Time Warner question - HBO w/o cable box?
darin Ginther
standard" service and would like to add HBO. No cable box currently,
although I do subscribe to Road Runner, not that such is related.
I called TW to inquire about adding HBO they told me the following:
1) I can add HBO at the rate of +$10.95.
2) I have to add cable boxes at a rate of +$7.95 each TV in my home
that I want to subscribe to HBO on.
Q: Can I get HBO w/o the cable box, as I'm aware of some people in my
area that are getting it w/o a box?
A: The FCC requires cable boxes for HBO for parential control reasons
and that anyone getting HBO w/o a box might was grandfathered into
their system before the applicable FCC ruling. We cannot offer you
HBO without renting you a box.
Q: Can I buy my own box so that I don't have to "rent" it?
A: No, you cannot purchase a box.
Can anyone tell me if I'm getting straight answers here?
It seems very odd to me that the FCC would require cable boxes for
subscription cable services. Also, I thought the FCC had ruled that
you could now own cable boxes rather than be forced to rent them?
The above bumps my cable (TV) bill up to ~$64 with HBO and 1 cable
box.
I require the cable modem access, but if there is a better deal on
direct-TV, let me know.
-D
Tramr300
Yes you can purchase your own box through various palces (Ebay is a good start)
Just find out what make & model your company is using. I assume it is an analog
signal coming into your home.
The cable company makes billions of $$ a year renting out boxes.
It is not illegal to own a box...
""Don't shake my tree, if you don't like what comes down""
:-) **** Life Is Too Short...*** (-:
****Enjoy The Ride...***
Gary Tait
wrote:
>>Q: Can I buy my own box so that I don't have to "rent" it?
>
>Yes you can purchase your own box through various palces (Ebay is a good start)
For pirate boxes though.
>Just find out what make & model your company is using. I assume it is an analog
>signal coming into your home.
>The cable company makes billions of $$ a year renting out boxes.
>It is not illegal to own a box...
>
Except if it's purpose is to defet cable security.
The cable company has the right to know if you have a "descrambler
box", and intend to use it on their syste, mand they have every right
to deny you use of such a box.
Gary Tait
<swe...@cluemail.com.invalid.gov> wrote:
>On 1 Mar 2004 09:13:25 -0800, d_gi...@hotmail.com (darin
>Ginther) wrote:
>
>>I'm a cable TV subscriber in the Austin, TX area. I have "new
>>standard" service and would like to add HBO. No cable box currently,
>>although I do subscribe to Road Runner, not that such is related.
>>
>>I called TW to inquire about adding HBO they told me the following:
>>
>>1) I can add HBO at the rate of +$10.95.
>>2) I have to add cable boxes at a rate of +$7.95 each TV in my home
>>that I want to subscribe to HBO on.
>>
>>Q: Can I get HBO w/o the cable box, as I'm aware of some people in my
>>area that are getting it w/o a box?
>
>Yes - you can get it without the box (I do). Everybody who has
>analog cable, actually has a filter on their line to prevent them
>from getting HBO if they're not paying for it. Remove the filter,
>and you have HBO.
But don't do it yourself, get them to do it, unless you want to steal
the service.
>
>They used to have Skinimax too, but got rid of it 16-18 months
>ago.
>
>There's a law on the books that says the cable company cannot
>force you to upgrade to a higher their of service to get premium
>movie channels, but they can require that you add equipment (at an
>additional charge).
>
>I believe the legal term is "tier-through pricing".
>
>>A: The FCC requires cable boxes for HBO for parential control reasons
>>and that anyone getting HBO w/o a box might was grandfathered into
>>their system before the applicable FCC ruling. We cannot offer you
>>HBO without renting you a box.
>
>I've never heard of that.
>
>>Q: Can I buy my own box so that I don't have to "rent" it?
>>A: No, you cannot purchase a box.
>
>That's correct. The digital boxes have not been cracked yet, but
>"they" are working on it. This means that TW still has the
>monopoly on the boxes.
You are confusing owning boxes with theft boxes. genuine legitimate
customer owned boxes are around the corner, if not here already (in
some markets anyway)
>>Can anyone tell me if I'm getting straight answers here?
>
>The parental control law sounds bogus. You are correct in assuming
>the cable company is lying to you. TW has always practiced evil
>sales tactics. They want digital cable boxes in every home, and
>will do anything to put them there - including lying.
>
>I can't see how they could "grandfather" people into a cable law
>requiring parental controls. Tell them your TV has the V-Chip -
>problem solved. I think they're lying their asses off to try and
>give you the box.
>
>-sw
Gary Tait
wrote:
>It seems very odd to me that the FCC would require cable boxes for
>subscription cable services. Also, I thought the FCC had ruled that
>you could now own cable boxes rather than be forced to rent them?
>
You can, if they don't have embedded security (as current digital
boxes mostly do). If they do have embedded security, it is within your
provider's rights to deny their use on their system.
Gary A. Edelstein
wrote:
>I'm a cable TV subscriber in the Austin, TX area. I have "new
>standard" service and would like to add HBO. No cable box currently,
>although I do subscribe to Road Runner, not that such is related.
>
>I called TW to inquire about adding HBO they told me the following:
>
>1) I can add HBO at the rate of +$10.95.
>2) I have to add cable boxes at a rate of +$7.95 each TV in my home
>that I want to subscribe to HBO on.
>
>Q: Can I get HBO w/o the cable box, as I'm aware of some people in my
>area that are getting it w/o a box?
>
>A: The FCC requires cable boxes for HBO for parential control reasons
>and that anyone getting HBO w/o a box might was grandfathered into
>their system before the applicable FCC ruling. We cannot offer you
>HBO without renting you a box.
>
I'm surprised they grand fathered these subscribers in. The old
technology for this requires them to devote an analog station to HBO
and either:
- 'Scramble' it and they provide an in-line positive trap to
'descramble' it; or
- Have a negative trap on all the lines that can be removed to get the
channel.
I had understood that most major cable systems had eliminated these
old methods. If TWC in your area hasn't yet, then I bet they have
plans to do so.
I believe they have the right to provide HBO via any method they
choose. Even though it may be (probably temporarily) technically
possible for them to provide it to you like the grand fathered
subscribers, they don't have to.
>It seems very odd to me that the FCC would require cable boxes for
>subscription cable services.
>
AFAIK, they don't. See this page:
http://www.fcc.gov/parents/channelblocking.html
I think they require new sets and cable boxes to have V-Chip
technology. If a cable system wants to continue to provide HBO with
the old trapping methods I mentioned above, I think that meets the
intent of the regs where the systems have to have a way to block
certain content on request. A trap or scrambling will do that.
>Also, I thought the FCC had ruled that
>you could now own cable boxes rather than be forced to rent them?
>
You can for unscrambled analog channels, but apparently the cable co.
doesn't have to let you have the option to buy one for scrambled
premium channels and probably 'cable digital' channels.
Perhaps someone with better knowledge of the regs will clarify further
if I'm mistaken.
Gary E
|Gary A. Edelstein
|edel...@SPAMyahoo.com.invalid (remove NO SPAM and .invalid to reply)
|"We have met the enemy and he is us." - Walt Kelly's Pogo
J. Steven Swinnea
darin Ginther <d_gi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>I'm a cable TV subscriber in the Austin, TX area. I have "new
>standard" service and would like to add HBO. No cable box currently,
>although I do subscribe to Road Runner, not that such is related.
Just to be sure try Channel 98 that's where TW carries the analog HBO
signal. Several months ago the filter on that channel disappeared on
our line (maybe they pulled all of them in our neighborhood when HBO
supposedly moved to the digital service?) and we've been able to get
the unscrambled signal since.
S.S.
=Ö§âmâ ßíñ Câmpbell
Preach on the alt.hypocrite usenet.
"Gary Tait" <class...@yahoo.cominvalid> wrote in message
news:dp2740ppc1e0lnlql...@4ax.com...
Dave Everett
news:76c21be9.04030...@posting.google.com...
I wouldnt believe a word TW says. I dumped them for Dish Network 2 years
ago. pay $52 per month for 3 receivers and can add HBO if I want, anytime.
D. E. Smith
"J. Steven Swinnea" <swi...@che.utexas.edu> wrote in message
news:c207ar$773$1...@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu...
Darin Ginther
"Dave Everett" <Da...@divemasters.org> wrote in message
news:JNP0c.3395$F71....@newssvr22.news.prodigy.com...
> I wouldnt believe a word TW says. I dumped them for Dish Network 2 years
> ago. pay $52 per month for 3 receivers and can add HBO if I want, anytime.
You're partly correct. I shouldn't have believed a work that the
representative from TW said. He was correct about the answers to my
questions, but not correct regarding the WHY.
You can use aftermarket analog (I dont know about digital) cable boxes with
TW. FCC regulates that you can do so. However TW does not have to
provision them if they don't want to, which would apply to the digital side
of things. Analog aftermarket boxes can and are currently being used. The
TW spin on this is that TW may "upgrade" the hardware at any time and then
you've got a worthless box on your hands. Course, if they do that, they've
got to spend the cash to replace the ones that are used as rentals, so I
don't see that as very likely.
TW does offer HBO as an analog signal. It's currently non-provisioned to
new subscribers by an Arcom negative trap. They provide it to old-school
subscribers that have been customers for years (grandfathered). The will
not provide it (IE - provision it) for new subscribers. Want HBO, you've
got to get digital cable. GRRR... This bumps the price up to over $18/mo
for the HBO addition..
Understand that this wouldn't normally bother me, but I'm paying ~$100 for
non-premium channels and a cable modem. You'd think they would be willing
to keep my life simple by not requiring that I rent a digital box for every
TV in my home...
My alternative is to drop the TV side of my service and go with dish
network. I require the cable modem for work..
Mike Reed, LP
> On Tue, 02 Mar 2004 00:45:03 GMT, "Darin Ginther"
> <d_gi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> When they disconnected my digital service, they did that from the
> head-end office. Once I disconnected the digital box, and plugged
> in the analog, I still had cable (+HBO which I never had to begin
> with) for another 2 months until they came and physically
> disconnected the cable.
Which, technically, is a crime. See next:
§ 31.12. Theft of or Tampering With Multichannel Video or Information
Services
(a) A person commits an offense if, without the authorization of the
multichannel video or information services provider, the person
intentionally or knowingly:
(1) makes or maintains a connection, whether physically, electrically,
electronically, or inductively, to:
(A) a cable, wire, or other component of or media attached to a multichannel
video or information services system; or
(B) a television set, videotape recorder, or other receiver attached to a
multichannel video or information system;
(2) attaches, causes to be attached, or maintains the attachment of a device
to:
(A) a cable, wire, or other component of or media attached to a multichannel
video or information services system; or
(B) a television set, videotape recorder, or other receiver attached to a
multichannel video or information services system;
(3) tampers with, modifies, or maintains a modification to a device
installed by a multichannel video or information services provider; or
(4) tampers with, modifies, or maintains a modification to an access device
or uses that access device or any unauthorized access device to obtain
services from a multichannel video or information services provider.
<snip, doesn't apply here>
(d) An offense under this section is a Class C misdemeanor unless it is
shown on the trial of the offense that the actor: <snip, doesn't apply here>
(e) For the purposes of this section, each connection, attachment,
modification, or act of tampering is a separate offense.
Added by Acts 1995, 74th Leg., ch. 318, § 10, eff. Sept. 1, 1995. Amended by
Acts 1999, 76th Leg., ch. 858, § 1, eff. Sept. 1, 1999.
Darin Ginther
"Mike Reed, LP" <NOmre...@yahoo.comSPAM> wrote in message
news:xsS0c.18098$qo....@fe1.texas.rr.com...
>
> > On Tue, 02 Mar 2004 00:45:03 GMT, "Darin Ginther"
> > <d_gi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > When they disconnected my digital service, they did that from the
> > head-end office. Once I disconnected the digital box, and plugged
> > in the analog, I still had cable (+HBO which I never had to begin
> > with) for another 2 months until they came and physically
> > disconnected the cable.
>
> Which, technically, is a crime. See next:
Grrr.
Did you read the thread or start in the middle? I'm paying ~$100 for a
cable modem and non-premium cable.
TW wants $18 (minimum) for HBO and one digital receiver. They do carry HBO
on an analog line, but refuse to provision it for me (it would be cheaper) -
I'm guessing that they want to do away with analog HBO eventually, but don't
want to take the revenue hit by removing the old analog subscribers now
paying for it. IMHO, TW found a loop hole in regulations that try to
prevent people from being pushed into upgraded services (digital cable).
IT's not the service I'm paying additional $$ for, it's the *equipment*.
'Wertz fessed up, so make sure you're accusing the right person... Some
people get pissed at hacked up posts that make them look like they've
committed a crime.
Besides, if the cable company or the contractor doesn't come out to
de-provision the connection promptly, I've never heard of anyone being
prosecuted under those circumstances. It has been suggested that
ocassionally the cable companies leave cabled plugged in for the new
resident as a "teaser". - That's why disconnect isn't a huge priority.
Thank you for your posts, Steve, I found them very helpful.
-D
Gary Tait
<swe...@cluemail.com.invalid.gov> wrote:
>On Mon, 01 Mar 2004 14:14:53 -0500, Gary Tait
><class...@yahoo.cominvalid> wrote:
>
>>But don't do it yourself, get them to do it, unless you want to steal
>>the service.
>
>Now why would I want to steal from a scum-sucking organization
>such as Time Warner Austin?
>
Why would you want to advocate theft?
>>You are confusing owning boxes with theft boxes. genuine legitimate
>>customer owned boxes are around the corner, if not here already (in
>>some markets anyway)
>
>I suspect that Time Warner will never allow you to use customer
>owned boxes when they can legally force you to rent them and make
>much more money.
>While charging $8/mo for box rental, they can
>pay off their investment in 8 months, and continue to reap the
>$8/mo extra after that as pure profit.
>
>-sw
T
Hü©k Hö§hïmötö !
"Gary Tait" <class...@yahoo.cominvalid> wrote in message
> Why would you want to advocate theft?
>
BECAUSE IT SEEMS TO SEND YOU INTO SEIZURES!
Steal those money-grabbing assholes BLIND!
God Bless Texas
> Take your PC shit someplace else.
Damned Mac snobs . . .
New Question
"Gary Tait" <class...@yahoo.cominvalid> wrote in message
> You are confusing owning boxes with theft boxes. genuine legitimate
> customer owned boxes are around the corner, if not here already (in
> some markets anyway)
How long is "around the corner"? When can we expect customer owned boxes to
be universal in every market?
Gary Tait
I'd give within the next 3 years, if nobody balks. Right now, I think
at least Motorola has a cablecard (it will be the providers duty to
get them though), and there are some digital sets ready to accept the
card, and it has been made known Tivo is woking on an STB that uses
cablecard.
G. Bloser
I also live in the Austin area and have Standard Cable with TW (no
box) and Earthlink Broadband (billed through TW).
A few weeks ago we moved within our neighborhood into a new house and
had all our services transfered. Last week I was zapping through all
the channels and noticed that there was something on channel 98 that
wasn't there before. It was HBO!
Well, I guess the cable guy made a mistake and enabled HBO for us. And
no, I did not give a him an "extra tip".
But can I get in trouble for it? Can TW find out?
I mean I always can say I didn't order it and wasn't aware that was
available for us.
Does anyone have experience with this?
-G
Gary A. Edelstein <edel...@SPAMyahoo.com.invalid> wrote in message news:<k9v640pfje2unhomr...@4ax.com>...
Gary Tait
<swe...@cluemail.com.invalid.gov> wrote:
>On 6 Mar 2004 22:30:42 -0800, gstew...@yahoo.com (G. Bloser)
>wrote:
>
>>I also live in the Austin area and have Standard Cable with TW (no
>>box) and Earthlink Broadband (billed through TW).
>>A few weeks ago we moved within our neighborhood into a new house and
>>had all our services transfered. Last week I was zapping through all
>>the channels and noticed that there was something on channel 98 that
>>wasn't there before. It was HBO!
>>Well, I guess the cable guy made a mistake and enabled HBO for us. And
>>no, I did not give a him an "extra tip".
>>But can I get in trouble for it? Can TW find out?
>>I mean I always can say I didn't order it and wasn't aware that was
>>available for us.
>>Does anyone have experience with this?
>
>Don't worry about it. TW Austin does audit most neighborhoods a
>couple times a year, and you'll probably get a block on it
>sometime int he not too near future. They never confront you
>about it though - they just correct the problem and tag your line
>in case they see it happen a couple times or more (in which case
>they still don't confront you).
>
>-sw
They will confront you if you keep remiving the trap.
Doug McLaren
G. Bloser <gstew...@yahoo.com> wrote:
| Well, I guess the cable guy made a mistake and enabled HBO for us. And
| no, I did not give a him an "extra tip".
| But can I get in trouble for it? Can TW find out?
| I mean I always can say I didn't order it and wasn't aware that was
| available for us.
Not anymore. You just told the whole world that it's available for
you, with google archiving it forever :)
| Does anyone have experience with this?
Since you didn't do it, I doubt anything bad will come of it. They
may eventually fix it, but I certainly don't see them parking the
tempest van out in front of your house to catch you watching HBO that
you didn't pay for.
Of course, cable companies have done crazy things before, so ...
--
Doug McLaren, dou...@frenzy.com Gotta run, my government's collapsing.
Hü©k Hö§hïmötö !
"Gary Tait" <class...@yahoo.cominvalid> wrote in message
> They will confront you if you keep remiving the trap.
>
BUT..........Gary Tait WILL slither up into your home via the toilet bowl
and sniff your underwear (whether it's actually ON you or not!)
Although, there IS one way to stop him:
Leave one or two of your cable bills out in plain site, whereupon he will
stare at then, whack off until he passes out, then you can kick his narrow
ass in the morning! (But be careful.....he might like it!)
G. Bloser
Well, maybe that explains why there is a van in front of my house since last week :)
nosp...@notaol.com.invalid
<swe...@cluemail.com.invalid.gov> wrote:
>On Sun, 07 Mar 2004 09:58:56 -0500, Gary Tait
><class...@yahoo.cominvalid> wrote:
>
>>They will confront you if you keep remiving the trap.
>
>No, they won't.
>
Yes they will, Steve. I know because I work for Time Warner in the
same Texas division as Austin and have had ample occasion to be one of
the "confronters."
I've viewed your comments in this thread with a bit more than passing
interest. Wish I'd had the time over the past week to correct some of
your more misinformed remarks. As one who obviously has spent no time
whatsoever inside the confines of a cable company, it's clear your
remarks (i.e. your opinions) are based on your own limited frame of
reference. In short, you just don't always know what your're talking
about but presume to act as if you do.
Virtually all cable companies have been in some stage of rebuilding
over the past two years. Some local systems have completed the rebuild
and are moving on, while others are still undergoing this lengthy
process. The rebuild is designed to provide many new services, among
them digital cable, Hi-Speed Data, Video-On-Demand, HDTV, PVRs and
probably (VoIP) telephone service.
The first step in the rebuild process is to expand the video channel
line-up with digital cable offerings. This offers cable subscribers
hundreds of channels where, prior to the rebuild, a local cable
company was limited to roughly 75-80 channels on the analog band.
While the new digital cable may offer multiple versions of the various
premium channels (my system offers 14 HBOs, 12 Cinemax, 8 Showtime,
etc.) it takes a considerable amount of time after digital cable has
been deployed to migrate current premium channel subscribers over to a
new system such as digital cable. For that reason, premium channels
originally on the analog line-up remain there for quite some time even
they are duplicated on the digital line-up.
Slowly, a cable company will start with one or two of the analog
premiums and remove it from the analog line-up. Ultimately, ALL
premium channels will be removed.
Some analog premiums required an analog converter in order to be seen
in a subscriber's home, while others were trapped as a means of
blocking those channels when a customer did NOT subscribe.
As the time nears when a channel like HBO is scheduled to be moved
from the analog line-up, cable companies will devote less emphasis to
auditing and tracking who might be getting it for free. Simply stated,
cable companies probably won't care very much whether or not a
customer has access to free HBO because they know its days are
numbered. And, if a customer does receive it for free, there's a good
chance that customer will upgrade to digital when HBO is finally
removed from the analog line-up.
As to the subject of personally owned converters...The simple fact is
cable companies would gladly abdicate control of those converters to
the customer wishing to own one because they are enormously expensive
to buy, maintain and keep. The amount one pays for converter rental
doesn't begin to cover what it actually costs (en masse) to purchase,
program, warehouse, maintain, repair, deliver and recover. This
element of cable TV is a capital-intensive, labor-intensive MASSIVE
cost all cable companies would prefer to do without. And, once ALL the
organizations who have an interest in such things can agree on the
standards that will ensure signal security, cable subscribers will
have the ability to own a converter and cable companies will be able
to releive themselves of this costly headache.
f
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<nosp...@notaol.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:404c84a8.834671@news-server...
> cost all cable companies would prefer to do without. And, once ALL the
> organizations who have an interest in such things can agree on the
> standards that will ensure signal security, cable subscribers will
> have the ability to own a converter and cable companies will be able
> to releive themselves of this costly headache.
And how many years do you think it will take to make customer converter
ownership mainstream?
God Bless Texas
> Lets start with: Cable companies suck.
How about "Everyone named Steve is an idiot"?
Based in fact just as much as your statement.