Leonard's voice
alvintchase
intimate voice of any singer in pop music.I agree with him.I'm
listening to "The best of Leonard Cohen" now,and his voice might not
be great on a technical level,but it sounds really good to me...
~greg
"alvintchase" <relay...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:a78957eb.04101...@posting.google.com...
CLARICE ...
Christgau said everything I need to catch him
is right here in these pages...
ARDELIA
Christgau said a lot of things.
(Just in case anyone doesn't know it,
I have seen "Silence of the Lambs"
(-a few (thousand) times.)
In this case I "apply" it to
Robert Christgau.)
~
Christgau said different things at different times.
The best thing about him is that he's often reviewed
his own reviews, often changing his mind in the process.
I've always found Christgau worth reading, ever since 1967,
back when there was any competition (eg -Crawdaddy.)
Everything he's written, he's written clearly, and passionately,
and always with something disturbing to say, - a few
highly-provocative partial-truths. You may never get the
whole truth from him. But then again I'm too lazy to write
it all up.
What Christgau says about The Best of Leonard Cohen [Columbia, 1975]
on his internet site:
http://www.robertchristgau.com/get_artist.php?id=791&name=Leonard+Cohen
is this:
"I've always found "Sisters of Mercy" unnecessarily (and uncharacteristically)
icky--you can read their address by the moon, eh? But if like me you admire
his records more than you play them, this is the one you'll pull off the shelf. A- "
But:
"icky"
- misses the point that the song is intended to be a lullaby.
"eh?"
- misses the point that that image is a haiku.
and:
"admire ... more than ...play"
- is much the same fallacy as the "Omega Point proof of God"
[essentially that, for consciousness to have evolved
in the universe, the parameters of the universe had
to have been so finely tweaked, that only a conscious
hand could have effected it. The fallacy is much the
same as it is for most probability fallacies; - the
absence of a clear 'sample-space' for the comparison.
In this case, if Christgau played Cohen as much as he
says he admires him, then there'd be no way he could
ear-stomach 99% of the other music that he has to listen
to in order to write his reviews. And so those reviews
whould not exist. And in particular, this particular review,
with the line: "admire ...more than...play" - would simply
not exist.]
As for myself, about that last point, I don't listen
to Cohen as much as I admire him either. But it's
because if I did, I am certain I'd burn up in paroxysms
of nostalgia. I found that I could listen to specific songs
with impunity usually only when some discussion of
them had come up on the ng, so that there's something
specific to think about or search for in them. I think that's
what I am going to miss most about the ng.
poetman
>The rock critic, Robert Christgau said that Leonard Cohen had the most
intimate voice of any singer in pop music.
I am not gay. Can a truly heterosexual man praise another man's voice with
the word 'intimate'? Robert Christgau also seems to be saying that people
don't find Cohen's 'intimate' voice appealing, for how else then can one
explain Cohen's limited fame or album sales? Is Robert Christgau saying that
my grandmother, who never showed any interest whatsoever when I played a
Cohen record, was deaf to quality music? Is he criticising everybody that
doesn't agree with him by saying that they have bad taste?
>[Leonard Cohen's] voice might not be great on a technical level
What exactly might be wrong with it, technically?
Joe Way
I think that's
> what I am going to miss most about the ng.
What is this shit? I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that
you've had bad medical information, but even thus, I'm a big believer in
"the power of positive thinking." Doctor Norman Vincent Peale is holding
you in good thoughts right now.
If there is something that you have to tell us-then fire away. However, if
it is just some mildly miffed, warm-blooded, loser, bullshit, then, fuck
you!
All of us get tired and want to quit sometime-not just our tawdry, shabby
jobs, or our demanding families, but the words that reach toward oblivion.
Who gave you permission to just end it right here after some soft-shoe,
ass-ended, clarrisa-clouded, lamb putrid observations.
All of your goddamn research is dross. Get with it man-and don't give us
this drifted archetype!
Joe
>
>
>
>
>
>
~greg
"Joe Way" > ...
> Greg wrote:
>
> > I think that's what I am going to miss most about the ng.
>
> What is this shit?
Great! - Thank you, Joe! :)
Here's the rest of it:
SGT. TATE:
What is this shit?
Did somebody go up on five?
OFFICER JACOBS:
No. Nobody went up.
SGT. TATE:
Call Pembry, ask him to tell...
...gunshots...
SGT. TATE:
CP, shots fired on five!
Repeat, shots fires on five!
BOBBY:
Sergeant Tate!
SGT. TATE:
Holly shit!
Various:
What the hell?
(son of a) Bitch! etc.
SGT. TATE:
Shut up!
Bobby, get the vest.
BOBBY:
Right, Sarge.
OFFICER JACOBS:
Look! It stopped!
SGT. TATE:
Seal off a ten block radius.
Get me the swat team and an ambulance,
double quick. We're goin up!
--------------------
It's always been my intention, Joe, to hang around
here just long enough to suck out the silver tongues
of the silver-tonged devils who post here. To acquire
their power. The better to speak in tongues.
But now's the time for me too to escape the confines of this cage.
But, like Hannibal Lector, I'll be leaving
"In another face"
(Astral Weeks - Van Morrison)
That is to say, like all the other little Hannibal Lectors
who have left here before me, I will be leaving my reasons
behind, in the form of the half-eaten carcasses of the
posters who I have found to be rude (from *my* perspective):
LECTER:
I would not have had that happen to you.
Discourtesy is unspeakably ugly to me.
But the real thing is, Joe, there are just so many OT references
to one movie, -however perfect, - one poster should be
permitted to make. So I must now leave this place, to go
off and watch some other movies, - any other movie!
(
Let's see.
Here's a Jennifer Love Hewitt flick I haven't seen:
"If Only" (2004)
"After his impetuous musician girlfriend, Emily (Hewitt),
dies in an accident shortly after they had a fight
(and nearly broke up), a grief-stricken British businessman,
Peter Wyndham (Nicholls), living in London gets a chance
to relive the day all over again, in the hope of changing
the events that led up to her getting killed..."
Sounds promising.
A reviewer says it's "...a huge step for her.
one of the best acted films in a great while."
Guess I'll be quoting from "If Only" from now on,
just as soon as I get a chance to see it.
)
> I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that
> you've had bad medical information,
What do you mean, Joe?
You know perfectly well I was diagnosed 'passive-aggressive'!
-Not in itself fatal, perhaps. But the perfect excuse
to "take my ball and go home".
> but even thus, I'm a big believer in
> "the power of positive thinking."
> Doctor Norman Vincent Peale is holding
> you in good thoughts right now.
Yes; -- but he be dead, Joe!
- died about 10 years ago, -age 95.
(Died of a stray negative thought, I beleive.)
And yes, I know all dead people hold me in high regard.
It's called "envy of the living".
It's why we put heavy stones over their graves;
- so they can't crawl out and literally eat our brains
(as they do literately.)
> If there is something that you have to tell us-then fire away. However, if
> it is just some mildly miffed, warm-blooded, loser, bullshit,
what is it that's got me down the most?
--just this:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/Presidential_04/chart3way.html
> then, fuck you!
> All of us get tired and want to quit sometime-not just our tawdry, shabby
> jobs, or our demanding families, but the words that reach toward oblivion.
> Who gave you permission to just end it right here after some soft-shoe,
> ass-ended, clarrisa-clouded, lamb putrid observations.
"CLARICE", Joe,
- not "clarissa":
CLARICE:
You see a lot, Joe, But are
you strong enough to point that high-
powered perception at yourself? How
about it...? Look at yourself and
write down the truth.
Or maybe you're afraid to.
"A census taker once tried to test me."
- true story. Came to my door and began asking questions.
I told him he probably didn't want me - I was sure I'd skew
his statistics some way or other. But I wanted to be cooperative.
Right up until he asked me my 'race'.
Then I told him to go to hell.
Another one came back a couple of days later.
And then another one a couple of days after that.
I still don't know if I was braking the law by refusing to cooperate.
(--eg, jury-duty was obligatory.)
And I've heard all the arguments, and I've found use for
or 'enjoyed' census statistics, and I am more or less
pro affirmative action (--rationally applied).
But something in my gut refuses to go along with 'race' statistics.
I find it unspeakably ugly, and un-American (-pardon
my redundancy.).
> All of your goddamn research is dross.
> Get with it man-and don't give us
> this drifted archetype!
"who's going to buy
this bullshit
if you don't become the ocean
you'll be seasick
every day"
- LC.
~greg.
Joe Way
>> Greg wrote:
>>
>>> I think that's what I am going to miss most about the ng.
>>
>> What is this shit?
>
> Great! - Thank you, Joe!
> behind, in the form of the half-eaten carcasses of the
> posters who I have found to be rude (from *my* perspective)
>
> - not "clarissa":
>
> CLARICE:
> You see a lot, Joe, But are
> you strong enough to point that high-
> powered perception at yourself? How
> about it...? Look at yourself and
> write down the truth.
> Or maybe you're afraid to.
Now I've done it-I've both angered and insulted you and that was really not
my intention. As Eliot said-
³That is not it at all,
That is not what I meant, at all.²
There are some of us here, Paul, myself, Jim (and I'm sure many others) who
really look forward to those observations of yours and for you to quit, to
back away, to "take your ball and go home" as you put it, is hurtful to us
and quite frankly, I was not prepared to take it lying down (now I'm not
sure if that should be laying down-but I digress).
I'll not turn the high powered perception on myself here as I've done that
too much lately anyway. I'll just leave you with one more Eliot quote:
"There are three conditions which often look alike
Yet differ completely, flourish in the same hedgerow:
Attachment to self and to things and to persons, detachment
From self and from things and from persons; and, growing between them,
indifference
Which resembles the others as death resembles life,...'
"What we call the beginning is often the end
And to make an end is to make a beginning.
The end is where we start from."
You probably know the end here, but you've known it since you started.
Don't lose hope for Kerry-in the background as I write here is the Sinclair
broadcast-their best shot and it is lame.
Joe
Paul Galvin
"~greg" <g_m@(remove)comcast.net> wrote in message.
>
> what is it that's got me down the most?
> --just this:
> http://www.realclearpolitics.com/Presidential_04/chart3way.html
I have written and deleted many replies to this greg. However a commentator
today in Game 1 of the finals of your domestic baseball competition trumped
anything I could have said when he observed, "the Cardinals bring quite an
international flavour to this world series." That tickled me! An
international flavour in a world series! What next!!
Why do so many Americans over-rate their importance in the scheme of things.
Have a look at this site.
http://www.census.gov/cgi-bin/ipc/idbrank.pl
There's really not that many of you is there? Hu is the President of China.
Who is the leader of Indonesia, India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Norway, New
Zealand? Australia (one of the coalition of the willing) had elections on
October 9. Do you know the results? They were possibly more significant to
me than yours will be. Actually Dubya seems to have forgotten about
Australia being part of the coalition. In the debates he talked about Tony
Blair and Poland.
If you want to fuck off, then fuck off. I beleive the name Jikan is free
again. If you feel you have nothing more to contribute, then so be it. Thank
you for enriching my life over the last few years. From what I have read of
"Dear Heather" I'm sure I would have been most interested in your
observations.
Before you go though, how can I make a CD from twoshakesofalambstail.com.
I've tried (Nero) but keep getting the diagnostic "cannot copy" (or
something.)
--
Paul (head spinning)
ps This post may cause the ng to crash anyway as I have been having computer
problems. A couple of days ago my e-mail thingy just crashed. I lost
everything, really pissed me off! I think it's OK now.
kevin
My introduction to Leonard was The Future (the song and
then the album) and my first impression of it, before I had
figured out if I liked the music or not, was of what a great
voice he had. Later, after listening to his earlier albums and
realizing how his voice had deteriorated I was even more
glad that I chose to listen to one of his later works first.
His voice on the later albums still sounds great to me even
despite it having lost the more youthful tone of his early
recordings. I've wondered how differently I would have
viewed the later albums had I listend to the earlier ones first.
kevin
"Paul Galvin" <p.k.g...@xtra.co.nz> wrote in message
news:bOHed.759$lF1....@news.xtra.co.nz...
> I have written and deleted many replies to this greg.
Haven't we all.
However a commentator
> today in Game 1 of the finals of your domestic baseball competition
trumped
> anything I could have said when he observed, "the Cardinals bring quite an
> international flavour to this world series." That tickled me! An
> international flavour in a world series! What next!!
The funniest thing for me was Manny's play in left field... aieee!
WWJDD?
The Passion of Johnny Damon!
> Why do so many Americans over-rate their importance in the scheme of
things.
Ah, c'mon, a usenet user wondering how others can think so highly
of themselves... aieeee!
Bob Allison
"Paul Galvin" <p.k.g...@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
>
> Before you go though, how can I make a CD from twoshakesofalambstail.com.
> I've tried (Nero) but keep getting the diagnostic "cannot copy" (or
> something.)
Download the tracks.
Put them in a folder.
Name it Leonard Cohen Bootleg.
Burn it on a CD.
--
I watch late night TV so you don't have to.
Bob
In Carmel, CA
Paul Galvin
"Bob Allison" <thebo...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:thebobert1-A4C87...@newssvr14-ext.news.prodigy.com...
Thank you Bob,
I really shouldn't be allowed on one of these things. However, even I
managed this, with your help (and the 13 year old boy from Thailand who
lives with us.) Have a virtual Red Needle on me.
--
Paul.