Freelance Jokes Story
Donz5
For some late-night hosts, the laughs come cheap
Freelance writers send in jokes, hoping to hear them on TV. The pay?
$75 to $100. It may violate the WGA's contract, but enforcement is
tough.
By Matea Gold and Richard Verrier
May 4, 2009
http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/la-et-comedy-writers4-2009may04,0,1819148.story
Reporting from Los Angeles and New York -- "Beautiful day in New York
City," David Letterman mused on the "Late Show" recently. "Am I right
about that? A gorgeous day. It was so nice today that AIG gave a bonus
to Al Roker."
That joke, part of Letterman's March 17 monologue, wasn't penned by
the late-night host or one of the dozen writers on his staff. It was
written by Phil Johnson, a freelance writer and Web developer, sitting
at home in Boston.
Johnson says he has gotten more than 160 of his jokes on the "Late
Show With David Letterman" and, before that, "The Tonight Show With
Jay Leno."
The 39-year-old is part of an underground network of comedy writers
who supply the late-night programs with a constant stream of material.
If one of their jokes gets on the air, they get a check for $75 or
$100. What they don't get is any credit or union pay.
That doesn't daunt Matt Little, an unemployed comedian who spends
hours each day scouring news websites in his Brooklyn apartment,
crafting one-liners that may never air. The 28-year-old got his joke-
writing start while working as a page at the "Late Show," where he
persuaded the head monologue writer to let him submit material.
Little still remembers what it felt like the first time Letterman used
one of his jokes. The quip: "It was so hot out today that Rupert
Murdoch bought Dairy Queen."
"I was in the balcony paging that day, and I had to run off in the
corner where it was really dark and kind of jumped around, trying not
to scream like a little girl," he recalled.
For each of the 15 or 20 jokes that he's gotten on the air, he's
received a check for $75 from Worldwide Pants, Letterman's production
company. In the memo line, it reads "one joke."
"You pour so much time into this," said Little, who also submits
material for the "Weekend Update" segment of "Saturday Night Live."
"And you don't find out until the show airs if you got a joke on or
not. I like to say that it's like you're holding your lottery ticket
in your hand, hoping that the words match up."
An open secret
Known colloquially as "faxing into a show," because the jokes were
submitted by fax until e-mail became ubiquitous, freelance joke
writing has been a fixture of late-night television, quietly
flourishing for decades. It is widely acknowledged in the industry
that jokes told by Leno, Letterman, Jimmy Fallon or SNL's Seth Meyers
might originate with a wannabe joke writer eager to break into showbiz
and not with a credited Writers Guild of America member.
Letterman and Leno declined to comment on their use of freelancers, as
did executives at CBS and NBC, which also airs Fallon's program and
"SNL."
Although the union says the practice violates its contract, the guild
has never made the issue a high priority, even as it has worked to
organize unaffiliated reality show writers. That's in part because it
receives few complaints from freelancers happy to get on the air,
regardless of the low pay and the difficulty of policing what is a
clandestine activity.
Steve Bodow, head writer for "The Daily Show With Jon Stewart," which
does not accept freelance jokes, said it's "not a bad way for people
running shows to test new writers out under something approaching real
show-making deadlines."
But Bodow, who has never freelanced jokes himself, also sees the
downside: the "potential for producers to unfairly exploit the many
hungry writers out there -- stringing them along, paying them for
piecework, and never creating real staff-level jobs."
The issue has resurfaced as Conan O'Brien prepares to succeed Leno on
"The Tonight Show" on June 1. O'Brien is one of the few late-night
hosts to refuse freelance jokes, and East Coast guild officials used
his move to privately remind their California counterparts of the
prohibition.
"Conan is one of the key players in this industry, and we knew he was
pure on this issue," said Lowell Peterson, executive director of the
WGA, East. "This was just an opportunity to let the West know that
this was a culture that was moving west. We just want to encourage
that culture."
"It's a question of really maintaining employment opportunities for
guild writers," he added. "Some people might say, 'What's a joke or
two?' But that's what our folks do -- they write a joke or two or
six."
While the guild's contract permits the hiring of freelancers, it
requires that they be paid union minimums -- $3,215 for a comedy
sketch under 10 minutes -- if they are employed as professional
writers on a guild-covered show.
Many freelancers don't think to complain about their status; they're
just happy to have a foothold in the business. Among them is Greg
Volk, a 28-year-old writer in New York, who has been working as a
freelancer for "Late Show" since 2004 and has gotten an estimated 100
jokes on the air. Thrilled to be writing for the likes of Letterman,
he color-copied the first check he received for a joke.
"That is still my biggest credit, and I owe anything I've done since
then to that," added Volk, who said having the freelancing on his
resume helped him land jobs at the Onion News Network and VH1. "It's
helped me get tons of jobs, except for at the 'Late Show.' I'm
resigned to fact that I probably won't ever be a staff writer there."
Not organized
Indeed, few freelancers win the big prize: a late-night staff writer
job. That troubles Dawna Kaufmann, a former stand-up comic and staff
writer for "Saturday Night Live" and "Mad TV" who has worked as a
freelancer for Leno. A self-described "fax person" in the late 1990s,
Kaufmann said she sold hundreds of jokes to Leno and other late night
show hosts, receiving $50 to $100 per joke. "To me, writing for Leno
and others was a full-time job, and it bothered me that I and others
like me weren't put on staff and paid under a union contract."
Other freelancers echo her frustrations.
"I would love to be in the WGA. I'm a professional writer who needs a
union," said one freelance writer in an e-mail to The Times. The
writer, who said he routinely pens jokes for Leno's monologue, spoke
on condition he not be named in order to protect his career.
In the past, the union has taken action against shows that used
freelancers. The guild lodged a complaint with ABC in 2003 over the
use of freelancers on "The Jimmy Kimmel Show." The show's producers
agreed to stop the practice.
The union also warned Leno not to solicit freelance material on "The
Tonight Show" after a staff writer lodged a complaint in 2001. At the
time, Leno maintained he was buying freelance jokes to use in his
stand-up act at a comedy club in Hermosa Beach, where he performs most
Sunday nights.
Peterson said he believed none of the New York-based shows employ
freelance writers. When informed that The Times had spoken to writers
who freelance for several, including "Late Show" and "SNL," he was
taken aback. "Wow, that's disturbing," he said, vowing to "follow up
on the matter."
Tough to enforce
It's not difficult to find comedians who submit material on spec to
the shows. Johnson sends in dozens of jokes each week and publishes
the ones that make it on the air on his website. For now, he doesn't
mind the small stipend as long as it comes with the thrill of hearing
his jokes on the air.
"Any time someone has made an allegation, we've tried to investigate
it," added Patric Verrone, president of the WGA, West, an ex-writer
for Johnny Carson's "Tonight Show." "The problem we run up against is
that the show denies it happens, and the writer who did it won't come
forward to provide us with concrete evidence."
Jeff Hermanson, assistant executive director for WGA, West, said that
it was "unacceptable" for the late-night hosts -- who are some of the
guild's most prominent members -- to use material from freelance
writers but added that he did not know of any who were doing so.
"Anyone who is a joke writer knows this is going on," said Kaufmann.
"It's an absolute abrogation of everything the guild should be about."
Jess Band-ee-Coot
> [via BH]
>
> For some late-night hosts, the laughs come cheap
>
> Freelance writers send in jokes, hoping to hear them on TV. The pay?
> $75 to $100. It may violate the WGA's contract, but enforcement is
> tough.
>
> By Matea Gold and Richard Verrier
> May 4, 2009
>
> http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/la-et-comedy-writers4-2009may04,0,1819148.story
>
> Reporting from Los Angeles and New York -- "Beautiful day in New York
> City," David Letterman mused on the "Late Show" recently. "Am I right
> about that? A gorgeous day. It was so nice today that AIG gave a bonus
> to Al Roker."
A couple of points to make;
1) So the writing staff can't even come up with these lame Al Roker
jokes? They have to prune these "gems" from outside sources???
2) When I proposed that the musicians in this group compose a new theme
for the Tony Mendez show, Maybe was the first to pipe in with, "Oh,
they'll never accept unsolicited material -- it's against their policy!"
Well, apparently it's not. If the "Late Show" is doing it, which is on a
major network, don't you think "TMS" (which is just a little internet
show) would do it, too?
3) I think the whole thing is kind of weak. If the writers on your staff
can't come up with enough good jokes, fire them and get writers who can.
--
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"The good thing about a bee is that it stings once and then it dies.
I wish I could say the same for Steve Curtis.�
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Robert Cohen
wrote:
> Donz5 wrote:
> > [via BH]
>
> > For some late-night hosts, the laughs come cheap
>
> > Freelance writers send in jokes, hoping to hear them on TV. The pay?
> > $75 to $100. It may violate the WGA's contract, but enforcement is
> > tough.
>
> > By Matea Gold and Richard Verrier
> > May 4, 2009
>
>
> > Reporting from Los Angeles and New York -- "Beautiful day in New York
> > City," David Letterman mused on the "Late Show" recently. "Am I right
> > about that? A gorgeous day. It was so nice today that AIG gave a bonus
> > to Al Roker."
>
> A couple of points to make;
>
> 1) So the writing staff can't even come up with these lame Al Roker
> jokes? They have to prune these "gems" from outside sources???
>
> 2) When I proposed that the musicians in this group compose a new theme
> for the Tony Mendez show, Maybe was the first to pipe in with, "Oh,
> they'll never accept unsolicited material -- it's against their policy!"
> Well, apparently it's not. If the "Late Show" is doing it, which is on a
> major network, don't you think "TMS" (which is just a little internet
> show) would do it, too?
>
> 3) I think the whole thing is kind of weak. If the writers on your staff
> can't come up with enough good jokes, fire them and get writers who can.
>
> --
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> "The good thing about a bee is that it stings once and then it dies.
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The writers guild won't ally with Teamster's because many authors are
really mean mutha-fuggers ... in goony (sic kening) cruelish
fantasies
Guilty joke-sneaks are eternally neurotically punished
Registering openly & honestly is professional & ethical: Honorable
script-smiths duly register their material: Therefore, a "John Smith"
is scabbing
Maybe
wrote:
> 2) When I proposed that the musicians in this group compose a new theme
> for the Tony Mendez show, Maybe was the first to pipe in with, "Oh,
> they'll never accept unsolicited material -- it's against their policy!"
> Well, apparently it's not. If the "Late Show" is doing it, which is on a
> major network, don't you think "TMS" (which is just a little internet
> show) would do it, too?
I didn't even contribute to your thread, "Do you play an instrument"
so it wasn't me that said that in regard to the Tony Mendez show.
But I can tell you, music rights and faxing jokes are two different
things. It would be harder to get unsolicited music to be accepted on
the show.
Maybe...American Idol still has trouble getting rights to songs
Jess Band-ee-Coot
Well I apologize if it wasn't you.
That said, American Idol has trouble because they are trying to secure
the rights to songs which have already been published.
That's a different scenario than someone willingly submitting an
original song they've composed.
The legal dilemma there is that the network rejects the outside idea,
then does something similar and risks getting sued by whomever
submitted the original idea.
--
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"The good thing about a bee is that it stings once and then it dies.
I wish I could say the same for Steve Curtis.”
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Alan Page
CB wrote:
> 2) When I proposed that the musicians in this group compose a new theme
> for the Tony Mendez show, Maybe was the first to pipe in with, "Oh,
> they'll never accept unsolicited material -- it's against their policy!"
> Well, apparently it's not. If the "Late Show" is doing it, which is on a
> major network, don't you think "TMS" (which is just a little internet
> show) would do it, too?
If you were to do a little research, the TMS is not "just a little
(I)nternet show..." it is "The greatest show on the Internet" - David
Letterman.
"Maybe" wrote...
> I didn't even contribute to your thread, "Do you play an instrument"
> so it wasn't me that said that in regard to the Tony Mendez show.
That was probably me, quoting the CBS site:
Creative Submissions/Communications
CBS does not accept or consider creative ideas, suggestions or materials
other than those CBS has specifically requested. This is to avoid the
possibility of future misunderstandings when projects developed by CBS's
staff might seem to others to be similar to their own creative ideas,
suggestions or materials.
The CBS site is referring to stuff submitted to CBS, not the LSwDL.
Remember, CBS does not own LSwDL.
--
Alan
~WWWWW~
What a Wonderful Web We Weave
Jess Band-ee-Coot
If you were to do a little research, the TMS is not "just a little
> (I)nternet show..." it is "The greatest show on the Internet" - David
> Letterman.
My apologies to Tony Mendez. The show is on the internet as opposed to a
major television network. Better?
> That was probably me, quoting the CBS site:
>
> Creative Submissions/Communications
> CBS does not accept or consider creative ideas, suggestions or materials
> other than those CBS has specifically requested. This is to avoid the
> possibility of future misunderstandings when projects developed by CBS's
> staff might seem to others to be similar to their own creative ideas,
> suggestions or materials.
>
>
> The CBS site is referring to stuff submitted to CBS, not the LSwDL.
> Remember, CBS does not own LSwDL.
>
So in that case, when it comes to LSwDL, we don't know what they
will or wont accept from outside sources.
R H Draney
>
>Creative Submissions/Communications
>CBS does not accept or consider creative ideas, suggestions or materials
>other than those CBS has specifically requested. This is to avoid the
>possibility of future misunderstandings when projects developed by CBS's
>staff might seem to others to be similar to their own creative ideas,
>suggestions or materials.
>
>
> The CBS site is referring to stuff submitted to CBS, not the LSwDL.
>Remember, CBS does not own LSwDL.
And as has often been pointed out, Paul doesn't pick the musical acts....
But I'll bet any recommendations for musical guests that he tosses out are given
*serious* consideration....r
--
A pessimist sees the glass as half empty.
An optometrist asks whether you see the glass
more full like this?...or like this?
Mark Leckner
All I got was a lousy mouse pad!!!
Mark
James Langdell
Show and not just post them here in alt.fan.letterman? I wondered why
nothing I wrote ever got on the show. Next thing you know, somebody
will reveal that Dave's not even here.
--James
randwill
"Donz5" <do...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:93ba4e67-95fc-4cf5...@n4g2000vba.googlegroups.com...
> [via BH]
>
> For some late-night hosts, the laughs come cheap
>
> Freelance writers send in jokes, hoping to hear them on TV. The pay?
> $75 to $100. It may violate the WGA's contract, but enforcement is
> tough.
>
Fortunately freelance writers do just fine with all that money they saved by
switching to Geico.
What?!
WHAT!!??
Jess Band-ee-Coot
Please stop.
DTSmith
> > Fortunately freelance writers do just fine with all that money they saved by
> > switching to Geico.
>
> > What?!
>
> > WHAT!!??
>
> Please stop.
>
He will when they do, right?
Jess Band-ee-Coot
Why punish *us*, though?
We're innocent bystanders.