African-Americans and "Blackfoot"
hengruh
African Americans, especially in the southeast and the Five
Civilzed Tribes. However, I am very confused why so many African
Americans claim "Blackfoot" as being one of their ancestor
tribes. Blackfoot/Blackfeet are from northern Montana and Canada,
and I don't think they had significant contact with blacks. Do
African Americans claim"Blackfoot" simply because they know they
have native blood, and not knowing enough of Native American
history, they cue in on "Black"foot and make the assumption then?
Any ideas, as I meet lots of black people who claim "Blackfoot"
Lance
* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
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WiccaIrish
>African Americans, especially in the southeast and the Five
>Civilzed Tribes. However, I am very confused why so many African
>Americans claim "Blackfoot" as being one of their ancestor
>tribes. Blackfoot/Blackfeet are from northern Montana and Canada,
>and I don't think they had significant contact with blacks. Do
>African Americans claim"Blackfoot" simply because they know they
>have native blood, and not knowing enough of Native American
>history, they cue in on "Black"foot and make the assumption then?
>Any ideas, as I meet lots of black people who claim "Blackfoot"
>
I know in the past there were a lot of African-Americans who claimed
'Blackfoot' thinking they wouldn't be persecuted. And I know there were
Blackfoot people who claimed African-American to stay on their land. One theory
I came across about the origin of the Cherokee and Blackfoot mix says that:
"the claim to Cherokee and Blackfoot blood is actually a story intentionally
designed by people's ancestors to cover up the African ("Black") bloodline in
their past, and to disguise it as American Indian. Hence "Black" becomes
"Blackfoot."
But this all doesn't mean that they don't really have Blackfoot in them. They
may have.
KDenn39
>Any ideas, as I meet lots of black people who claim "Blackfoot"
Me too, it is Blackfoot or Blackfeet, them not knowing the two are different
tribes, and then there is the old Cherokee business... everyone is a
Cherokee...
gemini...@ink.net
I am reading a very interesting book now about
the overlapping similarities in culture and
spiritual beliefs between the Navajo and the
people of Tibet.
Is anyone on this list aware of these similarities?
(for example, sand painting)
...geminiwalker
Randy
First of all the "proper" term is BLACKFOOT. The name Blackfeet was forced
on the tribe by the all knowing white man..... Something about having two
feet and not just one ect ect, yada yada yada...and the "There are more than
ONE of you isn't there??" Duhhh.....
If you were to ask someone of the tribe what they were they would say
Siksika......which means Blackfoot.....not feet.
The Wheeler-Howard act...or the infamous IRA is where the term Blackfeet
came from....so in 1935 was when we became "OFFICIAL". hehe
The Pikuni, the Bloods, and the Siksika are all Blackfoot. Of course there
is the inter tribal word wars of who is what and doing whatever when.
I have heard that the Cherokee had been called "Blackfoot because they had
alot of interracial roots....as well as the Seminoles. That would make
sense because they are located in the south.
Then you got the Siha Sapa, one of the 7 Lakota Bands. That means
blackfeet also. I have even heard something about a Ottawa/Blackfeet
band......anybody know of this???
Anyways....somehow I get the feeling that they just identify with the name
Black for the obvious reasons. It is known that only about less than 1% of
the Buffalo Soldiers actually saw battle and even then those guys really did
not have much opportunity for marrying the enemy.....i.e. us. hehe
So that would leave the southern states the most logical area to start
looking....anyways, thats my opinion.
And that would leave the Pikuni/Blackfoot entirely out of the picture 'cause
there is about 3500 miles between us.
And then you gotta remember that just because they are black, does not
lessen the wannabeism any.
Randy
"hengruh" <hengruh...@yahoo.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:0a9cba16...@usw-ex0103-019.remarq.com...
> I know about the strong connection between Native Americans and
> African Americans, especially in the southeast and the Five
> Civilzed Tribes. However, I am very confused why so many African
> Americans claim "Blackfoot" as being one of their ancestor
> tribes. Blackfoot/Blackfeet are from northern Montana and Canada,
> and I don't think they had significant contact with blacks. Do
> African Americans claim"Blackfoot" simply because they know they
> have native blood, and not knowing enough of Native American
> history, they cue in on "Black"foot and make the assumption then?
> Any ideas, as I meet lots of black people who claim "Blackfoot"
>
Lance Foster
of Montana. Just saw Pat Head who was my counselor (in later years Ken Pepion
took over). I remember lots of people from that way, McDonald, Still Smoking,
TailFeathers, Fish.. Nothing like the sight of the Rocky Mountain Front to make
me glad!@
Lance
KDenn39
>on the tribe by the all knowing white man.....
Are you sure??? Try it again cuz your not correct on this one...
KDenn39
> the overlapping similarities in culture and
> spiritual beliefs between the Navajo and the
> people of Tibet.
>
I dont care.. they are not related
KDenn39
http://www.blackfeetnation.com/
Which this site explains that the Blackfoot are in Montana.. the Blackfeet are
in Canada...
Sometimes the Blackfoot are called Blackfeet, but anyone who is from the area
do know the difference between Blackfoot and Blackfeet.. I am not from the
area, nor do I belong to either tribe.. I learned the difference..
Randy
That site has been up a little over a year I think. It's based in Browning.
There are no Blackfeet, its just another word war.
"KDenn39" <kde...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000229010417...@ng-dc1.aol.com...
WiccaIrish
>>First of all the "proper" term is BLACKFOOT. The name Blackfeet was forced
>>on the tribe by the all knowing white man.....
>
>Are you sure??? Try it again cuz your not correct on this one...
I'm part Blackfoot, and yes its Blackfoot not Blackfeet. Blackfeet is a band of
the Lakota. I know other Blackfoots who don't like the to be called Blackfeet.
KDenn39
>the Lakota.
Care to tell everyone what part of the Lakota are "Blackfoot"??? Do the Lakota
know this? Do you know what a Lakota is??
You done some trolling on the AOL Native boards... you going to do it here
too??
KDenn39
>
Then why is there a Blackfeet tribe in Canada?
Randy
fight?
Im not. I am saying however that until the whites came, there was no such
thing as Blackfeet. Thats all. I do not want to spend the time explaining
this to you though.
If you really want to learn you can go back to the web site you first
mentioned and begin looking there. Or you can email me and I will give you
a lot more.
I explained in my first post thatt the Lakota have a *band* called Siha
Sapa. Siha Sapa means blackfeet. Thats all I said. Read my first post and
find out. The other bands are Miniconjou, Oohenumpa, Itazipachola, Oglala,
Hunkpapa, and Sichhangu.
One more thing KDenn. If I post something you disagree with, and then I
explain my position, by doing that I am not saying you are a bad person or
you are an idiot or dumb or anything. All I am doing is just explaining
what I wrote. We all are wrong sometimes, you and me even. Dont be so
defensive; Im not trying to start an argument. So if you are going to call
me a troll now, fine. I just won't answer you any more.
adios
Randy
"KDenn39" <kde...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000301002451...@ng-dc1.aol.com...
KDenn39
>> You done some trolling on the AOL Native boards... you going to do it here
>> too??
>
Then Randy wrote:
> So if you are going to call
>me a troll now, fine. I just won't answer you any more.
My post was not even in response to Randy, however he did take it that way.. my
response was to wicca person who has been a ding a ling on the AOL boards... I
dont even think Randy is a member of AOL to be a troll there.
>..why are you looking for a
>fight?
I love a good debate.. if others want to take it for a fight, I can rumble with
the best of um!
> I am saying however that until the whites came, there was no such
>thing as Blackfeet.
Before the whites came, there were many tribes who had their own names... not
just one or two... whites renamed a lot of things..
Yonagadoga
There is one other explanation of this "Blackfoot Cherokee" term. Seems
it was used in the late 18th century to describe the Tuscaroras, a group
closely related to the Cherokees, who left North Carolina for the Buffalo, NY
area in 1713 after losing a rebellion against the English colonists.
According to the story, they were called "Blackfoot" because they had
traveled through a burnt-out area.
Yona.
TREV
decendants of African Slaves who escaped into Canada. Most people
also think that just because you're Native American, you never
leave the reservations. And we all know that that's not true. So
the possiblilty of Native American and other races, including
Afro American, coming together, if you will, is not an
impossibility.
In article <0a9cba16...@usw-ex0103-019.remarq.com>, hengruh
TREV
ancestried people I know tell me that they have a hard enough
time being Black and that claiming to be anything else doesn't
make their life any better but that they don't neglect one
ancestry for the other. They just don't make their ancestry a
public statement because when people see them, the first thing
they see is Black. They tell me that as long as they don't forget
their ancestry and as long as they let their children know about
their ancestry, that's all that matters.
Randy
randy
"Yonagadoga" <yonag...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000301132852...@ng-df1.aol.com...
Randy
misinterpretation.
Thanks
Randy
"KDenn39" <kde...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000301111305...@ng-de1.aol.com...
Hokte
Trev, I really did appreciate your comment. I am a Black/Native with
Blackfoot ancestry. The circumstances that brought my family to it's
current place, may have been unusual, but it did occur. I can't speak
for everyone's family, I only know about my own. I'm sure that many
may claim Blackfoot ancestry erroneously, but no one knows everything
about their heritage. My acknowledgement of my Native heritage is not
because I am a wannabe. To dismiss any part of my heritage would be
very disrespectful to my ancestors who survived so that I could be here
today.
Cehecares,
Hokte
TREV
of them are proud to be Black and nothing else. They figure their
lives are much better for that. Most of the ones I know are just
proud to know and have friends who are Indians.
But I never deny any one their heritage, be they Indian, Black or
martian. I don't know what runs through other peoples veins.
Frankly, I don't care.
It is no big amazing wonder that Indians and Blacks mixed,
Freedman or not. It happened and it is still happening. And I am
sure there are a lot of Black "tribes in the sense of Africa" who
refused and still refuses to accept the mixing of blood. But that
still doesn't say that it didn't happen or that it's not
happening.
What is a wonder to me is that the Black/Indian mixed people that
I know, are proud of both their ancestry and they proclaim and
celebrate it. There's nothing wrong with that. But it is wrong
when they choose to learn and know and live one over the other.
Life as a Freedman or Indian, was a way of survival for both
people and I am happy the Freedman loved the Indians enough to
want to claim a kinship, even if the blood didn't flow through
"some" of the Freedman's veins. And for the ones who blood flows
of both people, I solute them. Especially the Black/Choctaw, I
solute their courage and "want" to even be socially acquainted
with the people in which they had to struggle against to seek a
life of freedom from slavery for a second time.
You want to know my definition of wannabe? Here it is: some one
who not only claims something they are not but they paint up,
they don feathers, they speak the "Oooooh Great Spirit" talk,
everything is "Sacred";
they horn their way to the drum and they sing and they feel this
"liar's" spirit; they give themselves an "Indian name" and they
give their dog and horse Indian names; they go back in history,
get some poor soul's name, like Crazy Horse, and claim he is
their gggggggggggggggrand-father, and they give up the religion
and the way of life that they were raised in, for the "Red Road",
and they can spout off every thing about Indians, they are
experts on the subject of Indians. They will even go so far as to
pay big money for someone to teach them how to be Indian and when
they get just a little bit on knowledge under their moccasins,
they get this great idea, "I'm a pipe carrier "or "I'm a medicine
man or woman" or "I'll be damned, I'm a holy man, I can now hold
"sacred" ceremonies" and they form new tribes, lordy mercy! And
you know what, they haven't a clue as to what it all means.
They are the ones who will when it comes to getting a job,
wouldn't put "Indian or Native American" on the job application,
because their chances of getting that job are better if they
didn't. They are only Indian when it's convenient.
Boy, I could go on. But it's getting late or early as it is.
WiccaIrish
>Care to tell everyone what part of the Lakota are "Blackfoot"??? Do the
>Lakota
>know this? Do you know what a Lakota is??
>
>You done some trolling on the AOL Native boards... you going to do it here
>too??
It seems to me that your the one doing the trolling, always trying to start
something or say something really rude (I don't go around calling people trolls
and calling them non-NAs). I say you need to cool it, you seem to have a
problem with me voiceing my opinions or other people trying to make connections
with NAs and other cultures (e.g., Tibetans and Navajos, Celts and NAs). I
filtered you from the AOL boards and it looks like I will have to do the same
to you on the newsgroup. I never wanted to start anything, I simply corrected
you because I know that me and other Blackfoot people have a problem with the
tribe being called "Blackfeet." I'll stand by my belief and I could careless
what you or anybody else thinks of me. Please do not try to contact me, even by
email like you did last time.
KDenn39
There are some people who are Black and Indian mixed, but not as many as some
think there are..
Many tribes who had slaves gave the Black people their own tribe when slavery
was abolished.. Indians did not think just to set them "free" by golly, they
needed their own tribe... and so there are the "Freedman" tribes... Now,
generations later, more Blacks than not have taken this to mean they have
Indian blood.. simply not the case...
I have never met a Black person who did not claim to be Cherokee, or Blackfoot.
Every now and then a different tribe is claimed... not often.
Just because a person is Black does not mean they are automatically Indian as
well... in fact, most tribes forbid the mixing of Indian and Black peoples...
KDenn39
I been on this board over a year... maybe two? You just came here.. your a
troll..
>I say you need to cool it,
Nope, freedom of speech, I will say what I want too..
>you seem to have a
>problem with me voiceing my opinions or other people trying to make
>connections
>with NAs and other cultures (e.g., Tibetans and Navajos, Celts and NAs).
That is where your problem in AOL started.. trying to say Indians were like the
Celts, funny thing is you never claimed to be Indian on AOL boards, in fact
said you had no Indian blood... and now suddenly you want to make a claim that
does not belong to you?? OH yes, lets not forget your comment that you found it
ironic that Irish have Indian blood??
>I
>filtered you from the AOL boards and it looks like I will have to do the same
>to you on the newsgroup.
Please do.. then I will be able to make cracks about you...
>I never wanted to start anything,
You did, every time you post you want to start something...
>I simply corrected
>you because I know that me and other Blackfoot people have a problem with the
>tribe being called "Blackfeet."
Like I said, you suddenly claim to be of a tribe but when you first came to the
boards on AOL you said you were not Indian, but that you are "wiccan" and
"Irish"
>I'll stand by my belief and I could careless
>what you or anybody else thinks of me.
That is fine.. your a wannabe on AOL and a wannabe on the newsgroup...
>Please do not try to contact me, even by
>email like you did last time.
Hahaha temptation... never play fate
KDenn39
>misinterpretation.
>Thanks
No problem Randy :o)
Kip King
I'm mixed blood, and I consider myself to be Indian, not part-Indian.
Both of my parents and all my relatives who have been alive in my
lifetime are or were Indian.
TREV wrote:
> (snip)
> But it is wrong
> when they choose to learn and know and live one over the other.
> (snip)
Kip King
TREV
If you are mixed Native America and White and you choose to learn
and know the culture of Native American and neglect or ignore the
White culture (whatever that might be), I feel, you are doing a
great dishonor to your White ancestors and I think this is wrong.
Wouldn't it be better to know them both? They both make you
whole.
<Most Indian-white mixed bloods choose to be one race. I'm mixed
blood, and I consider myself to be Indian, not part-Indian. Both
of my parents and all my relatives who have been alive in my
lifetime are or were Indian. snip from Kip>
It has nothing to do with being part this or part that. It's
about knowing where you come from and who and what made you.
John
Freedmen of the "Five Civilized Tribes. These figures represent adult,
minor, and newborn Freedmen of each tribe. Each of the Freedmen were
eligible for allotted land in Oklahoma along with the Indians of each tribe.
Can't verify whether any were or were not mixed blood.
Cherokee 4909
Chickasaw 4674
Choctaw 5991
Creek 6802
Seminole 986
Total 23362
These figures were taken from a cd produced by the Oklahoma Historical
Society containing the Dawes Rolls for the Five Civilized Tribes. I CAN NOT
verify the accuracy of the cd. These Freedmen were granted freedom from
slavery with the Emancipation Proclamation and were living in Indian
Territory of what is now Oklahoma in 1907.
John
"KDenn39" <kde...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000302001708...@ng-dc1.aol.com...
Randy
But *living* them both is impossible. What if one parent is Christian and
the other atheist?? Could you live both lives here also? Does this analogy
provide you with more clues???
You can only *be one person, not two. You can only live one life, not two.
Knowing and understanding them both is necessary and logical. Living them
both, conflicting as they are, is impossible.
Think about it.
Randy
"TREV" <jeannette.bu...@lmco.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:049d17a4...@usw-ex0102-015.remarq.com...
Kip King
think there is a difference between a mixed blood who had one Indian
parent and one non Indian parent and a mixed blood like me (and many
eastern Indians) who comes from a long line of mixed bloods. I liken our
situation to that of some Mexicans who know that they descend from
Indians and non Indians, but who have only known mixed blood ancestors
for generations.
TREV wrote:
>
> <Why is it wrong? snip from Kip>
>
> If you are mixed Native America and White and you choose to learn
> and know the culture of Native American and neglect or ignore the
> White culture (whatever that might be), I feel, you are doing a
> great dishonor to your White ancestors and I think this is wrong.
>
> Wouldn't it be better to know them both? They both make you
> whole.
>
TREV
No, the Slaves were not captured but just as they went to live
with the Cherokee, Seminole, Chickasaw and other Nations, they
went to live with the Chocktaw, thinking they would be free. But
they were actually, in a sense, still slaves and they were
treated as slaves. So they had to wage a war against the Chocktaw
to get out from under. Many people were killed.
TREV
of injustice to both people. According to what I have read, he
gathered and recorded his information based on the shade of a
person's skin. If you were a very pale Indian, you were recorded
as Indian and if you were anything darker than vanilla, you were
recorded as Black. That is why so many people of both ancestry
are having such a difficult time completing their family tree.
This is something so far off the subject but, have you heard
about the new Tigger movie (Winnie The Pooh)? Well I have Black
friends that are in a roar. The movie is about Tigger trying to
find all of his Tigger relatives and he wants to fill his Tigger
Tree. My Black friends don't like the name, Tigger, because when
little kids say Tigger, it sounds to close to the "n" word. They
are so funny and they have just made a complete comedy show about
this. They are making so much humor over this, LOL... Crazy
people
Anyway, back to the subject at hand.
With the Dawes Role, you sometimes can't tell who's what. You
just have to get information from family if possible.
Thanks again.
TREV
said "live". I guess I just saw that he with mixed blood
considers himself as Indian and live as Indian. And I took from
this that the White ancestry was set aside, if you will. As long
as one ancestry isn't neglected for another, then that is good.
Everybody has the right to know who made them and their children
has the right to know.
I have a Chinese/Lakota friend and she teaches her children only
about her Chinese ancestry because she thinks so lowly of her
Native American ancestry. She absolutlly refuses to let her kids
know anything about them. This is so wrong and there have been
time when she has stopped talking to me because I disagree.
But people have to live and learn.
TREV
because one ancestry race is no longer living in the family
doesn't meant they should be forgotten. DNA is a life long chain,
from generation to generation. Somewhere in the chain, there are
still traits of all of your mixture. I just think a person should
learn, know and never forget. And hey, when it comes to health
issues, that's very important.
TREV
were accepted and successful and still there. Others were not
accepted and I have to believe that that happened because they
were to Americanized, the blood was too watered. Maybe the skin
was too white or light. See there is predjudice everywhere. But
mostly I think they didn't survive there was because they
couldn't live that life.
It's like a lot of Suburban Native Americans who have never lived
on a reservation. They would have a very difficult time living on
the reservations.
LOL, why you say Cherokee? And why you say Black? I could be
orange and stripped black and be a Tigger family member .. LOL
make sure that the "T" is the first letter there.
But I don't think it's that difficult actually. Because Black and
Native American, like you said, have lived in common means and
have to still live that commonality. And there are a lot of
things that are common in both cultures. They way we raise
families (well some things have changed today, they use to raise
their families in the same manner, city life has changed a lot
of this). Both people see the earth and nature as a force not to
be messed with. Both people care about and don't want the natural
resources abused. But I think the greed of money has changed a
lot of these likes. And when I think about the mineral mines in
Africa and I see how the land has been destroyed by money hungry
people from other countries and how some of the African people
have been influenced by the wealth, and how they have become just
as greedy, it makes me sick.
Both Native American and Black have always felt a higher power,
"spirituality" , being in control and really trusted and believed
in this higher power, unwavering.
But what I like about the Native Americans, especially what I
hear about life on the reservations, even though some people are
living at and sometimes below the poverty level, they still have
maintained "family" and they teach the culture.
Now Black families no longer have that luxury. But a lot of Black
people are trying their best to "go back" and learn the African
culture so that they can bring it to the people and the children.
I think this is good because it gives the younger people
something to look forward to and it gives them something to be
proud of.
I think it is a tad bit more difficult with Native American/White
mix. And I believe so because of the way the Native Americans
have been treated by the Whites. I think it's like the struggle
that Black/White mixed people have to face. One side of the
person is always fighting with the other.
With Native American/Black mix, I feel like there's nothing to
fight against because both sides are "rocking in the same boat".
The Seminole and Black relationship was something that the US
government has never been able to put down. No matter how hard
they tried. I love it!!!! And it's still going strong today.
KDenn39
handle being white... because of being a person of color has enriched my life..
sure there are hard times... but I would not have traded it for the world.
>And I am
>sure there are a lot of Black "tribes in the sense of Africa" who
>refused and still refuses to accept the mixing of blood.
I heard some Blacks tried to return to Africa, but they were not accepted...
have you heard anything about this?
>It is no big amazing wonder that Indians and Blacks mixed,
Oh it did happen.. I seen a photo of the most handsome man I ever seen, he was
Oglala and Black... I hope to find that photo again some day and scan it.. it
was a old photo.
>What is a wonder to me is that the Black/Indian mixed people that
>I know, are proud of both their ancestry and they proclaim and
>celebrate it.
And while on this subject, (something I have wanted to ask but keep forgetting)
You, mixed Black and Cherokee (right?) anyway, how hard is it to be in both
cultures from what you see of a white Indian mixed person?
>Especially the Black/Choctaw, I
>solute their courage and "want" to even be socially acquainted
>with the people in which they had to struggle against to seek a
>life of freedom from slavery for a second time.
Have you related to the Freedmen of the Seminole? Great relationship there...
>lordy mercy! And
>you know what, they haven't a clue as to what it all means.
Lordy do I know LOL
KDenn39
You know Kip, I think there is a difference between white and Indian mix to
Black and Indian mixed.. why?? Because the Black and Indian people actually
have many things that are common.. we do share a close knit family relationship
with our elders and to extended family members.. we also share hardships in the
US of A, I think we can relate more to each other, and so one cannot compare a
Black Indian mixed to a white Indian mixed... specially if the white was raised
in white socitety where as a Black person already has been raised in many ways
of a Indian.. not that ways are just Indian, but we have so many common links,
and respect...
KDenn39
>eligible for allotted land in Oklahoma along with the Indians of each tribe.
I believe I had heard a man from the Seminole Nation talk about this, and it
was the Indians decission to allot part of their lands to the recently freed
slaves.. a wonderful thing in my opinion... sharing... so I for one would not
doubt the CD...
My people are on the Dawes rolls with the Cherokee.. but we are NOT Cherokee
people...
I also think the Dawes rolls are a great source for research.. information is
hard to find on Indians and Blacks...
Kip King
of my closest friends (he's more like a brother to me) is Creek,
Cherokee and black. He looks noticebly black but considers himself
Indian. He's a master of many types of Indian singing: war dance, round
dance, gourd dance and peyote. Over the years I've dated several women
who were Indian and black (including my current companion, she looks
black too).
Kip King
and has three kids by her. We have sweats at his house. I can't go in,
because of my multiple sclerosis, but I often man the door.
Carter
> >solute their courage and "want" to even be socially acquainted
> >with the people in which they had to struggle against to seek a
> >life of freedom from slavery for a second time.
what was meant? Does this person think slaves escaped from white master
first and then were captured by Choctaws and had to fight for freedom
again? And now they want a 'social aquaintance' with the Choctaw?
something wrong here
Kip King
make up a politically dominate minority there. They are called
Americo-Liberians. Also a black Jamaican, Marcus Garvey, organized a few
boat loads of black Americans to go "back to Africa". He originally
wanted to transport all blacks in the Americas "back to Africa".
KDenn39 wrote:
> (snip)
> I heard some Blacks tried to return to Africa, but they were not accepted...
> have you heard anything about this?
>(snip)
theg...@bigfoot.com
I will try to be brief as I don't mean to give my moment by moment genealogical
search. My Mother's Mother (Gran) who is Eng/Irish is so glad for me to be tracking
things. My Grandfather and his Mother both had very short lives. Short lives but,
very influencing on the family they raised. Both were strong, loving people with
spirits so great they radiated and caused strangers to be friends. My G-Aunt is
unfortunately unable to communicate. My maternal Grandmother has told that she
isn't so sure if G-Grandma might have as much African blood as Indian blood because
of the intensity of her skin color. Grandma loved her husband and his Mother very
much and I hope I do them all well.
Jennifer
p.s. I don't have their glorious pigmentation, but have been told by more than one
person that they can tell that I am a mix of something. I have a very sweet memory
of overhearing two young Sisters trying to figure out what I am. (If I was an
African mix or not.) Things are truly in the eye of the beholder because once on my
first flight to England a white woman shocked and insulted me greatly by slyly
mentioning to me, "Don't worry love, you are the right type." (????) sheesh
KDenn39 wrote:
> I were not Indian I would want to be Black.. I really dont think I could
> handle being white... because of being a person of color has enriched my life..
> sure there are hard times... but I would not have traded it for the world.
>
> >And I am
> >sure there are a lot of Black "tribes in the sense of Africa" who
> >refused and still refuses to accept the mixing of blood.
>
> I heard some Blacks tried to return to Africa, but they were not accepted...
> have you heard anything about this?
>
> >It is no big amazing wonder that Indians and Blacks mixed,
>
> Oh it did happen.. I seen a photo of the most handsome man I ever seen, he was
> Oglala and Black... I hope to find that photo again some day and scan it.. it
> was a old photo.
>
> >What is a wonder to me is that the Black/Indian mixed people that
> >I know, are proud of both their ancestry and they proclaim and
> >celebrate it.
>
> And while on this subject, (something I have wanted to ask but keep forgetting)
> You, mixed Black and Cherokee (right?) anyway, how hard is it to be in both
> cultures from what you see of a white Indian mixed person?
>
> >Especially the Black/Choctaw, I
> >solute their courage and "want" to even be socially acquainted
> >with the people in which they had to struggle against to seek a
> >life of freedom from slavery for a second time.
>
Anuh1
>The African nation of Liberia was founded by American blacks. They still
>make up a politically dominate minority there. They are called
>Americo-Liberians. Also a black Jamaican, Marcus Garvey, organized a few
>boat loads of black Americans to go "back to Africa". He originally
>wanted to transport all blacks in the Americas "back to Africa".
>
Interesting, Kip. I've never heard that before. But I have heard that taking
all Blacks back to Africa was Abraham Lincoln's preference. It was slavery
that he was wanting to eliminate. He didn't much like Blacks, as such.
Kip King
American history was of Minnesota Sioux POW's under Lincoln.
John
Seminole rich plantation owners who owned slaves before the Removal. Many
of them brought their slaves to Indian Territory and established their farms
and plantations in Indian Territory. They owned slaves to work their land.
Those slaves were freed by the Emancipation Proclamation at the close of the
Civil War. The freed slaves or Freedmen of those tribes were free to go
where they wished, but many continued to live in Indian Territory within the
Nations that freed them. These are the Freedmen on the Dawes Roll.
John
"TREV" <jeannette.bu...@lmco.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:024f9efa...@usw-ex0102-016.remarq.com...
> Carter, that was me, TREV.
>
> No, the Slaves were not captured but just as they went to live
> with the Cherokee, Seminole, Chickasaw and other Nations, they
> went to live with the Chocktaw, thinking they would be free. But
> they were actually, in a sense, still slaves and they were
> treated as slaves. So they had to wage a war against the Chocktaw
> to get out from under. Many people were killed.
>
>
Carter
how dark most of the five civilized fullbloods are? I'm old enough to
have known many, many Elders of those Nations who were the same color as
their parents. They damn sure ain't vanilla no matter what is written.
Also, you may be correct but I never have seen any evidence of the slave
rebellion against the Choctaw, could you tell me when or where? Was it
before the Freedmen townships were established? CC
TREV wrote:
>
> John, thank for the information. But I read that Dawes did a lot
> of injustice to both people. According to what I have read, he
> gathered and recorded his information based on the shade of a
> person's skin. If you were a very pale Indian, you were recorded
> as Indian and if you were anything darker than vanilla, you were
> recorded as Black. That is why so many people of both ancestry
> are having such a difficult time completing their family tree.
>
> This is something so far off the subject but, have you heard
> about the new Tigger movie (Winnie The Pooh)? Well I have Black
> friends that are in a roar. The movie is about Tigger trying to
> find all of his Tigger relatives and he wants to fill his Tigger
> Tree. My Black friends don't like the name, Tigger, because when
> little kids say Tigger, it sounds to close to the "n" word. They
> are so funny and they have just made a complete comedy show about
> this. They are making so much humor over this, LOL... Crazy
> people
>
> Anyway, back to the subject at hand.
>
> With the Dawes Role, you sometimes can't tell who's what. You
> just have to get information from family if possible.
>
> Thanks again.
>
John
several teams assigned to various areas of Indian Territory. Their job was
to record all Indians of the Five Civilized Tribes before abolishing Indian
Territory and determine who was eligible for land allotment. The land left
over after allocation to Indians was to be combined with Oklahoma Territory
to become the State of Oklahoma and open for white settlement. There were
many improprieties in the process. Many people claimed membership in the
Five Civilized Tribes who were not members, some who were members claimed
membership but could not document it. Many married into the tribes for the
sole purpose of obtaining land, then promptly dumped their Indian spouse
after obtaining title to the land. The Freedmen residing in Indian
Territory were eligible to enroll on the Dawes roll. Those Tribal Members
and Freedmen residing outside Indian Territory were not eligible for
enrollment.
John
"TREV" <jeannette.bu...@lmco.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:01402e4c...@usw-ex0102-015.remarq.com...
> John, thank for the information. But I read that Dawes did a lot
> of injustice to both people. According to what I have read, he
> gathered and recorded his information based on the shade of a
> person's skin. If you were a very pale Indian, you were recorded
> as Indian and if you were anything darker than vanilla, you were
> recorded as Black. That is why so many people of both ancestry
> are having such a difficult time completing their family tree.
>
Omoya
as someone else suggested. I'm Black with Creek ancestry, but many of
our relations and friends don't have a clue which Southeastern nation
they're from. Family lore links them to Native tribes, but the names
of those tribes have been lost. And so, I have a feeling that people
just kinda "improvised," along the way--possibly joking, until the joke
was lost in the family history orations. But I agree with the author
of this message--the Southeast is the place to begin, really, for many
reasons. Some of us were "slaves" of the Five Civilized Tribes, some
of us were allies in battle, some of us were runaways (the Underground
Railroad ran through Indian country, more often than not) who stopped
off and stayed...So odds are all those Blackfoot people...aren't...
TREV
the Dawes did the people an injustice. It was a man named Plecker
who did the so called count. And he use the shade of skin to
determine who was Indian and who wasn't. That's what I get for
distrubing a friend late at night so I can use her computer to
get to the internet. Gotta get me one of these things one day...
Forgive please.
Kip King
hengruh
TREV
William Katz. It is called "Black Indians, A Hidden Heritage". In
it it talks about how the Chocktaw and Chickasaw were just as
horrible if not worse the the White Slave owners.
But the book explains that the Chickasaw was much worse than the
Chocktaw.
I tried to find the story of the battle between the two people,
but I can't put my hands on it at this time. Forgive me if I am
wrong, but it maybe in the other book by Katz called "Proudly Red
and Black". Unfortunately, I loaned that book to a friend who
doesn't believe that there is such a person as Native and Black.
In "Black Indians", there is a paragraph that talks about how
even after emancipation, the Slaves refuse to leave the land and
the people that they had lived with and had grown to love, even
the Chickasaw. Now that's what I call strong love.
I thought at one time the story was on the net. I will look for
it and post the link.
Only the Seminole treated the Slaves as equals.
TREV
Indians. I said that the shade of the person's skin was used to
determine if they were Indian or Freedmen. Very light skined
people were recorded as Indian. Darker than very light shaded
people were enrolled as Freedmen.
I will find the article on how the enrollment was done and post
the link.
TREV
Do I give myself away? I know, it's that foot I got shoved down
my throat, isn't it?
I have tried to keep my amnaminity, animossity, unanamisity, ah,
you know, I didn't want anybody to know... hehehehehe
I tried to be secretive about this.
Geewiz.... you just know too much.
How da'heck you do that?
I frist came to alt.native back in 1995 and in mid 1996, I
couldn't get access anymore. Then like magic, I could get in and
came across this facinating conversation. I wish we could all
meet and talk.
I'm going down to Hampton University in Virginia to see the
exhibit of the Native Americans who went to Hampton. There is a
museum there dedicated to these Native students.
There is a great story there.
Take care!
TREV
I could never get to the white only fountains cause my mom would
grab me by the collar. Since then, I drink only Sprite!!
Dare me!!!
TREV
Oh but you forgot to say ...."it's sacred"
KDenn39
*uhummmm clearing my throat* I need to send you a belated birfday card <vbg>
I do enjoy the conversation here in this thread, I find it informative and it
is of things I have always thought about :o)
KDenn39
>>boat loads of black Americans to go "back to Africa". He originally
>>wanted to transport all blacks in the Americas "back to Africa".
>>
>Interesting, Kip. I've never heard that before.
I had heard about it, and had heard the were not all accepted back..
KDenn39
I dont know what was meant by that, but you are the right type... your a very
kind person.. who could ask for more?
When I was little there were still Black Only and White Only drinking fountains
at the court house.. one hot day when my mother had to be at the court house I
needed a drink of water, I could not read yet, and I drank from the Black Only
fountain... my sister teased me and told me I was gonna turn Black... I went
over to the White Only fountain, and took a drink from it.. I learned that
water was just as sweet no matter what fountain I drank from.. Now, I am in the
middle.. I drink Pepsi
KDenn39
>just have to get information from family if possible.
Family is always good, but the enrollees did give testimony of which are still
on record... it is amazing what you can learn from the testimonies.
Erik A. Mattila
> If the dawes com. only enrolled light skined ndns how do you account for
> how dark most of the five civilized fullbloods are? I'm old enough to
> have known many, many Elders of those Nations who were the same color as
> their parents. They damn sure ain't vanilla no matter what is written.
> Also, you may be correct but I never have seen any evidence of the slave
> rebellion against the Choctaw, could you tell me when or where? Was it
> before the Freedmen townships were established? CC
As Mr. K. Tiger once uttered: "Where I come from when someone sees a really black
blackman, they say he must gots some Seminole in him!"
Erik
>
> TREV wrote:
> >
> > John, thank for the information. But I read that Dawes did a lot
> > of injustice to both people. According to what I have read, he
> > gathered and recorded his information based on the shade of a
> > person's skin. If you were a very pale Indian, you were recorded
> > as Indian and if you were anything darker than vanilla, you were
> > recorded as Black. That is why so many people of both ancestry
> > are having such a difficult time completing their family tree.
> >
> > This is something so far off the subject but, have you heard
> > about the new Tigger movie (Winnie The Pooh)? Well I have Black
> > friends that are in a roar. The movie is about Tigger trying to
> > find all of his Tigger relatives and he wants to fill his Tigger
> > Tree. My Black friends don't like the name, Tigger, because when
> > little kids say Tigger, it sounds to close to the "n" word. They
> > are so funny and they have just made a complete comedy show about
> > this. They are making so much humor over this, LOL... Crazy
> > people
> >
> > Anyway, back to the subject at hand.
> >
> > With the Dawes Role, you sometimes can't tell who's what. You
> > just have to get information from family if possible.
> >
> > Thanks again.
theg...@bigfoot.com
Thank you,
Jenn
p.s. sweet story
KDenn39
Old Ndn secret <g> If I told you I would have to ... well you know the
saying... hehehehehehe
> I know, it's that foot I got shoved down
>my throat, isn't it?
What foot? Where? I dinnit see one <g>
>Geewiz.... you just know too much.
>
Shhhhh your going to get me to believe that LOL
>How da'heck you do that?
I will share many secrets with you.. but only in person
>Do I give myself away?
Jest a little
> I wish we could all
>meet and talk.
me too.. me too.. and one day I really do hope to meet you in person :o)
KDenn39
lol
>Dare me!!!
>
how about a double dare?
Kip King
Kip King
the south we never knew which town would expect us to follow the same
rules as negros (what blacks were called back then) and which towns
would treat us as whites. This situation was compounded by the fact that
my mom could pass and my dad couldn't.
Kip King
Europeans, so saying they were not accepted, means by the Europeans that
ran those countries (and created their borders along artificial colonial
lines, not natural African ethnic lines), not necessarily the native
black Africans.
Erik A. Mattila
> >Marcus Garvey, organized a few
> >>boat loads of black Americans to go "back to Africa". He originally
> >>wanted to transport all blacks in the Americas "back to Africa".
> >>
>
> >Interesting, Kip. I've never heard that before.
>
> I had heard about it, and had heard the were not all accepted back..
I got curious and looked up Garvey and Liberia on the internet. There's
a lot of interesting stuff.
The Marcus Garvey and Universal Negro Improvement Association Papers
Project (UCLA) http://www.isop.ucla.edu/mgpp/ Very interestin
collection of Garvey documents.
As far as I could see, Garvey helped quite a few African Americans, from
the Carribean as well as the US, return to Africa, and I think they
went to many countries. But the easiest was Liberia, which was then
under the political control of African Americans. During the Monroe
administration (1820) there was a scheme cooked up to repatriate
Freedman to Africa, and the initial action was a group of 200 black
colonists who the US Military establish a foothold between Sierra Leone
and the Ivory Coast to establish a new United States Colony. In 1847,
after much more immigration of Freedmen, the Republic of Liberia
declared independance from the United States, which apparently wasn't
opposed. The Americo Liberians seemed to have never been more that 5%
of the population, the majority being members of the 10 or so ethnic
groups who were living in this area of West Africa. The Americo
Liberians were overthrown during a civil war in the eighties by a 'War
Lord' of of one of the groups, and it was pretty bad news, similar to
other ethnic upheavels that have plagued West Africa in modern times.
However, there were peace accords in 1996, and various groups are today
vying for political power through elections.
Erik Mattila
Anuh1
<jeannette.bu...@lmco.com.invalid> writes:
>Forgive please.
Far as I can see, there isn't a whole lot to be forgiven here. I wouldn't
worry about it if I were you.
KDenn39
OH darn heheheheh is it too late to say it now??
Carter
> As Mr. K. Tiger once uttered: "Where I come from when someone sees a really black
> blackman, they say he must gots some Seminole in him!"
Carter
> > I know, it's that foot I got shoved down
> >my throat, isn't it?
>
> What foot? Where? I dinnit see one <g>
Thomas F Brown
> And Plecker did it in Virginia, not Oklahoma.
>TREV wrote:
>>
>> John and everybody, forgive me please. I typed wrong when I said
>> the Dawes did the people an injustice. It was a man named Plecker
>> who did the so called count. And he use the shade of skin to
>> determine who was Indian and who wasn't.
I didn't see your original post, but this one is incorrect. Plecker
used Census records and other rudimentary genealogical research
methods to categorize people he thought were passing as Indians.
He didn't use shade of skin color.
Erik A. Mattila
Carter wrote:
> Erik A. Mattila wrote:
> > As Mr. K. Tiger once uttered: "Where I come from when someone sees a really black
> > blackman, they say he must gots some Seminole in him!"
> Goddamn Erik, you must have read my mind. I was thinking about Ken :)
Sounds like you 2 ort to re-contact. I'll see what I can do. I think about Tiger
every time I hear the song "Cherokee Maid." One time we were riding along highway 101
between SF and Eureka, and he asked me "Did you ever hear that song "Cherokee Maid."
"Nope" I told him, "I can't say that I have." So he reaches over and switches the
radio on and they were playing "Cherokee Maid." About two months later we were riding
along, between Eureka and Chiliquin, Oregon, and he askes me "Did you ever hear that
song "Cherokee Maid." Before I answered, he reached over and switched on the radio,
and you guess it, "Cherokee Maid." The funny thing was that he was studying to be a
radio engineer at the time. I was sure that he had put a Country Western crystal-set
up where the sun don't shine or something. Or else it was just mystical, which is a
possibility. (I met a Cherokee in Oklahoma once who was an Automobile mystic, Paul
Rogers. We were driving the backroads around the old Dwight Mission School, near
Vian, and he turned to me and said "If you pull the third plug from the front, on the
right as you are standing in the front of the car, you'll see a hairline crack in the
insulator." I did, and he was right. I guess he must have been mentally timing the
strokes as we were cruising along at 28 thousand rpms in my friends 'over-the-hill'
Mercury.)
I also met a Lakota Caddillac mytic once. But you're going to have to twist my arm to
tell that story. He was formerly one of Dick Wilson's Goon Squad.
Erik
Kip King
http://www.timesdispatch.com/virginia/1pleck05.shtml
Kip King
TREV
methods for determining who was what. I will take time and find
the document.
SMea1958
<Rand...@interconnect.net> writes:
>You can only *be one person, not two. You can only live one life, not two.
>Knowing and understanding them both is necessary and logical. Living them
>both, conflicting as they are, is impossible.
>
>Think about it.
>
>Randy
I would be at odds living as an Indian practicing Am. Indian
Religion(shamanism?) and as a Celtic practicing Druidism(an ancient religion of
magic and mysticism)
SMea1958
>That friend I mentioned is married to a woman on one of the local rezes
>and has three kids by her. We have sweats at his house. I can't go in,
>because of my multiple sclerosis, but I often man the door.
Thanks, I know you are being blessed.
SMea1958
(KDenn39) writes:
>we do share a close knit family relationship
>with our elders and to extended family members..
which is why I respect you folks. You really do believe blood is thicker than
water. To my great and shattering disapointment, I found out my ex did not. He
believed lies about me. I could not live with a man who does not trust me.
SMea1958
(KDenn39) writes:
>Oh it did happen.. I seen a photo of the most handsome man I ever seen, he
>was
>Oglala and Black... I hope to find that photo again some day and scan it.. it
>was a old photo.
>
I met a lady at a powwow who is Indian and Black. She had a bearing of royalty
about her. Not the stuffy kind. The kind that lets you know she was proud to
be who she is. I think she said was of the Mandan tribe. Although it might be
Ogala since it was this post which reminded me of her. It has been over eight
years.
ORoc839278
I have enjoyed reading your postings but I have a question about your choice of
subject title: African Americans and Blackfoot?
Seems recently, that I keep reading posts on various boards from African
Americans claiming they have Blackfeet Indian ancestry and I wondered if
perhaps this was some sort of term used by people of Indian and Black ancestry
and did not infact mean they are looking for a Blackfeet ancestor.
Thanks for responding.
ORoc839278
Thank you for bringing up this issue as I for one have encountered this same
sort of claims from people of Southern Black origin. You are absolutely right
the Blackfeet people of Montana and Canada would have little to no contact with
African Americans. I live in the Northern Rockies and there still is very few
people of African origin living up here-mainly white with some ndns and a
growing Hispanic population.
I think there is confusion on the part of these claimees and that you may have
hit the nail on the head with they are extending this claim upon some word
associated misconception. The Blackfeet Tribe is physically VERY isolated and
have little contact with the outside world and I doubt many hooked up with any
former slaves simply because of geography.
I have a friend who is 3/4 Blackfeet from Browning who has a Sicilian ancestor
in her family tree and how he got up to Glacier counrty is quite legendary in
the tribe.
ORoc839278
are you enrolled in the Blackfeet Tribe? I hear a resounding, No. Unlike Randy
who did state some correct information in regards to the Siksika and
Piegans,your information is sketchy at best. I doubt you have ever been to the
reservation nor do you know anyone from there. You after all keep making this
absurd claim about African Americans who were part "Blackfoot" who denied their
heritage so they could keep their land with complete disregard for the
geography of the tribe.
I have lived in Montana and have friends from Browning who are enrolled tribal
members and when referring to themselves in English called themselves,
Blackfeet.
ORoc839278
If you read there opening page it clearly states welcome to the Blackfeet Tribe
of Montana's homepage.....it does not list Blackfoot.
Randy
Sometimes you dont get all the info from the internet. Most of the People
in Browning don't get the internet. The name "Blackfeet" is a white name
which was forced on us in 1935 under the Wheeler-Howard Act....ie....the
IRA.
Randy
"ORoc839278" <oroc8...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000321003136...@ng-fg1.aol.com...
FourCrows
kde...@aol.com (KDenn39) wrote:
> >Wow, do you know Black people who are wannabes? The Black/Native
> >ancestried people I know tell me that they have a hard enough...
> There are some people who are Black and Indian mixed, but not as
> many as some
> think there are..
> Many tribes who had slaves gave the Black people their own tribe
> when slavery
> was abolished.. Indians did not think just to set them "free" by
> golly, they
> needed their own tribe... and so there are the "Freedman"
> tribes... Now,
> generations later, more Blacks than not have taken this to mean
> they have
> Indian blood.. simply not the case...
> I have never met a Black person who did not claim to be Cherokee,
> or Blackfoot.
> Every now and then a different tribe is claimed... not often.
> Just because a person is Black does not mean they are
> automatically Indian as
> well... in fact, most tribes forbid the mixing of Indian and Black
> peoples...
Aneen!
Just thought I'd add some more ingrediants to this stewing
conversation. Many of the tribes I work for and with down here in
Louisiana (Biloxi, Caddo, Chitimacha, Tunica, Avogel and their
combinations) have black, creole and cajun roots. Mainly it was due to
any non-whites being forced to live elsewhere (sometimes for their own
protection and peace). Naturally, they intermarried. Many of these
tribes have African/American ancestry in some of their families. In
fact, some of them have a hard time proving NDN bloodlines, but it has
been accepted they are because they were isolated and/or ostracized
from the mainsteam society. Since they lived in the "wilderness"
(bayous and swamps), it was assumed they must be Indians. I'm sure
many of these groups met and married NDNs who nbo one knew were living
in these wild areas. However, other than the Mardi Gras Indians, no
one around here claims Blackfoot/feet as a bloodline.
FourCrows
FourCrows
Replying to you and everyone in general, i guess. Since we are talking
of mixed ancestry (or mixed up in some cases). Has anyone ever heard
of the Mingos? Apparently they were a group of NDNs and outcasts who
formed a few villages along the Ohio River. They were apparently made
up of Traders, Shawnee, Seneca, Miami, and others who left their own
tribes for whatever reason. Whatever happened to this group? Can't
seem to find any info other than cursory mentions in a few books.
Thanks. Four Crows
tkavanagh
> Aneen Randy-
>
> Replying to you and everyone in general, i guess. Since we are talking
> of mixed ancestry (or mixed up in some cases). Has anyone ever heard
> of the Mingos? Apparently they were a group of NDNs and outcasts who
> formed a few villages along the Ohio River. They were apparently made
> up of Traders, Shawnee, Seneca, Miami, and others who left their own
> tribes for whatever reason. Whatever happened to this group? Can't
> seem to find any info other than cursory mentions in a few books.
According to Vol 15 (Northeast) of the Handbook of North American Indians, p
320, "From Delaware came the name Mingo, applied to non-League Senecas,
Cayugas, and other Iroquoians in the Ohio Valley in the 18th Century, whose
descendants are the Seneca-Cayuga of Oklahoma."
Also, p 622: In Western PA and Ohio, the Shawnee were closely associated with
that section of the Iroquois called the Mingo, later known s the Seance of San
dusky (citations) The solaced Eastern Shawnee eventually split away from the
rest of their tribe to accompany these Seances to Oklahoma."
tk
Kip King
In colonial times, they lived under a Chief named John Logan. I think
some descendants may still live in West Virginia.
FourCrows wrote:
>
> Aneen Randy-
>
> Replying to you and everyone in general, i guess. Since we are talking
> of mixed ancestry (or mixed up in some cases). Has anyone ever heard
> of the Mingos? Apparently they were a group of NDNs and outcasts who
> formed a few villages along the Ohio River. They were apparently made
> up of Traders, Shawnee, Seneca, Miami, and others who left their own
> tribes for whatever reason. Whatever happened to this group? Can't
> seem to find any info other than cursory mentions in a few books.
>
Kip King
Randy
the NDN guy named Mingo....but maybe I was just dreamin'...........I try and
do that sometimes....
As for this post, I really dont know how it got started again. I thought it
was history and then suddenly....here it is again. Just cant kill it with a
stick!
Randy
"FourCrows" <mhazlett...@eatel.net.invalid> wrote in message
news:0146ce5a...@usw-ex0107-049.remarq.com...
ORoc839278
You're right we have been over this before.
I just thought it was interesting people who don't live in Montana nor have
been to the Blackfeet rez equate themselves as experts. By the way, the
Blackfeet in Montana are called the Pikuni-got some friends from up around
there.
Thanks for the information about the name information-you learn something
everyday.
Randy
Thanks.
Randy
"ORoc839278" <oroc8...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000321184606...@ng-ba1.aol.com...
Kip King
Kip King wrote:
>
> As far as I know, the Mingo were (are) a mixture of Cayuga and Shawnee.
> In colonial times, they lived under a Chief named John Logan. I think
> some descendants may still live in West Virginia.
>
> FourCrows wrote:
> > >
Kip King
Tony Manyfingers
ORoc839278 wrote in message
<20000321184606...@ng-ba1.aol.com>...
>Randy,
>
>You're right we have been over this before.
>I just thought it was interesting people who don't live in Montana nor have
>been to the Blackfeet rez equate themselves as experts. By the way, the
>Blackfeet in Montana are called the Pikuni-got some friends from up around
>there.
>Thanks for the information about the name information-you learn something
>everyday.
Oki.
Is it true that the American "Siksika " Indians who adopted the IRA
constitution adopted the name Blackfeet
because they did not want o be call "Blackfoots"?
Tony on the Blood Rez