The Real Story on Montres Allison
HIRAM 695
watches ? There seems to be a lot of confusing information out there. Thanks.
michael turner
Everything you need to know:
In particular "MONTRES ALLISON apparent overcharge" and "Is Montres
Allison a $60 Chinese watch?"
It's quite entertaining reading. :-)
--
Michael Turner
Email (ROT13)
zvxr.gh...@ivetva.arg
HIRAM 695
me a favor and summarize all of that for me. Bottom line ? Thanks.
George Scott
mom's basement (really). There are multiple companies that do the same
thing and sell $60 watches for 200 - 300 bucks. MA has the balls to pretend
that these watches would retail for many thousands of dollars. What a joke.
"HIRAM 695" <hira...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040425202356...@mb-m03.aol.com...
Richard Sexton
HIRAM 695 <hira...@aol.com> wrote:
>Can someone give me a straightforward, unslanted, unbiased opinion of these
>watches ? There seems to be a lot of confusing information out there. Thanks.
I wouldn't give you $10 for one.
http://forums.timezone.com/index.php?t=tree&goto=1016&rid=0
--
Usenet special: on cases of any filters for BMW: http://u.bmwz.org
http://www.mbz.org | Mailing lists: http://lists.mbz.org
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | Orkut:RS79 Classifieds: http://ads.mbz.org
2 X 280SE | Watches list: http://watches.list.mbz.org
Richard Sexton
HIRAM 695 <hira...@aol.com> wrote:
>I appreciate the referrals to a number of messages and dozens of strings. Do
>me a favor and summarize all of that for me. Bottom line ? Thanks.
If you were to order 1000 $10 Chinese watches and have the dials
made with your name on them you'd be a serious competitor.
dAz
On 26-Apr-2004, ric...@vrx.news (Richard Sexton) wrote:
> In article <20040425190444...@mb-m22.aol.com>,
> HIRAM 695 <hira...@aol.com> wrote:
> >Can someone give me a straightforward, unslanted, unbiased opinion of
> >these
> >watches ? There seems to be a lot of confusing information out there.
> >Thanks.
>
>
> I wouldn't give you $10 for one.
hmmm, just looking at the profile of millionsmart, they produce 600k to 699k
pieces per month,
so thats on the low side of 7.2million watches per year, sales are US$2 -3
million per year, so
that makes about 0.28 to 0.42cents per watch,
of course from that they have to pay their staff (150 to190 of them), pay
for the raw materials,
the power and water, rent?, did I miss anything?
Brian Talley
> In article <20040425190444...@mb-m22.aol.com>,
> HIRAM 695 <hira...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>>Can someone give me a straightforward, unslanted, unbiased opinion of these
>>watches ? There seems to be a lot of confusing information out there. Thanks.
>
>
>
> I wouldn't give you $10 for one.
>
> http://forums.timezone.com/index.php?t=tree&goto=1016&rid=0
>
> http://www.globalsources.com/gsol/GeneralManager?&catalog_id=2000000003844&design=clean&language=en&action=GetSupplier&page=supplier/ProductDetail&supplier_id=6008802694995&product_id=8809909834&action=GetProduct
I absolutely agree, and I wouldn't waste my money on one,
either, knowing what it really is. I've read the history
behind Terry and Linda Allison.
But what I want to understand, from an uncharacteristically
forgiving perspective, is why they should be castigated as
they have been.
(Remember, I'm a comparative neophyte, here, so go easy on me.)
I look at Rolex. Nice watch. Lotsa slick marketing. It reminds
me of Microsoft....
Then, I look at MarcelloC. Great case, great movement, and
arguably as good (or nearly) a watch at a fraction the price.
People crave distinction; they like to stand out from the
crowd. Rolex has spent countless dollars marketing their
product and arguably misleading buyers that their watches are
vastly superior to every other watch. When you wear a Rolex,
the drooling masses swoon. When you wear a MarcelloC, nothing
happens....
Yet this forum, for the most part, accepts Rolex.
Why, then, does it slam MA?
Okay, MA charges Rolex prices, yet Rolex uses relatively
decent movements and MA uses utter crap. Given. But so what? If
Rolex isn't worth the money and MA isn't worth the money, why not
slam Rolex as hard?
For that matter, what defines worth? Does name recognition count
for nothing? (I know a purist would rightly say "no".) Is it
the movement? The accuracy? I have an el-cheapo Hamilton with a
2824-2 that is within chronometer specs. It's still worth far
less than a Rolex.
A moron at work has an MA, and this guy is very, very concerned
with form over function. I'm not sure whether to point out the
true nature of his pride and joy.
Regards,
Brian
HIRAM 695
something. You can't eat gold and it can't keep you warm or protect you from
wolves. Yet everyone wants it, hence its value. Who am I to say who should
pay how much for an MA ? It looks like enough people want one to sustain what
others would consider an excessive price. An MA can't be the only thing on the
market that is valued far above its intrinsic value. Thanks for getting back
to me.
Richard Sexton
The other thing that's really annoying about MA is all the shills
he pays to talk tup the $12 watches to make people believe they
actually might be worth $50 or more. They aren't of course.
Notice the lack of magazine reviews of this piece of crap?
Brian Talley
> In article <20040426180129...@mb-m27.aol.com>,
> HIRAM 695 <hira...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>>An enlightened analysis. What determines worth ? How much people will pay for
>>something. You can't eat gold and it can't keep you warm or protect you from
>>wolves. Yet everyone wants it, hence its value. Who am I to say who should
>>pay how much for an MA ? It looks like enough people want one to sustain what
>>others would consider an excessive price. An MA can't be the only thing on the
>>market that is valued far above its intrinsic value. Thanks for getting back
>>to me.
>
>
> The other thing that's really annoying about MA is all the shills
> he pays to talk tup the $12 watches to make people believe they
> actually might be worth $50 or more. They aren't of course.
>
> Notice the lack of magazine reviews of this piece of crap?
No argument.
I guess what I'm was asking is what level of quality must a watch
movement have before a vendor can charge significantly inflated
prices? MA fails and Rolex passes. Can it be narrowed down further?
For right or wrong, Rolex is regarded by many as a good watch, and
by the masses as an outstanding watch. MA is regarded as tripe here
and by others in the know, and is unknown by the masses. I wonder
if MA were to engage in an advertizing/propaganda campaign as Rolex
has over the years, if it couldn't elevate itself as a "player" in
the watch industry without needing to improve the quality of its
watches.
Regards,
Brian
Richard Sexton
>movement have before a vendor can charge significantly inflated
>prices? MA fails and Rolex passes. Can it be narrowed down further?
>
>For right or wrong, Rolex is regarded by many as a good watch, and
>by the masses as an outstanding watch. MA is regarded as tripe here
>and by others in the know, and is unknown by the masses. I wonder
>if MA were to engage in an advertizing/propaganda campaign as Rolex
>has over the years, if it couldn't elevate itself as a "player" in
>the watch industry without needing to improve the quality of its
>watches.
It's not an exact science and there is no right answer; it
depends on your own feelings.
I think they're both crap and you couldn't pay me to own either.
But, what is certain is a Rolex is worth real money and MA
can be duplicated at any Chinee factory for a few bucks. Uh,
I guess a Rolex can too but you can tell the differnce
as they can't fake the movement (yet), whereas the MA
is just one of a dozen or swo brands coming off the
Chinese assembly line.
Besides, MA already has an effective campaign; people actually
buy the stupid things.
HIRAM 695
big price tag ?
Williams, Steve
>So where can someone buy a watch made by the same Chinese company, without the
>big price tag ?
This link may prove instructive about the watch and a source for a similar one:
http://forums.timezone.com/index.php?t=tree&goto=1016&rid=220
Mike Lipphardt
popular on the PMWF right now.
Mike
"Williams, Steve" <steve.w...@swissonline.ch> wrote in message
news:vd5v80hfmahiv71ne...@4ax.com...
Richard Sexton
HIRAM 695 <hira...@aol.com> wrote:
>So where can someone buy a watch made by the same Chinese company, without the
>big price tag ?
Look for counterfit Frank Muller watches. Could cost you all of $60
if you pay full (street) retail. Try Canal St. in NYC.
Brian Talley
>>I guess what I'm was asking is what level of quality must a watch
>>movement have before a vendor can charge significantly inflated
>>prices? MA fails and Rolex passes. Can it be narrowed down further?
>>
>>For right or wrong, Rolex is regarded by many as a good watch, and
>>by the masses as an outstanding watch. MA is regarded as tripe here
>>and by others in the know, and is unknown by the masses. I wonder
>>if MA were to engage in an advertizing/propaganda campaign as Rolex
>>has over the years, if it couldn't elevate itself as a "player" in
>>the watch industry without needing to improve the quality of its
>>watches.
>
> It's not an exact science and there is no right answer; it
> depends on your own feelings.
Precisely: emotions drive purchases.
If today's buyers of MA watches find that the things croak after
a few months or years, there may be a wee bit of angst generated
and repeat customers might be few and far between; MA will be its
own undoing. Let us hope this happens.
But I'm concerned that the buyer will take his broken MA to a
jeweler who will swap out the movement with a better ETA, charge
$200, and the buyer will be happy again, proud to show off his
baby and be none the wiser.
This is where utter crap can overtake quality in market share,
and it can be very hard to alter a market's perceptions.
> I think they're both crap and you couldn't pay me to own either.
Everyone's entitled to their views. I won't go anywhere near an
MA, and Rolex seems to provide too little bang for the buck for
my liking.
> But, what is certain is a Rolex is worth real money and MA
> can be duplicated at any Chinee factory for a few bucks.
Need I remind you Rolex are stamped out by robots on an assembly
line, too? Granted, QC is likely far, far higher there than at
the cheesy factory where movements used in MA watches are made.
And finishing is likely far better too. And there's that COSC
certification (which arguably counts for little, but which serves
to boost the cost of a watch by at least $600).
> Uh,
> I guess a Rolex can too but you can tell the differnce
> as they can't fake the movement (yet),
What layperson will be able to discern the difference between a
$60 ETA movement shoved in a case that looks like it's a Rolex,
versus a genuine Rolex movement in a genuine Rolex case? Few.
> whereas the MA
> is just one of a dozen or swo brands coming off the
> Chinese assembly line.
As you say, it depends on one's feelings. Rolex and MA (and ETA
and others) make movements on assembly lines. A lot determines
worth, however. I'm seeing that marketing counts for a great
deal in this regard. Tell the world you're something special
often enough, and before you know it they believe you!
But if MA built their own cases (and didn't pilfer from Frank
Muller, for example) and kept prices to around $100, would you
feel differently? Many consider Poljot and Vostok to be great
deals. Might MA be in that category if they didn't try to be
something they're not?
I think that nailed it. Most people are happy with their Guess,
Fossil, Kenneth Cole and similar-ilk watches found in jewelry
displays at the mall. Those who want something "really nice" buy
a Seiko. Then, there are the rest of us who try to learn a thing
or two, and we see what's really out there. When Allison comes
along with his MA offering, people in the know flip out. How
many other companies offering a comparably shoddy product have
tried to break into the high-end watch market using marketing
ploys alone, with a quality-be-damned attitude? Any? If so, have
any succeeded?
All this said, the Patek Philippe name came up in a previous
post, and you had less-than-complimentary things to say about
their movements. Can you elucidate? At the very least, can you
say which movements (or level of finishing (with an example))
you consider decent?
> Besides, MA already has an effective campaign; people actually
> buy the stupid things.
Yes, well, many people will buy anything because they're dumb
as a bag of hammers, and there's not much we can do about that.
But the average guy on the street is far more likely to recognize
the name Rolex than Montres Allison.
What will be the case in a generation or two? Might MA be seen
as a reputable, high-end watch when, under the hood, it's still
just a p.o.s.?
Regards,
Brian
Richard Sexton
>> can be duplicated at any Chinee factory for a few bucks.
>
>Need I remind you Rolex are stamped out by robots on an assembly
>line, too? Granted, QC is likely far, far higher there than at
>the cheesy factory where movements used in MA watches are made.
>And finishing is likely far better too. And there's that COSC
>certification (which arguably counts for little, but which serves
>to boost the cost of a watch by at least $600).
I understand that, I'm just waying a Rolex is expensive
and liquid. "you can sell any watch as long as it says
Rolex on the dial". In that sense they're worth something;
I still won't have anything to do with one though, I think
they're junk.
>What layperson will be able to discern the difference between a
>$60 ETA movement shoved in a case that looks like it's a Rolex,
>versus a genuine Rolex movement in a genuine Rolex case? Few.
Damn few.
>But if MA built their own cases (and didn't pilfer from Frank
>Muller, for example) and kept prices to around $100, would you
>feel differently? Many consider Poljot and Vostok to be great
>deals. Might MA be in that category if they didn't try to be
>something they're not?
Hey, an MA is probbaly a good $60 watch. With an ETA it might be
a good $120 watch.
>I think that nailed it. Most people are happy with their Guess,
>Fossil, Kenneth Cole and similar-ilk watches found in jewelry
>displays at the mall. Those who want something "really nice" buy
>a Seiko. Then, there are the rest of us who try to learn a thing
>or two, and we see what's really out there. When Allison comes
>along with his MA offering, people in the know flip out. How
>many other companies offering a comparably shoddy product have
>tried to break into the high-end watch market using marketing
>ploys alone, with a quality-be-damned attitude? Any? If so, have
>any succeeded?
Rolex comes to mind. A solid $800 watch with a somewhat fragile
movement but the casework is superb.
>All this said, the Patek Philippe name came up in a previous
>post, and you had less-than-complimentary things to say about
>their movements. Can you elucidate? At the very least, can you
>say which movements (or level of finishing (with an example))
>you consider decent?
I did in an earlier post.
>> Besides, MA already has an effective campaign; people actually
>> buy the stupid things.
>
>Yes, well, many people will buy anything because they're dumb
>as a bag of hammers, and there's not much we can do about that.
>But the average guy on the street is far more likely to recognize
>the name Rolex than Montres Allison.
>
>What will be the case in a generation or two? Might MA be seen
>as a reputable, high-end watch when, under the hood, it's still
>just a p.o.s.?
I suspect in a generation people might collect them like some
people collect old Timex's today. Interesting cheap nasty watches.
Norman Schwartz
"Brian Talley" <bta...@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:syUjc.122852$M3.9...@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
>
> What will be the case in a generation or two? Might MA be seen
> as a reputable, high-end watch when, under the hood, it's still
> just a p.o.s.?
>
(theirs or yours ?) warranty.
Sapphire crystals are not too common at the mall.
Richard Sexton
>> as a reputable, high-end watch when, under the hood, it's still
>> just a p.o.s.?
>>
>Nevertheless the hoods are sapphire crystals, and they offer a lifetime
>(theirs or yours ?) warranty.
>Sapphire crystals are not too common at the mall.
You need to go to a better mall.
Brian Talley
> "Brian Talley" <bta...@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:syUjc.122852$M3.9...@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
>
>>What will be the case in a generation or two? Might MA be seen
>>as a reputable, high-end watch when, under the hood, it's still
>>just a p.o.s.?
>>
>
> Nevertheless the hoods are sapphire crystals,
Given the duplicitous nature of the whole operation, I'd have
to assume it was really mineral glass, unless someone here were
to say differently. Even if the crystals were sapphire, that
hardly makes the watches worth what Allison is charging.
> and they offer a lifetime
> (theirs or yours ?) warranty.
That's very generous: they'll replace a $60 watch whenever it
croaks, after you pay two (or more) orders of magnitude for it?
> Sapphire crystals are not too common at the mall.
Neither are MAs.
Regards,
Brian
Brian Talley
>>>But, what is certain is a Rolex is worth real money and MA
>>>can be duplicated at any Chinee factory for a few bucks.
>>
>>Need I remind you Rolex are stamped out by robots on an assembly
>>line, too? Granted, QC is likely far, far higher there than at
>>the cheesy factory where movements used in MA watches are made.
>>And finishing is likely far better too. And there's that COSC
>>certification (which arguably counts for little, but which serves
>>to boost the cost of a watch by at least $600).
>
> I understand that, I'm just waying a Rolex is expensive
> and liquid. "you can sell any watch as long as it says
> Rolex on the dial". In that sense they're worth something;
> I still won't have anything to do with one though, I think
> they're junk.
Interesting. I suppose my plebian ways didn't permit me to
consider an item's worth to be based on what I could get for it
if I tried to sell it, but rather the materials, craftsmanship
and quality that went into making it. (Clearly, I buy too many
things that depreciate over time and too few that appreciate in
value. I'll try to change my ways as soon as my bank account
permits.(Don't hold yer breath.))
That said, should MA's marketing campaign be effective enough,
might you consider an MA's "worth" significant because its
resale value might, in due time, be high?
I guess what I'm wondering is this: are those dim bulbs who
are buying MAs today engaging in fiscal Darwinism or are they
lucky and/or far-sighted, and understand that one day, like
Rolex, these things are likely to have a high resale value?
>>I think that nailed it. Most people are happy with their Guess,
>>Fossil, Kenneth Cole and similar-ilk watches found in jewelry
>>displays at the mall. Those who want something "really nice" buy
>>a Seiko. Then, there are the rest of us who try to learn a thing
>>or two, and we see what's really out there. When Allison comes
>>along with his MA offering, people in the know flip out. How
>>many other companies offering a comparably shoddy product have
>>tried to break into the high-end watch market using marketing
>>ploys alone, with a quality-be-damned attitude? Any? If so, have
>>any succeeded?
>
> Rolex comes to mind. A solid $800 watch with a somewhat fragile
> movement but the casework is superb.
Rolex is comparably shoddy to MA? That's quite a statement. If all
goes well for MA, then, they too could one day be another Rolex?
>>All this said, the Patek Philippe name came up in a previous
>>post, and you had less-than-complimentary things to say about
>>their movements. Can you elucidate? At the very least, can you
>>say which movements (or level of finishing (with an example))
>>you consider decent?
>
> I did in an earlier post.
I'll dig on groups.google.com; I wouldn't want you waste your time
repeating yourself on my account. ;-)
>>What will be the case in a generation or two? Might MA be seen
>>as a reputable, high-end watch when, under the hood, it's still
>>just a p.o.s.?
>
> I suspect in a generation people might collect them like some
> people collect old Timex's today. Interesting cheap nasty watches.
But not like Rolex are today? Hmmm. I thought maybe a similarity
could be drawn between Rolex and MA in that quality was circumspect
and marketing was the high point in their respective business plans.
Regards,
Brian
Norman Schwartz
eBay .
> > Sapphire crystals are not too common at the mall.
>
Neither are MAs.
>
That's why people buy them on the 'net, which is better than the malls for
many reasons.
omniscient idiot
make me wonder, what does the law says about dishonest marketing /
advertising, really, if at all the law touches this subject?
I don't think that MA is alone in being dishonest, at most it is
unusual in being unusually dishonest. That said, the existence of this
bunch makes me, uhm, nostalgic about what happened in my youth (though
I am still in it, mind).
Myself, the watch I am wearing is a $60 NOS Seiko S-Wave which was
advertised as having a list price of $225. I bought it not because it
was so much cheaper than the list price, but because it was cheap and
because some people I know have good experiences with the (gray market
US-based net) vendor. In other words, I trust rumors, and not anything
else. I happened to have spent much of my life so far in some third
world countries (which I prefer not to name) where (for all the good
things I found there) the adage "buyer beware" was a cardinal rule. In
other words, we could count on the vendors being basically dishonest
in general, and we had to find some people in the know (almost always
by word of mouth) to find the exceptions - then stick to that vendor
(and this applied not only to watches). The existence of MA and Stauer
make me think that in a way, things are the same here in the States.
Or, are things any different in that there is some legal recourse?
I still find it a bit hard to believe that the buyers of that watch
are that stupid. Is the watch probably better than we assume? Or, is
it prohibitively difficult/expensive to, say, sue them? Or, do people
simply blame themselves for buying inferior products, hence letting
the crooks off the hook so easily? Are they that easily placated by
that "lifetime warranty"? Or, since (or so I assume) MA's dishonesty
is just a matter of degree, does it mean it is technically legal?
Regards, oi
"Norman Schwartz" <nm...@att.net> wrote in message news:<oQfkc.4019$Xj6....@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>...
Rob Kramer
> Notice the lack of magazine reviews of this piece of crap?
Actually, I was surprised to see a MA section in one of those yearly watch
catalogue books. Dunno which one it was, but one of the more crappy ones
for sure :) With a picture of Terry III even.
Cheers,
Rob
Norman Schwartz
"omniscient idiot" <roo...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> Myself, the watch I am wearing is a $60 NOS Seiko S-Wave which was
> advertised as having a list price of $225. I bought it not because it
> was so much cheaper than the list price, but because it was cheap and
> because some people I know have good experiences with the (gray market
> US-based net) vendor. In other words, I trust rumors, and not anything
> else. I happened to have spent much of my life so far in some third
> world countries (which I prefer not to name) where (for all the good
> things I found there) the adage "buyer beware" was a cardinal rule. In
> other words, we could count on the vendors being basically dishonest
> in general, and we had to find some people in the know (almost always
> by word of mouth) to find the exceptions - then stick to that vendor
> (and this applied not only to watches). The existence of MA and Stauer
> make me think that in a way, things are the same here in the States.
> Or, are things any different in that there is some legal recourse?
>
> I still find it a bit hard to believe that the buyers of that watch
> are that stupid. Is the watch probably better than we assume? Or, is
> it prohibitively difficult/expensive to, say, sue them? Or, do people
> simply blame themselves for buying inferior products, hence letting
> the crooks off the hook so easily? Are they that easily placated by
> that "lifetime warranty"? Or, since (or so I assume) MA's dishonesty
> is just a matter of degree, does it mean it is technically legal?
IMO MA is telling you that *if* their product bore a label such as Franck
Muller and had been made in the Swiss Alps (I know people climb there, but
do they make any watches there?) it would cost $3,000-$6,000 but here is
something similar, yet unique in its own way for a couple of hundred bucks,
so why not take advantage of it schmuck? We offer a lifetime guarantee and
our watches do look very nice (the dials *are* unique, nicely done, colorful
with great fine detail and the crystals are all sapphire). I like to wear
nice looking watches, take pics with fine cameras, and listen to great audio
equipment but know nothing about their inner mechanisms, ditto for autos. MA
does not conceal their movements even though they are made in a non-existent
fictitious place, AND they are telling you this *out loud*. Moreover they
proudly display many of their movements in see through backs. (Lighten up
it's all just a pastime.)
No affiliation whatsoever with MA,
Norman
Norman Schwartz
"Richard Sexton" <ric...@vrx.news> wrote in message
news:Hwy2I...@T-FCN.Net...
> >> What will be the case in a generation or two? Might MA be seen
> >> as a reputable, high-end watch when, under the hood, it's still
> >> just a p.o.s.?
> >>
> >Nevertheless the hoods are sapphire crystals, and they offer a lifetime
> >(theirs or yours ?) warranty.
> >Sapphire crystals are not too common at the mall.
>
> You need to go to a better mall.
>
Wing C Ng
>big price tag ?
I visited the Hong Kong company who made these watches in China
mainland. Rene Barton uses the same source, and seems at least
honest. I have one and it actually works well.
Wing
Brian Talley
> Despite all the seemingly nice service MA gives, all these stories
> make me wonder, what does the law says about dishonest marketing /
> advertising, really, if at all the law touches this subject?
Sure there are. But who wants to endure the expense and
commit the time to go after these clowns?
> I don't think that MA is alone in being dishonest, at most it is
> unusual in being unusually dishonest.
Right. This is where I was going with my posts: what line
must a company not cross before it alienates a large percentage
of its potential market? Rolex apparently have not crossed it
for most people. MA have.
> I still find it a bit hard to believe that the buyers of that watch
> are that stupid.
You're kidding, right? People make monumentally stupid decisions
every minute of every day, some of which result in death. Buying
a luxury item without having done any research on it is hardly
unusual.
Regards,
Brian
Norman Schwartz
> Right. This is where I was going with my posts: what line
> must a company not cross before it alienates a large percentage
> of its potential market? Rolex apparently have not crossed it
> for most people. MA have.
By happily letting them go every day for $200-$300 they are telling you that
they are not "Rolexes" and are not even aiming in the direction of a Rolex
market. They are simply fancy good looking toys, claiming to have been made
in an obviously fictitious location, and apparently having good looking
movements since they have the testicles to display them for all to see
beneath sapphire crystals. In addition they offer and honor a lifetime
warranty (so long as no one else opens them up), which Rolex itself doesn't
do.
> > I still find it a bit hard to believe that the buyers of that watch
> > are that stupid.
>
> You're kidding, right? People make monumentally stupid decisions
> every minute of every day, some of which result in death. Buying
> a luxury item without having done any research on it is hardly
> unusual.
IT IS NOT A LUXURY ITEM and I'm not sure of just who it is that has made a
"monumentally stupid decision".
omniscient idiot
> Muller and had been made in the Swiss Alps (I know people climb there, but
> do they make any watches there?) it would cost $3,000-$6,000 but here is
> something similar, yet unique in its own way for a couple of hundred bucks,
> so why not take advantage of it schmuck? We offer a lifetime guarantee and
> our watches do look very nice (the dials *are* unique, nicely done, colorful
> with great fine detail and the crystals are all sapphire). I like to wear
> nice looking watches, take pics with fine cameras, and listen to great audio
> equipment but know nothing about their inner mechanisms, ditto for autos. MA
> does not conceal their movements even though they are made in a non-existent
> fictitious place, AND they are telling you this *out loud*. Moreover they
> proudly display many of their movements in see through backs. (Lighten up
> it's all just a pastime.)
> No affiliation whatsoever with MA,
> Norman
True, but:
1. In the following:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31387&item=4106054541&rd=1
(posted by an earlier poster in this thread)
someone claimed a retail price of $1,895. I think this is nothing more
nor less than fraudulent marketing (though many will claim Rolex - and
many others - are guilty of the same thing). I don't know if the ebay
seller is actually one of the MA folks, but even if not, I suspect the
number $1,895 may have come from them.
2. After all are said, I actually wonder how I should feel about MA.
Should MA be admired, for being so blatant (or, in a more polite way,
"open") about being less than honest? Or, should they be criticized
(even vilified, condemned, prosecuted or whatever) for being less than
honest?
So they claim that (even ignoring the ebay link) simply making the
thingy come from Switzerland and labeling it "Franck Muller" will make
it much more "precious" (or, rather, "worthy of big mark up"). OK, we
all know that such a statement is not 100% incorrect, but in effect
they say that with those big names being nothing more than
profiteering crooks, then why not try MA.
I guess it could even be said that we should even admire and praise MA
and put them in the highest pedestal, for they are at least "open
about exposing other people's bad side".
Speaking of people from outside horology, MA reminds me of two sport
coaches: Luiz Scolari (formerly Brazil's World Cup winning soccer
coach) and Jerry Tarkanian. Scolari once got caught instructing his
players making more violent fouls toward the opponents, and far from
apologizing to the public (the "politically correct" manner), he
claimed instead that other coaches did the same thing, he was just
stupid enough to admit it openly. Tarkanian was once reportedly
apologizing to a reporter for failing to provide him with a hooker. I
once had a debate with my roommate whether such people should be
criticized for being so unabashed about that (a bit like MA IMHO), or
whether they should be admired for being - in a sense - so brutally
honest about they way things are done. I realize this comparison is
less than perfect, but if MA is no worse, quality wise, than others, I
guess we may even put them in the same ballpark as those. Regards, oi
Norman Schwartz
> 1. In the following:
>
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31387&item=4106054541&rd=1
> (posted by an earlier poster in this thread)
> someone claimed a retail price of $1,895. I think this is nothing more
> nor less than fraudulent marketing (though many will claim Rolex - and
> many others - are guilty of the same thing). I don't know if the ebay
> seller is actually one of the MA folks, but even if not, I suspect the
> number $1,895 may have come from them.
>
price (at www.montreasallison.com) and I sort of believe they are merely
suggesting that such a watch might command that, BUT, that they are
available (from them ?) at 1/10 that price. Perhaps they are hopeful that
their watches will gain wider publicity, become harder to get, and cost
those prices. If so, their offerings are "promotional" in nature being loss
leaders, and you might consider grabbing one for $200 while you can. MA's
watches are limited in number and once gone, there are no more. The
following year sees new and different models, also in limited number. In any
event $200 can't represent anyone's life savings, in contrast to certain
other watches which might in fact be *my* life's savings.
Richard Sexton
>must a company not cross before it alienates a large percentage
>of its potential market?
Pretending to be something you aren't.
Norman Schwartz
"Richard Sexton" <ric...@vrx.news> wrote in message
> >Right. This is where I was going with my posts: what line
> >must a company not cross before it alienates a large percentage
> >of its potential market?
>
> Pretending to be something you aren't.
>
Eric Dreher
wrote:
After having looked at Terry's pictures and bio, you might be
on to something there.
-------------------------------------------------
"Bush's message is clear. His message is a steady
leader and Kerry's a flip-flopper."
- Carter Eskew, senior adviser to Al Gore
montres...@gmail.com
newyorkwa...@gmail.com
09-11-2016 Reviews, Ratings, and Complaints about Montres Allison can be seen at the following links:
http://www.bbb.org/denver/business-reviews/watches-wholesale-and-manufacturers/montres-allison-inc-in-thornton-co-90248023/#bbbonlineclick
https://www.facebook.com/montresallisonusa/
http://www.yellowpages.com/brighton-co/mip/montres-allison-inc-526366229
https://www.yelp.com/biz/montres-allison-thornton
https://www.glassdoor.com/Overview/Working-at-Montres-Allison-EI_IE1343074.11,26.htm
https://www.trustpilot.com/review/montresallison.com
http://www.resellerratings.com/store/Montres_Allison
https://www.ekomi-us.com/review-montresallisoncom.html
https://www.chamberofcommerce.com/thornton-co/1332594514-montres-allison-inc
http://www.dexknows.com/business_profiles/montres_allison-l2705995911?bp=1
Montres Allison
royalcust...@gmail.com
certifiedcontr...@gmail.com
> Can someone give me a straightforward, unslanted, unbiased opinion of these
> watches ? There seems to be a lot of confusing information out there. Thanks.
Montres Allison produces very limited quantity, unique watches. Montres Allison has been devoted to artisan-crafted watch production since 2004.
fenc...@gmail.com
hugegold...@gmail.com
testi...@gmail.com
WatchCentral.TV
watchg...@gmail.com
wyobu...@gmail.com
newyorkwa...@gmail.com
royalcust...@gmail.com
https://www.instagram.com/p/BKYmRjgjOK7/?taken-by=montresallison
https://www.instagram.com/p/BKYhCbajyJe/?taken-by=montresallison
https://www.instagram.com/p/BKXqDh5jT57/?taken-by=montresallison
https://www.instagram.com/p/BKXpxlhDrob/?taken-by=montresallison
https://www.instagram.com/p/BKXpXFcjJnA/?taken-by=montresallison
https://www.instagram.com/p/BKWaG7DDbgd/?taken-by=montresallison
https://www.instagram.com/p/BKV7AJaDr7l/?taken-by=montresallison
certifiedcontr...@gmail.com
hugegold...@gmail.com
> Can someone give me a straightforward, unslanted, unbiased opinion of these
> watches ? There seems to be a lot of confusing information out there. Thanks.
replicatimepi...@gmail.com
royalcust...@gmail.com
Montres Allison
"Somebody earlier said that they didn't know of any other WIS that had anything good to say about MAs, but I found this info doing a search:
Here is a link to the original message:
http://www.network54.com/Hide/Forum/mes ... 1050504978
Slugo (aka Mike Ferber) is a well known WIS (term given to those on the
internet who particpate heavily in watch forums) Mike Ferber's
opinion is very highly respected by everybody in the wristwatch world.
Below are his comments regarding his Montres Allison and he is in
agreement with Baron Harkonnen (aka Mike Strickland) who may be one of
the most prolific watch forum particpators in the history of the
internet. Mr. Strickland is known as a genius and his intelligence
is highly regarded by all. His comments follow.
Return to
the Forum
Some preliminary
info on my Montres Allison >>
April 16 2003 at
7:56 AM
Slugo (Login
MFerber)
Official Animal House Moderator & Abe's of Maine LOVER!
from IP address 216.220.167.140
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I
pretty much agree with the Baron. This is a huge and very well
constructed watch. The case and all the components are finished as
well as any Omega amd much better than a number of more expensive
watches. The stem is large and easy to manipulate. The strap is the
real thing, pure thick, supple alligator with a better than average
deplopyant buckle. The dial is a work of art, just as good as any
Genta or equivalent timepiece. The movement appears to have as much
mods as what IWC does on some of its models.
I'm very well pleased. Pictures later...
Slugo
Here is the link to the orginal message:
http://www.network54.com/Hide/Forum/mes ... 1050349316
Return to the Forum
Why you should take
Terry Allison II seriously.
April 14 2003 at 12:41
PM
Baron Harkonnen (no
login)
from IP address 68.17.226.123
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I
recieved my MA watch in the mail today. It is an automatic with second
hand, no date.
Mine is not the one that JW has, mine has a gold washed ETA movement,
and an apeture in the dial with allows the balance wheel to be seen.
The watch is massive, the case is well finished, it has a genuine
alligator dial and a SS deployant buckle.
I came with a catalog with detailed pictures of several models,
including the $99,000 tourbillon. (that is not a joke).
I was really impressed with the heft and size of the watch, must be
about the size of a Panerai. Weighs a half pound or so.
Personally I rank watches with ETA movements pretty much the same, I
rank sample with some of Franck Muller less expensive pieces. Probably
half a cut above the Omega Seamaster line, at least in the finish of the
case, hands, dial. The ETA movement has some rough swirls (gillouche?)
cut in it before it was gold washed, but it shows well through the dial
and display backto the naked eye.
I passed the watch around at lunch, there were three attorney's and a
chiro present. They all seemed to like the watch and took the $6000 plus
price tag as ordinary. They all have Rolexes, usually tt DJs or Subs.
I'm going to wear it for a couple of months and send it to John Davis
and see if he will take it apart. I really don't care for the shape,
round or square is my preference.
My G2 is due back from the factory and I'll take some close ups.
The hands look a whole lot better on this one than the hands on the one
that JW got, and I looked at 10x.
Here is a post from Mike Strickland regading his qualifications after his
postive Montres Allison comments:
Return to the Forum
Dear "Guest User" My
Qualifications
April 15 2003 at 2:35 PM
Baron Harkonnen (no
login)
from IP address 68.17.252.67
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regarding my qualifications as a judge of watches:
I took Walt Odets watch school in 1999, both courses.
I have owned three Pateks and one Vacheron + Constantin (still have it).
I have three Hamilton pocket watches, including 2 992 RR certified
watches. Hamilton 992's have finishing that makes Patek and Lange both
look crude.
I have three Rolexes. A TT GMT Master from 1978, a solid 18kt Datejust
from 1970, and a virgin President 18030. I have owned Rolexes since
1969, perhaps fifteen total.
I sold three watches on eBay about 5 months ago, A Speedy Pro that I had
for 25 years, a JLC 14ky WG diamond watch, and a vintage BlancPain 50
Fathoms that I bought for $75 at a flea market. My take for the three
was just shy of 3 grand. My investment was less than $700.
I currently own about 65 pieces worth around 35 grand. From Timex of a
NIB 1929 Hamilton Masterpiece to a Enameled cased Tavanese.
I own seven Shugarts, and have 4 WIS pins from Time Zone.
How about you, chump.
But there is much to be said for knowledge about fish hooks and beer.
But history is more my interest, I have a BS from the University of
Maryland in Management with a Minor in History. I am nearly finished
with an MA in history from UF.
Plus my dick is much bigger than yours and I use it more often
LOLOLOLOLOL
And here are Ross Feinstein's
comments. Ross is a former moderator of the timezone.com website and is
extremely well known and his opinion is very highly regarded. Here is the
orginal link:
http://www.network54.com/Hide/Forum/mes ... 1050539780
Return to the Forum
No ass kissing
here>>>
April 16 2003 at 5:36 PM
Ross (Login
RossF)
Animal House Member
from IP address 205.188.209.134
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have
had the watch for the good part of today. My original thoughts are still
valid. I put the watch on par with Oris, Fortis, and the many other ETA
watches in this category.
I would not compare it to IWC, and would fall short of equating it to
Omega and Breitling.
I am still at a loss as to what the 'H B C' stands for on the rotor and
cheapens the look. The hairline inside the crystal has me curious. The
dial design, especially with the diamonds(?), leaves something to be
desired in my opinion. I think dividing the dial into thirds detracts
from visibility and when quickly glancing at the watch it is not as easy
to tell the time as a black dial with white hands should be.
As much as I might have wanted to say, I will not say it's a bad watch.
I also will refrain from saying it's a great watch. I am Delta Neutral
(just for you Mike) on it. For now."
Montres Allison
Here are some more old reviews/comments of Montres Allison watches from the early 2000s:
"As a writer, I have spent many painful hours watching the time pass, waiting for inspiration to strike. With my new inspired Montres Allison Jitana, I don't watch the time, I watch the beautiful craftsmanship of movements in this bold, yet elegant timepiece."
"Thanks so much for your time. I LOVE the watch and am getting a lot of compliments from everyone who sees it!"
"Beautiful watch! Excellent service and fast shipment! Highly recommended"
"I wanted to let you know how much I am enjoying the MA Jitana, which I purchased from your company last week...It is beautiful and I enjoy wearing it very much...It does attract a lot of attention, which is nice I guess, but I like it just for me! It is a truly unique design and is like having the charm of a Grandfather clock on my wrist!"
"great to deal with. watch was better than described! and quick delivery!"
"Beautiful watch, fast shipment, above and beyond excellent service....thank you!"
"I received your package in perfect condition and was very impressed with the Montres Allison watch. It has a great similarity to one of my favorite watch brands, Dubey & Schaldenbrand! I was particularly impressed with the precision of manufacture- the date hand lines up perfectly, for example.The first two people to whom I have shown the watch were quite vocal in expressing how "good looking" it was in design and general appearance."
"wow....what a watch....thank you!!!"
"Prompt, helpful service. Unusual, excellent quality watch at a very good price."
"HI,HOW ARE YOU? I LOVE THE JITANA YOU SENT ME, FANTASTIC!! I HAVE A TRIPLE DIAMOND ROLEX, AND I HAVE HAD MORE COMMENTS ABOUT THE MONTRES!! ROLEX HAS TO GO!! I WOULD LIKE A MASTER CALENDER ASWELL, BUT I AM OFF TO THE BAHAMAS ON TUESDAY SO I WILL KEEP AN EYE OUT... WHEN I GET BACK, I REALLY WANT ONE....SUPER STUFF....."
"Beautiful Watch and Very Quick Delibery!! Highly Recommended "
"Cant say enough about quality of product,service, and satisfaction AAAAAAAAAA!!"
"JUST TO LET YOU KNOW I RECD IN THE WATCH REALLY GEORGEOUS, AND "HEAVY" ILL HAVE TO START EXCERCISING TO STRENGTHEN MY WRIST THANKS AGAIN"
"THANK YOU FOR THE GREAT WATCH A++++++++++"
"I am very happy to confirm you that I received the watch and I'm absolutly ENTHOUSIAST. It's exactly like I expected, BEAUTIFULL.
Thank you again and I hope to make another business with you in the future."
"You have been Wonderful to work with. I've always wanted to own a truly great watch but never could afford one."
"I wanted to thank-you again & let you know I recieved my blue Montres Allison. It is both truly beautiful & unique. I Love It & will buy another one from you in the future."
"good honest people with tremendously beautiful watch"
"Just for your information my wife Vhie wears the Master Calendar prototype, and it looks very nice on her too. She also wears the J & N with the leather strap which works. I concur with your comparisons with Franck Muller and would add that some Ulysses Nardin models with the tonneau shaped steel cases also have a similar feel to them."
"GRRRREAT WATCHES AWSOME VERY NICE COMMUNICATIONS..."
"Great looking watch,immediate delivey!!!!!"
"Very nice watches at a bargain.Cheers and Thanks"
"The watch arrived today and I am awestruck. It is far more beautiful than I had imagined. You have created a masterpiece..."
"GREAT WATCH, GREATEST SERVICE,..."
"Recommend without reserve. A+++++++"
"Yes, the watch is very handsome and I don't think it will come off my wrist for the next little bit."
"What a spectacular timepiece and great experience..."
"OUTSTANDING CUSTOMER SERVICE. Great to do business with. SUPER WATCH."
"Hi, my wife and I were shopping in Richmond BC (an affluent suburb of Vancouver with a high level of relatively wealthy ???n immigrants) and stopped in a high-end jewelry and watch store. The senior sales manager had a good look at both MA watches and was very impressed with them, especially the J & N. In his view both of them had the Franck Muller look, with the J & N a lot like a Muller Tourbillon watch. He also thought both of them appeared to be very well manufactured. Incidentally he didn't think much of Rolex except as a good investment watch."
"Very well crafted and good value too!"
"BEAUTIFUL WATCH. Great transaction. AA++"
"Great Service. Wonderful top quality watches. Fast shipment. Recommend."
"Excellent watch, great price, super fast shipping, highly recommended!!! A+++++++"
"My wife is wearing the Jour and it looks like a ??? $. You guys did another Larry Walker and hit one right out of the park. My wife was born in the Philippines and the gold tones of the dial and bezel combined with the elegant brown leather strap make for a very fine match for her light coffee-colored skin tone. I dare say this could be treated as a unisex watch for the right person. I'm not surprised one of the Broncos has one too. The Slaathaug has also arrived in A1 condition."
"Great Looking Timepiece - Thanks, and please put me on your mailing list."
"A true professional his description was detailed and poetic the item equally so."
"i got a great watch for a super price! thanks."
"ps after taking 3 links out Thursday evening to fit the watch correctly, the Slaathaug is the only watch I have been wearing. It rightly receives nothing but the highest praise from my clients (I'm the Canadian equivalent of a CPA with over 400 clients, so this watch is getting some attention, and the right kind too)."
Montres Allison
https://www.chrono24.com/en/all/montres-allison-tourbillon-2016--id4945165.htm