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Gustavo mutters about Generations Cyclonus
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Gustavo Wombat, of the Seattle Wombats
Jun 1, 2015, 3:27:26 AM6/1/15
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I saw this in a toy store today, and absolutely had to have it. To some extent it is appealing because it is such a terrible, horrible, bad idea, but is also works so much better than it should.
Perhaps I should start by saying that the Generations Silverbolt mold is really not one of my favorites -- it has a single mode it looks good in, the combiner torso. The Silverbolt color scheme is just so broken up between red, white and orange, that it accents all of the mold's weak points. And there are weird gaps in the wings on the back of the robot mode. And the bottom of the vehicle mode is just a mess of colors clearly revealing a robot in an awkward position. It reminds me a lot of the TF:Energon Storm Jet in terms of trying hard and just not getting there.
Universe 2.0 Silverbolt is such an excellent toy that it sets a very high standard for Silverbolt to reach, and simply combining with a bunch of limb-bots isn't enough to do it. Universe 2.0 Silverbolt's underside is a robot in a serene and stately position, for instance, which is much better.
So, I dislike Generations Silverbolt. Sure, he combines, and that's good, but he's a really kind of crappy and substandard toy beyond that. The weird gaps in the wings in robot mode really bother me.
I have Silverbolt and Cyclonus side by side in robot mode, and Cyclonus just looks better. The very simple purple and silver color scheme hides a lot of flaws, and the wings on his back are solid. There's still weird stuff like enormous kneepads and arms that want to hold slightly too close to his sides like he is trying not to take up space as he stands, but overall, it is a much nicer robot mode.
There are a huge number of remold visible here, and it is surprising not how much is remolded, but how much isn't, and how it still manages to evoke an entirely different character.
The only things that leap out and scream "Silverbolt!" are the shoulders and the gun. Swapping the gun with any other gun he can hold helps tremendously. Even Bombshell makes a better gun. The shoulders though... it's hard not to see Silverbolt there.
He's got a very good robot mode, but he's not a great Cyclonus. The shoulder wings are too low, and the bunny ears are too small, for instance, and he seems too boxy and not nearly rounded enough. But, he's recognizable, and had this toy been released in the era of TF:Cybertron or something, he would have been praised.
There are some changes to the transformation scheme to accommodate Cyclonus's larger head -- it no longer tucks completely away, it just pushes back. It is important to rotate the head first, otherwise his face will be visible in the other modes.
There are also the winglets on his arms. In vehicle mode, those are removed and then held in his hands. There is something absolutely preposterous about that, as if Cyclonus is maintaining his disguise by hanging onto his parts. If parts are going to be removed during transformation, this is the best scenario for them. It is like Cy-Kill holding onto his front wheel in motorcycle mode.
Almost the entire vehicle mode is remolded and redesigned from Silverbolt. Not just cosmetic changes either -- the fusalage rides higher to give more room for tucking the head away. The wings are, of course, entirely different, and also have parts that cover some Concorde details that still appear on the robot's legs -- this is what ends up giving him the much more solid look in robot mode. You can tell he is evil because the nose cone is not soft rubber, and he longs to take your eye out.
The underside still has a robot on it, but the robot is now mostly the same color as the plane itself, rather than being bright red. If you connect the chest pieces of the super robot, you can break up the obvious robot bits a bit more, although it makes it harder for him to land since now the front landing gear is not long enough. It looks like someone was considering this when designing the sculpt, as the collar around the neck has a bit of engine detailing.
The combiner torso is not as good as Silverbolt's, but still a pretty good toy. He just doesn't have the iconic look of an existing character. There is something off about the head sculpt that doesn't quite read as Galvatron to me, so this doesn't look like the dismembered remains of our beloved crazed Decepticon. Not quite.
As to how this might fit into a storyline, I am at a bit of a loss. I have no doubt that if Cyclonus had found Galvatron's body destroyed on Thraal but his mind intact, that he would have gone through with something like this.
Overall, a remold of the shoulders would have gone a long way to differentiating this mold use, but it is still surprisingly good.
Perhaps I should start by saying that the Generations Silverbolt mold is really not one of my favorites -- it has a single mode it looks good in, the combiner torso. The Silverbolt color scheme is just so broken up between red, white and orange, that it accents all of the mold's weak points. And there are weird gaps in the wings on the back of the robot mode. And the bottom of the vehicle mode is just a mess of colors clearly revealing a robot in an awkward position. It reminds me a lot of the TF:Energon Storm Jet in terms of trying hard and just not getting there.
Universe 2.0 Silverbolt is such an excellent toy that it sets a very high standard for Silverbolt to reach, and simply combining with a bunch of limb-bots isn't enough to do it. Universe 2.0 Silverbolt's underside is a robot in a serene and stately position, for instance, which is much better.
So, I dislike Generations Silverbolt. Sure, he combines, and that's good, but he's a really kind of crappy and substandard toy beyond that. The weird gaps in the wings in robot mode really bother me.
I have Silverbolt and Cyclonus side by side in robot mode, and Cyclonus just looks better. The very simple purple and silver color scheme hides a lot of flaws, and the wings on his back are solid. There's still weird stuff like enormous kneepads and arms that want to hold slightly too close to his sides like he is trying not to take up space as he stands, but overall, it is a much nicer robot mode.
There are a huge number of remold visible here, and it is surprising not how much is remolded, but how much isn't, and how it still manages to evoke an entirely different character.
The only things that leap out and scream "Silverbolt!" are the shoulders and the gun. Swapping the gun with any other gun he can hold helps tremendously. Even Bombshell makes a better gun. The shoulders though... it's hard not to see Silverbolt there.
He's got a very good robot mode, but he's not a great Cyclonus. The shoulder wings are too low, and the bunny ears are too small, for instance, and he seems too boxy and not nearly rounded enough. But, he's recognizable, and had this toy been released in the era of TF:Cybertron or something, he would have been praised.
There are some changes to the transformation scheme to accommodate Cyclonus's larger head -- it no longer tucks completely away, it just pushes back. It is important to rotate the head first, otherwise his face will be visible in the other modes.
There are also the winglets on his arms. In vehicle mode, those are removed and then held in his hands. There is something absolutely preposterous about that, as if Cyclonus is maintaining his disguise by hanging onto his parts. If parts are going to be removed during transformation, this is the best scenario for them. It is like Cy-Kill holding onto his front wheel in motorcycle mode.
Almost the entire vehicle mode is remolded and redesigned from Silverbolt. Not just cosmetic changes either -- the fusalage rides higher to give more room for tucking the head away. The wings are, of course, entirely different, and also have parts that cover some Concorde details that still appear on the robot's legs -- this is what ends up giving him the much more solid look in robot mode. You can tell he is evil because the nose cone is not soft rubber, and he longs to take your eye out.
The underside still has a robot on it, but the robot is now mostly the same color as the plane itself, rather than being bright red. If you connect the chest pieces of the super robot, you can break up the obvious robot bits a bit more, although it makes it harder for him to land since now the front landing gear is not long enough. It looks like someone was considering this when designing the sculpt, as the collar around the neck has a bit of engine detailing.
The combiner torso is not as good as Silverbolt's, but still a pretty good toy. He just doesn't have the iconic look of an existing character. There is something off about the head sculpt that doesn't quite read as Galvatron to me, so this doesn't look like the dismembered remains of our beloved crazed Decepticon. Not quite.
As to how this might fit into a storyline, I am at a bit of a loss. I have no doubt that if Cyclonus had found Galvatron's body destroyed on Thraal but his mind intact, that he would have gone through with something like this.
Overall, a remold of the shoulders would have gone a long way to differentiating this mold use, but it is still surprisingly good.
banzait...@gmail.com
Jun 2, 2015, 8:25:59 PM6/2/15
to
>Universe 2.0 Silverbolt is such an excellent toy that it sets a very high standard for Silverbolt to reach, and simply combining with a bunch of limb-bots isn't enough to do it. Universe 2.0 Silverbolt's underside is a robot in a serene and stately position, for instance, which is much better.
You are talking about what I arguably think is one of the best transformer toy molds of all time, of which I like the Silverbolt mode the least. Here they are in official order of awesomeness
1 - http://www.tfu.info/2009/Decepticon/TFUSkyfall/skyfall.htm
2 - http://www.tfu.info/2009/Decepticon/TFUDarkwind/darkwind.htm
3 - http://www.tfu.info/2008/Autobot/TFUSilverbolt/silverbolt.htm
This toy is so great, that it even pulls off the usually terrible idea of having lights AND sounds that has ruined so many previous transformer molds. Comparing any toy to this mold is a very high bar, IMO.
-Banzaitron
Zobovor
Jun 4, 2015, 1:21:30 AM6/4/15
to
On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 1:27:26 AM UTC-6, Gustavo Wombat, of the Seattle Wombats wrote:
> I saw this in a toy store today, and absolutely had to have it. To some
> extent it is appealing because it is such a terrible, horrible, bad idea, but
> is also works so much better than it should.
You're right that if this had been released prior to the advent of the Classics line, people would have loved it. They've raised the bar so high since that time, though. It's no longer acceptable to put a G1 head on an otherwise unrelated toy and call it a successful update. It's not even okay to remold a toy so that it kinda-sorta looks like the character. Cyclonus is a step backwards.
> I saw this in a toy store today, and absolutely had to have it. To some
> extent it is appealing because it is such a terrible, horrible, bad idea, but
> is also works so much better than it should.
I recognize that they wanted to amortize the cost of the Silverbolt mold and resell it. I just don't feel like Cyclonus was the answer. We already got a really, really good update for Cyclonus in 2008. Granted, that was seven years ago, so maybe it was time for him to make another retail appearance.
If they absolutely had to take a jet toy and turn it into the body for another combiner robot, why not Scattershot?
Maybe I'll pick this toy up if I see it and I can't think of anything else to spend $25 on, but you'd be surprised how infrequently that happens.
By the way, the hinge for the combiner mode head was really weak on Silverbolt. I had to exchange the toy because my first one broke. Did they fix this for Cyclonus?
Zob
banzait...@gmail.com
Jun 4, 2015, 8:43:38 PM6/4/15
to
> If they absolutely had to take a jet toy and turn it into the body for another combiner robot, why not Scattershot?
#whatevs You would of bitched harder about that decision and you KNOW it!
I don't have cyclonus yet (preordered him on amazon, but I think he looks pretty good, from afar anyways). I am getting nervous about the combiner wars getting remold crazy. If, as predicted by many, Alpha Bravo is the new vortex, I am gonna be super pissed.
-Banzaitron
Zobovor
Jun 4, 2015, 9:22:06 PM6/4/15
to
On Thursday, June 4, 2015 at 6:43:38 PM UTC-6, banzait...@gmail.com wrote:
> You would of bitched harder about that decision and you KNOW it!
Assuming that a hypothetical Combiner Wars Scattershot would have gotten approximately as much remolding as was done to turn the toy into Cyclonus, I think it could have worked. Silverbolt basically got completely re-shelled in vehicle mode, so we can assume that Scattershot's jet mode would have looked appropriate and accurate. Even if the robot mode just got a new head, I think Scattershot is boxy enough that it would have worked.
> You would of bitched harder about that decision and you KNOW it!
Maybe I'll throw a digital repaint together later to help us all visualize it. No promises, though.
> I am getting nervous about the combiner wars getting remold crazy. If, as
> predicted by many, Alpha Bravo is the new vortex, I am gonna be super
> pissed.
I'm less worried about Vortex and more worried about the other Combaticons. Vortex is supposed to be a helicopter, so using Alpha Bravo isn't a horrible idea. What about Blast Off? We haven't gotten a space shuttle toy yet, so unless they plan on substantially re-shelling one of the Aerialbots, we'll need an all-new toy that isn't going to be used anywhere else. That doesn't seem like Hasbro's style. Same with Brawl. No tanks yet, and I'm worried they're going to reuse Rook. Even with a perfect head sculpt, that's going to be a tough sell. I'm expecting to see First Aid reused as Swindle, too. We're finally, FINALLY getting a new Swindle toy, and I get the feeling it's not going to be nearly as cartoon-riffic as I want it to be. In all probability, he'll have that Combiner Wars peg for a chest, which in some ways ain't any better than the G1 toy.
I recognize that Hasbro is, and always will be, in the business of making money, and one of the ways they do this is by using the same toys over and over and over. But, as Ironhide said, ah don't have tah like it.
On the other hand, Air Raid and Skydive have yet to be recycled. They share design elements with each other, but neither of them has been reused. So, maybe there will be some surprises.
Zob (will probably end up buying Ironhide, Sunstreaker, Mirage, and Prowl no matter how horrible they are)
Zobovor
Jun 4, 2015, 9:35:07 PM6/4/15
to
On Thursday, June 4, 2015 at 7:22:06 PM UTC-6, Zobovor wrote:
> Maybe I'll throw a digital repaint together later to help us all visualize it.
Actually, it looks like somebody already did:
> Maybe I'll throw a digital repaint together later to help us all visualize it.
http://images6.fanpop.com/image/photos/37500000/Fanmade-Combiner-Wars-Techobots-transformers-37502616-720-540.jpg
I have faith that if they did the other Technobots, they would not be as horrible as the digibashes in that picture.
Furthermore, it turns out that a Voyager Scattershot actually is listed in at least one retailer computer system (a casemate of Onslaught), so perhaps my prediction is going to come true.
Zob (not hating the Scattershot idea)
Gustavo Wombat, of the Seattle Wombats
Jun 5, 2015, 1:38:06 AM6/5/15
to
On Thursday, June 4, 2015 at 6:22:06 PM UTC-7, Zobovor wrote:
> On Thursday, June 4, 2015 at 6:43:38 PM UTC-6, banzait...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > You would of bitched harder about that decision and you KNOW it!
>
> Assuming that a hypothetical Combiner Wars Scattershot would have gotten approximately as much remolding as was done to turn the toy into Cyclonus, I think it could have worked.
I think the colors in robot mode are too similar, so they would want to at least space them out so they aren't on the shelves at the same time.
> On Thursday, June 4, 2015 at 6:43:38 PM UTC-6, banzait...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > You would of bitched harder about that decision and you KNOW it!
>
> Assuming that a hypothetical Combiner Wars Scattershot would have gotten approximately as much remolding as was done to turn the toy into Cyclonus, I think it could have worked.
However, given that Silverbolt is basically all the wrong colors, that might not have mattered.
> > I am getting nervous about the combiner wars getting remold crazy. If, as
> > predicted by many, Alpha Bravo is the new vortex, I am gonna be super
> > pissed.
>
> Because you weren't expecting to buy the toy multiple times? Or because you don't think it would be suitable for Vortex? Personally, I can't look at Alpha Bravo and NOT see Vortex's head sculpt. As far as I'm concerned, it seemed like a foregone conclusion from the start.
> I'm less worried about Vortex and more worried about the other Combaticons. Vortex is supposed to be a helicopter, so using Alpha Bravo isn't a horrible idea. What about Blast Off? We haven't gotten a space shuttle toy yet, so unless they plan on substantially re-shelling one of the Aerialbots, we'll need an all-new toy that isn't going to be used anywhere else. That doesn't seem like Hasbro's style. Same with Brawl. No tanks yet, and I'm worried they're going to reuse Rook.
Blast Off => Strafe
Dragstrip => Lightspeed
Protectobot Motorcycle Guy => Lightspeed
Brawl => Nosecone
There would be some remolding required for each, of course, but they are doable.
MWG
Jun 5, 2015, 5:39:14 PM6/5/15
to
On Thursday, June 4, 2015 at 8:22:06 PM UTC-5, Zobovor wrote:
> On Thursday, June 4, 2015 at 6:43:38 PM UTC-6, banzait...@gmail.com wrote:
<snip>
> On Thursday, June 4, 2015 at 6:43:38 PM UTC-6, banzait...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > I am getting nervous about the combiner wars getting remold crazy. If, as
> > predicted by many, Alpha Bravo is the new vortex, I am gonna be super
> > pissed.
>
> Because you weren't expecting to buy the toy multiple times? Or because you don't think it would be suitable for Vortex? Personally, I can't look at Alpha Bravo and NOT see Vortex's head sculpt. As far as I'm concerned, it seemed like a foregone conclusion from the start.
>
> I'm less worried about Vortex and more worried about the other Combaticons. Vortex is supposed to be a helicopter, so using Alpha Bravo isn't a horrible idea. What about Blast Off? We haven't gotten a space shuttle toy yet, so unless they plan on substantially re-shelling one of the Aerialbots, we'll need an all-new toy that isn't going to be used anywhere else. That doesn't seem like Hasbro's style. Same with Brawl. No tanks yet, and I'm worried they're going to reuse Rook. Even with a perfect head sculpt, that's going to be a tough sell. I'm expecting to see First Aid reused as Swindle, too. We're finally, FINALLY getting a new Swindle toy, and I get the feeling it's not going to be nearly as cartoon-riffic as I want it to be. In all probability, he'll have that Combiner Wars peg for a chest, which in some ways ain't any better than the G1 toy.
>
One of the nice things about the Combaticons is that they do have repaint options beyond just the expected G2 colors (I hope we actually do get Combiner Wars updates of the G2 teams, including an orange Devastator and the unmade Stunticons and Protectobots). The "Car Robots/Robots in Disguise" incarnations of the Combaticons/Commandos would probably be pretty popular (especially if the tank was available in your choice of tan or blue). There are also the Walmart set colors (arctic grey/white or that weird looking orange version), plus some Japan-exclusive versions. Brawl could probably be repainted into Bombshock and Guzzle, a new Swindle could be repainted into Hound... Blast-Off might need some reworking since the classic space shuttle design was retired (and they made a big deal about on the news, along with America basically killing NASA all together). Vortex would hopefully get a lot of remolding from the Blades/AB version of the mold, like how First Aid is so different from Off Road (but the missiles on the arm seem like a real shout out to Vortex's arm cannons).
> > I am getting nervous about the combiner wars getting remold crazy. If, as
> > predicted by many, Alpha Bravo is the new vortex, I am gonna be super
> > pissed.
>
> Because you weren't expecting to buy the toy multiple times? Or because you don't think it would be suitable for Vortex? Personally, I can't look at Alpha Bravo and NOT see Vortex's head sculpt. As far as I'm concerned, it seemed like a foregone conclusion from the start.
>
> I'm less worried about Vortex and more worried about the other Combaticons. Vortex is supposed to be a helicopter, so using Alpha Bravo isn't a horrible idea. What about Blast Off? We haven't gotten a space shuttle toy yet, so unless they plan on substantially re-shelling one of the Aerialbots, we'll need an all-new toy that isn't going to be used anywhere else. That doesn't seem like Hasbro's style. Same with Brawl. No tanks yet, and I'm worried they're going to reuse Rook. Even with a perfect head sculpt, that's going to be a tough sell. I'm expecting to see First Aid reused as Swindle, too. We're finally, FINALLY getting a new Swindle toy, and I get the feeling it's not going to be nearly as cartoon-riffic as I want it to be. In all probability, he'll have that Combiner Wars peg for a chest, which in some ways ain't any better than the G1 toy.
>
>
> On the other hand, Air Raid and Skydive have yet to be recycled. They share design elements with each other, but neither of them has been reused. So, maybe there will be some surprises.
>
>
> Zob (will probably end up buying Ironhide, Sunstreaker, Mirage, and Prowl no matter how horrible they are)
Travoltron
Jun 9, 2015, 11:21:06 AM6/9/15
to
Are there going to be limbs for this guy, or will I have to buy the
unwanted limbs (Alpha Bravo, etc.) to make a gestault?
unwanted limbs (Alpha Bravo, etc.) to make a gestault?
Zobovor
Jun 9, 2015, 5:22:45 PM6/9/15
to
On Tuesday, June 9, 2015 at 9:21:06 AM UTC-6, Travoltron wrote:
> Are there going to be limbs for this guy, or will I have to buy the
> unwanted limbs (Alpha Bravo, etc.) to make a gestault?
Given the character biography that Cyclonus has to use his newfound mind control powers to hypnotize other robots into combining with him, I'd say it's a far bet that he doesn't have any limbs to call his own.
> Are there going to be limbs for this guy, or will I have to buy the
> unwanted limbs (Alpha Bravo, etc.) to make a gestault?
I guess you could use Alpha Bravo and Offroad and Rook and whatever piece-of-garbage Combaticon limb they try to sell us.
Zob
Cappeca
Jun 9, 2015, 5:23:06 PM6/9/15
to
Em terça-feira, 9 de junho de 2015 12:21:06 UTC-3, Travoltron escreveu:
> Are there going to be limbs for this guy, or will I have to buy the
> unwanted limbs (Alpha Bravo, etc.) to make a gestault?
They should make a Sweep out of one of the Aerialbots mold, and we'd have to buy four of them for the limbs.
> Are there going to be limbs for this guy, or will I have to buy the
> unwanted limbs (Alpha Bravo, etc.) to make a gestault?
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