WAS vs WERE
ask
Hi all...
I'd like to know the rule by which you use either WAS or WERE.
For example:
I wish I WERE an Oscar Mayer weiner.....or
I wish I WAS an Oscar Mayer weiner.
If I WERE to go to the theater.....or
If I WAS to go to the theater.
Thanks...
Adrian
Raymond S. Wise
You're asking about the "past subjunctive," also known as the "'were'
subjunctive," because the only time you see its effects is in the past
tense of the first person singular and the third person singular, when
instead of the indicative form "was" being the verb, "were" is used
instead.
See the section "Past Subjunctive" of the article "Subjunctive" by Mark
Israel in the AUE FAQ (AUE is the newsgroup alt.usage.english , another
Usenet group discussing English usage.)
http://alt-usage-english.org/excerpts/fxsubjun.html
--
Raymond S. Wise
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
E-mail: mplsray @ yahoo . com
Bob Cunningham
> > I'd like to know the rule by which you use either WAS or WERE.
> > For example:
> > I wish I WERE an Oscar Mayer weiner.....or
> > I wish I WAS an Oscar Mayer weiner.
> > If I WERE to go to the theater.....or
> > If I WAS to go to the theater.
> > Thanks...
> > Adrian
> You're asking about the "past subjunctive," also known as the "'were'
> subjunctive,"
Actually, "past subjunctive" is a misnomer. The only thing
"past" about it is that "were" is used both for the
subjunctive and for the past tense.
In a statement like "I wish I were rich", the "were" doesn't
have any clear time reference. Consider
Future reference:
If I were rich, I would buy a yacht tomorrow.
Present reference:
If I were rich, I wouldn't be driving a 1977 Dodge.
I know some grammarians call it the "past subjunctive", but
it's still a misnomer.
To refer clearly to the past with contrary-to-fact sense,
you use a construction with "had" and a past participle:
If I had been rich, I would have bought a yacht.
A better answer to the original poster is that in
I wish I were an Oscar Mayer Weiner
"were" is used because the speaker is not an Oscar Mayer
Weiner. That is, that he or she is an Oscar Mayer Weiner is
contrary to fact. It's a disservice to the reader to imply
that "were" always refers to the past when it's used for the
subjunctive.
Raymond S. Wise
When speaking of the subjunctive, it is necessary to distinguish
between the present subjunctive, both frozen and active forms--"God
save the Queen!" "I asked that they be informed."--and the past
subjunctive, both frozen and active forms--"As it were." "I wish I were
there." What terminology do you propose to distinguish the two? "'Were'
subjunctive" works for the past subjunctive, but what would you call
the present subjunctive?
I dislike the term "double negative" for "negative concord," but if a
person wished to find articles via Google dealing with negative
concord, his best bet would be to use "double negative" among his
search terms. So it is with the "'were' subjunctive": To do a thorough
and efficient Google search on the matter, it would be necessary to use
the term "past subjunctive" among your search terms.
Bob Cunningham
<mpl...@my-deja.com> said:
> > > ask wrote:
> > > > Hi all...
> > > > Thanks...
> > > > Adrian
Strictly speaking, there's no such thing as a present
subjunctive, but I suppose if we're to call "if he were" the
"were" subjunctive, we could call "if he be" the "be
subjunctive".
> I dislike the term "double negative" for "negative concord," but if a
> person wished to find articles via Google dealing with negative
> concord, his best bet would be to use "double negative" among his
> search terms. So it is with the "'were' subjunctive": To do a thorough
> and efficient Google search on the matter, it would be necessary to use
> the term "past subjunctive" among your search terms.
I was referring to the case where grammar is to be taught to
a student. I suppose it's necessary to call "if it were"
the past subjunctive because it's an entrenched misnomer.
But in telling a learner about it, we shouldn't use "past
subjunctive" without explaining that it is an unfortunate
but well-established term despite the fact that "if it were"
often doesn't have a past sense.
I think I've read one grammarian who said it's an error to
use "if it were" to refer to the past, as in "My nephew
wasn't at home when I called, but if he were I would have
asked him". Correct usage would be to replace "were" with
"had been".
But I've seen "if it were" used with a past sense by
respected writers -- Ernest Hemingway and Agatha Christie
among them -- so I guess it's a controversial usage. I for
one would never use it.
As for Google, if you want to find out about the wild
juniper trees that proliferate in Utah, you'll do well to
search on "cedar" and "Utah", even though there are people
who get a little upset over calling a juniper tree a cedar,
just as there is at least one person who finds it disturbing
to see "if it were" called "past subjunctive"..
meirman
<a...@Tampabay.rr.com> posted:
>
> Hi all...
>
> I'd like to know the rule by which you use either WAS or WERE.
There are three or four types of cases in which WERE, or some other
verb in the subjunctive, is used. They are all sort of related.
> For example:
>
> I wish I WERE an Oscar Mayer weiner.....or
This category could be called "Contrary to Fact". Since you are not
an Oscar Meyer weiner, the statement is contrary to fact, and the
subjunctive, WERE, should be used.
> I wish I WAS an Oscar Mayer weiner.
> If I WERE to go to the theater.....or
IIRC, statements beginning with "If" need the subjunctive about half
the time. When they need it, it's because the situation described is
similar to the Contrary to Fact. Since I don't know the end of your
sample sentence, let me try a simpler example: If I WERE to see the
Taj Mahal... , either because you're not likely to ever see it, or
because at least you're not seeing it now.
> If I WAS to go to the theater.
Again let's change it.... Well, I'm having a hard time thinking of an
example, but I'm looking for a simple if-then situation, where we are
not hypothesizing a situation so much as saying what consequences
follow from a given situation such as "If I was caught cheating, I'd
be embarrassed." The trouble with that one is I don't cheat and I
wouldn't be caught, so I prefer to use WERE, to make that point.
Someone may provide a sentence. Let's change the subject to HE. If
he was a child molestor, he should have been shot. This still
recognizes two situations, that he was and that he wasn't, but in the
first case, it's not hypothetical. Hence the indicative mood, not the
subjunctive.
Another place for the subjunctive is "God bless you", etc. This is a
wish that something will happen. It's not necessarily contrary to
fact, but otoh, it hasn't happened yet, at least at the moment someone
says it.
>
> Thanks...
> Adrian
s/ meirman
--
If you are emailing me please
say if you are posting the same response.
Born west of Pittsburgh Pa. 10 years
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Chicago, 6 years
Brooklyn NY 12 years
now in Baltimore 22 years
Bob Cunningham
<exw...@earthlink.net> said:
[...]
> I think I've read one grammarian who said it's an error to
> use "if it were" to refer to the past, as in "My nephew
> wasn't at home when I called, but if he were I would have
> asked him". Correct usage would be to replace "were" with
> "had been".
Now I find that what I was remembering is in Bergen and
Cornelia Evans's _A Dictionary of Contemporary American
Usage_, s.v. "subjunctive", on page 485, right-hand column,
starting at line 5.
But they don't say it's a flat-out error. They say
The subjunctive _were_ should not be used in
speaking about a past event, as it is in _if he
were here yesterday_. If we do not know what
actually happened, the indicative _was_ is
required. If we know that he was not here, the
past perfect form, _if he had been here
yesterday_, is preferred.
Bill Bonde ('by a commodius vicus of recirculation')
While we are at it, we should go all the way, in for a penny and all,
and claim that there is no subjunctiveness in 'were' either since it is
used in the indicative.
--
"Throw me that lipstick, darling, I wanna redo my stigmata."
+-Jennifer Saunders, "Absolutely Fabulous"
Raymond S. Wise
That's not going all the way. Going all the way would be to consider
"were" in such uses to be a plural, as Ben Jonson appears to have done.
See
http://www.ceafinney.com/subjunctive/excerpts.html
Bob Cunningham
commodius vicus of recirculation')"
[...]
> While we are at it, we should go all the way, in for a penny and all,
> and claim that there is no subjunctiveness in 'were' either since it is
> used in the indicative.
Why not say there's no "were" indicative because "were" is a
subjunctive form?