Autoscan doesn't find digital broadcast channels
Ray K
cable as it enters the house. (Normally the input cable goes to a 2-way
splitter, with one output going into Comcast's set-top box, which feeds
the TV.) In activating the Auto Scan feature to select the available
channels, 73 analog channels were detected but none of the digital
channels were. Before starting the scan I selected Cable, not Antenna,
as the input.
Another HDTV, connected to the other output of the splitter, detected
the OTA digital HD channels. (Again, there is no Comcast box feeding the
second set.)
Sounds like I have a problem in the Vizio TV. Any other possibilities?
Thanks,
Ray
cjdayton...@cox.net
It could be that the Vizio has no qam tuner.
Which model do you have?
Chip
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Art
if the set pickus any digital stations. Possible, as mentioned, the set does
not have a quam tuner, thereby not capable of receiving the cable supplied
digital signals. Your operations manual will indicate the specifications of
the product and inform if indeed there is quam capabilities.
<cjdayton...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:20080101203916.661$t...@newsreader.com...
Ray K
It's the VX32L, sold in Walmart and Costco. According to this page,
http://www.vizio.com/media/products/pdfs/VX32_SpecSheet.pdf
it has a ATSC/QAM/NTSC tuner.
I could try the rabbit ear idea next time I'm at my girlfriend's house.
She's within 20 miles line-of-sight to the transmitters on the Empire
State Building. But remember that when I hook her upstairs LG HDTV to
the downstairs cable where the Vizio is connected, the LG detects and
displays the digital channels.
There's also some ringing around abrupt dark/light transitions (see my
post of 1/1/08, 10:27PM), so I'm sort of anxious to return the set.
Especially since last night Circuit City had an impressive Toshiba
32HL67 open box set for only $560.
Thanks, Art and Chip.
Ray
Wes Newell
> It's the VX32L, sold in Walmart and Costco. According to this page,
>
> http://www.vizio.com/media/products/pdfs/VX32_SpecSheet.pdf
>
> it has a ATSC/QAM/NTSC tuner.
The way it's listed on that (or clear QAM) suggest that something is
different. This from the manual also suggest it may not work.
The channel availability through cable
depends upon which channels your cable operator
supplies in Clear QAM; consult your cable
operator for more information.
With all these disclaimers, I don't like your chances of it working.
--
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Wes Newell
> It's the VX32L, sold in Walmart and Costco. According to this page,
>
> http://www.vizio.com/media/products/pdfs/VX32_SpecSheet.pdf
>
> it has a ATSC/QAM/NTSC tuner.
There's also a Tuner mode selection in the menu. The manual doesn't give
the options but it does show you can select more than 1 option. Give that
a try. It's default is antenna.
Del Mibbler
> For this test, a Vizio 32" set is directly connected to the Comcast
> cable as it enters the house. (Normally the input cable goes to a 2-way
> splitter, with one output going into Comcast's set-top box, which feeds
> the TV.) In activating the Auto Scan feature to select the available
> channels, 73 analog channels were detected but none of the digital
> channels were. Before starting the scan I selected Cable, not Antenna,
> as the input.
>
> Another HDTV, connected to the other output of the splitter, detected
> the OTA digital HD channels. (Again, there is no Comcast box feeding the
> second set.)
. . . . .
>It's the VX32L, sold in Walmart and Costco. According to this page,
>
>http://www.vizio.com/media/products/pdfs/VX32_SpecSheet.pdf
>
>it has a ATSC/QAM/NTSC tuner.
>
>I could try the rabbit ear idea next time I'm at my girlfriend's house.
>She's within 20 miles line-of-sight to the transmitters on the Empire
>State Building. But remember that when I hook her upstairs LG HDTV to
>the downstairs cable where the Vizio is connected, the LG detects and
>displays the digital channels.
Sounds like you did the right things to test this. You know that
clear QAM signals are available, and the Vizio isn't finding them even
with a direct connection to the cable, while another receiver does
even with a reduced signal. That leaves 3 possibilities:
1) The Vizio is extremely insensitive to QAM. If so, it's defective.
2) The QAM tuner is not working. Still defective.
3) The clear QAM stations are on RF cable channels the Vizio can't
tune. Neither the spec sheet nor the owner's manual says what cable
channels it supports. Some receivers can only go as high as 125,
others go to 135. Cable channels are actually defined up to 158, but
I've never heard of a cable company going above 135. I have heard of
them putting the local broadcast channels above 125. That complies
with the FCC requirement that these channels be unencrypted and
available to all subscribers while effectively preventing some
receivers from getting them. See if the LG receiver that gets them
will tell you what real channels (not virtual channels) they are on.
If you do decide to return the Vizio and get a different set, look for
one with two RF inputs, one for antenna and one for cable. It's a big
advantage when you have both available, as you apparently do. But
avoid any set that has one for analog and one for digital. That's
just stupid, but I've seen one like that. Wish I could remember the
brand so that I could warn people away.
Del Mibbler
Bill R
Just to add some more information to Del's informative post be sure to
look at the splitters or distribution amps that you have on your cable.
As Del pointed out, digital cable usually goes up to channel 135 and
quite often the old splitters or amps don't pass the higher frequencies.
I had to replace several of them when I got my first TV with a QAM tuner.
I just did a re-scan this morning and my cable company now has 50 clear
QAM channels. More than half of them are music channels including a few
Music Choice channels. I don't know why they are clear but sometimes
the cable company does not appear to know that some of their channels
are clear QAM. They ran two PPV channels in the clear for several months.
--
Bill R.
Remove nospam_ and x in e-mail address to reply by e-mail
Del Mibbler
for this model (AVS Forum | Display Devices | LCD Flat Panel Displays
| Official Vizio VX32L Thread) you'll find that others are having
similar issues with the QAM tuner, but it's by no means universal.
Del Mibbler
Del Mibbler
>In article <9nlnn3t5kikikv2lt...@4ax.com>,
> Del Mibbler <mibbler@large> wrote:
>
>> If you do decide to return the Vizio and get a different set, look for
>> one with two RF inputs, one for antenna and one for cable.
>
>um, that doesn't make sense. Cable IS rf.
Which is why you need an RF input for it. And a second one for
antenna if you have both available, so that you can connect both
without swapping cables or using a switch, and the TV can scan each
without losing the scan results for the other, and you can select any
available channel regardless of its source.
>
>What you mean is "one for analog and one for digital". I agree.
I don't mean that, for reasons I'll discuss in response to your next
post.
>
>To the original poster: in your TV setup, you may have to tell the TV
>to look for QAM. It may be looking for OTA. If you plug your cable in,
>it won't find anything.
The OP said he did select cable, but there are apparently two menu
screens where that can be selected. I'd expect them to have the same
effect, but who knows?
Del Mibbler
GeorgeB
wrote:
>Art wrote:
>> Possible, as mentioned, the set does
>> not have a quam tuner, thereby not capable of receiving the cable supplied
>> digital signals. Your operations manual will indicate the specifications of
>> the product and inform if indeed there is quam capabilities.
>>> Ray K <rayk...@optonline.net> wrote:
>>>> For this test, a Vizio 32" set is directly connected to the Comcast
>>>> cable as it enters the house. (Normally the input cable goes to a 2-way
>>>> splitter, with one output going into Comcast's set-top box, which feeds
>>>> the TV.) In activating the Auto Scan feature to select the available
>>>> channels, 73 analog channels were detected but none of the digital
>>>> channels were. Before starting the scan I selected Cable, not Antenna,
>>>> as the input.
>>>>
>>>> Another HDTV, connected to the other output of the splitter, detected
>>>> the OTA digital HD channels. (Again, there is no Comcast box feeding the
>>>> second set.)
>>>>
>>>> Sounds like I have a problem in the Vizio TV. Any other possibilities?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> Ray
>it has a ATSC/QAM/NTSC tuner.
>
>I could try the rabbit ear idea next time I'm at my girlfriend's house.
>She's within 20 miles line-of-sight to the transmitters on the Empire
>State Building. But remember that when I hook her upstairs LG HDTV to
>the downstairs cable where the Vizio is connected, the LG detects and
>displays the digital channels.
All I would add is to be SURE that you were in cable mode. The lowest
QAM I get in Greenville SC is 76.x.
You covered the very slight possibility that half of the splitter
could be bad.
Alan
>In article <9nlnn3t5kikikv2lt...@4ax.com>,
> Del Mibbler <mibbler@large> wrote:
>
>> one with two RF inputs, one for antenna and one for cable.
>
Indeed, that is why cable connects to one of the RF inputs.
>What you mean is "one for analog and one for digital". I agree.
No, he didn't. He was fairly clear about that.
Alan
Del Mibbler
>In article <9nlnn3t5kikikv2lt...@4ax.com>,
> Del Mibbler <mibbler@large> wrote:
>
>> But
>> avoid any set that has one for analog and one for digital. That's
>> just stupid, but I've seen one like that. Wish I could remember the
>> brand so that I could warn people away.
>
>And yet, you don't say why.
>
>And yet, I have such a set. Sanyo. I have my cable plugged into the
>analog port, and I enjoy 90 or so channels--using the TV to tune them.
>No cable boxes here, thank you very much.
>
>I also have my cable plugged into the digital port. I asked the TV to
>do a digital cable search, and it found the clear QAM channels that my
>system is sending out.
>
>So now I have the best of both worlds.
>
>Tell us again what your objection is to separate analog and digital
>inputs, and why that's "just stupid".
Ah, yes: Sanyo. Thanks for reminding me.
If you have two RF inputs, but one is only for analog and the other
only for digital, and if you have a source that has both on it, then
you need a splitter to drive both inputs. That works, you're doing
it, but it shouldn't be necessary and it cuts your signal level in
half.
Now suppose you have two RF sources: antenna and cable, or maybe two
antennas pointed different directions, and each has both analog and
digital on it. How do you connect them to your two inputs, short of
using a switch and rescanning whenever you flip it?
Now, if you use cable only for analog and antenna only for digital (or
vice versa) then it would be efficient. That was potentially the
situation where I saw this set, in Casa Grande, AZ last year. I found
their Cox cable had no digital on it at all, not even encrypted. I
determined that with a simple outside antenna they could get the
Phoenix digitals, and with a better one they might get Tucson as well.
They had a big HDTV and no HD to display on it, but they weren't
willing to put up an antenna.
I have four digital/analog receivers. The OnAir GT for my laptop has
only one RF input, a tradeoff I'll readily accept in return for its
small size and portability. The LG standalone DVR has two, dedicated
as one for antenna and one for cable. If both are used it tunes
analog from cable only and digital from both. It integrates the
results into its guide, so when I select a channel it may come from
analog cable, digital cable or digital OTA, depending on where I've
told it to get that channel. The two MyHD cards each have two
nondedicated inputs, so I can configure them as I want, including two
antennas without resorting to Join-tennas.
Del Mibbler
Steve Urbach
>
>>To the original poster: in your TV setup, you may have to tell the TV
>>to look for QAM. It may be looking for OTA. If you plug your cable in,
>>it won't find anything.
>
>The OP said he did select cable, but there are apparently two menu
>screens where that can be selected. I'd expect them to have the same
>effect, but who knows?
>
>Del Mibbler
Hey that sounds like the Scepter Komodo 37" (with 2 RF inputs, Analog and
Digital)
There is a DTV section and a ? (Analog) section on the menu.
They are *not* the same..
Bill's News
"Ray K" <rayk...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:477aeabb$0$13815$607e...@cv.net...
I don't have a Vizio, but my tuner's scanner has separate
options for scanning cable analog and cable digital; likewise
for OTA. These are checkboxes, so it will scan both, digital
first, when both are checked. Is there any such option in this
TV?
Ray K
Sorry for the delay in posting my latest results.
To recap the situation: The incoming cable from Comcast goes to a 3-way
splitter on the first floor.
Output 1 goes to a first floor TV.
Output 2 goes to a 2-way splitter on the second floor. One of its
outputs goes to a cable company box that feeds an analog TV, the other
goes directly to an LG 20SL7D HDTV (no cable box).
Output 3 goes nowhere. (Yes, I know I should terminate it in a 75-ohm load.)
The problem is that two of the three HDTVs I've connected to Output 1 on
the first floor don't detect the OTA digital channels (2.1, 4.1, 4.2,
etc.) during Auto Scan. (A Vizio VX32L or its replacement Toshiba 32HL67
doesn't; the LG 20LS7D does.)
Regarding tuner specs:
Vizio - On the carton, the tuner is described as "NTSC/CABLE/ATSC (HDTV
OFF-AIR/CLEAR QAM)." Channel coverage is not stated, even in the manual.
Toshiba - says this on the carton: "NTSC/ATSC (8VSB) DIGITAL CABLE
(64QAM, 256 QAM; in-the-clear, unencrypted)." In the Specifications
section of the manual, it details channel coverage:
VHF: 2-13
UHF: 14-69
Cable:
Midband (A8 throught A1; A through I)
Superband (J through W)
Hyper band (AA through ZZ, AAA, BBB)
Ultra band (65 through 94, 100 through 135)
Note that coverage does not extend to channel 158. Del on 1/2/08 raised
this as a possible source of my problem.
LG - Its tuner is described as NTSC-M, ATSC, 64 & 256 QAM. Program
coverage is given as VHF 2-13, UHF 14-69, CATV 1-135, DTV 2-69, CADTV 1-135.
The LG also doesn't cover above 135, so that doesn't explain the
problem. But it may be the only TV of the three that covers DTV 2-69.
For what it's worth, here in central NJ, about 20 miles from NYC, the
16+ OTA digital channels fall within the 8-61 range. And Comcast states
that HDTV broadcast feeds are include even in the Limited Basic Service
package, which is what the LG detects.
I am careful to specify Cable as the input during Auto Scan. None of the
setup menus distinguish between analog and digital cable as the input
source; the choices are simply antenna or cable. I may be mistaken, but
somewhere along the line I think I bypassed the first floor splitter and
connected the incoming cable directly to the TVs without solving the
problem, eliminating it as the problem. I have not tried hooking rabbit
ears to the TVs because I don't have one; maybe I'll try a three foot
length of wire or a folded FM dipole (horrors).
Ray
Wes Newell
> To recap the situation: The incoming cable from Comcast goes to a 3-way
> splitter on the first floor.
>
> Output 1 goes to a first floor TV.
> Output 2 goes to a 2-way splitter on the second floor. One of its
> outputs goes to a cable company box that feeds an analog TV, the other
> goes directly to an LG 20SL7D HDTV (no cable box). Output 3 goes
> nowhere. (Yes, I know I should terminate it in a 75-ohm load.)
>
> The problem is that two of the three HDTVs I've connected to Output 1 on
> the first floor don't detect the OTA digital channels (2.1, 4.1, 4.2,
> etc.) during Auto Scan. (A Vizio VX32L or its replacement Toshiba 32HL67
> doesn't; the LG 20LS7D does.)
>
How do you expect TV's hooked up to Comcast cable to detect OTA signals is
my question. If you have one TV detecting the digital channels, it's more
than likely (and almost has to be) detecting them via the comcast content
fed via QAM. IOW's, one of the TV's has a QAM tuner capable of picking
them up on the channels Comcast feeds them and the other 2 don't.
Reading farther, I see you aren't really talking about OTA reception, but
cable reception of local stations. This may confuse a lot of people trying
to help til they read farther. What I said above is probably still the
answer, but you need to contact Comcast and find out what frequencies they
are using for the locals. If it turns out they are using some high
frequencies not normally supported by the TV's it probably on purpose so
you can't get the channels without subscribing to their HD package and
using their HD cable box.:-)
> Regarding tuner specs:
>
> Vizio - On the carton, the tuner is described as "NTSC/CABLE/ATSC (HDTV
> OFF-AIR/CLEAR QAM)." Channel coverage is not stated, even in the manual.
>
> Toshiba - says this on the carton: "NTSC/ATSC (8VSB) DIGITAL CABLE
> (64QAM, 256 QAM; in-the-clear, unencrypted)." In the Specifications
> section of the manual, it details channel coverage: VHF: 2-13
> UHF: 14-69
> Cable:
> Midband (A8 throught A1; A through I) Superband (J through W)
> Hyper band (AA through ZZ, AAA, BBB)
> Ultra band (65 through 94, 100 through 135)
>
> Note that coverage does not extend to channel 158. Del on 1/2/08 raised
> this as a possible source of my problem.
>
> LG - Its tuner is described as NTSC-M, ATSC, 64 & 256 QAM. Program
> coverage is given as VHF 2-13, UHF 14-69, CATV 1-135, DTV 2-69, CADTV
> 1-135.
>
> The LG also doesn't cover above 135, so that doesn't explain the
> problem. But it may be the only TV of the three that covers DTV 2-69.
>
> For what it's worth, here in central NJ, about 20 miles from NYC, the
> 16+ OTA digital channels fall within the 8-61 range. And Comcast states
> that HDTV broadcast feeds are include even in the Limited Basic Service
> package, which is what the LG detects.
>
But they don't have to transmit them on the same frequencies, and you can
bet they don't. Got a TV that will pick them up, fine. Don't, tough.:-)
> I am careful to specify Cable as the input during Auto Scan. None of the
> setup menus distinguish between analog and digital cable as the input
> source; the choices are simply antenna or cable. I may be mistaken, but
> somewhere along the line I think I bypassed the first floor splitter and
> connected the incoming cable directly to the TVs without solving the
> problem, eliminating it as the problem. I have not tried hooking rabbit
> ears to the TVs because I don't have one; maybe I'll try a three foot
> length of wire or a folded FM dipole (horrors).
>
At only 20 miles from the transmitters one of those $2 uhf antennas from
Radio Shack would probably work.
Ray K
last post. I don't know if I can get the channel remapping info from
Comcast, but I'll try.
Ray
Del Mibbler
>I don't know if I can get the channel remapping info from
>Comcast, but I'll try.
Another possibility is that the LG TV that you said earlier gets the
cable channels might have some way to show the real channel numbers.
Looking at its online manual:
http://us.lge.com/download/product/file/1000002412/20LS7D_manual.pdf
the channel edit function appears to show only virtual numbers, but
the example shown is for analog (2-0, 6-0, etc.). Look at the CADTV
tab to see what it reports.
Another approach is Manual Scan. That calls for you to enter an RF
(real) channel number and it appears to show you the virtual channels
it finds there. Again, the only example shown is analog.
You might be able to force-tune to a real cable channel using the
remote's number pad and the TV may report at least the first virtual
channel it finds there. I can do that with my older LG DVR.
Finally, if you have or can borrow a computer-based tuner that does
clear QAM, there's a good chance that somewhere in its software it
will show you the real channel numbers. The AutumnWave OnAir GT works
well for that, and it easily locks onto cable channels my other
receivers sometimes have trouble with.
Del Mibbler
T Shadow
avsforum.com has threads by viewing area. Probably the best way to get local
info, IMHO.
Curious
Best Regards