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Watch the full documentary "Transformation: The Life and Legacy of Werner Erhard"

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Wind Bag

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Dec 25, 2010, 1:32:20 PM12/25/10
to

Caligari

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Dec 25, 2010, 6:34:12 PM12/25/10
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On Dec 25, 10:32 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> http://www.wernererhard.com/film.html

Company and political party bios of their leaders are always heroic,
leaving out troublesome details.

-- Caligari

Serena Nordstrup

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Dec 26, 2010, 6:54:46 AM12/26/10
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On Dec 26, 7:32 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> http://www.wernererhard.com/film.html

If someone were to supply a transcript, we could better devote a
thorough discussion to the ~word~ of the ~source~, stripped of the
filmick rhetorick.

Sqakingly
Serena

Wind Bag

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Dec 26, 2010, 9:35:13 AM12/26/10
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"If someone were to supply a transcript, "

If your mother and father (or foster or adopted parents or wolves,
whatever the case may be) showed you any love growing up, you would
not be here talking gibberish.

"we could better devote a thorough discussion to the ~word~ of the
~source~, stripped of the filmick rhetorick".

Noted.


Sqakingly
Serena


Wind Bag

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Dec 26, 2010, 9:44:34 AM12/26/10
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"Company and political party bios of their leaders are always heroic,"

As convenient to your trolling as your paranoid point of view is,
Robyn Symon's 64 minute "Transformation: The Life and Legacy of Werner
Erhard" is not a "Company and political party" bio.

"leaving out troublesome details. "

Cool story bro.

Caligari

unread,
Dec 26, 2010, 1:08:27 PM12/26/10
to
On Dec 26, 6:44 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "Company and political party bios of their leaders are always heroic,"
>
> As convenient to your trolling as your paranoid point of view is,
> Robyn Symon's 64 minute "Transformation: The Life and Legacy of Werner
> Erhard" is not a "Company and political party" bio.

I guess that's why the producer of "Transformation: The Life and
Legacy of Werner Erhard", Walter Maksym:

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2483564/

is also Werner Erhard's lawyer:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Werner_Erhard_vs._Columbia_Broadcasting_System
:
"Erhard's attorney was Walter Maksym,[9] who would later serve as
executive producer of a 2006 film about his client."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outrageous_Betrayal :
"During the course of his research for the book Pressman received
multiple letters from Werner Erhard's attorney Walter Maksym, and in
1994 the Chairman of Landmark Education Art Schreiber..."

http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Werner_Erhard_vs._Columbia_Broadcasting_System
:

"Attorneys
Walter P. Maksym 2056 N LINCOLN AV CHICAGO IL, 60614 (773)
929-2923 Plaintiff Werner Erhard"

>
> "leaving out troublesome details. "
>
> Cool story bro.

Here's a cool story. The FAQ page on the film, https://www.transformationfilm.com/faq2.htm
, states:

"Who is the filmmaker?
The film was produced and directed by two-time Emmy award winner,
Robyn Symon. She is a former TV news reporter and Producer with PBS.
You can find out more about her at www.symonproductions.com."

But Robyn Symon's IMDB page, http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2365704/ ,
does not show one Emmy award listing. And if you search the Emmy's
award database, http://www.emmys.com/award_history_search , for "Robyn
Symon" you get:

"There are no results that match your search criteria."

Also, Robyn Symon's website, http://www.symonproductions.com/credits.html
, does show two Emmy wins:

1996-"Leap Of Faith"
1994-"Hemingway’s Key West"

But neither of those show up in the Emmy database -- again at
http://www.emmys.com/award_history_search .

-- Caligari

Caligari

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Dec 26, 2010, 1:45:57 PM12/26/10
to
On Dec 26, 10:08 am, Caligari <enric.me...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Dec 26, 6:44 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > "Company and political party bios of their leaders are always heroic,"
>
> > As convenient to your trolling as your paranoid point of view is,
> > Robyn Symon's 64 minute "Transformation: The Life and Legacy of Werner
> > Erhard" is not a "Company and political party" bio.
>
> I guess that's why the producer of "Transformation: The Life and
> Legacy of Werner Erhard", Walter Maksym:
>
> http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2483564/
>
> is also Werner Erhard's lawyer:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Werner_Erhard_vs._Columbia_Broadcasting_...

> :
> "Erhard's attorney was Walter Maksym,[9] who would later serve as
> executive producer of a 2006 film about his client."
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outrageous_Betrayal:
> "During the course of his research for the book Pressman received
> multiple letters from Werner Erhard's attorney Walter Maksym, and in
> 1994 the Chairman of Landmark Education Art Schreiber..."
>
> http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Werner_Erhard_vs._Columbia_Broadcasting...

> :
>
> "Attorneys
> Walter P. Maksym    2056 N LINCOLN AV CHICAGO IL, 60614  (773)
> 929-2923    Plaintiff   Werner Erhard"
>
>
>
> > "leaving out troublesome details. "
>
> > Cool story bro.
>
> Here's a cool story.  The FAQ page on the film,https://www.transformationfilm.com/faq2.htm

> , states:
>
> "Who is the filmmaker?
> The film was produced and directed by two-time Emmy award winner,
> Robyn Symon.  She is a former TV news reporter and Producer with PBS.
> You can find out more about her atwww.symonproductions.com."
>
> But Robyn Symon's IMDB page,http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2365704/,
> does not show one Emmy award listing.  And if you search the Emmy's
> award database,http://www.emmys.com/award_history_search, for "Robyn

> Symon" you get:
>
> "There are no results that match your search criteria."
>
> Also, Robyn Symon's website,http://www.symonproductions.com/credits.html

> , does show two Emmy wins:
>
> 1996-"Leap Of Faith"
> 1994-"Hemingway’s Key West"
>
> But neither of those show up in the Emmy database  -- again athttp://www.emmys.com/award_history_search.
>
>   -- Caligari

Turns out Robyn's Emmy's comes from Suncoast Regional Emmy,
http://suncoast.emmyonline.org/ , not The Emmys, http://www.emmys.tv/
. They "offer annual Emmy Awards called The Suncoast Regional Emmy
Awards to television markets in the entire State of Florida,
Alexandria, Baton Rouge, Lafayette, Lake Charles and NEw Orleans,
Lousiana, Mobile, Alabama, Thomasville, Georgia and Puerto Rico." --
http://suncoast.emmyonline.org/about/default.aspx . It would have
been clearer and more honest to say: two time Suncoast Regional Emmy
award winner.

;)

Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted

Caligari

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Dec 26, 2010, 2:04:45 PM12/26/10
to
On Dec 26, 10:58 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Enrich, have you dug in and  thoroughly research how "Walter Maksym"
> came to be credited and what large of small part he played or did not
> play  in the production of "Transformation: The Life and Legacy of
> Werner Erhard"? Perhaps spoken to the filmmaker and asked them why?
>
> You show a convenient lack of interest in complete information. If
> some person like yourself wishes to compile agreeable fragments of
> data  from the internet  to show a view that the word is in fact
> "world is full of trickery" or some other victim  point of view, it is
> easily done.

I have asked Robyn Symon's questions about her film, 'Transformation:
The Life and Legacy of Werner Erhard" at http://www.youtube.com/user/symonprod.
None of them were answered.

-- Caligari

Message has been deleted

Wind Bag

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Dec 26, 2010, 2:13:02 PM12/26/10
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"I have asked Robyn Symon's questions about her film, 'Transformation:
The Life and Legacy of Werner Erhard" at http://www.youtube.com/user/symonprod.
None of them were answered.

-- Caligari"

Again, how convenient.

Wind Bag

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Dec 26, 2010, 2:28:27 PM12/26/10
to
Enrich, have you dug in and thoroughly researched how "Walter Maksym"
came to be credited and what large or silent role he played or did
not play in the production of "Transformation: The Life and Legacy of

Werner Erhard"? Perhaps spoken to the filmmaker and asked them why?

You show a staggering lack of interest in presenting complete
information. If someone like yourself wishes to compile 'agreeable'
fragments of data from the internet and then show a view that, in
fact, the "world is full of trickery" or some other victim point of
view, it can be easily done.

Caligari

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Dec 26, 2010, 2:47:38 PM12/26/10
to

You've edited that entry three times, deleting it twice. Are you
satisfied with your statement yet?

-- Caligari

Wind Bag

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Dec 26, 2010, 2:50:41 PM12/26/10
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You've edited that entry three times, deleting it twice. Are you
satisfied with your statement yet?

-- Caligari

Yes.Now I am thank-you.

Caligari

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Dec 26, 2010, 2:51:57 PM12/26/10
to

Certainly.

Wind Bag

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Dec 26, 2010, 3:07:57 PM12/26/10
to
> > Yes.Now I am thank-you.
>
> Certainly.

Enrich, before labeling another filmmakers project a "company" or
"political party bio" or spreading your uninformed propaganda, have
you thoroughly researched how "Walter Maksym" came to be credited and

Caligari

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Dec 26, 2010, 3:22:15 PM12/26/10
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I guess you weren't satisfied with your last statement yet.

Doesn't take a genius to wonder about the objectivity of a documentary
that's executive produced by the lawyer the documentary is about.

-- Caligari

Wind Bag

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Dec 26, 2010, 3:41:13 PM12/26/10
to
"I guess you weren't satisfied with your last statement yet.

Doesn't take a genius to wonder about the objectivity of a documentary
that's executive produced by the lawyer the documentary is about."

-- Caligari

Enrich, who asked you if had taken the time to "wonder" about this,
that and the other thing or asked you about any of the things you
"wonder" about? Do you think that your "genius" "wonderings" =
reality/fact/truth?

The question remains on the table, if your are interested: before
labeling your fellow filmmakers project a "company bio" did you
THOROUGHLY research how "Walter Maksym" came to be given a film credit
and what large or silent role did "Walter Maksym" play or not play in

Caligari

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Dec 26, 2010, 4:04:58 PM12/26/10
to

You should not question if all the information is given in a film
claiming to be a documentary until every detail is researched on the
fact that it's funded and produced by the lawyer the documentary is
about. Just believe it's objective until then?

-- Caligari

Caligari

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Dec 26, 2010, 4:18:26 PM12/26/10
to

When BP, Audi, GE, etc. take out ads in magazines and hire an
independent firm to produce them -- sometimes multi-page ads with
"advertisement" at the top to make it clear -- it's obviously an ad.
Even when they spend a lot of money to hire production companies and
film directors like BMW:

http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/25/video-collection-bmw-films-the-hire/

or Honda:

http://dreams.honda.com/#/video_in

It's obvious the films are not just cool, but to promote the company.
At the least the film "Transformation: The Life and Legacy of Werner
Erhard" should be called a company executive bio, if not just
advertisement.

-- Caligari

Wind Bag

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Dec 26, 2010, 4:30:54 PM12/26/10
to
You should not question if all the information is given in a film
claiming to be a documentary until every detail is researched on the
fact that it's funded and produced by the lawyer the documentary is
about. Just believe it's objective until then?

-- Caligari

Besides you, who is interested in what Enrich "believes" or
"questions" or finds "obvious" ? You labeled the film a "company
bio". The question was asked if you thoroughly researched your
claim. I am concluding that you did not investigate what you are
talking about and that you have a lack of interest in reality, and
leaving it there.

Caligari

unread,
Dec 26, 2010, 4:56:30 PM12/26/10
to
On Dec 26, 1:30 pm, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> You should not question if all the information is given in a film
> claiming to be a documentary until every detail is researched on the
> fact that it's funded and produced by the lawyer the documentary is
> about.  Just believe it's objective until then?
>
>   -- Caligari
>
> Besides you, who is interested in what Enrich "believes" or
> "questions" or finds "obvious" ?  

People are interested in the authenticity of documentaries. For
example at the Atlanta showing:

http://www.atlantafilms.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=news_national;action=display;num=1149268198
:

-- Caligari

Tex

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Dec 26, 2010, 6:50:29 PM12/26/10
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> Turns out Robyn's Emmy's comes from Suncoast Regional Emmy,http://suncoast.emmyonline.org/, not The Emmys,http://www.emmys.tv/

> .  They "offer annual Emmy Awards called The Suncoast Regional Emmy
> Awards to television markets in the entire State of Florida,
> Alexandria, Baton Rouge, Lafayette, Lake Charles and NEw Orleans,
> Lousiana, Mobile, Alabama, Thomasville, Georgia and Puerto Rico." --http://suncoast.emmyonline.org/about/default.aspx.  It would have

> been clearer and more honest to say:  two time Suncoast Regional Emmy
> award winner.
>
>    ;)- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

LOL!!!!
Creating her own reality!!!!!!

Caligari

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Dec 26, 2010, 7:12:28 PM12/26/10
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;)

You can become an OSCAR member here: http://www.oscarmn.org/index.html

computeruser

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Dec 27, 2010, 6:31:44 AM12/27/10
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The film also contains Jane Self reemphasizing* the "Humanitarian
Award" bestowed on Werner Erhard. To my recollection the only
Humanitarian Awards he was ~~honored~~ with was the "Mahatma Gandhi
Humanitarian Award" from the discredited Gandhi Memorial International
Foundation. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gandhi_Memorial_International_Foundation

IMO it is like ~~creating your own reality~~ or purchasing your
credentials from a diploma mill.

* Jane Self wrote the book 60 Minutes and the Assassination of Werner
Erhard (1992), which was marketed to ~~graduates~~ of est/Forum,
through a postcard campaign. I first read about the "Humanitarian
Award" in her book. This underlying premise that he was "honored" (and
therefore honorable) is flawed given the nature and source of this
award.

Her book was published by Breakthru Publishing, which also published
"Diets Don't Work".


.

[In 1999, Yogesh Gandhi entered a guilty plea to the charges of mail
fraud, tax evasion and violating federal election law over his
contributions involving the Gandhi Memorial International Foundation
and the Democratic National Committee in 1996.]

computeruser

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Dec 27, 2010, 7:06:17 AM12/27/10
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Reminds me of the the Nobel Laureate prizes, given by the Royal
Swedish Academy of Sciences vs. the Nobel Peace Prize (given by the
Norwegian Nobel Committee). Two vastly different realms yet they
share the same name.


Wind Bag

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Dec 27, 2010, 11:26:56 AM12/27/10
to
Computeruser,

what "Award" is real anyway or without some flawed humans attached to
them?

IMO the American Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences "Academy
Awards" is the most popular and accepted and advertized of the "award"
shams and each year "winners" advertize their awards to promote
themselves and sell themselves and profit and fortify and build their
reputations with them. It is the American way. Werner Erhard and Jane
Self are Americans.

IMO Marlon Brando (Sacheen Littlefeather) dealt this "award" "and the
winner is" nonsense in this way: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QUacU0I4yU.

Most Americans are more gracious than Brando about accepting what is
offered to them from others and the spirit in which it is offered,
whether the award is a sham or not, and just move on.

Tex

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Dec 27, 2010, 1:22:39 PM12/27/10
to

Then everything is just "empty and meaningless"?

No, some awards actually DO mean something.
Nobel Prize.
Pulitzer Prize.
Certainly Emmys, Oscars, Tonys are indicate the recipients have
reached a high standing among their peers.
I've not seen many awarded that weren't excellent in their craft.

The guy giving the Ghandi Humanitarian award was a scam artist.
What does it say about people who list the award on their resume even
though it is public knowledge that the award is meaningless?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gandhi_Memorial_International_Foundation

computeruser

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Dec 27, 2010, 1:27:35 PM12/27/10
to
"Wind Bag" wrote...
> computeruser,

If I understand you correctly; Jane Self seems to give more merit to awards
than you or I do.

Perhaps Werner was gracious about accepting the award, I have no certainty
on what he did or didn't do in this instance. Do you?

The issue (for me) is how Jane Self is using the information to promote and
sell and fortify and build his reputation, with the flawed underlying
premise. IMO; some would call it a straw man or blind faith.

Perhaps she did not do adequate fact checking, or perhaps there is another
explanation I've missed.

Is she a "Tool" for Werner or a sloppy journalist or...(?)......?

.


Caligari

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Dec 27, 2010, 1:26:04 PM12/27/10
to

There's a difference when an individual poses as an award organization
based on merit as Yogesh K. Gandhi with his Gandhi Memorial
International Foundation con that does no more than accept money to
send an award. To an organization that takes in votes from fellow
artists in the field like the Academy Awards based on published rules
and verifies them through an independent accounting agency
Pricewaterhouse Coopers. As there's a difference to a mail in Diploma
that you get just for paying a fee to getting a degree after years at
Harvard University studying, taking tests and learning a field.

-- Caligari

Wind Bag

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Dec 27, 2010, 1:31:57 PM12/27/10
to
"Then everything is just "empty and meaningless"?

I do not promote this idea nor did I say that.

"No, some awards actually DO mean something."

Says who?


"Nobel Prize.
Pulitzer Prize.
Certainly Emmys, Oscars, Tonys are indicate the recipients have
reached a high standing among their peers.
I've not seen many awarded that weren't excellent in their craft."

That these awards meet some standard for you is ok. I do not give
them any value.


"The guy giving the Ghandi Humanitarian award was a scam artist."

What is a "scam artist"? Is that like a "true believer" These are
catchy sweeping labels that marganalize and discredit persons you
don't like. Too convenient.

"What does it say about people who list the award on their resume even

though it is public knowledge that the award is meaningless."

This is a loaded unfactual "do you still beat your wife"? question.

Caligari

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Dec 27, 2010, 1:35:08 PM12/27/10
to

When someone has beat his wife, it's a valid question.

-- Caligari

Wind Bag

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Dec 27, 2010, 1:37:57 PM12/27/10
to
There's a difference when an individual poses as an award organization
based on merit as Yogesh K. Gandhi with his Gandhi Memorial
International Foundation con that does no more than accept money to
send an award. To an organization that takes in votes from fellow
artists in the field like the Academy Awards based on published rules
and verifies them through an independent accounting agency
Pricewaterhouse Coopers. As there's a difference to a mail in Diploma
that you get just for paying a fee to getting a degree after years at
Harvard University studying, taking tests and learning a field.

-- Caligari

A sham or not, no two "awards" are the same Enrich. All awards are
trumped up to sell something and perpetuate some culture and there is
often profit involved somewhere along the line. IMO mediocre films and
perfomances have been given "awards" while others of high quality were
overlooked. The Oscars are one of the silliest most self serving
"awards" there is.

Wind Bag

unread,
Dec 27, 2010, 1:42:50 PM12/27/10
to
When someone has beat his wife, it's a valid question.

-- Caligari

Granted.

Caligari

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Dec 27, 2010, 2:17:48 PM12/27/10
to

There are choices that are of just good rather than great. But
there's the winners of "Gone With The Wind", "Casablanca", "On the
Waterfront", "The Bridge on the River Kwai", "Ben-Hur", "West Side
Story", "Lawrence of Arabia", "My Fair Lady", "The Sound of Music",
"Midnight Cowboy", "Patton", "The Godfather", "Annie Hall", "Amadeus",
"Rain Man", "Forest Gump", "Million Dollar Baby", "Crash", "No Country
for Old Men". You may not consider all of these great by taste, they
are my choices for great Oscars winners. But it's no sham -- you can
take some of the films to the mattresses! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQ9wXs6vOps

-- Caligari

Ellen

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Dec 27, 2010, 3:11:24 PM12/27/10
to
On Dec 27, 8:26 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:


> Most Americans are more gracious than Brando about accepting what is
> offered to them from others and the spirit in which it is offered,
> whether the award is a sham or not, and just move on.


If your bit of "If this than that" nonsense is indicative of the rest
of your intellectual prowess I'd say you are a perfect candidate for
Werner Erhard's programs and a perfect spokesperson for their
"education." But watch out. They might call you back for more
training (coaching) for making them ~look bad.~


Blechhhh

Wind Bag

unread,
Dec 27, 2010, 3:27:56 PM12/27/10
to
"If your bit of "If this than that" nonsense is indicative of the rest
of your intellectual prowess I'd say you are a perfect candidate for
Werner Erhard's programs and a perfect spokesperson for their
"education." But watch out. They might call you back for more
training (coaching) for making them ~look bad.~ "

Blechhhh"

Cool story bro.

Ellen

unread,
Dec 27, 2010, 3:52:54 PM12/27/10
to


I'd watch out for that bit of thought-stopping programming they've
inserted into your puny brain. It turns into a knee-jerk response
after a while, and one meant to arrest whatever progress or maturity
you might otherwise attain.


Ellen

Wind Bag

unread,
Dec 27, 2010, 4:12:15 PM12/27/10
to
"I'd watch out for that bit of thought-stopping programming they've
inserted into your puny brain. It turns into a knee-jerk response
after a while, and one meant to arrest whatever progress or maturity
you might otherwise attain.

Ellen"

Cool story bro.


Ellen

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Dec 27, 2010, 4:48:50 PM12/27/10
to

...A minor miracle they've managed to shoehorn it in.

Can you understand the mechanism of self-selection into groups such a
Landmark?

Ellen

Wind Bag

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Dec 27, 2010, 4:53:35 PM12/27/10
to
"...A minor miracle they've managed to shoehorn it in.

Can you understand the mechanism of self-selection into groups such a
Landmark?


Ellen"


:-*

Tex

unread,
Dec 27, 2010, 5:24:59 PM12/27/10
to
On Dec 27, 1:31 pm, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "Then everything is just "empty and meaningless"?
>
> I do not promote this idea nor did I say that.
>
> "No, some awards actually DO mean something."
>
> Says who?
>
> "Nobel Prize.
> Pulitzer Prize.
> Certainly Emmys, Oscars, Tonys are indicate the recipients have
> reached a high standing among their peers.
> I've not seen many awarded that weren't excellent in their craft."
>
> That these awards meet some standard  for you is ok. I do not give
> them any value.
>
> "The guy giving the Ghandi Humanitarian award was a scam artist."
>
> What is a "scam artist"? Is that like a "true believer"

No.
A scam artist might be someone arrested by the FBI for mail fraud, for
example.

-
http://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/1998/March/098.htm.html

YOGESH GANDHI ARRESTED


Yogesh Gandhi was arrested by the FBI without incident last
night in Walnut Creek, California, near San Francisco. A complaint
filed in the U.S. District Court in San Francisco charges Gandhi
with violating 18 U.S.C. 1341, the federal mail fraud statute.

Gandhi was arrested by agents from the San Francisco Field
Office, working in tandem with agents from the Justice Department's
Campaign Financing Task Force.

Gandhi is scheduled to appear before U.S. Magistrate Judge
Maria-Elena James in federal District court in San Francisco at
9:30 a.m., Pacific Standard Time.

A complaint and affadavit are attached.

A true believer is something quite different.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/true+believer
One who is deeply, sometimes fanatically devoted to a cause,
organization, or person: "a band of true believers bonded together
against all those who did not agree with them"
.
Do you see the distinction?
Quite simple, really.

>These are
> catchy sweeping labels that marganalize and discredit  persons you
> don't like. Too convenient.
>
> "What does it say about people who list the award on their resume even
> though it is public knowledge that the award is meaningless."
>
> This is a loaded unfactual "do you still beat your wife"? question.

The facts are quite evident.
The award was presented by a scam artist and convicted felon.
If you discovered this, wouldn't you remove it from your resume?
Hardly something to be proud of receiving.
To Werner's credit, I could not see any reference to this award on his
website.


Wind Bag

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Dec 27, 2010, 6:03:09 PM12/27/10
to
"http://www.thefreedictionary.com/true+believer

One who is deeply, sometimes fanatically devoted to a cause,
organization, or person: "a band of true believers bonded together
against all those who did not agree with them"
.
Do you see the distinction? "

I read what you said and what it said and understand and accept what
you are talking about. "True believer" is just not a term I use or
would ever apply to another person.

"The facts are quite evident. The award was presented by a scam artist
and convicted felon. If you discovered this, wouldn't you remove it
from your resume?"

Tex, based on the scenerio you provided here and the rhetoric and
discriptions you presented (and not on the reality of the situation
whatever it was or wasn't) I would remove it from any resume' .

Tex

unread,
Dec 27, 2010, 9:06:11 PM12/27/10
to
On Dec 27, 6:03 pm, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "http://www.thefreedictionary.com/true+believer
>
> One who is deeply, sometimes fanatically devoted to a cause,
> organization, or person: "a band of true believers bonded together
> against all those who did not agree with them"
> .
> Do you see the distinction? "
>
> I read what you said and what it said and understand and accept what
> you are talking about. "True believer" is just not a term I use or
> would ever apply to another person.
>
> "The facts are quite evident. The award was presented by a scam artist
> and convicted felon. If you discovered this, wouldn't you remove it
> from your resume?"
>
> Tex, based on the scenerio you provided here and the rhetoric and
> discriptions you presented  (and not on the reality of the situation
> whatever it was or wasn't) I would remove it from any  resume' .

We can agree on this then.

Serena Nordstrup

unread,
Dec 29, 2010, 6:57:11 AM12/29/10
to
On Dec 27, 3:35 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "If someone were to supply a transcript, "
>
> If your mother and father (or foster or adopted parents or wolves,
> whatever the case may be) showed you any love growing up, you would
> not be here talking gibberish.

If I were ever to grow up, you might care to investigate the wolves in
my background.

> "we could better devote a thorough discussion to the ~word~ of the
> ~source~, stripped of the filmick rhetorick".
>
> Noted.

Any progress on finding or generating a transcript?

> Sqakingly
> Serena

Serena Nordstrup

unread,
Dec 29, 2010, 7:02:19 AM12/29/10
to
On Dec 27, 3:44 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "Company and political party bios of their leaders are always heroic,"
>
> As convenient to your trolling as your paranoid point of view is,
> Robyn Symon's 64 minute "Transformation: The Life and Legacy of Werner
> Erhard" is not a "Company and political party" bio.

How about Jack Rosenberg (aka ~erhard~) -- do you regard one or more
of the manifestations of this person as a ~leader~?

> "leaving out troublesome details. "
>
> Cool story bro.

Not so much a ~story~ as the articulation of a law of corporate/
ideological propaganda.

Serena Nordstrup

unread,
Dec 29, 2010, 7:06:17 AM12/29/10
to
On Dec 27, 8:28 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Enrich, have you dug in and  thoroughly researched how "Walter Maksym"
> came to be credited and what large or silent role  he played or did
> not play in the production of "Transformation: The Life and Legacy of
> Werner Erhard"? Perhaps spoken to the filmmaker and asked them why?
>
> You show a staggering lack of interest in presenting complete
> information. If someone like yourself  wishes to compile 'agreeable'
> fragments of data  from the internet and then show a view that, in
> fact, the  "world is full of trickery" or some other victim point of
> view, it can be easily done.

Did someone or did someone not taint the name and reputation of Walter
Maksym by associating his name with that of the notorious ~werner
erhard~ in the credits of a filmic production?

Serena Nordstrup

unread,
Dec 29, 2010, 7:08:24 AM12/29/10
to
On Dec 27, 8:28 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Enrich, have you dug in and  thoroughly researched how "Walter Maksym"
> came to be credited and what large or silent role  he played or did
> not play in the production of "Transformation: The Life and Legacy of
> Werner Erhard"? Perhaps spoken to the filmmaker and asked them why?
>
> You show a staggering lack of interest in presenting complete
> information.

You have access to sources and/or methods of "complete information"?
Pray tell!

Serena Nordstrup

unread,
Dec 29, 2010, 7:15:35 AM12/29/10
to
On Dec 27, 9:41 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "I guess you weren't satisfied with your last statement yet.
>
> Doesn't take a genius to wonder about the objectivity of a documentary
> that's executive produced by the lawyer the documentary is about."
>
>   -- Caligari
>
> Enrich, who asked you if had taken the time to "wonder" about this,
> that and the other thing or asked you about any of the things you
> "wonder"  about?

Wondering requires permission?

If so, I apply for same.

> Do you think that your "genius" "wonderings"  =
> reality/fact/truth?
>
> The question remains on the table, if your are interested: before
> labeling your  fellow filmmakers project a "company bio" did  you
> THOROUGHLY research how "Walter Maksym" came to be given a film credit
> and  what large or silent role did "Walter Maksym" play or not play in

Serena Nordstrup

unread,
Dec 29, 2010, 7:22:36 AM12/29/10
to
On Dec 27, 10:30 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
> You should not question if all the information is given in a film
> claiming to be a documentary until every detail is researched on the
> fact that it's funded and produced by the lawyer the documentary is
> about.  Just believe it's objective until then?
>
>   -- Caligari
>
> Besides you, who is interested in what Enrich "believes" or
> "questions" or finds "obvious" ?  

Why do you ask?

> You labeled the film  a "company bio".  

Not so: Enric made a generick statement about corporate and political
films.

> The question was asked  if you thoroughly researched your
> claim.  I am concluding that you did not investigate what you are
> talking about  and that you have a lack of interest in reality, and
> leaving it there.

Comrade Bag: you omitted to answer the questions -- You should not
question if all the information is given in a film claiming to be a
documentary until every detail is researched on the fact that it's
funded and produced by the lawyer the documentary is about? Just
believe it's objective until then?

Squakingly
Serena

Serena Nordstrup

unread,
Dec 29, 2010, 7:29:10 AM12/29/10
to

The Nobel prizes also share an origin in the legacy and funding which
Alfred Nobel distributed within the then United Kingdoms of Sweden and
Norway, so they do not stem from entirely different realms.

Serena Nordstrup

unread,
Dec 29, 2010, 7:34:27 AM12/29/10
to

Please address the question in an informative manner: Can you
understand the mechanism of self-selection into groups such as
~landmark~ ~education~?

Tex

unread,
Dec 29, 2010, 7:59:42 PM12/29/10
to

While you're at it, can you also tell us the air-speed velocity of an
unladen sparrow?
How many angles can fit on the head of a pin?
Where were you on the night of October 17th, 1973, between 7:57 and
8:23?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y2R3FvS4xr4

Serena Nordstrup

unread,
Dec 30, 2010, 2:32:27 AM12/30/10
to
On Dec 30, 1:59 pm, Tex <ritter_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Dec 29, 7:34 am, Serena Nordstrup <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > On Dec 28, 10:53 am, Wind Bag <replynega...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > "...A minor miracle they've managed to shoehorn it in.
>
> > > Can you understand the mechanism of self-selection into groups such a
> > > Landmark?
>
> > > Ellen"
>
> > > :-*
>
> > Please address the question in an informative manner: Can you
> > understand the mechanism of self-selection into groups such as
> > ~landmark~ ~education~?
>
> While you're at it, can you also tell us the air-speed velocity of an
> unladen sparrow?
> How many angles can fit on the head of a pin?

Excluding archangels -- in this case only. (Unlike understanding the
mechanism of self-selection into groups such as ~landmark education~,
archangels may count as off-topick in discussions on
alt.fan.landmark...)

> Where were you on the night of October 17th, 1973, between 7:57 and
> 8:23?

(You may specify the time zone when formulating and delivering your
reply.)

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y2R3FvS4xr4

computeruser

unread,
Dec 30, 2010, 5:41:47 AM12/30/10
to

While the seed money comes from the funding Alfred Nobel set aside in
his will; the governing bodies function separately and [it is my view
that] the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences is operationally vastly
different. They are awarding based on achievements. While the
Norwegian Nobel Committee seems to award based on those they see as
having the same mindset and political agenda as their own governing
body. This is more in line with the old boys clubs, and not on
academic or scientific progress.

Caligari

unread,
Dec 30, 2010, 11:59:14 AM12/30/10
to

Their attempt to predict Obama for the Nobel Peace Prize was not wise.

-- Caligari

Serena Nordstrup

unread,
Jan 1, 2011, 12:45:38 AM1/1/11
to

Compare the Sweden-based Nobel Prize for Literature.

Message has been deleted

Bathypelagic Man

unread,
Jan 25, 2011, 2:30:02 PM1/25/11
to
"Excluding archangels -- in this case only. (Unlike understanding
the mechanism of self-selection into groups such as ~landmark
education~, archangels may count as off-topick in discussions on
alt.fan.landmark...)"

Can't make heads or tails of what you say most of the time Serena but
I am left admiring you for your intelligence and skill with words. How
did you wind up being sooooooooo super???

tubby

unread,
Jan 25, 2011, 7:28:37 PM1/25/11
to

A Muse maybe????

Cheers

"Bathypelagic Man" wrote in message
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