Where can I buy an external digital tuner for my analog VCR?

[Al 2048]

Hello.

I live in a Chicago suburb. My cable company, Comcast, has migrated to
an all-digital signal. Before this migration, I had channels 2, 2.1
(CBS), 5, 5.1 (NBC), 7, 7.1 (ABC), etc. After the migration, the
analog channels (2, 5, 7) disappeared.

Why is this a problem? Well, my VCR is an analog VCR, and my VCR's
tuner can detect only the analog channels (2, 5, 7). The tuner can not
detect the digital channels (2.1, 5.1, 7.1).

If I use the Digital Transport Adapter (DTA) supplied by Comcast, then
I can still use the VCR to record. However, I can not record one
channel while watching a different channel.

So, I want to get rid of the DTA and to have a VCR that can record
digital channels. That means that I have to buy a VCR with a digital
tuner or an external digital tuner for my current analog VCR.

So, can someone please tell me where I can buy an external tuner? Are
external tuners even made anymore?

Thanks for any information.

Regards,

Alex K.

[Kimba W Lion]

Al 2048 <al2...@aol.com> wrote:

>So, can someone please tell me where I can buy an external tuner?

Walmart, Target, amazon.com...

On amazon, search for DTV converter box.

I don't know of any that will change channels at your VCR's command, so you'll
have to set it to the channel you want to record, manually.

[Bruce Esquibel]

In alt.tv.tech.hdtv Al 2048 <al2...@aol.com> wrote:

> If I use the Digital Transport Adapter (DTA) supplied by Comcast, then
> I can still use the VCR to record. However, I can not record one
> channel while watching a different channel.

> So, I want to get rid of the DTA and to have a VCR that can record
> digital channels. That means that I have to buy a VCR with a digital
> tuner or an external digital tuner for my current analog VCR.

I don't think anyone ever made a VCR with digital tuners, they were just
about dead and buried when OTA digital took over.

Although the digital adapters are still around, it's not really going to be
any different than what you have now with the DTA, at least what it sounds
like to me.

Have you considered moving into the 21st century and getting rid of the VCR?

I dunno the availability but something like the Magnavox MDR513H, it sort of
replaces the VCR, can record the digital OTA signals directly, puts them to
a hard drive, but if you want to archive, can burn it to DVD.

-bruce
b...@ripco.com

[Movie Fan]

Radio Shack.

[tomcervo]

On Apr 30, 2:33 am, Al 2048 <al2...@aol.com> wrote:

Hit the Goodwill's and thrift shops after a visit to the Big Box
converter section. See what the converters look like and look for them
on the cheap. You can find them w/o remotes for next to nothing, and a
universal remote will tune them.

[T. Keating]

On Mon, 30 Apr 2012 10:22:04 +0000 (UTC), Bruce Esquibel
<b...@ripco.com> wrote:

>In alt.tv.tech.hdtv Al 2048 <al2...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>> If I use the Digital Transport Adapter (DTA) supplied by Comcast, then
>> I can still use the VCR to record. However, I can not record one
>> channel while watching a different channel.
>
>> So, I want to get rid of the DTA and to have a VCR that can record
>> digital channels. That means that I have to buy a VCR with a digital
>> tuner or an external digital tuner for my current analog VCR.
>
>I don't think anyone ever made a VCR with digital tuners, they were just
>about dead and buried when OTA digital took over.

Their are a number of DVD/VCR combo recorders with a DTV tuner still
on the market. You just have to google for them..

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per Bruce Esquibel:

>Have you considered moving into the 21st century and getting rid of the VCR?

I did that some years back using a
(now-out-of-business-snuffed-out-by-being-acquired-by-Google)
Tivo-on-steroids app called "SageTV".

When I have to use a VCR or even a DVD player it seems sooooo
cumbersome and inconvenient - especially fast forwarding.

With political ads becoming more-and-more prevalent I would have
to consider convenient/quick fast forward an absolutely essential
feature just on the basis of mental hygiene.

The OP sounds pretty technical - probably more technical than I
am... so I'd have to second the recommendation for a disc-based
system.

The Tivo box I tried out a few years back was pretty slick, but
they wanted a monthly fee for the program guide and it didn't
scale to multiple rooms in the house.

OTOH, I think I saw a reference recently to a Tivo that does
scale to multi-rooms.

My system uses standalone tuners that make their output available
over the LAN - and SageTV uses that.

Maybe somebody can recommend a functional equivalent to SageTV.
--
Pete Cresswell

[whosbest54]

In article
<8a310ac6-69dc-4f2c...@f37g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>,
al2...@aol.com says...

It appears to me none of the replies to you in this thread so far
answered your request completely or correctly. Here's my take.

Comcast went digital. Apparently, they no longer carry analog cable
channels your VCR can tune directly. That means you'll need a cable box
tuner that can. There are none that allow you to record one channel
while watching another on the VCR without having 2 boxes.

The DTA is exactly that. You must use it to record on the VCR. One
option is to split the cable and hook each leg up to 2 DTA boxes with
one hooked up to the VCR and the other to the TV. Then you could record
from one box while watching another.

A number of posters referred you to getting a converter box that works
only for over the air (OTA) TV. Unfortunately, those won't work with
cable. You do have the option of getting one of those boxes and hooking
up an antenna and getting only over the air channels. But these work
like a cable box and won't allow you to record one channel while
watching another unless you have 2 boxes. You could hook up an OTA
coverter box tuner to your TV and watch that while recording from the
DTA. If your set is HD digital, you could hook up an antenna directly
to it and watch the local OTA stations while recording from the DTA
without the need for a converter box.

Comcast likely carries some or most of the local OTA channels as clear
digital QAM. Most HD digital sets made over the last few years have
built in clear QAM tuners. You may be able to split the cable and hook
one leg up to the DTA and the other directly to your HD set and record
off the DTA with the VCR and watch clear QAM channels on your TV at the
same time. If your set is analog, this isn't an option. Based on your
post, it sounds like your set is digital and may be able to get clear
QAM stations already.

Finally, you can get rid of the VCR and get a digital video recorder.
It's likely you'll have to get Comcast's DVR or a model that takes their
cablecard to be able to watch and record all the channels you subscribe
to with a DVR.

whosbest54
--
The flamewars are over...if you want it.

Unofficial rec.audio.opinion Usenet Group Brief User Guide:
http://whosbest54.netau.net/rao.htm

Unofficial rec.music.beatles Usenet Group Brief User Guide:
http://whosbest54.netau.net/rmb.html

[Kimba W Lion]

Kimba W Lion <noreplie...@norepliesbyemail.invalid> wrote:

>DTV converter box.

Since you only mentioned OTA channels, my answer only applies to OTA
reception. If you want the cable-only channels as well, you'll have to use a
box from the cable company.

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per whosbest54:

>Finally, you can get rid of the VCR and get a digital video recorder.
>It's likely you'll have to get Comcast's DVR or a model that takes their

>cablecard...

Or just get rid of Comcast.

We seem tb the only people for miles around that have only OTA,
yet I've got more programs on disc than I could possibly watch.

Seems to me like everything I'd want to watch is available OTA
given that it's automagically recorded for me and I can watch any
time I want.

Two exceptions are sports and CSPAN - but I'm not a sports fan
and can live without CSPAN.
--
Pete Cresswell

[GMAN]

No, he wants one that can do cable.

[GMAN]

But the digital tuner in them are for OTA digital only

[UCLAN]

On 4/30/2012 3:14 AM, Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:

> May I suggest Tivo? Appliance, two tuners so it can watch/record two
> things at once.

The new TiVo Premier Elite has SIX tuners. That's right - record five
programs at the same time, and watch a sixth, or record all six.

[Note: TiVo Premier Elite soon to be renamed.]

[Barry Margolin]

In article <a082th...@mid.individual.net>, UCLAN <UC...@invalid.net>
wrote:

> [Note: TiVo Premier Elite soon to be renamed.]

Good -- too many superlatives.

--
Barry Margolin
Arlington, MA

[Sal]

"whosbest54" <whosb...@NOSPAM.yahoo.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:20120430-1...@whosbest54.news.shared-secrets.com...


< snip >

> Comcast went digital. Apparently, they no longer carry analog cable
> channels your VCR can tune directly. That means you'll need a cable box
> tuner that can. There are none that allow you to record one channel
> while watching another on the VCR without having 2 boxes.
>
> The DTA is exactly that. You must use it to record on the VCR. One
> option is to split the cable and hook each leg up to 2 DTA boxes with
> one hooked up to the VCR and the other to the TV. Then you could record
> from one box while watching another.
>
> A number of posters referred you to getting a converter box that works
> only for over the air (OTA) TV. Unfortunately, those won't work with
> cable. You do have the option of getting one of those boxes and hooking
> up an antenna and getting only over the air channels. But these work
> like a cable box and won't allow you to record one channel while
> watching another unless you have 2 boxes. You could hook up an OTA
> coverter box tuner to your TV and watch that while recording from the
> DTA. If your set is HD digital, you could hook up an antenna directly
> to it and watch the local OTA stations while recording from the DTA
> without the need for a converter box.

< snip >

Thank goodness somebody got it right! The OTA converters, the coupon boxes
that helped transition old TVs into the digital age, demodulate a digital
modulation called 8-VSB. Cable boxes almost always use something called
QAM. They are totally incompatible. This means one box will rarely do
both.

However, I found one here:
http://www.amazon.com/Mygica-LDA-9000-Standalone-Digital-Monitor/dp/B004AH6HM4/ref=pd_sim_e_2
that might do it for you, depending on whether it puts out something that
you can pump into your VCR. It says coaxial (RF) near the bottom of the
page, so it should work.

I also found this one
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815260027 which says
it does composite output, which would be marginally better that RF.
Investigate to make sure it really does composite. "Component" is NOT the
same and there's some confusion in the description.

I own neither of these but there were some favorable user reviews.

"Sal"

[Jim Wilkins]

"GMAN" <Winnie...@100acrewoods.net> wrote in message
news:1qznr.279097$P92.2...@en-nntp-07.dc1.easynews.com...

The Hauppauge 950 USB tuner on my DTV recording PC accepts OTA and QAM
(FIOS), not cable, but they list this:
http://store.hauppauge.com/hardware2.asp?product=wintv-dcr-2650

[John McWilliams]

On 4/30/12 PDT 11:19 AM, Barry Margolin wrote:
> In article<a082th...@mid.individual.net>, UCLAN<UC...@invalid.net>
> wrote:
>
>> [Note: TiVo Premier Elite soon to be renamed.]
>
> Good -- too many superlatives.
>

But the new name will be "TiVo Titanic Super-Elite Primo Select DVR".....

[John McWilliams]

Two? You'd be missing several dozens of movie channels, hundreds of
specialty channels, ESPN, and, of course, the Oprah channel.

[tv-fa...@its-all-good.com]

> From: Al 2048 <al2...@aol.com>

>If I use the Digital Transport Adapter (DTA) supplied by Comcast, then

>I can still use the VCR to record. However, I can not record one
>channel while watching a different channel.

if you're a real tv fanatic like me, you can do what i did.

when i started out, i got a couple of power bars and a dozen timer
switches (like the ones that turn your lamp off and on while you're on
vacation) and plugged them into the power bars. buy 12 cheap dta tuners
(look around - you can find cheap ones) and set each one to a different
channel that you want to tape and turn them on, allowing the timers to
turn them off again. set your timers to match the program settings on your
vcr. channel all of the outputs of the dta tuners to a couple of large
switchboxes (coaxials) and then send the output of that to your vcr. set
your vcr to the output channel of the dtas tuners (usually 2, 3 or 4).

now as each show you want to tape is about to start, one lamp timer will
switch on and turn on a corresponding dta tuner, which will output its
selected channel to an output switchbox and then onto your vcr. this will
work until the lamp timer switches off again (after the show has ended),
switching off that particular dta tuner. your vcr will automatically shut
off as well and wait for the next program in its timer. each lamp timer
will start up its dta tuner and output its signal.

when you return home, you will have a tape filled with all of your
favorite programs. it works like a charm. i've used this for years without
fail. i'm now up to 8 power bars and 48 dta tuners and lamp timer
switches, outputting to 6 collective output coaxial boxes and 20 vcrs.

sincerely, tv fanatic. (they don't call me that for nothing)

[Adam H. Kerman]

Al 2048 <al2...@aol.com> wrote:

>I live in a Chicago suburb. My cable company, Comcast, has migrated to
>an all-digital signal. Before this migration, I had channels 2, 2.1
>(CBS), 5, 5.1 (NBC), 7, 7.1 (ABC), etc. After the migration, the
>analog channels (2, 5, 7) disappeared.

I'm confused. Were you able to tune in digital subchannels because your tv
has a digital tuner? Yes, Comcast is eliminating analog channels head end
by head end throughout the country.

The .1 subchannels were the HD subchannels, although WTTW-HD is 11.3
on Comcast.

>Why is this a problem? Well, my VCR is an analog VCR, and my VCR's
>tuner can detect only the analog channels (2, 5, 7). The tuner can not
>detect the digital channels (2.1, 5.1, 7.1).

>If I use the Digital Transport Adapter (DTA) supplied by Comcast, then
>I can still use the VCR to record. However, I can not record one
>channel while watching a different channel.

I have no idea why not, given that you have a digital tuner. Are you using
composite video and stereo connections via the RCA jacks? Just change the
input selector between the tv tuner and VCR and you'll have no trouble.

>So, I want to get rid of the DTA and to have a VCR that can record
>digital channels.

That doesn't make sense. Keep the DTA. Just correct the connection between
VCR and tv and use the tv's tuner when you want to watch a different
channel than what's being recorded on VCR.

[TJ]

", Supreme Enhanced version."

TJ

[Al 2048]

On Apr 30, 9:45 am, whosbest54 <whosbes...@NOSPAM.yahoo.com.invalid>
wrote:

<<<<
Comcast likely carries some or most of the local OTA channels as
clear
digital QAM. Most HD digital sets made over the last few years have
built in clear QAM tuners. You may be able to split the cable and
hook
one leg up to the DTA and the other directly to your HD set and
record
off the DTA with the VCR and watch clear QAM channels on your TV at
the
same time. If your set is analog, this isn't an option. Based on
your
post, it sounds like your set is digital and may be able to get clear
QAM stations already.
>>>>

My tv is, indeed, digital, and it does have a QAM tuner. Your idea of
splitting the cable, etc., certainly would allow me to watch one
channel while recording another.

However, there is one more problem. My VCR can be programmed for up to
8 events. For example, before the migration, I could program the VCR
to do the following:

record channel 2 from 3 PM to 4 PM (event 1)

record channel 5 from 4 PM to 5 PM (event 2)

record channel 7 from 6 PM to 7 PM (event 3)

and so on


If the VCR can record only via the DTA, then the VCR can record only
the channel to which the DTA's tuner is set. If I want the VCR to
record channel 2 from 3 PM to 4 PM, and then channel 5 from 4 PM to 5
PM, then I would have to do the following:

at 3 PM, I would have to set the DTA tuner to channel 2

then, at 4 PM, I would have to change the DTA tuner to channel 5

I can NOT leave the house and expect the VCR to record one channel,
and the *subsequently* a different channel.


However, if I get rid of the DTA and get an external QAM tuner for my
VCR, a QAM tuner that can get HD digital channels from the cable, then
my problem is solved. Alternatively, I can buy a new VCR with a built-
in QAM tuner.

So, where can I find an external QAM tuner for my VCR? If I get a DVR
from Comcast, then I have to pay a monthly fee. I don't want to pay a
monthly fee to record something. I already have a paid-for VCR.

By the way, thanks to everyone for all of the responses so far.

Regards,

Alex K.

[G-squared]

WHY would you fool around with analog tape? Best Buy hasn't had tapes
in years. Doesn't that tell you something? It doesn't take much of a
computer to record HDTV. I've been doing that for 7+ years starting
with a very modest AMD Sempron 2500, 512 megs RAM and ATI tuner and
video card. The TV recorded on the PC is as 'perfect' as the off air
signal - you CANNOT tell them apart. Granted a 'slow' PC may stutter
if you try surfing the web while the machine is in record but the AMD
quad core machines never stutter including web browsing, playing
another HD recording AND playing out another HD stream across the LAN.
You do not need special hardware for this The 10/100 link can play
multiple streams but if you're moving files between machines a gigabit
link can be about 5 times faster than the 10/100. The Hauppauge tuners
work great for clear QAM on cable or ATSC OTA.

G²

[P.V.]

"Al 2048" kirjoitti
viestissä:1618b4e6-da53-42ae...@21g2000vbh.googlegroups.com...

A tuner can't do the job unless it can be somehow ordered to switch
channels. On this side of the Pond, there are (or at least have been)
set-top-boxes that have timers in them. You could set such an STB to switch
on, and to a certain channel at a certain time, just like you're setting
your VCR; you'd just have to do the timer settings twice. Perhaps you could
find an STB for QAM that has the timer feature.

Another solution would be to use a chain of STB's that are kept always on
and that are set to output a digital channel set on each of them on a
different analog RF channel. This would require that there are channels left
that are not used for the digital broadcasts, and supposing the RF output
channel on the STB's can be changed. So each of the STB's would pass through
all incoming signals, digital and analog, and add a new analog one.

But whatever you'll decide to do, remember that your VCR must be very old
already, and it won't function forever. If you're going to make a big
one-time investment to avoid monthly fees, you might not be lucky enough to
have the time to get your money back from your investment before the VCR
will fail.

P.V.

[Daniel W. Rouse Jr.]

"Al 2048" <al2...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:8a310ac6-69dc-4f2c...@f37g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...

> Hello.
>
> I live in a Chicago suburb. My cable company, Comcast, has migrated to
> an all-digital signal. Before this migration, I had channels 2, 2.1
> (CBS), 5, 5.1 (NBC), 7, 7.1 (ABC), etc. After the migration, the
> analog channels (2, 5, 7) disappeared.
>
> Why is this a problem? Well, my VCR is an analog VCR, and my VCR's
> tuner can detect only the analog channels (2, 5, 7). The tuner can not
> detect the digital channels (2.1, 5.1, 7.1).
>
> If I use the Digital Transport Adapter (DTA) supplied by Comcast, then
> I can still use the VCR to record. However, I can not record one
> channel while watching a different channel.
>
> So, I want to get rid of the DTA and to have a VCR that can record
> digital channels. That means that I have to buy a VCR with a digital
> tuner or an external digital tuner for my current analog VCR.
>
> So, can someone please tell me where I can buy an external tuner? Are
> external tuners even made anymore?
>
> Thanks for any information.
>

As said in previous responses--you can get a digital TV converter box.

Be aware that many are significantly more affected by DTVs limitations than
the newer TVs with built-in newer tuners. Except for a few with good luck,
expect a good amount of audio dropouts, picture artifacts and even picture
freezes unless the antenna is the right one and the aiming is spot on. You
won't be able to monitor this while watching one channel but recording from
another channel.

Best bet is to stick with the DTA from Comcast, even if it means not being
able to watch one channel and record from another channel.

[Jim Wilkins]

"G-squared" <stra...@yahoo.com> wrote
-WHY would you fool around with analog tape? Best Buy hasn't had tapes
-in years. Doesn't that tell you something? It doesn't take much of a
-computer to record HDTV. I've been doing that for 7+ years starting
-with a very modest AMD Sempron 2500, 512 megs RAM and ATI tuner and
-video card. The TV recorded on the PC is as 'perfect' as the off air
-signal - you CANNOT tell them apart. Granted a 'slow' PC may stutter
-if you try surfing the web while the machine is in record but the AMD
-quad core machines never stutter including web browsing, playing
-another HD recording AND playing out another HD stream across the
LAN.
-You do not need special hardware for this The 10/100 link can play
-multiple streams but if you're moving files between machines a
gigabit
-link can be about 5 times faster than the 10/100. The Hauppauge
tuners
-work great for clear QAM on cable or ATSC OTA.
-G²

I started with a 2.2GHz single-core Pentium and Hauppauge 950 tuner
with their software on XP. The CPU was barely adequate, >90% busy when
recording 1080i, and the software could freeze from as little as
changing window size.

Now I have a 3GHz single core, Windows 7 and Media Center using the
same USB tuner, and the CPU loafs below 30%. Media Center's controls
are aimed at brain-dead vidiots but it has worked well enough for a
year and automatically switches channels.

The only remaining issue is the high cost and low reliability of
terabyte hard drives. 1080i consumes about 6.5G per hour.

jsw

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per John McWilliams:

>> Two exceptions are sports and CSPAN - but I'm not a sports fan
>> and can live without CSPAN.
>
>Two? You'd be missing several dozens of movie channels, hundreds of
>specialty channels, ESPN, and, of course, the Oprah channel.

Agreed.

But how much TV can I watch every day?

By the time I get through Charlie Rose, the evening news, and
maybe a couple TED presentations my grey matter is about dried
up.

If the weather's poor and I take enough coffee, maybe I can
handle an American Experience, FrontLine, POV, or somesuch... but
that's a stretch.

And then there's NetFlix....

One specialty channel that I left out is the History Channel.
When I go down the shore to my #2 daughter's place it's a problem
getting to the beach - I tend tb glued to the History Channel.

"Diffrn't strokes for diffrn't folks...."
--
Pete Cresswell

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per Al 2048:

>However, there is one more problem. My VCR can be programmed for up to
>8 events. For example, before the migration, I could program the VCR
>to do the following:
>
>record channel 2 from 3 PM to 4 PM (event 1)
>
>record channel 5 from 4 PM to 5 PM (event 2)
>
>record channel 7 from 6 PM to 7 PM (event 3)

I think Elmo Shagnasty nailed it: get a PC running Windows Media
Center.

Mine (running a different product) lives down in the rec room and
my TVs are fed by little black boxes that only draw 5-6 watts.

My own preference is for standalone "HD HomeRun" tuners that can
be accessed by the PC over the LAN. But there are plenty of
card-based tuners and the number of simultaneous programs you
could record would be limited only by the number of tuners/PC
slots.

I use 4 and have never had a conflict - and that's really only
three bc I almost never watch a show in real-time. Instead I'll
tune in 10-20 minutes after it starts and watch a buffered
version so I can fast-forward the commercials.
--
Pete Cresswell

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per G-squared:

>It doesn't take much of a
>computer to record HDTV. I've been doing that for 7+ years starting
>with a very modest AMD Sempron 2500, 512 megs RAM and ATI tuner and
>video card.

What application do you use to record the TV?
--
Pete Cresswell

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per Jim Wilkins:

>The only remaining issue is the high cost and low reliability of
>terabyte hard drives.

They're down to under a hundred bucks around here (Southeastern
Pennsylvania, USA).

Right now, I've got movies and all other data besides recorded TV
on a NAS box that can lose two drives without losing any data.

In something over two years, I've had one die on the NAS box very
soon after Day-1 and had one DOA - but no other failures.

I recently moved Recorded TV from the NAS box to a couple of
drives on my 24-7 PC and every so often I back those up to an old
Windows Home Server box....but my feeling is that recorded TV is
pretty much a disposable commodity... if I lose a drive, no big
deal.
--
Pete Cresswell

[J G Miller]

On Tue, 01 May 2012 09:38:48 -0400, (PeteCresswell) wrote:

> But how much TV can I watch every day?

About 24 hours worth (with brief toilet breaks unless
you have a screen in the bathroom).

> By the time I get through Charlie Rose, the evening news, and
> maybe a couple TED presentations my grey matter is about dried
> up.

Time for re-runs of "Roseanne" or "Sanford and Sun" then? ;)

[J G Miller]

On Tuesday, May 1st, 2012, at 09:45:36h -0400, Pete Cresswell expounded:

> I think Elmo Shagnasty nailed it:
> get a PC running Windows Media Center.

Why not Myth TV?

<http://www.mythtv.ORG/>

Open source and no need to buy a licence from Micro$loth Corporation.

[shawn]

On Tue, 1 May 2012 14:34:07 +0000 (UTC), J G Miller <mil...@yoyo.ORG>
wrote:

That would be the way that I would go but doesn't Myth TV require a
certain amount of technical knowledge? That's not something that
everyone has or wants to deal with when at home.

[Del Mibbler]

Al 2048 <al2...@aol.com> wrote (in part):

>If the VCR can record only via the DTA, then the VCR can record only
>the channel to which the DTA's tuner is set. If I want the VCR to
>record channel 2 from 3 PM to 4 PM, and then channel 5 from 4 PM to 5
>PM, then I would have to do the following:
>
>at 3 PM, I would have to set the DTA tuner to channel 2
>
>then, at 4 PM, I would have to change the DTA tuner to channel 5
>
>I can NOT leave the house and expect the VCR to record one channel,
>and the *subsequently* a different channel.

Some VCRs can control a cable box using an IR Blaster to emulate the
STB's remote control. Check your VCR's manual to see if it can do
that.

Del Mibbler

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per J G Miller:

>> By the time I get through Charlie Rose, the evening news, and
>> maybe a couple TED presentations my grey matter is about dried
>> up.
>
>Time for re-runs of "Roseanne" or "Sanford and Sun" then? ;)

My re-run taste (or lack thereof?) goes more to Benny Hill...
--
Pete Cresswell

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per J G Miller:

>Why not Myth TV?
>
> <http://www.mythtv.ORG/>
>
>Open source and no need to buy a licence from Micro$loth Corporation.

Myth was my first choice when I was getting in to this.

But I could not make it work. Spent a couple months on it and
it was like a part-time job - except the pay was lousy.

Finally abandoned it for a now-defunct product called "SageTV"
and never looked back.

In retrospect, I think most of my problems were around SQL
Anywhere's security.

In fairness to MythTV, there are others who have been using it
for years with no problems at all.

But $100 for Sage got me my life back....
--
Pete Cresswell

[GMAN]

We are talking VCR/DVD settop recorders,not PC cards.I own a Hauppage and yes
they are nice but not the same.

[Jim Wilkins]

"GMAN" <Winnie...@100acrewoods.net> wrote

>>
>>The Hauppauge 950 USB tuner on my DTV recording PC accepts OTA and
>>QAM
>>(FIOS), not cable, but they list this:
>>http://store.hauppauge.com/hardware2.asp?product=wintv-dcr-2650
>>
> We are talking VCR/DVD settop recorders,not PC cards.I own a
> Hauppage and yes
> they are nice but not the same.

We are talking about DTV adapters or replacements for a VCR, and a PC
running Media Center, Myth, Sage etc is a very good if power-hungry
alternative, without a monthly fee. An older PC you already have may
be fine, mine is from 2005.

I still have two VCRs on DTV converters arranged so I can record two
channels and watch a third, but why archive degraded versions when the
PC captures the full HDTV resolution perfectly?

jsw

[J G Miller]

On Tuesday, May 1st, 2012, at 11:15:52h -0400, Shawn wrote:

> That would be the way that I would go but doesn't Myth TV require a
> certain amount of technical knowledge?

Apparently it is not anywhere near as bad as it used to be in
setting up and getting working.

However, there is something much simpler if you just want to
record shows which recently came to my attention, thanks to
Dr Sian Mountbatten, and so tried out and that is tvheadend.

So long as you can know the frequencies and parameters for
each multiplex (which you can find by using w_scan in -x mode)
then it is all a very simple web interface.

<https://www.lonelycoder.COM/tvheadend/>

Furthermore the recordings it makes are x.264 (I think) encoded
in mkv container so these are smaller than raw MPEG-2 transport stream
recordings which can be an issue if you are doing lots of recording.

[dmaster]

On Monday, April 30, 2012 1:33:20 AM UTC-5, Al 2048 wrote:
> Hello.
>
> I live in a Chicago suburb. My cable company, Comcast, has migrated to
> an all-digital signal. Before this migration, I had channels 2, 2.1
> (CBS), 5, 5.1 (NBC), 7, 7.1 (ABC), etc. After the migration, the
> analog channels (2, 5, 7) disappeared.
>
> Why is this a problem? Well, my VCR is an analog VCR, and my VCR's
> tuner can detect only the analog channels (2, 5, 7). The tuner can not
> detect the digital channels (2.1, 5.1, 7.1).
>
> If I use the Digital Transport Adapter (DTA) supplied by Comcast, then
> I can still use the VCR to record. However, I can not record one
> channel while watching a different channel.
>
> So, I want to get rid of the DTA and to have a VCR that can record
> digital channels. That means that I have to buy a VCR with a digital
> tuner or an external digital tuner for my current analog VCR.
>
> So, can someone please tell me where I can buy an external tuner? Are
> external tuners even made anymore?
>
> Thanks for any information.
>

> Regards,
>
> Alex K.

Theres been a lot of discussion of many ways to approach your problem. For me, *IF* you only care about clear QAM channels (locals that don't require a Cable Company box), then the simplest solution might be to replace the VCR with a DVD recorder with a QAM tuner. I've used them for OTA for years. My experience is that re-recordable DVD Media can be problematic, but once-recordable media has never failed me. I buy single use DVD+R or DVD-R for under $0.25 each. Using the DVD Recorder is almost identical to using a VCR.

Dan (Woj...)

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per (PeteCresswell):

>In something over two years, I've had one die on the NAS box very
>soon after Day-1 and had one DOA - but no other failures.

Oops... Shoulda' kept my mouth shut.

A few hours after that post, my XP box started having *really*
long XP splash screens.

Looked at MyComputer and one of the TV drives was missing.

Yanked it, put it into one of those USB/toaster type wrappers and
it just kept clicking and clicking....

This will be the second Seagate Barracuda that has gone South on
me.

Ran down to the local 'puter store, brought home a WD 2-TB for
$125 and am recovering to it now.

Two terabytes for $125? !!!.... Not one, but *two*.... !

When I bought my first MacIntosh way back in the early eighties,
I paid $800 extra for a 20-megabyte hard drive.

That was about $1,700 in 2011 dollars.

1 TB = 1,048,576 MB.

2 TB = 2,097,152 MB

2,097,152/20 = 104,857 times the storage.

$125/$1,700 = .074 of the price.

25 years, over a hundred thousand times the storage for less than
10 percent of the price....

Sheesh!

--
Pete Cresswell

[Sal]

"shawn" <nanof...@gNOTmail.com> wrote in message
news:tfvvp75ch44gi21q5...@4ax.com...

>
> That would be the way that I would go but doesn't Myth TV require a
> certain amount of technical knowledge? That's not something that
> everyone has or wants to deal with when at home.

That's all relative to what you want to accomplish. A teenager who wants a
driver license will invest many hours of study and practice.

But yes, even the creators of Myth TV admit it's difficult, letting you know
that it will take hours and still may not work out. Scary. Their current
version number (0.25) is a tacit admission that it's
not-ready-for-prime-time; version numbers 1.0 and higher are reserved for
fully functional releases.

But keep watching for somebody to claim a ready-to-run Windows installation.
You still need tuner hardware.

RELATED: Buying a new PC and adding one of these little Hauppauge sweeties
just might be all you'll ever want.

http://hauppauge.com/site/products/data_hvr2250.html
Roof antenna into one port, cable into the other port; The only downside
seems to be the need to watch on the PC or to own a TV that has a PC input.
(I have two that do.) If you do not have one, there are add-ons that take
your PC out and convert it to something that goes into TV.

That site has a number of other things that might work for you. Overall,
consider that a PC-based DVR has potentially hundreds of hours capacity,
compared to an eight hour VHS tape and the pictures are much better.

Numbers: each HD hour uses about 5 GB of data storage and you can get
single hard drives with over 1,000 GB of capacity.

Some DVD recorders have hard drives. You could use one of these without
ever burning a single DVD. Dunno if any do HDTV.

"Sal"

[whosbest54]

In article <1618b4e6-da53-42ae-9f54-
525eff...@21g2000vbh.googlegroups.com>, al2...@aol.com says...

Other than the suggestions posted so far, I'm unaware of a QAM tuner
that will get all the stations you subscribe to in HD that will do what
you want and have it's own timer. You'd need one that takes CableCard
with a timer that outputs composite vid or on RF.

The cable companies know this and that's why they get so many of their
subscribers to rent their DVR.

There some DVD recorder/VCR units that have digital tuners for OTA and
possibly clear QAM, but I don't believe they take CableCard.

You can build a PC based DVR that will work with OTA and clear QAM
only, as others suggested.

There is the Magnavox DVR/DVD recorder which I know works with OTA and
I believe clear QAM. I don't think it takes CableCard.

<http://www.walmart.com/ip/Magnavox-MDR515H-F7-500GB-HDD-and-DVD-R-
with-Digital-Tuner/15080509>

The Moxi DVR is CableCard ready:

http://www.moxi.com/us/moxi_dvr.html

whosbest54
--
The flamewars are over...if you want it.

Unofficial rec.audio.opinion Usenet Group Brief User Guide:
http://whosbest54.netau.net/rao.htm

Unofficial rec.music.beatles Usenet Group Brief User Guide:
http://whosbest54.netau.net/rmb.html

[J G Miller]

On Tuesday, May 1st, 2012, at 13:33:40h -0700, Sal declared:

> Their current version number (0.25) is a tacit admission that it's
> not-ready-for-prime-time;

It is no such admission.

> version numbers 1.0 and higher are reserved for fully functional releases.

All depends on what you mean by "fully functional".

QUOTE

When will Myth reach 1.0?

What's in a number? Numbering releases is extremely arbitrary, even more so in
open source, even many commercial projects select version numbers out of the air
and on the basis of how it will affect sales.

Perceived 'wisdom' in the commercial world is that releases containing new features
get a major version number and cost more, those receiving just bug fixes get minor
numbers and cost less.

In a project like MythTV where every release contains a new feature we'd be on
version 23.0, but that doesn't give an accurate impression of where MythTV is
in its development.

MythTV is very stable, but it cannot be said that the developers consider it to be
finished, and the version numbering reflects that.

UNQUOTE

Not finished does not mean that that the features in the current version are
not fully functional.

[Gene E. Bloch]

Note that disk drive manufacturers quote capacity in decimal units, so
that 1 TB = 1000000 MB...

It's the marketeers: it makes the drives look marginally bigger :-)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

[Gene E. Bloch]

On Tue, 1 May 2012 11:49:16 -0700 (PDT), dmaster wrote:

> Using the DVD Recorder is almost identical to using a VCR.

Or even easier, if you ask me.

I agree with your remark (that I clipped) about re-recordable media not
being 100% dependable.

[Wes Newell]

It does require you to know what you have, and what to buy to make it
work. I've been running it since 2005. When I first started with it I
compiled it from source to later find out there was a prepackaged version
for my distro. I run the backend on my main machine with 6 tuners (3
dual) and then have frontends on my TV's. I still using version 0.23
because I didn't like what they did when they went to 0.24. But once
setup, I didn't have any major problems with any of them. I think I've
been running 0.23 for several years now.

[Patty Winter]

In article <10376374.664.1335898156771.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynbq3>,
dmaster <dan...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

[bunch of quotage snipped]

>For me, *IF* you only care about clear QAM channels (locals that don't
>require a Cable Company box), then the simplest solution might be to
>replace the VCR with a DVD recorder with a QAM tuner.

I second that recommendation. I got one of these a year or so ago:

www.magnavox.com/p/index_player.php?id=58

Lots of good info about the 513 and related models here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=940657

I've only using the built-in QAM tuner occasionally, but it has
worked fine when I have.


Patty

[Jim Wilkins]

"(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.Invalid> wrote in message
news:blg0q71au0up82cl7...@4ax.com...
> ...>

> This will be the second Seagate Barracuda that has gone South on
> me.
>
> Ran down to the local 'puter store, brought home a WD 2-TB for
> $125 and am recovering to it now.
>
> Two terabytes for $125? !!!.... Not one, but *two*.... !

> Pete Cresswell

A WD My Essentials 2T died on me a few months ago, 3 months out of the
1-year warranty. As a loyal customer they will sell me another for
$159.

HDTune showed the growing bad block problem soon enough for me to back
up most of the files, HDTV recordings of low value. The drive had been
written ONE time. It had cost $89 at Walmart on Thanksgiving 2010,
before the floods in Thailand hurt production.

The replacements are 2T Seagates, $109.99 each from Staples. More
often they are $129. The reviews are somewhat more favorable unless
you have a Mac.

This time I tested them continuously for the two-week return period,
and found and swapped one partially bad one the first day. Their test
program didn't show it as bad but I overloaded them with details and
they gave in. It did fail SeaTools, which they don't have.

The read speed benchmark in HDTune initially showed numerous read
retries, as slower access rates. After a few full scans and benchmark
repeats the read rate settles to a steady 25MB/S, which I take as a
good drive.

http://www.hdtune.com/download.html
http://www.seagate.com/support/downloads/seatools/
http://support.wdc.com/product/download.asp?groupid=301&sid=3&lang=en

jsw

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per Wes Newell:

> I've been running it since 2005. When I first started with it I
>compiled it from source to later find out there was a prepackaged version
>for my distro. I run the backend on my main machine with 6 tuners (3
>dual) and then have frontends on my TV's.

Seems to me like at least giving Myth a try is a no-brainer. The
price is right, and if it does not work out there is always
Windows Media Center.
--
Pete Cresswell

[Al 2048]

On May 1, 12:46 am, "P.V." <a...@nymo.us> wrote:
> A tuner can't do the job unless it can be somehow ordered to switch
> channels. On this side of the Pond, there are (or at least have been)
> set-top-boxes that have timers in them. You could set such an STB to switch
> on, and to a certain channel at a certain time, just like you're setting
> your VCR; you'd just have to do the timer settings twice. Perhaps you could
> find an STB for QAM that has the timer feature.
>


Some responses have suggested that I use a computer to record TV.
Unfortunately, that will not be possible. I have two TVs, and there is
no room for a computer next to either TV.

However, the idea of a DTA or a set top box that can change channels
based on a timer is an excellent idea. Does anyone know where I can
buy such a DTA or set top box?

Thanks.

Regards,

Alex K.

[Adam H. Kerman]

Al 2048 <al2...@aol.com> wrote:

>However, the idea of a DTA or a set top box that can change channels
>based on a timer is an excellent idea. Does anyone know where I can
>buy such a DTA or set top box?

Comcast set-top boxes without DVRs have been able to change channels at
the start of programs for years, even back in the days of analogue
descrambler boxes.

[Sal]

"J G Miller" <mil...@yoyo.ORG> wrote in message
news:jnpihm$e1r$1...@dont-email.me...

> On Tuesday, May 1st, 2012, at 13:33:40h -0700, Sal declared:
>
>> Their current version number (0.25) is a tacit admission that it's
>> not-ready-for-prime-time;
>
> It is no such admission.
>
>> version numbers 1.0 and higher are reserved for fully functional
>> releases.
>
> All depends on what you mean by "fully functional".

There's always a potential problem when a poster (me) abbreviates his
thoughts to avoid "running-on ad nausium."

Such is this time.

The assignment of a less-than-unity number for a release is customarily
associated with software whose developers are less than totally confident in
the ability of their work to run flawlessly in all situations, on all
machines and in concert with other applications that might be running
already or might be started. How about that phrase "A Work in Progress"?

While a 0.25 release might run on my machine, I'd be unwise to bet money
that it will also run on Joe's, Sally's and Fred's machines.

My statement was a cautionary note, not a condemnation of betas. The
less-than-unity numbering has a useful purpose, as does a warning flag at a
place on the sidewalk upon which you might stumble.

I meant no insult. I hope that's expressed more clearly.

"Sal"

[AJL]

On Tue, 01 May 2012 16:21:30 -0400, "(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.Invalid>
wrote:

>25 years, over a hundred thousand times the storage for less than
>10 percent of the price....
>
>Sheesh!

My first 6 transistor portable AM radio was near $300. My first LED
wristwatch (the one you had to push the button to read) was near
$200. Now you can find either at the dollar store...

[G-squared]

I doubt the MPEG2 is converted to H.264 on the fly as it takes a fair
chunk of processing power to do it.

G²

[G-squared]

On May 1, 6:47 am, "(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.Invalid> wrote:
> Per G-squared:
>
> >It doesn't take much of a
> >computer to record HDTV. I've been doing that for 7+ years starting
> >with a very modest AMD Sempron 2500, 512 megs RAM and ATI tuner and
> >video card.
>
> What application do you use to record the TV?
> --
> Pete Cresswell

The ATI tuners (2 on-line and 2 more in 'retired' computers) run ATI
MMC 9.14. The Hauppauge tuner runs WinTV 6. The 3 machines normally
used are all AMP Phenom II quad cores, 2 x 3.4GHz and a 3.2GHz. The 3
machines have 8 TB across 6 drivves, 2 per machine. VideoReDo renders
much faster when reading and writing with different drives though I
frequently do the editing across the LAN using another machine as the
source. Why? I'm too old to sit through commercials any more. Machines
all run Win XP Pro SP3.

Fry's last week had a 2 TB drive for $114 so the price is dropping
again. As for unreliability, I've had 2 Seagate 1.5 TB drives trip
SMART which got me warranty replacements and a Maxtor 300 GB several
years which was not under warranty. In each case the data was
recoverable and copied onto a new drive before returning the bad one
(or retiring the Maxtor). Highly recommend GetDataBack for recovering
damaged hard drives. BTW these machines are shut down each night.
California electricity is too expensive to waste on a PC not doing
anything useful.

G²

[G-squared]

Intentionally down converting HD to SD just bugs me. I _like_ HD TV.
But if you're happy, enjoy.

G²

[J G Miller]

On Tuesday, May 1st, 2012, at 18:35:42 -0700, Al 2048 wrote:

> and there is no room for a computer next to either TV.

I think that you do not know just how small some computers have become.

<http://www.nettopreview.com/>

[J G Miller]

On Wednesday, May 2nd, 2012, at 00:48:27h -0700, G-squared wrote:

> I doubt the MPEG2 is converted to H.264 on the fly as it takes a fair
> chunk of processing power to do it.

Well I may very well be wrong about the encoding, but it definitely
puts the recordings in .mkv files rather than just dumping them as raw .ts

Also, if you try to connect to the streaming feature of tvheadend
on the same machine, both vlc and mplayer run slow indicating that
there is quite a bit of processing going on.

I just have not had time to investigate this further, but in its
basic recording functionality, tvheadend really does work well
with only the minimal configuration needed of entering in the
multiplex frequencies and parameters through its web interface.

So for those not looking for the full mythtv experience of a back
end and a front end, and just a tv recorder, tvheadend would probably
be the more appropriate choice of the two.

The GNOME offering of gnome-dvb-daemon and totem is definitely a
work still in progress and more like alpha quality than beta.

[Michael Black]

You can find LED watches at the dollar store? There's a reason they
disappeared, leaving only a few traces. There's an Alistair Mclean book
where the hero presses a button to check the time, I think the watch may
have even been specified as a "Pulsar", and anyone reading that book who
was born a few years later wouldn't get the reference.

But it's not quite the same thing. We kind of expect things to drop in
price. But both RAM and hard drives, even computers for that matter, have
dropped in price but improved dramatically. It's the improvement that is
significant, and then the price drop is icing on the cake.

Michael

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per Al 2048:

>Some responses have suggested that I use a computer to record TV.
>Unfortunately, that will not be possible. I have two TVs, and there is
>no room for a computer next to either TV.

The implementations I am familiar with do not require a full-on
computer anywhere near a TV.

Instead, the computer is located wherever it is convenient (as in
using my own 24-7 PC in the rec room) and each TV has a little
black box under it that draws 5-6 watts and connects to the PC
via ethernet.

I've also done it over WiFi, but in my case it was easy enough to
pull the ethernet wires: Kitchen, 1 bedroom, rec room...
--
Pete Cresswell

[AJL]

On Wed, 2 May 2012 10:11:41 -0400, Michael Black <et...@ncf.ca> wrote:

>On Tue, 1 May 2012, AJL wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 01 May 2012 16:21:30 -0400, "(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.Invalid>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> 25 years, over a hundred thousand times the storage for less than
>>> 10 percent of the price....
>>>
>>> Sheesh!
>>
>> My first 6 transistor portable AM radio was near $300. My first LED
>> wristwatch (the one you had to push the button to read) was near
>> $200. Now you can find either at the dollar store...
>>
>You can find LED watches at the dollar store? There's a reason they
>disappeared, leaving only a few traces.

Yes, I realized after I posted it that I probably would be taken to
task by some technical perfectionist for using "LED" instead of
"digital" to describe the wristwatch. But my point was just to confirm
the OPs amazement at how cheap some electronics has become over the
years and not to be perfectly exactly technically correct.

>There's an Alistair Mclean book
>where the hero presses a button to check the time, I think the watch may
>have even been specified as a "Pulsar", and anyone reading that book who
>was born a few years later wouldn't get the reference.

Yes that's the kind of watch. You had to push a button to light up the
LED display. I had one, though I don't remember the brand. We used to
call them Polish watches since it took two hands to read one. Went
along with the Polish jokes of the day. Of course all that is
politically incorrect these days...

>But it's not quite the same thing. We kind of expect things to drop in
>price.

Not all things drop in price. I could buy a new car for around US$2K
in those days. A Coke was still a nickel a bottle.

>But both RAM and hard drives, even computers for that matter, have

>dropped in price but improved dramatically. .

I was talking little longer time frame. I remember working on those
old original color TVs that were the size of a washing machine and
cost nearly as much as a car (late 50s). Now I can buy the same
(screen) size TV for a fraction of the cost and carry it out under my
arm.

>It's the improvement that is
>significant, and then the price drop is icing on the cake

And that would be subjective. IMO it's both.

[dmaster]

On Wednesday, May 2, 2012 2:58:48 AM UTC-5, G-squared wrote:
...

> Intentionally down converting HD to SD just bugs me. I _like_ HD TV.
> But if you're happy, enjoy.
>
> G²

Of course, that's why I use my 2 OTA, non-subscription, HD DVRs. }:) This was in response to the Original Poster who was looking for a way to use his *VCR*. DVD recordings should be a considerable improvement for *him*.

Dan (Woj...)

[J G Miller]

On Wednesday, May 2nd, 2012, at 09:27:40h -0700, AJL wrote:

> Yes that's the kind of watch. You had to push a button to light up the
> LED display.

If I recall correctly, Kojak had one. ;)

[Sal]

"AJL" <123...@no--mail.com> wrote in message
news:1im2q75vfdj9onht7...@4ax.com...

> On Wed, 2 May 2012 10:11:41 -0400, Michael Black <et...@ncf.ca> wrote:

< snip >

> Yes, that's the kind of watch. You had to push a button to light up the

> LED display. I had one, though I don't remember the brand. We used to
> call them Polish watches since it took two hands to read one.

I remember. But later, The Great Advance of the Era was a sensor in some
watches, which, if you flicked your wrist a certain way, the LEDs came on
for a second or two enabling you to read the time and leave the other hand
free to hold onto your burger or steering wheel or girl friend ... whatever.

"Sal"

[Al 2048]

Well, that's a good start. But I would prefer for the set top box to
change channels based on a timer. What if I want to start recording at
a program's halfway point? I may not want to record an entire program.

Any other boxes or DTAs that can be programmed to change channels?

As for DVRs, are there any DVRs that do not require a monthly fee?

Regards,

Alex K.

[Adam H. Kerman]

Al 2048 <al2...@aol.com> wrote:
>On May 1, 10:56 pm, "Adam H. Kerman" <a...@chinet.com> wrote:
>>Al 2048 <al2...@aol.com> wrote:

>>>However, the idea of a DTA or a set top box that can change channels
>>>based on a timer is an excellent idea. Does anyone know where I can
>>>buy such a DTA or set top box?

>>Comcast set-top boxes without DVRs have been able to change channels at
>>the start of programs for years, even back in the days of analogue
>>descrambler boxes.

>Well, that's a good start. But I would prefer for the set top box to
>change channels based on a timer. What if I want to start recording at
>a program's halfway point? I may not want to record an entire program.

What do you care how early the channel changes as long as the channel
has been changed before you start recording on the VCR?

In any event, there are options. You can use the listings and have the
channel changed a few minutes before the start of the program. Or, you
can not use the listing and set it to change the channel at a specific
time.

>Any other boxes or DTAs that can be programmed to change channels?

This is not a feature of a DTA. You'd have to rent the non-DVR set-top box.

>As for DVRs, are there any DVRs that do not require a monthly fee?

Sure, if you don't want to subscribe to Trib listings (used by TiVo) or
TV Guide listings (used by Comcast). But these devices are painful to use
without a listing service.

[Ant]

On 5/3/2012 3:20 AM PT, Elmo P. Shagnasty typed:

>> As for DVRs, are there any DVRs that do not require a monthly fee?
>

> Yes.

Old DTV Pal DVR did. I am still using it. The current replacement,
Channel Master CM-7000PAL (same design with a different brand and model
name), as well. Note this is for OTA only so no cable and satellite
services can be used!
--
"An ant may work its (her) heart out, but it (she) can't make money."
--unknown
/\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
/ /\ /\ \ Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
| |o o| |
\ _ / If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
( ) If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.

[~consul]

'tis on this 4/30/2012 3:22 AM, wrote Bruce Esquibel thus to say:

> In alt.tv.tech.hdtv Al 2048<al2...@aol.com> wrote:
>> So, I want to get rid of the DTA and to have a VCR that can record
>> digital channels. That means that I have to buy a VCR with a digital
>> tuner or an external digital tuner for my current analog VCR.

> I don't think anyone ever made a VCR with digital tuners, they were just
> about dead and buried when OTA digital took over.

I still have vcr tapes of movies that I haven't bought their dvd version. And my vcr has a digital tuner.
--
"... respect, all good works are not done by only good folk. For here, at the end of all things, we shall do what needs to be done."
--till next time, consul -x- <<poetry.dolphins-cove.com>>

[~consul]

'tis on this 5/1/2012 6:47 AM, wrote (PeteCresswell) thus to say:
> Per G-squared:
>> It doesn't take much of a
>> computer to record HDTV. I've been doing that for 7+ years starting
>> with a very modest AMD Sempron 2500, 512 megs RAM and ATI tuner and
>> video card.
> What application do you use to record the TV?

I personally have been using my happauge usb tv tuner for at least 5 years. I use their tuner to decode the OTA signal, but since Win7, I've been using Media Center to set up the recording times/channels. Works perfectly.

[Nancy2]

Not every area has Comcast, do they?

N.

[Adam H. Kerman]

The O.P. told us he's a Comcast subscriber.

[Michael Black]

On Thu, 3 May 2012, ~consul wrote:

> 'tis on this 4/30/2012 3:22 AM, wrote Bruce Esquibel thus to say:
>> In alt.tv.tech.hdtv Al 2048<al2...@aol.com> wrote:
>>> So, I want to get rid of the DTA and to have a VCR that can record
>>> digital channels. That means that I have to buy a VCR with a digital
>>> tuner or an external digital tuner for my current analog VCR.
>> I don't think anyone ever made a VCR with digital tuners, they were just
>> about dead and buried when OTA digital took over.
>
> I still have vcr tapes of movies that I haven't bought their dvd version. And
> my vcr has a digital tuner.

I didn't get a VCR until I'd gotten a DVD player, which was in the fall of
2003. I liked the idea of DVDs better than tape that would break. But
once I had the DVD player, I was paying attention to prerecorded movies,
and noticed VHS movies were being cleared out. So I got a VCR some months
later, for $20 at a garage sale, it was in a box with the manual and
remote, and started buying VHS movies. At 25cents to a dollar, I can get
a lot of movies for the price of one DVD.

I have bought DVDs, but there are lots of movies I'm not interested enough
in to pay money for, like "Mr. Deeds" that I got last week. On the other
hand, some movies I've bought on VHS because I've found them, and then
replaced with DVDs when the price is right, movies I really want on DVD.

I've brought home a number of VCRs since buying that one, people are just
tossing them out and I certainly won't spend money on a new one, if they
are still available, so best to keep some backups while they are free and
available.

Michael

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per ~consul:

>but since Win7, I've been using Media Center

Is Media Center built in to Win 7?

Separate purchase?

When I was fooling around with it on an XP box, it seemed like it
wasn't really conceived as an add-on - more as something that was
sold pre-installed on a "Windows Media Center PC".
--
Pete Cresswell

[Roger Blake]

On 2012-04-30, Elmo P. Shagnasty <el...@nastydesigns.com> wrote:
> You will not find a VCR with a digital tuner.

I bought one just about a year and a half ago, a Toshiba combo VCR/DVD
recorder with digital tuner. Both the VCR and DVD can record from the
digital tuner, which supports ATSC and clear QAM. Works great.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roger Blake (Change "invalid" to "com" for email. Google Groups killfiled.)

"Climate policy has almost nothing to do anymore with environmental
protection... the next world climate summit in Cancun is actually
an economy summit during which the distribution of the world's
resources will be negotiated." -- Ottmar Edenhofer, IPCC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Adam H. Kerman]

Roger Blake <rogb...@iname.invalid> wrote:

>I bought one just about a year and a half ago, a Toshiba combo VCR/DVD
>recorder with digital tuner. Both the VCR and DVD can record from the
>digital tuner, which supports ATSC and clear QAM. Works great.

What do you do for listings, or can it pick up the in-band listings on
some channels and index them?

Anyone make a CableCARD receiver with DVR in a consumer model?

[Roger Blake]

On 2012-05-04, Adam H. Kerman <a...@chinet.com> wrote:
> What do you do for listings, or can it pick up the in-band listings on
> some channels and index them?

For listings I just go to the TV section of the newspaper.

Prior to purchasing this unit I used Zinwell DTV converters that
have built-in timers for recording use. Unfortunately the timers
tend to be a bit unstable on those, every once in a while they'll
start selecting the wrong channels or stop working entirely.

The Toshiba VCR with digital tuner on the other hand has been 100%
reliable. For anyone interested, it is a Toshiba model DVR670. A
quick web search shows it to be discontinued now but it may be
possible to find someplace with old stock or maybe a used one.
JVC makes (or made) A similar unit, the model DR-MV150B.

[TJ]

On 05/04/2012 08:45 AM, Roger Blake wrote:
> On 2012-05-04, Adam H. Kerman<a...@chinet.com> wrote:
>> What do you do for listings, or can it pick up the in-band listings on
>> some channels and index them?
>
> For listings I just go to the TV section of the newspaper.
>
> Prior to purchasing this unit I used Zinwell DTV converters that
> have built-in timers for recording use. Unfortunately the timers
> tend to be a bit unstable on those, every once in a while they'll
> start selecting the wrong channels or stop working entirely.
>
> The Toshiba VCR with digital tuner on the other hand has been 100%
> reliable. For anyone interested, it is a Toshiba model DVR670. A
> quick web search shows it to be discontinued now but it may be
> possible to find someplace with old stock or maybe a used one.
> JVC makes (or made) A similar unit, the model DR-MV150B.
>

The TV section of our newspaper doesn't list all OTA channels, except
for PBS, and if you happen to be lucky enough to receive channels
outside what the paper considers "local," you don't see those, either.

I use zap2it.com. I have a customized page bookmarked with a six-hour
grid of all the channels I can receive, and I can look ahead up to two
weeks. It gives brief descriptions, too - something our paper quit
printing to save money. Of course, if you are using the listings to
trigger the timer rather than time-of-day, that won't work for you.

The Zinwell timer is stable enough - it's the clock and channel list
that aren't. The built-in clock has a tendency to drift, and if using
the PSIP data instead, you are at the mercy of the accuracy of each TV
station. In addition, there's a serious firmware Daylight Saving time
bug that has to be watched for. As for the channel list, if you happen
to tune into a channel that's off the air for some reason, the Zinwell
automagically takes it off the list, and shifts the list accordingly.
The timer selects from list position rather than channel ID, even though
the user selects from channel ID, so will then time it to a different
channel than the one you selected. While they are a big PITA, these
problems can be worked around once you understand what is happening.

But to my knowledge the Zinwell only works with OTA, so will not help
the OP in any case.

TJ

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per Elmo P. Shagnasty:

>> Is Media Center built in to Win 7?
>

>all but home basic, yes.

I just found it on a 7 laptop I have access to.

Aside from the UI being irritating (the mouseovers, the
dumbed-down huge graphics...) it seems to have the basic
functionality that somebody who wants a DVR replacement would
want.

Maybe there's even an alternative UI a-la the "Classic" overlay
for Windows 7.

I'm about to try to make my Boxee act as a media extender for it.
--
Pete Cresswell

[Adam H. Kerman]

Elmo P. Shagnasty <el...@nastydesigns.com> wrote:

>And because what you really meant was "DVD recorder" instead of "DVR", I
>will point out that Windows Media Center can put the recordings onto DVD
>natively.

Well, no, I wasn't asking about DVD recorders. I own one with TiVo Series2
built in, the Toshiba model, analog tuner.

[J G Miller]

On Friday, May 4th, 2012, at 12:45:05h +0000, Roger Blake wrote:

> On 2012-05-04, Adam H. Kerman <a...@chinet.com> wrote:
>> What do you do for listings, or can it pick up the in-band listings on
>> some channels and index them?
>
> For listings I just go to the TV section of the newspaper.

Ever considered installing xmltv and using one of their grabbers?

[Jim Wilkins]

"Adam H. Kerman" <a...@chinet.com> wrote in message
news:jnviek$l2a$1...@news.albasani.net...

> What do you do for listings, or can it pick up the in-band listings
> on

> some channels and index them?...

http://www.titantv.com/default.aspx/

jsw

[Adam H. Kerman]

Adam H. Kerman <a...@chinet.com> wrote:
>Roger Blake <rogb...@iname.invalid> wrote:

>>I bought one just about a year and a half ago, a Toshiba combo VCR/DVD
>>recorder with digital tuner. Both the VCR and DVD can record from the
>>digital tuner, which supports ATSC and clear QAM. Works great.

>What do you do for listings, or can it pick up the in-band listings on
>some channels and index them?

You're all missing the point of the question I asked about listings. DVRs
are painful to use without listing information. It's not so much that listings
make it easier to set up recordings. It's trying to keep track of what was
recorded.

Some broadcast channels (I've not seen this on satellite channels as often)
have in-band programming information, limited to nothing more than series
title and episode. Sometimes a very brief description is included.

If a DVR without a listing service captured this information and indexed
it, it would make it easier to keep track of what was recorded.

[Roger Blake]

On 2012-05-04, TJ <T...@noneofyour.business> wrote:
> The TV section of our newspaper doesn't list all OTA channels, except
> for PBS, and if you happen to be lucky enough to receive channels
> outside what the paper considers "local," you don't see those, either.

Has not been a problem here, the paper lists all the channels that
we can receive. Additionally for direct viewing we use Digitalstream
converters which have a program guide available, though it is limited
to the current day.

> bug that has to be watched for. As for the channel list, if you happen
> to tune into a channel that's off the air for some reason, the Zinwell
> automagically takes it off the list, and shifts the list accordingly.

I've seen that kind of behavior, but also have had situations where
the unit simply ignores the schedule altogether and does not turn
itself on. A few times I've done factory resets to get the timers
working again.

I also have some DTV-Pal converters here, but got so disgusted with all the
problems and the runarounds from Dish Network that even after finally
receiving units with allegedly "fixed" firmware under warranty (a real
battle) I just put them in a corner to gather dust. That is one company
I will never, ever do business with again.

> But to my knowledge the Zinwell only works with OTA, so will not help
> the OP in any case.

Yes, it's for ATSC only.

[Ant]

On 5/4/2012 1:47 PM PT, Roger Blake typed:

> I also have some DTV-Pal converters here, but got so disgusted with all the
> problems and the runarounds from Dish Network that even after finally
> receiving units with allegedly "fixed" firmware under warranty (a real
> battle) I just put them in a corner to gather dust. That is one company
> I will never, ever do business with again.

Everyone had that problem with those cheap converter boxes. Horrible.
However, DVR was much better but it still has a few minor annoying bugs.
The company stopped supporting it like after a year and its support kept
thinking I had a DVR. Lame.
--
"It's kind of an insane case ... 6,000 ants dressed up as rice and
robbed a Chinese restaurant." --Steven Wright

[Ant]

On 5/4/2012 11:40 AM PT, Adam H. Kerman typed:

>> What do you do for listings, or can it pick up the in-band listings on
>> some channels and index them?
>
> You're all missing the point of the question I asked about listings. DVRs
> are painful to use without listing information. It's not so much that listings
> make it easier to set up recordings. It's trying to keep track of what was
> recorded.
>
> Some broadcast channels (I've not seen this on satellite channels as often)
> have in-band programming information, limited to nothing more than series
> title and episode. Sometimes a very brief description is included.
>
> If a DVR without a listing service captured this information and indexed
> it, it would make it easier to keep track of what was recorded.

Really? I don't rely on my DVRs (computers and DTV Pal DVR) for their TV
guides. I am so used to VCRs to record things manually, I just use the
Internet to check for new episodes and then manually set them including
their titles (usually show/series title and S#E#; date and times are
already set from my schedulers). It doesn't bother me much. I only do
this once a week like on Sunday nights. Some channels don't even give
details until a day or two in advanced like KTTV in Los Angeles/L.A. :(
--
"It doesn't matter what your D&D manual says, you did not get 5
experience points for killing the giant ant in your kitchen." --BBspot's
Geek Horoscopes (7/30/2004)

[Gene E. Bloch]

What you call the "dumbed-down huge graphics" are designed to be seen on
your TV set from across the room...

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

[Adam H. Kerman]

Ant <a...@zimage.comANT> wrote:
>On 5/4/2012 11:40 AM PT, Adam H. Kerman typed:

>>>What do you do for listings, or can it pick up the in-band listings on
>>>some channels and index them?

>>You're all missing the point of the question I asked about listings. DVRs
>>are painful to use without listing information. It's not so much that
>>listings make it easier to set up recordings. It's trying to keep track
>>of what was recorded.

>>Some broadcast channels (I've not seen this on satellite channels as often)
>>have in-band programming information, limited to nothing more than series
>>title and episode. Sometimes a very brief description is included.

>>If a DVR without a listing service captured this information and indexed
>>it, it would make it easier to keep track of what was recorded.

>Really? I don't rely on my DVRs (computers and DTV Pal DVR) for their TV
>guides. I am so used to VCRs to record things manually, I just use the
>Internet to check for new episodes and then manually set them including
>their titles (usually show/series title and S#E#; date and times are
>already set from my schedulers). It doesn't bother me much. I only do
>this once a week like on Sunday nights. Some channels don't even give
>details until a day or two in advanced like KTTV in Los Angeles/L.A. :(

How do you set the titles? Do you have the ability to create your own
index and associate an entry with a specific recording?

Videocassettes had labels. As long as I remembered to write down what
I'd recorded, I didn't have problems.

[Ant]

On 5/4/2012 3:05 PM PT, Adam H. Kerman typed:

>>>> What do you do for listings, or can it pick up the in-band listings on
>>>> some channels and index them?
>
>>> You're all missing the point of the question I asked about listings. DVRs
>>> are painful to use without listing information. It's not so much that
>>> listings make it easier to set up recordings. It's trying to keep track
>>> of what was recorded.
>
>>> Some broadcast channels (I've not seen this on satellite channels as often)
>>> have in-band programming information, limited to nothing more than series
>>> title and episode. Sometimes a very brief description is included.
>
>>> If a DVR without a listing service captured this information and indexed
>>> it, it would make it easier to keep track of what was recorded.
>
>> Really? I don't rely on my DVRs (computers and DTV Pal DVR) for their TV
>> guides. I am so used to VCRs to record things manually, I just use the
>> Internet to check for new episodes and then manually set them including
>> their titles (usually show/series title and S#E#; date and times are
>> already set from my schedulers). It doesn't bother me much. I only do
>> this once a week like on Sunday nights. Some channels don't even give
>> details until a day or two in advanced like KTTV in Los Angeles/L.A. :(
>
> How do you set the titles? Do you have the ability to create your own
> index and associate an entry with a specific recording?

On my computers, very easy. On DTV Pal DVR, I have to do it after
recordings. However, DTV Pal DVR autoadds the titles whenever it starts
recording. I usually do it five minutes before the time to avoid missing
anything so it audoadds the title from before the time. So, I am forced
to delete and add my own.

> Videocassettes had labels. As long as I remembered to write down what
> I'd recorded, I didn't have problems.

Heh, yeah I usually just rewind my VHS tapes after I finish watching my
recordings. I rarely keep my recordings. If they are important, then
they go to a different tape. On DVRs and computers' HDDs, I just keep
them until I need more disk space/room.
--
"... Let's go pour these (peas from a can) onto an anthill I've found."
--Strong Bad (Witness the Cheatar! episode)

[Steve Fenwick]

In article <jns0k0$ko6$1...@dont-email.me>, J G Miller <mil...@yoyo.ORG>
wrote:

> On Wednesday, May 2nd, 2012, at 09:27:40h -0700, AJL wrote:
>
> > Yes that's the kind of watch. You had to push a button to light up the
> > LED display.
>
> If I recall correctly, Kojak had one. ;)

My "daily driver" watch is a TI red LED model that I bought back in 1978
or 1979. Still works great.

Steve

--
steve <at> w0x0f <dot> com
"Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of
arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to
skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, sidecar in the other, body thoroughly
used up, totally worn out and screaming "WOO HOO what a ride!"

[Michael Black]

On Fri, 4 May 2012, Steve Fenwick wrote:

> In article <jns0k0$ko6$1...@dont-email.me>, J G Miller <mil...@yoyo.ORG>
> wrote:
>
>> On Wednesday, May 2nd, 2012, at 09:27:40h -0700, AJL wrote:
>>
>>> Yes that's the kind of watch. You had to push a button to light up the
>>> LED display.
>>
>> If I recall correctly, Kojak had one. ;)
>
> My "daily driver" watch is a TI red LED model that I bought back in 1978
> or 1979. Still works great.
>

My first digital watch was a TI plastic cased LED watch, from the fall of
1976 (or perhaps the fall of 77). It was cheap at the time, but about
fifty dollars Canadian, the beginning push to make digital watches cheap.

It lasted not that long. I had it in my pocket for some reason, and I was
mowing the lawn and after I'd finished, I realized the watch wasn't in the
pocket. It had fallen out, and gone through the lawn mower.

I replaced it with another TI LED watch, a metal cased one that was at a
clearance price. I used that for a few years, until the battery wore out
and I decided I'd get a Casio LCD watch, about 1980.

I still have the metal TI LED. A couple of years ago, I decided to get it
running again, show it off to the kids. So I got a battery, but in trying
to put it in, the metal that holds the battery in came off, and I'm not
sure how it is supposed to go. So still it sits there.

For a few years in the 1990s I kept finding LED scientific calculators, no
HP35 (I remember when those came out) but somewhat later models, too
expensive for me to afford when they came out. I haven't seen any of
those in a long time, and I've never seen an LED watch at a garage sale,
and I've been going to those for about 20 years.

Michael

[JRStern]

On Tue, 1 May 2012 18:07:36 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
<murat...@gmail.com> wrote:

>A WD My Essentials 2T died on me a few months ago, 3 months out of the
>1-year warranty. As a loyal customer they will sell me another for
>$159.
>
>HDTune showed the growing bad block problem soon enough for me to back
>up most of the files, HDTV recordings of low value. The drive had been
>written ONE time. It had cost $89 at Walmart on Thanksgiving 2010,
>before the floods in Thailand hurt production.
>
>The replacements are 2T Seagates, $109.99 each from Staples. More
>often they are $129. The reviews are somewhat more favorable unless
>you have a Mac.

Gack.

I was going to say one might consider them as consumables, but I think
I'd like it to make MTTF a year or two, even so.

My non-DVR cable box seems to blow about once a year, fwiw. Cable
company seems unimpressed, they just swap in a new one.

J.

[~consul]

'tis on this 5/3/2012 8:29 PM, wrote Adam H. Kerman thus to say:
> Roger Blake<rogb...@iname.invalid> wrote:
>> I bought one just about a year and a half ago, a Toshiba combo VCR/DVD
>> recorder with digital tuner. Both the VCR and DVD can record from the
>> digital tuner, which supports ATSC and clear QAM. Works great.
> What do you do for listings, or can it pick up the in-band listings on
> some channels and index them?

I gotta check when i get home, but I coulda swore that there were listings on it after I did a scan.
--
"... respect, all good works are not done by only good folk. For here, at the end of all things, we shall do what needs to be done."
--till next time, consul -x- <<poetry.dolphins-cove.com>>