Throttles

[Marty McOmber]

Hi all,

Been meaning to ask this for some time and since I had reason to take the top off my binnacle this weekend, it is top of mind.  The PO on our 1985 P40 had a new Yanmar installed before it was sold. The installer was, to say the least, not very good and we needed to have a few items addressed before we closed the sale.

One of the less important items is that the throttle was installed backwards -- by which I mean that you pull the lever toward you (aft) to increase engine RPM and push it forward to slow down. It is a minor annoyance and I've actually grown so used to it that I nearly screwed up getting out of the slip on a charter boat last year. Let's just say I didn't look very accomplished :)

The PO insisted that fixing the backward throttle would require "re-engineering" the set up. 

1. Just wanted to check that other P40s throttle work in a tradition way (especially those of you with Yanmars).

2. Seems like all I would have to do is move the throttle cable from the forward part of the binnacle interior to the after part and then turn the throttle lever around inside the binnacle.

Finally, am I just crazy?

Thanks,

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Marty McOmber 

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[Larry Rovin]

I can confirm that Whisper (1987 #134) has a Yanmar and the throttle works the “normal” way.  Maybe the PO himself requires re-engineering!

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[Michael Moradzadeh]

There may not be room for that, but it may be even simpler, as we did on Cayenne, to extend the throttle lever on the ENGINE, in the opposite direction from the current one, effectively reversing it.  A drill, some metal stock, and a coupla bolts will set you up.

Michael

[Ernie Reuter]

On Iemanja...hull 66 1984.....also has a backwards throttle. Not sure if this was a linkage issue that came with the original Nanni diesel that was on the boat. The PO had repowerd with a Yanmar and it was backwards then. When we repowerd with another yanmar 2 years ago, we to had a backwards setup which I tried but could not figure out how to remedy.

I've lived with it.....

Ernie

[CAZ]

Gentlemen,

I have a P40  wth the original Perkins 108. It has the throttle backwards, also. I have chosen to live with it versus add more complexity to the linkage.

thanks,

Capt. Bill Caz.

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[Marty McOmber]

I feel much better knowing that I'm not the only one out there living with this backward condition!

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[Kenyon Stewart]

Mine is backwards too for now...

I'd love to retrofit the Edson single lever controls to my pedestal.  They're a little $$$ though.

[ddockrat]

When I changed to an Edson pedestal my linkage turned backwards. Instead of feeding the cable down from the top, I routed it in a loop up from underneath. Back to normal

Jon ash p40 67

Sent from my iPhone

[Michael Dobbs]

Backward on mine. Need to be doubly careful with guest conductors at the pedestal. 

Sent from my iPhone

[Michael Dobbs]

Backward on mine. Need to be doubly careful with guest conductors at the pedestal. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Apr 25, 2016, at 5:13 PM, ddockrat <ddoc...@verizon.net> wrote:

[Kenyon Stewart]

The common fix is to add a bell crank at the engine that reverses the motion of the cable actuation.  The can be found and some automotive parts outlets.  The more difficult bit is fabricating the bracket to hold it.

[Rob Raymond]

Great idea! I'm going to try fitting a bell crank. That backwards throttle drives me  nuts.

[Bob Peahl]

Anthem with Yanmar has normal throttle set up.  This was a simple conversion while repowering.

Bob Peahl

Anthem P40/70

Sent from my iPhone

[Bill Schmidt]

Marty,
    Let's assume that you have a Yacht Specialties/Merriman Pedestal. A  different pedestal may be, well, different. Removing the compass and the compass base (frozen bolts?) will reveal the cable ends and the levers to which they are attached. The levers are attached to the throttle and shift cable shafts by a hex headed small bolt. Remove the cable from the lever. Unbolt the shift lever and rotate it 180 degrees (this may require pulling the shaft out a little bit so that you can have access to the bolt head on the lever to re-tighten). Now re tighten the shift lever bolt. Check that the lever, now moving the way you want it to move, has clearance. Reattach the cable and recheck it again. Replace the compass base and compass. Open a cold beer.
Billy Manana

[Marty McOmber]

Thanks all.  And, yes, Bill I do have the Merriman Pedestal. And what you described is exactly what I was thinking I could do.  As long as there is room for the lever to be turned 180 degrees and operate appropriately. (I think you meant throttle arm, not shift leaver, right?)

[Bill Schmidt]

correct. But, for old times sake, maybe you would want to screw up the shift lever operation!
Billy

[Marty McOmber]

I can change the shift lever and leave the throttle as is. Then I would just need to stand facing aft and everything would be normal! :)  My wife says I do things back-asswards anyways. 

[ChinaDoll]

It's quite easily fixed. At the helm, on the backsides of the OME lever (Telflex/Morse), pull the keeper off, slide off the arm with the throttle cable, rotate the arm 180 degrees on the horizon, slide the arm back onto the lever, and replace the keeper. Voilà your shifting is now corrected. Some issues might be not having an original styled lever: the tall ones with one black throttle knob and a taller red knobed shifter, possibly other brands can be similarly changed, and the other issue is the mounted controll is too close to an inside corner or some other item blocks having the arm on the opposite side on the lever. Another issue is once the arm is on the correct side, your cable run for the shifting cable will may need to be rerouted to have a clean unbent entry to the shifting arm: do not attempt to bend the cable in any excessive way as this will cause binding inside the cable housing which will lead to a cable lock up and failure. Lastly, you may need to remove the cable and put it on from the outside, as flipping the arm over places it on the inside towards the levers. There may not be enough room to have the cable inside towards the housing.

[Rob Raymond]

We have the Yacht Specialties binnacle. I'm pretty sure that if the lever is turned around, there isn't enough room in the housing, and the cables won't line up. I may have to look again.

[Chris - Pelican]

We actually had the Edson single lever control installed by a third party the day we bought Pelican. Best investment EVER. I've maneuvered out of some of the tightest spots in heavy wind and tides because I can keep a hand on the wheel and adjust the throttle easily at the same time. I love it. Only downside is that it blocks the wheel lock knob so you have to remove it - and have no wheel lock. I use a piece of line to tie up my wheel in between sails.

Chris

s/v/ Pelican

Passport 40 #76

[Larry Lewis]

Ours is also backwards. The original Nanni was replaced by the PO with a Beta 50, which I love. I've gotten used to it. I can't imagine switching it now.

The knob on the handle is forward at idle (with the handle horizontal). Then to "up" the RPM one pulls up on the knob. A few minutes of mental training got it sorted out. The solution would have been to add a toggle behind the throttle as there was no room to extend the Beta throttle lever in the other direction.

Larry Lewis
S/V Thalia '85 P40 093

[Marty McOmber]

I just had another look and fiddled with the leaver.  Unfortunately, the "easy" fix won't work exactly as easily as I had hope. In the "backward" setup, the throttle arm is on a flat plane pointing forward, with the morse cable running up the forward side of the binnacle interior.  I had hoped to just rotate that throttle arm 180 degrees so it was in the same horizontal position, but pointing aft. Push the throttle forward would then increase RPM.  However, there just isn't room inside for that arm to swing upward. 

The other solution, but not sure it is possible, is to arrange it so the throttle arm is pointing downward when the engine is in idle and the the arm is brought up to a horizontal position as you increase RPM.  Seems like it would be tricking to make the appropriate connections if this is the case. But worth exploring further.

 

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[ChinaDoll]

Another thing needed to be mentioned, the levers are manufactured to be either left or right handed (sided) and that is why both the cable routing and the arms (throttle and shift) are easily interchangeable. None of these unit were made in a manner that required a left or right handed version. Also wanted to note that to keep the arm proud --facing inwards away from the lever-- to gain needed clearance, the arm can be flipped on both axis to keep the proper standoff fo the cable routing. In our set up, the throttle is on one side (front) as it is push to advance (increase rpms) and pulled to retard (cable push/pull). Our gear is pull (cable) for forward and push for reverse. Therefore the gear cable arm and throttle arm are on opposites side of the lever (by set up) for our right handed Morse controls, throttle cable front and shift cable aft. If the system needed to be reversed, the arms on the controll head could easily been reversed, or any possibly combination 2 things taken two at a time (n-1 or 3). There's no goffieness about putting bell cranks on existing bell cranks etc. A proper controll heard can do push or pull with a switch of the controll's lever arm at the inside part of the unit. This is both by design and the need to accommodate multiple installation situations with just one interchangeable model, fitting either side and any kind of a cable configuration.

[Bill Schmidt]

Uh....OK.
B.

[sbin....@gmail.com]

For the Beta 50 installed on Albireo, you can connect the Morse cable to either the end of the throttle lever. See attached photo. With the Morse cable connected as shown, pushing the throttle control at the binnacle results in higher revs.

Steve
s/v Albireo, #57, 1984

[Matthew Davidson]

Marty

I just read our Merriman / Yacht Specialties Installation Manual (See Attached)  that I just found while going through old papers. Merriman states: "If it is desired to have engine speed increase as lever is moved foreward, Inspect action of throttle lever on carburator to be sure this will be the case when cable is connected. Cable may have to approach from opposite direction on engine OR lever on carburator may have to be reveresed for proper action". Approaching from opposite direction seems to be an easy fix! Might need to change our cable housing clamp bracket on the engine but should not be too big of a deal? Thinking this will solve a big mystery. I will look into longer cables and reverse the approach direction for said cable to engine throttle connection. Should provide for the ACTION we all want...  push the lever to throttle-up. Now all I need to do is make this work on our Yanmar...

Matthew - Wildflower

[Marty McOmber]

That's promising. If you can figure it out I'm all ears. I have a yanmar as well and you approach seems right. 

Sent from my iPhone

<Merriman Yacht Specialties - IOM for Manual Shift-Throttle Controls.pdf>

[Ernie Reuter]

I too would enjoy the findings for Iemanja. 

Ernie