84e$2...@ID-40161.news.dfncis.de...
> "Fabian" <not...@orthere.not> wrote:
>
> >Moffat isn't exactly common you know.
>
> Look up "NASA Ames Space Center".
I guess, you didn't. That's "Moffet", although there are many who don't
know that.
--
Skitt (in SF Bay Area) http://i.am/skitt/
I speak English well -- I learn it from a book!
-- Manuel of "Fawlty Towers" (he's from Barcelona).
Rowan Dingle
[...]
>It hadn't dawned on me before I looked it up that "cannibal" is one of
>those terms (like "vandal") that comes from the name for an
>identifiable group of people (the Carib, as pronounced by the Taino
>and heard by the Spanish).
Also 'slave' and 'bugger'.
--
Rowan Dingle
Donna Richoux
I remember a discussion here showing that "slave" could have come from
Slavic (or the other way around), but I don't remember any discussion of
"bugger" tying it to an ethnic group. Can you provide a summary? I
remember all those "bug" and "bogey" words were tied together. The AUE
FAQ has under "bug=defect", after a discussion of Grace Hopper (1) and
Thomas Edison:
It may come from "bug" in the obsolete sense "frightful object",
whose use in Coverdale's 1535 translation of the Bible led to its
being nicknamed "the Bug Bible". (Coverdale rendered Psalm 91:5 as
"Thou shalt not nede to be afrayed for eny bugges by night"; the
King James Version reads "terror".) This word, which was the
source of the current word "bugbear" and may be related to "bogey",
comes from Middle English "bugge", which was used in the senses
"scarecrow" and "demon". Possible etyma are Welsh _bwg_="ghost" and
proto-Germanic *_bugja_= "swollen up, thick". The latter is also
posited as the etymon of the Norwegian dialect _bugge_="important
man" and English "big", from the proto-Indo-European *_beu-_="to
blow up, swell", whence the English words "poach"="cook", "pocket",
"poke"="bag", "pout", "Puck"="sprite", and "pucker".
"Bug"="insect" (which gave rise to the senses "germ", "annoy",
"enthusiast", and "listening device") is attested from 1622. It
may come from Anglo-Saxon _budda_="beetle", influenced by "bug"=
"frightful object".
Does your info connect to any of this?
(1) No, she and her coworkers did not invent the word. She told a story
many times that illustrated their use of it.
--
Best --- Donna Richoux
Joe Fineman
some heretics who came from Bulgaria, then to heretics generally & to
Albigensians in particular. Heretics were routinely accused of
sodomy, so "bugger" came to mean sodomite. With that meaning it
entered the English common law, so in Britain it has the distinction
of being at once a vulgarism and a legalism.
--- Joe Fineman j...@world.std.com
||: Wanting to meet the author because you liked the book is :||
||: like wanting to meet the goose because you liked the pate. :||
Rowan Dingle
>Rowan Dingle <din...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> In alt.usage.english Evan Kirshenbaum <kirsh...@hpl.hp.com> wrote:
>> >It hadn't dawned on me before I looked it up that "cannibal" is one of
>> >those terms (like "vandal") that comes from the name for an
>> >identifiable group of people (the Carib, as pronounced by the Taino
>> >and heard by the Spanish).
>>
>> Also 'slave' and 'bugger'.
>
>I remember a discussion here showing that "slave" could have come from
>Slavic (or the other way around), but I don't remember any discussion of
>"bugger" tying it to an ethnic group. Can you provide a summary?
See Joe Fineman's post.
> I
>remember all those "bug" and "bogey" words were tied together. The AUE
>FAQ has under "bug=defect", after a discussion of Grace Hopper (1) and
>Thomas Edison:
[snip bug info]
I do believe you're ferreting at the wrong hole there, Donna.
--
Rowan Dingle
Rowan Dingle
>See the OED. "Bugger" is cognate with "Bulgarian". It was applied to
>some heretics who came from Bulgaria, then to heretics generally & to
>Albigensians in particular. Heretics were routinely accused of
>sodomy, so "bugger" came to mean sodomite. With that meaning it
>entered the English common law, so in Britain it has the distinction
>of being at once a vulgarism and a legalism.
It wasn't just that the Cathars (Albigensians) were heretics, it was
apparently that their leaders, the *Perfecti*, 'practised severe sexual
celibacy, [and thus] were widely accused of sodomy. Hence the evolution
in the meaning of the word "buggery".' (From _Europe_ by Norman Davies.)
The NSOED, however, explains this evolution by saying that 'the
Bulgarians [were] regarded as belonging to the Greek Church'. Is this a
sly joke about 'Greek practices'? It's certainly misleading. Bogumilism
- the original, Bulgarian Catharism - was very far from Orthodox, Greek
or otherwise. Indeed, it owed much of its popularity to its *not* being
the Greek Church. For example:
===
But its greatest success was to occur in the principalities of Bosnia
and Hum (Hercegovina), whose rulers chose to propagate the Bogumil faith
as an antidote to the pretensions of their Hungarian Catholic and
Serbian Orthodox neighbours. [...] Bosnia remained predominantly
[Bogumil] until the Ottoman conquest of 1443. At this point the Bosnian
nobility promptly converted to Islam, thereby avoiding the Catholic and
Orthodox trap once again.
===from _Europe_===
Buggers or not, the Bogumils were rather queer. They were essentially
Manicheans, believing that the world had been 'created by Satan, God's
elder son. They also rejected Christ's miracles, except as allegorical
stories, the Sacraments, icons, feast days, and the entire liturgy and
ritual of Orthodoxy. They specially detested the Cross since it was the
instrument of Christ's murder. [...] Bogumil practices appeared very
strange to contemporaries. [...] Their only prayer was 'Our Father',
which they recited 120 times a day. They practised fasting, discouraged
marriage, and trained an elite caste of 'the Elect'. One branch, the
followers of Cyril the Barefoot, practised nudism in an attempt to
regain the Garden of Eden. Another, following the preacher Theodosius,
indulged in orgies, deliberately experiencing sin in order to qualify
for repentance. In political matters, all Bogumils presented a front of
passive but obdurate nonconformity.' (Ibid.)
Davies writes of the Cathars of Languedoc, 'They were vegetarian,
ascetic, puritanical'. Elsewhere, however, he writes that 'They saw no
sin in sexual liaisons that were mutually pleasurable'. This apparent
contradiction can perhaps be explained by their having 'a two-tier
system of morality--extremely severe for the Perfecti and extremely lax
for the laity'. (All ibid.)
Local names for, or equivalents of, Bogumils:
Dragovitsans and Kudugers (Macedonia)
Patarenes (Bosnia and Hercegovina)
Phundaites and Babuni (Serbia)
Runcarii or Runkeler (Germany)
Poplicani (northern France)
Bougres, Textores or Tisserands, Albigensians and Cathars (Languedoc)
Davies, a Welsh Lancastrian, seems to be rather fond of the
nonconformist Bogumils. He ends the relevant section with: 'Bogumilism
has been called "a hopeless faith". If so, its adherents showed
exceptional perseverance in place of hope.'
That's all, folks.
Except that I once read (leaflet, mid '80s) that five is the male age of
consent in Bulgaria.
--
Rowan Dingle
Robert M. Lewis
[deleted section]
>Davies writes of the Cathars of Languedoc, 'They were vegetarian,
>ascetic, puritanical'. Elsewhere, however, he writes that 'They saw no
>sin in sexual liaisons that were mutually pleasurable'. This apparent
>contradiction can perhaps be explained by their having 'a two-tier
>system of morality--extremely severe for the Perfecti and extremely lax
>for the laity'. (All ibid.)
Well that is perverse, with ideas like that (i.e., the two-tiered moral
system which reverses the natural order) it is no surprise that they had
to be eliminated.
Robert M. Lewis
Curiouser and curiouser!
Padraig Breathnach
>I do believe you're ferreting at the wrong hole there, Donna.
Get thee behind me, Satan. No, on second thoughts ....
PB
Rowan Dingle
>Rowan Dingle <din...@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>Davies writes of the Cathars of Languedoc, 'They were vegetarian,
>>ascetic, puritanical'. Elsewhere, however, he writes that 'They saw no
>>sin in sexual liaisons that were mutually pleasurable'. This apparent
>>contradiction can perhaps be explained by their having 'a two-tier
>>system of morality--extremely severe for the Perfecti and extremely lax
>>for the laity'. (All ibid.)
>
>Well that is perverse, with ideas like that (i.e., the two-tiered moral
>system which reverses the natural order) it is no surprise that they had
>to be eliminated.
Cynic!
Don't tell me - you've a teetotalitarian priest who's a secret sherry
drinker?
--
Rowan Dingle
Robert M. Lewis
>Cynic!
No, I'm a neo-Calvinist agnostic, we believe that the elect (who we are)
are those chosen by a highly questionable deity not to suffer eternal
life (it being clear to us that being or doing anything for eternity
would be hell). I will confess to being a justified sinner when it comes
to drink, I will drink anything that I can get my hands on that doesn't
glow in the dark.
Robert M. Lewis
Curious traditionary facts for sale.
Rowan Dingle
That rules out Pernod, then.
--
Rowan Dingle
Skitt
"Rowan Dingle" <din...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:zs0CkABw...@wickenden.demon.co.uk...
Or any drink with tonic in it, right? I know that my gin and tonics glowed
under black light, popular in a certain era.
Neville X. Elliven
>> >Moffat isn't exactly common you know.
>>
>> Look up "NASA Ames Space Center".
>
>I guess, you didn't. That's "Moffet", although there are
>many who don't know that.
Your guess is correct. Upon looking it up, I found three
variations [see examples below], of which the third seems
to be the most numerous:
Moffat, http://www.sam.usace.army.mil/pa/jan2000/2001sho.htm
Moffett, http://ccf.arc.nasa.gov/jf/mfa/
Rowan Dingle
>"Rowan Dingle" <din...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
[...]
>> >I will confess to being a justified sinner when it comes
>> >to drink, I will drink anything that I can get my hands on that doesn't
>> >glow in the dark.
>>
>> That rules out Pernod, then.
>
>Or any drink with tonic in it, right?
Right. Very strange that. Pernod just looks a bit odd, with or without
water...
> I know that my gin and tonics glowed
>under black light, popular in a certain era.
...But Tonic Water REALLY DOES GLOW. Especially under a bug-killer.
--
Rowan Dingle
Skitt
"Neville X. Elliven" <Li0N...@NoSpam.Com> wrote in message
Upon further research, I seem to have been wrong also. I hate it when that
happens and nobody corrects me! How am I to learn?
Anyway, I am now quite convinced that the Field was named for Rear Admiral
William Moffett, and thus it is officially Moffett Field. I have driven by
the place countless times, but not lately. For the life of me, I can't
understand why I wrote "Moffet" as the correct spelling -- must be that old
age is creeping up on me and affecting my faculties. Horrors!
Brian J Goggin
<din...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>...But Tonic Water REALLY DOES GLOW. Especially under a bug-killer.
You want to eschew that stuff, guv. Bad for you, it is. Stick to the
gin.
bjg
alejandr...@gmail.com
Phagy = need to eat.
1972 Uruguayan National Rugby team plane crashes on the Andes mountains. Survivors remaining alive 72 days eating human flesh. In that case was anthropophagy and not cannibalism because they feed from the deaths and didn't kill a single one. The book also 2 movies "Viven"(alive) but the version with Ethan Hawke isn't the best. True story. Too long to tell here.