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False Memory
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Mike_Duffy
Aug 29, 2019, 7:52:02 PM8/29/19
to
I recently subscribed to 'Crave' TV. Crave has rights to several old TV
series, and recently I started viewing the 1980's series 'Cheers'. I was
very much looking forward to seeing favourite scenes that I remembered from
the original airing. One scene I was looking forward to when a particular
episode started (Season 10, Episode 9 "Head Over Hill") is around the 18:15
mark. What I remembered the character Sam Malone saying was:
"Well, the way I see it, uh, you let down the whole team. It's like, you
know, the bottom of the ninth, one out, runner on first, you're up at bat,
The coach tells you to bunt. The team expects you to bunt. The runner on
first expects you to bunt. The fans expect you to bunt. Even the blind guy
selling peanuts in the bleachers expects you to bunt. But instead of
bunting, YOU SLEEP WITH JOHN ALLAN HILL!!".
However, what he says is missing the entire sentence about the blind peanut
seller. I can understand my memory making errors or completely missing a
line from a TV show I watched over 30 years ago, but that part was the most
humourous part, essentially the main reason why it had ended up on my list
of permanently-remembered favourites. Close inspection of the segment show
that both the preceeding & following sentence are part of the same 'take'.
Forgetting is one thing, but confabulation is another. Should I commit
myself now, or wait until I make the same sort of mistakes in real life?
--
http://mduffy.x10host.com/index.htm
series, and recently I started viewing the 1980's series 'Cheers'. I was
very much looking forward to seeing favourite scenes that I remembered from
the original airing. One scene I was looking forward to when a particular
episode started (Season 10, Episode 9 "Head Over Hill") is around the 18:15
mark. What I remembered the character Sam Malone saying was:
"Well, the way I see it, uh, you let down the whole team. It's like, you
know, the bottom of the ninth, one out, runner on first, you're up at bat,
The coach tells you to bunt. The team expects you to bunt. The runner on
first expects you to bunt. The fans expect you to bunt. Even the blind guy
selling peanuts in the bleachers expects you to bunt. But instead of
bunting, YOU SLEEP WITH JOHN ALLAN HILL!!".
However, what he says is missing the entire sentence about the blind peanut
seller. I can understand my memory making errors or completely missing a
line from a TV show I watched over 30 years ago, but that part was the most
humourous part, essentially the main reason why it had ended up on my list
of permanently-remembered favourites. Close inspection of the segment show
that both the preceeding & following sentence are part of the same 'take'.
Forgetting is one thing, but confabulation is another. Should I commit
myself now, or wait until I make the same sort of mistakes in real life?
--
http://mduffy.x10host.com/index.htm
John
Aug 29, 2019, 9:30:32 PM8/29/19
to
On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 23:51:55 +0000, Mike_Duffy <Lo...@Website.in.sig>
wrote:
You should always, *always*, get tested as soon as you suspect your
sanity. Or as soon as anyone else suspects it. This advice should, of
course be followed by all politicians, too.
It may be that by going to be tested you are finding the door and
that this gains you a breakthrough so you wake up to the Real World in
which you are institutionalised and safe instead of being "here" and
creating all the modern nightmares you imagine yourself suffering,
such as your local, regional, State and National leaders.
That would make us all vanish which might be no bad thing.
J.
wrote:
sanity. Or as soon as anyone else suspects it. This advice should, of
course be followed by all politicians, too.
It may be that by going to be tested you are finding the door and
that this gains you a breakthrough so you wake up to the Real World in
which you are institutionalised and safe instead of being "here" and
creating all the modern nightmares you imagine yourself suffering,
such as your local, regional, State and National leaders.
That would make us all vanish which might be no bad thing.
J.
MajorOz
Aug 30, 2019, 12:41:14 AM8/30/19
to
JimP
Aug 30, 2019, 10:29:22 AM8/30/19
to
On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 23:51:55 +0000, Mike_Duffy <Lo...@Website.in.sig>
wrote:
wrote:
Me, I remember all of us building a starship, getting to Alpha
Centauri A-B system, finding it full of condos, and coming back here.
Oh, well, I guess I did remember that after all. Never mind.
--
Jim
Barry Gold
Aug 30, 2019, 3:40:13 PM8/30/19
to
Sometimes they will cut a sentence out of a show when they re-"air" it.
In this day of computer editing, it's easy to remove a sentence or so
even in what looks like a continuous take. I keep seeing this in the
closed captions: there will sometimes be a few words, sometimes an
entire sentence, that shows up in the captions but is not heard through
the speakers. Looks to me like it was in the shooting script but was
removed during the final edit, and the captions were done (in advance?)
from the script.
I'm not familiar with Crave TV. Do they run ads in their shows. If so, a
shows from the 1990s might be cut because there are more commercials now
than there were in the 90s (18 min. vs. 16 min.)
Of if it's commercial-free, are they showing it in a 42-minute time
frame (suitable for a more recent show)? Again, that would require
cutting it to fit the time.
I do so have a memory. It's backed up on DVD... somewhere...
In this day of computer editing, it's easy to remove a sentence or so
even in what looks like a continuous take. I keep seeing this in the
closed captions: there will sometimes be a few words, sometimes an
entire sentence, that shows up in the captions but is not heard through
the speakers. Looks to me like it was in the shooting script but was
removed during the final edit, and the captions were done (in advance?)
from the script.
I'm not familiar with Crave TV. Do they run ads in their shows. If so, a
shows from the 1990s might be cut because there are more commercials now
than there were in the 90s (18 min. vs. 16 min.)
Of if it's commercial-free, are they showing it in a 42-minute time
frame (suitable for a more recent show)? Again, that would require
cutting it to fit the time.
Mike_Duffy
Aug 30, 2019, 5:18:48 PM8/30/19
to
On Fri, 30 Aug 2019 12:40:10 -0700, Barry Gold wrote:
> Sometimes they will cut a sentence out of a show when they re-"air" it.
> In this day of computer editing, it's easy to remove a sentence or so
> even in what looks like a continuous take.
And as MajorOz mentions, someone might have decided any joke about blind
> Sometimes they will cut a sentence out of a show when they re-"air" it.
> In this day of computer editing, it's easy to remove a sentence or so
> even in what looks like a continuous take.
people might not be PC nowadays, despite that I cannot really see how blind
people could take offence at what I remembered.
> I'm not familiar with Crave TV. Do they run ads in their shows.
> shows from the 1990s might be cut because there are more commercials now
> than there were in the 90s (18 min. vs. 16 min.)
>
> Of if it's commercial-free, are they showing it in a 42-minute
seems to me that with no alteration, episode running times should be much
more consistent. The longest is almost a minute longer than the shortest.
I was sort of hoping someone here might remember it the way I do.
--
http://mduffy.x10host.com/index.htm
Barry Gold
Aug 30, 2019, 8:55:57 PM8/30/19
to
On 8/30/2019 2:18 PM, Mike_Duffy wrote:
> They run 23 to 24 minutes. (Originally it was in a 30 minute slot.) It
> seems to me that with no alteration, episode running times should be much
> more consistent. The longest is almost a minute longer than the shortest.
>
> I was sort of hoping someone here might remember it the way I do.
The running time variation does seem to indicate that somebody has been
> They run 23 to 24 minutes. (Originally it was in a 30 minute slot.) It
> seems to me that with no alteration, episode running times should be much
> more consistent. The longest is almost a minute longer than the shortest.
>
> I was sort of hoping someone here might remember it the way I do.
editing it for some reason. Maybe for Political COrrectness as you
speculate.
Unfortunately, I never watched the original so I can't help you with the
memory question.
JimP
Aug 31, 2019, 12:49:05 PM8/31/19
to
On Fri, 30 Aug 2019 17:55:55 -0700, Barry Gold <Barry...@ca.rr.com>
wrote:
people who could hear to stop calling them Hearing Impaired. They
didn't like it and they didn't have permission to call them that.
Sadly, didn't work.
--
Jim
wrote:
>On 8/30/2019 2:18 PM, Mike_Duffy wrote:
>> They run 23 to 24 minutes. (Originally it was in a 30 minute slot.) It
>> seems to me that with no alteration, episode running times should be much
>> more consistent. The longest is almost a minute longer than the shortest.
>>
>> I was sort of hoping someone here might remember it the way I do.
>
>The running time variation does seem to indicate that somebody has been
>editing it for some reason. Maybe for Political COrrectness as you
>speculate.
>
>Unfortunately, I never watched the original so I can't help you with the
>memory question.
Interestingly. I distinctly remember the Deaf Community informing the
>> They run 23 to 24 minutes. (Originally it was in a 30 minute slot.) It
>> seems to me that with no alteration, episode running times should be much
>> more consistent. The longest is almost a minute longer than the shortest.
>>
>> I was sort of hoping someone here might remember it the way I do.
>
>The running time variation does seem to indicate that somebody has been
>editing it for some reason. Maybe for Political COrrectness as you
>speculate.
>
>Unfortunately, I never watched the original so I can't help you with the
>memory question.
people who could hear to stop calling them Hearing Impaired. They
didn't like it and they didn't have permission to call them that.
Sadly, didn't work.
--
Jim
Dione Marshall
Sep 3, 2019, 9:17:41 PM9/3/19
to
I believed for years that the last line of "The Man with the X-Ray Eyes", after the screen went black, was "oh, my god, I can still see!" No one else remembers it as I do, and I've watched it more recently and there's no such line. Alternate universe skipping or self editing memories? Who can say?
JimP
Sep 4, 2019, 10:56:21 AM9/4/19
to
On Tue, 3 Sep 2019 18:17:39 -0700 (PDT), Dione Marshall
<babh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>I believed for years that the last line of "The Man with the X-Ray Eyes", after the screen went black, was "oh, my god, I can still see!" No one else remembers it as I do, and I've watched it more recently and there's no such line. Alternate universe skipping or self editing memories? Who can say?
Ray Milland I believe. We watched it. Scared me.
<babh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>I believed for years that the last line of "The Man with the X-Ray Eyes", after the screen went black, was "oh, my god, I can still see!" No one else remembers it as I do, and I've watched it more recently and there's no such line. Alternate universe skipping or self editing memories? Who can say?
I think he did say that. Right after his character plucked his eyes
out.
--
Jim
Basil D
Sep 5, 2019, 7:30:22 PM9/5/19
to
"Stephen King, in his horror film book Danse Macabre, claims there were rumors that
the ending originally went further, with Milland crying out "I can still see" after
gouging out his eyes. Corman has denied the existence of that ending but expressed
enjoyment with the idea, saying 'Now it’s interesting. Stephen King saw the picture
and wrote a different ending, and I thought, "His ending is better than mine"'."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X:_The_Man_with_the_X-ray_Eyes
A wordier version, with more details {including about the movie overall):
https://filmmakermagazine.com/83301-hidden-horror-roger-cormans-x-the-man-with-the-x-ray-eyes/
Note especially the last paragraph (of the article per se).
JimP
Sep 6, 2019, 2:37:49 PM9/6/19
to
--
Jim
Dione Marshall
Sep 7, 2019, 2:03:31 PM9/7/19
to
I didn't read that either. The two of us, and Mr. King, must have migrated from a near analogue alternate universe.
Basil D
Sep 11, 2019, 10:12:17 PM9/11/19
to
widely.
~~Basil
Mike Spencer
Dec 29, 2019, 2:28:29 AM12/29/19
to
Barry Gold <Barry...@ca.rr.com> writes:
> Sometimes they will cut a sentence out of a show when they re-"air" it.
> In this day of computer editing, it's easy to remove a sentence or so
> even in what looks like a continuous take. I keep seeing this in the
> closed captions: there will sometimes be a few words, sometimes an
> entire sentence, that shows up in the captions but is not heard through
> the speakers. Looks to me like it was in the shooting script but was
> removed during the final edit, and the captions were done (in advance?)
> from the script.
with subtitles. Occasionally A DVD turns up without subtitles and
usually I can find the subtitle text file on the net. But it's not
unusual to find that the subs start out of sync (they cropped some
lead-in material from the film), drift gradually out of sync (they
dropped frames in a consistent pattern to shrink the data?) or
suddenly go seconds or minutes out of sync, obviously because they cut
all or part of a scene.
Given that, I easily assume that when a particular version of a movie
lacks a line or scene I remember, it's probably on the cutting room
floor. I saw The Name of the Rose in the theater when it was
released. There was a scene in which William of Baskerville consults
the abbey blacksmith about his damaged glasses. It's missing from the
DVD I have as well as the opening scene of Adso as an old man and the
explanation by William of how he knows the Abbot's horse is named
Brunellus. Similar for the DVD of Good Fellas. (In these cases, for
commercial DVDs, the on-board subtitles sync correctly, or course.)
The worst case I know of is Kurosawa's The Idiot, where the studio cut
100 minutes from the original 265 minute version of the film that was
faithful to the novel. The original footage has been lost.
Yes, it pisses me off. Getting old is problematic enough without a
digital media implementation of the memory hole.
--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada
JimP
Dec 29, 2019, 11:59:23 AM12/29/19
to
On 29 Dec 2019 03:27:55 -0400, Mike Spencer
When I was stationed in San Deigo I saw the spoof on James Bond, the
original Casino Royale.
In the scenes where David Niven is introduced as the One, The Only,
The Original James Bond, his butler is seen right after that. The
audience laughed.
That short bit where the Really Old Butler is taking a drink carafe
and drink glasses into James Bond and his guests was removed in later
showings. The tray, etc. are shaking as he walks into the room. I
haven't seen it on TCM when the movie is shown there.
--
Jim
original Casino Royale.
In the scenes where David Niven is introduced as the One, The Only,
The Original James Bond, his butler is seen right after that. The
audience laughed.
That short bit where the Really Old Butler is taking a drink carafe
and drink glasses into James Bond and his guests was removed in later
showings. The tray, etc. are shaking as he walks into the room. I
haven't seen it on TCM when the movie is shown there.
--
Jim
rincewind
Jan 3, 2020, 12:39:15 AM1/3/20
to
JimP
Jan 3, 2020, 10:42:43 AM1/3/20
to
movies with David Niven as the Original James Bond.
There is a scene were M and some others are travelling to get him out
of retirement. One of the people in the limo goes on and on about how
he is The One, The Only, Original James Bond.
The movie then cuts to the old decrepit butler, bringing drinks into
the room on a silver tray. The audience laughs. Then we see David
Niven and the rest.
In later showings, the butler bringing the drinks in was deleted. This
tok place in San Deigo, CA. Apparently it was beng used as a test
showing, and additional cuts were made after this movie run.
So my claim is Milland shouting he can still see was in the movie, but
it was later cut out.
--
Jim
rincewind
Jan 3, 2020, 12:00:40 PM1/3/20
to
(Quote)
Not impossible. My wife and I saw "The Shining," on opening night. (As King fans more than Kubrick fans, we were disappointed.) In describing the end of the movie, I mentioned the hospital scene, and people insisted I had made it up! Apparently, Kubrick disliked the sequence, and ordered it cut that night!
So my claim is Milland shouting he can still see was in the movie, but
it was later cut out.
(End)
it was later cut out.
Not impossible. My wife and I saw "The Shining," on opening night. (As King fans more than Kubrick fans, we were disappointed.) In describing the end of the movie, I mentioned the hospital scene, and people insisted I had made it up! Apparently, Kubrick disliked the sequence, and ordered it cut that night!
danny burstein
Jan 3, 2020, 12:09:20 PM1/3/20
to
>So my claim is Milland shouting he can still see was in the movie, but=20
>it was later cut out.=20
>(End)
>Not impossible. My wife and I saw "The Shining," on opening night. (As King=
> fans more than Kubrick fans, we were disappointed.) In describing the end =
>of the movie, I mentioned the hospital scene, and people insisted I had mad=
>e it up! Apparently, Kubrick disliked the sequence, and ordered it cut that=
> night!
I saw the movie musical "1776" when it opened at Radio City
Music Hall in 1972. Yes, children, movies used to have big
and splashy premiers.
It contained the song "Cool, Considerate, Men", aka "To the Right,
alwayts to the Right, never to the Left, forever to the Right".
However... when the film went into general distribution
that scene was clipped out.
(There were claims that this was due to pressure from the Nixon
White House. Yeah. Maybe).
When VHS pre-recorded tapes became a thing the scene
was still missing.
Ditto for the first LaserDisc. (Yes, I had them....)
A deluxe LaserDisc came out a year or two later,
and... it included a pisspoor quality version
of that clip.
The narrator explained that they were lucky enough to
find it on (their version of...) someone's basement
storage and garbage locker...
Later on better quality originals were located (or maybe
there was high quality restoration?).
Anyway, when I told my friends, who saw the film in
general release or VHS, etc., about the scene, they
all said I was making it up...
--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
dan...@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
>it was later cut out.=20
>(End)
>Not impossible. My wife and I saw "The Shining," on opening night. (As King=
> fans more than Kubrick fans, we were disappointed.) In describing the end =
>of the movie, I mentioned the hospital scene, and people insisted I had mad=
>e it up! Apparently, Kubrick disliked the sequence, and ordered it cut that=
> night!
I saw the movie musical "1776" when it opened at Radio City
Music Hall in 1972. Yes, children, movies used to have big
and splashy premiers.
It contained the song "Cool, Considerate, Men", aka "To the Right,
alwayts to the Right, never to the Left, forever to the Right".
However... when the film went into general distribution
that scene was clipped out.
(There were claims that this was due to pressure from the Nixon
White House. Yeah. Maybe).
When VHS pre-recorded tapes became a thing the scene
was still missing.
Ditto for the first LaserDisc. (Yes, I had them....)
A deluxe LaserDisc came out a year or two later,
and... it included a pisspoor quality version
of that clip.
The narrator explained that they were lucky enough to
find it on (their version of...) someone's basement
storage and garbage locker...
Later on better quality originals were located (or maybe
there was high quality restoration?).
Anyway, when I told my friends, who saw the film in
general release or VHS, etc., about the scene, they
all said I was making it up...
--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
dan...@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
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