open a fraction/crack

[Yurui Liu]

Hi,

Is the following sentence correct with "a fraction" or "a crack"?

The door is open a fraction/a crack.

I'd appreciate your help.

[David Kleinecke]

The door is ajar?

[Tony Cooper]

Of the two choices, I would expect "crack".

--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

[Mark Brader]

Yurui Liu asks about:

>> he door is open a fraction/a crack.

I say correct either way.

Tony Cooper:

> Of the two choices, I would expect "crack".

Or "a bit" or "a little" or it's "slightly open". Lots of choices.
--
Mark Brader | "Warning! Drinking beer, wine or spirits during
Toronto | pregnancy can harm your baby." (City of Toronto
m...@vex.net | notice in restaurant washrooms--men's and women's)

[bil...@shaw.ca]

On Tuesday, February 25, 2020 at 7:54:00 PM UTC-8, Mark Brader wrote:
> Yurui Liu asks about:
> >> he door is open a fraction/a crack.
>
> I say correct either way.
>

Grammatically fine either way. But a crack gives you a very good
visual idea of how far open the door is. A fraction could mean one
per cent open or 50 per cent open. A crack is therefore a more
helpful expression.

> Tony Cooper:
> > Of the two choices, I would expect "crack".
>
> Or "a bit" or "a little" or it's "slightly open". Lots of choices.

Of all of those, "a fraction" is the least helpful, unless you make
it "a small fraction".

bill

[Quinn C]

* bil...@shaw.ca:

> On Tuesday, February 25, 2020 at 7:54:00 PM UTC-8, Mark Brader wrote:
>> Yurui Liu asks about:
>>>> he door is open a fraction/a crack.
>>

>> Or "a bit" or "a little" or it's "slightly open". Lots of choices.
>
> Of all of those, "a fraction" is the least helpful, unless you make
> it "a small fraction".

Sounds like a lost cause. In practice, "a fraction" often means "a small
fraction".

<https://www.churchmilitant.com/news/article/only-a-fraction-of-peters-pence-funds-go-to-the-poor>

--
I don't see people ... as having a right to be idiots. It's
just impractical to try to stop them, unless they're hurting
somebody. -- Vicereine Cordelia
in L. McMaster Bujold, Gentleman Jole and the Red Queen

[Eric Walker]

"Ajar" means partially open. The original--a "crack" or "fraction"--
suggests only a slight opening, whereas a door that is ajar might be
almost fully open. "Slightly ajar" would probably answer.


--
Cordially,
Eric Walker

[Mark Brader]

Yurui Liu asked about:

>>> The door is open a fraction/a crack.

David Kleinecke:
>> The door is ajar?

Eric Walker:

> "Ajar" means partially open. The original--a "crack" or "fraction"--
> suggests only a slight opening, whereas a door that is ajar might be
> almost fully open. "Slightly ajar" would probably answer.

No, "ajar" means slightly open. And I just checked about 6 dictionaries
under onelook.com and all but one of them say so.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto "Asps. Very dangerous. You go first."
m...@vex.net -- Raiders of the Lost Ark

[Yurui Liu]

Tony Cooper於 2020年2月26日星期三 UTC+8上午11時42分58秒寫道：

> On Tue, 25 Feb 2020 18:36:00 -0800 (PST), Yurui Liu
> <liuyur...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Hi,
> >
> >Is the following sentence correct with "a fraction" or "a crack"?
> >
> >The door is open a fraction/a crack.
> >
> >I'd appreciate your help.
>
> Of the two choices, I would expect "crack".

Is it more common to use "a crack" with "by" as in "The door is open
by a crack"?

[Spains Harden]

Neither is common so neither can be "more common".

The door is open a fraction.
The door is open by a fraction.
The door is open a crack.
The door is open by a crack.
The door is ajar.

… are all good English and all mean:

The door is very slightly open.

[RH Draney]

On 2/26/2020 4:15 AM, Spains Harden wrote:
>
> The door is open a fraction.
> The door is open by a fraction.
> The door is open a crack.
> The door is open by a crack.
> The door is ajar.
>
> … are all good English and all mean:
>
> The door is very slightly open.

And in the English of many of my relatives when I was growing up in the
'60s: "The door isn't to"....r

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Wednesday, February 26, 2020 at 12:24:42 AM UTC-5, Eric Walker wrote:
> On Tue, 25 Feb 2020 19:37:33 -0800, David Kleinecke wrote:
> > On Tuesday, February 25, 2020 at 6:36:03 PM UTC-8, Yurui Liu wrote:

> >> Is the following sentence correct with "a fraction" or "a crack"?
> >> The door is open a fraction/a crack.
> >> I'd appreciate your help.
> > The door is ajar?
>
> "Ajar" means partially open. The original--a "crack" or "fraction"--
> suggests only a slight opening, whereas a door that is ajar might be
> almost fully open.

_What_ language does he claim to legislate on??

> "Slightly ajar" would probably answer.

That does not appear to be an orthodox use of "answer," and "slightly
ajar" is redundant.

[Spains Harden]

What? Have you never read A A Milne?

A Doctor came hurrying round, and he said:
"Tut-tut, I am sorry to find you in bed.
Just say 'Ninety-nine', while I look at your chest...
Don't you find that chrysanthemums answer the best?"

The Dormouse looked round at the view and replied
(When he'd said "Ninety-nine") that he'd tried and he'd tried,
And much the most answering things that he knew
Were geraniums (red) and delphiniums (blue).

<http://www.glirarium.org/bilch/literatur/doctor.html>

[Jerry Friedman]

Fine with either, though some people like me dislike the use of "a
fraction" (with no further information) to mean a small amount.

--
Jerry Friedman

[Ken Blake]

On 2/25/2020 9:26 PM, bil...@shaw.ca wrote:
> On Tuesday, February 25, 2020 at 7:54:00 PM UTC-8, Mark Brader wrote:
>> Yurui Liu asks about:
>> >> he door is open a fraction/a crack.
>>
>> I say correct either way.
>>
> Grammatically fine either way. But a crack gives you a very good
> visual idea of how far open the door is. A fraction could mean one
> per cent open or 50 per cent open.

Yes, but...

...as far as I'm concerned,in a sentence "like the door is open a
fraction," it's widely understood to mean a very small percentage.

> A crack is therefore a more
> helpful expression.

Either is OK for me.

--
Ken

[Peter T. Daniels]

Anything goes in nonsense verse.

[Sam Plusnet]

Yes. I was always puzzled by the request/instruction.

"Pull the door to."

It seemed to suggest (to me at least) closing the door until it was
almost, but not fully, closed. In practice it actually meant "Close the
door".

--
Sam Plusnet

[Peter T. Daniels]

We did this not all that long ago with "on the latch."

[Eric Walker]

On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 01:09:50 -0600, Mark Brader wrote:

> Yurui Liu asked about:
>>>> The door is open a fraction/a crack.
>
> David Kleinecke:
>>> The door is ajar?
>
> Eric Walker:
>> "Ajar" means partially open. The original--a "crack" or "fraction"--
>> suggests only a slight opening, whereas a door that is ajar might be
>> almost fully open. "Slightly ajar" would probably answer.
>
> No, "ajar" means slightly open. And I just checked about 6 dictionaries
> under onelook.com and all but one of them say so.

There are dictionaries and there are dictionaries.

The American Heritage Dictionary (5th Ed.) has:

a·jar (ə-jär)
adv. & adj.
Partially opened: left the door ajar.



--
Cordially,
Eric Walker

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Thursday, February 27, 2020 at 3:27:36 AM UTC-5, Eric Walker wrote:
> On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 01:09:50 -0600, Mark Brader wrote:

> > Eric Walker:
> >> David Kleinecke:
> >>> Yurui Liu asked about:

[Brader's screwing with the attributions repaired]

> >>>> The door is open a fraction/a crack.

> >>> The door is ajar?

> >> "Ajar" means partially open. The original--a "crack" or "fraction"--
> >> suggests only a slight opening, whereas a door that is ajar might be
> >> almost fully open. "Slightly ajar" would probably answer.
> > No, "ajar" means slightly open. And I just checked about 6 dictionaries
> > under onelook.com and all but one of them say so.
>
> There are dictionaries and there are dictionaries.
>
> The American Heritage Dictionary (5th Ed.) has:
>
> a·jar (ə-jär)
> adv. & adj.
> Partially opened: left the door ajar.
> --
> Cordially,
> Eric Walker

The more you cite that rag, the wronger it looks. It is valuable only
for its etymologies, which were overseen by the late Cal Watkins and
(more recently, for Semitic) by John Huehnergard.

[Spains Harden]

The way I see this (and please go to your nearest door and test it for
yourself), a "half-open" door is open. It isn't "wide-open" but it
is open.

A "partially opened" door is all but closed? All the dictionaries are
in agreement, and so are we?

[Peter T. Daniels]

A partially opened door might be 99% open. That is not what "ajar" means.

[Spains Harden]

A 99% open door is not open? I don't think you ever read anything
you reply to.

[Peter T. Daniels]

You are reinforcing the reputation you have with some of our more
curmudgeonly correspondents. "Ajar" means 'open a very small amount'.
"Partially open" is not constrained to 'a very small amount'. "Half-
open" is not "ajar." "Slightly ajar" is, as I said at the beginning
of this thread, redundant and otiose.

[Spains Harden]

"Slightly ajar" is good English. Other than that you are agreeing
with me.

[Peter T. Daniels]

Then you might work on clarity of communication, because it certainly
looked like you were endorsing the AHD's definition and EW's weird claim.

What does "slightly ajar" contrast with? What other kind of ajar is there?
(Don't say Mason jar.)

[Mark Brader]

Mark Brader:

> > No, "ajar" means slightly open. And I just checked about 6 dictionaries
> > under onelook.com and all but one of them say so.

Eric Walker:
> The American Heritage Dictionary (5th Ed.) has...

Yes, that's the one that gets it wrong.
--
Mark Brader | "... there is no such word as 'impossible' in
Toronto | my dictionary. In fact, everything between
m...@vex.net | 'herring' and 'marmalade' appears to be missing."
| -- Dirk Gently (Douglas Adams)

[Spains Harden]

Of course there is "slightly ajar" when it needs "pushing to".

[Peter T. Daniels]