AOQ Firefly Review 9: "Ariel"
Arbitrar Of Quality
Season One, Episode 9: "Ariel"
(or "...And you will know us by the trail of red")
Writer: José Molina
Director: Alan Kroeker
When I sat down to watch "Ariel," I was, as I often am, quite tired.
After the episode ended, I felt pretty exhilarated. "Ariel" tends to
have that effect. _Firefly_ didn't really run long enough to have a
peak or a central moment to the extent that some shows do, but I
always think of the pairing of "Airel" and "War Stories" as the core
of the series. It's when stuff happens, and the phrase "on Ariel"
will get plenty of use (relatively speaking; the series doesn't back-
reference very often) in the episodes to come. It's not the seventh
episode, but if this were _Buffy_, it totally would be.
There's a sense of inevitability to this incident, which begins in the
midst of standard banter ("well it beats just sitting." "It *is* just
sitting"). Then River grabs herself a knife and slices Jayne up.
Double-take time. And explains herself only by "he looks better in
red," as if it's the most natural thing in the world. As Mal
surmises, she's getting worse, and this series-long issue is not going
to go away on its own, however wishful one's thinking may be. I
remember how much I took it for granted that she'd have to gradually
stabilize, taking her at her word from "Safe," but now the viewer
understands that this was bound to occur eventually. One has to feel
for Simon here, trying to keep things from spiraling out of control,
and a little grateful to Mal for his support in public and his harsh-
sounding but rationally plain-spoken negotiation in private. The
doctor re-emerges as once again a would-be criminal mastermind,
busting out a plan that's detailed enough (and involves obtaining the
payment as well as the goods) that he had to have been keeping in
reserve in case of emergency. Thinking retrospectively, again, this
had to happen sooner or later. All it needed was the right confluence
of River losing control and proximity to a core planet.
Something William has pointed out which I never would've noticed on my
own is that perhaps the reason Jayne looks better in red is that he
was wearing a particular color originally - it was a Blue Sun shirt,
the same logo River defaced from the food cans in "Shindig." Even
when building the story to one climax, Joss and company are setting up
a fresh string of clues that could one day lead somewhere. Have I
mentioned that I love this show?
So the first half resolves into primarily yet another heist show... I
wonder if _Firefly_ was exciting to anyone who'd worked on the vampire
shows because there was finally a premise that'd lend itself to doing
this kind of thing regularly (Wash: "You know, it's all very sweet;
stealing from the rich, selling to the poor..."). Also a little bit of
a look at a bona fide core planet, but it's more about the venom with
which Mal and Zoe react to it. So since it's an involved plan that
involves multiple steps, the episode wisely settles on a tone
throughout that's very brisk, always moving no matter how heavy it
gets. I think it's more entertaining than most capers. A bit that's
now one of my favorite Kaylee moments that hadn't registered much
until this viewing: "Figures. First time on a core and what do I get
to do? Look through trash. Couldn't he send me shopping at the
Triplex, or... oooh! Synchronizers!" Hee.
I also like the exchange between the siblings as they're about to go
under. Simon lapses into talking to River like a child (an easy thing
to do) and she makes it clear that she understands what's going on
medically, but still has the same kind of panic with regard to going
to sleep. Throughout the episode, I was trying to get a read on how
much River understands of the chaos around, particularly in light of
her still unexplained erratic abilities. My other comment on River is
that the part where Simon steps in and takes charge of the near-death
patient is a bit silly plot-wise, but it's something he has to do, and
River seems so proud of him. Most of her dialogue is the usual
cryptic poetry, but Glau does a lot with the facial expressions this
week.
Speaking of doing a lot, Edmonson may have outdone himself with this
week's soundtrack, which is another classic, as he continues to
produce some of the best incidental music this side of Yoko Kanno.
This is more about tense but cautious navigation through glittering
sterile corridors than rambling journeys across the frontier, and the
music delivers - my favorite use is probably the first time they enter
the hospital, but it's all good.
The briskness means that bits of humor are sprinkled throughout the
episode, particularly when we're following Mal, and it's snappy enough
that I can enjoy it (even if defibrillator paddles really shouldn't
work as a precision knock-out-the-guard tool). If one is pointing to
the way _Firefly_ derives humor from naturalistic absurdity, a
highlight of the entire series is Mal, Zoe, and Jayne struggling to
learn how to present their case. The actors were presumably stretched
to their limits and forced to go outside anything from their own
experiences when playing the role of actors trying to learn their
technobabble lines. Seriously, though, they sell the frustration in a
way I can only call "delightful." In typical ME style, José is
actually setting us up for a killer payoff once they're finally in the
hospital, with a lesson about how amusing over-scripting can be.
I don't think it's an accident that Jayne's funniest moment comes so
close to the point when the show reveals that he's introduced an
unforeseen complication into the crew's plan. And from here on,
"Ariel" is never not exciting. Not a surprise, strictly speaking, but
I found it to be a rather crushing (in a good way) disappointment to
me the first time around, since Jayne was winning me over. And they
keep cutting back to him pondering, letting us hope maybe he'll think
twice. I guess I hoped his experiences in "Jaynestown" would somehow
make things different instead of pushing him further into his
antihero's lifestyle. This was inevitable too, both with surprisingly
non-telegraphed setup here (the touch-screen, "as long as I get paid
I'm happy") and with the fact that the show has reminded us several
times that if the money got good enough, things could get
interestin'. As Pavel Chekov said, if you introduce a loaded chicken
in episode one...
The other thing "Ariel" does, despite its pretty title, is make wanton
cruelty seem like pretty satisfying revenge. Jayne being betrayed by
his own instrument of betrayal and ending up in the same position as
the Tams is fitting. Despite the stock image (and the over-the-top
fancy killin' device), the smug Alliance headhunter cluelessly running
afoul of the blue-handed pair feels like his just deserts. And of
course back on the ship, we'll make Jayne suffer more, and it couldn't
happen to a nicer guy. With regard to the captivity portions, Simon
seems a little too gushingly hero-worship for my taste, but a more
Simon moment comes when they have a chance to escape, and have to take
out their captors. Jayne's like an enraged animal fighting for his
life, River seems traumatized by all the stimuli, but Simon keeps his
head and does the distasteful things that he feels has to be done; he
can be a killer, but always operating from fear and necessity rather
than anger.
It's odd how little of an effect this ends up having on the series on
a literal sense. Jayne, Simon, and River are all still crew members.
The former is still a money-grubber, and the lattermost is still crazy
(although to the first-time viewer, there's the possibility that this
will start to fix her). We know how she was damaged, but not what the
consequences are. The blue-handed guys are still hunting. Still, as
long as we've put our characters through a lot, it feels like we've
gone somewhere.
Time hanging out on newsgroups has made certain things jump out to me
more. There's a definite policy statement being made that goes beyond
the literal story towards the end: "I got pinched!" "Which is what
*happens* when you call the feds." I don't feel like discussing at
length whether or not this represents the opinion of the show and/or
its creators, but it definitely represents Mal's. Moving on, his fake
attempt to kill Jayne is, in a sense, a cop-out for both the
characters and the viewer. Taken strictly in terms of what happens,
it amounts to a stern warning ("I know I said no one double-crosses me
and mine. But I'll let you off this time. If it ever happens
again...") But the execution of the sequence is done intensely enough
that it works, and works well. Praising the acting once again,
particularly the non-verbal, Fillion is practically smoldering with
rage as he clocks Jayne with the wrench, and that fire is what carries
the scene and makes the viewer buy into it. One wonders whether
Jayne's initial denial or his dying wish has an impact on how our hero
ultimately behaves. And of course whether Mr. Cobb having the fear of
death put into him is change, or just self-preservation. Finally, Mal
closes with this ultimatum: "The next time you decide to stab me in
the back, have the guts to do it to my face." Which doesn't even make
sense (at least when taken literally rather contextually). But he
plays it straight with such conviction that it seems like a strong
line to close the scene on anyway. What could be more _Firefly_ than
a contradiction like that?
That closing bit makes me melt a little, with the fade-out on the
siblings' faces rather than the injection. "It's time to wake up."
Yay for Mutant Enemy employing DS9 alums, director Alan Kroker in this
case. He's also another of the increasing ranks of ME people who've
worked on _24_.
Ron Glass does not appear in "Ariel." And Inara gets one of those
"leave at the beginning of the show, come back at the end" things that
I honestly expected the series to do more often (like it looked like
it was going to do in "Jaynestown").
So...
One-sentence summary: An adrenaline-charged thrill ride for the whole
family!
AOQ rating: Excellent
[Ratings so far:
1) "Serenity" - Excellent
2) "The Train Job" - Good
3) "Bushwhacked" - Decent
4) "Shindig" - Good
5) "Safe" - Decent
6) "Our Mrs. Reynolds" - Good
7) "Jaynestown" - Excellent
8) "Out Of Gas" - Good
9) "Ariel" - Excellent]
Don Sample
Arbitrar Of Quality <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
> FIREFLY
> Season One, Episode 9: "Ariel"
> (or "...And you will know us by the trail of red")
> Writer: José Molina
> Director: Alan Kroeker
>
> A bit that's
> now one of my favorite Kaylee moments that hadn't registered much
> until this viewing: "Figures. First time on a core and what do I get
> to do? Look through trash. Couldn't he send me shopping at the
> Triplex, or... oooh! Synchronizers!" Hee.
Also, that she picks up a compression coil catalyzer, looks at it, and
then throws it away. (I guess she's already stocked up on spares for
that part.)
--
Quando omni flunkus moritati
Visit the Buffy Body Count at <http://homepage.mac.com/dsample/>
mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges
> that the part where Simon steps in and takes charge of the near-death
> patient is a bit silly plot-wise, but it's something he has to do, and
> River seems so proud of him. Most of her dialogue is the usual
> cryptic poetry, but Glau does a lot with the facial expressions this
> week.
simon acts on his conscience
as dangerous to him and his sister he cannot simply let a man die
and jayne watches simon do an idiot thing just to do the right thing
> experiences when playing the role of actors trying to learn their
> technobabble lines. Seriously, though, they sell the frustration in a
> way I can only call "delightful." In typical ME style, José is
> actually setting us up for a killer payoff once they're finally in the
> hospital, with a lesson about how amusing over-scripting can be.
poor jayne all dressed up and no whgere to speak his lines
so he has to blurt them out anyway
> out their captors. Jayne's like an enraged animal fighting for his
> life, River seems traumatized by all the stimuli, but Simon keeps his
> head and does the distasteful things that he feels has to be done; he
> can be a killer, but always operating from fear and necessity rather
> than anger.
i thought simon didnt kill anyone
but that he throttled his guard just enough to pass him out
but the guard wouldve survived if not for blue hands two by two
> particularly the non-verbal, Fillion is practically smoldering with
> rage as he clocks Jayne with the wrench, and that fire is what carries
> the scene and makes the viewer buy into it. One wonders whether
> Jayne's initial denial or his dying wish has an impact on how our hero
> ultimately behaves. And of course whether Mr. Cobb having the fear of
jaynes final wish that mal lie about what he did
means that jayne was ashamed
shame means a conscience and a morality
and a person with morals just might do the right thing
rather than the convenient thing
which means jayne can be trusted
at least a little
and in getting betrayed by alliance so not going there again
adds to his trustworthiness
meow arf meow - they are performing horrible experiments in space
major grubert is watching you - beware the bakalite
impeach the bastard - the airtight garage has you neo
George W Harris
and on subsequent viewings, although it lacks some of
the depth found in episodes such as "Jaynestown" and
"Objects in Space". "Ariel" belongs to the Hollywood
subgenre known as the caper flick, and I am a sucker
for caper flicks.
Caper flicks come in two main varieties: there's
the caper flick where the protagonists are trying to stop
the heist, as in "Die Hard" and "The Taking Of Pelham
1-2-3" and there's the caper flick where the protagonists
are committing the heist, as in "Asphalt Jungle",
"Ocean's 11", "The Italian Job", and "$" (the remake of
"Ocean's 11" (another Soderbergh flick!) with George
Clooney is superior to the Frank Sinatra original, whereas
the original of "The Italian Job" with Michael Caine is
superior to the Mark Wahlberg remake. There's just the
one version of "$", with Warren Beatty and Goldie Hawn,
and "Asphalt Jungle" with Sterling Hayden, Louis Calhern,
Jean Hagen, James Whitmore and Sam Jaffe (with a small
role for Marilyn Monroe) is of course the defining noir
caper flick).
Caper flicks generally follow a basic narrative plan.
When our protagonists are trying to stop the caper, usually
the film starts with the start of the job, and we watch as
our protagonists discover something is wrong, try to figure
out what's going on, and scramble to stop it. When our
protagonists are committing the caper, we usually start with
a reveal of some underlying motivation beyond just the
payoff, go through the planning phase, and then the caper
happens. Invariably some complication arises, and the
crew has to improvise to try to overcome it. The underlying
motivation can be revealed in flashback (as in
"Underneath"), and frequently the planning phase is
presented in a heavily abridged format, to preserve a big
reveal in the actual job (as in "Ocean's 11").
Just as "Our Mrs. Reynolds" was a caper flick of
the first type (although this wasn't apparent until halfway
through), "Ariel" is a caper flick of the second type. We
have the underlying motivation - our Criminal Mastermind
wants to help his sister. We have the planning phase,
presented as a montage with voiceover. We have the job
itself, with it's complication, and the improvisation to
overcome that complication.
And it's the complication that's the heart of the
episode, because, after all, "Firefly" is really about Jayne.
Ever since "Serenity" the episode, "Firefly" has been
setting up Jayne to sell out the Tams; hardly an episode
has gone by (quite possibly no episode has gone by)
without Jayne declaring that Serenity'd be better off
without the doc and his moonbrain sister, pointing out the
wisdom of dumping them on some godforsaken rock, or
noting that there's a lucrative award offered for their
capture. This refrain has been so constant that it's faded
into the ambient noise, which allows the actual betrayal to
be something of a surprise.
This betrayal is allowed somewhat by Mal's
leadership style. We have noted previously that a large
measure of the reason Jayne has developed what loyalty
he has to Mal is that Mal acts with the expectation that
that loyalty will be given. We saw this in "Serenity", with
Jayne being set up as the sniper, and we saw how Jayne
has been affected by it in "Out of Gas" and "Jaynestown".
Mal keeps expecting this same loyalty here, but this time the
money's good enough, and we have a very interesting day.
This expectation of loyalty manifests in Mal
assigning Jayne to escort the Tams while he and Zoe loot
the pharmacy. A cursory analysis might lead one to
conclude that Mal's mistake in assigning Jayne to take
charge of two people he has continually argued to betray
might be because a) his expectation of loyalty has led him
to a false assumption of loyalty, b) he has fallen into the
pattern of teaming up with Zoe for one part of the job while
having Jayne work on his own (as in the confrontation with
Patience in "Serenity", "The Train Job", and the rescue of
the Tams at the end of "Safe"), and c) he has tuned out
Jayne's constant talk of betrayal. However, I believe that
his mistake may have been one of miscalculation rather
than inattention. Mal has shown an occasional ability to
size people up and anticipate their reactions - this was seen
with his initial encounter with Jayne in the "Out of Gas"
flashback and with the lead-up to the confrontation with
Patience in "Serenity" the episode. It may very well be that
Mal's expectation of loyalty from Jayne is a conscious effort
on Mal's part to cultivate actual loyalty. If this is the case,
then it could very well be that Mal considered the possibility
that Jayne would betray the Tams, but had to weight that
against the effect it would have on Jayne's loyalty if, by
having either him or Zoe go to the imaging suite while the
other went with Jayne to loot the pharmacy, Mal showed
that he did. not. trust. Jayne. If Mal's trust and expectation
of loyalty over the course of their relationship has
engendered some degree some degree of loyalty from
Jayne, then an open declaration of mistrust could sweep
all of that away, and we'd be back to the Jayne who shot
Marco for a 3% raise and his own bunk. I think the fact that
Mal was so quick to reach the correct conclusion as to what
happened suggests that he had considered the possibility
beforehand.
Or, maybe he did it because if he didn't, we wouldn't
have a story, so the writer wrote it that way.
In any event, we get to the complication. Jayne
calls the feds, they all get pinched, they escape while the
creepy Blue Hand Group slaughter the remaining security
contingent (and just for talking to River! Why would they
kill anyone that heard River speak? What could she possibly
know that poses such a threat?), and they eventually get away.
All pretty much by-the-numbers.
And then we get the denouement, which really makes
this episode stand out. Unlike Arb - can I call you Arb? - I
believe that Mal fully intended to kill Jayne right until the very
end. Mal is loyal to his crew, something which he hasn't made
any effort to hide, and as such, Jayne's protestations that he
only sold out the Tams, he didn't sell Mal out, carries no weight.
Mal has identified himself with his ship and his crew, transferring
his faith from a God that will not let the very pretty die, to the
few people that he knows and loves. For Mal, personal loyalty
is not enough - it is nothing without loyalty to the crew, which he
does not see in Jayne.
Not until the end, when Jayne demonstrates shame.
Just as in "Jaynestown", when Jayne left Stitch Hessian out of
the aircar story in the bar, Jayne cares what the crew thinks.
There, we could ascribe it to how he wants to be treated, but
here, he cares what they will think of them after he's gone, for
he's resigned himself to being sucked out that hole. Mal sees
this as, if not loyalty, then at least potential. It's enough.
So how will this affect Jayne? It can hardly help but
affect him some way. As in Jaynestown, he betrayed someone
on his crew, and as in Jaynestown, he was staring death in the
face as a consequence, and as in Jaynestown, he was saved
at the last second for reasons that he doesn't fully comprehend.
We saw at the end of Jaynestown how those events confused
him, and led him to the strange land of self-examination, but we
haven't seen any real change in his behavior. How will these
events affect him?
Some things to note:
Ariel won't be the last planet we hear of that's named
for a character in "The Tempest". I guess someone in the
Alliance Planning Office was a fan.
In the junkyard, the part that Wash throws that hits
the air ambulance is, in fact, a catalyzer for a compression
coil just like the one that caused so much trouble last
episode.
Once again, we get misinterpreted prescient
statements from River - "I don't want to go back!" - taken by
Simon to mean Serenity when she means the academy.
--
"I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar." -Wash, 'Serenity'
George W. Harris For actual email address, replace each 'u' with an 'i'
Atlas Bugged
news:1177420276.5...@n15g2000prd.googlegroups.com..
>When I sat down to watch "Ariel," I was, as I often am, quite tired.
>After the episode ended, I felt pretty exhilarated.
I was the guy who'd been hit over the head with a sledge-hammer.
I have avoided a lot of TV over quite a few years because I deemed it a
waste of precious time. "Ariel" single-handedly showed me that the medium
could have greatness just like any other art form, such as literature, which
I'd deemed more worthy of my finite stay above-ground.
>"Ariel" tends to have that effect.
"Ariel" is incomparable.
>_Firefly_ didn't really run long enough to have a
>peak or a central moment to the extent that some shows do, but I
>always think of the pairing of "Airel" and "War Stories" as the core
>of the series.
That's my view on the back-to-back "Out Of Gas" and "Ariel."
>I think it's more entertaining than most capers.
It really is. That's because Molina succeeded on several levels. A clever
scheme is ordinarily sufficient for a Good Night of TV. But this was so
much more, and all of it far above the routine.
>My other comment on River is
>that the part where Simon steps in and takes charge of the near-death
>patient is a bit silly plot-wise, but it's something he has to do, and
>River seems so proud of him.
It is about the only colorable mis-step in the story. It's really the one
and only time in "Ariel" where you couold imagine you were just watching a
routine prime-time sort of show. It's not bad at all. When a sequence such
as this is a show's low-point, that's a very, very good thing.
>[...]And from here on,
>"Ariel" is never not exciting.
Yeah.
One of the hallmarks of your reviews is that you take your time and
generally touch all the bases. So my nit-pick for this evening is: You
haven't mentioned the great special-effects eye-candy when Simon gets to the
diagnostic machine and scans River. That's an unforgettable moment in the
history of sci-fi imagery.
>With regard to the captivity portions, Simon
>seems a little too gushingly hero-worship for my taste, but a more
>Simon moment comes when they have a chance to escape, and have to take
>out their captors. Jayne's like an enraged animal fighting for his
>life, River seems traumatized by all the stimuli, but Simon keeps his
>head and does the distasteful things that he feels has to be done; he
>can be a killer, but always operating from fear and necessity rather
>than anger.
Well-said. These characters are *tangible.* Simon is a doctor, and of a
"formal" upbringing, with fancy principles and hippocratic oath. But he's
driven to act like a bloodthirsty animal when his highest value is at stake.
Brilliant characterization.
>[Jayne] is still a money-grubber
Ooops! Not quite. Yes and no. There's been change.
>Time hanging out on newsgroups has made certain things jump out to me
>more. There's a definite policy statement being made that goes beyond
>the literal story towards the end: "I got pinched!" "Which is what
>*happens* when you call the feds." I don't feel like discussing at
>length whether or not this represents the opinion of the show and/or
>its creators, but it definitely represents Mal's.
I have made very firm assertions regarding these matters, and I stand by
them. Glad to see you at least concede the element in Mal. But we knew
this was going to be a show about justice, and we knew Minear was pulling
some strings the moment Crow found himself pureed in a jet-intake.
This is not your father's sci-fi.
>Moving on, his fake
>attempt to kill Jayne is, in a sense, a cop-out for both the
>characters and the viewer.
I disagree that it has ever been established to be "fake." Jayne said
certain things. Had he said other things, I believe he'd have been out the
airlock. Crow, too, could have had a different fate.
>Taken strictly in terms of what happens,
>it amounts to a stern warning ("I know I said no one double-crosses me
>and mine. But I'll let you off this time. If it ever happens
>again...") But the execution of the sequence is done intensely enough
>that it works, and works well. Praising the acting once again,
>particularly the non-verbal, Fillion is practically smoldering with
>rage as he clocks Jayne with the wrench, and that fire is what carries
>the scene and makes the viewer buy into it. One wonders whether
>Jayne's initial denial or his dying wish has an impact on how our hero
>ultimately behaves.
I have no question that this is the case.
It's possible this was Mal trying to "teach Jayne a lesson," but I think
that's a different show.
In the FIREFLY universe, one among the key messages is that actions have
consequences and the Universe Definitely Does Not Give A Shit.
Or as Gregory House, M.D., says in the similar context of that show, "I
prefer to think that life is not a rehearsal."
>One-sentence summary: An adrenaline-charged thrill ride for the whole
>family!
Perhaps I'm missing your sarcasm, but I deem it an adrenaline-charged thrill
ride for adults only.
We all want forgiveness, compassion, baby Jesus, and warm-and-fuzzy.
The Whedon/Minear/Molina response? Horseshit. Get it right, or FOAD.
Reality - what a bummer!
Atlas Bugged, 4/24/2007 6:43:08 PM
--
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http://snipurl.com/k8ui "One page, all you need to know, referenced."
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better."
GOODBYE, SG-1
http://snipurl.com/1d8kw "Homage to the legend w/ last ep comments, no
spoilers."
TROLL/RATS:
http://snipurl.com/19k1q "Referenced guide to stinkers that hide."
Apteryx
>FIREFLY
>Season One, Episode 9: "Ariel"
>So the first half resolves into primarily yet another heist show... I
>wonder if _Firefly_ was exciting to anyone who'd worked on the vampire
>shows because there was finally a premise that'd lend itself to doing
>this kind of thing regularly (Wash: "You know, it's all very sweet;
>stealing from the rich, selling to the poor...").
Great expression of a potential mission statement
>her still unexplained erratic abilities. My other comment on River is
>that the part where Simon steps in and takes charge of the near-death
>patient is a bit silly plot-wise, but it's something he has to do, and
>River seems so proud of him.
As well as making River proud, which is a worthwhile objective in itself, it
also makes it clear to the audience that Simon really is top flight doctor.
Just in time for us to see he can also be a killer. Plus we get another
insight into River's talent -
Simon: No one is going to die.
River: He is.
>"Ariel" is never not exciting. Not a surprise, strictly speaking, but
>I found it to be a rather crushing (in a good way) disappointment to
>me the first time around, since Jayne was winning me over. And they
>keep cutting back to him pondering, letting us hope maybe he'll think
>twice. I guess I hoped his experiences in "Jaynestown" would somehow
>make things different instead of pushing him further into his
>antihero's lifestyle.
A good lesson against too easy redemptions. I'm sure the lessons of
Jaynestown are not lost on Jayne, but its too soon and not enough to turn
him into a reliable guy right away. People are harder to turn around than
ocean liners, though like ocean liners, they can be turned around
eventually.
> This was inevitable too, both with surprisingly
>non-telegraphed setup here (the touch-screen, "as long as I get paid
>I'm happy") and with the fact that the show has reminded us several
>times that if the money got good enough, things could get
>interestin'. As Pavel Chekov said, if you introduce a loaded chicken
>in episode one...
Well he would know (chickens, of course, being a Russian inwention).
>The other thing "Ariel" does, despite its pretty title, is make wanton
>cruelty seem like pretty satisfying revenge. Jayne being betrayed by
>his own instrument of betrayal and ending up in the same position as
>the Tams is fitting. Despite the stock image (and the over-the-top
>fancy killin' device), the smug Alliance headhunter cluelessly running
>afoul of the blue-handed pair feels like his just deserts.
Dramatically satisfying, but beyond silly if taken for real. How long do a
secret orgainisation's secret ops stay secret if they use their own unique
weapons to kill their victims? In a hospital?
And while I don't mean to teach the Blue Gloves their job, might not killing
the people who gave you a tip-off have a deleterious effect on information
gathering in future?
>will start to fix her). We know how she was damaged, but not what the
>consequences are.
We know she can't control her feelings (supposedly because her amygdala was
removed, which, as wikipedia is our guide, might be expected to have the
opposite effect - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amygdala) so the consequences
would appear to be potentially drastic.
>Time hanging out on newsgroups has made certain things jump out to me
>its creators, but it definitely represents Mal's. Moving on, his fake
>attempt to kill Jayne is, in a sense, a cop-out for both the
>characters and the viewer. Taken strictly in terms of what happens,
>it amounts to a stern warning ("I know I said no one double-crosses me
>and mine. But I'll let you off this time. If it ever happens
>again...") But the execution of the sequence is done intensely enough
>that it works, and works well.
He convinced me it wasn't a fake. I think Jayne would be wise not to assume
it was.
>So...
>One-sentence summary: An adrenaline-charged thrill ride for the whole
>family!
>AOQ rating: Excellent
I'd only go as far as Good. It's fun and all, and important for the show,
but no more than that. For me its the 7th best FF episode. I give it the
same rating as the 25th best AtS episode (Why We Fight), and it falls
between the 64th and 65th best BtVS episodes, Flooded and Seeing Red.
--
Apteryx
George W Harris
wrote:
:As well as making River proud, which is a worthwhile objective in itself, it
:also makes it clear to the audience that Simon really is top flight doctor.
:Just in time for us to see he can also be a killer.
Just a quibble, Simon isn't a killer. Jayne killed the
guard he fought, but Simon only rendered his unconscious.
When the BHG showed up in the holding cell, they checked
the guards, and the only reason they would have for taking
out the Lightsticks of Death is if one of the guards was alive.
Jayne snapped his guard's neck, ergo Simon's guard was
still alive.
--
Doesn't the fact that there are *exactly* 50 states seem a little suspicious?
Apteryx
news:jf0u23ppho4iick3n...@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 25 Apr 2007 18:25:40 +1200, "Apteryx" <apt...@xtra.co.nz>
> wrote:
>
> :As well as making River proud, which is a worthwhile objective in itself,
> it
> :also makes it clear to the audience that Simon really is top flight
> doctor.
> :Just in time for us to see he can also be a killer.
>
> Just a quibble, Simon isn't a killer. Jayne killed the
> guard he fought, but Simon only rendered his unconscious.
> When the BHG showed up in the holding cell, they checked
> the guards, and the only reason they would have for taking
> out the Lightsticks of Death is if one of the guards was alive.
> Jayne snapped his guard's neck, ergo Simon's guard was
> still alive.
True. And in fact during the hour or so it took me to complete my post,
while distracted by other stuff, the same thought had occurred to me, and I
intended to go back to edit that statement before hitting the "send" button.
But then I got distracted by other other stuff...
--
Apteryx
Donny Macro
"Apteryx" <apt...@xtra.co.nz> wrote in message
news:f0ms95$hpt$1...@aioe.org...
That's for chickens to laugh at.
or in Russian: Eta kuram na smekh
>
>>The other thing "Ariel" does, despite its pretty title, is make wanton
>>cruelty seem like pretty satisfying revenge. Jayne being betrayed by
>>his own instrument of betrayal and ending up in the same position as
>>the Tams is fitting. Despite the stock image (and the over-the-top
>>fancy killin' device), the smug Alliance headhunter cluelessly running
>>afoul of the blue-handed pair feels like his just deserts.
>
> Dramatically satisfying, but beyond silly if taken for real. How long do a
> secret orgainisation's secret ops stay secret if they use their own unique
> weapons to kill their victims? In a hospital?
>
> And while I don't mean to teach the Blue Gloves their job, might not
> killing the people who gave you a tip-off have a deleterious effect on
> information gathering in future?
>
>
>>will start to fix her). We know how she was damaged, but not what the
>>consequences are.
>
> We know she can't control her feelings (supposedly because her amygdala
> was removed, which, as wikipedia is our guide, might be expected to have
> the opposite effect - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amygdala) so the
> consequences would appear to be potentially drastic.
while one person has said:
"The "stripping of amygdala" part makes no sense. Damage to the amygdala
should have messed up River's memories big time. In addition, clinical case
reports show that individuals with injuries to amygdala tend to become
docile with a flat emotional affect, which is the opposite of what is
depicted in River"
I don't think they removed her Amygdala, they "stripped" it, if they removed
it they wouldn't have had to go in and do it "over and over" ... When I
first saw this episode I go the idea of them removing a protective covering
or something... obviously it makes little sense for the real world, and the
original script has it as her "limbic system" that was "stripped"
>
>>Time hanging out on newsgroups has made certain things jump out to me
>>its creators, but it definitely represents Mal's. Moving on, his fake
>>attempt to kill Jayne is, in a sense, a cop-out for both the
>>characters and the viewer. Taken strictly in terms of what happens,
>>it amounts to a stern warning ("I know I said no one double-crosses me
>>and mine. But I'll let you off this time. If it ever happens
>>again...") But the execution of the sequence is done intensely enough
>>that it works, and works well.
>
> He convinced me it wasn't a fake. I think Jayne would be wise not to
> assume it was.
>
I didn't think that was fake, and one person I showed the episodes too just
before we went to see the movie, turned at the point (just before Mal closed
the hatch) and said "how the hell is Jayne in the movie?"
Cruithne3753
Simon seems a little too gushingly hero-worship for my taste,
If you're on about when they were back aboard Serenity, then it seemed
to me that Simon was deliberately bigging up Jayne (not aware at this
point of his betrayal) in order to persuade Jayne to be more accepting
of himself and River.
C.O.Jones
> >fancy killin' device), the smug Alliance headhunter cluelessly running
> >afoul of the blue-handed pair feels like his just deserts.
>
> Dramatically satisfying, but beyond silly if taken for real. How long do a
> secret orgainisation's secret ops stay secret if they use their own unique
> weapons to kill their victims? In a hospital?
>
> And while I don't mean to teach the Blue Gloves their job, might not killing
> the people who gave you a tip-off have a deleterious effect on information
> gathering in future?
Not if you kill everyone, and keep it a secret.
"In a freak accident today, all the security staff of the Ariel
Hospital were killed when an experimental medical device
malfunctioned."
--
////////// \\\\\\\\\\\
The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity.
-- Harlan Ellison
Don Sample
"C.O.Jones" <ap...@solidbrass.com> wrote:
> In article <f0ms95$hpt$1...@aioe.org>, Apteryx <apt...@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
>
> > >fancy killin' device), the smug Alliance headhunter cluelessly running
> > >afoul of the blue-handed pair feels like his just deserts.
> >
> > Dramatically satisfying, but beyond silly if taken for real. How long do a
> > secret orgainisation's secret ops stay secret if they use their own unique
> > weapons to kill their victims? In a hospital?
> >
> > And while I don't mean to teach the Blue Gloves their job, might not
> > killing
> > the people who gave you a tip-off have a deleterious effect on information
> > gathering in future?
>
> Not if you kill everyone, and keep it a secret.
>
> "In a freak accident today, all the security staff of the Ariel
> Hospital were killed when an experimental medical device
> malfunctioned."
Or
The terrorist 'Tam Gang' attempted a ruthless robbery of
critical medical supplies from the Ariel Hospital yesterday.
Several brave security personnel were killed by the terrorists,
who only managed to escape with a few thousand credits worth
of drugs, which were quickly replaced with stocks from
surrounding hospitals. No civilians were injured by the
terrorists, and there were only minor disruptions in hospital
services.
Parliament today has announced a doubling of the reward for
information leading to the apprehension of these terrorists,
but warns that they are extremely dangerous. If any Citizen
believes that they have information about the Tams' location
they should wave the information to..."
drifter
/snippet/
> And while I don't mean to teach the Blue Gloves their job, might not
> killing the people who gave you a tip-off have a deleterious effect
> on information gathering in future?
Only if the tip-givers find out; and if you kill everyone who gives you a
tip, how would the information spread? Although I suppose you might
eventually run out of people to ask questions of.
--
Kel
_______________________________________________________
"Oh, Buffy. You really need to have every square inch of your ass
licked." Darth Willow, kinda gay.
Michael Ikeda
news:f0ms95$hpt$1...@aioe.org:
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1177420276.5...@n15g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>>FIREFLY
>>Season One, Episode 9: "Ariel"
>
>
>>Time hanging out on newsgroups has made certain things jump out
>>to me its creators, but it definitely represents Mal's. Moving
>>on, his fake attempt to kill Jayne is, in a sense, a cop-out for
>>both the characters and the viewer. Taken strictly in terms of
>>what happens, it amounts to a stern warning ("I know I said no
>>one double-crosses me and mine. But I'll let you off this time.
>> If it ever happens again...") But the execution of the
>>sequence is done intensely enough that it works, and works well.
>
> He convinced me it wasn't a fake. I think Jayne would be wise
> not to assume it was.
One sidepoint on this scene. While it didn't seem to matter much to
Mal, Jayne's protestation that he didn't betray Mal may have mattered
to Jayne. Jayne may actually have acquired a sort of genuine loyalty
to Mal, but either hadn't yet extended it to the entire crew or
(perhaps more likely) didn't consider Simon and River to be part of
the crew.
--
Michael Ikeda mmi...@erols.com
"Telling a statistician not to use sampling is like telling an
astronomer they can't say there is a moon and stars"
Lynne Billard, past president American Statistical Association
Julian Treadwell
> One sidepoint on this scene. While it didn't seem to matter much to
> Mal, Jayne's protestation that he didn't betray Mal may have mattered
> to Jayne. Jayne may actually have acquired a sort of genuine loyalty
> to Mal, but either hadn't yet extended it to the entire crew or
> (perhaps more likely) didn't consider Simon and River to be part of
> the crew.
I agree. I think Jane's become a team player since he threw Stitch
Hessian out of a moving plane and shot his previous employer in the leg,
but he reserves the right to decide who's on his team. Simon and River
didn't qualify until the last part of the BDM.
Apteryx
news:dsample-2B4461...@news.giganews.com...
That's just a Government news release - who's going to believe one of them?
There will be orderlies who found the bodies who talk to both to staff who
saw the Academy agents arrive (blue gloves - way to stay inconspicuous) and
to doctors who examined the bodies and who know that death wasn't caused by
regular weapons. And if even one of the security staff mentioned to family
or friends that they had caught the dangerous Tams and top level Alliance
agents were on their way to retrieve them, and they talk to those orderlies,
they'll have the whole picture.
That's still OK for the Alliance if they can prevent the media publishing
anything those people say, and if this is just a one-off. If on the other
hand this is the Blue Gloves normal method of operation, there will ripples
of word of mouth radiating out from every incident they've been involved in.
--
Apteryx
C.O.Jones
wrote:
> Apteryx wrote:
>
> /snippet/
>
> > And while I don't mean to teach the Blue Gloves their job, might not
> > killing the people who gave you a tip-off have a deleterious effect
> > on information gathering in future?
>
> Only if the tip-givers find out; and if you kill everyone who gives you a
> tip, how would the information spread? Although I suppose you might
> eventually run out of people to ask questions of.
Of course, by then one would have all the answers anyway!
Daniel Damouth
> On Wed, 25 Apr 2007 18:25:40 +1200, "Apteryx" <apt...@xtra.co.nz>
> wrote:
>
>:As well as making River proud, which is a worthwhile objective in
>:itself, it also makes it clear to the audience that Simon really
>:is top flight doctor. Just in time for us to see he can also be a
>:killer.
>
> Just a quibble, Simon isn't a killer. Jayne killed the
> guard he fought, but Simon only rendered his unconscious.
Not that Simon wouldn't kill, under the right circumstances, for
River...
-Dan Damouth
One Bit Shy
news:1177420276.5...@n15g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> FIREFLY
> Season One, Episode 9: "Ariel"
> When I sat down to watch "Ariel," I was, as I often am, quite tired.
> After the episode ended, I felt pretty exhilarated. "Ariel" tends to
> have that effect. _Firefly_ didn't really run long enough to have a
> peak or a central moment to the extent that some shows do, but I
> always think of the pairing of "Airel" and "War Stories" as the core
> of the series.
Ariel through Trash is my favorite mini-run of the series, but the single
peak for me is Objects In Space.
> Then River grabs herself a knife and slices Jayne up.
> Double-take time. And explains herself only by "he looks better in
> red," as if it's the most natural thing in the world. As Mal
> surmises, she's getting worse, and this series-long issue is not going
> to go away on its own, however wishful one's thinking may be.
I've been enjoying George W. Harris's commentary about how Firefly is really
about Jayne, but I always watched the series through the window on River,
and things just got more complicated on that front. Her issue certainly
isn't going away on its own, but that issue is a lot bigger than just coping
with a mentally ill girl on board. I like how this episodes shows how River
brings the Alliance closer to them. Even more how she moves them closer to
the Alliance. The caper is risky in its own right, but nothing compared to
what it brushes up against.
Much more so than the series opener, this episode shows how dangerous it is
to Serenity and crew to keep River and Simon on board - how much her
existence there can control their path.
> I
> remember how much I took it for granted that she'd have to gradually
> stabilize, taking her at her word from "Safe," but now the viewer
> understands that this was bound to occur eventually. One has to feel
> for Simon here, trying to keep things from spiraling out of control,
> and a little grateful to Mal for his support in public and his harsh-
> sounding but rationally plain-spoken negotiation in private.
The episode - and series - works hard to get you rooting for River and
approving Mal's decisions regarding her. The underlying issues, however,
aren't that clear cut. It's natural that ethically challenged Jayne would
be the first to reach for a way out - and to grab for the money in doing so.
But he did get knifed by River for no apparent reason, and he's not wrong
when he warns Mal that any of them could be next. He also spoke openly to
Mal of the value in leaving them on Ariel - with or without a reward. It's
not just Jayne's greed and amorality at work in his decision. River's
behavior is a valid reason unto itself.
Even Mal is affected by the situation. I don't think there was a lot of
negotiation going on in that private moment with Simon. I saw it as an
ultimatum. One that Mal really hopes Simon can live up to - Mal wants to
help the two of them - but an ultimatum none the less. It was Simon that
later pushed Mal to a kind of compromise by enlisting him into being part of
the solution. I'm not sure that Mal would have agreed to the caper if it
didn't include helping River. With River included, it gives Mal reason to
avoid ditching Simon and River somewhere. Before that I think Mal saw
himself headed towards Jayne's solution soon enough - albeit without any
kind of reward.
> So the first half resolves into primarily yet another heist show...
Which I love. I'm a sucker for heists. This one is done pretty well -
especially for such a small amount of air time.
> I
> wonder if _Firefly_ was exciting to anyone who'd worked on the vampire
> shows because there was finally a premise that'd lend itself to doing
> this kind of thing regularly (Wash: "You know, it's all very sweet;
> stealing from the rich, selling to the poor...").
I don't know about the others, but definitely yes, for Joss. I smile a
little at the talk of what a great sci-fi setup Firefly is - which it is.
It's just that I'm convinced that the primary purpose of the construct is to
give Joss maximum flexibility to indulge in any kind of story and setting
that comes to mind.
> Also a little bit of
> a look at a bona fide core planet, but it's more about the venom with
> which Mal and Zoe react to it.
Yes. Also note the very particular statement to Jayne at the end that
getting pinched is what happens when you call the feds. From his point of
view, their corruption is implicit in all dealings. They can't deal with
you straight.
Which raises another underlying issue. When Mal nearly kills Jayne at the
end, how much of his motivation is Jayne's dealing with the feds as opposed
to just the personal betrayal of River and Simon? And by extension, how
much of Mal's support of River and Simon is because it's a way of sticking
it to the Alliance?
Mal would likely say that personal loyalty and resisting the Alliance are
the same thing. No difference. You can't have the former without the
latter.
There's truth in such a thought, but likely some rationalization too. Are
the risks he's taking with them really the right thing to do? He seems to
be choosing to ride this tiger and refusing to consider something like
finding a good cave for them to hide in.
> My other comment on River is
> that the part where Simon steps in and takes charge of the near-death
> patient is a bit silly plot-wise, but it's something he has to do, and
> River seems so proud of him.
I don't really like the scene 'cause it's so cliché. Ridiculously so. (I
was waiting for Simon to say, "Damn it! I'm a doctor!" Which I suppose
would at least have given me a laugh.) But River proud of him does make up
for some of it. A lot of River's innocence is displayed this episode. I
love it when she wakes up and says, "Copper for a kiss." I don't know why
she says that, but the look on her face is of such simple happiness that it
melts me.
Anyway, Dr. Tam at work does serve a few functions even with the cliché.
Shows off River's prescience again. Demonstrates the truth of River's
observation that this is where Simon really belongs. (That fact alone is
part of the complexity of the brother/sister relationship. River's pride in
Simon's performance tempered by her knowledge that she's keeping him from
that life.) Perhaps most importantly, the moment serves to contrast Simon's
readiness to kill if he has to for River's sake.
> In typical ME style, José is
> actually setting us up for a killer payoff once they're finally in the
> hospital, with a lesson about how amusing over-scripting can be.
Did you notice that Jayne got the line wrong anyway? And that it still
didn't matter?
> Not a surprise, strictly speaking, but
> I found it to be a rather crushing (in a good way) disappointment to
> me the first time around, since Jayne was winning me over. And they
> keep cutting back to him pondering, letting us hope maybe he'll think
> twice. I guess I hoped his experiences in "Jaynestown" would somehow
> make things different instead of pushing him further into his
> antihero's lifestyle. This was inevitable too, both with surprisingly
> non-telegraphed setup here (the touch-screen, "as long as I get paid
> I'm happy") and with the fact that the show has reminded us several
> times that if the money got good enough, things could get
> interestin'. As Pavel Chekov said, if you introduce a loaded chicken
> in episode one...
All true enough, and really, Jaynestown couldn't be enough on its own.
After all, Jayne got treated as a hero by betraying someone!! The
Jaynestown experience shocked him and left him struggling to understand why
someone would sacrifice himself that way, but the object lesson wasn't
enough. He needed the backside of the object lesson that he got here in
Ariel. Forget the philosophy and ethics for a moment and just see the
practicality that betrayal can have terrible consequences - that the guys
paying you your 30 pieces will turn on you in a flash. Jayne is a simple
man. Sometimes the simple message is best.
Speaking of Jayne, I think it's interesting how freaked out he is by River
this episode. And then to have all those unexplained screams of people
dying in the distance... well, his superstitious side seems to be working
overtime. All in all, a very unsettling day for him.
> The other thing "Ariel" does, despite its pretty title, is make wanton
> cruelty seem like pretty satisfying revenge. Jayne being betrayed by
> his own instrument of betrayal and ending up in the same position as
> the Tams is fitting. Despite the stock image (and the over-the-top
> fancy killin' device), the smug Alliance headhunter cluelessly running
> afoul of the blue-handed pair feels like his just deserts.
One more scene I didn't really like. It seems like he should have struck
out at the device the blue-hand guy was holding - or at least try to get
away. Not terribly important. The creepiness of these guys did get across.
> And of
> course back on the ship, we'll make Jayne suffer more, and it couldn't
> happen to a nicer guy. With regard to the captivity portions, Simon
> seems a little too gushingly hero-worship for my taste, but a more
> Simon moment comes when they have a chance to escape, and have to take
> out their captors. Jayne's like an enraged animal fighting for his
> life, River seems traumatized by all the stimuli, but Simon keeps his
> head and does the distasteful things that he feels has to be done; he
> can be a killer, but always operating from fear and necessity rather
> than anger.
I'll add myself to the list of those saying Simon didn't kill the guard.
Although I'm not sure why the episode didn't have him do it. I think it's
clear that Simon was ready to if he had to. Hmmm. Maybe they decided that
Simon, the good doctor, would let up once the guard was unconscious.
Perhaps killing him in that context would have been too wanton to be true to
his character.
> It's odd how little of an effect this ends up having on the series on
> a literal sense. Jayne, Simon, and River are all still crew members.
> The former is still a money-grubber, and the lattermost is still crazy
> (although to the first-time viewer, there's the possibility that this
> will start to fix her). We know how she was damaged, but not what the
> consequences are. The blue-handed guys are still hunting. Still, as
> long as we've put our characters through a lot, it feels like we've
> gone somewhere.
Hmmm. I suppose Jayne would likely still be greedy, but to the point of
repeating something like this? One would think that, at the least, he'd be
a lot more reluctant in the future. I also think he surely must have
finally heard Mal when he said that attacking anybody on the crew was an
attack on Mal. Whether he truly grasps the sense of team and family
implicit in that remains to be seen, but the whole experience has to be
behavior modifying to him. (Oh, look - a Spike comparison. I'd been
thinking of some others, but that's good enough for now.)
I think this episode also commits Mal to Simon and River an extra layer
deeper - and by extension everybody.
The other way this episode moves things along is by showing us more of the
blue-handed ones and explaining more of what's going on in River. The crew
of Serenity don't know a lot of that - but we do. And even the crew should
eventually be talking with each other about what the sounds of death that
Jayne, River and Simon heard were all about.
> Moving on, his fake
> attempt to kill Jayne is, in a sense, a cop-out for both the
> characters and the viewer.
And I'll add my voice to those saying not fake. Mal didn't decide to let
Jayne live until he showed capacity for shame. A baby step on the path to
Jayne's redemption, but enough for Mal to decide he was worth the effort.
> Taken strictly in terms of what happens,
> it amounts to a stern warning ("I know I said no one double-crosses me
> and mine. But I'll let you off this time. If it ever happens
> again...") But the execution of the sequence is done intensely enough
> that it works, and works well.
Because they both know that Jayne is about to die. They're each surprised
in their way that he gets to live.
> Praising the acting once again,
> particularly the non-verbal, Fillion is practically smoldering with
> rage as he clocks Jayne with the wrench, and that fire is what carries
> the scene and makes the viewer buy into it. One wonders whether
> Jayne's initial denial or his dying wish has an impact on how our hero
> ultimately behaves. And of course whether Mr. Cobb having the fear of
> death put into him is change, or just self-preservation. Finally, Mal
> closes with this ultimatum: "The next time you decide to stab me in
> the back, have the guts to do it to my face." Which doesn't even make
> sense (at least when taken literally rather contextually). But he
> plays it straight with such conviction that it seems like a strong
> line to close the scene on anyway. What could be more _Firefly_ than
> a contradiction like that?
OK... It's an interesting scene that I'm not confident that I fully
understand. (There are a lot of possibilities.) But one thing I note is
Jayne's remark that hey, at least he wasn't betraying Mal. It appears that
until now, Jayne really didn't get that Mal was genuinely dedicated to his
crew. I think he probably gets that now. And upon (very slow) reflection,
he'll probably eventually get that the crew includes him.
The same moment suggests that Jayne did have at least some sense of loyalty
to Mal personally. I'm not sure what exactly that means and am skeptical
that it ran too deep, but something seems to be there.
My more tenuous thought is about Mal's statement, "The next time you decide
to stab me in the back, have the guts to do it to my face." It reminds me a
little of Mal's confrontation with Jayne when the latter offered him Vera.
Initially, Mal seemed to take it as some kind of showdown that he was sort
of expecting. Where I'm going with this is that I think Mal looks at a
direct challenge to him as something different. If Jayne were to, say,
attempt to take charge of the ship by directly taking out Mal, it wouldn't
be good, but it wouldn't be as lowdown as betraying his crew. Does that
make sense? I don't think that it's something that exactly stands up to
logical scrutiny, but there could be an emotional distinction that matters
to Mal.
> So...
> One-sentence summary: An adrenaline-charged thrill ride for the whole
> family!
> AOQ rating: Excellent
My comments about legitimate reasons for Jayne to want to take down Simon
and River, and about Mal being motivated by his anti-Alliance feelings don't
mean that I'm for Jayne or against Mal or River. No, I'm rooting for River
and want Mal to stay true to himself as shown. But I do think the episode
is a little weak at getting across some of the implicit moral ambiguity of
the situation. It's just a tad too emotionally pat for my taste. A tad too
much leading the audience by the nose. That would be my biggest criticism.
None the less, the whole of the episode more than overwhelms such concerns.
(And enough is shown of contrary possibilities to allow me to come up with
those thoughts anyway.) It's mostly a very cool episode and earns an
Excellent from me too.
OBS
C.O.Jones
Damouth <dam...@san.rr.com> wrote:
Or for Kaylee. He does try his hand at killing later on. Unfortunately,
he is not a very good shot...
Arbitrar Of Quality
wrote:
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in messagenews:1177420276.5...@n15g2000prd.googlegroups.com..
> >My other comment on River is
> >that the part where Simon steps in and takes charge of the near-death
> >patient is a bit silly plot-wise, but it's something he has to do, and
> >River seems so proud of him.
>
> It is about the only colorable mis-step in the story. It's really the one
> and only time in "Ariel" where you couold imagine you were just watching a
> routine prime-time sort of show. It's not bad at all. When a sequence such
> as this is a show's low-point, that's a very, very good thing.
Indeed.
> > One wonders whether
> > Jayne's initial denial or his dying wish has an impact on how our hero
> > ultimately behaves.
>
> I have no question that this is the case.
>
> It's possible this was Mal trying to "teach Jayne a lesson," but I think
> that's a different show.
There's been a lot of discussion about that point in this thread.
Basically, I always saw it as a fake in past viewings. (On first
viewing, I was kinda hoping he'd go through with it, actually.) It's
really only this time that I started being drawn to the extent to
which particular things that Jayne says may influence Mal's response -
definitely the shame at the end being the most important. (There's
also his insistence that he wouldn't betray Mal if it were just the
two of them involved, that his lack of loyalty is only to people he
hasn't accepted as crew. On its own that could generate another few
paragraphs, but let me just say that if one focuses on that angle it's
very much a "teaching Jayne a lesson" scene - here's a clear moral,
now don't you forget it.)
So why wasn't it clearer? Maybe that's my issue for, to tweak your
words, expecting it to be a different show than it is, due to what I'm
familiar with. And maybe it's the difference between watching
something casually and watching closely with a eye towards discussing
it. But maybe it's simply not that clear what Mal has in mind -
either through a mis-step in the writing, or because it's the intended
effect for us to be in Jayne's head, following him in initially
assuming that it's bluster and quickly finding that Mal is moving us
to consider taking it more seriously.
> >One-sentence summary: An adrenaline-charged thrill ride for the whole
> >family!
>
> Perhaps I'm missing your sarcasm, but I deem it an adrenaline-charged thrill
> ride for adults only.
It's sarcasm the whole family can enjoy.
-AOQ
mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges
> > that's a different show.
>
> There's been a lot of discussion about that point in this thread.
> Basically, I always saw it as a fake in past viewings. (On first
> viewing, I was kinda hoping he'd go through with it, actually.) It's
> really only this time that I started being drawn to the extent to
> which particular things that Jayne says may influence Mal's response -
if mal was simply going to kill jayne
he wouldntve left him with a radio
i think mal was looking for some sign any sign that he could trust jayne
and that it was jaynes shame that showed thrre was a lever
Atlas Bugged
<mair_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:mair_fheal-DB358...@sn-ip.vsrv-sjc.supernews.net...
> if mal was simply going to kill jayne
> he wouldntve left him with a radio
>
> i think mal was looking for some sign any sign that he could trust jayne
> and that it was jaynes shame that showed thrre was a lever
I believe the intent of the story-teller was more direct; sometimes a cigar
is just a cigar.
It's a good question - why the radio?
Ostensibly, it was to get the confession, so Mal could be sure he's killing
the guy properly.
Of course, what's a coerced confession worth? Well, it can be worth a lot,
maybe all. It was up to Mal to judge its sincerity.
Sometimes confessions - even when coerced - can be definitive, as in the
case where the confession reveals a fact only known to the interrogator and
whomever is the perp.
Jayne could *possibly* have saved himself by making a confession of the
form, "Sure, whatever you say, I did it, just please let me out of here."
But Mal took the uncertainty and coercion to a level where he hoped to avoid
that. It worked.
So the radio does not settle the issue of whether Mal was just "teaching a
lesson," an interpretation with which I vigorously disagree.
Of course, there's a tiny percent chance I'm wrong. But if I am, FIREFLY
isn't a milestone in quality television, it is instead SEVENTH HEAVEN IN
SPACE, a dull, family-oriented, been-there-done-that entry in the contest to
sell breakfast cereal, and there is no distinct philosophy being presented.
And the rest of "Ariel" was just MISSION:IMPOSSIBLE with quirky characters
and better sets.
But I definitely doubt it.
Atlas Bugged, 4/27/2007 7:39:29 AM
Arbitrar Of Quality
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in messagenews:1177420276.5...@n15g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> Ariel through Trash is my favorite mini-run of the series, but the single
> peak for me is Objects In Space.
Between those points and "Safe" as the weakest, we're agreeing too
much again. (Although I don't know if my mini-run would include
"Trash" but not "Out Of Gas;" I like the former a lot, but it's not on
the level of the two episodes that precede it.)
> I've been enjoying George W. Harris's commentary about how Firefly is really
> about Jayne, but I always watched the series through the window on River,
> and things just got more complicated on that front.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and But (at least by this point in
the series, not so much the first few episodes) I'm way into River
too. Something about the cute teenage chick discovering her strength
archetype just stays endlessly interesting to me the same way it does
to Joss.
>Also note the very particular statement to Jayne at the end that
> getting pinched is what happens when you call the feds. From his point of
> view, their corruption is implicit in all dealings. They can't deal with
> you straight.
>
> Which raises another underlying issue. When Mal nearly kills Jayne at the
> end, how much of his motivation is Jayne's dealing with the feds as opposed
> to just the personal betrayal of River and Simon? And by extension, how
> much of Mal's support of River and Simon is because it's a way of sticking
> it to the Alliance?
I don't think it's as interesting a line of thought for this
particular story, but you're right in seeing Serenity Valley in most
of what Mal does and thinks.
> > My other comment on River is
> > that the part where Simon steps in and takes charge of the near-death
> > patient is a bit silly plot-wise, but it's something he has to do, and
> > River seems so proud of him.
>
> I don't really like the scene 'cause it's so cliché. Ridiculously so. (I
> was waiting for Simon to say, "Damn it! I'm a doctor!" Which I suppose
> would at least have given me a laugh.)
How about "I'm a doctor, not a criminal mastermind?"
> > In typical ME style, José is
> > actually setting us up for a killer payoff once they're finally in the
> > hospital, with a lesson about how amusing over-scripting can be.
>
> Did you notice that Jayne got the line wrong anyway? And that it still
> didn't matter?
Did he get the line wrong, other than the timing?
> I'll add myself to the list of those saying Simon didn't kill the guard.
> Although I'm not sure why the episode didn't have him do it. I think it's
> clear that Simon was ready to if he had to. Hmmm. Maybe they decided that
> Simon, the good doctor, would let up once the guard was unconscious.
> Perhaps killing him in that context would have been too wanton to be true to
> his character.
Okay, this wasn't immediately obvious to me when the guy stopped
moving. I thought I heard the neck-snap sound effect, but apparently
he just passed out (kudos to those who bothered to keep track of which
guard was which and count how many Jayne killed and such). I don't
know why the show didn't have him kill the guy either; keeping the
pressure on until he's totally sure he's not going to get attacked
again the moment he stands up sounds like something I could see from
Simon.
> My comments about legitimate reasons for Jayne to want to take down Simon
> and River, and about Mal being motivated by his anti-Alliance feelings don't
> mean that I'm for Jayne or against Mal or River. No, I'm rooting for River
> and want Mal to stay true to himself as shown. But I do think the episode
> is a little weak at getting across some of the implicit moral ambiguity of
> the situation. It's just a tad too emotionally pat for my taste. A tad too
> much leading the audience by the nose. That would be my biggest criticism.
I can see that, but I guess I'm even more forgiving, especially given
what the precipitating event is; a lazier, more clear-cut story
wouldn't have had Jayne triggered by anything in particular, and then
it could've been a lot worse. (Although just watching him get
increasingly uneasy about his personal safety over a few shows
could've been interesting too). Plus, of course, I'm old-fashioned
enough to almost automatically side with these ridiculously idealized
and flawless squeaky-clean heroes who help people in need even when
they put themselves at risk by doing so.
-AOQ
Arbitrar Of Quality
> >As Pavel Chekov said, if you introduce a loaded chicken
> >in episode one...
>
> Well he would know (chickens, of course, being a Russian inwention).
Hee.
-AOQ
mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges
Arbitrar Of Quality <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
> Okay, this wasn't immediately obvious to me when the guy stopped
> moving. I thought I heard the neck-snap sound effect, but apparently
> he just passed out (kudos to those who bothered to keep track of which
> guard was which and count how many Jayne killed and such). I don't
> know why the show didn't have him kill the guy either; keeping the
> pressure on until he's totally sure he's not going to get attacked
> again the moment he stands up sounds like something I could see from
> Simon.
because he is doctor trained throughout his adulthood to save life not take it
i would like to think it would take something profound
to get a doctor to kill
(standing aside and letting nature takes it course as a person dies
is different lesson he would have to learn)
simon would know something of the physiology of blood loss to the brain
One Bit Shy
On Apr 26, 8:44 pm, "One Bit Shy" <O...@nomail.sorry> wrote:
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in
> messagenews:1177420276.5...@n15g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>> Ariel through Trash is my favorite mini-run of the series, but the single
>> peak for me is Objects In Space.
> Between those points and "Safe" as the weakest, we're agreeing too
> much again. (Although I don't know if my mini-run would include
> "Trash" but not "Out Of Gas;" I like the former a lot, but it's not on
> the level of the two episodes that precede it.)
I liked OMR better than you though, so at least we're not in lock-step. And
OOG - yeah, I see that a lot like it, and it is well made. But like I said
before, I don't feel much watching it. I'm much more engaged in Trash -
plus I get a kick out of the futeristic schtick in it. Sometimes I'm just
easy.
>> > In typical ME style, José is
>> > actually setting us up for a killer payoff once they're finally in the
>> > hospital, with a lesson about how amusing over-scripting can be.
>>
>> Did you notice that Jayne got the line wrong anyway? And that it still
>> didn't matter?
> Did he get the line wrong, other than the timing?
He's been struggling to remember "neural response", and ended up saying
"neural reaction" instead - just like his repeated error. Which goes to
your over-scripting remark. It's a technical distinction that wouldn't
generate notice coming from an ambulance guy, but Simon tortured Jayne with
it anyway.
OBS
Arbitrar Of Quality
Heh, didn't even notice it. At least personally, coming from a bio/
medical-science background, I'd probably use the terms interchangeably
without thinking about it.
-AOQ
Arbitrar Of Quality
> On Apr 26, 8:44 pm, "One Bit Shy" <O...@nomail.sorry> wrote:
> > I've been enjoying George W. Harris's commentary about how Firefly is really
> > about Jayne, but I always watched the series through the window on River,
> > and things just got more complicated on that front.
>
> I'm going to go out on a limb here and But (at least by this point in
> the series, not so much the first few episodes) I'm way into River
> too. Something about the cute teenage chick discovering her strength
> archetype just stays endlessly interesting to me the same way it does
> to Joss.
Forgot to finish my witty little contribution (this is what happens
when you compose messages in pieces), which is that I'm going to go
out on a limb and say that _Firefly_ is about a nine-character-and-a-
ship ensemble cast, with particular focus on Malcolm Reynolds.
-AOQ
~well, it seemed clever when I thought of it~
Zombie Elvis
<tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
>When I sat down to watch "Ariel," I was, as I often am, quite tired.
>After the episode ended, I felt pretty exhilarated. "Ariel" tends to
>have that effect. _Firefly_ didn't really run long enough to have a
>peak or a central moment to the extent that some shows do, but I
>always think of the pairing of "Airel" and "War Stories" as the core
>of the series. It's when stuff happens, and the phrase "on Ariel"
>will get plenty of use (relatively speaking; the series doesn't back-
>reference very often) in the episodes to come.
This is a pretty good place for back references. I've always debated
in my mind whether or not "Ariel" or "War Stories" is my favorite
Firefly episode. I never seem to be able to pick one.
--
"Yes, yes, this is a fertile land and we shall thrive. We will rule
over all this land and we will call it,...'This Land.'
I think we should call it your grave!
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal.
Hah, hah, hah. Mine is an evil laugh."
-- Wash
Roberto Castillo
roberto...@ameritech.net
Julian Treadwell
> FIREFLY
> Season One, Episode 9: "Ariel"
> Writer: José Molina
> Director: Alan Kroeker
>
> When I sat down to watch "Ariel," I was, as I often am, quite tired.
> After the episode ended, I felt pretty exhilarated.
Yes, it's faster-paced (maybe better-paced too) than the other 'caper'
episodes (TTG, Jaynestown, the pilot episode). And there are great
plot-twists that kept my interest piqued.
>Then River grabs herself a knife and slices Jayne up. Double-take time.
That it was. Positively Hitchcockian.
>The doctor re-emerges as once again a would-be criminal mastermind,
I'm not sure when he'd been one before? Oh, I guess you mean busting
River out of the "academy".
> Speaking of doing a lot, Edmonson may have outdone himself with this
> week's soundtrack, which is another classic, as he continues to
> produce some of the best incidental music this side of Yoko Kanno.
Gorramn it, I've watched this episode countless times and never noticed
the soundtrack. (Memo to self: Pay Attention Next Time!!!) But maybe
that's the mark of good background music, it shouldn't be noticeable,
rather a subconscious stimulant.
> This is more about tense but cautious navigation through glittering
> sterile corridors than rambling journeys across the frontier, and the
> music delivers - my favorite use is probably the first time they enter
> the hospital, but it's all good.
>
>The actors were presumably stretched
> to their limits and forced to go outside anything from their own
> experiences when playing the role of actors trying to learn their
> technobabble lines. Seriously, though, they sell the frustration in a
> way I can only call "delightful."
Yeah, and unexpected - Jayne's often shown as a bit brainless, but it's
good to have Mal and Zoe shown in a less-than-super-hero light. Makes
them much more human.
> The other thing "Ariel" does, despite its pretty title, is make wanton
> cruelty seem like pretty satisfying revenge.
The severity of the Alliance security guy's fate is pretty excessive,
but I personally wouldn't have found his futuristic keelhauling of
Jayne's betrayal excessive, although I would have mourned the loss of
the character from the rest of the series most grievously. On Serenity
Mal has to be judge, jury and executioner - he has no choice. And
treason has always been the most serious of crimes.
> There's a definite policy statement being made that goes beyond
> the literal story towards the end: "I got pinched!" "Which is what
> *happens* when you call the feds." I don't feel like discussing at
> length whether or not this represents the opinion of the show and/or
> its creators, but it definitely represents Mal's.
Yeah. I agree that it does, and also with AB's claims about Mal having
a libertarian attitude to life (see AB's site). This is best shown when
Bukh quotes Mal's statement that "governments are just men, usually
notably ungoverned" at the start of WS. (And Simon immediately
recognises Mal as the author, suggesting Mal may occasionally indulge in
political rants over the dinner table).
> One-sentence summary: An adrenaline-charged thrill ride for the whole
> family!
>
> AOQ rating: Excellent
Agreed. In my top 5.
George W Harris
<julian.t...@jcu.edu.au> wrote:
:> When I sat down to watch "Ariel," I was, as I often am, quite tired.
:> After the episode ended, I felt pretty exhilarated.
:
:Yes, it's faster-paced (maybe better-paced too) than the other 'caper'
:episodes (TTG, Jaynestown, the pilot episode). And there are great
:plot-twists that kept my interest piqued.
"Jaynestown" isn't a caper episode, and the pilot
isn't, either. "Trash" most definitely is, and, actually, so is
"Our Mrs Reynolds", although it's of a different variety
(more like "Die Hard" than "$").
:
:>Then River grabs herself a knife and slices Jayne up. Double-take time.
:
:That it was. Positively Hitchcockian.
:
:>The doctor re-emerges as once again a would-be criminal mastermind,
:
:I'm not sure when he'd been one before? Oh, I guess you mean busting
:River out of the "academy".
:
In "Jaynestown", of course. It was even remarked
upon.
--
I'm not an actor, but I play one on TV!
Julian Treadwell
> On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 16:06:42 +1000, Julian Treadwell
> <julian.t...@jcu.edu.au> wrote:
>
> :> When I sat down to watch "Ariel," I was, as I often am, quite tired.
> :> After the episode ended, I felt pretty exhilarated.
> :
> :Yes, it's faster-paced (maybe better-paced too) than the other 'caper'
> :episodes (TTG, Jaynestown, the pilot episode). And there are great
> :plot-twists that kept my interest piqued.
>
> "Jaynestown" isn't a caper episode, and the pilot
> isn't, either. "Trash" most definitely is, and, actually, so is
> "Our Mrs Reynolds", although it's of a different variety
> (more like "Die Hard" than "$").
Yes, not sure what I was thinking. Brain fade I guess, sorry.
> :
> :>Then River grabs herself a knife and slices Jayne up. Double-take time.
> :
> :That it was. Positively Hitchcockian.
> :
> :>The doctor re-emerges as once again a would-be criminal mastermind,
> :
> :I'm not sure when he'd been one before? Oh, I guess you mean busting
> :River out of the "academy".
> :
> In "Jaynestown", of course. It was even remarked
> upon.
Ah. Not sure his performance there qualifies him as a "mastermind" lol.
George W Harris
<julian.t...@jcu.edu.au> wrote:
:George W Harris wrote:
:> On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 16:06:42 +1000, Julian Treadwell
:> <julian.t...@jcu.edu.au> wrote:
:>
:> :> When I sat down to watch "Ariel," I was, as I often am, quite tired.
:> :> After the episode ended, I felt pretty exhilarated.
:> :
:> :Yes, it's faster-paced (maybe better-paced too) than the other 'caper'
:> :episodes (TTG, Jaynestown, the pilot episode). And there are great
:> :plot-twists that kept my interest piqued.
:>
:> "Jaynestown" isn't a caper episode, and the pilot
:> isn't, either. "Trash" most definitely is, and, actually, so is
:> "Our Mrs Reynolds", although it's of a different variety
:> (more like "Die Hard" than "$").
:
:Yes, not sure what I was thinking. Brain fade I guess, sorry.
Happens to the most of us.
:
:> :
:> :>Then River grabs herself a knife and slices Jayne up. Double-take time.
:> :
:> :That it was. Positively Hitchcockian.
:> :
:> :>The doctor re-emerges as once again a would-be criminal mastermind,
:> :
:> :I'm not sure when he'd been one before? Oh, I guess you mean busting
:> :River out of the "academy".
:> :
:> In "Jaynestown", of course. It was even remarked
:> upon.
:
:Ah. Not sure his performance there qualifies him as a "mastermind" lol.
Hence the "would-be".
--
Never give a loaded gun to a woman in labor.
George W. Harris For actual email address, replace each 'u' with an 'i'.